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Smiley Smile Stuff => General On Topic Discussions => Topic started by: Smilin Ed H on August 12, 2010, 02:55:49 PM



Title: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 12, 2010, 02:55:49 PM
Can anyone tell me more about his involvement with the BB?  When it started; how much he contributed; was he considered anything more than a backing musician; when it finished etc

How involved with the BB was Dennis Dragon?

Was he in the live band with Billy Hinsche, or did Billy become more involved when Dragon left - though I'm aware, of course, that Hinsche had been around the BB for some time (late 60s?)

Thanks



Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 12, 2010, 02:58:20 PM
Daryl wrote the tag to "Don't Go Near The Water" - tell you something ?  :)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Jon Stebbins on August 12, 2010, 03:35:39 PM
Daryl's tenure was approx. 67 to 72. He was heavily involved in collaborating with Dennis Wilson, hence his co-writing credits on Cuddle Up and Make It Good. He was the Rumbo as in Dennis Wilson and Rumbo(DW's solo single circa '71). Dennis' unreleased early '70's solo LP would have had several more DW/DD collaborations.

Dennis Dragon and Billy Hinsche were obviously in the touring band at the same time, check out Good Vibrations from London(Crystal Palace Bowl '72) footage...both on stage together. Dennis D's tenure was  as a percussionist '70 on and off to '72 or so.(BTW that's him on timbales on the studio cut Its About Time.) Billy's tenure was '69 to '90's on and off.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Jonas on August 12, 2010, 04:33:25 PM
Some good material in the TapeOp interview with him and Dennis (Dragon)...I'll see if I can find it!


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Wrightfan on August 12, 2010, 06:27:19 PM
Daryl's tenure was approx. 67 to 72. He was heavily involved in collaborating with Dennis Wilson, hence his co-writing credits on Cuddle Up and Make It Good. He was the Rumbo as in Dennis Wilson and Rumbo(DW's solo single circa '71). Dennis' unreleased early '70's solo LP would have had several more DW/DD collaborations.

Dennis Dragon and Billy Hinsche were obviously in the touring band at the same time, check out Good Vibrations from London(Crystal Palace Bowl '72) footage...both on stage together. Dennis D's tenure was  as a percussionist '70 on and off to '72 or so.(BTW that's him on timbales on the studio cut Its About Time.) Billy's tenure was '69 to '90's on and off.

67? Did he have anything to do with SMiLE or did he come on board after?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on August 12, 2010, 06:49:26 PM
I feel like Daryl's contributions to Beach Boys records are way under-appreciated.  I suspect he played a lot of the instruments on a lot of Sunflower and Surf's Up songs.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Jason on August 12, 2010, 08:04:28 PM
Daryl came into the fold before the Boys' November 1967 American tour, along with Ron Brown, who played bass. They were not, however, the band's first backup members; Carl augmented the touring group with a horn/string/keyboard section consisting of Igor Horoshevsky, Frank St. Peters, Richard Thompson, and Jim Carther for a mid-1967 European tour.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Mike's Beard on August 12, 2010, 10:10:29 PM
Daryl wrote the tag to "Don't Go Near The Water" - tell you something ?  :)

It tells me that the TM's should have gave him a cowriting credit on it!

I have The Dragons BFI cd on it's way to me, from what I gather it's a keeper.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 13, 2010, 12:39:33 AM
Thanks for this.

Was there ever any attempt to make him a 'Beach Boy' in the way that they (Carl?) wanted Billy in the group in 69(?)? On that excerpt from Whistle Test where they sing Mess of Help, he seems like part of the band

Did his association with Dennis continue after he left?



Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: adamghost on August 13, 2010, 01:04:31 AM
I think he was offered but declined, wasn't he?  There is a group picture from the Holland era that he's in.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: The Heartical Don on August 13, 2010, 03:11:57 AM
What happened to Toni Tennille?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 13, 2010, 03:59:46 AM
What happened to Toni Tennille?

Still married to Daryl.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: The Heartical Don on August 13, 2010, 04:09:27 AM
What happened to Toni Tennille?

Still married to Daryl.

Lovely! Seems so seldom in showbiz...


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: c-man on August 13, 2010, 04:40:56 AM
The extra musicians that they brought along for the 1967 Euro tour may not have actually been used...I seem to recall Mike Love quoted in a music rag around that imte (reprinted in Look! Listen! Vibrate!) that they were only going to be used for the UK shows.  A dispute with the British Musicians Union resulted in their non-use in Britain too.

Daryl's older brother Doug and younger brother Dennis both actually started touring with the Boys in early '68...Dennis D has told a great story of Dennis Wilson shoving a hamburger in his face when he realized he was a veggie!  The three Dragons toured with the BBs in various combinations over the next several years.  All three of them play on the track for "Got To Know The Woman", and Dennis D.  plays most of the drums on the "Sunflower" album, as well as on "Disney Girls".  Their sister, Kathy Dragon, plays flute on the latter.  Daryl's future wife Toni played keyboards alongside Daryl on most of the stateside '72 tours.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 13, 2010, 04:50:34 AM
What happened to Toni Tennille?

Still married to Daryl.

Lovely! Seems so seldom in showbiz...

Daryl was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease last August. It's of a slow-progressing nature... but still...


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Rocker on August 13, 2010, 05:46:16 AM

Dennis D has told a great story of Dennis Wilson shoving a hamburger in his face when he realized he was a veggie! 


 :lol :lol


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: The Heartical Don on August 13, 2010, 06:39:12 AM
What happened to Toni Tennille?

Still married to Daryl.

Lovely! Seems so seldom in showbiz...

Daryl was diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease last August. It's of a slow-progressing nature... but still...

That is bad news, Andrew. For a musician to realize that his abilities are threatened this way... I really feel for the guy.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 13, 2010, 08:31:11 AM
Was Toni Tenille involved in any BB recordings?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Christian on August 13, 2010, 08:48:12 AM
Was Toni Tenille involved in any BB recordings?

background vocals on "Everyone´s In Love With You"

edit: could be she´s on "Cuddle Up" too.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 13, 2010, 09:07:56 AM
So, well after her involvement with the touring band.

Thanks - everyone.

I've seen the picture of Toni with the band, are there any of Dennis and Doug?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Fun Is In on August 13, 2010, 09:26:57 AM
Leaf's book has a photo on page 151 with Dennis playing live w/ the band.

In the Tom Nolan RS article from the "Surf's Up" era, there's a studio photo w/ Carl playing guitar and Daryl playing bass.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on August 13, 2010, 09:34:39 AM
Leaf's book has a photo on page 151 with Dennis playing live w/ the band.

In the Tom Nolan RS article from the "Surf's Up" era, there's a studio photo w/ Carl playing guitar and Daryl playing bass.

Which is one of the coolest looking pictures--they've both got sunglasses on and just look hip.  Very much wish we had more shots like that in the studio w/instruments.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Big Bri on August 13, 2010, 09:46:33 AM
That shot is also in one of the Beach Boy "songbooks". I think the one with the Whit cover?
"Beach Boys Complete". I'll check it out when I get home......

Bri


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Fun Is In on August 13, 2010, 09:52:45 AM
That's the one all right, "The Beach Boys Complete" which includes sheet music and both parts of the Nolan article.

it's copied here:
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,9114.20.html


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 13, 2010, 10:36:44 AM
I've got the Nolan article and I've seen other pictures of Daryl; I was wondering if anyone could post a scan of Doug or Dennis with the band.

Thanks


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: busy doin nothin on August 13, 2010, 01:48:31 PM
I've always wondered if the female background vocalist on Long Promised Road was Toni Tennille -- the "na na na na na nas" over the verses.  Anyone know?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 13, 2010, 01:52:01 PM
I've always wondered if the female background vocalist on Long Promised Road was Toni Tennille -- the "na na na na na nas" over the verses.  Anyone know?

Marilyn.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Beach Head on August 13, 2010, 10:04:38 PM
I've got the Nolan article and I've seen other pictures of Daryl; I was wondering if anyone could post a scan of Doug or Dennis with the band.

Here's a photo of Dennis with the band, live in 1972. He's second from the left, not the guy on keyboards.  8)

(http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/74253347.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF878921CC759DF4EBAC47D06CFF0C4FC8CA051404C1E9B5E730BAE85928583C1B9958C8)

I've never seen a photo of Doug with the band.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 14, 2010, 01:34:56 AM
Damn, I can't see ypour photo  :-[


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: busy doin nothin on August 14, 2010, 05:52:17 AM
I've always wondered if the female background vocalist on Long Promised Road was Toni Tennille -- the "na na na na na nas" over the verses.  Anyone know?

Marilyn.

Thanks.  Suppose that should have occurred to me!   :)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: c-man on August 14, 2010, 07:51:51 AM
So, well after her involvement with the touring band.

Thanks - everyone.

I've seen the picture of Toni with the band, are there any of Dennis and Doug?

Not any with Doug that I know of (btw, Doug also says he acted as their tour manager for a spell in the late '60s), but Dennis D. can be seen performing with them on the youtube clips from David Frost Show '71 and Crystal Palace Bowl '72.  Daryl did play on quite a few of their studio recordings, including the haunting vibes on "Til I Die".   Incidentally, Bruce hired Toni and Daryl to help do the background vocals (along with Carl, Billy Hinsche, and himself) on Elton John's "Don't Let The Sun Go Down On Me".  Later, he brought Toni in to help sing backups on Pink Floyd's "The Wall" album, after a planned session with the Beach Boys themselves fell through.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 14, 2010, 08:33:02 AM
Daryl played on the following:

Cool, Cool Water - piano
Deirdre, Tears In The Morning, Forever - vibraphone
Don't Go Near The Water - Moog, guitar
Got To Know The Woman - tack piano
Student Demonstration Time - bass, tack piano
This Whole World - tubular bells
'Til I Die - vibraphone


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Beach Head on August 14, 2010, 01:38:45 PM
Damn, I can't see ypour photo  :-[

Weird. It's there when I'm logged in, but once I log out, it's gone!  :(

So rather than trying to post the photo again, here's a link to it:

http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/74253347.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF878921CC759DF4EBAC47D06CFF0C4FC8CA051404C1E9B5E730BAE85928583C1B9958C8 (http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/74253347.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF878921CC759DF4EBAC47D06CFF0C4FC8CA051404C1E9B5E730BAE85928583C1B9958C8)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 14, 2010, 02:16:39 PM
I've got the Nolan article and I've seen other pictures of Daryl; I was wondering if anyone could post a scan of Doug or Dennis with the band.

Here's a photo of Dennis with the band, live in 1972. He's second from the left, not the guy on keyboards.  8)

(http://cache1.asset-cache.net/xc/74253347.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF878921CC759DF4EBAC47D06CFF0C4FC8CA051404C1E9B5E730BAE85928583C1B9958C8)

I've never seen a photo of Doug with the band.

Crystal Palace Bowl, London - June 3rd.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: gsmile on August 14, 2010, 03:05:15 PM
That link still doesn't work for me!  Can anybody repost, please and thank you?  Or PM?  I really want to see it.  Is it Top Gun Shades cool?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on August 14, 2010, 05:06:46 PM
Daryl played on the following:

Cool, Cool Water - piano
Deirdre, Tears In The Morning, Forever - vibraphone
Don't Go Near The Water - Moog, guitar
Got To Know The Woman - tack piano
Student Demonstration Time - bass, tack piano
This Whole World - tubular bells
'Til I Die - vibraphone



I suspect he played on more than that--call it a hunch.  I'm all too well aware of the spotty documentation at that time.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Ed Roach on August 14, 2010, 08:11:11 PM
Interesting; I've periodically been looking for some pictures of Daryl, Toni or Dennis to post - don't think I've ever even seen Doug play with them - and just now someone sent me a link to Ben Edmonds article on Dennis.  (Wanted to know if I've ever seen it, even though I'm quoted in it!  As I recall, this was the MoJo article, with the first page printed across an alternate shot of mine from Stebbins book cover shot). 
Here's the link, & some things on Daryl & Dennis - Wilson, that is:

But Dennis and Daryl Dragon, the classically trained pianist and Beach Boy sideman, were like the odd couple – the most accomplished musician in the band's organisation, and the least.

“I was sitting out in the bleachers during a soundcheck when I heard these amazing piano chords coming from the stage,” said Dragon, whose band nickname was ‘Captain Keyboard’ and who would later find his own fame in The Captain & Tennille. “I looked up and it was Dennis, which kind of shocked me. I only knew him as [this] wildman drummer. I didn't even know he played piano! When I asked him who'd composed the gorgeous music he was playing, he said, ‘I did.’ I was floored. Dennis had none of the formal training I'd had, but these were chords my instructors would've killed for. He didn't know the names of notes, nothing. He just played around until he found the notes that matched what he was hearing in his head. The richness and instinctive innovation of his chords reminded me of Richard Wagner, whom Dennis had never heard of.

“My real function with Dennis was to give him encouragement. The band didn't see the value in his writing because they didn't see it as commercial. They were looking for the next hit, because this [1969-72] was when the hits had stopped coming. Dennis didn't think on those terms. My contribution to his songs has been somewhat overstated, to be frank. My relationship with him was more like Salieri’s with Mozart. I'd sit there and try and write down what was coming out of his head. There was never any thought but that we were shaping his musical inspiration. If I did anything, it was really just to help him commit to his ideas, which was not always easy for a guy with his constant energy overload."

http://beatpatrol.wordpress.com/2009/07/06/ben-edmonds-dennis-wilson-the-lonely-sea-2002/


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 14, 2010, 11:39:46 PM
Daryl played on the following:

Cool, Cool Water - piano
Deirdre, Tears In The Morning, Forever - vibraphone
Don't Go Near The Water - Moog, guitar
Got To Know The Woman - tack piano
Student Demonstration Time - bass, tack piano
This Whole World - tubular bells
'Til I Die - vibraphone



I suspect he played on more than that--call it a hunch.  I'm all too well aware of the spotty documentation at that time.

Oh, for sure - many more keyboards, of course, and pretty much all of Dennis' stuff 1970-72, I'm thinking


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on August 15, 2010, 06:19:14 AM
"My relationship with him was more like Salieri’s with Mozart. "

I.E., Salieri's FICTIONAL relationship with Mozart...

Daryl played on the following:

Cool, Cool Water - piano
Deirdre, Tears In The Morning, Forever - vibraphone
Don't Go Near The Water - Moog, guitar
Got To Know The Woman - tack piano
Student Demonstration Time - bass, tack piano
This Whole World - tubular bells
'Til I Die - vibraphone



I suspect he played on more than that--call it a hunch.  I'm all too well aware of the spotty documentation at that time.

Oh, for sure - many more keyboards, of course, and pretty much all of Dennis' stuff 1970-72, I'm thinking

Has anybody ever sat down with him and gone through song-by-song?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 16, 2010, 02:44:48 AM
Thanks, everyone.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 17, 2010, 02:48:15 AM
Just found this:

http://earcandy_mag.tripod.com/ddragon.htm


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 17, 2010, 11:35:27 AM
Who's on bass?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRbBPhodF4Q


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 17, 2010, 11:55:04 AM
Steady Eddie Carter.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 17, 2010, 12:22:01 PM
Thanks again, Andrew.  Was this the show where they were joined by Keith Moon (photo in the Tobler book, I think or am I confusing that with something else?)?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 17, 2010, 01:34:17 PM
Thanks again, Andrew.  Was this the show where they were joined by Keith Moon (photo in the Tobler book, I think or am I confusing that with something else?)?

Nope, that's the show - Crystal Palace Bowl, London 1972.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Ed Roach on August 17, 2010, 01:52:41 PM
I'm amazed that nobody has mentioned The Surf Punks, Dennis Dragon's group.  One of the craziest shows I ever attended had The Honey's open for them!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-77HbqTF9O0&feature=related


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 18, 2010, 02:29:21 AM
Thanks again, everyone  :)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 18, 2010, 07:52:43 AM
More questions that occur to me:  Was Daryl on any albums earlier than Sunflower and is he on the live album? 

Presumably, he could also be somewhere in the mix on older songs used on Love You, 15 Big Ones and KTSA...? And POB?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Bill M on August 18, 2010, 09:45:02 AM
is he on the live album?

Something I've always wondered.  I don't think he's in the credits of supporting musicians on BBIC (someone correct me if I'm wrong), but he must have been with the band during some of the shows recorded for the album in '72, right?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Jon Stebbins on August 18, 2010, 09:56:04 AM
More questions that occur to me:  Was Daryl on any albums earlier than Sunflower and is he on the live album? 

Presumably, he could also be somewhere in the mix on older songs used on Love You, 15 Big Ones and KTSA...? And POB?
Not on POB for sure.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 18, 2010, 10:05:02 AM
Either it's in print too small to read, but I don't see his name there either.  Now that I've strained my eyes to look at the tiny print on the reproduction of the back of the 15 BO cover, I can see that Daryl is credited on Everyone's in Love etc too and he's also on Susie Cincinnati with Dennis Dragon.

Is he on Good Time from Love You?

He's also credited on KTSA.  Is this for When Girls Get Together or did he contribute something new?  I know some of it was recorded at his Rumbo studios...

Finally, I know Kathy Dragon played flute on Going Public, but was she really on Surfin' Around the World too?

Thanks Jon.  Just saw your reply.  I thought he might have been on some nascent version of one of the songs.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Mike's Beard on August 18, 2010, 10:38:14 AM
Steady Eddie Carter.

Aka Matt Stone, co-creator of South Park.



Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Christian on August 18, 2010, 11:10:07 AM
Is he on Good Time from Love You?

Probably, as it was recorded at the same session as "Susie Cincinnati".

He's also credited on KTSA.  Is this for When Girls Get Together or did he contribute something new?  I know some of it was recorded at his Rumbo studios...

Daryl played keyboards on "Some Of Your Love".

Finally, I know Kathy Dragon played flute on Going Public, but was she really on Surfin' Around the World too?

No, she´s not on "Surfin´ Round The World".


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 18, 2010, 11:29:38 AM
Thanks.  That's the internet for you - unreliable one minute; informative the next!


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Christian on August 18, 2010, 11:59:07 AM
btw, one early session credit for Daryl was playing bass or keyboard * on Bruce & Terry´s "Four Strong Winds" (June 1965).
(* Larry Knechtel is on keyboards or bass)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Myk Luhv on August 18, 2010, 01:19:11 PM
Is that a cover of the Ian Tyson song?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: dogear on August 18, 2010, 01:25:00 PM
Is that a cover of the Ian Tyson song?
Yes, it is.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: c-man on August 18, 2010, 05:19:55 PM
Daryl's on "Bluebirds Over The Mountain" (marimba).


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Myk Luhv on August 18, 2010, 05:32:27 PM
Is that a cover of the Ian Tyson song?
Yes, it is.

Is it... good?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 18, 2010, 11:04:22 PM

Excellent: the Sundazed Best Of Bruce & Terry CD is, IMHO, an essential purchase along with The Rip Chords stuff from the same source.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Curtis Leon on August 19, 2010, 03:08:26 AM
Thanks again, Andrew.  Was this the show where they were joined by Keith Moon (photo in the Tobler book, I think or am I confusing that with something else?)?

Nope, that's the show - Crystal Palace Bowl, London 1972.

I would have loved to see that. One of the greatest drummers in the world, with the world's greatest vocal band. Even if it was, as I have heard, a lousy performance. I do know that Keith loved the Beach Boys...


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 19, 2010, 09:45:00 AM
The Wild Honey on YouTube sounds pretty good! No Keith on that one, though and the quality's poor but the camera angles suggest it was filmed professionally...


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Mike's Beard on August 19, 2010, 10:56:08 AM
Is that a cover of the Ian Tyson song?
Yes, it is.

Great Song. Sounds very much like early Byrds.  Yes I know Melcher produced them both!  ::)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Dove Nested Towers on August 20, 2010, 01:51:18 AM
Just found this:

http://earcandy_mag.tripod.com/ddragon.htm

Hey Smilin' Ed, That is a really great interview, thanks for the link The web site Dragon mentions, where he discusses in detail his collaboration with Dennis, doesn't seem to exist any more. Too bad. Does anyone have that interview?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Christian on August 20, 2010, 01:59:43 AM
Here´s the link:

http://www.danaddington.com/denny/dragon.html


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 20, 2010, 02:10:07 AM
Thanks.  There's a great facebook link too


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: gsmile on August 20, 2010, 02:28:23 PM
Excellent: the Sundazed Best Of Bruce & Terry CD is, IMHO, an essential purchase along with The Rip Chords stuff from the same source.

I've always preferred Bruce's output in his pre-Beach Boys days.  He and Terry Melcher had a great friendship that shone through the music.  I can't help but smile when I listen to stuff like "I Love You Model T", "Don't Go Away", their Spectorized cover of Buddy Holly's "Everyday"...just great stuff.  Too bad Bruce and Terry couldn't mine as exuberant results in the dire 80s and 90s.  You'd never even recognize Kokomo being produced by the same guy who did such a warm, breezy version of "Four String Winds".


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Mike's Beard on August 20, 2010, 03:45:48 PM
What I've never quite figured out was when Brian began to cut back on the epic productions why Bruce didn't just step in as The Beach Boys producer. He certainly had the credentials.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: gsmile on August 20, 2010, 04:28:25 PM
What I've never quite figured out was when Brian began to cut back on the epic productions why Bruce didn't just step in as The Beach Boys producer. He certainly had the credentials.

I don't think that Bruce has ever considered "The Beach Boys" his main gig.  He contributed to some songwriting and production sporadically from 20/20 through to Surf's Up, but the problem is Bruce never found a good collaborator within the group, unlike the "rough and smooth" combo of Bruce & Terry.  Bruce is also strangely a "Brianista" as them call them.  He's stated that Brian lost his "magic" after "Til I Die".  Bruce's productions often aped Brian's style (Nearest Faraway Place, Oh Darlin') and he even gave Brian a co-credit for a song he basically had nothing to do with (Deirdre).  Away from the Beach Boys, Bruce had much more success producing David Cassidy and having Barry Manilow take "I Write the Songs" to the top of the charts.  When he started a label (Equinox) and released the California Music 45, he even got Brian involved.  "Going Public" didn't exactly set the charts aflame, but I also guess that Bruce only intended it as a small project anyway.  When he was called back to the Beach Boys in 79, it was to do damage control and take the main production reigns away from a mentally incapable and understandably terrified Brian who had been released prematurely from the hospital.  Even then, that was a co-production with James William Guercio.  Even "Keeping the Summer Alive" was a clean-up job when Brian started and couldn't finish the problem.  Ever since then, Bruce has just treated "The Beach Boys" as his day job.  Bruce has always been a better collaborator than "artist".  Bruce can sometimes make a great sounding record, but he doesn't possess the "creative vision" to drive the group into new directions and maintain a level of creative artistry.  Dennis certainly possessed this, but by the time his talent fully blossomed into record production, the group was essentially in shambles and Dennis' solo album was unfairly left to wither on the vine.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Dove Nested Towers on August 20, 2010, 11:57:39 PM
Here´s the link:

http://www.danaddington.com/denny/dragon.html

Thanks, Christian. That's a really good interview. It's so sad that Dennis didn't have any confidence in his work, that Dragon and Barbara had to give him lots of praise and support. Also that the other BBs didn't want to have anything to do with him, creatively speaking, didn't feel that his work was commercial. With the exception of Mike (and to a lesser extent Al and Bruce), you would think that the others wouldn't have put so much of an emphasis on that, even though they were struggling mightily to stay relevant and find a new formula, a balance between creativity and commerciality. I'm sure there was a lot of jealousy and competitiveness involved as well. What a shame.

I hope that if there ever is a comprehensive D.W. retrospective/anthology, that it will contain all or most of  the early '70s material for the proposed album collaboration with Dragon that Alan Boyd has said is in the vaults, as well as (of course) WIBNTLA  and the "I've Got A Friend" instrumental track. One can only dream....


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 21, 2010, 02:52:30 AM
Do we know if he is on the live album?


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: c-man on August 21, 2010, 06:23:56 AM
Do we know if he is on the live album?

Yes, some of it was recorded on the "Winter 1972 Tour" as stated in the liners, which would be November '72.  Both Daryl AND Toni were on that tour, even though they're not credited among the supporting musicians for some reason.


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: smile-holland on August 21, 2010, 07:07:33 AM
I think he was offered but declined, wasn't he?  There is a group picture from the Holland era that he's in.

he's on the front picture of the Dutch and German release of the Marcella 45 (behind the wheel)

(http://i34.tinypic.com/nq4g03.jpg)


Title: Re: Daryl Dragon
Post by: Smilin Ed H on August 22, 2010, 02:18:39 AM
Thanks for sharing this and thanks for all the info.

On the subject of Bruce and reasonably relevant to the thread in that the C&T sang this and Daryl must've been around when Bruce recorded it inititally, here's Bruce in Girona earlier this year.  Man can still sing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CYXC2qxGF4