The Smiley Smile Message Board

This time around, it’s not a Beatles album keeping Pet Sounds from the top spot but Marvin Gaye’s What’s Going On. The Beach Boys Today! also made the list along with Brian Wilson Presents Smile (that’s a first for Brian to make it as a solo artist). I haven’t looked at the entire list so I don’t know if any other Beach Boys albums made it. I would have liked to at least see Summer Days and Wild Honey which are just as good as Today! in my opinion.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/best-albums-of-all-time-1062063/

Wild Honey is at number 410, and Today! at 466. Brian Wilson Presents SMiLE at 399 is a pleasant surprise, though the omission of Sunflower, Surf's Up and Pacific Ocean Blue is naturally disappointing. I'm just glad though that Pet Sounds is literally the only album in the top 10 where its position remains completely unchanged from the original list (Sgt. Pepper meanwhile has gone from number one to 24)

Fantastic! BWPS definitely deserves to be on that list. And now I need to check out 'What's Going On'.

I'm waiting for the day when Pet Sounds edges into it's rightful place at number 1 ;D

Ah, I guess I missed Wild Honey, glad it made the list!

Sunflower was on the original 2003 list but it’s never reappeared. The Smile Sessions box set was on the 2012 list but I think it’s appropriate Brian’s solo version is there in its place as that’s the true completed work.

As far as non-Beach Boys albums go, the real loser as far as genres go is jazz.... so many fantastic, groundbreaking jazz albums, and the highest is at number 31 - Kind Of Blue by Miles Davis.

Would have liked to have seen Pink Floyd's highest ranked album actually in the top 25, or even in the top 50 (it's at 55 I think).

Disappointing showing for The Byrds, where it has only two albums on the ranking - Mr. Tambourine Man and Sweetheart Of The Rodeo; neither of which are in the top 250. The Notorious Byrd Brothers and Younger Than Yesterday would have been more than worthy contenders. I don't think any of Gene Clark's solo albums made the cut either.

Odessey And Oracle going from 100 to 243 is inexcusable. A top 10 album as far as the 60s go for my money.

Is Wild Honey better than Smiley Smile?

As far as I'm concerned -- YES!!

I think they're comparable, quality-wise. It's just a matter of taste.

There are also two albums with BBs on backing vocals on the list:

129. Pink Floyd, The Wall
214. Tom Petty, Wildflowers

The biggest surprise for me was the Beatles' Revolver (#11) ranking higher than Sgt. Pepper's LHCB (#24).

Why? Revolver was their best record.

Who is on backing vocals for these albums???

I'm not surprised that Revolver ranked higher than SPLHCB, that's been coming for a while, but for Revolver to drop from 3 to 11 and, especially, SPLHCB to drop from 1 to 24 is pretty surprising.

Carl Wilson, Wildflowers
Bruce Johnston, The Wall

RJM, I agree that Revolver's a better album than Sgt. Pepper, but Pepper's been a perennial #1 for decades. Neither one is my favorite Beatles album, which is Abbey Road.  ;D

Super fantastic about PS.

All the more reason to get the Feel Flows box into the music news cycle in a BIG way!

Maybe this can pave the way for that?

The fact that arguably the world's most famous music publication granted this wonderful band such a high honor, one would think that the same magazine might be interested to dig a little deeper into the album that is considered by many to be the second greatest work of this band, and just why that box is in jeopardy.

There's got to be some reporter who would see value in that…

Fascinating how popular opinion changes - and perhaps more predictable how a publication like this flip flops in order to cater to public opinion - but still, Sgt Pepper going from #1 to not even being in top ten is quite something. Glad to see Pet Sounds hold its place - it really is kind of a miracle of an album - even sonically it just shimmers and melts around your ears like nothing else ever recorded.

Happy to see Wild Honey included.

I remember PS coming in at #1 in a Times of London ranking in the early '90s.  Approximately as much time has passed since then as had passed between 1966 and then, and PS is still standing.  Brian hit one of out of the park with that album, and it's absolutely stood the test of time.  It is and always will be tragic that we didn't get a 1967 Smile album when Brian was so close to potentially topping (or at least matching) himself but how can we not be grateful for PS as well as everything that came before and much of what came after. 

It always bugs me when they put “greatest hits” releases in these lists. 

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/remaking-500-greatest-albums-1061229/

It was a much younger generation of writers, musicians, and execs voting. As shocking as the Beatles drop was, the fact that Pet Sounds retained it’s spot from the 2003 is remarkable.

These lists are done to generate discussion and debate, and of course they change from year to year and with the generation gap of who is casting votes and writing the blurbs. It's good to get classic albums into the general public like this, with the hope that fans will see unfamiliar albums on the list and consider picking them up to listen.

Some surprises...Coming from an era where Sgt. Pepper was always near or at the top, as was "A Day In The Life" on greatest song lists, it is shocking to see it fall as it did and not even crack top 10. While I disagree, I can understand the reasons why. With younger audiences I'm in regular contact with, for The Beatles it's now either Abbey Road or The White Album that are the favorites. I think both of those currently have more hype and attention, and especially with Abbey Road they have a more modern sound in terms of mixing and production, and there are more songs that rock for lack of a better term than Pepper. I personally think Pepper literally kicked down all the doors of what could be done on a rock album when it was new, and any conversation with musicians who were active when it came out in '67 will back that up, but in the digital age and with new listeners, it doesn't seem to have held the same impact and has been eclipsed by their later work. The real sad part for me is how the early Beatles releases are almost overlooked entirely...and those are simply amazing, especially if one dreams of becoming a songwriter.

I agree with RJM - It is remarkable, but not surprising, that Pet Sounds has held on to the #2 spot. It's very heartening to see such a placement and such respect being given to the album and Brian's masterpiece. It continues to inspire and influence, as well as make all kinds of people from all ages and backgrounds happy when they listen. Justified and deserved - I'm not even surprised or upset that it didn't make #1 on this list. Both Pet Sounds and Marvin's masterpiece "What's Going On" were decades ahead of their time both in music and message. They still resonate some 50 years later in spite of all that's changed. People are still listening and being inspired by the personal work and messages of these two musicians.

What strikes me is how both Marvin Gaye and Brian Wilson, the #1 and #2 albums on the list, both expressed how they had to get this music out, how they had to get it to the listeners as a personal message, and how they did it despite challenges or people around them telling them it won't work. I think that personal element is what makes them timeless as well.

And what also struck me was just how few of the top albums on that list were available for modern fans to see played live, performed by the creators. I think the ranking of Pet Sounds may answer the critics who question why Brian and his band toured so much behind Pet Sounds in recent years. If it weren't in demand, if it were not continually ranked as high as this recent list, if it were not something fans of all ages wanted to experience in person, there would be no tours.

To back up what you're saying about Abbey Road - it was the highest selling vinyl album of the 2010s.

Here's the Beatles breakdown I posted on https://thebeachboystoday.proboards.com/ (https://thebeachboystoday.proboards.com/)

The Beatles lost With The Beatles in 2012 and 2020, but considering they included Meet The Beatles in each list, I'm not sure why it was included in the first place. I don't like to see albums on the list that overlap. That's an obvious problem with compilations and could even have been a factor in omitting Smiley Smile and Surf's Up (in favor or TSS/BWPS). Despite the 2012 list clearly being a minor revision of the 2003 list, there were some major changes. Look at Let It Be, it dropped from #86 to #392 in 2012! Then, when most other Beatles/classic rock albums were plummeting in 2020, it rose 50 spots. Go Figure! Other notable developments are Please Please Me being omitted from the 2020 list (after being a top 40 album!) and Abbey Road climbing to #5, leapfrogging four Beatles albums, to become their highest ranked album in 2020.

John Lennon took a somewhat unexpected hit in 2020. He's in great company, but the drop seems excessive to me. Especially considering the recent, critically acclaimed Imagine box set. Interesting that Band on the Run was omitted from the 2020 list in favor of Ram.

The Beatles
Sgt Pepper (1, 1, 24)
Revolver (3, 3, 11)
Rubber Soul (5, 5, 35)
The Beatles (10, 10, 29)
Abbey Road (14, 14, 5)
Please Please Me (39, 39, - )
Meet The Beatles (59, 53, 197)
Let It Be (86, 392, 342)
Help (332, 331, 266)
A Hard Day's Night (388, 307, 263)
With the Beatles (420, - , - )

John Lennon
Plastic Ono Band (22, 23, 85)
Imagine (76, 80, 223)

Paul McCartney
Band on the Run (418, 418, - )
Ram ( - , - , 450)

George Harrison
All Things Must Pass (437, 433, 368)

Sunflower not making the list is exactly why we need the feel flows box set, people need to be reminded of just how good it is

Definitely. Who knows - without Sunshine Tomorrow maybe Wild Honey isn't added to the 2020 list?

I think that's an incredibly accurate and likely assumption.

Amen

Forever Changes at 180? No respect for this list, really. Leonard Cohen way down there too ...

Never been a fan of Rolling Stone or the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame, or any of these kind of elitist protectors of the boring old guard ... now with an apparent Pitchfork-influenced pandering. Rolling Stone will never admit that More of the Monkees is better than any Beatles record. The fact that they list an album (Please Please Me) at number 39 in one installment, then omit it from the entire top 500 in the next shows how laughable the rankings are.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/10-classic-albums-rolling-stone-originally-panned-101316/jimi-hendrix-are-you-experienced-1967-101413/

Truth.

Pet Sounds, BWPS, Sunflower, Wild Honey, Surf’s Up, etc all deserve top 500 ranking...

Personally, Hums of the Lovin Spoonful and Warren Zevon’s Excitable Boy or self-titled album are glaring omissions.

Most glaring omission to me is If You Can Believe Your Eyes and Ears by the Mamas & Papas.

Tangentially related because it's from the same magazine in the same week ...

In addition to PS getting voted #2, the very same magazine, Rolling Stone just did a story about Mike's "Beach Boys" playing drive-in concerts:

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/beach-boys-drive-in-concert-shows-1065445/?fbclid=IwAR2-tx10zJ5ykkurDfTe3XQLAU1yN13u65fdMd80xidP03S3zKBHW9DTwbA

The article completely omitted any mentioning of Feel Flows, yet went out of its way to mention rumors of a BBs reunion. Maybe BBs reunion rumors sell more magazines or get more clicks by comparison to FF mentions, I don't know.

It's interesting to me that this article happened the exact same time that the band got voted so highly in that RS Top 500 poll. Maybe it's just completely coincidental timing, or maybe somebody at the magazine had more incentive to dig into the modern goings-on of the band due to the timely high ranking of PS. If the latter is the case, I wonder if Mike and/or anyone else went out of their way to ask RS to not mention FF, or if RS just chose to not mention it. Or if maybe the writer at RS just was totally ignorant of FF even existing.

If it seems outlandish, I have no doubt that Mike (and probably Brian and many other celebs) go out of their way to ask for certain topics to not be brought up, in general. That would certainly be nothing new.

RS seems to probably be pretty desperate for ad revenue, and their website has gotten more user-unfriendly to use and seems closer to clickbaity ad pop up websites than I ever remember it seeming. I just wonder maybe they are avoiding mentioning FF in case Mike or the band might threaten to not give them exclusives in the future. Sort of the way Murry threatened radio stations to not play The Marksmen. Just a thought that crossed my mind, who knows. One wonders why there's a media blackout on FF from a major publication who is anything but afraid to talk about the band this week.

But once again, being that the band is in Rolling Friggin Stone twice in one week in 2020 for different reasons, this could be the ideal time for another music publication to strike while there's a little bit more BBs buzz than usual, and do some digging into the FF situation.  

Agree about the suckiness of RS' website. I've subscribed to the magazine for decades, but have been forced to drop it due to overpriced renewal rates.

I noticed that the article mentions another tour date for M&B (Charlotte) as happening this year, but it has actually been pushed back to 2021. Which means the dates on the official BB page aren't being updated frequently enough.

Anybody still interested in reading RS, if you have a library card and your local library supports the RB Digital app, you can check out digital copies of the magazine on the app.

https://www.recordedbooks.com/rbdigital-marketing

Wild Honey is better than Sgt Pepper.

Hell yes. I haven’t listened to it yet, but I bet even SIP is better than Smiley Smile.

I dunno about More of the Monkees, but Pisces, Aquarius, Capricorn & Jones Ltd. and Head are both top tier - and sadly I would not be surprised if both were omitted from this ranking

Nice to see Pet Sounds holding steady at #2 but it would seem that Rolling Stone is struggling to stay relevant with this list.  There are some oddball changes listed here that seem a little head-scratching.  I know Lauryn Hill's album is popular but does it really deserve to be in the top 10?  Sgt. Pepper's fall from grace seems a little surprising since it has been forever hyped as one of the best albums ever even though Revolver, The Beatles (White Album) and Abbey Road seem to be favored more by fans in recent years.  🤷‍♂️