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Non Smiley Smile Stuff => Smiley Smilers Who Make Music => Topic started by: Boxer Monkey on February 13, 2006, 05:59:02 PM



Title: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Boxer Monkey on February 13, 2006, 05:59:02 PM
Recording, recording, recording, sweating blood over homemade demo EPs for which I will receive no feedback from the "friends" to whom I must dispense copies unsolicited (like they'd ever ask). Thanks for nothing. Do I suck? Should I worry what they think? Shouldn't I be doing this for myself? I mean, validation is important, yet I can't kid myself into believing I'm some "misunderstood genius." But if the imperfect is truly more alive, shouldn't my follies resonate all the more? Play guitar for, like, three hours a night to forget that I'm alone: Shouldn't the guitar make me less alone somehow? Strapping it on is like being tied to an anchor (and I don't mean it gives my life a center of gravity). Sinkin' thinkin'.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: the captain on February 13, 2006, 06:00:29 PM
No, because I know how good it feels to wander back to recordings I've done, put on the headphones and listen.

And proving myself inferior is a hell of a lot more worthwhile than imagining myself superior.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Boxer Monkey on February 13, 2006, 06:07:24 PM
No, because I know how good it feels to wander back to recordings I've done, put on the headphones and listen.

And proving myself inferior is a hell of a lot more worthwhile than imagining myself superior.

See, I can't even listen to my stuff anymore without hearing what's wrong with it. One night I had this terrifying moment of branding-iron hot ephiphany where a track I'd created dissolved into the river of sludge that I imagine most people hear. I have no objectivity otherwise, and this flash of detachment filled me with revulsion. I ended up fleeing my apartment and walking, like, four miles angsting over how I've wasted the last 10 years or so of my life on this garbage (like in "Ed Wood": "These movies are TERRIBLE! You're wasting your lives making merda!!!!").

Proving myself inferior is no picnic. (I'd much rather imagine I control the weather.)


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 13, 2006, 06:46:51 PM
I too feel like this very often.

I know I have some talent for songwriting, and I can play my guitar and keyboards pretty well.

I'm trying not to lose hope and faith in myself.

I actually think i've written better songs than Lennon & Mccartney must have at 17 years old. Maybe this is just my ego and foolishness coming into play. It gives me hope.

I am happy though, with the thought of being a cool Uncle who teaches his nephews/neices how to play/write songs. I'm in love with the whole idea of a family sitting around a piano having a great time, though you'd never find that in my house now.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 13, 2006, 07:24:54 PM
It's when things get rough that you've got all the more reason not to quit.  That is, unless you're a quitter; then it's best to quit and not fool yourself.  Not you, but someone other than you, who is a quitter. 

(That came out wrong, I think.  Someone flame me quick.)


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on February 13, 2006, 07:59:37 PM
It happens to me...I wrote one song last spring and made about 35 demos of it and now cant listen to it....to me they are my diary...sometimes I have to take a sabbaticals and just have fun with my music etc...I give CD's to friends and get no feedback....totally....I get more feedback from downloads...take a break...you need to refresh the mind and soul...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Aegir on February 13, 2006, 10:09:37 PM
Well, personally I don't write/record music for others... I do it just because I feel the need to. Creative fulfillment and all that nonsense. I don't need other people to like them.. in fact, most people think I'm a joke. But I just record anyway. Many of my songs have never been heard by anyone but me.. and I don't care. I just to try to get people to listen to them, years ago, but now I realize that it's not about what others think of you. It's just for yourself.

And I've been recording songs since I was 14, so it's quite interesting to hear how my voice and personality change over the years.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: no on February 13, 2006, 10:58:19 PM
Just discovered this thread. It's amazing how it mirrors my frustrations in the "Wishlist Thread."

Dude. Writing music is hell. Thinking about my "heroes" and their youthful ages upon being signed and accomplished is also.

I've been in bands a plenty; pop, punk, two foda-ing prog-metal bands (yikes!) and even a cover act. I just turned 24 and feel like a mummified old foda, yet I still think from time to time that playing music and thinking music is the obvious answer.  Performing/writing has healed and hurt me in wicked ways -- I can't imagine anything more tortuous than those formative years, attempting to write structurally-sound tunes without a foda-ing clue as to the mechanics of writing (or pitch).  Sheer horror.  One of those "wouldn't wish it on my..." sorta things.  I'd love to offer some advice, but I'm clearly too jaded.  I suppose if it grants you euphoria, even if it's only once a month and fleeting, don't hang up, man.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Matinee Idyll on February 13, 2006, 11:09:33 PM
What a resounding thread...

I'd completely given up, and I don't mean to gloat... but I spent part of last week with one of me musical heroes, and it was amazing to see how damn simple writing music came to him...  No self consciousness, just draw up a ukelele tab, tune it to some wierd 6th chord, and start making stuff up... once things started flowing, it just came natural. Now I feel a whole lot more confident in my own ability to 'do it'.

I too appreciate not having family who give any feedback on what you're coming up with, even a "That sounds sh*t" would be a start.  Like Heroes, I too yearn for rollickin' family sing songs (we're two peas punchin' it out in the same pod man, I love ya)

Stick with it guys,  if only for yourself.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: richardsnow on February 14, 2006, 03:06:08 AM
I did give up.

I did it hard from 89-96
The nail in the coffin for me was when a sh*t band beat my band in a competition. We'd got complex 3 part harmonies down, they'd brought a bigger crowd.  ;D
Any how I gave up for 5 years. Didn't write one song.
It was only the internet that got me started again. By putting up my old recordings on MP3.com for a laugh, then I started getting the response I'd never got when I was just sending out the tapes.

God bless t'internet :-)


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 14, 2006, 06:16:08 AM
If you feel like you can't write, check out these two fellows; maybe it will inspire you.  All you need is a few chords and something/anything to say.  How do you think these guys feel about their validity?

R. Stevie Moore: http://www.rsteviemoore.com/

Daniel Johnston: http://www.hihowareyou.com/


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris Brown on February 14, 2006, 10:34:11 AM
I've never really felt like giving up creating music, but there are certainly times when I wonder if all the effort is worth it.  I don't write music to please other people though (unless it's a girlfriend or something); I do it to challenge myself and because I enjoy it.  If someone else enjoys it too, that's great, but it isn't the end of the world if they don't.  Like others have said, I also find it interesting to go back and listen to things I did when I was younger.  It is fun to listen to these songs and go back to those times in your life, and it also gives you a good perspective to see how far you've come since.  My point is that there are plenty of reasons to keep making music, but the best reason is to do it because you enjoy it.   


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 14, 2006, 12:11:19 PM
I've never not felt like giving it up.  I hope someday I actually do give it up instead of giving it up for a few months and coming back.  I've never really felt one positive feeling from listening to my own music.  There are times I've thought the production job I did was good, but that's not enough.  Recording it is the biggest pain.  I'll just continue making music vicariously by pretending to be in the Beach Boys.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on February 14, 2006, 02:58:07 PM
OK here is one method...for instance...I have a CD called "Genesis Archive II 1976-2000"...the very last track is called "Mama work in progress" it is fascinating in that Phil Collins is just making up stuff to the beat of the electronic drums, Tony Banks live keys and Mike Rutherfords live guitar... at the end he says "need to write more words"...that's one method, you have abeat and just saing whatever feels right with it...the same for "No Son of Mine"... they jam and pick out the best bits for development.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 14, 2006, 03:04:23 PM
I really labour with my songs. I have a hard time accepting mediocrity so I push the songs to the brim.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 14, 2006, 04:20:50 PM
Whenever I hear a song from Dylan's Love and Theft album, it makes me think about how easy it is to write great songs: take a bunch of great lines and cobble them together.  And the music?  Just rip off old blues numbers and tin pan alley standards.  Example:

The trailing moss and mystic glow
Purple blossoms soft as snow
My tears keep flowing to the sea
Doctor, lawyer, Indian chief
It takes a thief to catch a thief
For whom does the bell toll for, love? It tolls for you and me


It sounds brilliant, but why?  Because of the love of performing, clearly exuded by Dylan.  The love of it supercedes all else. 


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris Brown on February 14, 2006, 04:58:11 PM
Funny you should mention laboring over your songs H&V...one of the fun things for me has been listening to old songs that I rushed and finished in a half hour and comparing them to more recent songs that I take forever to finish.  For better or worse, becoming familiar with the Smile saga made me realize that it is okay to take a long time to work on a song, as long as it turns out good in the end!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 14, 2006, 05:39:30 PM
Becoming familiar with the SMiLE saga left me thinking about rushing recordings just to get them done. It's okay for one Brian Wilson to not finish a project, he was already set for life financially.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Jason on February 14, 2006, 07:49:35 PM
I think about quitting music every day. Sometimes I feel like it just won't pay off, that I'm not hip to the newer music, which I've tried to be. Sometimes you have to sacrifice your artistic intents if you ever want to make any real money. I don't think my industrial album will make me any money whatsoever. My instrumental album was all done live, and I think that has no commercial potential (all the tracks are over 10 minutes).


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 14, 2006, 07:54:00 PM
Jason, post some darn songs and we'll decide.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris D. on February 14, 2006, 09:17:59 PM
Quote
One night I had this terrifying moment of branding-iron hot ephiphany where a track I'd created dissolved into the river of sludge that I imagine most people hear.

You have no idea how much I can relate to that.

Always believe in your greatness.

Always know how much you can suck.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Jason on February 14, 2006, 09:19:10 PM
I found an instrumental that's actually listenable (I dunno if you guys want to hear the near-unlistenable stuff). I'll be posting it tomorrow, and showing off my love for cliched melodies and overlong instrumentals.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 15, 2006, 02:27:32 PM
I think I figured out why music isn't fun for me.  It's because I have to do it by myself.  For me, music isn't overdubbing yourself, it's playing with other people.  I remember the first time I played guitar in a "band" sort of setting.  It was at a music camp I went to, and somehow there was a spontaneous jam on Live's hit of the day, "Lakini's Juice."  I remember having to wipe tears from my eyes as we played together, drums, bass, two guitars, piano.  It was so much fun to react to other people playing, hear the big sound in the room, etc.

I just don't enjoy having to play everything myself.  It's gratifying from a standpoint of I'm able to listen to it and have a document of how neat it is that I'm able to play tons of instruments at fairly proficient levels, but that's it.  Otherwise, it's a chore.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 15, 2006, 02:28:55 PM
I think I figured out why music isn't fun for me.  It's because I have to do it by myself.  For me, music isn't overdubbing yourself, it's playing with other people.  I remember the first time I played guitar in a "band" sort of setting.  It was at a music camp I went to, and somehow there was a spontaneous jam on Live's hit of the day, "Lakini's Juice."  I remember having to wipe tears from my eyes as we played together, drums, bass, two guitars, piano.  It was so much fun to react to other people playing, hear the big sound in the room, etc.

I just don't enjoy having to play everything myself.  It's gratifying from a standpoint of I'm able to listen to it and have a document of how neat it is that I'm able to play tons of instruments at fairly proficient levels, but that's it.  Otherwise, it's a chore.

I see your point, but there's a lot of good things about one person recordings...just, uh, let me think of a few...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 15, 2006, 02:35:22 PM
One person recordings can be great, some of mine are...but it's not fun or enjoyable, for me.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 15, 2006, 02:40:24 PM
One person recordings can be great, some of mine are...but it's not fun or enjoyable, for me.

Therapeutic?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 15, 2006, 02:42:53 PM
On the contrary.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Mitchell on February 15, 2006, 07:50:48 PM
I wish I could help you, Josh.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris Brown on February 15, 2006, 08:13:01 PM
I know exactly what you mean Josh.  I've had lots of times where I have a really good idea for a song but the sheer thought of all the work it would take for me to do just the music is so overwhelming it gets put on the back burner, and that is typically where it stays.  What I wouldn't give to just be able to call up a bunch of musicians, tell them what to play and just do it.  Maybe I'm just lazy, I'm not sure.  It's definitely frustrating Josh, I feel your pain!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: theeponymuseudonym on February 16, 2006, 12:11:58 AM
i play the drums...unfortunately i have given up for the time being.
theres a group in Washington State who say they want me.

i am not that bright.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 16, 2006, 06:59:45 PM
i am not that bright.

Even the dullest lightbulbs still provide someone enough light to read.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on February 16, 2006, 07:06:44 PM
H&V I love that song you posted a while back...did you finish it?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wonderphil on February 16, 2006, 10:18:37 PM
You solodubbers may be surprised how interested
good players are in helping a composer/recordist...

If you check around for an open-minded
professional jazz keyboardist, that's the key...

They can play literally anything, certainly re: BW-styles...

And they can cherry-pick the best rhythm section
(bassist/drummer) for any specific recording session...

Depending on what your main instrument is,
maybe you replace one of the ringers...

By getting the basic tracks done live you get a great feel
(by not using a click track), and after they leave you
can fill in the framework with overdubs, if desired...

If they really dig your stuff and they're not gigging that night
anyway, they may work real cheap (20 bucks each per session?)...

For a little dough you get to play with some great players
that make the whole recording process magic and exciting...

And if they like your engineering, etc. maybe they'll want
you to record them, and you can just barter services... ;)

Bob Phillips
20to20soundesign





Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 17, 2006, 08:56:27 AM
I had a band rehearsal yesterday.

Had to endure tons of insults to my new songs. Apparently they sound too much like movie soundtrack material rather than "Cool - ass - rebellious - rock band" type of junk.

Put me off making anything for a while.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris D. on February 17, 2006, 09:06:59 AM
Why are you listening to those toasters, man?  Besides, what fucking rock music is really rebellious these days?  Write what you want.  That's what's rebellious, and that's what's fun.  You need to go solo, babe.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Evenreven on February 17, 2006, 09:19:52 AM
Idiots. Go solo, man. I can't remember if I said so, but the song you shared the other day was golden. I've listened to it a lot.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 17, 2006, 01:08:53 PM
Quote
I had a band rehearsal yesterday.

Had to endure tons of insults to my new songs. Apparently they sound too much like movie soundtrack material rather than "Cool - ass - rebellious - rock band" type of junk.

Put me off making anything for a while.

This brings up an interesting issue.  Here you are talking about how difficult it is to work with people, and that's true.  The bands I were in during high school were pretty dumb.  It was hard to work with your friends in the context of a band.  It was dumb too, because I was better at every instrument than the people playing them, as is usually the case.  This isn't me trying to make myself sound egomaniacal, it's just that most people until you get to high levels of commitment are not very good musicians.

But on the other side, here I am complaining about how solo recording is the pits.  It's a no win situation, which is why it should be given up.

Ideally, I'd have a core group of me and a couple of trusted collaborators, the "band", then I'd hire session musicians to play the arrangements I'd write out.

f*** this g*ddamned motherfucking fuckshit.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 17, 2006, 01:37:43 PM

 I was better at every instrument than the people playing them, as is usually the case.  This isn't me trying to make myself sound egomaniacal, it's just that most people until you get to high levels of commitment are not very good musicians.

foda this g*ddamned motherfodaing fodamerda.

Same as my situation now. I can play everything I want on my recordings better than they can.This is only because I can appreciate subtley whereas my friends just want cocky riifs and drum fills. The only problem is I don't have my own drum set, and can't afford a decent one. The people in my "band" listen to heavy music. It's nothing like what i've written, wrote, or have even listened to myself.

I say, let all us Smiley Smile Message Board members form a super group. Aeijtzsche can lead us all to greatness.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 17, 2006, 01:44:36 PM
If we all make a pact to move to LA or New York, it could work.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 17, 2006, 07:29:07 PM
We could add tracks to a particular song, via the internet.  It could work, right?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Mitchell on February 17, 2006, 11:04:09 PM
The Night Was So Young worked pretty well.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 05:59:35 AM
It's not the same as actually playing live with people.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 18, 2006, 06:53:55 AM
It's not the same as actually playing live with people.

Yeah, but, apparently, you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't.  So this is straddling a wobbly fence here - I say we should give it a try for a track on this comp.  Our own "We Are The World" or "Do They Know It's Christmas?".  Only, hopefully, better.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 06:58:43 AM
Quote
Yeah, but, apparently, you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't.

Which is why all my musical equipment is going on ebay monday morning.  I'm out.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: andy on February 18, 2006, 07:54:48 AM
Dude, are you serious? come on, man.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 08:17:54 AM
Quote
Dude, are you serious? come on, man.

I don't know, maybe, maybe not.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: andy on February 18, 2006, 08:30:08 AM
You're going to regret it if you do. Really, really regret..much more than if you'd keep it. You have just about everything you need, except space.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 18, 2006, 08:54:25 AM
Quote
Dude, are you serious? come on, man.

I don't know, maybe, maybe not.

Josh,

It's fine if you simply give up yourself, but think about the treasure all your gear would be to your children, or their children. They'll uncover all this great stuff and pick up the slack you left off. I'm not selling anything of mine that is music-related. I want everything of mine passed down through the years to other family members.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 09:05:03 AM
That's a decent point.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Jason on February 18, 2006, 09:06:32 AM
Guys, this thread's becoming a real downer. It pains me to see so many musicians down on themselves.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 09:12:53 AM
Quote
That's a decent point.

Except I just remembered that I don't expect to have any kids.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 18, 2006, 09:13:09 AM
It's giving me hope to see so many others in similar situations. Perhaps we're all just stuck in the same pit, but talking about it will help us all out.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 18, 2006, 09:13:34 AM
Quote
That's a decent point.

Except I just remembered that I don't expect to have any kids.

Why's that?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Jason on February 18, 2006, 09:14:19 AM
If I've learned anything from posting music here, I've learned to record shorter material. No one wants to download a 25 MB file, I do not think I'm liked THAT much, if at all.  :P


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 18, 2006, 09:22:56 AM
Quote
Why's that?

Lots of complicated reasons, the most basic of which is that I don't like kids very much.

I would really like to be able to have some kind of round-table discussion with some of my favourite musicians...about the hardships they face, emotionally.

I wonder if Brian worried about how good Pet Sounds was, and if he ever felt like it wasn't worth it.  Or even other musicians that you wouldn't normally think of.  Avril Lavigne, does she ever lay awake at night wondering why she even bothers, since she secretly gets no payoff from what she does?

Does any musicians actually get any payoff?  Or artist for that matter?  Or is the nature of an artist to be empty?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 18, 2006, 09:35:06 AM
Quote
Why's that?

Lots of complicated reasons, the most basic of which is that I don't like kids very much.

Does any musicians actually get any payoff?  Or artist for that matter?  Or is the nature of an artist to be empty?

If you had a child of your own you wouldn't like him/her? I think people forget the amount of love that usually seeps into a person with their own. I'd dive infront of traffic to save my little dog. You'd be a fine Dad.

I'm sure every musician who has now "made it" has wondered about their situation. It's something every human comes to a one point. Whether or not they're bagging groceries at a store or playing to sold out crowds. We often wonder if we're in the right place for us, with the right people, etc.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Jason on February 18, 2006, 09:35:14 AM
Quote
Why's that?

Lots of complicated reasons, the most basic of which is that I don't like kids very much.

I would really like to be able to have some kind of round-table discussion with some of my favourite musicians...about the hardships they face, emotionally.

I wonder if Brian worried about how good Pet Sounds was, and if he ever felt like it wasn't worth it.  Or even other musicians that you wouldn't normally think of.  Avril Lavigne, does she ever lay awake at night wondering why she even bothers, since she secretly gets no payoff from what she does?

Does any musicians actually get any payoff?  Or artist for that matter?  Or is the nature of an artist to be empty?

That's human nature, not artist nature. Humans are always down on themselves, we all have confidence problems.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 18, 2006, 09:36:53 AM
I think it's just terrible that the most talented people seem to be most lacking in drive and self-confidence.

I'd put Josh way up their with the people on this board in terms of overall talent, yet he seems to feel he has none most of his days.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Mitchell on February 18, 2006, 10:09:28 AM
He knows he's got talent, he just doesn't have satisfaction.

Me, I get the biggest satisfaction from anything I do and listen to it over and over. I don't think I am that talented, however (other people have told me otherwise from time to time). It's frustrating for me when I can't do something, be it play drums and bass since I don't have the equipment or actually know how to play a song, period, but I never try to better myself in any area, really. The only thing I have tried to improve in the last couple of years is my singing and 'engineering'.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on February 18, 2006, 04:00:39 PM
Most of what I have heard from this board is evidence that there IS talent here...I think we all feel like giving up at times...even Picasso didn't paint every year of his life...I weed my collection of tape demos (they go as far back as 1983) and convert the ones I want to keep to .mp3... makes them easy to store and I can go back in time and remember my younger days when writing a song was so easy to me...I now write mostly instrumentals...I can write words still but I am more interested in upgrading my guitar skills...I play in a church group and its fun and we learn a lot from each other...we are not all buddies either but I have decided that that's not necessarily a problem...it takes time to get to know people and of course some you find out you dont want to be friends with anyway...so going solo is ok to me and being in a group sometimes to...I gave CD of some of my songs to our group leader but I never heard a comment since...so I just keep making music for myself cuz I enjoy it as a hobby and dont take it as my career ambition...but it would be nice...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: scooter on February 24, 2006, 09:11:34 AM
Lots...But I THINK  that  playing music (live WAY more than studio) is what's keeping me from self inflicted death...To me nothing beats the live experience, instant feedback, for better or worse...Not sure if I'm a composer really, although Zappa said anybody who improvises a solo is composing; But I am a guitarist/bassist/drummer/harmony singer--that's good enough for me, though I wish I could REALLY play keyboards...It does bother me sometimes that my worst solos might get the biggest response...Does that  happen to anybody else? I'm certainly not making a living at it now,but I'm not planning on giving it up...Gotta gig tonite--two acoustic gtrs.,(or a piano) and a harmonica--there's a lot a trio like that CAN do, and there's a lot it can't do...I prefer my Thursday night open mic jams, but my ears need a break...I could go on, but I got in late, and I need a nap, at least I think I do--bi-polars LOVE to sleep, well, some of us do--keeps us outta trouble...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 24, 2006, 07:59:50 PM
even Picasso didn't paint every year of his life.

Yeah, and some people don't even like Picasso...they prefer realism.  Pfft.  Sure, what-ever!  But, that goes to show that some people just won't like whatever you record no matter what you do, just because of their own personal tastes.  So to let others dictate what you create is totally messed up.  I make songs because it satisfies a personal need to create, like Picasso's love of painting.  And I love Picasso's paintings!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on February 24, 2006, 11:19:00 PM
I couldn't give up music; it's my life. I've been writing since I was 11...almost 17 years now. I know I'll never hit it "big", nor would I want to really. I just want to be able to keep recording and getting feedback. I just want to make NEW music that sounds like nothing else out there, to innovate. I know that I have a lot of people who hate the music I do, but there are also a good amount that actually really really like it. THOSE are the people I'm doing it for. I get a thrill out of that. I know this music could never be pulled off live; I secretly like that.

Without this, I honestly can say I have nothing. Music IS my life.



Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: theeponymuseudonym on February 25, 2006, 12:16:24 AM
BRIAN'S NEW BAND ARE LOVE SLAVES.....AND BORING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HEY MR.WILSON GET SOME DOPE SMOKERS,PLEEZE.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on February 25, 2006, 01:49:47 AM
I...don't think Brian needs to be around that anymore.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: scooter on February 25, 2006, 06:34:44 AM
"more dope smokers please" --you're kidding, right ? NOT funny though...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: theeponymuseudonym on February 26, 2006, 09:50:46 PM
I'm waiting for "hey little tomboy", "Lazy Lizzy" & "Deep Purple" to be performed by Brian Wilson's
new Alt-Schnoozers...

Thats what I'd pay to see. That, and a picture of "nude on the beach" Dennis!!!!



Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on February 27, 2006, 03:09:24 AM
even Picasso didn't paint every year of his life.

Yeah, and some people don't even like Picasso...they prefer realism.  Pfft.  Sure, what-ever!  But, that goes to show that some people just won't like whatever you record no matter what you do, just because of their own personal tastes.  So to let others dictate what you create is totally messed up.  I make songs because it satisfies a personal need to create, like Picasso's love of painting.  And I love Picasso's paintings!

Yes, I (we) have something to say inside of us that we want to say with music...it's not me looking for a hit single...it's a personal expression...it's just great when other people can dig it too!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Uncomfortable Seat on February 28, 2006, 10:28:55 AM
It's sometimes very difficult to have to relate to five other people, but i'm extremely thankful that I have them and their voices.  There are many times when I feel like it could be over, and then I would stop, but then I wouldn't know what else to do.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Joshilyn Hoisington on February 28, 2006, 02:01:28 PM
Quote
It's sometimes very difficult to have to relate to five other people, but i'm extremely thankful that I have them and their voices.  There are many times when I feel like it could be over, and then I would stop, but then I wouldn't know what else to do.

I think the occasional tension and difficulty is ultimately worth it, for the glory of collaborative creation.  Not that I can remember what that's like.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: scooter on February 28, 2006, 04:50:27 PM
Quote
It's sometimes very difficult to have to relate to five other people, but i'm extremely thankful that I have them and their voices.  There are many times when I feel like it could be over, and then I would stop, but then I wouldn't know what else to do.

I think the occasional tension and difficulty is ultimately worth it, for the glory of collaborative creation.  Not that I can remember what that's like.

After what I just went thru 2 wks ago, I would say it's easier on my nervous system to be a freelancer...So for now, I am...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 28, 2006, 06:42:48 PM
My school day is broken up into two different sections. I have 3 normal classes then I get on a bus and go 50 minutes away to an Audio Recording school. There i'm surrounded by talented kids who often surpass me in many projects we do. Each day when I leave there I feel so emotionally drained that i've actually cried on the bus back many times just out of that gray mood. While on that bus coming home I won't listen to any music, i'll sit and think about how terrible I am at everything which extends into music. These bad moods can swing right in from hardly any provoking. It could be a car i'll see and it'll set me off. It's tough to deal with when getting home I feel no inspiration to make any music at all.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on February 28, 2006, 07:34:19 PM
My school day is broken up into two different sections. I have 3 normal classes then I get on a bus and go 50 minutes away to an Audio Recording school. There i'm surrounded by talented kids who often surpass me in many projects we do. Each day when I leave there I feel so emotionally drained that i've actually cried on the bus back many times just out of that gray mood. While on that bus coming home I won't listen to any music, i'll sit and think about how terrible I am at everything which extends into music. These bad moods can swing right in from hardly any provoking. It could be a car i'll see and it'll set me off. It's tough to deal with when getting home I feel no inspiration to make any music at all.

Uh...so, ever feel like giving up music?  I guess that would be a 'yes'.  I mean, can they be SO good at music that it just makes you HATE music - is that the conclusion to this premise?  What is the underlying reason for this?  What are the real motivating factors behind your mood swings?  Don't take me wrong in this, just sounds like it's not just you having an isolated occurance in a vacuum, void of meaning, if you know what I mean. 


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on February 28, 2006, 07:43:03 PM


Uh...so, ever feel like giving up music?  I guess that would be a 'yes'.  I mean, can they be SO good at music that it just makes you HATE music - is that the conclusion to this premise?  What is the underlying reason for this?  What are the real motivating factors behind your mood swings?  Don't take me wrong in this, just sounds like it's not just you having an isolated occurance in a vacuum, void of meaning, if you know what I mean. 

No, I perfectly understand your questions.

Feeling the intimidation of others is just an aspect to what I guess is an insecurity I have with myself. It's often simply seeing people with such direction with their own music/careers/lives whereas I (self-imposed) have hardly any. That of course can get a person down for some time. Sometimes I find myself so incapable of "lightening up" and joking around with people whom I haven't know for a long time. Inside though i'm a chatty little person, though this will never leave my head when i'm with a group of people. This side of my personality while able to be fixed is a major bummer for lack of a better word. There are attempts i've made to be as social and outgoing as possible but those attempts are often shot down by similar insecurities that get me. A good nap usually takes care of that though to be honest. I'll find my body forcing me into sleep when i'm upset, almost as if it's the only way to get over that feeling.

 :) - this is because I feel like i've gone into whining in this thread.  :D


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on March 01, 2006, 03:55:08 AM
H&V I have had to accomodate superior musicians in my church...I was the only guitar player in a small band in 2002 and people would say that's great the way I played and I would say cheerfully "Oh thanks but I'm not that good"...finally a guy joined who was and is really really good on guitar and keyboards!!! He basically was handed the leadership and I repositioned myself as backup guitar, it was humbling...but the right thing to do...so what I'm saying is that there will always be people who sound better than ourselves to us...just keep on learning...this guy who leads us now I have learned a lot of stuff from him...you just have to learn to work with the right people for you..........

...........or else just go solo :D


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: scooter on March 01, 2006, 07:56:46 AM
Try to look at it the way I (as a gutarist) do--Clapton can't do what EVH can do, but Eric's doin fine, probably doesn't have to worry about geting a REAL job :)   Keep at it...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: mike8902 on June 26, 2006, 12:48:59 PM
Please guys don't ever give up because you're all so fucking brilliant. I thoroughly enjoy listening to all of your music. I sit up and cry everynight listening and listening and listening


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: b.dfzo on June 27, 2006, 06:23:10 AM
I would cry, too,  if I was listening to the music I've made...lol.  Bad joke.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Vega-Table Man on July 03, 2006, 08:33:33 AM
Feeling the intimidation of others is just an aspect to what I guess is an insecurity I have with myself. It's often simply seeing people with such direction with their own music/careers/lives whereas I (self-imposed) have hardly any. That of course can get a person down for some time. Sometimes I find myself so incapable of "lightening up" and joking around with people whom I haven't know for a long time. Inside though i'm a chatty little person, though this will never leave my head when i'm with a group of people. This side of my personality while able to be fixed is a major bummer for lack of a better word. There are attempts i've made to be as social and outgoing as possible but those attempts are often shot down by similar insecurities that get me. A good nap usually takes care of that though to be honest. I'll find my body forcing me into sleep when i'm upset, almost as if it's the only way to get over that feeling.

Wow, this is a paragraph I could have written ... I think I know how you feel.

As far as giving up making music ... I have been thinking about this a lot lately. Over the past few years, I've found it increasingly difficult to summon the energy and interest necessary to make any home recordings (or even get as far as writing a song). It used to be great fun and therapeutic for me, but I don't find that to be the case lately. It does seem more like a chore.

I do wonder if the solo overdubbing approach (which I've done since I was a teenager) has a lot to do with this. I think the opportunity to work with other musicians would definitely excite me and get me more into it.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on July 03, 2006, 07:54:30 PM
I've given up. Gave up months ago.  :D

Other things have shown themselves which have taken on a bit more importance to me personally. Music is a fantastic career for the right people though. I think there is a point however where the dream does die, and those who aren't fit for it fall in the back like I did. Take that as hope though, because there are many people naturally inclined to music and creativity.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 03, 2006, 08:00:00 PM
At one point I felt like giving up, but these days we are on a big songwriting streak. Besides, now we're starting to get offers from local labels, but haven't seen anything that sounds like a good deal (one wanted ownership of our copyrights).


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on July 03, 2006, 08:58:28 PM
http://www.negativland.com/albini.html  This is not a fun read.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 03, 2006, 11:43:11 PM
Thank you for posting that. It reminds me of why we are not shopping demos around to any majors right now. I mean, we could , and we might even get some interest (not likely), but it wouldn't be worth it.

That said, I do want to get something going soon. I mean, so far the highlight of our "career" is Taylor Hanson likes our stuff. I mean, that's cool, and I'm grateful for the compliment, but it's not putting money in my wallet just yet.

Sad. It always comes down to money, doesn't it?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 03, 2006, 11:52:43 PM
Quote
These A & R guys are not allowed to write contracts. What they do is present the band with a letter of intent, or "deal memo," which loosely states some terms, and affirms that the band will sign with the label once a contract has been agreed on. The spookiest thing about this harmless sounding little memo, is that it is, for all legal purposes, a binding document. That is, once the band signs it, they are under obligation to conclude a deal with the label. If the label presents them with a contract that the band don't want to sign, all the label has to do is wait. There are a hundred other bands willing to sign the exact same contract, so the label is in a position of strength. These letters never have any terms of expiration, so the band remain bound by the deal memo until a contract is signed, no matter how long that takes. The band cannot sign to another laborer or even put out its own material unless they are released from their agreement, which never happens. Make no mistake about it: once a band has signed a letter of intent, they will either eventually sign a contract that suits the label or they will be destroyed.
That right there is required reading. I didn't know about that....


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Aegir on July 04, 2006, 01:27:58 PM
Wow, that sucks. But now you're famous!

Nonetheless, I'm going to write "DON'T SIGN THE DEAL MEMO" in various places all over so I can ingrain that in my head.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 04, 2006, 06:37:09 PM
Hell, I just titled a new song as such. :lol


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Chris Brown on July 04, 2006, 07:29:37 PM
Quote
As far as giving up making music ... I have been thinking about this a lot lately. Over the past few years, I've found it increasingly difficult to summon the energy and interest necessary to make any home recordings (or even get as far as writing a song). It used to be great fun and therapeutic for me, but I don't find that to be the case lately. It does seem more like a chore.

I do wonder if the solo overdubbing approach (which I've done since I was a teenager) has a lot to do with this. I think the opportunity to work with other musicians would definitely excite me and get me more into it.

I totally know what you mean Vega-Table Man.  The past 8 or 9 months I've felt the same exact way, and it is incredibly frustrating.  I'm so used to being motivated to write and record all the time, but now I rarely do either, and pretty much all studio time is spent just playing songs on the piano.  On the rare occasion I get a good idea for a song, I don't get past a verse or chorus and then I just lose interest and drop it.  Maybe I'm just too critical, since lately it seems like everything I write sucks, but this never used to be a problem (at least until after I finished the song).  And then there are the songs that I have managed to finish, or almost finish...I can't even get movitated to record them.  Like you said, it feels like a chore now, rather than a therapeutic outlet.  I used to love recording, even if it took hours and hours to get it right.  Now I just don't have the patience for it.  It's really weird.  It happened very suddenly too (although I think losing my girlfriend last November may have had something to do with it, since before it happened I had been writing like crazy for an album I was going to give to her for Christmas).

I think the solo aspect of it is definitely a factor...so often I wish I had a group of musicians or singers that I could just teach parts to and let them do the rest.  If I have a song that requires lots of overdubs, it just seems like such a pain to have to sit down and do them all one by one.  Again, I used to enjoy this but now I just find it tedious, and I lose patience with it very quickly.  Same with vocal overdubs...I'm such a perfectionist that I want the vocals to be as good as they can be, but the fact that I know this takes time deters me from doing so.  I'm hoping all of this is just a phase and I'll eventually get back into it at some point.  I can totally relate to what you're saying though!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Vega-Table Man on July 05, 2006, 05:33:21 AM
I'm hoping all of this is just a phase and I'll eventually get back into it at some point.  I can totally relate to what you're saying though!

I hope it's just a phase too ... for both of us! I think that actually may be possible. Deep down I do seem to assume that one day I'll be able to get back into it again.

It does sound like our experiences are nearly identical. Even as far as writing just a verse or a chorus of a song, and then giving up ... This has been happening to me too. The thing is, I recognize that a few of these fragments actually do have potential, but I still just can't get motivated to finish them.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: shelter on July 05, 2006, 06:14:55 AM
My advice as an amateur musician with mediocre talent who has however sold a few thousand CDs and played many shows in 7 different countries the last few years:

First of all: homemade demos are useless. Nobody will listen to them.
Second: don't wait around until someone 'discovers' you. People won't come asking for you, not even if you're good.

Save some money and book a few days at a real studio. Send the result to every record label you can think of. Not just the big major labels, also to the small indie labels. If you offer a finished product (a professional recording plus, if possible, professional cover art work) you've got a chance that some low budget indie labels will bite. Cause record labels are lazy, they'll do as little as possible so they like it when people offer them a finished product. So far this has worked for every single band I've ever been in. And if this doesn't work, release it yourself! Having 500 or 1000 CD's professionally pressed isn't really that expensive anymore. Maybe that doesn't sound very glamorous, but it's a start and it beats waiting around for something to happen.

Good luck.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: scooter on July 05, 2006, 12:12:37 PM
Feeling the intimidation of others is just an aspect to what I guess is an insecurity I have with myself. It's often simply seeing people with such direction with their own music/careers/lives whereas I (self-imposed) have hardly any. That of course can get a person down for some time. Sometimes I find myself so incapable of "lightening up" and joking around with people whom I haven't know for a long time. Inside though i'm a chatty little person, though this will never leave my head when i'm with a group of people. This side of my personality while able to be fixed is a major bummer for lack of a better word. There are attempts i've made to be as social and outgoing as possible but those attempts are often shot down by similar insecurities that get me. A good nap usually takes care of that though to be honest. I'll find my body forcing me into sleep when i'm upset, almost as if it's the only way to get over that feeling.

Wow, this is a paragraph I could have written ... I think I know how you feel.

As far as giving up making music ... I have been thinking about this a lot lately. Over the past few years, I've found it increasingly difficult to summon the energy and interest necessary to make any home recordings (or even get as far as writing a song). It used to be great fun and therapeutic for me, but I don't find that to be the case lately. It does seem more like a chore.

I do wonder if the solo overdubbing approach (which I've done since I was a teenager) has a lot to do with this. I think the opportunity to work with other musicians would definitely excite me and get me more into it.

So there are people who feel the way I do...my two cents--take  a break, don't quit completely...and I don't think being a local legend would be all that bad...if you're playing Music, and people like it and you're not working in a grocery store, what's the problem?  If you really really wanna be the next (fill in the blank) that's OK, get in line...I would be perfectly satisfied with hometown sucess...on a personal note (no pun intended) I would LOVE to give up the grocery store...I am primarily a musician rather than a songwriter, but a talented one, so I've been told--no I wasn't standing in front of a mirror...If I could, I'd ask God to take away my drumming chops and make me a songwriter...as long as I could stil play guitar and bass and sing harmony... but I haven't given up TRYING to write songs...maybe that's my point--this is way more than two cents, innit ? DON'T GIVE UP--take a break,recharge your batteries...if this talent we have IS God given (dunno how else to explain MY [self-taught] ability)  then we probably shouldn't throw it away...


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Aegir on July 06, 2006, 09:10:59 PM
I honestly don't know how anyone could "give up" music.. I love writing songs and playing my guitar. Even if I were to get completely demoralized that I was never going to make it big (even if I was good enough), I wouldn't stop writing and playing.

Would I like to be in a band that played live often and recorded albums, whose members catered to my every whim? Of course. Would I like to play stadiums and be on the radio and be adored by young girls all over the world? HELL YES! But will the fact that none of that will probably ever happen be enough to make me stop doing what I love? Absolutely not.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on July 06, 2006, 10:38:37 PM
For me it's like the whole Syd Barret thing.

When I think about my own music that I've made it's just like a bad dream.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: PMcC on July 07, 2006, 07:25:02 PM
For me, it's like a Brian thing. Only one third of what I write and produce will ever be heard. And it's also like a Bach thing, where I won't find fame and fortune until 30 years after my death,,,


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: richardsnow on July 20, 2006, 12:19:08 PM
I'm having a "feel like giving up" week this week.

After we played the IPO in May I was on a high. We went down well, every one dug it. We came out 4th in the top bands of the festival out of over 100.

Then on Sunday we supported Snow Patrol.
Although we went down well. I could see that we confused a lot of people by singing harmonies and using falsetto vocals and melodic basslines.   
The trend at the moment seems to be to do a 8 quaver beats in a bar bass line of the same note repeated. ( i.e bass lines my baby son could play. )
with a simple repeated guitar motif fitted on the top.   
Despite playing infront of over 1000 people we sold 3 albums. :-[ pretty soul destroying.

I'll carry on though , what can you do?


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: Don't Back Down on July 20, 2006, 10:12:11 PM
Every now and then I feel like giving up music, but I realize I'm only 19 and have my whole life ahead of me to work on it and eventually make something that I'm proud of. Whether it gets heard by a large crowd, small crowd, or just to finally please myself. Meanwhile while I have the opportunity in college to do home recordings, perform Jazz music, Classical music, getting together with my buddies playing and writing this gives me more inspiration to continue on. There are occasions when I come across someoone "better" than me (especially at school) I tend to find myself wanting to give up, but I just need to keep on practicing and perfecting my craft.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: matt-zeus on July 21, 2006, 01:47:49 AM
I'm having a "feel like giving up" week this week.

After we played the IPO in May I was on a high. We went down well, every one dug it. We came out 4th in the top bands of the festival out of over 100.

Then on Sunday we supported Snow Patrol.
Although we went down well. I could see that we confused a lot of people by singing harmonies and using falsetto vocals and melodic basslines.   
The trend at the moment seems to be to do a 8 quaver beats in a bar bass line of the same note repeated. ( i.e bass lines my baby son could play. )
with a simple repeated guitar motif fitted on the top.   
Despite playing infront of over 1000 people we sold 3 albums. :-[ pretty soul destroying.

I'll carry on though , what can you do?


Don't worry, you're much much better than Snow Patrol (No offense if they're your friends but their music is as boring as hell), their music doesn't resonate my brain in any way at all. I can imagine that the majority of their audience (generalising I know) would have quite bland tastes!


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: richardsnow on July 22, 2006, 09:55:29 AM

Don't worry, you're much much better than Snow Patrol (No offense if they're your friends but their music is as boring as hell), their music doesn't resonate my brain in any way at all. I can imagine that the majority of their audience (generalising I know) would have quite bland tastes!

No i'm not keen either. I felt a real loner when they were playing. The whole crowd loved them. And I just stood there and said to my wife, "Why Don't I like this? am I weird?"


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: matt-zeus on July 23, 2006, 11:33:21 AM
I often feel a lot like that when people are raving about the latest NME cover band, I feel like I 'don't get it', but the truth is I don't think I do. A lot of stuff rarely makes me excited and just sounds like watered down versions of stuff which wasn't that good in the first place.


Title: Re: Ever feel like giving up music?
Post by: wind chime on July 30, 2006, 06:17:12 PM
When I want to give up I end up writing something new anyway.... ;)