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Smiley Smile Stuff => 1970's Beach Boys Albums => Topic started by: Charles LePage @ ComicList on December 26, 2005, 10:57:06 AM



Title: Sunflower
Post by: Charles LePage @ ComicList on December 26, 2005, 10:57:06 AM
Discuss, review and rate Sunflower, released August 1970.

(http://www.smileysmile.net/images/albums/sunflower.gif)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 26, 2005, 11:03:03 AM
For me, this is the most overrated Beach Boys album by fans. I like some of it -- and consider "This Whole World" to be among the top handful of Beach Boys songs ever, comparable to all the greats. But some of it is really grating to me. Often pointed to as an example of how great a writer Dennis was becoming, I think that half his tracks on the disc are absolutely embarrassing ("It's About Time" and "Got To Know the Woman"...those lyrics, even for the Beach Boys, are just remarkably bad). Of course, the aforementioned TWW, Cool Cool Water, Slip On Through, Forever are gems, and I like some of the others, like All I Wanna Do and Our Sweet Love. To me, they're easy-going, pretty songs in the tradition of Friends, but with the talented Mr. Desper at the helm, thus sounding brilliant. I'd give this about a 3.75 if I could.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jason on December 26, 2005, 01:09:55 PM
The album that made me the fan I am today. I don't care if it's overrated or underrated, it will always have a soft spot in my heart. Everyone is in their top form, especially Dennis and Mike. Five stars.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 26, 2005, 01:14:12 PM
I have to give this a 5. The album everyone thinks Abbey Road is.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: monkee knutz on December 26, 2005, 11:32:35 PM
The best Beach Boy album... even if it does have 'At My Window' on it.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Wolfgang on December 27, 2005, 01:34:31 AM
Sunflower is one of my favorit BB LP. I would say no.2 

Smile!
Wolfgang


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: donald on December 27, 2005, 12:34:02 PM
I recognize the quality of the album.  The range of talent of the band is undeniable.

It just always struck me as a little TOO SWEET for the most part.  I do listen to it as I rotate playing of BB albums but it gets less play, for example, than Holland, Love You, or Friends.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SurferGirl7 on December 27, 2005, 01:13:26 PM
Great album. It was good idea to put Sunflower with Surf's Up on twofer. It is a very strong side one. The only thing I don't like is Tears In The Morning. A bit too dramatic for my taste. My favorite vocals of the whole album is All I Wanna Do. The backing vocals and that intro. really kicks butt (that's besides all side 1, Our Sweet Love, At My Window and of course Cool, Cool Water).




Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Wizard_Glick on December 27, 2005, 07:29:12 PM
For me, this is it. This album is my all-time favorite, not only of the Beach Boys, but by anyone! My all-time favorite. I never get tired of listening to it, I wore out my original vinyl album over the years, and it has a permanent seat in my home CD player.

Hail Sunflower!!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: monkee knutz on December 27, 2005, 07:36:16 PM
Hail Glick & his freeble energizer! I can't live without this album either. The vinyl sounds sooooo goooood!!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 27, 2005, 07:38:05 PM
Hail Glick & his freeble energizer! I can't live without this album either. The vinyl sounds sooooo goooood!!

me three. I don't wanna fight anymore. I just wanna lay in the grass and be cool.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: HighOnLife on December 27, 2005, 07:40:56 PM
It's docked one star because of Bruce's dreck.

 :P


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 27, 2005, 07:42:12 PM
Deirdre is AMAZING! Tears, less so.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: HighOnLife on December 27, 2005, 07:43:09 PM
I'm referring to Tears. Dierdre the best song Bruce ever wrote.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on December 27, 2005, 07:45:39 PM
The album is worth it for "All I Wanna Do", in my top 5 BB's tracks for sure.

The rest of the album suffers from sounding alittle too 'sweet', I much prefer the production on 20/20 for example...  Compare the sound of "Be With Me" or "I Can Hear Music" to anything on this album, and 20/20 kicks it.  Brians falsetto on "Sunflower" shits me too, sounds like a bad Mickey Mouse impersonation...  just listen to the close of "Add Some Music"... God awful.

3.75/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: HighOnLife on December 27, 2005, 07:47:05 PM
Hey, at least Brian doesn't sound like he did on Orange Crate Art.  :D


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 27, 2005, 07:48:04 PM
*sigh*

You narrowly survive, Matinee, due to your affinity for All I Wanna Do, my favorite song of all time.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on December 27, 2005, 07:53:22 PM
*sigh*

You narrowly survive, Matinee, due to your affinity for All I Wanna Do, my favorite song of all time.

Ha, I know a good song when I hear it mate... And "Add Some Music" sure as f*** isn't.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: monkee knutz on December 27, 2005, 07:56:44 PM
I used to think Johnston's contributions made this album a bit 'light', but many years ago I realized they help to make it perfect. Then I fell in love with Disney Girls. Luther, I wouldn't change a word of Got To Know The Woman... positively Denny!

I just wanna lay in the grass and be cool, too!
 ;D


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 27, 2005, 07:57:40 PM
That's one of the most beautiful, soulful and spiritual songs I have ever had the honor of hearing. I love it. Really."Music is in my soul.." Exactly.

Disney Girls is great. I agree, my Monkee man.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: HighOnLife on December 27, 2005, 07:58:34 PM
Let the 'At My Window' lovefest continue!



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 27, 2005, 08:31:36 PM
Luther, I wouldn't change a word of Got To Know The Woman... positively Denny!

A perfect encapsulation of a personality doesn't make a good song, necessarily. I agree with the last two words of your above sentence. The first part, though...I couldn't disagree more.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on December 27, 2005, 08:56:04 PM
Ian, you're right, the middle eight of "Add Some Music" is one of the most beautiful, soulful creations ever.  "When day is over.. I close my tired eyes.." The rest of the song though is utter dreck.

The rest is worth suffering through for that bridge though.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on December 28, 2005, 05:35:19 AM
I have to give this a 5. The album everyone thinks Abbey Road is.

WORD.  And this is from an Abbey Road fan.  The comparison is perfect and apt.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on December 28, 2005, 05:41:42 AM
For those of you complaining about lyrics...

THIS IS A (*^&#@ BEACH BOYS ALBUM!!!!

Since when do we expect great lyrics from them?  Seriously.  And some of us actually don't analyze lyrics while listening to music at a primary level.  I hear the words and how they are sung, how the vocal lines fit with the song, before I hear what is being sung.  So unless they are just BAD (and these aren't), bad lyrics don't bother me (example of when they do bother me -- Hey Little Tomboy).

Musically, this is the climax and absolute peak of the band as a band.  Though Brian still had a heavy hand in these sessions, Carl and Denny were also forces, and Mike contributed some of his best vocals and songs (Like, say, All I Wanna Do) and Bruce had his one good song (I say -- replace Tears with a finished Soulful Old Man Sunshine and you would have the most perfect album imaginable).

For me, 5 is not high enough.  This is the album that made me a hardcore BB fan and the one I like best and play most often.  And yes, that includes Pet Sounds.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 28, 2005, 12:02:37 PM
And some of us actually don't analyze lyrics while listening to music at a primary level.
But some of us do.

I hear the words and how they are sung, how the vocal lines fit with the song, before I hear what is being sung.  So unless they are just BAD (and these aren't), bad lyrics don't bother me (example of when they do bother me -- Hey Little Tomboy).
Me too. And so when I hear "Fun, Fun, Fun," it's great. When I hear "I Get Around," it's great. They are clearly intended to be just good-time rock music. (For that matter, same with "Susie Cincinnati" and many others, including of this era.) But when I hear a song that has lyrics intended to do something else and they fail, I have every right to call them sh*t--and I do it. "It's About Time" is absolutely idiotic, a song about some poor hasbeen famous rock star? I'm amazed Carl could even sing that trash. I'd personally take Brian writing the Love You songs every single time. Don't mistake me (or whoever) saying that these lyrics are awful to mean that I can't appreciate songs with less-than-VDP wordplay. Sometimes it just means that, well...they don't work. They're bad.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on December 28, 2005, 12:32:45 PM
But some of us love those lyrics, as well.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 28, 2005, 01:05:38 PM
Shall In insert some bit about opinion or subjectivity or something?  ;)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on December 28, 2005, 01:28:28 PM
You mean you can't ignore the words and listen to the most convincing BB rockers of all?  Because the two Denny tracks you dislike are the most credible all-out rocker type songs that the band ever did.  And I love them for that reason. GTKTW has a great rising chorus with some nifty Mike bass vocals, and the congas/drums on IAT are convincing.  Plus Carl gets a real solo for a change.  What's not to like?  I listen to how those songs are sung, not what is sung.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 28, 2005, 01:33:20 PM
I have listened, many times. GTKNW, for me, is more tolerable because the other aspects of the song come through to bear more of the weight. But while It's About Time might rock (indeed, does rock), it still isn't good. I can like parts of a song and not others, or decide one aspect balances out others. IAT isn't musically strong enough to make up for the awful lyrics. Better ones might have made it at least what I would like (but never love, under any circumstances).


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on December 28, 2005, 01:34:15 PM
(but never love, under any circumstances).

Correction--maybe if they inserted a bit about loving and praising Luther, for example...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 01, 2006, 10:22:55 PM
Love every single song. Deirdre the most. Love the sound, amazing sounding album. Dig the vibe.

One of my favourite Beach Boys albums.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: dogbreath on January 02, 2006, 02:03:29 AM
Could NOT believe how gorgeous this was when I first heard it (on release), and it still blows me out of the window every time I play it (which is why I leave it open). Heavenly stuff from Brian, with soul from Dennis. After Pet Sounds, their best album, and I know some rate it above that.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: wesi72 on January 02, 2006, 07:59:33 AM
Fabulous album - my favourite.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: APPLEI on January 04, 2006, 10:14:00 AM
I have to give this a 5. The album everyone thinks Abbey Road is.
i agree with that,
i think all of the members of the group gave strong performances on this album


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 08, 2006, 12:43:50 PM
I'll admit though that sometimes I wonder if the songs are as strong as the production and sound of the record.

Same could be said for much of Pet Sounds s'pose.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 08, 2006, 12:47:13 PM
I'll admit though that sometimes I wonder if the songs are as strong as the production and sound of the record.

Same could be said for much of Pet Sounds s'pose.

I believe several of the songs are far inferior to the production of Sunflower. The production is pretty consistently fantastic. The songs...about half that. But I disagree on Pet Sounds, which I think is easily the most consistently good BBs album in terms of songs.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Glenn Greenberg on January 08, 2006, 02:39:07 PM
I give this a 4.

Great album, but it gets a point taken off because it's not quite up to the standard set by PET SOUNDS, and because of "Tears in the Morning."

You take off "Tears in the Morning" and put on "San Miguel" instead, and you've got a DAMN great album.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Howdy Doody on January 08, 2006, 07:24:20 PM
I don't dig Dennis's songs either on this outing.  However Sunflower is a rarified gem in that it has a bevy of gourgeous songs on its grooves.  I like Diedre and not Tears in the morning too much.  Our sweet love is in my top ten BB songs of all time.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on January 10, 2006, 05:34:08 PM


The rest of the album suffers from sounding alittle too 'sweet', I much prefer the production on 20/20 for example...  

20/20 is definitely edgier and more schizophrenic. Maybe that's why people dig it.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on January 10, 2006, 06:17:02 PM
3.

There are 12 songs on this album. 6 of them are some of my favorites and fucking brilliant: 1. Slip On Through, 2. Cool Cool Water, 3. All I Wanna Do, 4. This Whole World, 5. Forever and 6. Add Some Music To Your Day. I find the other half of the album pretty hard to listen to. I almost gave it a 4, but I really can't stand half the music on this album. The production is amazing though. Gee, maybe it'll grow on me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 06:29:46 PM
Man, Deirdre, It's About Time and Our Sweet Love rule! Give em a chance again.
I can understand not liking Tears, Window and Got To Know, but those will grow on you with time as well.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 06:32:51 PM
Man, Deirdre, It's About Time and Our Sweet Love rule! Give em a chance again.


Two out of three ain't bad.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 06:54:22 PM
It's about time for you to admit you're wrong about It's About Time.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 07:09:06 PM
If or when I am, I will. Until then...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 10, 2006, 07:13:06 PM
Put it on LOUD.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 07:14:04 PM
If I stub my toe, I don't hit it with a hammer to make it feel better.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 10, 2006, 07:23:08 PM
I can't stand all that loud guitar solo noisy rock stuff.

But if I put it on loud I start to see and feel what the people who love that stuff are into.

Your example doesn't really fit with music.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 07:24:31 PM
It does to me.

I do like plenty of loud guitar solo noisy rock stuff. Just not sh i t.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 07:29:17 PM
It's About Time is incredible. Really.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 08:33:47 PM
Criminey!

These ain't just the words of an aussie drongo... It's About Time is absolutely fantastic... the most convincingly rocky the Beach Boys ever got in the studio, instrumentation is fabulous, The harmonies jaw dropping eg. "another WOOOOOOOOOORLLLLLD!"  Holy crap!  How can you not like that!?  Shoulda been a big single.

Kicks the f*** out of Add Some Music, and some of you like that, and not this... Silly, silly.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 08:36:21 PM
Add Some Music is amazing, too. Both of those songs are incredible. The whole damn album is.

*knocks all your heads together like the Three Stooges*


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 08:39:31 PM
Ian, if it was just the middle 8... maybe opening the album like "Meant for You" then I'd say it was amazing.

As it is, it's a fucking gem (middle 8 - "Music is in my soullll...) wrapped in dog poop (everything else).

* slaps Ian upside the head *


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 08:40:09 PM
Criminey!

These ain't just the words of an aussie drongo... It's About Time is absolutely fantastic... the most convincingly rocky the Beach Boys ever got in the studio, instrumentation is fabulous, The harmonies jaw dropping eg. "another WOOOOOOOOOORLLLLLD!"  Holy crap!  How can you not like that!?  Shoulda been a big single.


Easy. It's garbage.

I used to be a famous star yap yap blah blah fvck me. Jesus.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 08:40:42 PM
*kicks both of you in the nuts*


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 08:41:07 PM
Ow.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 08:42:49 PM
Will someone else who knows how great both those damn songs are help me out here?
Thanks in advance.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 08:43:54 PM
* Backs Ian into a corner *

Nope, you're on your own mate...

He says "artist" Luther, not "star"... ::)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 08:45:15 PM

He says "artist" Luther, not "star"... ::)

That doesn't help. In another band, someone would have said, "Man, these lyrics are ridiculously bad."

But it was the Beach Boys...Hell, Al and Carl probaby thought they were great. I'd rather hear some Riely enviro-trash than that.

OK, maybe not.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 08:46:54 PM
Quote
Nope, you're on your own mate...

For the moment.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 08:54:19 PM
Ha, Run Ian!

Go round up your goons! :)

Luther... I think thems fine lyrics, they serve their purpose...  C'mon, it's about the delivery... Carl could be singing the dictionary around this time and he'd smoke it. 

He and Denny were on fire vocally on Sunflower.  Absolutely.

"OH THE CREATION!"

http://www.reasontorock.com/tracks/its_about_time.html

Just found this website, read that, and believe.

"This recording is a beautiful incarnation of the rock aesthetic. It is a true collaborative work, with multiple songwriters and musicians working together seamlessly (and with little input from Brian Wilson, the often-alleged “genius” of the group). The words are meaningful and expressive, but clearly rely on rock instrumentation and vocals to achieve their impact. The recording is wonderful, with every note, instrument and sound contributing to the overall, unified effect. A sense of liberation, of release from constraints, is expressed by both words and music. The basic 4/4 rock beat serves as a sturdy foundation for the overlaid rhythmic complexity delivered by multiple drums, instruments and vocals. Electric instruments are used to provide a unique sound to the piece, with the detailed sounds of the notes mattering more than the symbolic values recorded by musical notation. And the whole recording achieves an artistic effect that far transcends traditional elements of a song."


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 09:00:27 PM
That review applies to the entire album.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 09:00:37 PM

Just found this website, read that, and believe.


You found that on the internet? Then it's gotta be true...

It fvcking sucks. One of the worst BB songs ever. Carl singing well doesn't make words less awful.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 09:01:42 PM
Utter heresy.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 09:03:28 PM
"Brian Wilson, the often-alleged “genius” of the group"

No, this is heresy.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 09:05:11 PM
Pfft... you're not one of them "I'll only like it if Bri was involved" Beach Boys fans are you Luther?

Well Bri does backing vocals, happy?

What I find funny is that everyone is singing "Nono", "no", "no no" "no"...

The Bri chimes in with "Ohhh yeah." 

Always makes me smile that bit.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 09:06:50 PM
Pfft... you're not one of them "I'll only like it if Bri was involved" Beach Boys fans are you Luther?

No. But neither am I one of those, "I'm going to act as if Brian weren't CLEARLY the most talented member, just to be different and spite others," either.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 09:07:51 PM
I should note, my love for Holland ought to prove my position. I'm not a Brian-only fan.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 09:09:35 PM
Bri was the most talented member.

Until Denny took over the reigns around "20/20" time, and he didn't give them up until he died.

That's not some anti-Bri attitude, I love the big guy... It's just what I believe.

I love Holland too.  Onya Luth :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 10, 2006, 09:13:21 PM
Dennis was too limited in scope; his music was sometimes nice, but it feels like 2 or 3 songs being rewritten over and over again.

And he hardly took over at 20/20, or hung on till he died. I didn't notice him dominating the travesty of 15BO, or the Brian-laden Love You, or the sh1tty MIU. Or the awful KTSA. Dennis became pretty good by the late 60s, but the truth is, he stayed that way through the late 70s, and he was done soon after, unable to hold even the croaky notes Brian was offering up.

Anyway, that's it for me today. Be back to bicker later. A pleasure, as always.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 09:19:36 PM
Well, if the other band members had allowed him, he coulda saved all them albums you mentioned...  Look at the gold on LA, he was writing stuff that good all through the 70's...  Personally, POB is ten times the album Love You is to my ears.  He reaches depths I can't hear on Love You...  We can only dream of a Denny led mid 70's BB album...

Hell, from Friends on his was some of the most consistently great and varied music on the albums he was ALLOWED to contribute to...  Yes, a couple of duds... but many absolute gems.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 10, 2006, 11:17:33 PM
Dennis was too limited in scope; his music was sometimes nice, but it feels like 2 or 3 songs being rewritten over and over again.

And he hardly took over at 20/20, or hung on till he died. I didn't notice him dominating the travesty of 15BO, or the Brian-laden Love You, or the merdaty MIU. Or the awful KTSA. Dennis became pretty good by the late 60s, but the truth is, he stayed that way through the late 70s, and he was done soon after, unable to hold even the croaky notes Brian was offering up.

Anyway, that's it for me today. Be back to bicker later. A pleasure, as always.

WTF????
WHO CARES IF HE COULD SING LIKE HE DID IN THE 60's???!!!
POB is a masterpiece, man. And his songs have as much variety as Brian's.
Speaking of Brian, there's a man who LITERALLY writes the same songs over and over.
He abdicated the BB songwriting because he held the same opinions of their later material that you do, Luther.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 10, 2006, 11:19:37 PM
I do  remember a song of Brians... "Keep an Eye on the Warmth of the Sun"... err. ;)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on January 11, 2006, 03:55:16 AM
<trumpet blare in background the cavalry theme>

ENOUGH OF THIS LYRIC BASHING!

It was 1970 -- show me a band that didn't succumb to such "serious" lyrics at some point.  But in this case, it isn't pure cliche, as at that time in BB history, it could have been a serious view of Brian's retreat or of some member's enlightenment perhaps.  I wouldn't call them inspired lyrics but surely not as bad as you point out.  But the way that they are sung!  Man, Carl just wails!  There are no musical flaws anywhere on IAT.  And the drums are awesome!  Try to find a drums only boot that I have heard (no idea where my copy is now) that rules too.  And Carl on guitar solo?  I've died and gone to heaven.

And Add Some Music -- come on, this is pure Beach Boys, and I bet that Brian had a lot of lyrical input.  Sounds like his words. 

How anyone can bash Add Some Music and It's About Time and praise Solar System is beyond me.  If you like one, you should like the other.  Lyrics are peer.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 11, 2006, 04:10:30 AM
I think the lyrics are a serious view of Dennis' enlightenment...

I used to be a famous artist (BB's out of touch), "Struggling to express myself" - the other BB's not encouraging Denny to write so much, and being viewed merely as a sexual object of the group.  He used to blow his mind on drugs until he realised that the way for him to write songs was in 'knowing me'... rather than seeking some higher being.

It's all there in plain english, fantastic lyrics... sound great when sung.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 11, 2006, 09:55:06 AM
Thanks Jeff!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 11, 2006, 01:06:28 PM

How anyone can bash Add Some Music and It's About Time and praise Solar System is beyond me.  If you like one, you should like the other.  Lyrics are peer.

Normally I don't say things like this, but since I'm under all-out attack the past screen or two...

That statement is just wrong. It's stupid. To say that I should like one song's lyrics because I like another's makes no sense, especially in the three examples you list. I DO like Solar System because it's funny. I don't like It's About Time (by the way, I listened to Sunflower a few more times today at work, so it is fresher in my mind) because it's a stupid story. The music rocks--no question. Carl sings well--no question. But that doesn't mean I HAVE to like it. I fvcking hate it. What's the difference to you? I think the "story" absolutely ruins it. I can't listen to it.  I would rather--BY FAR--listen to Brian's silly, nonsensical lyrics, whether they're intentionally funny or the product of him just being out of it, than listen to pseudo-serious, pretentious ones.*

Add Some Music, although I don't recall saying anything one way or the other (not to say that I didn't), I am ambivalent about. It has a great vocal arrangement. Its lyrics are stupid, but more harmless, to these ears.

But really, Jeff--"if you like one, you should like the other." That's just wrong.


*Speaking of having listened earlier, I am OK with some of the lyrics. The later ones, when he sings something about how we need to love one another, etc., and it seems a bit more general, are fine. I don't particularly like them, but neither am I willing to go on record against them the way I am with the earlier ones in the song.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on January 11, 2006, 01:18:22 PM
I never said you were wrong or dumb for your opinions.  Read me carefully -- it is "beyond me" -- I don't get it.

And I wasn't saying that if you like one you must like another.  But the reasons you give for hating one could be applied by people hating the other, is my point.  You say that the lyrics for IAT are stupid.  Fair enough.  But a LY hater would use the same rationale to torpedo Solar System or Johnny Carson, that's my point. Again, you are free to your opinion, and I am free to look at you very strangely, shake my head, and say,"I don't get it."  In my mind, all of those songs are on the same level in terms of lyrics.

Remember -- most people around here subscribe to the phrase "IMO".  We just argue our opinions strenuously, especially those of us who place Sunflower in their personal top 3 albums of all time.

"Should" = "I would think in a real setting this would be the case" ; not = "it is a moral imperative that you like this"


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 11, 2006, 01:27:21 PM
I didn't say you were dumb, Jeff. But I did say you're wrong, and I do think you are. The second sentence I quoted is wrong. The first one wasn't my issue.

Anyway, here's where I realize that I've said my opinion, it's unpopular and will be argued against, and so I have nothing else to add, really. Then we get to the point where Ian or somebody says that's quitting and I'm admitting I'm wrong or something. Then I say it doesn't matter, it's just pop, and then I catch hell for that, too. This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friend. Some people started singing it not knowing what it was, and they'll continue singing it forever just because

 ;)




Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on January 11, 2006, 02:28:15 PM
You just sound p**sed and angry and that was not my intent.  I expanded upon my meaning in my last post, though, on the sentence you disliked:  "If you hate the one song, I would think that you would hate the other -- I know I would."  That was more my point.  "Should" being probably the wrong word.  I know that I would raise objections to Solar System before I would the Sunflower tracks.   But that's me.  I can argue that as my opinion, and I can say that I think I am right and thatit is a valid one you should consider, but I can't say you are stupid for not agreeing with me.  But I do not want to offend either.  I just assume that the arguments get intense around here because we all like it.  If you don't I am sorry.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 11, 2006, 03:15:04 PM
I always sound pissed, or so it seems.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: aeijtzsche on January 11, 2006, 04:33:43 PM
Beach Boys songs have lyrics?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 11, 2006, 04:35:32 PM
That's what Mike Love tells me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: aeijtzsche on January 11, 2006, 04:50:45 PM
Seriously, even after millions of listens, I still forget the lyrics to most songs, including "Stoked".  Lyrics just don't register on a deep level.

I'm glad about that, too.

I skipped Got to Know the Woman without even listening for more than 20 seconds, because it seemed so typical.  Then, for some reason, I decided to listen to the whole thing, and I'm glad I did, because the "choruses" are really interesting and cool.  It doesn't fit with the "bar-room romp" feel of the rest of the song, which I like, and the womens voices bathed in reverb and Mike's ridiculous-as-usual bass mutterings are typically brilliantly silly.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 11, 2006, 04:53:47 PM
There are songs where the lyrics mean far more to me than the music; others are about equal; others the opposite. And I like (or hate) different lyrics for so many reasons, it is impossible for me to explain how or why. I don't much worry about it: if someone has the time and energy to analyze why I feel or think the way I do about them, they're more than welcome. But I try not to get too worked up about the reasoning behind my tastes.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff Mason on January 11, 2006, 05:35:57 PM
Seriously, even after millions of listens, I still forget the lyrics to most songs, including "Stoked".  Lyrics just don't register on a deep level.



You and me both.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 11, 2006, 06:47:18 PM
Seriously, even after millions of listens, I still forget the lyrics to most songs, including "Stoked".  Lyrics just don't register on a deep level.

But... Stoked has one a one word lyric.  And you just said it.  Perhaps that was your humorous intent... If so, hehe :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: aeijtzsche on January 13, 2006, 09:23:14 AM
My intent is never humourous.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 13, 2006, 10:49:57 AM
Your avatar makes it seem that you are here for funny business. Get a picture of a car crash or something.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Chris D. on January 13, 2006, 10:55:28 AM
Quote
enviro-trash

Is that even possible?

Ian -- what the f***?  A thread with people kicking other's nuts, and you and I took so much heat not too long ago over what?  Here's my input: BALLS BALLS BALLS.

Matinee, do you honestly talk like this in person?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 13, 2006, 11:11:51 AM
HAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: analogdemon on January 13, 2006, 11:20:16 AM
OK children.  Can we please knock off the attacking of Luther and get back to discussing Sunflower?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 13, 2006, 11:21:58 AM
That's what we've been doing the whole time, knothead.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 13, 2006, 11:25:37 AM
One day I had Sunflower on and I fell asleep during "At My Window". I woke up during the verse to Cool Cool Water and it was just amazing. I guess I wasn't fully woken but I was aware of what sound was entering my ears and I could interpret it. It all made sense then for that one track.

I've never enjoyed that song as much as in that state, that once.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: analogdemon on January 13, 2006, 11:26:40 AM
It really is a shame that this album didn't get any love when it came out.  I don't think that the critics who called it "the true follow-up to Pet Sounds" were too far off.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 13, 2006, 11:31:53 AM
I'm sure that a few good reviews cropped up here and there. The guy who complimented it for having a much crisper stereo sound than Abbey Road was with it. Though that was more a compliment to Steve Desper than the actual music from the guys.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 13, 2006, 12:04:13 PM
Rolling Stone gave it a rave review, as they did with 20/20 and Surf's Up.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: analogdemon on January 13, 2006, 12:10:27 PM
I more meant love from the general music-buying public, not critics.  I know Sunflower got generally positive reviews in the music press.  As a matter of fact, it may have been Roling Stone that called it the true followup to Pet Sounds.  I guess the Beach Boys just weren't cool in 1970.  *shrug*


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 15, 2006, 02:59:21 AM
One day I had Sunflower on and I fell asleep during "At My Window". I woke up during the verse to Cool Cool Water and it was just amazing. I guess I wasn't fully woken but I was aware of what sound was entering my ears and I could interpret it. It all made sense then for that one track.

I've never enjoyed that song as much as in that state, that once.

Damn man, exact same thing here...  I woke up during the haunting, Smile-era part... lying awake in bed at night, hearing that... the heavens opened ;)

Onya mate, perfect.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on January 15, 2006, 07:03:23 AM
OK children.  Can we please knock off the attacking of Luther and get back to discussing Sunflower?

Were the posts before this one attacking me? If so I didn't notice. Oh, and if so, fvck anyone who was doing it.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jonas on January 16, 2006, 04:13:42 PM
I cant believe so many people dislike Tears....its one of my favorite tunes. Its so beautiful to me, even though the lyrics are sad :p



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 16, 2006, 04:39:11 PM
Yep, I used to be one of them, now I'm one of you.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Compost on January 17, 2006, 11:31:23 AM
Mostly good.

'Tears in the Morning' is a nauseating concoction of treacle and dogmerda.
'Got to Know the Woman' is...lame.  Sorry, it's cheesy.  Way too Jerry Lee for me.
'At My Window' is very forgettable.

4


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 21, 2006, 03:27:48 PM
Seriously, even after millions of listens, I still forget the lyrics to most songs, including "Stoked".  Lyrics just don't register on a deep level.

I'm glad about that, too.

I skipped Got to Know the Woman without even listening for more than 20 seconds, because it seemed so typical.  Then, for some reason, I decided to listen to the whole thing, and I'm glad I did, because the "choruses" are really interesting and cool.  It doesn't fit with the "bar-room romp" feel of the rest of the song, which I like, and the womens voices bathed in reverb and Mike's ridiculous-as-usual bass mutterings are typically brilliantly silly.

I normally don't pay attention to lyrics in songs; I'm just not lyrically inclined. That probably explains why out of roughly 200 songs I have recorded in 5 years, every last song save one is instrumental.

I love Sunflower. This, Friends, and Holland happen to be my 3 favorite BB albums. And, yes, that includes Pet Sounds. I *love* PS, but I get the most enjoyment from these 3.

Got to know the woman...call me crazy, but it sounds like a proto-Ben Folds Five song to me. Love it. Actually, there's not a single track on this album that doesn't appeal to me in some way. Yes, even "At My Window". Hell, at times, esp. "At My Window".


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on January 24, 2006, 07:56:47 PM
I have the album on now. And I cannot even begin to explain how amazing the actual sound of this album is. Is there anything comparable (non Beach Boys) that I could listen to?

I don't think i've ever heard anything with such rich sound.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 27, 2006, 04:57:16 PM
Yep, I used to be one of them, now I'm one of you.

What happened Ian?  Bruce Johnston and Peter Allen whooped your ass? ;)  I think "Disney Girls" is better than Bruces two tunes here, but I like them nonetheless... The massed "I've got tears, I've got tears, I've got..."  is quite powerful.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 27, 2006, 04:58:33 PM
Quote
Bruce Johnston and Peter Allen whooped your ass?

Yep, and they "don't use jelly".


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 27, 2006, 05:05:37 PM
ROFL!  :o

BWAHAHA...

Oh dear, but seriously what made you reevaluate mate?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on January 27, 2006, 05:10:13 PM
I opened my heart. And closed my snide and ironic nature.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on January 27, 2006, 05:11:34 PM
'ey, that's touching mate... but never froget who y'are.

Is it based on fact, 'tears'?  Autobiographical...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: TV Forces on February 02, 2006, 11:35:13 AM
Another album that would be a masterpiece if not for some awful song choices.

"Got To Know the Woman" ruins the first side for me.  "Slip On Through," "This Whole World," "Add Some Music," and "It's About Time" are all great. 

I'm not big on "Tears in the Morning."  Overly emotional Bruce there.  "Forever," "Our Sweet Love," "Cool Cool Water."  Superb!   4 out of 5 stars!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Don't Back Down on February 02, 2006, 11:53:37 AM
My only gripe (sp?) about this album is that they should have opened it up with "This Whole World". Other than that, that's pretty much it. This album moved to my top three. Beaten by Summer Days, and Pet Sounds. I don't know, I enjoy "Got To Know The Woman" a lot. A great lead by Dennis (didnt even know it was him on lead at first) I love the backing vocal on it especially Mike's "mmahmmahmmahmmowmow" during the chorus. "Deirdre" is great. Love the backing track with the trombone, flute, percussion, etc. Great lead from Carl on "It's About Time" but then again, has Carl ever given a bad lead? Lovin' the beat of the drums and percussion in the back. "Tears In The Morning" - great instrumental track with the acordian mixed in there, always enjoy a good Bruce lead. His voice fits perfectly in his leads, imo. "All I Wanna Do" has a good melody too it. All in all, I give it a 5.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: TV Forces on February 07, 2006, 08:55:05 AM
You mean you can't ignore the words and listen to the most convincing BB rockers of all?  Because the two Denny tracks you dislike are the most credible all-out rocker type songs that the band ever did.  And I love them for that reason. GTKTW has a great rising chorus with some nifty Mike bass vocals, and the congas/drums on IAT are convincing.  Plus Carl gets a real solo for a change.  What's not to like?  I listen to how those songs are sung, not what is sung.

Oh I know..  everytime Dennis says "do the chicken," I merda myself.
No really..  that song is like "Octopus's Garden" on Abbey Road.  Ruins it!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: theeponymuseudonym on February 12, 2006, 06:33:17 PM
dennis say "DO THE CHICK-AHH!!!"

man alive...denni w gettin his groove on,boy.

a little bckgrnd on sunflower here. 1992/93 continuing on my Bb freakdom.

at first, i was embarrsed by it. i thought slip on, was too hollywood sounding, especially after i smoked a j, then was driving around thinking the background harmonies haad to be women!!!!
i could see them on some f**in' Krofft pupppet show singing "belive,belive" while Denny wa bbeing seriously lustful.
kinda the same way as on here comes the night the wild honey version. the overall lust made me yes, uncomfortable.

then i had a unrealistic anticipation for tihs whole world by Brian. see according to the todd gold bio;
Brian desciberd this tune similar to Surfs up!!!
so when i heard the chugga gtr, immediately, i thought what the f? ui was expecting introspective ruminations, instead i get more Krofft variety show???

to be continued...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: theeponymuseudonym on February 14, 2006, 05:34:01 PM
"add some music"- loved the group vocal

"got to know the woman"-dennis gettin his groove on
"deirdre"-someone read my BJ appreciation post
"its about time"- a denny inspired reading from Carl, perhaps moved by Brian. an excellent blacksploitation
outtake!!! or starsky and hutch.

Side 2
"tears"- a girlfriend once lamented how wimpy guys can get when faced w/ a cold and lonely bed.
i like Bruce's reading. It took balls to utter the word dAMN a a BB lyric i bet!!! wonder if this why the song didn't chart?

"alli wann do"- to date Mike & Brian's LAST GREAT SONGWRITING COLLAB. IMHO
beautiful production & you can distinctly hear all the bb vox individually.
funny would Mike Love allow his voice to be so bent on a new vox track ever nowadays????

"forever"-beautiful chords, full o'heart from Denny & the gang, Brian falsetto rules.
 when i did first hear the song, for a spell, i thought maybe they were coping the descending chord structure of the day...HOWEVER, this is considerinh, probably the only otyher time they used this was for time to get alone.
so, there, a minor critique of Forever. oh, and DENNY WILL HAVE HIS REVENGE ON JOHN STAMOS!!!

"our sweet love"- GOD ONLY KNOWS rewrite in my book. beyond beautiful sung by Carl. tears my heart out!!!
when did Brian write this, doctor??? i dont think it was on the last capitol disk, nor the landlocked versions eh??
the lyric about the child w/his new toy brings a choke of grief to me.

"at my window"- i won no new Bb converts w/ this one. !st i thought sung by Alan, then i listened closer, and said ahhh, it is my friend Bruce!!!
awesome florish at the end w/ Bass Gtr and harmonies at the fade. i wonder if this tune & add some music were recorded at a similar date???

"cool cool water"- Brian's funny relief at the end of L.p.'s seems to have morphed on this track. I'd like to start a post series on the comedown of Sunflower by using cool water last!!!
Brilliant use of moog synth, they sound like raindrops. reminds me of Pitterpatter the gtr lick sounds like falling rain also!!!
Brian and Mike probably buried the hatchet on this tune, smoked reefer and let it go.

well these are my first recollections of the beach boys Magnum opus SUNFLOWER, now please reply...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jason Penick on February 23, 2006, 01:56:37 PM
It really irks me when people say, "this album would be great if only they replaced song A with song B, and switched C & D around in the line-up."  Make yourself a mix cd and shut the f*** up already.


Dennis didn't write the lyrics to "It's About Time", Bob Burchman did.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Matinee Idyll on February 23, 2006, 04:04:38 PM
"Forever" verses always reminded me of "Day in the Life"... what's limiting about ascensions and decensions...  Still, both ripper songs.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: RobtheNobleSurfer on February 23, 2006, 05:48:32 PM
That's your opinion and I respect that.  ;D

There is no such thing, however, as BB music that is too sweet for me.  Sunflower is sweet yet soulful. Slip On Through is what "Wild Honey" SHOULD have sounded like. This Whole World is one soulfully kickass Brian rocker that holds its own with the likes of I Get Around or any heyday BB track. Plus there are comtemplative numbers like Add Some Music, Our Sweet Love, and (especially) Forever.  Hell, I even like Bruce's songs (Deirdre more than Tears..) Cool Cool Water tops everything off with inventiveness reminiscent of SMiLE (hell they even use SMiLE's water chant to boot!). I put this as one of my top 10 "desert isle" BB discs and I stand by this.

5 out of 5.

Or 6 out of 5?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: summerinparadise.flac on March 19, 2006, 06:36:18 PM
4/5
I love alot of it, Slip On Through was probably the first Beach Boys song I really flipped over. I don't like the two Bruce contributions, but they are pleasent enough not to bother me.
All I Wanna Do has one of my favorite Mike vocals.
My only complaint is the backing vocals sometimes sound harsh to my ears.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Reverend Joshua Sloane on April 14, 2006, 07:50:58 AM
"When Girls Get Together" should've been included or used to replace one of the subjectively lesser-thought of songs. I've been listening to it all night and it's amazing. The lyrics of course are terrible in every way, all except the last bit;

'One bright springtime morning
I over heard an elderly lady's voice
As I walked by her bench she told her friends of her great loss

After they'd gone away
Three little girls came skipping through the park
Talking of little boys and getting home before it's dark'

I think those two sets are pretty nice the way they bounce off from each other. The song's production is so spiritual; trombones, cellos, horns, woodwinds, and that wonderful sleepy little guitar part. This is one of those songs that really makes me sit up, makes me feel like crying from such a great feeling. I'd take this song over any on Sunflower to be honest.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: busy doin nothin on April 14, 2006, 05:04:57 PM
"When Girls Get Together" . . . . I've been listening to it all night and it's amazing. The lyrics of course are terrible in every way, all except the last bit;

'One bright springtime morning
I over heard an elderly lady's voice
As I walked by her bench she told her friends of her great loss

After they'd gone away
Three little girls came skipping through the park
Talking of little boys and getting home before it's dark'

I think those two sets are pretty nice the way they bounce off from each other. The song's production is so spiritual; trombones, cellos, horns, woodwinds, and that wonderful sleepy little guitar part. This is one of those songs that really makes me sit up, makes me feel like crying from such a great feeling. 

Amen, brother.  I think Sunflower is perfect as is (so I guess I disagree with you on that point), but boy do I agree with you on "When Girls Get Together."  What an absolutely beautiful song.  You're right on target about the "spiritual" production/arrangement.  And you're right, those last two verses are very poetic (although I like all the lyrics).  I also particularly love the vocals -- the simple two-part harmony is rare for the Beach Boys and sounds very sweet.  I can't tell if it's Mike double-tracked harmonizing with himself or Mike and Brian (if it's Brian singing harmony his vocal is really buried in the mix, but AGD's liner notes say it's Brian).  Either way it's a beautiful vocal, very soulful in its way.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on May 07, 2006, 01:52:49 PM
I have to give this a 5. The album everyone thinks Abbey Road is.

Do you mean an attempt to recapture the magic?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: I. Spaceman on May 07, 2006, 01:55:05 PM
No, but yes!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: The Trader on June 11, 2006, 07:33:31 PM
Sunflower is bliss from the second its starts till those closing notes of Cool, Cool Water. Definately one of my favourite record of all time.

I love it so much that i actually resist listening to it, until ive done something positive. and then i reward myself with a Sunflower listening session.  :P


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on June 18, 2006, 03:04:21 PM
Quote
I can't tell if it's Mike double-tracked harmonizing with himself or Mike and Brian (if it's Brian singing harmony his vocal is really buried in the mix, but AGD's liner notes say it's Brian).

It's Brian. You can hear him a little better on a good pair of headphones.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Shady on October 02, 2006, 01:54:06 AM
Got it today.

5 stars...stunning


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Magic Transistor Radio on January 05, 2007, 10:23:55 PM
I like this album a lot, but I only gave it a 4. I think that all of the songs are very well done, but none of them really knock me out. Like on Surfs Up (Til I Die, Life of a Tree and Feel Flows). Although, unlike Surfs Up there are no weak tracks. I have a hard time listening to Add Some Music though.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: melissalynn on February 02, 2007, 02:30:27 PM
A BIG 5 stars from me. This is my favorite all around BB album. Many little-known gems are hidden on Sunflower...the first time I heard it I was in Heaven.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on April 17, 2007, 04:37:00 AM
I really like this album. I also have a soft spot for it because this was my first real exploration in to becoming a fan of the boys. Believe it or not before I got into the band I had no idea of ANY of the bands songs. I didnt know who Wouldnt It Be Nice, California Girls or Fun Fun Fun or any songs were by? But this album was what started it for me. I took the CD out of my dads collection about a year and a half ago and I put on the song Forever (after it was suggested to me) and I fell in love with it. I didnt stop playing that song for ages. Then I heard Tears In The Morning and although I know a lot of people dont particularly like that song it was better than a lot of garbage I had been listening to previously and therefore it made me think to myself - "man ive never heard either of these songs yet they're so great, maby these guys have more unheard gems like this" and so there is where my desire to explore their albums/songs in more detail began. So I hold a soft spot for Forever and Tears In The Morning. I love pretty much every song on this album:

Slip On Through - fantastic opener. Sets the tempo nicely for a great album
This Whole World - a great BW composition and production. Classic song
Add Some Music - a great group effort (in terms of vocals - though I dont think Dennis gets a turn at lead? or am I wrong there?)
Got To Know The Woman - not the best cut on the album but a bit of harmless fun and pretty good nonetheless
Deirdre - can get a bit old and boring but still decent enough and still a pretty decent composition
Its About Time - another decent song though nothing spectacular
Tears In The Morning - already covered this one above. I will add though that I really love the piano section at the end of the song
All I Wanna Do - a fantastic song. Brilliant
Forever - no doubt one of the bands best songs ever in my opinion (though of course Im biased due to the reason I mentioned above)
Our Sweet Love - a fantastic song
At My Window - again a bit of harmless fun. I really dont mind this song though its certainly the low point of the album
Cool Cool Water - slendid composition once more. Rounds off the album nicely.

Overall brilliant singing, brilliant engineering/production and generally brilliant songs. An easy 5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: thomasogg on July 12, 2007, 03:37:46 PM
4 of of 5. An undeniably great album, but I personally prefer Surf's Up and Holland. Dennis' songs are all great of course, though they really shouldn't have left off his magnificent 'Lady', a ballard even better than Forever (ideally they could've included it in place of either 'Deirde' or 'At My Window'. Preferably Deirde - I hate Bruce!) Anyway, I'm also not overly keen on 'Add Some Music..', but the rest of the album - 'Our sweet love', "cool cool water', 'this whole world' - is pretty great, and 'All I Wanna Do' is probably Mike's finest hour in the bands entire career. For 2 and a half minutes it's genuinely possible to fogot just what an absolute c*** the bloke was! All in all, a great record! Not in my top 5 perhaps, but definately ten ten!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on September 04, 2007, 02:20:22 AM
This would be a perfect album if not for one line: "do the chicken".


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on September 04, 2007, 02:29:44 AM
This would be a perfect album if not for one line: "do the chicken".

So does that mean that you didn't give it a 5 just for that?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on September 04, 2007, 03:21:22 AM
No, I still gave it a 5. Nothing's perfect.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on September 04, 2007, 09:28:49 AM
No, I still gave it a 5. Nothing's perfect.

Yeah I gave it a 5 of course... I agree though, nothing is perfect kind of like in "You Still Believe In Me" how it has the bicycle bell etc.. Im used to it but I would have preferred Brian had left it out (I know it was impossible unless he re-recorded it but still) and "come on and do the chicken" kind of bugs me aswell


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on September 04, 2007, 02:12:01 PM
No, I still gave it a 5. Nothing's perfect.

Well, a 5 on a 5 scale is. By definition, right?  ;)

You're right about that line, though. Just plain embarrassing. (Obviously, very good album despite them. But I didn't give it a 5. I forget what I gave. It was long ago when I voted.)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on September 04, 2007, 07:34:43 PM
I actually quite like the bell in You Still Believe in Me.

But anyway, yes, five out of five is indeed perfect. But there's no, you know, 4.9.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on September 04, 2007, 07:37:31 PM
I actually quite like the bell in You Still Believe in Me.

But anyway, yes, five out of five is indeed perfect. But there's no, you know, 4.9.

I'm no mathematician, but there must be: it comes between 4.8 and 5.0, right? Or between 4.89 and 4.91. Or...aw, damn, math sucks. I shall now return to music.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on September 04, 2007, 11:53:22 PM
I forget what I gave. It was long ago when I voted.)

Luther I'm pretty sure that if you look up the top at the results of the poll, the number that you voted for is in bold whereas the others aren't, atleast thats how it is for me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on September 05, 2007, 12:01:33 AM
I actually quite like the bell in You Still Believe in Me.


Yeh I still like the bell but only because thats how I know the song to be. I just think it would have been better without it. But yeh I still like it all the same, it doesn't tarnish the song for me or anything like that, whereas "come on and do the chicken" sort of tarnishes GTKTW, I mean I still like the rest of the song but I just cringe when that line comes up.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: donald on September 07, 2007, 08:13:30 AM
Funny thing is, I hear Do the Chicken, along with that beat, and I automatically go into chicken mode. 
Good Funky Pretty.  Much better than the Manilowesque syrup slathered on some of the tracks. :p


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on September 07, 2007, 01:07:30 PM
Mmmm, syrup.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: 8o8o on October 23, 2007, 01:43:52 PM
A well-deserved fiver, and a deep bow for this album.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Robav63 on October 24, 2007, 01:06:59 PM
I've just got hold of Sunflower/Surfs Up via eBay...its a "twofer" but 12" vinyl version in a gatefold sleeve. At 99p its a real bargain ;D

I didnt know this had been released and I've never heard of it before.

I wont get it for a week or two, so can anyone throw any light on its year of release/country of origin???


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on November 27, 2007, 07:13:27 PM
Just got the album today.....it is very optimistic sounding, and very different from anything else I've heard by them....at the moment I give it a 3.5- 4 out of 5.......something just doesn't seem quite right about the album though....


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on December 01, 2007, 01:59:41 PM
After a # of listens, I'm not impressed with this album the way other people are....BJ's music kills it....Dennis' songs, with the exception of "Forever", sound rather dated to me, but OK....."Forever" being to the Beach Boys what "Something" was to the Beatles, IMO.

This Whole World is pure genius.

All I Wanna Do sounds cool...

Cool Cool Water is cool....

All in all I prefer Love You, Holland, CATP, and Surf's Up(kinda), to this album...

I give this album a ......3



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on December 01, 2007, 11:13:22 PM
After a # of listens, I'm not impressed with this album the way other people are....BJ's music kills it....Dennis' songs, with the exception of "Forever", sound rather dated to me, but OK....."Forever" being to the Beach Boys what "Something" was to the Beatles, IMO.

This Whole World is pure genius.

All I Wanna Do sounds cool...

Cool Cool Water is cool....

All in all I prefer Love You, Holland, CATP, and Surf's Up(kinda), to this album...

I give this album a ......3


I love Sunflower, even Bruce's songs. Took me a while to get past the corniness, but they are enjoyable or me to listen to now. Cool Cool Water is fucking breathtaking. Forever is great. I love Dennis' other songs. So what if they sound dated, a dated-sounding song from 1970 still sounds a hell of a lot better than dated-sounding stuff from the 80s. Add Some Music has some iffy lyrics, but that's just a minor distraction. Steve Desper did a great job making Sunflower sound awesome.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: warnakey on December 02, 2007, 01:58:10 PM
I agree with Ascrodin. Sunflower is an absolute creative peak for all of the beach boys. Dennis Wilson opens the album and sets pace for the whole album. Dennis' songs are amazing and sensitive and he was always getting better.

But by this point Brian Wilson was making far fewer songs, but everything he did was as genius as his Pet Sounds days. This Whole World is incredible. The breakdown "when girls get mad at boys" is beautiful enough to bring you to tears.

And the sort of corny Add Some Music To Your Day is outstanding, especially if you let the song get past the first and second verses, when the amazing backing vocals come in. The Beach Boys were singing and blending together better than ever.

Things only get better from here with Dennis' 50s rocker, Got To Know The Woman. And it quickly segues into my favorite song of the album, Bruce's beautiful ballad Deirdre. Whether you know it or not, Bruce Johnston is an outstanding singer, songwriter and pianist. Deirdre is an amazing high point of this album, and my second daughter will be named Deirdre (right after Caroline   ;)).

And the album never lets up, the next few songs bring you offerings from Dennis and Bruce and Brian, and even Carl and Al helped write some of the songs. I really love the songs All I Wanna Do and the sensitive Brian, Carl and Al piece, Our Sweet Love. These songs are very moving.

Obvious highlights are Dennis' Forever, and Bruce's Tears In The Morning, with their strong song writing and beautiful instrumentations. This album was definitely a little ballad heavy, but the result is an extremely sensitive and moving album.

I guess the weirdest part of the whole album is the ending with the story book like At My Window and Cool, Cool Water. But these 2 songs are still just as amazing as everything else.

I guess all I'm trying to say is, dismissing this album as anything less than outstanding, and one of their best albums is evidence of someone with no ears, or highly dysfunctional ones. This album has all the instrumentation of Smile, the sensitivity of Pet Sounds, the relaxing vibes of Friends, and one of the last true Beach Boys albums we have.

The album f


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: roll plymouth rock on December 02, 2007, 04:34:48 PM
This album represents the pinnacle of their progression in the studio to me...true stereo sound, 24 track recorded on the best mics and gear, well, pretty much ever. An audiophile album in the same league as Pet Sounds and Smile for me personally (at least in terms of production and sound, perhaps not lyrics and hooks though). The more I listen to this album, the more it opens up in terms of sound and I am left blown away by all the little nuances and minute details each time I listen to this album. It really does feel like their last kick at the can in terms of an artistic album being produced by a more or less cohesive unit. Things would never be this way again imo...an easy decision to rate this album a 5.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on December 02, 2007, 07:40:37 PM


I guess all I'm trying to say is, dismissing this album as anything less than outstanding, and one of their best albums is evidence of someone with no ears, or highly dysfunctional ones.


With all due respect, I disagree with that statement........  there is nothing wrong with my ears if I can't bear to listen to Bruce's songs, or if Denny's contributions sound dated to me....except Forever, which I have much love for.....I like his songs alot, they are "nice", but sound dated..

Add Some Music is a good idea, but bores me to listen to it...I especially can't stand Mike's lead vox on that one....

Our Sweet Love is an incredible tune, don't get me wrong...but it just doesn't thrill me the way most any of Brian's other tunes do...it's just kind of like..."eh"...

This album has all the instrumentation of Smile, the sensitivity of Pet Sounds, the relaxing vibes of Friends, and one of the last true Beach Boys albums we have.


Again, with all due respect, I disagree with this statement.....
all the instrumentation of SMiLE!???? nope...

the sensitivity of Pet Sounds??? little here compares to the musical representation of human sensitivity as the immortal Pet Sounds does......

the relaxing vibes of Friends??? not on the whole....

one of the last true BB albums???   well, what about Surf's Up, CATP, Holland, and Love You?? Those don't count??

Nothing wrong with my ears, Warnakey, just different tastes....

P.S. Did I mention how much I can't stand Bruces' crap?? There is nothing Bruce wrote that belongs in the category of "Rock and Roll"......Give ME ROck, or Give me Death...anything except Bruce Johnstons garbage  >:D


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on December 02, 2007, 08:03:35 PM
One last thought...I do love the sound quality / nuances on this record, and I think Mr. Desper needs to be commended for his efforts...... :rock


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on December 03, 2007, 08:57:49 AM
Bruce's songs are kinda "schmaltzy" (for lack of a better term), and it took me many many listens to get used to them. Bruce does have a good voice and is a good musician, I love the harmonies on Dierdre and Tears in the Morning, but his schmaltziness can be too much for some ears. There are still some days when I skip over Bruce's songs. Sunflower would've been even better with Soulful Old Man Sunshine and Loop De Loop in place of BJ's songs (Dierdre and TITM are still better than Disney Girls, IMO). I personally don't care if some of the songs sound dated. I like the sound of stuff from that period of time. It's About Time sounds just like any other hippie rock song from the time, and I love it. Our Sweet Love is a blatant God Only Knows ripoff, but Steve Desper's stereo mix absolutely saves it. If anything, its Desper's work along with all the Beach Boy harmonies that make me like Sunflower so much. The only downfall is that Brian didn't contribute any lead vocals apart from Cool Cool Water and one line and the (faux??) French in At My Window.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on January 26, 2008, 01:07:38 PM
Sunflower is a tricky one : some fantastic numbers on here... others which do nothing for me. Like Surf's Up it seems to get better - a lot better -  towards the end. The BB often seemed to have a strangely anti-commercial commercial ethic. The efforts to draw in a proto-Manilow audience resulted in back-loaded albums as the syrupy ballads stack up.  A weird combination of Dennis, then cheese, Dennis, then more cheese.  It's like after "SMiLE" they still imagined they were playing the Pop Band board game but were actually kidding themselves. They Knew Too Much.

I'd say that this was the first album in the late 60s to actually contain weak Brian Wilson songs like "Add Some Music" - showing he was fallible, or simply keeping his best for other projects? Not sure anyone knows...

Anyway, when this album is good, the music is up there with the Beach Boys' best, as good as anything I've ever heard.

Hot - At My Window, Cool, Cool Water, It's About Time, All I Wanna Do, At My Window, Got To Know The Woman, Cool Cool Water, At My Window again.

Not My Tea - The rest.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jonas on January 28, 2008, 01:13:10 AM
Missin a few good numbers, imo...but to each their own! :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on January 28, 2008, 01:50:24 AM
This album is weird.....

I dig Slip on Through

I LOVE This Whole World

Add Some Music is too long and repetitive and hollow for me.......

Got To Know the Woman, Deirdre, Tears in the Morning do nothing for me..........

It's About Time is cool, I dig it......

All I Wanna Do is BRILLIANT.........can't get enough listens......my favorite Mike Love performance besides Meant For You

Forever is great

Our Sweet Love......eh, it works because it is Brian but it is so bland compared to their more creative works

At My Window.......a little weird, but they sing about a bird, so I like it

Cool Cool Water......a great feel in the Pet Sounds sense of the word, but the song sounds too dry compared to Da Da and Da Da's ingenious arrangement.........however Cool Cool Water serves it's purpose. Definitely cool. Always impressive, but doesn't sound quite right or fully developed. Beats the crap out of 90% of the rest of the BB catalogue....(Still prefer Da Da and Blue Hawaii though)

I still give it a 3......I think it is really overrated by BB fans, and not on the whole in the league of Pet Sounds and others.......however Despers work is UNREAL.........I'd give it a 10 just for his work...........


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on January 28, 2008, 02:27:36 AM
At My Window is very very strange.

I have 2 possible explanations:

a) alien abduction

b) a visitation of the Holy Spirit

or perhaps a combination of the above.

Is the bird there simply to throw us off the scent?  :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on January 28, 2008, 08:57:32 AM
I can't help but wonder how At My Window would sound if Brian sung lead instead of Bruce. Bruce's voice makes it kind of like a cutesy kid's song, but I think with Brian singing lead it would end up sounding like another Busy Doin' Nothin' or I'd Love Just Once to See You... a man who is not "all there" singing about his life.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Ebb and Flow on January 28, 2008, 11:01:18 PM
"At My Window" is such a sublime, beautiful song and underrated by a lot of people who say they love this record when for me it's one of the best on it.  I think I'd probably prefer Brian singing it, just because I find his voice to be more soothing and less irritating than Bruce's.  In a way I like that he only pops up for the backing vocals and the brief little passage in French, which never fails to give me chills.

Like most of the mid to late period stuff, Sunflower's an awesome, if flawed endeavor.  One of my greatest wishes would be to listen to the original masters, track by track, just to hear how some of these beautiful songs were constructed.  I hope someday we get the chance.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: MBE on January 29, 2008, 12:18:02 AM
Actually this is my favorite LP period. It sounds so good, they were at their peaks vocally, as songwriters, and producers. The songs all flow together and I wouldn't change a thing (except maybe the overly long fade of Tears).


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on January 29, 2008, 02:29:50 AM
The songs all flow together and I wouldn't change a thing (except maybe the overly long fade of Tears).

Yeah plus it is too quiet. But yeah I really have to disagree with some people. This album for me is the groups peak as a creative force. As MBE suggests, they were all at their peaks vocally, as songwriters and producers. Well maby not all at their peaks but as an overall entity the group was at it's peak. Basically every song on this album has something good to offer and I really can't pick out a bad track.

And for those who say "Bruce doesn't have a rock and roll bone in his body" etc.. well I agree. But then, not all of Brian's or Denny's or Carl's stuff is what I would call straight out rock and roll, but I still like it. I actually like some of Bruce's songs like "Tears...", "Deirdre", "Disney Girls", "The Nearest Faraway Place" etc.. And don't think that I'm saying that I love his songs and listen to them all the time, I just don't sit there screaming "STOP!!" when his songs are playing. They aren't THAT bad. As I say I like them at times and they certainly aren't as bad as some people suggest. His songs aren't mind-blowing in the way that some of Brian's and Denny's finest work can be but they are still pleasant enough. I'd sure rather listen to some of Bruce's songs than a lot of other garbage out there. I'm sure there are people who will strongly disagree with me and that's fine as everyone's entitled to their opinion of course.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on January 29, 2008, 04:56:16 AM
We can agree to differ, I reckon... as has been pointed out, the Beach Boys had different peaks, and they sounded differently each time.  George W Bush is a fan - who knows, maybe he even reads this forum - something tells me he's not a fan of "Cabin Essence" or "Brian Fell Into The Trombone" or rants about smog ... but who knows? People can pick and choose between their different phases and albums, and there's no right or wrong, even if I don't like "Barbara Ann," it is still the Beach Boys. So, I don't see Sunflower as the highest point, but it is a very good album by any measure other than that applied to "Today" or "Pet Sounds" - or even "20/20".

And we will never know if Bruce would have been successful as a solo artist or not. Maybe he could have joined the Bee Gees ?  :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: signum on January 29, 2008, 05:32:56 AM
Sunflower is probably my favourite album (not just among Beach Boys albums), although sometimes I like Wild Honey about as much. Actually I love every album and track they released from "Today" to "Holland" except "Bull Session with the Big Daddy" so it's hard to decide best albums.

But every track on Sunflower is amazing. I always liked Bruce's songs too: the different styles are a good thing on Sunflower. The production is great: 1970 was in a great period anyway I think and I don't know why they had to make such inferior productions later on. Deirdre is beautiful, and the drums are amusing and I like the flutes. I don't care for the lyrics but then I rarely bother with them anyway. "At My Window" is a highlight, especially Brian's Spanish bit-he was writing amusing songs at this time. I like Mike's singing on this album: he only started to go wrong from "15 Big Ones" onwards I thought. And Cool, Cool Water is sublime-I'm very glad they dug that out. Personally I like the ending of "Tears In The Morning" but I do notice how it seems to end the same way as "The Nearest Faraway Place" or "Bluebirds": they all seem to have some musical effect in common. Plus if you examine it there is very little of "Tears In The Morning" really: it just repeats the same few notes of tune in different keys. It is still a good piece of music though.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SMiLE-Holland on January 29, 2008, 05:58:06 AM
"At My Window" is a highlight, especially Brian's Spanish bit-he was writing amusing songs at this time.

tiny detail, I know.... but it's French, not Spanish....


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on January 29, 2008, 06:07:49 AM
"At My Window" is a highlight, especially Brian's Spanish bit-he was writing amusing songs at this time.

tiny detail, I know.... but it's French, not Spanish....

I think people get confused because from memory it says that its Spanish in the twofer liner notes. Well it says it somewhere anyway.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SMiLE-Holland on January 29, 2008, 07:20:31 AM
in the 2-fer? Have to check that out...

Le moineau est venu
se poser a ma fenętre

The sparrow has come
(and set down) at my window

....is that the correct translation?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: signum on January 29, 2008, 11:17:02 AM
Thanks very much. So it's French then. I read somewhere that it was Spanish, even before I heard the song. I know no Spanish, but a bit of French and for some reason I thought that Brian wasn't saying the French word "fenetre" (I don't know how to type the accent) because it sounded something like "foonetre" to me and so I thought "there's your Spanish" and left it at that!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SloopJohnB on January 29, 2008, 12:35:47 PM
in the 2-fer? Have to check that out...

Le moineau est venu
se poser a ma fenętre

The sparrow has come
(and set down) at my window

....is that the correct translation?

Your translation is correct, and the correct sentence with all the accents at the right places is:

 "Le moineau est venu se poser ŕ ma fenętre".

...And even though I'm French, I had to listen to this part quite a few times before understanding what Brian was saying!  ;D


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on January 29, 2008, 01:52:05 PM
This album for me is the groups peak as a creative force. As MBE suggests, they were all at their peaks vocally, as songwriters and producers. Well maby not all at their peaks but as an overall entity the group was at it's peak.

I agree that at this time they were as a group somewhat peaking in terms of involvement, ideas, teamwork, and vocal prowess......however there are lots of other tunes from this era that could have and should have IMO replaced the weaker tunes on this record....it would have made Sunflower better, more popular, and more meaningful. Why is it that this band kept so much of their best material off the record store shelves???


And we will never know if Bruce would have been successful as a solo artist or not. Maybe he could have joined the Bee Gees ?  :)

...or the Starland Vocal Band....



Got To Know the Woman, Deirdre, Tears in the Morning do nothing for me..........


........Agreed.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: MBE on January 29, 2008, 03:14:55 PM
Frankly I still think nothing should have been taken off. Really they could have made it a 2 LP set if they included, I'm Going Your Way, Back Home, Good Time, Loop De Loop, I Just Got My Pay, Games Two Can Play, Susie Cincinnati, Walkin, San Miguel, Lady, and Carnival. I think Break Away, Celebrate, and Cottonfields would have worked too but I doubt Capitol would have leased the cuts in the US at least. The only song I left out is When Girls Get Together, which I consider the only miss from this era.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Sheriff John Stone on January 29, 2008, 04:41:57 PM
....however there are lots of other tunes from this era that could have and should have IMO replaced the weaker tunes on this record....it would have made Sunflower better, more popular, and more meaningful. Why is it that this band kept so much of their best material off the record store shelves???

You know, Sunflower (I think it was first called Add Some Music) was originally REJECTED, and, supposedly, the weaker songs WERE TAKEN OFF.

When I first became a BB fan (1976), you couldn't find Sunflower in the record stores. I had to order it as an import and paid big bucks for it.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on January 29, 2008, 04:56:21 PM
....however there are lots of other tunes from this era that could have and should have IMO replaced the weaker tunes on this record....it would have made Sunflower better, more popular, and more meaningful. Why is it that this band kept so much of their best material off the record store shelves???

You know, Sunflower (I think it was first called Add Some Music) was originally REJECTED, and, supposedly, the weaker songs WERE TAKEN OFF.


Yeah, thats what they say....but they could've done a better job...imo


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dr. Byrds on March 23, 2008, 10:17:42 PM
I recently ripped this album from my original vinyl pressing and it re-affirmed my love for Sunflower. I love it all, even Bruce's numbers. Love the production, such crisp, powerful sound! Faves: Our Sweet Love, At My Window, Add Some Music, Cool Water.

But, I think Holland holds up a little better than this as a cohesive album, IMO.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on March 30, 2008, 08:20:03 AM
Frankly I still think nothing should have been taken off. Really they could have made it a 2 LP set if they included, I'm Going Your Way, Back Home, Good Time, Loop De Loop, I Just Got My Pay, Games Two Can Play, Susie Cincinnati, Walkin, San Miguel, Lady, and Carnival. I think Break Away, Celebrate, and Cottonfields would have worked too but I doubt Capitol would have leased the cuts in the US at least. The only song I left out is When Girls Get Together, which I consider the only miss from this era.
Can't forget Soulful Old Man Sunshine, quite possibly the greatest non-SMiLE related unreleased (until Endless Harmony) song in their catalog.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Ana-Lu on April 01, 2008, 08:24:53 AM
I'd say there are 5 or 6 good tunes, the rest filler, some really unlistenable.  Still, the photo of Mike Love in the toga is compensation.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on April 02, 2008, 02:00:05 AM
I'd say there are 5 or 6 good tunes, the rest filler, some really unlistenable.  Still, the photo of Mike Love in the toga is compensation.


Just out of interest, which songs are "good tunes" and which ones are "filler"... sorry to me I can't hear any filler (that is reserved for such titles as Denny's Drums, Boogie Woodie, Bull Session..., Our Favorite Recording Sessions, Cassius Love vs. Sonny Wilson etc..) so I'd be interested to hear what you deem "filler"?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Ana-Lu on April 02, 2008, 07:01:58 AM
I was using the term "filler" in a more global sense rather than in a Beach Boys-centric way, i.e. to describe content that is half-baked, unfinished sounding, or just plain bad - or any combination thereof.  And, you're right, LP/CD filler in most genres of music doesn't sink to the depths of "Denny's Drums" or "Bull Session with the Big Daddy."  So we don't get hung up on the term, I'll revise my statement to say that about half of Sunflower is really great, and the rest half-baked or just plain bad (or a combination thereof).

I always thought you could get a single killer LP by combining the best of Sunflower and Surf's Up.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on April 02, 2008, 04:25:46 PM
I really appreciate your posts, Ana-Lu, just because Sunflower seems to be one of those albums onto which people here heap what I consider an excessive amount of praise.

As a work of engineering and production, I think virtually every second is brilliant. The performances are mostly really, really good. But if someone wants to know what's filler, to my ears and tastes the answer is "Got to Know the Woman," "It's About Time," and "Tears In the Morning." And I don't much like "At My Window." And I think "Forever" isn't really much better. And "Slip On Through" and "Deirdre" are slightly better.

The only tunes on the album I really love--I mean really love, ones that I consider worthy of inclusion among the best of the band's output--are "This Whole World," "All I Wanna Do" and "Our Sweet Love." After that it's varying degrees of brilliantly produced mediocrity.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on April 02, 2008, 05:30:28 PM
I really appreciate your posts, Ana-Lu, just because Sunflower seems to be one of those albums onto which people here heap what I consider an excessive amount of praise.

As a work of engineering and production, I think virtually every second is brilliant. The performances are mostly really, really good. But if someone wants to know what's filler, to my ears and tastes the answer is "Got to Know the Woman," "It's About Time," and "Tears In the Morning." And I don't much like "At My Window." And I think "Forever" isn't really much better. And "Slip On Through" and "Deirdre" are slightly better.

The only tunes on the album I really love--I mean really love, ones that I consider worthy of inclusion among the best of the band's output--are "This Whole World," "All I Wanna Do" and "Our Sweet Love." After that it's varying degrees of brilliantly produced mediocrity.

Luther and Ana- Lu I agree with your sentiments, although I have a different choice of fillers. I can't stand Bruce's contributions and GTKTW. You can add Add Some Music to that list too. That song is ok to me about once every three months, anymore than that and I get sick of it. Forever is a good song, although I prefer the a capella version from Hawthorne.

Desper's work though, BRILLIANT.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Ana-Lu on April 02, 2008, 06:33:37 PM

Luther and Ana- Lu I agree with your sentiments, although I have a different choice of fillers. I can't stand Bruce's contributions and GTKTW. You can add Add Some Music to that list too. That song is ok to me about once every three months, anymore than that and I get sick of it. Forever is a good song, although I prefer the a capella version from Hawthorne.

Desper's work though, BRILLIANT.

I think I'm with you on your choices.  I basically like the first two tracks on side 1, and then most of side 2 after "Tears in the Morning."  ASM may be the most overrated song in their catalog. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on April 03, 2008, 08:39:24 AM
I agree with you guys in the 'half is good and half is not so good' theory. But I got to tell you, songs like Deirdre, Tears In The Morning and Got to Know The Woman (shudder) are not only bad songs, the production is completely different then This Whole World, Slip On Through (I love that song) etc., to the point where they don't sound like "Sunflower" songs when people discuss the SOUND of Sunflower. They really are filler and not part of a cohesive piece of art.

By the way, I consider 'Cool Cool Water' to be the equal of 'This Whole World' and 'All I Wanna Do'. I haven't noticed anyone bashing it yet. The production is awesome on that song and its great to finally hear Brian's voice.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on April 03, 2008, 01:22:17 PM
By the way, I consider 'Cool Cool Water' to be the equal of 'This Whole World' and 'All I Wanna Do'. I haven't noticed anyone bashing it yet. The production is awesome on that song and its great to finally hear Brian's voice.

Well, I'm always available to step up and bash something otherwise beloved...

No, really I think it's fine. But it's not a favorite of mine at all. And the sound effects annoy me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on April 03, 2008, 05:31:20 PM
By the way, I consider 'Cool Cool Water' to be the equal of 'This Whole World' and 'All I Wanna Do'. I haven't noticed anyone bashing it yet. The production is awesome on that song and its great to finally hear Brian's voice.

Well, I'm always available to step up and bash something otherwise beloved...

No, really I think it's fine. But it's not a favorite of mine at all. And the sound effects annoy me.

Cool, Cool Water is my favorite song on the album. I had actually heard it a for the first time a few months before I bought Sunflower, and thought it was a SMiLE track (this was before I'd heard any of the bootlegs). Turns out only part of it was from SMiLE, but I still sometimes include it in my SMiLE mixes, just because the hammering in Workshop makes a perfect segue into the drums at the beginning of CCW. I initially didn't like Bruce's songs, but the entire album has grown on me. I would've added Soulful Old Man Sunshine to the album, though. With the exception of SDT and Disney Girls from Surf's Up, I can listen to every BB album from Sunflower through Holland without skipping any tracks.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Sheriff John Stone on April 03, 2008, 06:16:50 PM
As I mentioned in a previous post, when I became a Beach Boys' fan in the mid/late 1970's, I couldn't find Sunflower. It was either out of print or my local record store wasn't hip enough to carry it. But I read a few glowing reviews in some books, and I had to have it. I eventually had a record store order it as an import - and I paid for it!

I like Sunflower; it's a good album. Maybe a very good album. But I think it falls short of greatness. Yes, it is the most "group" Beach Boys' album. And, yes, Brian was involved, although I question just HOW MUCH or HOW LONG he was involved. But don't forget, this debut album with their new record company was originally rejected, which would become a trend.

When I listened to the first three songs - "Slip On Through", "This Whole World" and "Add Some Music" - I thought, "Wow, this IS awesome".

But then things started to fade a bit. "Got To Know The Woman", "Deidre", "It's About Time", and "Tears In The Morning" didn't measure up to the first three. OK songs but didn't blow me away.

"All I Wanna Do", "Forever", and "Our Sweet Love" are excellent songs, not filler, although "Our Sweet Love" does remind me of a re-cycled "God Only Knows".

So right now the album was a little up and down, and I looked forward to the last two songs. "At My Window" is a tough one. It's charming and I love the tag, but these bird watching, going out in the grass, looking at the sky songs are things that Brian could churn out in a minute. Cute but not overwhelmingly great.

Which is what I think about "Cool Cool Water". I know I'm SUPPOSED to love it, but I find it slightly boring. I do love the water chant, and I spliced it out to use on my SMiLE mixes. The harmonies are also impressive, but the song doesn't really go anywhere. It's like a part is missing that Brian never wrote or completed.

I like Sunflower a lot. I always enjoy it. But I like all Beach Boys' albums a lot. To me, Sunflower is on a par with Surf's Up, CATP, and Holland. They all have their strengths and weaknesses. But I never viewed Sunflower as The Beach Boys' Sgt Pepper....


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on April 03, 2008, 06:39:47 PM
No, really I think it's fine. But it's not a favorite of mine at all. And the sound effects annoy me.

Luther, I agree. Those sound effects really bug me too. I think if Cool Cool Water hadn't included the last minute or so (ie: from "From the mountains on down to the sea" onwards) then it would've been so much better


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on April 03, 2008, 08:30:40 PM
Only songs I don't care for are Add some Music(pretty, but goes on forever, dumb lyrics) and the horrible, totally out of place Tears in the Morning.  I still like it though. The rest of the songs are great. I love the Dennis Wilson songs, and well just about everything. Especially the sound. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on April 03, 2008, 08:51:49 PM
'At My Window' like 'In The Back of My Mind' is a paranoid schizophrenic song, especially when the strings build up and we hear Al sing 'He Came To My Window...(and then Brian JUMPS IN REPEATING) HE CAME TO MY WINDOW followed by the whole group singing HE CAME TO MY WINDOW and then 'FROM THEIR EYES' and a discordant piano and then the tag of 'Fly Away'. Beautiful creepy stuff. And a catchy tune.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: MBE on April 03, 2008, 09:26:43 PM
I have to be a hold out and say I love this album. Tears isn't a great song (the bootleg version is better) but I don't dislike anything but the piano solo at the end. The rest of the LP to me is dynamite. Brian and Dennis do some of their best stuff here. Actually they all do some of their best stuff. The vocals are truly magnificent.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Wrightfan on May 16, 2008, 05:47:56 PM
Five. Best BB album not named Pet Sounds.

Best to worst:
All I Wanna Do
This Whole World
Cool Cool Water
Slip on Through
Forever
Our Sweet Love
Add Some Music To Your Day
Deirdre
Tears in the Morning
It's About Time
At my Window
Got to Know the Woman


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: sunflower on June 14, 2008, 03:18:00 PM
I can´t say enough good things about this album!

I love the production, singing, songwriting.. The only tracks I would change  is "At my window" and "All I wanna do" which I´ve always thought should have been replaced with "San Miquel", "Susie Cincinatti", Good times or "Games too can play".

First I was kinda bugged that Brian didn´t sing more lead vocals on the album, but you can clearly hear him singing harmony in almost every song. :-D


For me this is right up there with Pet Sounds, Today and Summer Days


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: TimeToGetAlone on June 19, 2008, 06:29:00 PM
One of my favorite albums.  I always find it harder to say stuff on the stuff I really like, so I'll end it there.

Slip On Through - 5/5
This Whole World - 5/5
Add Some Music To Your Day - 5/5
Got To Know The Woman - 4.5/5
Deirdre - 5/5
It's About Time - 4.5/5
Tears In The Morning - 4.5/5
All I Wanna Do - 5/5
Forever - 5/5
Our Sweet Love - 5/5
At My Window - 5/5
Cool Cool Water - 5/5

Definitely 5 for me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on September 11, 2008, 11:40:48 PM
I reckon Sunflower is one of the big factors in Mike's defence.  Without knowing his exact writing contribution, he does some great vocals on this album. He's in good voice throughout.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Poprocks on October 04, 2008, 09:43:11 AM
I'll 5 star this one.  It's not *perfect* like Pet Sounds, but for my money, this is the best album between Pet Sounds and Love You.  I'd say this is pretty much on par with Love You.  Here's my ranking from favourite track to least favourite:

This Whole World (catchy as hell... I wish it were a little longer, but it's still outstanding)
Add Some Music (Took a while to grow on me, but now I *love* it... what a great song!)
All I Wanna Do (Breathtaking!  Satisfyingly peaceful and happy while also being haunting and psychedelic.)
Cool, Cool Water (Awesome suite-like piece)
At My Window (Cute song... just makes me smile.)
Slip on Through (Good album opener... great vocals from Denny)
Forever (Gorgeous song, but I don't think I like it quite as much as most BB fans)
Our Sweet Love (pleasant song, but it just doesn't quite do it for me...)
Deirdre (Would be higher, but the "I love your red hair" part makes me cringe every time)
It's About Time (Good li'l rocker, this)
Got to Know the Woman (I'm tempted to skip this one every time...)
Tears in the Morning (too long & grandiose for me... tries too hard to be all Pet Sounds epic-like)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on October 05, 2008, 12:57:55 PM
Geeze, you give away fives pretty easily considering your feelings on the songs. Any album where you want to skip one of the tracks and that's not even your least favorite song in the album should not have a five.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Poprocks on October 06, 2008, 02:26:21 PM
Well, the album has charm.  So I'm willing to forgive a couple of minor hiccups.  The only BB albums I'd give 5 stars to are Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile, Sunflower and Love You.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 06, 2008, 04:21:09 PM
I believe that's what they call grade inflation.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Poprocks on October 07, 2008, 02:13:11 PM
In retrospect, I was a little harsher in my comments than I *truly* feel about it.  Like Got to Know the Woman, I may be *tempted* to skip it, but I usually do listen to it anyway and end up reveling in its corny goodness.  Our Sweet Love, I'm not really even sure what I meant by it not doing it for me... I guess it's not one of my favourites on the album, but again, it's a well-done song and pleasant to listen to.  Tears in the Morning is the only song on the album I actually truly don't like that much.  Dierdre, I like the song a lot, I just don't like the way Bruce sings that one line.

I think if I had an AMG-style scale, I'd give it a 4.5.  But overall on an integer scale I like it enough to give it a 5, so I stand by that rating!  And I don't think giving 4 BB albums 5 stars on a *Beach Boys fan site* constitutes grade inflation!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 07, 2008, 02:40:21 PM
I think 5/5 implies perfection (or so close that you have to round upward). To each his own, but I don't find that many BBs albums that can claim that. If a person acknowledges flaws, doesn't that by definition pull the rating down away from perfection? Doesn't matter to me one bit--you can give them all 10/5 for all I care. Just a funny math.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Poprocks on October 08, 2008, 07:06:19 AM
Ah, ok.  Well I guess in my opinion/scale, 5 means "excellent", 4 means "very good", 3 means "good", 2 means "fair" and 1 means "poor".  The only BBs album I think is *perfect* is Pet Sounds.  So I guess it would have to be at least "excellent" by definition.  But the other 3 albums I mentioned, while I don't believe they're perfect, I do believe they're excellent.  So I guess they fit as fives on my scale but not yours.  Again, to each his own.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on October 18, 2008, 02:07:31 PM
I think 5/5 implies perfection (or so close that you have to round upward). To each his own, but I don't find that many BBs albums that can claim that. If a person acknowledges flaws, doesn't that by definition pull the rating down away from perfection? Doesn't matter to me one bit--you can give them all 10/5 for all I care. Just a funny math.
By that logic my favorite album of all time, the White Album by the Beatles, would get about a 3.5 in my book. Screw that. I'll give it a five.

Good albums are often greater than the sum of the individual songs. Rating songs is fine, but it does not follow that the rating for the whole album must or even should be a mathematical average of those individual songs and if it's higher than that it is "grade inflation".


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 18, 2008, 06:49:38 PM
I don't recall starting--or continuing--in the song-ranking. I don't care. At all. And if you want to rate some album with half mediocre songs as a 5/5, do it. If you want to rate an album with not a single good song a 6.75/1.993, do it. Please note that I already said I didn't care. I continue to not care.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on October 19, 2008, 02:35:48 AM
Well, I am not saying that you care. Nor was I accusing you of song-ranking(I would never accuse anybody of such a horrible crime against humanity without a LOT of evidence, believe you me.)

 I am saying that the logic your post was founded on is not necessarily correct. (And one would wonder what made you tell the poster that in the first place?)
 Again, to repeat my point, there are plenty of great albums on which not every song is great. The White Album is themost glaring example of that. I think it's perfectly fine to rate an album with a "perfect" five, while rating, say, Wild Honey Pie alone at about 1.5. (The whole number rating system is a bit absurd, of course, but it is a convenient shorthand for communicating how you feel about a certain...thing. Song. Work of art. Whatever.)



If we can agree that an album can be greater than the sum of its parts, then your post is wrong. If, however, you believe an album is only the sum of its parts,  then we disagree.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 19, 2008, 06:54:45 AM
I give Sunflower a 5/5 because dennis is soooo cute & the beach boys R my favorite group ever. (That, btw, is my way of saying I'm done with this conversation. Repeat your point--again [I didn't understand you, your intellect is SO DIZZYING!] if you think it will help. But I don't care. Didn't care. Won't care. And don't need condescending "lessons" on logic from some message board participant.)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on October 19, 2008, 07:04:04 AM
I give Sunflower a 5/5 because dennis is soooo cute & the beach boys R my favorite group ever. (That, btw, is my way of saying I'm done with this conversation. Repeat your point--again [I didn't understand you, your intellect is SO DIZZYING!] if you think it will help. But I don't care. Didn't care. Won't care. And don't need condescending "lessons" on logic from some message board participant.)
Look, man, I was replying to what I thought was a rather confrontational reply of  yours(and Aegir's, actually, now that I look it all over) to the other guy's opinion. I don't think there's any reason to get upset, I certainly didn't expect it. (Though I feared it.) I guess I am a little disappointed that you got (apparently) angry and sarcastic.
I can accept that you have bowed out of the conversation.

 He rather graciously accepted your criticism of his,er, criticism, in my opinion.

I certainly haven't been giving any lessons, and did not mean to be condescending(any more than you were to him/her). But, heck, I'll apologize if I came off that way--I thought that you(plural) had been coming off that way, ironically enough.

 I was just making a point--I accept that you don't care, but don't really care that you don't, either! I guess I think that's beside the point.
 Your posts stand, and so do mine. Does it matter? Of course not. Or of course. 

I really don't feel I was picking on you so much as just sayin'.

Anyway, peace.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on October 19, 2008, 01:25:37 PM
Look, man, I was replying to what I thought was a rather confrontational reply of  yours(and Aegir's, actually, now that I look it all over) to the other guy's opinion.
I wasn't being confrontational. I just thought it was weird.

Can't we all just get along?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jason on October 19, 2008, 07:47:37 PM
I give Sunflower a 5/5 because dennis is soooo cute & the beach boys R my favorite group ever. (That, btw, is my way of saying I'm done with this conversation. Repeat your point--again [I didn't understand you, your intellect is SO DIZZYING!] if you think it will help. But I don't care. Didn't care. Won't care. And don't need condescending "lessons" on logic from some message board participant.)

You are the only one with a condescending tone in this thread.  Lighten up and don't be such an dick.

Take your own advice. Name calling is NOT tolerated on this message board. There's an ignore feature on the forum. If you do not like Luther's comments, use it. And same goes for Luther, if he feels as such. Otherwise, you all can take your drama to PMs.

Everyone needs to take three steps back, count to ten, and relax.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel S. on October 19, 2008, 08:26:54 PM
I had no idea such a happy upbeat record like Sunflower could a be a vortex for so much hate and shame.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on October 19, 2008, 08:50:01 PM
No sh*t.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: signum on October 20, 2008, 12:14:42 PM
It seems good to turn back to give Sunflower the praise it deserves. And everyone surely makes a good subjective point about it. On the one hand I can never think of ratings for albums because it seems meaningless, but on the other hand I gave in to temptation and gave a 5/5 to Sunflower and that was the only time I gave a rating, just because I saw it as SO good. But if God is perfect, he is also infinite. Anything finite is not perfect, but it may be as good as you can imagine it being, without imagining it changing into something else.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Bedroom Tapes on October 21, 2008, 04:48:46 PM
This is my FAVORITE Beach Boys album!  I love every cut on it.  The group sounded so cohesive and better than before.   :grouphug  I think it's highly underrated and it's a shame it was one of the lowest charting Beach Boys albums.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: axl wills on May 10, 2009, 10:40:55 AM
The best beach boys lp as a band.Dennis shines on it.Cool cool water is the best song to drank a cold drink during a hot summertime!The harmony vocal are bright,dreamy and sweet;seemed they were feeling good together at that time.My fav album of the boys! 5/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on July 07, 2009, 11:10:54 PM

Everyone needs to take three steps back, count to ten, and relax.

Relax, don't do it, when you want to go to it...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on July 07, 2009, 11:21:30 PM

Everyone needs to take three steps back, count to ten, and relax.

Relax, don't do it, when you want to go to it...


OMG, a Frankie reference on Smiley SMiLE!! Fodaing awesome...way to go, Alex...  :rock


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on July 07, 2009, 11:22:36 PM
....on the Sunflower thread nonetheless,...that just made my night... a Frankie/Sunflower connection.... 8)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: CarlsDarlin on July 15, 2009, 01:37:09 PM
I love Sunflower.  It is so awesome.  I like all the tracks but it's taken a while for Cool, Cool Water and All I Wanna Do to grow on me.  Dennis proved that he is a genius on his tracks. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Amanda Hart on July 17, 2009, 08:46:33 AM
I love Sunflower.  It is so awesome.  I like all the tracks but it's taken a while for Cool, Cool Water and All I Wanna Do to grow on me.  Dennis proved that he is a genius on his tracks. 

hmm...those two plus This Whole World are my favs.  I think that sort of thing is fascinating, we're all huge fans of this stuff, but to see all the variety between what eras/albums/songs are people's favorites really speaks to the quality of work of the bulk of their output.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: slothrop on July 21, 2009, 12:04:37 AM
An amazing album. I prefer post Pet Sounds albums for the most part and this has got to be my favorite on most days. My only real gripe is with "It's About Time" and "Tears in the Morning". Don't like the female vocals in "Got to Know the Woman" either. "Time" sounds like some sort of song from the musical Hair and "Tears" is just too melodramatic and annoying. The arrangement makes me cringe too.

But the rest is so good that it outweighs these minor quibbles. If "Deidre" were moved to open side two, we'd have a flawless side, with snapshots of each member giving their best. Although Mike has led the band into nothing but an oldies act, "All I Wanna Do" has to be one of the warmest, most loving songs I've ever heard. You can literally feel the "good vibrations" on that one. The incredible bass line, the psychedelic vocals, all drowned in a gorgeous echo.

Overall the album is beautiful and is also proof that Brian (who is clearly all over the record) didn't check out after Pet Sounds, though he definitely took a break for 20/20. If "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" and "Good Time" had been used in place of the aforementioned weak tracks, or just added to the album, it would be perfect. Either way, the Brits were right when they said it was a true successor to the grandeur of PS/The Beach Boys equivalent to "Sgt. Pepper's". A definite 5.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: sockittome on July 21, 2009, 04:53:21 PM
Sunflower is the only BB album that I feel is equal to Pet Sounds.  Both albums may have a few very minor flaws, but they have a certain flow that makes for a great experience from start to finish.  20/20 has excellent songs, but it lacks the cohesiveness of what I would consider a GREAT album.  The Rolling Stone Record Guide called 20/20 "singles packaged pretentiously".  Welllllll, I don't know if I'd go that far.....

Bottom line:  there is something magical about Sunflower that would never manifest itself again for the Boys.  Surf's Up tried, and had some substantial high points (no pun intended), but anyone hearing "Don't Go Near the Water" for the first time had to know that the Boys were in for a bumpy ride.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on July 31, 2009, 08:05:22 AM
Commercially it wouldn't have made a big difference, but there's a monster argument for Sunflower being a double album. The Beach Boys were badly managed and insanely talented.

side one:
"Slip On Through"
"Loop de Loop"
"San Miguel"
"Deirdre"
"Forever"

side two:
"The Lord's Prayer"
 "Break Away"
 "Celebrate The News"
 "All I Wanna Do"
 "Got To Know The Woman"
"Good Time"

side three:
"Our Sweet Love"
"Add Some Music To Your Day"
"This Whole World"
"I Just Got My Pay"
"At My Window"

side four:
"It's About Time"
 "Our Sweet Love"
"At My Window"
"Cool, Cool Water"

stop me if you've heard this one before, but thats one album full of goodies.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Aegir on July 31, 2009, 02:15:46 PM
I don't like the sequencing of that, especially with most of the Dennis songs being confined to the first two sides and "At My Window" being on the album twice.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff on July 31, 2009, 03:14:13 PM
Commercially it wouldn't have made a big difference, but there's a monster argument for Sunflower being a double album. The Beach Boys were badly managed and insanely talented.

side one:
"Slip On Through"
"Loop de Loop"
"San Miguel"
"Deirdre"
"Forever"

side two:
"The Lord's Prayer"
 "Break Away"
 "Celebrate The News"
 "All I Wanna Do"
 "Got To Know The Woman"
"Good Time"

side three:
"Our Sweet Love"
"Add Some Music To Your Day"
"This Whole World"
"I Just Got My Pay"
"At My Window"

side four:
"It's About Time"
 "Our Sweet Love"
"At My Window"
"Cool, Cool Water"

stop me if you've heard this one before, but thats one album full of goodies.

What sort of monster would be making this argument?  Presumably one without ears.  Loop de Loop?  I Just Got My Pay?  The Lord's Prayer?  These are just diluting an album that already suffers from the inclusion of Got to Know the Woman.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on July 31, 2009, 06:17:52 PM
While I agree that Sunflower is diluted with some weak songs, I do agree that there are plenty of other really good possibilities that could have been included. Double album, probably not (for my taste, in that I almost always disagree with the idea of releasing a double album). But a different, stronger single album, sure.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on July 31, 2009, 07:37:47 PM
You could also add to that Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Lady, I'm Going Your Way, Seasons In The Sun, Susie Cincinatti, Back Home, Take A Load Off Your Feet etc.. Pretty crazy when you think about it!

and "At My Window" being on the album twice.

"Our Sweet Love" is in their twice as well.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Jeff on July 31, 2009, 11:02:31 PM
You could also add to that Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Lady, I'm Going Your Way, Seasons In The Sun, Susie Cincinatti, Back Home, Take A Load Off Your Feet etc.. Pretty crazy when you think about it!

To me that list just says that the Beach Boys made several mediocre or mediocre-minus songs that fortunately were left off of Sunflower.  Why is that crazy?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: TdHabib on July 31, 2009, 11:40:35 PM
You could also add to that Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Lady, I'm Going Your Way, Seasons In The Sun, Susie Cincinatti, Back Home, Take A Load Off Your Feet etc.. Pretty crazy when you think about it!

To me that list just says that the Beach Boys made several mediocre or mediocre-minus songs that fortunately were left off of Sunflower.  Why is that crazy?
[/quote]You call "Lady (Fallin' in Love)" mediocre?? Blasphemy ;D


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: TdHabib on July 31, 2009, 11:40:54 PM
And yes Luther, the quoting went hay-wire there. I GET IT.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: mikeyj on August 01, 2009, 01:02:14 AM
To me that list just says that the Beach Boys made several mediocre or mediocre-minus songs that fortunately were left off of Sunflower.  Why is that crazy?

Well I think it's pretty amazing that they were so productive at that time - if you read my post I never said that those songs should have been on Sunflower just mentioning the fact that they had so much material in the vaults that dated from around that time. I also think it's funny how some people think that Brian is the be all and end all in the band and yet the other guys showed that they were capable as well. Obviously that's your opinion that those songs are mediocre or even worse but I think there is some decent material there. Yes, considering their past record some of those songs are mediocre but then again compared to some of the earlier material most songs ever written in the pop field look pretty mediocre. But I think some of those songs are still pretty decent especially since some of them weren't even finished. And there's probably more that I am forgetting as well.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on August 01, 2009, 08:26:52 AM
And yes Luther, the quoting went hay-wire there. I GET IT.

Technically, I doubt it went haywire. You just made a mistake.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on August 01, 2009, 08:29:45 AM
I do think Lady is mediocre, though, if on the good end of mediocre. It's better than some of his material on Sunflower, though. That album, in my perfect world, should have included it, as well as Good Time (remarkable that they left that off, it's in the upper half when compared to the songs on that current album), Take a Load Off Your Feet, Breakaway (yeah, so it was a single ... so what. Put it on the album, too), and Loop de Loop and if they had finished it, Soulful Old Man Sunshine.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Amazing Larry on August 01, 2009, 10:00:38 PM
Sunflower as a double-album:
                   Side 1
1.San Miguel
2.Deirdre
3.All I Wanna Do
4.Break Away
5.Loop de Loop
6.Slip On Through
                  Side 2
7.Cotton Fields
8.When Girls Get Together
9.Good Time
10.Take A Load Off Your Feet
11.I Just Got My Pay
12.Add Some Music To Your Day
                 Side 3
13.This Whole World
14.Soulful Old Man Sunshine
15.Tears In The Morning
16.Games Two Can Play
17.At My Window
18.Celebrate The News
                 Side 4
19.Back Home
20.Fallin' In Love
21.Our Sweet Love
22.Forever
23.Susie Cincinnati
24.Cool, Cool Water


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: carl r on August 02, 2009, 04:31:05 AM
My ideas were a bit rushed originally, i prefer crinkleman's to my own in most regards. I Just Got My Pay is one of my favorites, just don't ask why, I really couldn't tell you. At My Window ... it was a mistake to include it twice, but thinking about it, an instrumental reprise would be nice to hear. As for being a monster, I guess there's a bit of truth in that. Rar!

Just an additional thought: one of the criticisms of the released Sunflower is lack of a theme. I guess increasing the number of "pom-pom-pom" numbers would let a theme emerge, of a "Music Hall" Beach Boys. Bear with me. A tragi-comic night at the Peoples Musical Theatre. Sunflower extended.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Alex on August 03, 2009, 07:49:14 PM

Everyone needs to take three steps back, count to ten, and relax.

Relax, don't do it, when you want to go to it...


OMG, a Frankie reference on Smiley SMiLE!! Fodaing awesome...way to go, Alex...  :rock

Well, I did recently go to a FGTH concert at the Pleasuredome!! :lol :lol


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: sleeptalk on October 03, 2009, 12:00:15 AM
i really don't get the hate for the bruce songs that some people seem to have. the only two songs on the album that are definitely better than them are "forever" and "cool cool water," and maybe "all i wanna do"...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 03, 2009, 09:26:56 AM
Considering I rank This Whole World among my favorite 5-10 BBs songs, I'd certainly rank it above Bruce's Sunflower songs (not to mention above Forever--by about a factor of a hundred--and Cool Cool Water).


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: sleeptalk on October 03, 2009, 10:24:48 AM
Considering I rank This Whole World among my favorite 5-10 BBs songs, I'd certainly rank it above Bruce's Sunflower songs (not to mention above Forever--by about a factor of a hundred--and Cool Cool Water).

the a capella "Forever" on Hawthorne is my 2nd favorite Beach Boys song, after "God Only Knows." it is scripture.

"This Whole World" is great, though.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on October 03, 2009, 06:32:07 PM

the a capella "Forever" on Hawthorne is my 2nd favorite Beach Boys song, after "God Only Knows." it is scripture.

Fair enough. But file me under "heretic," then.  ;)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Don_Zabu on March 26, 2010, 10:39:14 PM
Unlike most, I actually love "Add Some Music Too Your Day". It's able to penetrate past the part of my brain that would normally notice how corny the lyrics are and directly bury itself in the overgrown child part of me.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: slothrop on March 28, 2010, 08:45:03 PM
Unlike most, I actually love "Add Some Music Too Your Day". It's able to penetrate past the part of my brain that would normally notice how corny the lyrics are and directly bury itself in the overgrown child part of me.

Indeed, the lyrics are corny. However, they're also very true. Great lyrics because they speak the truth and don't care whether it's "hip" or not.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: LetHimRun on April 02, 2010, 05:21:07 PM
5. Great album. A little bit of sugar from Bruce, but not horrible. The rest is great.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Don_Zabu on April 11, 2010, 10:18:06 AM
If I were making up this album, I'd replace "Got to Know the Woman" with "Sail Plane Song", "Tears in the Morning" with "Soulful Old Man Sunshine", and "At My Window" with Bruce Johnston's version of "I Write The Songs". Yeah, I know the song hadn't been written yet, but it fits too well to not make it a flawless masterpiece for the ages.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Curtis Leon on August 04, 2010, 04:59:53 PM
Sunflower as a double-album:
                   Side 1
1.San Miguel
2.Deirdre
3.All I Wanna Do
4.Break Away
5.Loop de Loop
6.Slip On Through
                  Side 2
7.Cotton Fields
8.When Girls Get Together
9.Good Time
10.Take A Load Off Your Feet
11.I Just Got My Pay
12.Add Some Music To Your Day
                 Side 3
13.This Whole World
14.Soulful Old Man Sunshine
15.Tears In The Morning
16.Games Two Can Play
17.At My Window
18.Celebrate The News
                 Side 4
19.Back Home
20.Fallin' In Love
21.Our Sweet Love
22.Forever
23.Susie Cincinnati
24.Cool, Cool Water


I wish I had half of those unreleased songs. Or, at least, I wish I had half of those songs in good quality. Ugh, I hate 128kbps.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: drbeachboy on August 04, 2010, 05:43:05 PM
In most cases 128kps is CD quality and transparent, unless the encoder is from the 1990's. The bad quality of a lot of that footwear is the source material itself.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Curtis Leon on August 04, 2010, 08:27:02 PM
In most cases 128kps is CD quality and transparent, unless the encoder is from the 1990's. The bad quality of a lot of that footwear is the source material itself.

Mmmm, really? Usually I notice quite a bit of difference between 128 and. say, 192 or 320.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: rab2591 on August 05, 2010, 07:18:06 AM
Last night 'The Whole World' popped into my head and I couldn't get it out. I found 'Sunflower' with the intention of listening to 'This Whole World' only. I saw 'Slip On Through' and remembered it was a fantastic song. So I started the album from the beginning and ended up listening to the entire album. I'd never really listened to Sunflower before (just as background music)....this time I gave the album my full attention...here are my impressions:

Slip On Through - 5/5 - Brilliant chorus - great vocal arrangement.
This Whole World - 5/5 - brilliant on every level.
Add Some Music - 5/5 - great message and beautiful song....LOVE the prelude to the chorus.
Got To Know The Woman - 3/5 - I like the idea of the song....would be 4/5 if "Got To Know A Woman" was not repeated umpteen times.
Deidre - 5/5 - yet another song that's brilliant on every level....chorus, verse, ending....love it all.
It's About Time - 5/5 - the verse rolls on like a locomotive engine. Chorus is brilliant, especially the buildup of the bridge.
Tears In The Morning - 4/5 - listenable but seems far too overdramatic to me. I love the piano ending.
All I Wanna Do - 5/5 - love the instrumentals and vocals.
Forever - 5/5 - probably the best on the album.
Our Sweet Love - 4/5 - good song, but not up to par with the rest of the album.
At My Window - 5/5 - love the childlike simplicity of the lyrics...love the vocals...
Cool, Cool Water - 5/5 - When the 'Love to Say da da' part came in I got a vivid image of me standing on a beach during a hurricane. Probably my favorite outro to any Beach Boys album.

Sunflower is now one of my favorite Beach Boy's albums. After listening to the album, I picked up Carlin's 'Catch A Wave' off my bookshelf and read about the Sunflower era. I can't believe the album wasn't more popular than it was/is. Really an underrated album in my opinion.

5/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dunderhead on August 29, 2010, 08:48:16 AM
This album is just so great. It's hard to rank Beach Boys albums, I honestly enjoy all the albums between All Summer Long and Holland. Sunflower is a cut above them however, and objectively it's hard to rank anything other than Pet Sounds above it.
Every song just works, Slip On Through is a fantastic opener. I've always felt this album was like the BB's Abbey Road, and Slip On through blows Come Together out of the water.
The album also features some of the best production on a BB album since Pet Sounds, everything sounds crystal clear, the instruments are all perfectly balanced.
I also think the songs that people don't like all that much, Our Sweet Love; Tears in the Morning; At My Window are great. The two weakest tracks are Got to Know the Woman and Cool Cool Water, which isn't bad, it just doesn't fit the album. I think the album would be better with Break Away and maybe When Girls Get Together instead. But as is Sunflower is a solid 5.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: ukulelejesus on September 22, 2010, 11:03:02 PM
Call me an idiot, but Deirdre is my favorite track on it. Go figure.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dunderhead on November 26, 2010, 04:50:54 PM
of unreleased songs I don't really like San Miguel, Loop De Loop, or WGGT,  I'm Going Your Way is a no brainer though, should have been put instead of Got to Know the Woman. I would love it if there was a live version.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Beckgtr09 on December 10, 2010, 09:09:14 PM
A couple days ago I was listening to my two fer disc of this album. Is it just me or is the French talking in AT MY WINDOW mixed down so I couldn't hear it ? Maybe it's just my hearing and old age finally getting a hold of me.  ???

Ted


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dr. Tim on February 20, 2011, 07:36:59 AM
Funny how all y'all claim to love this LP but insist on fuckin with the track order, or doing substitutions.

C'mon - do you like the album as is, or do you not?  Nuts how after all these years everybody still has an idea for changing it.  Can't we just appreciate what the artistes have done in the form they chose to give us without constantly CHANGING it?

So here is my idea for changing it -- keep the original running order, but segue/butt-splice the tracks.  This would have been a very 1970 FM radio-type fashion statement, like the Moody Blues.  Gives the appearance of a cohesive whole, even though it isn't.  Which, as John Lennon was happy to point out, was the case with Sgt. Pepper.

Pasted in from the "40 years old" thread, made sense to put it here.  5 for me, BTW.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on February 20, 2011, 07:55:25 AM
People still offer suggestions for "improving" Pet Sounds, too, so I'd say no album is safe... Personally, I knowing what else was around at the time, I find plenty of room for improvement to my taste. That said, it wasn't my album to make, and I can always screw with tracklists and running orders in my own time.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mahalo on March 07, 2011, 02:27:57 PM
Does All I Wanna Do use rotating speakers played into microphones? I'm trying to think where I've heard that before....


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Amazing Larry on September 08, 2011, 01:00:19 AM
Echoes by Pink Floyd?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Amazing Larry on October 16, 2011, 04:19:09 PM
1. Slip On Through 9.5/10
2. This Whole World 10/10
3. Add Some Music 8.5/10
4. Got To Know The Woman 8/10
5. Deirdre 8.5/10
6. It's About Time 9/10
7. Tears In The Morning 8/10
8. All I Wanna Do 10/10
9. Forever 10/10
10. Our Sweet Love 9.5/10
11. At My Window 9.5/10
12. Cool, Cool Water 10/10

Album Rating: 9.2


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Griffmanr on October 28, 2011, 08:43:53 AM
Sunflower is definitely my favorite Beach Boys album!!  It covers so many bases and yet totally plays as a cohesive unit.  It's awesome

Track by Track Review

1. Slip On Through - This is just a fantastic album opener.  It really kicks ass for sure!!  Dennis Rocks!  Fantastic harmonies on the chorus.  Love the ending when the bridge goes back into the chorus!  10/10
2. This Whole World - This song is just a mind blowing composition.  In less than 2 minutes Brian and the boys take us on a musical journey that's more varied and exciting than any 20 minute long-prog piece (though there are some really good ones of those too.)  10/10
3.  Add Some Music - goshdarn it this song should not be as good as it is.  The lyrics are kinda cheesy but damn do they work.  The mid section is so beautiful.  Love how everyone (but Dennis) sings a line. 10/10t's
4. Deirdre - I'm sometimes not a fan of Bruce (I feel like Disney Girls is a little overrated), but this is definitely my favorite of his compositions.  It's perfect sunshine pop!  10/10
5. Got to Know the Woman - Some people aren't that big of fans of this song but I think it's superb.  Great Vocal from Dennis.  I actually love the female backing singers on this. 10/10
6. It's About Time - Holy sh*t, a Beach Boys song that actually legitametly rocks in the studio.  Got to give props to Desper on this one. 10/10
7. Tears in the Morning - Definitely my least favorite one on here.  I think the entire thing is just a little bit schmaltzy, and I can't stand that candle line, however it's still a damn fine song.  I love the way the piano ending segues into the next track. 8/10
8. All I Wanna Do - This is possibly my favorite Beach Boys song.  The production is out of this world.  It gives me the chills every time. 11/10
9. Forever - A damn fine ballad from Dennis.  While it's not one of my top favorite Beach Boys songs it's still absolutely incredibly beautiful.  Brian's vocals at the end are awesome! 10/10
10. Our Sweet Love - A great ballad but it feels kind of like a retread of God Only Knows.  Love Brian's backing vocals on this.  9/10
11. At My Window - This is a strange one but I absolutely love it to death.  It starts out as this bizzare childish song that sounds like it could get annoying, and then all of a sudden it gets really creepy.  All of sudden you're then hit with one of the most gorgeous fades on a Beach Boys Song 9/10
12.  Cool Cool Water - Spectacular.  I personally like this more than Da Da (Maybe the box set will change my mind.)  10/10

All in all sunflower is an unbelievable album.  Though some of the songs (mainly Tears in the Morning) aren't perfect, I still wouldn't change a thing about it.  It's amazing how much joy this album brings me every time I listen to it.

10/10 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: louielouie on October 29, 2011, 09:45:41 PM
Sunflower is definitely my favorite Beach Boys album!!  It covers so many bases and yet totally plays as a cohesive unit.  It's awesome

Track by Track Review

1. Slip On Through - This is just a fantastic album opener.  It really kicks ass for sure!!  Dennis Rocks!  Fantastic harmonies on the chorus.  Love the ending when the bridge goes back into the chorus!  10/10
2. This Whole World - This song is just a mind blowing composition.  In less than 2 minutes Brian and the boys take us on a musical journey that's more varied and exciting than any 20 minute long-prog piece (though there are some really good ones of those too.)  10/10
3.  Add Some Music - goshdarn it this song should not be as good as it is.  The lyrics are kinda cheesy but damn do they work.  The mid section is so beautiful.  Love how everyone (but Dennis) sings a line. 10/10t's
4. Deirdre - I'm sometimes not a fan of Bruce (I feel like Disney Girls is a little overrated), but this is definitely my favorite of his compositions.  It's perfect sunshine pop!  10/10
5. Got to Know the Woman - Some people aren't that big of fans of this song but I think it's superb.  Great Vocal from Dennis.  I actually love the female backing singers on this. 10/10
6. It's About Time - Holy sh*t, a Beach Boys song that actually legitametly rocks in the studio.  Got to give props to Desper on this one. 10/10
7. Tears in the Morning - Definitely my least favorite one on here.  I think the entire thing is just a little bit schmaltzy, and I can't stand that candle line, however it's still a damn fine song.  I love the way the piano ending segues into the next track. 8/10
8. All I Wanna Do - This is possibly my favorite Beach Boys song.  The production is out of this world.  It gives me the chills every time. 11/10
9. Forever - A damn fine ballad from Dennis.  While it's not one of my top favorite Beach Boys songs it's still absolutely incredibly beautiful.  Brian's vocals at the end are awesome! 10/10
10. Our Sweet Love - A great ballad but it feels kind of like a retread of God Only Knows.  Love Brian's backing vocals on this.  9/10
11. At My Window - This is a strange one but I absolutely love it to death.  It starts out as this bizzare childish song that sounds like it could get annoying, and then all of a sudden it gets really creepy.  All of sudden you're then hit with one of the most gorgeous fades on a Beach Boys Song 9/10
12.  Cool Cool Water - Spectacular.  I personally like this more than Da Da (Maybe the box set will change my mind.)  10/10

All in all sunflower is an unbelievable album.  Though some of the songs (mainly Tears in the Morning) aren't perfect, I still wouldn't change a thing about it.  It's amazing how much joy this album brings me every time I listen to it.

10/10 

Excellent summary! :)

I also love this album badly, I remember the first time I listen to it for the first time, it was a mind blowing and totally emotive moment. Some of my favourite Beach Boys songs are in this album. I specially love Slip on through, Our sweet love, All I wanna do and At my window wich  I consider an almost graphic experience with that incredible textures (Agree with you, that fade out is out of this world). I have always thought of Sunflower as Beach Boys's Abbey Road :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: JK on October 30, 2011, 07:55:34 AM
8. All I Wanna Do - This is possibly my favorite Beach Boys song.  The production is out of this world.  It gives me the chills every time. 11/10

My opinion to the letter. And possibly that of others on this board. :=)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Puggal on March 14, 2012, 11:27:03 PM
This probably the most cohesive album the boys have recorded since Pet Sounds. Sonically, I mean. I guess the overwhelming "sunshine" vibe also makes it all feel quite cohesive (which I like). 4 stars, if only for a bit of uninspired sweetness in "At My Window" and Bruce's typically clunky "Tears in the Morning."

Did Brian write the melody to Deidre? It sounds "classically" Brian to me.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Wirestone on March 15, 2012, 12:02:09 AM
This probably the most cohesive album the boys have recorded since Pet Sounds. Sonically, I mean. I guess the overwhelming "sunshine" vibe also makes it all feel quite cohesive (which I like). 4 stars, if only for a bit of uninspired sweetness in "At My Window" and Bruce's typically clunky "Tears in the Morning."

Did Brian write the melody to Deidre? It sounds "classically" Brian to me.



Brian wrote some words to "Deidre" that Bruce didn't use.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Disney Boy (1985) on March 15, 2012, 02:42:19 AM
Awesome album. Tears In The Morning the only downer. By some considerable distance the best tracks are: Slip On Through, This Whole World, It's About Time, All I Wanna Do and Forever.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lee on March 15, 2012, 06:37:16 AM
Call me an idiot, but Deirdre is my favorite track on it. Go figure.

It's not my favorite on the album but I do love that song. I enjoy it much more than Disney Girls (which seems to be the Bruce track that gets the most attention).


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lowbacca on March 15, 2012, 07:07:07 AM
"Deirdre" is a fine, fine track. I would love to see Bruce's contribution to the reunion album to turn out to be something like "Deirdre".


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dunderhead on March 30, 2012, 11:46:07 PM
I just don't get why people don't like Tears, that was probably the song I liked most next to Slip on Through the first few times I listened to Sunflower. It hooks me from the opening stereo pan on the drums.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Melissa on April 19, 2012, 06:03:20 PM
Great album with some of their best songs. How can you not love "Add Some Music"?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Cabinessenceking on June 07, 2012, 02:31:10 PM
All near-perfect songs except Bruce material which imo is B compared to the rest. Not loving Got To Know The Woman either, its fine, but just not Slip On Through. Forever is good, but I dont play it alot, bit boring for my taste. Our Sweet love suffers much from sugar lyrics when one consideres the amazing backing track.

album is 9.0 for me


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Puggal on June 09, 2012, 04:52:27 PM
Probably going to "up" this to a weak 5, the only flaw being Tears in the Morning. This really is as close to perfect as the Beach Boys get. So, so lovely.

By the way, was Brian the primary composer of At My Window? 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on June 10, 2012, 06:02:34 AM
The melody is based on an old folk song, so neither of them wrote that. My guess is Brian's contribution is the weird chord change towards the end and the French spoken word part. And the production/arrangement in general.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: hypehat on June 10, 2012, 07:46:51 AM
The melody is based on an old folk song, so neither of them wrote that. My guess is Brian's contribution is the weird chord change towards the end and the French spoken word part. And the production/arrangement in general.
Really? I heard it was actually Lookin' At Tomorrow that was based on an old folk song. With 2 last sentences agree though.

As per Al, the hook is really similar to a song called Raspberries, Strawberries by The Kingston  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKAxV3rNBpo


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: lance on June 18, 2012, 07:17:46 AM
both of them are based on old folk songs.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: musicismylife101 on June 27, 2012, 05:03:05 PM
Great group effort. Nice to hear Bruce shine vocally, I think this is the most we hear of him in an album and as a lead vocalist. Dennis's Forever is stunning and Mike's vocals in All I Wanna Do are amazing. Add Some Music to Your Day is also nice and Carl's vocals shine in it. Very nice album.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: hypehat on June 30, 2012, 08:40:09 AM
both of them are based on old folk songs.
Can you indicate me the source where it's said that At My Window is based on some old folk song? I'm just curious about it.


I swear I showed you this already - Raspberries, Strawberries by The Kingston Trio


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: hypehat on July 02, 2012, 03:18:57 AM
both of them are based on old folk songs.
Can you indicate me the source where it's said that At My Window is based on some old folk song? I'm just curious about it.


I swear I showed you this already - Raspberries, Strawberries by The Kingston Trio
I know you did show me that. But I don't see much similarity between them. So, credits (Wilson-Jardine) are correct. THey didn't write it as "traditional", did they?

No, but the 'It came to my window' refrain is the same. Classic Al songwriting, that.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Ovi on July 02, 2012, 03:14:19 PM
I just listened to the album for the first time in about a year and I think it's really great. I don't know if it was due to my good mood or not, but I found every single song to be good, even 'At My Window' and 'Tears In The Morning' which I used to label as "too cheesy" or "not my thing". But I truly like every single song here. 'Cool Cool Water' is hypnotic, 'Slip On Through' and 'It's About Time' rock, 'All I Wanna Do' is just incredible and this time Mike's (/Brian's) TM lyrics really work, and the humming part in 'Forever' is one the most beautiful moments in The Beach Boys history.

5 out of 5.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: halblaineisgood on July 18, 2012, 08:56:19 PM
Sunflower original vinyl on a decent system. That is a
singularly awesome experience. I guess I should hear it
in quad now.

I have got this Sony receiver. It has the pro logic setting
on it. Do I just need to hook it up to that, with four speakers?


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: clinikillz on August 12, 2012, 08:39:31 AM
Fantastic group effort. Despite a couple throwaway tracks (Got to Know the Woman, Tears in the Morning), the album is a great listen. In my opinion, The Whole World, Forever and Cool, Cool Water are all-time classics. 4/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SufferingFools on September 06, 2012, 06:21:03 AM
Does anyone else on the planet actually prefer the original European track sequence of Sunflower (starting off with the 45rpm version of "Cottonfields" and putting "Deirdre" before "Got to Know the Woman")?  I was a big fan of the album already, but got hold of an old Stateside-label copy several years ago and it blew me away even more.  Maybe it wasn't what was originally intended by the group, but this was the version that went stratospheric in the UK back in 1970, which is at least historically significant.

My favorite moment on Sunflower, though, is at the end of "Our Sweet Love," at the verrrrrrrrry end of the final chord, that one little extra tambourine hit, as if the guy with the tambourine just couldn't contain his joy.  :)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Freddie French-Pounce on September 16, 2012, 06:45:45 AM
Does anyone else on the planet actually prefer the original European track sequence of Sunflower (starting off with the 45rpm version of "Cottonfields" and putting "Deirdre" before "Got to Know the Woman")?  I was a big fan of the album already, but got hold of an old Stateside-label copy several years ago and it blew me away even more.  Maybe it wasn't what was originally intended by the group, but this was the version that went stratospheric in the UK back in 1970, which is at least historically significant.

My favorite moment on Sunflower, though, is at the end of "Our Sweet Love," at the verrrrrrrrry end of the final chord, that one little extra tambourine hit, as if the guy with the tambourine just couldn't contain his joy.  :)

Cottonfields isn't a bad touch, simply because it's right at the beginning, and Deirdre before GTKTW works better, but then again i only really play the UK Lp, so...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Bean Bag on January 04, 2013, 12:47:40 PM
Does anyone else on the planet actually prefer the original European track sequence of Sunflower (starting off with the 45rpm version of "Cottonfields" and putting "Deirdre" before "Got to Know the Woman")?  I was a big fan of the album already, but got hold of an old Stateside-label copy several years ago and it blew me away even more.  Maybe it wasn't what was originally intended by the group, but this was the version that went stratospheric in the UK back in 1970, which is at least historically significant.
YES!!  Right on!!  I much prefer the UK tracklisting!  And you're right... it's the version that hit big!  I'm right there with you.

It wasn't until I heard the album sequenced this way that I truly got it.  The album didn't click with me before.  Sure, I liked the individual songs... but as an album, I didn't see why the Europeans saw it as another Pet Sounds.  I tried but couldn't see it.  Then hearing it opening up with Cottonfields -- I instantly heard it.  It just works.  Maybe it's the feeling of taking of your shoes, walking outside - barefoot - and putting the day behind you:  "When I was a little bitty baby..."  That's a nice opener.

Opening with "Slip on through" was too much for me.   Too heavy.  Too deep.  I like, easing into it with Cottonfields.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Heteronym on February 21, 2013, 10:54:28 AM
I've been reading about and listening to this album a lot recently, maybe because I've had never dig it they way most people have. Truth is, I had never given it a proper chance.

I don't understand how Sunflower can be called "too sweet", if for the first time or so we are presented with those nice rockers by Carl and Dennis. I agree, Slip On Through as an opener might not have been the best idea: I remember the feeling of "WTF?" when I first tried to list Sunflower and those weird notes came right up. I wasn't ready for it! Sunflower has the Add Some Music kind of vibe as well as that crazy upbeat feeling you get from Slip On Through, This Whole World, Got To Know The Woman and It's About Time. Even though 20/20 was a radical shift, this album seemed quite weird to me at first listen.

By reading the thread I became aware of the Tears In The Morning's dialetic. It's a well constructed song, but the way Bruce sings it...makes it cheesy as hell, as if it were some kind of lame country tune. Plus, the opening is a little too much to digest. Deidre is awesome, though.

As a Brian Wilson fanatic, I'm obviously disappointed with how little lead vocals he got during this era, but his voice is always present in the backing vocals and it adds so much! He really made Forever sound more beautiful than it already is. Although, I think he could have gotten the lead on At My Window and Our Sweet Love.

GTKTW and SOT have really grown on me; I find it incredibly funny how Brian "answers" Dennis' lines on GTKTW. Not to mention the "aaah-haha-haaa....baby, lemme tell your something". Awesome and it gave a whole new dimensoin to the BB's world.

I'll give it a 4 because, in spite of all the good things, this album lacks moments of real brilliance that characterizes the Beach Boys I had gotten used to. Maybe that was Brian's absence, I don't know, but Sunflower is still below Today, Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile, Wild Honey, Friends and Love You in my league. Plus, it kinda started the sequence of average albums that would last untill Love You


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Disney Boy (1985) on February 22, 2013, 11:38:19 PM
I've been reading about and listening to this album a lot recently, maybe because I've had never dig it they way most people have. Truth is, I had never given it a proper chance.

I don't understand how Sunflower can be called "too sweet", if for the first time or so we are presented with those nice rockers by Carl and Dennis. I agree, Slip On Through as an opener might not have been the best idea: I remember the feeling of "WTF?" when I first tried to list Sunflower and those weird notes came right up. I wasn't ready for it! Sunflower has the Add Some Music kind of vibe as well as that crazy upbeat feeling you get from Slip On Through, This Whole World, Got To Know The Woman and It's About Time. Even though 20/20 was a radical shift, this album seemed quite weird to me at first listen.

By reading the thread I became aware of the Tears In The Morning's dialetic. It's a well constructed song, but the way Bruce sings it...makes it cheesy as hell, as if it were some kind of lame country tune. Plus, the opening is a little too much to digest. Deidre is awesome, though.

As a Brian Wilson fanatic, I'm obviously disappointed with how little lead vocals he got during this era, but his voice is always present in the backing vocals and it adds so much! He really made Forever sound more beautiful than it already is. Although, I think he could have gotten the lead on At My Window and Our Sweet Love.

GTKTW and SOT have really grown on me; I find it incredibly funny how Brian "answers" Dennis' lines on GTKTW. Not to mention the "aaah-haha-haaa....baby, lemme tell your something". Awesome and it gave a whole new dimensoin to the BB's world.

I'll give it a 4 because, in spite of all the good things, this album lacks moments of real brilliance that characterizes the Beach Boys I had gotten used to. Maybe that was Brian's absence, I don't know, but Sunflower is still below Today, Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile, Wild Honey, Friends and Love You in my league. Plus, it kinda started the sequence of average albums that would last untill Love You

'Started the sequence of average albums that would last until Love You'? Seriously? I'd say Sunflower is more the start of a sequence of incredible albums - Surf's Up, Holland, In Concert - that would last until 15 Big Ones (Carl & The Passions is too much of a curate's egg to make the list). Don't get me wrong, I love all the '65-'69 albums as well. To me, pretty much the entire period from 1965 to 1973/4 is fantastic. But as always, each to their own...

Nice to see some love for Got To Know The Woman though. One of my biggest shocks on first joining this site was seeing all the critisim and dislike this song generated - i've always loved it from the very first listen! A few more Got To Know The Woman's and a few less Tears In The Morning's and perhaps the group wouldn't have been considered so cringingly naff at the time...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Heteronym on February 23, 2013, 05:05:31 AM
Maybe I was too harsh on Surf's Up because it has those moments of brilliance, although a track or two are really off to me. Anyway, I can't get into Holland and much less CATP. They aren't bad (especially Holland that does have some strong moments), but I can't help comparing the 70's material to the 60's ones...different times, I know (not just for the band, but musical context itself), but I just can't connect to those two albums. Well, maybe they will grown on me eventually.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lowbacca on February 23, 2013, 08:16:15 AM
Anyway, I can't get into Holland and much less CATP.
Please keep trying.  :-\ These 2 have been my favourite BBs LPs for the last couple of months. CATP especially is one of a kind.  :3d Such a cool era of Beach Boys sound.

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_d1cIWUKbr5w/Su23eVuX-2I/AAAAAAAAAb4/TOSfBdvK7z0/s320/The%20Beach%20Boys%20Carl%20&%20The%20Passions%20promo.jpg)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Les Garçons de la plage on February 24, 2013, 10:17:30 AM
The last excellent Beach Boys album - (OK, Love You is cool too but a bit.... weird, what with the synth arrangements and slightly goofy lyrics). Bruce Johnston-sung tracks are a bit sappy but not bad. My personal favourite -  All I Wanna Do, almost proto-shoegazing and a pretty overlooked track.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dudd on April 01, 2013, 06:38:41 AM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lowbacca on April 01, 2013, 07:56:43 AM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
Sappy kitsch deluxe.
But yeah, I guess it's an overall okay song..


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Dudd on April 01, 2013, 11:51:55 AM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
Sappy kitsch deluxe.
But yeah, I guess it's an overall okay song..
Eh. That's just Bruce Johnston's thing. To me, it's Dierdre that's the sappy one, and I still really like it.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lowbacca on April 01, 2013, 01:17:48 PM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
Sappy kitsch deluxe.
But yeah, I guess it's an overall okay song..
Eh. That's just Bruce Johnston's thing. To me, it's Dierdre that's the sappy one, and I still really like it.
"Deirdre" kicks major ass.  :) As does "Disney Girls". "Tears In The Morning" simply isn't as good a song as the aforementioned two, at least to my ears.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: bluesno1fann on August 30, 2013, 05:57:16 PM
Brilliant Album!
My favourite tracks would have to be Dennis's.
Other than the Smile Sessions, this album comes closest to greatness to Pet Sounds.
But seriously, no need for hatred for any of Bruce's tracks, they're all not really THAT BAD!!!
5 out of 5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Daniel Dolphin on September 30, 2013, 01:40:28 PM
I have thought about how Alan may have felt when sunflower was finally released in 1970. All his significant contributions were dismissed during the recompilations  of the album(loop de loop, back home,susie cincinetti,feet,good time). I have a feeling that he was compensated with some cocredits om it's about time and our sweet love. Vocally he only has One solo line in ASMTYD . No wonder that he craved to have more presence on "Surf's up" the year after.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: RiC on October 25, 2013, 11:08:46 PM
I'll give it 4/5. It is closer to five though. I just happen to think it's slightly overrated. Don't get me wrong, I love every song on it. It's very cohesive and there's a lot of Beach Boys classics. But there is couple mediocre songs in the middle too.

Slip On Through 4.5/5
Cool opener!
This Whole World 5/5
Perfect song and one of my all-time favorites. One of the best examples of Brian's genius. Who else could make a song that runs under 2 mins and is this great?
Add Some Music 4.5/5
Wait what they didn't have autotune back in the days!?
Got To Know The Woman 3/5
Nice song but it's definetely not up there with Forever or River song.
Deirdre 3/5
Yeah same here, nice song but this is not Disney Girls.
It's About Time 5/5
Another perfect one! And this even rocks pretty hard.
Tears In The Morning 3.5/5
A little bit better than Deirdre.
All I Wanna Do 4.5/5
Wow! Mike really can sing, at least sometimes.
Forever 5/5
No words needed here.
Our Sweet Love 4/5
As the title says, very sweet.
At My Window 4.5/5
I love the organ intro. And I can't imagine anyone than Bruce singing this. The fade out is one of the best ever.
Cool, Cool Water 5/5
And another perfect one! Brian sounds so cool here. Still I think this is a little bit out of place. Reminds too much of Smile and there it should've been.

For a Beach boys fan the cover art is really cool and awesome but show that to other people and they say it's really cheesy  :P I think they just don't get it  8)


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: RiC on December 28, 2013, 02:47:28 AM
I was just wondering, has Mike Love ever given any comments about Sunflower? Propably has but I couldn't find anything from quick search. He must hate it because it doesn't have any hits and it didn't sell...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Gabo on January 15, 2014, 07:26:42 PM
Not as good as Surf's Up. It has many mediocre songs while Surf's Up has just one bad one. It also seems a little too saccharine, especially the Bruce numbers and Our Sweet Love. It holds together a lot better than 20/20 as an LP but still has a lot of fluff.

About 4/5. Probably their third best of the 70s, after Love You and Surf's Up.



Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: bluesno1fann on January 15, 2014, 07:28:43 PM
Not as good as Surf's Up. It has many mediocre songs while Surf's Up has just one bad one. It also seems a little too saccharine, especially the Bruce numbers and Our Sweet Love. It holds together a lot better than 20/20 as an LP but still has a lot of fluff.

About 4/5.



For once I agree with you!  :lol
Except for the part about Surf's Up being better than Sunflower. Don't much care for Don't Go Near The Water, Take A Load Off Your Feet and the out-take 4th Of July as well as Student Demonstration Time!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: slippingonthrough on February 20, 2014, 10:27:58 PM
In Sunflower you can feel all the heart and soul they put into this record to make it as good as they could. They're all great songs. My favourite would have to be the opener "Slip On Through".

5/5 easily.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mr. Wilson on March 03, 2014, 03:24:47 PM
Album + cover art.. 5/5.. Music 5/5.. The only track im not crazy about is GTKTW.. Altho I don't skip it either.. Summer of 1970 this was a guilty pleasure that I only played when I was alone.. BB very unhip at the time and I was laughed at when I played it at a couple of party's .. I knew it was excellent but back in those hippie macho days this was too light + tender for the masses .. Doesn't matter quality always  shines thru.. A true group effort  from everyone and a true desert island disk..


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: drbeachboy on March 03, 2014, 04:32:49 PM
Album + cover art.. 5/5.. Music 5/5.. The only track im not crazy about is GTKTW.. Altho I don't skip it either.. Summer of 1970 this was a guilty pleasure that I only played when I was alone.. BB very unhip at the time and I was laughed at when I played it at a couple of party's .. I knew it was excellent but back in those hippie macho days this was too light + tender for the masses .. Doesn't matter quality always  shines thru.. A true group effort  from everyone and a true desert island disk..
We must be very close in age, as I went through much the same thing.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mr. Wilson on March 03, 2014, 05:10:16 PM
Yes sir I believe we are.. I noticed your posts years ago and had that feeling.. We grew up in a very special time ..


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Little Pad on August 23, 2014, 05:17:30 PM
5/5. A little bit too saccharine at times, but I can't fault any album with "Forever" on it too much.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: JK on August 24, 2014, 04:29:30 AM
5/5. A little bit too saccharine at times, but I can't fault any album with "Forever" on it too much.
Replace "Forever" with "All I Wanna Do" (my road-to-Hawthorne moment) and I couldn't agree more. :=) Same score for me too.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Little Pad on August 24, 2014, 05:31:54 PM
5/5. A little bit too saccharine at times, but I can't fault any album with "Forever" on it too much.
Replace "Forever" with "All I Wanna Do" (my road-to-Hawthorne moment) and I couldn't agree more. :=) Same score for me too.

That one's probably my 2nd favourite!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: JK on August 25, 2014, 06:26:52 AM
I never understood the appeal for "All I Wanna Do". It's cool, yes, but not sth. earth-shattering. I certainly like it, but it's not my Top anything BBs (100, 50, even 200).
"All I Wanna Do" draws the listener into a unique sonic world----unique even by Beach Boys standards. Mr Desper's finest moment, in this poster's humble opinion.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Disney Boy (1985) on August 31, 2014, 01:13:49 PM
All I Wanna Do is in my top twenty, possibly top ten.

So ahead of its time...


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Woodstock on August 31, 2014, 01:19:00 PM
I never understood the appeal for "All I Wanna Do". It's cool, yes, but not sth. earth-shattering. I certainly like it, but it's not my Top anything BBs (100, 50, even 200).
"All I Wanna Do" draws the listener into a unique sonic world----unique even by Beach Boys standards. Mr Desper's finest moment, in this poster's humble opinion.

Indeed. One of my favorite songs.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: beacharg on August 31, 2014, 02:29:00 PM
I never understood the appeal for "All I Wanna Do". It's cool, yes, but not sth. earth-shattering. I certainly like it, but it's not my Top anything BBs (100, 50, even 200).
"All I Wanna Do" draws the listener into a unique sonic world----unique even by Beach Boys standards. Mr Desper's finest moment, in this poster's humble opinion.

Indeed. One of my favorite songs.

I agree too, it must be in my top 5 or 10 (BBs songs). I always wonder if there is any demo or alternate version of this gem.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Woodstock on August 31, 2014, 02:36:50 PM
Nothing that has ever been booted.

Something from 1969 does exist - it was an early instrumental track ft. a sitar I think. Hopefully we'll get to hear that one day.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: alf wiedersehen on August 31, 2014, 09:27:30 PM
Nothing that has ever been booted.

Something from 1969 does exist - it was an early instrumental track ft. a sitar I think. Hopefully we'll get to hear that one day.

It's from '68.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: beacharg on September 01, 2014, 03:45:02 PM
Nothing that has ever been booted.

Something from 1969 does exist - it was an early instrumental track ft. a sitar I think. Hopefully we'll get to hear that one day.

:ahh :ahh :ahh that's great!

How we didn't get that in MiC???  ???


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: elnombre on December 21, 2014, 06:24:13 PM
Magnificent album all around. I'm surprised by the hate Tears gets on here. It reminds me of My Boy by Elvis, but then I'm a sucker for those kind of histrionics.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard on January 13, 2015, 11:42:01 PM
Like with Pet Sounds, this is an easy 5/5 for me and there's not much more I can say about it. While the aforementioned may be a better album, I think Sunflower is the better *Beach Boys* album. Everyone shines here, everyone sounds focused and on the same page in terms of creative direction. This is the one and only Beach Boys album I've heard that sounds impeccably cohesive, with not a single track that takes me out of the zone or where I have doubts about whether a certain track really belongs with the rest. This is where the group really works together and sounds like a whole, not as Brian's messengers or competing fractions. In a perfect world, they'd have kept up output like this through the 70s. Unfortunately, Brian is Back, Dennis going solo, and Endless Summer were all major steps backward they never truly recovered from. This is also the only time where a SMiLE fragment was used on a later album that didn't seem forced, desperate, half-finished or some combination of the three, in my opinion.

My only minor criticism is the lame title which seems kinda arbitrary and unfitting. That and the sort of goofy, sort of (vaguely) creepy cover art. Not sure what they were thinking on that end.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: CroatianSensation on January 14, 2015, 06:01:51 PM
This Whole World and Cool Cool Water are fantastic songs out of the album. The worst is At My Window. What a brutal song to listen to. Other then that 5/5 stars really solid listen


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SufferingFools on January 22, 2015, 08:44:18 AM
This Whole World and Cool Cool Water are fantastic songs out of the album. The worst is At My Window. What a brutal song to listen to. Other then that 5/5 stars really solid listen
I don't know that I'd call it "brutal."  Maybe a bit weak... as if the album wanders off for a psychedelic bathroom break before getting back on course.  I don't actually know what I'm saying here...  But it's well produced and fits into the album like a quirky little dream sequence.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: CroatianSensation on March 25, 2015, 06:44:16 PM

[/quote]
I don't know that I'd call it "brutal."  Maybe a bit weak... as if the album wanders off for a psychedelic bathroom break before getting back on course.  I don't actually know what I'm saying here...  But it's well produced and fits into the album like a quirky little dream sequence.
[/quote]

Alright I've grown on the album and it is a decent song.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: harrisonjon on April 11, 2015, 08:29:50 AM
With all due respect to Bruce, I tend to skip his tracks, although Tears In The Morning has some nice BVs. 'Add Some Music' is also a track that I have mixed feelings about; I love the middle 8 but the verses don't do anything for me. Highlights for me are All I Wanna Do, Our Sweet Love and Forever


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: KDS on April 15, 2015, 01:31:13 PM
Yep, this is the album I rank above Pet Sounds. 

I rank Sunflower as a five, and my favorite Beach Boys album.  I really like the band feel to the album. 

Slip on Through - A short and sweet opener from Dennis brings the Boys into the 70s in grand style

This Whole World - OK, so this one might've made a better album opener, but no arguments here.  Pure 100% Beach Boys.

Add Some Music - Sounds like the Boys trying to adapt to the early 70s acoustic scene.  Sounds great. 

Got to Know the Woman - The one possible clunker on the album, but it still fits to me. 

Deidre - This song has grown on me.

It's About Time - The Beach Boys didn't rock out too much after the mid 60s, but if you ask me, this is one of the best post surf/car rockers in their catalog.

Tears in the Morning - Great Bruce effort.  Don't care what anyone says. 

All I Wanna Do - For me, the highlight of the album, and possible the last great B. Wilson/Love composition.

Forever - Dennis sure had a knack for ballads. 

Our Sweet Love - Another ray of sunshine. 

At My Window - OK, maybe we didn't need a third Bruce Johnston lead vocal on this album.  Maybe Brian or Al?  Still a decent song. 

Cool, Cool Water - Great group vocals. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SufferingFools on May 03, 2015, 05:12:19 PM
With all due respect to Bruce, I tend to skip his tracks, although Tears In The Morning has some nice BVs. 'Add Some Music' is also a track that I have mixed feelings about; I love the middle 8 but the verses don't do anything for me. Highlights for me are All I Wanna Do, Our Sweet Love and Forever

Yeah, Carl's middle eight is definitely the saving grace of the song.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: KDS on May 05, 2015, 11:30:46 AM
Until I read some of the posts on this thread, I really didn't know that Add Some Music to Your Day was much a polarizing song. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: drbeachboy on May 05, 2015, 11:38:39 AM
Until I read some of the posts on this thread, I really didn't know that Add Some Music to Your Day was much a polarizing song. 
Me either.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SufferingFools on May 09, 2015, 08:12:53 AM
Until I read some of the posts on this thread, I really didn't know that Add Some Music to Your Day was much a polarizing song.  

I don't dislike it, but to me the verses seem to run in place too long once they've made their fairly simple harmonic point, and the lyrics aren't clever enough to lift them out of the rut.  I really love the middle eight and the way it comes back in from there, up through "music is in my soul."

Also, I like how some of the backing vocals on the verses are reminiscent of "Only the Lonely."


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: SufferingFools on June 15, 2015, 05:46:46 AM
If it's the UK track sequence, I rank this album about as high as Pet Sounds.  The standard (US) album sequence falls a bit short to me.  Just a slight reordering and one addition, but it makes all the difference to my ear.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Deejay Smersh on June 21, 2015, 10:45:41 AM
I think by Al J. Admitting that the beach boys didn't know what they had, concerning Dennis and his considerable musical abilities...They just focused on his outward behavior. Thus robbing the whole band of a more progressive and artistic era of music, imo. Btw, why did Bruce J. Quit the boys in 72,73 circa? He seemed a little too white bread.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: KDS on June 30, 2015, 05:55:34 AM
I think by Al J. Admitting that the beach boys didn't know what they had, concerning Dennis and his considerable musical abilities...They just focused on his outward behavior. Thus robbing the whole band of a more progressive and artistic era of music, imo. Btw, why did Bruce J. Quit the boys in 72,73 circa? He seemed a little too white bread.

I don't think Bruce was a fan of the direction Jack Rieley was taking the Boys in, with some of the environmental / political songs on the Surf's Up record. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Mike's Beard on September 25, 2015, 09:18:06 AM
1. Slip On Through (4/5)
2. This Whole World (5/5)
3. Add Some Music (5/5)
4. Got To Know The Woman (3/5)
5. Deirdre (5/5)
6. It's About Time (4/5)
7. Tears In The Morning (4/5)
8. All I Wanna Do (5/5)
9. Forever (4/5)
10. Our Sweet Love (4/5)
11. At My Window (5/5)
12. Cool, Cool Water (5/5)

The band in it's prime - sales be damned - they were untouchable at this point.
Overall 5/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: caseyhardmeyer on September 25, 2015, 09:53:34 AM
I like Sunflower, but man its reputation has really become so bloated (IMO of course).

"Got to Know...", "Tears" and "Its About Time" I have been routinely skipping for years. I used to love "Add Some Music", but as time has gone by I've found it to be excessively wooden, and the decision to release this as the lead single from this record is kind of baffling. "Slip on Through" would have been the obvious choice but "Forever" and "Our Sweet Love" would also have made excellent singles. It's funny that when Brian is finally forced out of the drivers seat the BBs (and Reprise) still didn't have a clue. I love "At My Window", but "Take A Load Off Your Feet" is my favorite track on Surf's Up so maybe I'm just a weirdo.

3.5/5


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lonely Summer on May 04, 2016, 10:54:34 PM
Side two of this album is one of the best album sides ever. Side one is marred only slightly by Bruce's cutsie "Dierdrie" and Dennis' silly "Got to Know the Woman"; other than that, this album is about as close to perfection as you can get in this earthly realm. And yes, I include "Tears in the Morning", dammit! (oops, Bruce's foul language rubbing off on me!). I've sat down to play it on the piano, and it's a well constructed song - I like how he moves the bass notes around, definitely a Brian influence, I enjoy singing it. I guess because I, too, have had tears in the morning.  "All I Wanna Do" "Forever" and "Our Sweet Love" is a perfect song cycle. And yet this album sank like an anchor upon release. Go figure.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: undercover-m on January 24, 2017, 01:29:10 AM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
psh, it is a great song

don't listen to the haters.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: You Kane, You Commanded, You Conquered on January 24, 2017, 08:20:00 PM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
psh, it is a great song

don't listen to the haters.

It's secretly the best song on Sunflower but only patricians know that.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Adult Child on February 06, 2017, 03:48:42 PM
It is an amazing, amazing record. But I do prefer Surf's Up.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: Lonely Summer on March 11, 2017, 03:38:50 PM
Why does everyone dislike Tears In The Morning? I think it's great...
psh, it is a great song

don't listen to the haters.
Yes it is, and that's one thing I am damn sure of!


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: the captain on March 16, 2017, 03:30:47 PM
I really like it, too. It's a little on the maudlin side, but it's really well done in my opinion. Bruce should have contributed a lot more, based on how talented a guy he was. I understand that this is a band that had a lot of talented people contributing, but even so, this guy was a great singer, a really good keyboard player, a solid musician all around, a good producer/arranger. It's strange to see so few things, especially considering the poorer material that ended up on some albums, or the droughts between albums.

Also, as corny as his approach may have seemed to the trying-hard-to-be-progressive faction of the band, I think that was a nice yin-yang. Especially since Brian was corny as hell while being progressive, serving as the perfect conduit between the two sides.


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: KDS on March 17, 2017, 10:43:08 AM
I really like it, too. It's a little on the maudlin side, but it's really well done in my opinion. Bruce should have contributed a lot more, based on how talented a guy he was. I understand that this is a band that had a lot of talented people contributing, but even so, this guy was a great singer, a really good keyboard player, a solid musician all around, a good producer/arranger. It's strange to see so few things, especially considering the poorer material that ended up on some albums, or the droughts between albums.

Also, as corny as his approach may have seemed to the trying-hard-to-be-progressive faction of the band, I think that was a nice yin-yang. Especially since Brian was corny as hell while being progressive, serving as the perfect conduit between the two sides.

I agree, but I wonder if Bruce felt like the outsider again when he rejoined the group full time in the late 1970s. 


Title: Re: Sunflower
Post by: JL on July 31, 2017, 06:18:30 PM
I like this one a lot, one of my favorite BB albums. It's full of beautiful, tuneful songs that are worth listening to over and over again. Add Some Music to Your Day is awesome with it's shared lead vocals from the group (I wish they had done that more often), Forever is Dennis' big moment, but other songs are highlights as well. Our Sweet Love is very nice and I can't get enough of Carl's tender vocals; Deirdre is probably my favorite Bruce song, and Cool, Cool Water is a great vocal experiment that's catchy as heck. Shout out to Slip on Through for being another solid contribution from Dennis. Some of the material is a bit too cheesy, the songs aren't as strong or substantive as on Pet Sounds and it's obviously not as wild as Smile. But Sunflower can stack up against virtually any other BB album. This, Surf's Up and Holland are their strongest albums of the 70's in my view.

4.5/5



Title: Re: Sunflower Sunset Sound Recording Sessions
Post by: Danny White on May 05, 2020, 09:55:00 AM
Anybody out there have Studio locations at Sunset Sound for Sunflower? Thanks, Danny