The Smiley Smile Message Board

Gershwin was an American composer. There are plenty of Americans who are worthy of this award. The fact that it was presented by BHO just so he could have his minstrel play a song named like his wife sucks. Besides, the awardee made an ass of himself calling out GWB. And no, I'm no Bush fan. Stick to plucking the strings Macca and leave the political commentary to professionals. And to answer Luther's question, the above is reason enough why it shouldn't go to a non-American. It's bad enough we have a president who bad mouths his own country, but to bring in a foreigner to pile on is pure bs. Clear enough now?

Please check your facts before making statements that make you look like woefully ill-informed. Obama (or any incumbent of the Oval Office, for matter) had nothing to do with awarding the Gershwin Prize to McCartney. From the Library of Congress website:

"The Library of Congress Gershwin Prize for Popular Song will honor either a songwriter, interpreter, or singer/songwriter whose career reflects lifetime achievement in promoting the genre of song as a vehicle of artistic expression and cultural understanding.

The selection will be made by the Librarian of Congress in consultation with a board that is both credible and broad enough in scope to represent the full spectrum of popular song.  Board members may include but need not be limited to scholars, producers, performers, music critics, songwriters, and subject specialists within and outside the Library of Congress."

Fact: The award was presented at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue by BHO.

 I don't get your point as it relates to the awarding of the honor.   I don't see anywhere where it has or needs to be presented by the president at the WH with a concert and assinine comments from the winner. You are obviously uninformed about this, and that was my point. Maybe if you were on this side of the pond you might catch a little news about Rome burning while Nero fiddles. I won't stray into your territory but  be careful about calling somebody woefully uninformed when you are just now gathering clues.

Alright Dave, we get that you have a bone to pick with Barack. We are sorry for you that Sarah is nowhere near the Oval Office (not really). Now lets end it.

How dare you!! You should be hauled up to the black board and write "I will not be woefully uninformed" 200 times and then have your mouth washed out with soap and stay after school and no less than 6 demerits-that'll learn ya!! :o

Laughing my rear end off old surfer dude. :lol

1 - the clear implication was that he picked Macca as this years recipient.

2 - He also presented the award at the White House last year.

3 - Politics in The Sandbox, please.

AGD, I do agree that politics shouldnt be included in this section, but i do wonder if ol' Dave in KC would have been offended if say, the Nuge or some redneck racist country star was at the White House and told Dubya that he was happy that there was a man in office that kept it in his pants. I bet you'd applaud him. So if Sir Paul wants to voice his opinion I'd say its just fine. And Dave, I'm sure you thought 2001-09 were just wonderful years right?

[End politics on my part]

Are you a professional Dave? If not, take your own advice. Thanks.

Just wondering what it is that Dave really finds so offensive about Obama - the tone of his politics, or the tone of his skin.

Not saying I agree with Dave in KC (I have an opinion on Obama's politics but quite frankly I don't really care, I'm not American, lots of people say Obama sucks, lots of people say GWB sucked, chances are the next US president will suck too, at least to some people)  but it pisses me off when, as soon as a black person is criticized, implied accusations of racism are invoked. Had Obama been jewish, you probably would have implied Dave in KC was a neo-nazi.

Breaking news: people of all races and of all religions can be wrong and criticized for their acts, regardless of their personal characteristics. I'm tired of people trying to discredit critics by resorting to such accusations. That's lame and weak.

Please feel free to tell everyone this message is irrelevant because I hate the British.

Ah, the woefully undereducated.

What a ridiculous thing to say. I can't say I agree with what Dave in KC had to say but not for one second did the thought pass my mind what you seem to be implying.

I'm hoping that you've missed the obligatory smiley face here. As you know I'm British too and this could mean me choosing a Mateus Rosé over a nice Burgundy while I settle down to watch the football next week ;).

Agreed...I love ya AGD, but I feel that was not for a moment what Dave in KC had in mind. I know a lot of people who are upset with the way things are going in the U.S., and legislation is constantly being passed that goes against the will of the majority of Americans no matter who is in office. Indeed, it is a sad time in history if one is implied of being racist for disagreeing with someones policies or just being damn frustrated with the basic inefficiency of their hard earned tax dollars at work.

Hinting and implying someone is a racist is certainly a good way to try to shut them up.

You know in my observations racism is actually a recurring theme in politics and the way certain people deal with political problems---but it is way hushed up compared to the way things used to be. And the way certain 'fair and balanced' commentators get OUTRAGED when you try and insinuate that certain people are exhibiting racist characteristics never fails to crack me up.

Full disclosure: I'm a liberal and in no way believe that Dave is a racist.

Is this really the first Flux thread on this board? If so, we have a lot of work to do to catch up to everyone on Shut Down.

I will say this...it seems like the American pubic has given Obama a lot less of a honeymoon period than any other president in recent memory. For what reason, I'll leave that open to debate.

Exactly, and that's why these accusations shouldn't be used too often. Not only do they lower the debate to name-calling, but in doing that, the strength of these accusations is also lowered. When someone is clearly racist and these accusations are based on fact, they will seem almost "casual", and that's not a good thing. I personally can't see why AGD said that - nothing seemed particularly racist in Dave in KC's posts.




Well, knowing AGD's acute sense of dry wit and sarcasm I figured a smiley would be redundant!  ;D

If you'll recall, within months of the moronic GWB being in office there was a show on TV called 'That's my Bush', about how moronic he was. I suppose AGD would think we were racist for allowing that show to air. As for why Obama is such a tool;
Let's see... Same wars, maybe more coming
Still have the 'patriot act'
still have the war on drugs
same economic policies as his predecessors (destroying real wealth while consolidating economic power amongst his Goldman Sachs buddies)

When you have a demagogue, with a fanatical mass-movement of personality cultists, imposing the program of a group of extreme bankers and finance oligarchs, that's fascism.
Maybe you guys love certain leaders and dislike others. I kinda can't stand any of them.

Sadly, I  live in a hick town where most people around here *do* hate Obama for the color of his skin, and me being as left-wing as I am...well...let's just say I can NEVER talk politics with anybody near where I live.

I'm not sure Dave may be a racist as AGD was hinting at, but it was obvious that he has some bone to pick to our President and this McCartney thing gave him an excuse to try to rip on the guy.

I didn't 'hint' at anything, just asked a straightforward question: what offends you most, his politics or the color of his skin ?  If the latter answer comes back, then we can start thinking about throwing allegations of racism around, but not before.

That's a pretty intellectually dishonest approach to this subject when, as a previous poster said, the mere insinuation of racism is used (often here in the US) to shut down political speech. Why bring it up at all? Do you like the BB because they are white, or is it the music? How stupid does that sound?
I can't stand this whole left/right, republican/democrat thing, since they both use fear, coercion and war to further their (and whatever big money is backing them) agenda, which has NEVER been to the benefit of ANYONE I've ever met.
Maybe you like endless wars, but I can do without, just like I can do without out so called 'leaders'.
Why defend someone who couldn't care less about you or anyone you know? It's absurd. Hero worship is repulsive, and 'hoping' someone else will make the 'changes' you want to see in the world, rather than being that change yourself, is just sad.

See, what's happening here is people putting words in my mouth. Not defending Obama, mainly because I'm English and we've got a bad enough mess over here (due in part to Blair licking Bush's ass when asked to, and frequently when not), thanks. Just want to know why Dave in KC gets so het up about it all. Personally, I find politics uninteresting because, when it comes down to it, all politicians will promise anything to get elected, then spend the rest of their time in office explaining why they can't walk the walk. If I detest anything, it's the obscene brand of political correctness that (over here at least), makes me run the risk of being branded a racist when all I'm being is patriotic (can't upset the muslims, you see, they're oppressed, and the sight of an English flag on our national day could be offensive to them: to which my reply is simple - well f*** off back home, then).

Where was I ? Oh, yes...

Again, I asked a simple question, one that has a simple answer, which I'm still awaiting.

1) Exactly...when I vote, I pretty much vote for whomever is the lesser of two evils.

2). With your second point...it's amazing how similar our two countries are.

Q: How can you tell when a politician is lying?
A: His lips are moving!    ;)

I refuse to vote. As the guys from South Park so diligently put it "you always end up having to choose between a douche and a turd".

Maybe it was the word 'minstrel' that prompted some doubt in AGD's mind.  Did with me.

He meant the term 'minstrel' as in McCartney was that night Obama's personal musician to play at his command, not the kind where some guy paints his face black and dances around in turn of the century vaudeville acts.  ::)

Go up to anyone in the street, say 'minstrel', and I'll bet you they won't say 'Blondel de Nesle', 'Alan a Dale' or the like. Minstrel in the US has a very specific connotation. Hence my question.

This thread (or splinter thread) certainly became fantastic.

Not too sure about that. I'll be out later and might try testing your theory, but I think 'wandering bard' when I hear minstrel, or, worse, New Christy Minstrels. Now, my grandfather might think 'blackface', but the only people I ever hear talking about race are the well-meaning 'liberals' who seem to like to bring it up any chance they get. I think its called 'race-bating'.

I live in Rednickville, USA, and surprised I haven't had a burning cross on my front porch yet...I think the vast majority of the people I live around would disagree with you. I guess they haven't realized it's 2010.

I may be in what may have once been considered nearly opposite of Redneckville, USA (though we're ever-further right) and was going to say something similar, but didn't want to seem as if I were baiting conservatives. I'll avoid assigning the reason people of any political stripe bring up race, but note that it seems an implicit or explicit topic pretty often by people all over the political map, and probably for a variety of reasons (even within each of those groups).

When someone happens to be black... and they get attacked.... and a passerby says "That man is black, and is getting attacked because he's black".....



I'd say the only thing we know for certain is that the passerby is racist. 

Nah, faulty logic. What if the passerby had only ever (or even primarily) witnessed attacks in the context of race-based attacks? Then it would be an understandable assumption, even if incorrect.