The Smiley Smile Message Board

...what would you pick? I'd mainly expose him to some of that modern music he apparently hates, just to see what his opinion would be. Here would be my choices:

Animal Collective - Sung Tongs. This album is kind of like a continuation of Smiley Smile, but brighter. It's psychedelic, acoustic 'freak folk' music with some adventurous harmonies and arrangements. ("Who Could Win a Rabbit" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTbd0Ncsyus (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTbd0Ncsyus))

Moses Hogan - some kind of compilation of his music. Over the last couple of decades, he took a lot black spirituals and made amazing choral arrangements for them."Elijah Rock" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLR31UyuFP0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLR31UyuFP0) = not the best recording, but it'll do) is a must hear song, and it's now practically a standard for many high school choirs. It reminds me of some of the SMiLE era vocals Brian came up with.

Stereolab - Kyberneticka Babicka EP. It's not the best Stereolab release. Really, I just would want Brian Wilson to hear the song "Kyberneticka Babicka". I predict he'd either really like it or run out of the room screaming after a couple of minutes. It's 10 minutes of two chord repetitions and processed vocal "ba bas" and "ooh ooohs". One review I read called it a missing song from Brian's early 70s work. (Unfortunately, "Kyberneticka Babicka" isn't on youtube.com, so here's "Interlock" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICm7rdiVWAY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICm7rdiVWAY)

Os Mutantes - Everything is Possible! (Greatest Hits) - Great psychedelic latin music from the late 1960s, mainly here just to teach Brian Wilson a lesson for releasing the song "Mexican Girl". It's like how Ravi Shankar felt he had to personally teach George Harrison a thing or two about how the sitar is actually played after hearing "Norwegian Wood". ("A Minha Menina" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ohTi8lbeok (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ohTi8lbeok)

Sufjan Stevens - Michigan. He's probably one of the more interesting pop "composers" since Brian Wilson, and he started almost as young. Although his songwriting isn't as good as Brian Wilson's (not to say that he doesn't have some great songs, because he does), the arrangements are outstanding at times and quite innovative for pop songs, all uniquely influenced by Philip Glass and folk. He also has an Americana theme going on with his music, with the albums "Michigan" and "Illinoise". ["Detroit" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRMIRpYl-VE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRMIRpYl-VE), ignore the intro before the song, it's about 50 seconds, although I personally like it because I live just a few miles from Detroit in a slowly sinking suburb)

BTW, I just found out that the melody of "Don't Hurt My Little Sister" was completely stolen from the beginning of the song "She's So Fine" by Flash Cadillac & The Contours. That's sad, I love that melody.

I cant pick my 5 now, but if I were to play Sufjan, it'd definitely be Illinoise, I think that album is a direct result of Brian's imprint in modern pop music.

I'd sit down with my big box of rare Brian Wilson "outside production" and other rare 45s... stuff like Sharon Marie, Kenny & Cadets, Paul Petersen, the Survivors, Rachel and the Revolvers, etc.  I'd be interested to see how many of those he'd remember, and if he had any interesting stories to tell about them.

Then I'd play "Thank Him", and ask why he's never done a "real" version of this tremendously wonderful song that has been lost for 45 years.

No need for any albums - I'd just play Be My Baby over and over and over and over and hope that Brian gets soooo happy that:

(a) he dosen't just wander off, and
(b) he answers all my questions with more than one word

I sent him an LP by the Bobby Doyle trio after asking his managment if it would get to him. They assured me it would though I never heard back. I really didn't expect too I guess. Why I sent it is because I like Kenny Rogers' early stuff when he was doing rock and jazz and Brian once said he liked him too (check out the Just Dropped In reference in H.E.L.P.)  This Bobby Doyle group Kenny was in was kind of like the Four Freshman mixed with Ray Charles. Rogers' voice was a lot higher then with no gravel. So if he did get it, I think he would have liked it.

I'd play him my 5 favorite BB/BW albums (Pet Sounds, Smile, Sunflower, Friends, Today) and bug him with questions about the songs non-stop...

And if the albums must be by someone else, I'd probably start with "XO" by Elliott Smith...

I reckon he wouldn't care all that much for any current or even cutting edge music. He likes easy listening and oldies stations. Probably better play him some Paul McCartney.

Brian definitely would not like Animal Collective. Though they have some Beach Boys influence, their alternative and noise influences would turn him off.

Jesus And Mary Chain - 'Psychocandy'

Lou Reed - 'Metal Machine Music'

The Shaggs - 'Philosophy Of The World'

PiL - 'Metal Box'

Dennis Wilson - 'Pacific Ocean Blue'

just kidding...

I think i'd rather eat a meal with Brian, and discuss food with him to be honest.

I love Moses Hogan.  I actually got to meet him at an all-state choir thing I did my senior year of high school (2001).  We sang one of his compositions, and it was so cool being taught by the actual composer.  Such a brilliant vocal arranger he was...Brian would definitely appreciate him.

I'd play him The Flaming Lips' The Soft Bulletin and hope he doesn't freak out. I'd bet there'd be a few parts that he'd like...maybe.

I wonder if he's ever heard Pink Floyd's Piper at the Gates of Dawn?

As far as playing him some BB-influenced post-70s music from more of an alternative background goes, I've read that someone once played him "Pale And Precious" by The Dukes Of Stratosphear and he thought it was great.

Was Pale and Precious the album with Psonic Psunspot and 25 O'Clock compiled together?

Blue Nile - High
Prefab Sprout - Steve McQueen
Elliott Smith - XO
Ron Sexsmith - Other Songs
Rufus Wainwright - Rufus Wainwright







or Kind of Blue...

I'd also play some for him that he would more than likely hate...I'd actually be more interested to sit down and discuss tunes with Scott or Darian. Not that I dont love Bri!

Wilco: Being There
Joe Henry: Fuse
I'm also gonna include The Flaming Lips: The Soft Bulletin, it's one of my favorites
I have to include Weezer: The Blue Album cause it's a masterpiece
R.E.M. - Up

That's Chips From The Chocolate Fireball. They just played him that one song.

Such a cool record. I like it even more than all the other XTC stuff.

First off, I'd try to use vinyl, if at all possible.

-Rubber Soul
-Bookends
-Love You
-A collection of later Spector projects (post 1970)
-Ok Computer

1. Brian Wilson 1988
2. Imagination
3. Getting In Over My Head
4. What I Really Want For Christmas
5. That Lucky Old Sun

For two reasons....I doubt if he's listened to any of them more than a few times, if at all. And, I would be curious to see how long he could sit through each one.

haha, good call John Stone!

I agree 100%. Would anyone on this board want to discuss their work or career 24/7 ?

I'd sooner give him 5 travel books.

I think it would be great if, say, he were a guest in my home and were perusing my music collection, then asking me to show him five albums he hadn't heard. Otherwise, no thanks. The glazed-eyed, uninterested Brian would depress me. My dad is about Brian's age ... I get enough disinterest from him when I play him music I like. Remember, just because some band may claim Brian as an influence, or sound to our ears like Brian, (for better or for worse) doesn't mean he'd give half a f*** about them. He's made pretty clear over the years that he wants to listen to what he already likes. I say leave the old guy alone.

I'd also play him Sweet Mountain .... just imagine where Brian was when he did this, he was in some mood

Take a look at most of the topics on this board. If BW/BB fans dont have hypothetical situations to discuss, there wouldnt be much discussion at all.

Leave it to Luther Downer to ruin all the fun...

Yes, he's quite a spoilsport, ain't he? Is it his genes? He seems to imbibe a lot, so perhaps he's battling a hangover situation. Or something.
But yeah, that Wilson fellow can get on your nerves too, especially when you are a news hack.
Proof: 'Brian, you like movies, I heard. Now then, what was the last movie you been to?'
Brian: 'Norbit'.
Hack: 'Hmmm you're in the know. What is for you the best movie of all time, ever made?'
Brian: 'Norbit'.


This really happened. I smell a 'my friend Bob' kind of situation.

Oh, I'm much more sinister than that. While I was playing the albums, I'd start asking why he was a failure as a both a popular musician and father, and how it feels to only be able to write pale facsimiles of the songs he perfected 40 years ago. Then I'd tie him to a piano bench and tell him that he'd never be free until he wrote a 3:30 length avant-garde song about cowboys and indians with 6 different musical sections. During all of this, I'd keep dangling cake and peanut butter and jelly sandwiches in front of his face, pulling them just out of reach and then devouring them right in front of his face, laughing. Then I'd tell him I'm a clone from the future sent by Spector's grandson, made from the mixed DNA of Mike Love and Phil Spector. Then I'd just do Native American dances to Animal Collective songs until he completed my song.

Yes, Luther, I want Brian glazed-eyed and uninterested. I just don't care like you do, I'm a greedy, selfish fan and I want his soul as a souvenir.

Although the band date from the late 1960s, I'm sure that tune is from the early 1970s.

Jeez, I go to work and come back to find everybody hates me. Guess I'll go eat worms, you bunch of f*ckers. EDIT: Whoa! I thought that would be edited to "luthers," as was happening earlier. And in case I am being mistaken for serious here, I'm kidding. (One never knows what gets missed...) I don't think you're a bunch of f*ckers. Or a bunch of luthers.

When did the swearing ban get lifted? I don't mind myself but it's funny to read here.

In my slightly abbreviated state of mind, I thought you typed "Lutherans".


Honestly I never minded the swearing, although I didn't lift it myself.

Sufjan Stevens is awesome.

I would lock him in a room and make him listen to these...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bD_0wegMc7Q    The Music Tapes - Majesty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_RbSAwMa3U    Daniel Johnston - The Story of an Artist

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkE-TZVM4Oo    Grandaddy - Fare Thee Not Well Mutineer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6sEdodZEg0    Trachtenburg Family - Mountain Trip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UjiOpwHNZ4    Mount Righteous - Sea Man

Either way works for me though I think I may have sworn only once on here. In real life I am a little worse lol.

I think this is a great topic idea if you accept that i a) it's obviously totally unfeasible to be in that situation, and b) if you were, Brian would most likely not be interested, but if one can pretend that he was keen to hear some new music I would play him:

1. Panda Bear - Person Pitch just because it would be interesting to play him something so overtly influenced by Pet Sounds, (and Phil Spector too). This record comes the closest for me to doing justice to the Brian Wilson legacy i.e. music that is both modern/forward looking and influenced by The Beach Boys, rather than tired pastiche which so much BB-influenced music is. The imminent Animal Collective record Merriweather Post pavillion takes the BB legacy one step further in (from what I have read and the live version of its songs that I've heard) in combining Beach Boys-style harmonizing with techno and dance textures - as if BW had taken ecstasy I guess! This I find really interesting as it really is developing Beach Boys music and taking it in a very new and artistsically legitimate direction, imo. Youtube 'Brother Sport' - this is one of the new tracks which'll be on the album.

2. The Pollytones acoustic version of BWPS. I love that - I'm sure it would put a smile on Brian's face too. Or probably not - who knows how he'd react to anything!

3. Can't think of anything else. Maybe Back to Black - it's not my favourite but it'd be interesting to get BW's take on an artist rerpoducing that Spector sound. I suspect he's heard it already.

sufjan's illinois, definitely - glad someone beat me to that observation.  it has possibly the most SMiLE ethos and flavour of any album i've heard, and is a balls-out tune-drenched joy.

other than that - ?  maybe things i reckoned would blow what's left of his mind.  jeff buckley's 'grace'.  goldfrapp's 'felt mountain'.  ravel's 'daphnis and chloe' (big influence on miles davis and burt bacharach, context fans.)  and maybe either a joni mitchell album, a bernard herrmann soundtrack or one of steven wright's two 'pony' albums, to get him giggling.  or, just to send him into cerebral orbit, some charles ives.

as for those who'd rather discuss food with him - i don't believe you.  what a gigantic waste of your time that would be.  and imagine the thumping you'd get from people.  'you had a couple of hours with brian wilson, and you talked about scallops?  what?'  (unless it's a deliberate comic self-stitch, of course.  like getting an audience with nelson mandela and asking him what his favourite number is.)

I really don't think Brian would like a majority of the music you people have been mentioning. Especially Animal Collective / Panda Bear.

Wow, another Music Tapes fan. If I was ever in a profession where I had my own lobby for guests to wait, "In an Ice Palace" would be on constant repeat.

Brian would hate Music Tapes, too. Julian Koster would get a punch in the face. (Sometimes he needs one anyway: a Christmas album on the singing saw? f***...)

as for those who'd rather discuss food with him - i don't believe you

Guess what? Its true. Not food for me but as I mentioned, travel.
So let me get this right. If you met Brian at the coffee shop he frequents and you struck up a conversation, you would encourage him to talk about music? Nice.
Just because it is the reason we are on this board does not mean Beach Boys music, Brian's music or the music of others would be of interest to Brian Wilson or any artist during their down time. In fact I would class it as rude.
The time for music is when they are writing it, recording it, promoting it or performing it. Outside of that leave it alone.

Given the state of Brian in the last 40 years I can not think of any reason he would want to discuss music out of hours. His short answers when he is on the clock confirm that.

You're right. I'd actually tie him to a spare bed in my house, break his legs and force him to go through all his albums, dissecting every note. Then (after re-breakings of his legs at the necessary intervals) we'd begin going through every album whose creator had either mentioned or been critically linked to BW. And then we'd go back to his influences. If I suspected he wasn't listening, I'd slap him across the face a few times. Tired? Smelling salts and speed. Brian, we are GOING to talk about this, damnit. It interests me and it's in your field of expertise. You OWE me, motherfucker. I bought your albums. [Breaks an ankle again for good measure.] That's a good use of both our time.

Oh god, I imagined every little bit of that.

Well, I'm starting think Brian's not a very nice guy. He hates on everybody else's new music, and then giving us his best doe-eyed toothy grin, tells us to buy something like Gettin' In Over My Head or Imagination, complete with slick modern production that would make Britney Spears proud. Maybe Koster would hit Brian in the face with a singing saw for those albums.

Maybe.

Here's an idea if Brian ever wants to make a genuinely contemporary album - but he never will- here's an idea on how I would help him do it, if I was the co-producer. Rather than play Brian the track, I'd have the band perform the songs for Brian, in their own style. He'd be a lot more receptive that way.

With that in mind, what songs would I like to play for Brian? "Killing Me Sweetly" of the new Scott Weiland disc. Although David Bowie is Weiland's biggest influence, he has mentioned Brian as an influence also, although this particular track sounds like something Dennis would've written. It's  a beautiful song.

The Daniel Johnston catalog would be interesting for Brian's reaction. Him doing "Casper the Friendly Ghost" could be the coolest thing ever.

For some reason, I would love him to do Alice in Chains' "Down in the hole".

I would play him Pacific Ocean Blue and asked him what he thought of it.

Believe it. Not scallops though if I can help it, i'd like to see what he thinks of Portuguese custard tarts and see if he wants to try some nice British cuisine - this is assuming we're in a British restaurant of course. Otherwise Brian will have to invite me to his regular restaurant to see what I think of his favourite dishes, I like (among other things) Steak, Burgers, Chips (french fries), Lasagne, Fajitas, Stir Fry, All day Breakfast, Escalopes, Jacket Potatoes, Omelettes, Pizzas, KFC, Corn on the cob, Chicken, Waffles, Pancakes, Birthday cake, Tea, Oxo, Cup-a-soup, Spag Bol, Chocolate (especially Belgian and Swiss) and biscuits. So if Brian is reading this then any of the above will do, but i'm really open to anything.

Really like that idea of talking food with Brian. In fact, this could make quite a good article: meet the guy at a restaurant, have a nice chat with him about his favorite dishes and maybe get to hear some free and easy anecdotes along the way.

2nded. In fact, the few times I joined in on the blueboard chats with "Brian," food is pretty much all I ever did discuss. And for what it's worth, "he" always responded.  ;D

So, Luther, you throw him a virtual hamburger and he responds? The words 'familiar' and 'scenario' come to mind.

I'd play him the Paley sessions...

now he sounds like pavlov's beach boy.  (or do i mean one of b f skinner's beach boys?)

 :) yeah, leave it to our Luther to travel the route of deep psychology...

This thread is weird, but this post was a real highlight.

Put another record on.

Yeah. Something like: 'Dickie Cheney Sings For Children (And Grown-ups Too!). Right?

How can we be so sure Brian wouldn't like it? He likes Smile now, and perhaps may like some modern Smile like musicians.

Amen! And how did this quote end up on the Al Jardine topic?

I like to have a couple tabs open in my browser. Using tabs is liking driving down the freeway while you're using your cell phone and trying to fix your hair. Eventually, you're going to crash into the wrong topic.

If I really felt like playing Brian something crazy, I'd play Black Moth Super Rainbow for him: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MC6aAs4kkbY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MC6aAs4kkbY)

I wonder what he'd think of Neutral Milk Hotel's In The Aeroplane Over The Sea.

1. Brian Wilson 1988
2. Imagination
3. Getting In Over My Head
4. What I Really Want For Christmas
5. That Lucky Old Sun

For two reasons....I doubt if he's listened to any of them more than a few times, if at all. And, I would be curious to see how long he could sit through each one.


If he did take the time, he might find a lot of good songs swamped by indifferent production.  Of course, he'd also find a lot of drivel and a lot that lies in between.

My guess--and obviously it's just a guess--is that he wouldn't like it. Over the years in various interviews he's talked about not liking things purely based on the singer's voice. And while I think Mangum's voice is really touching, it's not good in the sense that Brian Wilson seems to like singing. I really believe that on the whole, he'd rather hear an album of any words whatsoever--or none at all--being sung well in harmony than something really creative and personal but not necessarily sung well. But Mangum certainly does like BW.

be careful, he might take some of the melodies and re-write lyrics to em!

Am I the only one who thinks Aeroplane Over the Sea is an overrated collection of garbage?

No.

my 5


1. Stereolab - Cobra and Phases in the Milky Night

2. The Ronettes Feat. Veronica (of course!)

3. The instrumental version of Amy Winehouse's Back to Black album

4. Duffy - Rockferry

5. Nico - Chelsea Girl

I didn't know this existed...I presume the Spector influence is more apparent that way?

No, both you and Luther are the only ones who think that.

I love that album, but I have come across others who did not like it. At this point the hype may be hurting AOTS--the comments I hear are usually along the lines of "It's not THAT good" or "I"m not impressed" or "I don't see what all the fuss is about."

But for me, it's in my top ten of all time, maybe my top five.

Actually I love it, believing its among the best five albums of all time. I was just answering his question.

Yes and plus a lot cooler!

Here's my 5:

1. Florida Suite by Frederick Delius - a beautiful, very descriptive tribute to Florida in the early 20th century by a fairly obscure English composer. I think BW would love the aural imagery - you can almost feel the humidity in the air!

2. Bali by Wondermints - I wonder if Brian ever heard the whole album all the way through. Clever, witty, almost tongue-in-cheek at times.

3. Ravel - Orchestral Works (Montreal Symphony, Charles Dutoit conducting) - two works off here in particular are such magnificent orchestrations! The Mother Goose Suite has all the playfulness and childishness BW loves, yet is a very sophisticated piece of music. And Le Tombeau De Couperin is in the same vein, only even richer if that's possible.

4. Waltz For Debby - Bill Evans Trio - virtuoso live performances by the Bill Evans Trio of classic jazz/pop songs, just the kind of thing that might inspire. Sadly Evans' superb bassist Scott LaFaro was killed in a car crash a few days after this was recorded...

5. The Association - their self-titled album - if there was ever an album that could surpass the BBs/BW Band in vocal "gorgeousness", this might be it. Excellent songs, superbly played and magnificently sung. Maybe it would create a competitive spirit in Brian.

Or maybe I'm completely full of crap and he'd hate allof these!  ;D

Great list, mr. McShane. A truly great, and quite esoteric list. Chapeau!

Jim's is the only list I can see Brian liking.

Didn't someone, maybe Tony Asher, hip Brian to this around the time of Pet Sounds, so it may well have inspired his best work!? Anyway, great choice. I love Bill Evans, especially Undercurrent.

Don't know if anyone's already mentiond this, but I'd love to play The Zombies' Odyssey & Oracle to Brian. It's the album from the period that comes closest to sounding like Pet Sounds imo, with all the delicate vocal arrangements. Brian must have heard it - I wonder what he thought? It's a beautiful album.

I'd play him the American Spring album. From what I've heard, he still really loves that album (and possibly one or both of the singers   :o  ).
But I think it might stir him to start talking about the music a bit. After that, he'd probably lose interest, but maybe I'd put together a compilation of songs Brian might like and play it in the background while I chat with him about food. I'd probably also bring him a food-y present...maybe my chocolate molasses cookies, because that might set him at ease.

Am I the only one here who, if I were in the unlikely situation of meeting Brian face to face and given an opportunity to play him anything....would play him some of my own compositions?  Sure, I don't have 5 album's worth...YET, but how much time would I have with the old fellow?

It would be interesting to see his reaction.  The worst thing that could happen is he could laugh hysterically, or fall asleep, or tell me to please go away.  I wouldn't take it personally.  Afterall, this is the guy who created Pet Sounds, Good Vibrations and all the rest.  On a positive note, he might hear something he likes and encourage me to keep trying.

If you're gonna daydream, daydream big! 

That's the spirit, sockittome! Half way through your song, you could say "I can't work out what I should play here" and with any luck Brian would pluck one of his 'money chords' out of thin air - bingo a co-composition with Brian Wilson!!

Yeah, imagine Brian arranging and reworking your song on the spot and teaching everyone in the room harmony parts to sing...

Ha, if Brian was able to sit through one of my songs for two minutes and not lose interest that'd be validation enough.

yes! i love the album and i was just wondering a week or two ago what brian thought of it!

Brian would run out of the room screaming if I played him my music as is, but he'd really get into it if I was writing it in front of him. That'd scare the hell out of me, though.

Delius is hardly obscure - at least here in England. Very strong influence on the orchestral arrangements of Nick  Drake, and I wonder if BW would appreciate the Nick Drake albums - as long as he didn't hear Pink Moon and the story of ND's death.

Ravel's Tombeau is certainly a lovely piece, and in fact a suite of 4 pieces (or 6 for piano), but was written about the fallen in the 1914-18 war, so may prove too depressing... although that theme - of the passing of the older European civilisation, is also relevant to Delius, and of course, via Van Dyke Parks' lyrics, to Surf's Up!!!

Sadly, F. Delius is not well known here, and his music is rarely performed live. I have the Vernon Handley/Ulster Orchestra Florida Suite recording, I used to have Sir Adrian Boult's on LP but it is missing... I'm glad to hear Delius gets more respect in the UK.

I'd pay top dollar to hear our magnificent Chicago Symphony play the Florida Suite!

Despite the subject matter, Le Tombeau is so energetic and lively and full of color that I defy a listener not to enjoy it! The Prelude and Rigaudon are both just spectacular. Menuet is heartbreakingly beautiful and delicate. And followed by the energy and drive of Rigaudon, it's one of the most enoyable pieces of music I have ever heard. I don't find it depressing at all. It could just as easily be about a busy Paris street scene!   :)

Thanks so much for your comments too!!

I think he would love:

'Prélude A L'après-midi D'un Faune' by Claude Debussy, as played by the Boston Symphony Chamber Players (it is an original score for a full orchestra, but this group, led by Michael Tilson-Thomas, takes the biscuit IMHO - the intimacy and eroticism is palpable in every note. Pure shepherd's delight, in other words... ;))

Ed Carter and Mike Kowalski play on the Bryter Later album, actually.

Well spotted, AGD reminded me of that earlier as well. Maybe they played it to him - they must be proud to be on that album. But I doubt if introverted 1960s privately-educated colonial English chap would appeal to semi-introverted Californian from a more, er, standard educational background.

I was pretty skeptical of it b/c of the hype when I first listened to it, but it's grown on me, and now I absolutely love it!