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Smiley Smile Stuff => General On Topic Discussions => Topic started by: rickymyfataar on August 04, 2019, 08:36:11 AM



Title: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on August 04, 2019, 08:36:11 AM
This showed up on my feed today.

The Beach Boys: Wild Honey Tour Opening Film
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RkbeN07wWQ


Apparently Noven Jaisi who works for Mike has recently done work with Queen and Leif Garrett. This Wild Honey video is definitely better than his previous BB related work.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on August 04, 2019, 02:24:01 PM
It's from 2017, a 2 year old video. How is this news anyway? Wonder if MELECO got permission back then for Noven Jaisi to include footage of Al and Brian as part of their promo video for Mike's touring.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Custom Machine on August 04, 2019, 11:19:52 PM
It's news because it's a really well done film that has just hit Youtube.

Why would permission be needed from Brain and Al? The copyright at the end says Capitol / EMI / Meleco Records & Brother Records.



Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on August 05, 2019, 06:30:11 AM
Man, a ton of footage of original Beach Boys in this, considering it's a promo for Mike's tour, right?

Reminds me of the ad for one of his shows I edited (they promoted the Mike and Bruce show using all the original Beach Boys...which is a pretty unfair way to market what you're selling/promoting).

(https://i.imgur.com/MMwQc8y.jpg)


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on August 05, 2019, 06:57:03 AM
Man, a ton of footage of original Beach Boys in this, considering it's a promo for Mike's tour, right?


Actually it's an opening video for the concerts not a promo.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on August 05, 2019, 09:16:18 AM
It's news because it's a really well done film that has just hit Youtube.

Why would permission be needed from Brain and Al? The copyright at the end says Capitol / EMI / Meleco Records & Brother Records.



The first line is debatable as all opinions are. It's a guy who edits existing video promoting himself for hire, who has a history of creating fake trailers and clips using copyrighted video and audio and somehow getting away with it minus the usual copyright and usage issues that most people in and out of the "industry" need to follow.  The fact is the film was used by Mike on tour in 2017, which is two years ago...the same year Brian and Al on tour outperformed and outgrossed Mike's touring as the Beach Boys.

Why? The first image on this video says "MELECO Records", which as we know is Mike's company, *not* Brother/BRI/Capitol. If someone's image and voice, not to mention their music, is used as part of a commercial presentation for which tickets are sold, permission is needed.

I was just asking out loud because perhaps Brian and Al did allow it for this one, or maybe they didn't, I don't know. But if you go back to Mike's big-screen video presentations of years prior to 2017 - again I may be mistaken and would have to watch them again if that's possible - there were some absences in those big-screen concert videos that did not seem to be an issue with Jaisi's 2017 video.

Purely opinion here - I'm not a fan of gimmicks and schtick, especially when it comes to "Youtubers", no matter how much success some of these folks may experience as a result. Read into it any way you please. I'm also not a fan of closing down the comments section of YouTube and not allowing viewers to post opinions, which is a practice that both Jaisi and Mike seem to share on more than a few of their listings, this most recent one not yet included.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Pretty Funky on August 05, 2019, 11:59:13 AM
Quote...the same year Brian and Al on tour outperformed and outgrossed Mike's touring as the Beach Boys.

Wow, seriously?


As far as the YouTuber goes. I wonder why he never does a Brian tour video?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on August 05, 2019, 05:35:47 PM
Quote...the same year Brian and Al on tour outperformed and outgrossed Mike's touring as the Beach Boys.

Wow, seriously?


As far as the YouTuber goes. I wonder why he never does a Brian tour video?

Point #1: Absolutely true, according to Pollstar's end of year results for 2017. Despite some attempts to counter that fact by suggesting Pollstar got it wrong or something, the numbers are what they are. Brian's tour outperformed and outgrossed Mike's in 2017.

Point #2: I've been wondering the exact same thing for 4 years or however long it's been since Noven Jaisi first showed up with a trailer for something called "Still Tourin'", a fantasy Mike Love touring video documentary which apparently he dreamed up himself. Followed by featurettes and trailers on everything from ESQ magazine, to Mike's book, to Jeff Foskett.

Go figure.  ???


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Custom Machine on August 05, 2019, 06:02:29 PM
Prior to reading this thread, I'd never heard of Noven Jaisi. Here's a link to a list of "People I work with" which is heavily Mike Love and touring Beach Boys centric ... https://www.novenjaisi.com/clients.

Although he's got quite a few projects on Youtube, I wouldn't call him a "YouTuber" pre se; it appears that the majority of his videos are for paying clients, including Mike Love.

IMO the guy is a very talented video editor.



Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Custom Machine on August 05, 2019, 06:27:12 PM

Point #2: I've been wondering the exact same thing for 4 years or however long it's been since Noven Jaisi first showed up with a trailer for something called "Still Tourin'", a fantasy Mike Love touring video documentary which apparently he dreamed up himself. Followed by featurettes and trailers on everything from ESQ magazine, to Mike's book, to Jeff Foskett.

Go figure.  ???


Oh yeah, I remember that now. So the question is, was Mike a paying client for the Still Tourin' video, or did Mr. Jaisi do it on his own, with the result that Mike was impressed and became a paying client?



Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: marcella27 on August 05, 2019, 06:54:00 PM
I remember very vividly seeing the film on the opening night of the 2017 Mike and Bruce tour at the Royal Albert Hall in London.  Honestly, the video is so good and uses so much old footage that it had me hyped up, almost thinking I was about to see Brian, Carl, Al, Mike, Dennis and Bruce walk onto the stage - as opposed to just Mike and Bruce (with all due respect).  The video throughout the whole concert was very well done (no idea if Noven Jaisi was involved in all of it or just that opening clip) but it was also incredibly strange in that it featured many shots not just of Carl and Dennis, but also of Brian and Al, all presented in a very nostalgic, rose-tinted glasses kind of way.  I remember sitting there thinking that I wanted to say to Mike “you know, two of these guys are still alive, and you could be touring with them right now, instead of performing with a different band in front of old footage of them”.  The whole thing is extremely odd.     


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: CenturyDeprived on August 05, 2019, 10:00:23 PM
I remember very vividly seeing the film on the opening night of the 2017 Mike and Bruce tour at the Royal Albert Hall in London.  Honestly, the video is so good and uses so much old footage that it had me hyped up, almost thinking I was about to see Brian, Carl, Al, Mike, Dennis and Bruce walk onto the stage - as opposed to just Mike and Bruce (with all due respect).  The video throughout the whole concert was very well done (no idea if Noven Jaisi was involved in all of it or just that opening clip) but it was also incredibly strange in that it featured many shots not just of Carl and Dennis, but also of Brian and Al, all presented in a very nostalgic, rose-tinted glasses kind of way.  I remember sitting there thinking that I wanted to say to Mike “you know, two of these guys are still alive, and you could be touring with them right now, instead of performing with a different band in front of old footage of them”.  The whole thing is extremely odd.      

Pretty much sums it up. Sad but true, it's always gonna be pretty impossible to overlook that fact and just "enjoy" the footage as though we are horses with blinders avoiding what is unpleasant. Using footage of multiple living members who were edged out of the band makes the idea of using said footage at shows just weird.  I'd love to know how people somehow get that out of their heads and pretend that's not the case. I have no such drug to make it so. Noven Go Showboat, indeed.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: HeyJude on August 06, 2019, 06:45:11 AM
Prior to reading this thread, I'd never heard of Noven Jaisi. Here's a link to a list of "People I work with" which is heavily Mike Love and touring Beach Boys centric ... https://www.novenjaisi.com/clients.

Although he's got quite a few projects on Youtube, I wouldn't call him a "YouTuber" pre se; it appears that the majority of his videos are for paying clients, including Mike Love.

IMO the guy is a very talented video editor.



I could be wrong, but I remember having the impression that he kind of started out as a "Youtuber", producing those cheesy, clickbaity fake "trailers" and whatnot, and one of his Mike/BB-themed videos caught the eye of Mike (or someone in his camp), and subsequently he has done some actual work for hire.

I think his work originally came to focus on this board when he did this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Js3chYvh30M

It's a 2015 video titled "Still Tourin'" made to celebrate and/or promote specifically *MIKE'S* touring band. I don't know if at any point it was actually shown in public. But this video *understandably* troubled some fans because it mixes "C50" 2012 footage with post-2012 footage of Mike's band.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on August 06, 2019, 08:15:41 AM
@rickymyfataar meant to say intro to the shows, not promo for the tour, it was early haha...thanks for the correction.

I remember very vividly seeing the film on the opening night of the 2017 Mike and Bruce tour at the Royal Albert Hall in London.  Honestly, the video is so good and uses so much old footage that it had me hyped up, almost thinking I was about to see Brian, Carl, Al, Mike, Dennis and Bruce walk onto the stage - as opposed to just Mike and Bruce (with all due respect).  The video throughout the whole concert was very well done (no idea if Noven Jaisi was involved in all of it or just that opening clip) but it was also incredibly strange in that it featured many shots not just of Carl and Dennis, but also of Brian and Al, all presented in a very nostalgic, rose-tinted glasses kind of way.  I remember sitting there thinking that I wanted to say to Mike “you know, two of these guys are still alive, and you could be touring with them right now, instead of performing with a different band in front of old footage of them”.  The whole thing is extremely odd.     

This is exactly it. What really seemed odd were the soundbites from Brian himself...that's the moment where I was thinking, Brian could be up on stage talking/singing himself during the whole concert ya know.

Idk, that whole thing is odd. Noven seemingly came out of nowhere focussing almost solely on Mike's touring group. Not knocking it, but who in the world would make a hobby out of making promo videos for Mike's touring version of the Beach Boys? And I would say the same thing if someone were making fake promo videos for Brian's band...To me, it only makes sense if Noven was targeting Mike's band, trying to get a job out of it from the get-go. The whole thing is pretty interesting; I wonder what actually happened.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: HeyJude on August 06, 2019, 09:10:47 AM
I would have to imagine (though this is just guessing) that one modus operandi in posting these fake trailers to YouTube is to actually get a gig out of it. A proof-of-concept sort of thing; essentially a "pitch." Which is fine, but the problem with YouTube is that it's being "published" for everybody to see. Which then also, either incidentally or purposefully, also serves to promote the thing the video focuses on. And has varying degrees of potential to mislead people into thinking something is official (or even REAL at all) when it isn't.

I see that, thus far, it doesn't appear Jaisi's fake Ringo Starr trailers have yielded an official gig making a Ringo documentary. If Jaisi were sending these "demo reel" type trailers to the intended subjects as a pitch, or even posting the stuff online set to *private* so only potential clients could see it, that would make sense.

But multiple videos *celebrating* specifically *Mike's* touring band (he's STILL TOURIN' after all these years!!!!) which use vintage footage of the other BBs and, more pointedly, a video promoting Mike's tour which uses C50 footage of the other guys, is just inadvisable. Frankly, I'm a bit insulted that BRI has someone out there issuing takedown notices on all sorts of Beach Boys content online, yet Jaisi using footage from a myriad of sources goes unchecked. Granted, now that he does official work (I guess?) for Mike, the proper clearances *may* now be getting obtained (though the recent video posted just shows a rather blanket copyright notice for Meleco, Brother, and Capitol, and actually shows "Capitol/EMI" which arguably doesn't exist anymore and is in fact Capitol/UMe).

To be clear, I don't think Jaisi's work is some huge, heinous blight on the BB world or anything. He's a guy making his own videos and trying to get official gigs out of it. To each his own, etc, etc. Gotta make a living, etc. It's also cool that folks like Alan Boyd are being encouraging for someone trying to break into the field.

But I don't think it's being too bah-humbug to not just fawn and gush over Jaisi's work. He's mainly showcasing editing work, using mostly commercially released material (and then what appears to be some material supplied by Mike), and whether Jaisi is a true "fan" or just a guy wanting to be a video guy, I'm not a fan of his demonstrated ambivalence (or igorance?) of blurring the line between Mike's touring band and *THE* band (meaning the core, historical band), versus the C50 lineup, etc.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on August 06, 2019, 10:00:02 PM
Yeah I wonder what would happen if Noven started making videos for Brian. As in how would Mike take it? Judging by his website and Instagram, Noven and Mike are somewhat close.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Custom Machine on August 07, 2019, 12:03:19 AM

Granted, now that he does official work (I guess?) for Mike, the proper clearances *may* now be getting obtained (though the recent video posted just shows a rather blanket copyright notice for Meleco, Brother, and Capitol, and actually shows "Capitol/EMI" which arguably doesn't exist anymore and is in fact Capitol/UMe).


Good observation - as you say, Capitol/EMI no longer exists and in fact was acquired by Universal Music Group 7 years ago.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on August 07, 2019, 06:38:57 AM
Yeah I wonder what would happen if Noven started making videos for Brian. As in how would Mike take it? Judging by his website and Instagram, Noven and Mike are somewhat close.

Just tally up what he's done on his YouTube channel since 2015. Videos promoting Mike's tours, Mike's book, Mike's single, Mike's band, Mike's band members Jeff and Scott, ESQ magazine...

Not a single video on Brian, Al, or other Beach Boys that aren't in Mike's circle. For a Beach Boys fan, isn't that odd? The only appearances of Brian, Al, David, etc are as cameos or background in videos promoting Mike's various projects. And even his video "The Beach Boys: An American Band" (catchy title, I think it's been used before) is about Mike's backup band, not the Beach Boys.

That's what you get when you work for Mike I guess. All-in or goodbye?

I'm not trying to attack Noven himself, but it looks like he's 100% all-in on Mike Love centered projects and not the Beach Boys, otherwise he'd have content and testimonials beyond a near-total connection to Mike Love and MELECO.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Jay on August 07, 2019, 07:14:13 AM
 ::)


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on August 07, 2019, 09:13:19 AM
Judging by his website and Instagram, Noven and Mike are somewhat close.

Looking at Jaisi's Instagram, he implies that he was working with Mike's management since 2014...yet this quote from Andrew G Doe:

Mike's management say the video is nothing to do with them. Seems to be a fan creation, although they admit it's very well done.

claims that in October 2015 Mike's management knew nothing about Jaisi's video. Given the track record, I'm very inclined to believe Jaisi's account of things, so it's curious to me why management would deny the video had anything to do with them in October 2015 when it appears they did know of Jaisi and made things happen as far back as 2014. Also funny to remember the circus that followed with Andrew Doe claiming "schadenfreude" regarding posters asking some fairly straightforward questions about the odd circumstances around the video. Heck, Iian Lee even joined in to push back against people asking questions.

Anyways, this post has nothing to do with Jaisi, I'm really glad he is doing what he loves and he seems to have a lot of talent and drive...I really am looking forward to seeing where he takes all this. It's just interesting to see how people on this forum who are pretty close with Mike treated posters on this site because said posters merely asked some simple questions regarding the creation of the 'Still Tourin' video. In hindsight, it's beyond ironic the word schadenfreude was even brought up.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on August 08, 2019, 08:55:31 PM
For those saying the Wild Honey Opening is 2 years old, this one is new.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdGZjZ41PuU


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on August 09, 2019, 08:00:49 AM
Judging by his website and Instagram, Noven and Mike are somewhat close.

Looking at Jaisi's Instagram, he implies that he was working with Mike's management since 2014...yet this quote from Andrew G Doe:

Mike's management say the video is nothing to do with them. Seems to be a fan creation, although they admit it's very well done.

claims that in October 2015 Mike's management knew nothing about Jaisi's video. Given the track record, I'm very inclined to believe Jaisi's account of things, so it's curious to me why management would deny the video had anything to do with them in October 2015 when it appears they did know of Jaisi and made things happen as far back as 2014. Also funny to remember the circus that followed with Andrew Doe claiming "schadenfreude" regarding posters asking some fairly straightforward questions about the odd circumstances around the video. Heck, Iian Lee even joined in to push back against people asking questions.

Anyways, this post has nothing to do with Jaisi, I'm really glad he is doing what he loves and he seems to have a lot of talent and drive...I really am looking forward to seeing where he takes all this. It's just interesting to see how people on this forum who are pretty close with Mike treated posters on this site because said posters merely asked some simple questions regarding the creation of the 'Still Tourin' video. In hindsight, it's beyond ironic the word schadenfreude was even brought up.

The 2014 date posted by Jaisi does indeed raise some questions - As does the commentary about making things happen. Is the date and timeline accurate as Noven posted it, or what was really going on?

The reason why this comes up is the reactions and pushback posted back in October 2015 and in later posts and threads here about Noven's videos did not seem to match what the actual topic at hand really was. These videos and trailers showed up, and fans were wondering what all of it was. The same thing happened with Ringo's fans, I think the Queen fanbase to some degree was feeling the same way...people wondering if there would be a new documentary, or if the trailer was for something bigger...people asking what these videos were, why were they being posted, who was doing it, etc. And the questions got met with the reactions here like the one posted above, not to mention insults and people here suggesting people asking were conspiracy theorists and the like.

Why that kind of reaction?

So to say Mike's management said they had nothing to do with it, when someone from Mike's management at least by the latter half of 2015 was associated with Noven, in 2014 or 2015 or whatever is the actual date...it's surely worth asking the question since it seems the information we were given at the time doesn't match until more info may come out.

That whole episode never sat well, again mostly due to the pushback and reactions from certain fans and posters here in response to fans wondering what was going on with these video trailers.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Juice Brohnston on August 09, 2019, 08:13:25 AM
For those saying the Wild Honey Opening is 2 years old, this one is new.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdGZjZ41PuU

That's pretty awesome!!


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Rocker on August 10, 2019, 02:02:51 AM
For those saying the Wild Honey Opening is 2 years old, this one is new.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdGZjZ41PuU

That's pretty awesome!!



Where does the footage of Don Rickles introducing the Beach Boys come from?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Pretty Funky on August 10, 2019, 03:01:40 AM
http://www.tv.com/shows/kraft-music-hall/don-adams-and-don-rickles-are-alive-and-well-and-living-in-california-170671/


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Rocker on August 10, 2019, 03:21:41 AM
http://www.tv.com/shows/kraft-music-hall/don-adams-and-don-rickles-are-alive-and-well-and-living-in-california-170671/

Thanks! Didn't know about that. I couldn't find the BBs-footage on youtube. Did they perform live or lip-synch?


EDIT: Oh wait, is it this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ1UqDnY7as


If it weren't for the missing intro this would be my favorite Beach Boys TV appearance, even though it is playback. It's so colourful and happy. Beautiful.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: CenturyDeprived on August 10, 2019, 07:31:14 AM
http://www.tv.com/shows/kraft-music-hall/don-adams-and-don-rickles-are-alive-and-well-and-living-in-california-170671/

Thanks! Didn't know about that. I couldn't find the BBs-footage on youtube. Did they perform live or lip-synch?


EDIT: Oh wait, is it this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ1UqDnY7as


If it weren't for the missing intro this would be my favorite Beach Boys TV appearance, even though it is playback. It's so colourful and happy. Beautiful.

Wow, I have always loved the psychedelia of that BBs performance but had no idea that the two Dons introduced it.

Pretty sure that this Midnight Cowboy parody then was from the same episode:

https://youtu.be/-kEQ3ndLhq8

Too bad The BBs weren't part of a movie parody segment. Missed it by that much.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 21, 2019, 07:32:13 AM
Noven just shared a video for LBWL, I'm not sure what the intent is but it's really well made. Link below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shEtVIETr_Q


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll on October 21, 2019, 09:39:54 AM
Noven just shared a video for LBWL, I'm not sure what the intent is but it's really well made. Link below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shEtVIETr_Q

I never understood the lyrics of this song. Why is he looking back with love on segregation, assassinations etc?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 21, 2019, 09:55:02 AM


I never understood the lyrics of this song. Why is he looking back with love on segregation, assassinations etc?
[/quote]

Well, it states "It was the best of times, the worst of times", "Sounding fury, sounds of silence". It's playing with the contrast.

The song ends with "Bitter-sweet reflections that we're thinking of". I think the message is that the 60s had its ups and downs, but we're looking back with love.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: JK on October 21, 2019, 10:22:00 AM
I think NJ has done a great job. Call it (ahem) a labour of love.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on October 21, 2019, 03:35:19 PM
Noven just shared a video for LBWL, I'm not sure what the intent is but it's really well made. Link below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shEtVIETr_Q

I never understood the lyrics of this song. Why is he looking back with love on segregation, assassinations etc?

The line "Good Vibrations, Assassinations" with the Zapruder film playing at the same time is just odd to me. I get that there is contrast like rickymyfataar says, but it doesn't really work too well in video form (it doesn't really work well in song form either). This peppy "Lookin back with love" line is playing with imagines of MLK smiling in the background in a song that talks about his assassination. I mean, the song/video shows Charles freakin Manson and the message of the song is to look back on all of this with love. I'm honestly confused too.

Too bad Noven is completely locked down to Mike Love's side of things. He obviously has some great editing talent, but being hitched to Mike Love's wagon is kinda limiting given the solo output material.

Also, Noven, if you read the comments on this site, you may want to edit the hashtag #MikeLove to something more descriptive? The hashtag link just takes you to a bunch of videos of the reggae artist Mike Love.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: CenturyDeprived on October 21, 2019, 05:35:20 PM
Noven just shared a video for LBWL, I'm not sure what the intent is but it's really well made. Link below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shEtVIETr_Q

I never understood the lyrics of this song. Why is he looking back with love on segregation, assassinations etc?

The line "Good Vibrations, Assassinations" with the Zapruder film playing at the same time is just odd to me. I get that there is contrast like rickymyfataar says, but it doesn't really work too well in video form (it doesn't really work well in song form either). This peppy "Lookin back with love" line is playing with imagines of MLK smiling in the background in a song that talks about his assassination. I mean, the song/video shows Charles freakin Manson and the message of the song is to look back on all of this with love. I'm honestly confused too.

Too bad Noven is completely locked down to Mike Love's side of things. He obviously has some great editing talent, but being hitched to Mike Love's wagon is kinda limiting given the solo output material.

Also, Noven, if you read the comments on this site, you may want to edit the hashtag #MikeLove to something more descriptive? The hashtag link just takes you to a bunch of videos of the reggae artist Mike Love.

The JFK footage is in very awkward taste. It's also very odd because the song has such as upbeat, happy sound throughout. All of the chords and Mike's vocal are of a "happy" type nature, in complete contrast with the JFK/MLK lyrics, which are now brought to life visually through stock historical footage that has been synced to the song for some reason 38 years later.

I still can't help but to think of the chorus Jackson Browne's Sombody's Baby, and Fast Times at Rigdemont High, when I hear Looking Back with Love. I cannot believe that those two songs weren't influenced by one another in the songwriting process.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xk2NHZukTYg


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on October 21, 2019, 07:21:46 PM
If Noven is as talented as some are saying, why is he doing this kind of schmaltz for Mike Love? This is ham-fisted "nostalgia" that plays on a smoothed-out version of American history that wouldn't be out of place in a 7th grade history textbook. Reduce major events to a paragraph, if that, complete with a stock photograph.

But that's just the thing, I think...Mike Love has been writing lyrics that tap into this same cracked rear-view of history as nostalgia for decades, in fact I'd say the majority of his original output from the 1980's onward tries to recapture things that were relevant in 1963. I wish he'd expand more and look beyond the nostalgic bent of his lyrical focus, but for some reason that's all he seems able to consistently write about, or it's what he may think "fans" are expecting to hear.

It was like the "50 Years Of Good Vibrations" promotional schwag sold in 2016. It amped up the focus on psychedelia and imagery which was at that time directly influenced by and connected to psychedelic drugs, and the actual history was that Mike himself has been 100% against that scene and that image, yet used the same imagery from the same scene and activity he's railed against for decades to promote a tour. It's like history can be reduced to quick-cuts of imagery and iconography as long as we don't dig too deep into the actual people and events, and instead emblazon it on T-shirts, posters, and in this case a promo video to move product or promote something. I don't get it, but that's the state of affairs.

This video just plays into that good-old-days nostalgia bag even further than the song itself, which is forgettable if not totally anachronistic in the worst way. It sounds like an outtake from 1988. And it does sound like "Somebody's Baby", which in itself for everyone who has seen the film will recognize as a pretty devastating emotional trigger for the deeper messages which that film expressed when that song is matched with the scenes under which it plays...and that's when editing film to music is done on a truly artistic level that sticks with viewers for decades after the initial viewing.

So yes, it's another Mike Love promo. I wish Noven would branch out, and I wish Mike would write some new material that doesn't try to remind everyone of fun in the 1960's sun. That's been done.


Too bad Noven is completely locked down to Mike Love's side of things. He obviously has some great editing talent, but being hitched to Mike Love's wagon is kinda limiting given the solo output material.


Exactly my thoughts too, well, most of it.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 21, 2019, 10:19:20 PM
I don't really see the confusion with the lyrics. The 60s had its ups and downs, looking back on it with love is certainly better than looking back with hate. Let's take the Vietnam war or the assassinations, what the hell is the point of looking back with hate and hostility, Let us remember our veterans with love and honor them. Let's look at the good that JFK and MLK stood for while the were still alive. In my point of view, I think that's what the writers had in mind when they wrote the song.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on October 22, 2019, 09:41:45 AM
I don't really see the confusion with the lyrics. The 60s had its ups and downs, looking back on it with love is certainly better than looking back with hate. Let's take the Vietnam war or the assassinations, what the hell is the point of looking back with hate and hostility, Let us remember our veterans with love and honor them. Let's look at the good that JFK and MLK stood for while the were still alive. In my point of view, I think that's what the writers had in mind when they wrote the song.

Who says the only other option is to look back on it in hate? It just weird to see Charles Manson in the video (and referenced in the lyrics) immediately followed by "lookin back with love". No one here is saying that we need to look back in seething anger at Charles Manson. But on the flip side I don't think anyone here finds anything remotely lovable about looking back on the "Aquarian age running helter-skelter".

As for JFK and MLK, while I agree with you that looking back on the good seems to be the point of the lyrics, it just doesn't work for me when it comes to the actual song. The backing track half sounds like a happy 80s advertisement jingle for JC Penney. And as Century Deprived points out, the chords and vocals are in complete contrast with the subject material.

PS, I hope no one takes this criticism as Mike Love hate - he didn't even write the song.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 22, 2019, 09:57:00 AM
I can see your point rab2591 and I hope you can see the point of view the writers had when they wrote the song, regardless of what you think of the quality of the song.



Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: guitarfool2002 on October 22, 2019, 10:08:31 AM
True, Mike did not write this song which the video was made for - It's from his solo album where Mike has one co-writing credit across the entire group of songs on that album.

Just to clarify, my points were about Mike's tendency to write a majority of his lyrics over the past 40 years or so about this smoothed-out nostalgia trip view of history, and it suggests he is either unwilling or incapable of looking at the present or the future. Nevermind constantly looking back to the early 60's and writing as if he were still cruisin' around Hawthorne or hitting the beach. If that's what he feels comfortable writing about, fine. But if you look at his original song catalog since the 70's, this theme of "lookin back" dominates his lyrics, and in this case, the title song of his first solo album which he didn't even write. But the song fits as if he did write it. "Good Vibrations...assassinations...", that could have come from Mike's pen, and it's surprising it didn't.

I'll repeat my thoughts on the video, it plays into the whole notion of looking back on history with nostalgia and good vibes to a fault, to where clipping together existing 60's video is supposed to...what...take us back to the good ol' days? It's similar to many of Mike's solo efforts in the way he's a man well past middle age still writing about getting out of his boring school classes and cruisin for honeys with the top down, and whatever other imagery is present in these solo songs that was done when the Beach Boys were still under 21 years old.

That's just my own view, I still wish Mike being the lyricist that he's touted as being would have (or would period) expanded out from these weird 60's beach and dragstrip fantasies and put pen to paper on some different themes, perhaps more relevant to his own age and experience. And again, if Noven would branch out and do other things beyond clipping stock footage together for Mike's promos (how about a *Beach Boys* video???), his creativity might be put to better use versus this kind of retro nostalgia schlock centered on Mike.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: NateRuvin on October 22, 2019, 02:30:24 PM
guitarfool2002,

you say "That's just my own view, I still wish Mike being the lyricist that he's touted as being would have (or would period) expanded out from these weird 60's beach and dragstrip fantasies and put pen to paper on some different themes, perhaps more relevant to his own age and experience."

I think Crescent Moon, Cool Head Warm Heart, All I Wanna Do, Big Sur, Only With You, Ram Raj, Meant For You, etc (I could go on and on) certainly qualify, as being lyrically expansive from the beach and dragstrip fantasies. All I Wanna Do,  Big Sur and Only With You are  masterpieces, in my opinion, both lyrically and musically.

Saying Mike just writes Surfing lyrics, is like saying The Beach Boys only made Surfing music. Sure, at a glance it could look that way, but the truth is quite the opposite. Do It Again aside, it's not like Mike was writing about hot rods and hamburgers as his contributions in the Brother/Reprise era. He was contributing great stuff like the songs I already mentioned, as well as All This Is That, Don't Go Near The Water, and more. To say Mike just wrote surfing lyrics, is to neglect a large portion of his career. Sure, he was ready and eager to return to surf music with MIU, but that was post Endless Summer, when everything was different. Note, Al wasn't eager to pump out stuff like Lookin At Tomorrow post-Endless Summer, Mike wasn't the only one who was subject to this.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: super sally on October 22, 2019, 03:53:20 PM
I don't really see the confusion with the lyrics. The 60s had its ups and downs, looking back on it with love is certainly better than looking back with hate. Let's take the Vietnam war or the assassinations, what the hell is the point of looking back with hate and hostility, Let us remember our veterans with love and honor them. Let's look at the good that JFK and MLK stood for while the were still alive. In my point of view, I think that's what the writers had in mind when they wrote the song.


My opinion: the lyrics are terrible due to the obvious rhyming and the lack of nuance.

The lyrics describe a bunch of issues where people were killed and then says "NOW we are looking back with love."

I don't get it. Kind of a privileged vision-- "Weren't the old day's great."








Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: CenturyDeprived on October 22, 2019, 04:14:31 PM
I don't really see the confusion with the lyrics. The 60s had its ups and downs, looking back on it with love is certainly better than looking back with hate. Let's take the Vietnam war or the assassinations, what the hell is the point of looking back with hate and hostility, Let us remember our veterans with love and honor them. Let's look at the good that JFK and MLK stood for while the were still alive. In my point of view, I think that's what the writers had in mind when they wrote the song.


My opinion: the lyrics are terrible due to the obvious rhyming and the lack of nuance.

The lyrics describe a bunch of issues where people were killed and then says "NOW we are looking back with love."

I don't get it. Kind of a privileged vision-- "Weren't the old day's great."



While the term "tone deaf" at times in today's day and age gets thrown around excessively IMO, I believe it's the most perfect way to describe the song, its vibe, awkward contrast of all sorts of things.

Now that I think about it, the song plays like Mike's vision of a proto Forrest Gump type of thing. But in this case, it's one doofus walking through history talking about a whole bunch of events as though he's in a museum looking at exhibits while wearing an early '80s Walkman headset with happy, dorky music playing in the background, completely detached and divorced from the actual impact or resonance of these events.  And it also plays kinda like one of those "VH-1 Decades: The '60s" types of 2-hour documentary specials, only that Mike is trying to run a whole bunch of quickie references into 1 smushed together 3-minute-ish song.

I'm not saying the answer would have been for Mike to just omit all of the bad events from the song, and just talk about good events of the '60s. That'd probably be awkward too. But one would hope that if the desire was to just discuss a bunch of historical occurrences of a decade, that there could be some nuance, emotion, and reflection woven into the song, both lyrically and musically.

The tone deafness comes when there's little to no reflection or purpose (again, IMO) to these lyrics being thrown together other than to simply talk about events of a decade. Throwing in very serious events, including the Manson stuff which by all accounts detrimentally psychologically effected his cousin, and just throwing that lyric in there like it ain't no thing, followed by a happy "two girls for every boyyyy" lyric is just baffling and weird, weird, weird. Yes it was a weird decade with highs and lows for everyone (including Mike), but it comes across as cringey. The visuals that this new video has added only amplify that effect.

The fact that Mike's last name is Love gives the song a hokey double meaning, almost making it like Mike is a history professor, and is saying "class, you're going to look back at past events with me, Dr. Love", so it's hard to take anything in the song seriously right off the bat. It's an incredibly strange zone to be in as a listener. Frankly, the tone deafness of the song in contrast with its lyrical content might make this song rank as one of weirdest released songs in the history of this band, and that's saying something.

Far cringier than the song or the music video is the mimed live performance which contains a mimed finger gunshot during the "assassinations" lyric.  ::)



Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rab2591 on October 22, 2019, 04:16:02 PM
guitarfool2002,

you say "That's just my own view, I still wish Mike being the lyricist that he's touted as being would have (or would period) expanded out from these weird 60's beach and dragstrip fantasies and put pen to paper on some different themes, perhaps more relevant to his own age and experience."

I think Crescent Moon, Cool Head Warm Heart, All I Wanna Do, Big Sur, Only With You, Ram Raj, Meant For You, etc (I could go on and on) certainly qualify, as being lyrically expansive from the beach and dragstrip fantasies. All I Wanna Do,  Big Sur and Only With You are  masterpieces, in my opinion, both lyrically and musically.

Saying Mike just writes Surfing lyrics, is like saying The Beach Boys only made Surfing music. Sure, at a glance it could look that way, but the truth is quite the opposite. Do It Again aside, it's not like Mike was writing about hot rods and hamburgers as his contributions in the Brother/Reprise era. He was contributing great stuff like the songs I already mentioned, as well as All This Is That, Don't Go Near The Water, and more. To say Mike just wrote surfing lyrics, is to neglect a large portion of his career. Sure, he was ready and eager to return to surf music with MIU, but that was post Endless Summer, when everything was different. Note, Al wasn't eager to pump out stuff like Lookin At Tomorrow post-Endless Summer, Mike wasn't the only one who was subject to this.

Umm, Guitarfool specifically said that "the majority of [Mike's] original output from the 1980's onward tries to recapture things that were relevant in 1963" and he even said it a second time in the post you quoted him from: "Just to clarify, my points were about Mike's tendency to write a majority of his lyrics over the past 40 years or so about this smoothed-out nostalgia trip view of history" - given it's a couple months away from being 2020, the last 40 years would be 1980 onward. Bringing up Big Sur, Meant For You, Only With You, completely ignore what Guitarfool was talking about. So with that said, let's just look at Mike Love's solo single output since 1980. I will highlight in yellow any song that is a 50s/60s cover, mentions the 60s, or mentions the beach:

1981: "Looking Back With Love"
1981: "Runnin' Around The World"
1982: "Be My Baby"
1982: "Be True To Your Bud" (as sad as it is, it is basically a cover of a Beach Boys song from the 60s).
1982: "Da Doo Ron Ron"
1983: "Jingle Bell Rock"
2006: "Santa's Goin' To Kokomo"
2007: "Hungry Heart"
2015: "(You'll Never Be) Alone on Christmas Day"
2017: "Do It Again" (with Mark McGrath & John Stamos)
2017: "Unleash the Love"
2017: "All the Love in Paris" (with Dave Koz)
2017: "Darlin'" (with AJR)
2018: "It's OK" (with Hanson)

Only 4 songs out of 14 don't mention the 60s, are a cover from the 50s/60s, or mention the beach. And these are all singles - the songs that Mike Love wanted to be heard the most.

I'm very certain that Guitarfool is aware of the great lyrics that Mike has written over his entire career, which is probably why he is even more flabbergasted as to why Mike has spent so much of his time post-80s writing music about the 60s or covering songs from the 60s. Even Mike's Unleash the Love with the songs you mention (Crescent Moon, Cool Head Warm Heart, and Ram Raj) were released with a 2nd CD full of auto-tuned slathered covers of Beach Boys songs from the 60s (except for one song which is a nostalgic look at Brian). Just saying that it's hard to argue with GF's point given the mountain of evidence in Mike's discography that supports what he says.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll on October 22, 2019, 11:32:03 PM
IMO the lyrics are in poor taste/idiotic or both.

Lyrics were by D. Parker and it's the only writing credit in his career - https://www.discogs.com/artist/6746654-Daniel-Charles-Parker

Could it be Mike using a different name for some reason?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 24, 2019, 08:43:05 PM
There is footage of Dennis at what appears to be an early 70s concert at around 3.15. Does anyone know where is this from??


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: BBs Footage Saga on October 27, 2019, 10:29:21 AM
Surely from the lots of concert they shooted for the In Concert LP AD. That includes the Santa Barbara clip of Endless harmony doc (Sail on Sailor)


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 27, 2019, 08:27:31 PM
BBs Footage Saga, where can I watch it?  footage of the band in the early 70s are so hard to come by.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: BBs Footage Saga on October 28, 2019, 04:07:18 AM
That footage has not appeared in any public medium, only clips on documentaries as Endless Harmony.

As for avaliable footage of Early 70's : Something Else (Good Vibrations and Cotton Fields),  David Frost Show (Wouldn't It Be Nice and Cool Cool Water), Pop 2 (Country Air, Wouldn't It Be Nice, Cell Block nº9, Their Hearts were full of Spring, Cottonfields, It's About Time), Good Vibrations From Central Park (Heroes and Villains, Okie from Muskosgee, Forever, It's About Time, I Get Around, Good Vibrations), OGWT (You Need A Mess of Help), Music Unlimited (Don't Go Near The Water, You Need a Mess of Help), Good Vibrations from London (Do It Again, Wild Honey, Help Me Rhonda), Chicago New Year Rockin Eve (Good Vibrations, Darlin, Wishin You Were Here, Surfer Girl).

That If We add Clips of Documentaries: To the 1972-73 footage we can add the 1971 rally footage that appeared on youtube and in An American Band (Set to Student Demostration Time). Add Astroray Super 8 Movies and we can end With Billy Hinsche DVD.

That's Much, 85% of the things I told you are in youtube.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: urbanite on October 29, 2019, 12:31:49 PM
For whatever it's worth, the song and the video capture the bright and dark sides of the 60's, of which there were many.  It's a pop song, not meant to be the subject of a college lecture on the tumultuous 60's.  The video is pretty good, for what it purports to be.  It has a lot of interesting images.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on October 30, 2019, 07:30:35 AM
Thank you BBs Footage Saga. Been looking for that Something Else clip of Good Vibrations, is that on youtube?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: BBs Footage Saga on January 07, 2020, 05:38:51 AM
I'm Late but Here we are:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7FiRsDNVnA

Oopsie, it's blocked in the USA

Ok, I Published a Google drive in the description for those that can't see the video


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Rocker on January 07, 2020, 06:47:03 AM
I'm Late but Here we are:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7FiRsDNVnA

Oopsie, it's blocked in the USA

Ok, I Published a Google drive in the description for those that can't see the video


Awesome! Thanks for sharing this!


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: BBs Footage Saga on January 07, 2020, 09:41:39 AM
You're Welcome


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: rickymyfataar on January 07, 2020, 08:01:46 PM
Wow thanks BBs Footage Saga! How did you get this?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: bossaroo on January 07, 2020, 09:38:26 PM
a Google drive in the description?  I'm not finding this... can someone help?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: RangeRoverA1 on January 08, 2020, 05:54:27 AM
a Google drive in the description?  I'm not finding this... can someone help?
BB Footage Saga posted youtube clip, i.e. google drive is in youtube video description.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: RangeRoverA1 on January 08, 2020, 06:01:06 AM
Btw, thanks to share it. I'd seen it back in 2011 being newbie in BBs world - really liked the Al bit, he looks dashing.


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: Matt H on January 08, 2020, 08:57:19 AM
a Google drive in the description?  I'm not finding this... can someone help?
BB Footage Saga posted youtube clip, i.e. google drive is in youtube video description.

I don't see the link in the youbube video description.  Can someone post the link here?


Title: Re: Noven Jaisi
Post by: RangeRoverA1 on January 08, 2020, 09:02:07 AM
GV vid description link:

"For those that live in the USA:
https://www.youtube.com/redirect?q=https%3A%2F%2Fdrive.google.com%2Fopen%3Fid%3D17uXJt2omb5hhxZS9vZp8n6KORvSvBXXJ&v=t7FiRsDNVnA&event=video_description&redir_token=kH8-i2f4g0Xm1zQOXM0ga8lUyd58MTU3ODU4OTIwMEAxNTc4NTAyODAw "

Short link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/17uXJt2omb5hhxZS9vZp8n6KORvSvBXXJ/view?usp=drive_open