The Smiley Smile Message Board

Haven't picked up Ian and John's In Concert book in a while, but was wondering what you all thought was Brian's most active late-1970's period touring with the band.  Were there a block of shows when he played bass for more than just a few songs or contributed to songs vocally, more than just the token lead vocals ("Sloop John B.", "Surfer Girl" bridge, etc.)?  Audio from the '77 Seattle show sticks out in my mind with him being more active vocally (example "Catch A Wave").  There's a clip in the Endless Harmony doc I think of the band playing "In My Room" live with Brian on bass and singing his original vocal part.  I never could ID that show or year.

I remember reading/hearing recollections of Brian wanting to play bass full-time around this time, and Carl more or less put a kibosh on that saying Brian wasn't ready or more practice was needed).

Anyone have memories from seeing the band live around that time?  Any shows that stick out in your mind seeing Brian on bass the entire time?  Wish the show that had a "lively" Brian on bass during "Roller Skating Child" (?) was still on YouTube!

Brian played bass for most of the show throughout 1978 (the exception being a 4 or 5 song stretch mid-show). Videos from the Australian tour are a good way to catch that. He missed shows in August of that year due to his well-documented hospitalization that month. He toured with the band throughout most of the following three years, too, but hardly played bass at all (if at all) on those tours. But in '81 and early '82, he was covering Carl's leads, so I'd say that was a pretty active time for him with the band.

I always thought that possibly one of the reasons Carl decided to come back to the beach boys band was their performance without him. As we all remember from some of those televised shows the band was far from Stellar without Carl Wilson. Vocally Brian was not up to the challenge of covering Carl's lead vocals. The band itself was under rehearsed and not performing well either. I always sort of felt that Carl believed their Legacy was really hurt and maybe that was one of the reasons why he decided to come back. Who knows. But while it was sad to see Brian try to cover Carl's leads it was good to see him actually on stage at least contributing.

The in my room clip is in the 1985 American band documentary and I mentioned in the book that it was filmed at the April 1978 show in Houston. However the filmmakers did fool with some of the footage such as adding vocals from other times to footage if it sounded better-so I can’t 100% say he sounded like that on that night without seeing the raw footage-that was from the Jumbotron footage. I agree with Craig that 1978 and 1981 were two years where chances were high you’d catch Brian if you were at a show

My recollection is that the 1978 "In My Room" live footage from "An American Band" has an old track overlaid (maybe with extra reverb?); it's definitely not live '78 audio.

Brian was pretty active as well in very late 1976 and into 1977. Check out the Largo, MD footage from January 1977. He sings a number of leads (with an extra gravelly voice), and comes up and plays bass and sings as well (e.g. the infamous "Back Home" performance where he can't get the mic stand to adjust and smacks it and yells at it).

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/66770b378d462d722def6d581cc764e2/tumblr_inline_p7ntyzkDBD1s0x1ye_250.gif)

He was indeed active in much of 1978 as well. This is a '78 show:

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/783f25e0ddd6db0a3a2ee58f039514b4/tumblr_o8xgt5cDiU1sszfb1o1_500.gif)

1978 was the last tour where he was regularly active on bass. In 1979/1980, he was less engaged, spent most of the show to the side of the stage on piano, and usually only took a few lead vocal cameos, such as the bridge on "Surfer Girl", the opening lines to "Sloop John B", a joined partial lead on "Wouldn't It Be Nice" with Al, and a quick call and response at the very end of "Good Timin'"

He was more involved vocally in 1981 and into early 1982, taking over Carl's leads on "God Only Knows" and "Good Vibrations" (which he often sounded okay on), and continuing the little lead bits he did in 79/80, and also regularly attempted to sing "Don't Worry Baby" in its original key, which didn't tend to go well.

It was ironically when Carl returned in mid-1982 that Brian was less involved in the live shows, and also started missing more shows, culminating of course in his second episode with Landy late in the year.

I think Carl returned in April/May 1982 mostly because he never intended to leave permanently in the first place. While more was going on with his departure in 1981 than simply doing his solo album and touring behind it (he had issues with the stale setlist, the lack of rehearsals, some of the type of venues the band was booking, and lack of willingness from the band to record another album), I’ve spent a lot of time examining the band’s comments during that time, and have found that nobody much seemed to feel Carl was gone for good. While some posters for the ’81 Doobie Brothers tour where Carl was opening act did bill him as “formerly of the Beach Boys”, I think that had more to do with simply indicating his connection with the BBs and that he wasn’t *at that time* touring with the BBs.

If Carl had an impulse to return because he felt Brian wasn’t doing well, or the band wasn’t doing well without him, he didn’t seem to be in a rush about it. He was interviewed right after watching the July 5th, 1981 Queen Mary show that had been televised and, as I recall, called it “painful” and said something along the lines of “a little rehearsal would help a lot.” He knew early on that the band wasn’t doing well, and that Brian was having mixed results at best singing more leads. Yet Carl didn’t even do his “dry run” return until April 1982, and then left again for a bit before returning in May 1982.

My guess is that Carl returned because he wanted to be back in the band, and probably also wanted to share in the lucrative revenue the tours were still bringing, and back in 1982 he also still had enough clout that he could come back with a series of demands, which included a more interesting setlist, more rehearsals, and some changes in the touring band (which was necessitated anyway by Carl returning and the band needed one less bass player when Ed Carter moved back to bass). Carl also, at least in the very short term upon rejoining, supposedly got the band to agree to not book any additional casino shows beyond what was already booked. That particular request didn’t last very long based on subsequent tour schedules, but he was successful in getting a more interesting setlist and a tighter band sound.

Also, Brian sang the falsetto on "Hawaii" live in '79...but not the show I saw. When I saw them on the L.A. (Light) tour, they were still doing "Heroes And Villains", but shortly afterwards they dropped that one for awhile (it was added back in the following year for the European tour), and added "Hawaii". Of course, when they did "Hawaii" IN Hawaii for the Mike Douglas show toward the end of 1980, Brian was absent, and so Bruce handled the falsetto on that one. Interestingly, at that '79 show I saw, Brian was absent for not only "Heroes And Villains", "Lady Lynda", "Sumahama", and of course "I Write The Songs", but also "Surfer Girl", so Al sang the bridge on that latter one. He came back onstage for "Help Me Rhonda" and the "home stretch", and the complete crowd freakout that ensued.

This is pure speculation on my behalf.... it could easily be due to the nose candy and party favours... but my guess is that in the first gif, Brian is actually getting zapped by an improperly grounded microphone.  Which totalllllly sucks. 

Would that still happen with a foam windscreen on the mic?

If you watch the full video, just before that animated .gif starts, he's trying to adjust the mic stand. He can't get it to slide up, and then gets frustrated and gives up and slaps it (mouthing something that as I recall includes "f***ing microphone!").

I watched that full video (with Brian smacking the mic) awhile back, and it sure is sad to see him in that shape. I may be misremembering, but I seem to recall (or maybe I just recall reading this in a Youtube comment by someone at the time) that Brian was getting an inadvertent electrical jolt through the mic or some of his equipment, and that was the cause for his painful grimacing (and the resultant hitting of the mic in anger). Maybe that's totally wrong though.

On the "Back Home" video, I obviously can't say anything for sure. It seems like an awfully mild yet *long* shock if that's what it is. Mike is holding on to the mic just moments before Brian steps up.

It sure looks to me like he's trying to adjust the mic stand down below to make it taller, as he's taking over someone else's and he's taller. After he smacks the mic, he then proceeds to instead tilt the mic upwards more toward him (it also then moves up just a bit).

Hardly an intense mystery. But to me it's a case of Brian just being kind of weird and easily frazzled and probably wired. Just before the song, he sings "Airplane" and seems kind of wired and pretty much *screams* his lead vocal.

Brian really had no interest in touring as a BeachBoy at that time. He was told he needed the money, primarily by all the people on his payroll.

That's one of the reasons I used to get into trouble here. Apparently, it's not okay to say that people on Brian's payroll wanted to keep their jobs (the majority of them did, with the exception of a few good guys). Or that people who write a book about Brian/BBa want to sell a book, or whatever. (Fine with me, but tell the truth about it, please. I'm not accusing anyone of not caring, just admit there's an additional motive).

Also, at that point in time there had to be a Wilson performing for it to be a legitimate Beach Boys show. Brian wasn't happy and it showed.

Great points Debbie. As I rea=call when Carl left, and Dennis was consistently absent, it was either get Brian on stage every day, or contracts may be voided because of the "1 Wilson" requirement

Thanks Debbie. Let me chime in and say that the line "tell the truth about it, please" is and should be one of the guiding principles of any valid look at the history of this band. Sadly that principle too often falls by the wayside, and people who do know and tell the truth get labeled as the troublemakers when in fact those doing the labeling can be the real offenders. Anyway, it's good to get the truth out there in all cases, isn't it?  :)

I think it was the late, great Hal Blaine who said in an interview "Brian was the goose that laid the golden eggs..." for a lot of people, and if anyone interested in getting deeper into this band's history would look at that one notion and apply it to the earliest days as a band in Hawthorne through all the turmoil, they will see a common thread. Anyone who has seen "Love & Mercy", specifically the Kubrick tribute scene near the end when Brian's life flashes by and he's visited by various figures from his past, has seen several specific examples.

The names and faces changed, the expectations and behaviors did not for decades. Imagine the pressure of being held responsible for carrying, supporting, and forwarding an enterprise and numbers of people waiting for the golden eggs, and either not wanting to do it, saying "I don't want to do it", or simply not being physically or mentally up for doing it...and then feeling browbeaten into doing it anyway. Who would be happy in those cases?

No wonder the guy looked unhappy at various points.

In looking at the footage, seconds before the Brian vs. microphone incident, Mike is either arguing with Brian or being very expressive about something at the 8:10 mark:

https://youtu.be/NhQnELrh9a4?t=490

As Bruce was out of the band at the time, perhaps proper mic adjustments were something the band was lacking.

The band needed a Mike adjustment more than a mic adjustment   :lol

That exchange between Mike and Brian has always seemed a little weird. My best guess is that Mike is giving Brian some sort of mock half serious pep talk and Brian is responding in a sort of half serious intense fashion.

I've seen footage (privately, perhaps the Houston one) from a '78 show where Brian is THE bass player, basically. It's a bit shocking to see, and he's also very animated, running around in the back. He was functioning more as an integral part of the band, and he even nailed the tricky bass part on WIBN. Didn't sing much though.

The Houston '78 show is one of the shows in the BB vault; a few bits popped up in "An American Band" and "Endless Harmony" (the latter included that quick shot of an energetic Brian on bass on stage).

These uncut pro-shot shows should be released by BRI, but beyond publishing clearances needed for releasing videos, there are other issues with a lot of the footage like this. It's interesting to *us*, but sometimes pretty tough to see/hear (imagine releasing Brian's *screaming* lead on "Airplane" from the Largo '77 show), and also in some cases the only extant audio on these shows is arguably not of releasable quality (e.g. the Seattle '83 show with audio that sounds like it's coming from an AM transistor radio).

Yeah, I remember seeing another one from that tour where some of the band, Carl in particular are clearly in bad shape. He was playing "The Trader" behind a Wurli looking very hungover, glared at the camera and forcefully gestured the cameraman to get out of his face and shoot elsewhere. Might've been Largo I think? But I think the Brian bass one was probably the Houston one.

Yeah, I think the Carl keyboard moment was "All This Is That" from the Largo, MD 1977 show:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tVqBT5I1WE

From what I recall, both nights of a two-night stand were captured on video from Largo in 1977. Only one of the shows circulates and has been for years, and that's the one linked above. I think it's the second of two nights. I think tiny bits of the other show are seen in "Endless Harmony" (Brian in a different shirt at the piano). But both are supposedly in the BRI vaults.

31 year old Carl on stage, yaya-ed out of his gourd, wearing a Mickey Mouse sweater, and slaughtering a song about TM, is such a fantastically lewd scene.

Thanks, GF - you summed it up well.

(So sorry it took so long to reply. My husband is in home hospice, so mostly my life is wrapped around that.)

I think that period was so tough for all of them that most of what we see isn't pretty.  Brian was the guy who was never allowed a solo career for so long while others got to do theirs, he was the guy who brought Redwood/Three Dog Night to Brother Records, but was shut down (think about how that could have saved the day during that period). Carl brought Flame, so his taste was exquisite, too. Mike brought the Pickle Brothers. Let that sink in and consider that Brian might have been frustrated.

What I would say about one thing, and I may be absolutely wrong, is that one thing Carl wouldn't have wanted was to be remembered as a saint, as some people want to paint him. I honestly didn't know him terribly well, but better than many who speculate about him. He had a sense of humor that was occasionally wicked, oddly subtle, yet hilarious in a charming sort of way and always something that you wouldn't notice was funny, but he did. I wonder if their common sense of humor brought Brian and Carl back together as much as the music and family love (also, I talked to Melinda about this and she was a huge advocate of bringing them close again).

I understand why people are fascinated by that time period. I left in the middle of it because I wasn't tough enough, nor was I in the position to be Brian's advocate, so I left it to others. I think everyone did the best they knew to do, but somehow "Landy II" was considered to be the best answer by those in power. David Leaf had already found Brian's team at UCLA that brought him back to health a decade later, but I was the one who recommended them on David's behalf. No one was interested, so that's on me. They "knew better." I guess my meek presentation contributed to how things went pear-shaped. Life is full of these sad stories when people are all compromised by their own issues (in my case, lack of confidence).

The fact that Brian and the music lived on is nothing less than a miracle of love. I'd rather focus on that than the flip-side. Both are human and maybe useful stories in their own ways. People as brilliant as Brian and brothers could soar to the heights and hit rock-bottom. If the stories help others, great.

Very sorry to hear that, Debbie.


I love reading what you have to say. You paint a wonderful, unvarnished (no pun intended) picture of those days. But you shouldn't blame yourself for anything--we're all weak mortals, after all.

Yup, I think you're right! Apologies for my bad recollection.

No apologies needed! It had been so long since I had watched that one, I had forgotten all the weird stuff Carl (and the other guys) did. I remember first seeing the Australia '78 footage where Carl is super toasted, and then at some point after that I saw the Largo '77 footage, from a full year earlier, and was surprised that Carl was semi-toasted at that one as well.

It's pretty stunning then to watch the first 1979 footage of the band and to see Carl 100% sober and in charge of the band. It's one of the reasons it always bugs me when Mike (or others) bring up the "Wilsons doing drugs and drinking." I mean, it's unfortunate he still brings it up unprompted in general regarding any of the brothers, but I also think it's unfair to lump Carl in with the more chronic, long-lasting problems Dennis and Brian had. While I've often heard supposition that Carl continued to drink possibly excessively much, much later in his life, I have to say it NEVER showed in public or on stage post-1978. Professionally, Carl got his s**t together pretty quickly.

Exactly. Mike NEVER publicly talks about Carl getting his life in order, giving up drugs, and being the band leader again. I guess it's more fun to talk about the ways people have screwed up. I blame it at least partially on today's tabloid media. They always go for the seedy side of things.

Don't blame the media: In these cases blame Mike, as the blame rests squarely and blatantly on his shoulders for the comments he makes. If Mike were to bring up how Carl cleaned up and recovered and how Brian cleaned up and recovered, it would directly contradict the narrative Mike has been putting out there to less-educated fans for too long. Drugs/Wilsons...bad. Destroyed them and the band. Mike's "clean" lifestyle...he's still tourin'.

Ultimately it's hypocritical bordering on hogwash. I can totally understand how Mike or anyone would have strong feelings about seeing bandmates and family going through addiction issues. But Mike himself gets way too preachy about it, again for fans who don't know yet may believe this stuff, and what offends some of us is how he has used it to elevate himself and his lifestyle over the Wilsons, which is absurd. "Drugs destroyed the Wilsons...*I* never got into it, and I'm still tourin'." Well, so is cousin Brian FYI. It also becomes hypocritical when Mike himself used imagery directly related to and referencing this same psychedelic "drug culture" that he preaches against when he was selling merch and schwag for his 50th anniversary of Good Vibrations promotion. And that's just one of the contradictions out of a handful.

So if Mike did talk about Carl (and Brian, and Dennis) in the terms outlined in the posts above, his narrative wouldn't hold water. As if it does anyway.

He *should* talk about the positives more, as it seems he's been doing more recently. But it's hard not to expect that one interview to hit the Bumf*ck Times weekender section where he lapses into the Drugs-Wilsons-Bad-Etc narrative again.

The sad part is he does himself a great disservice by doing so. It turns people off and is the primary reason why he doesn’t get the respect he deserves. Every single member of the group was extremely talented including Mike, but every time he opens his mouth he puts his foot in it and overshadows that. It’s a damn shame because truth be told artistically he deserves better.  His more recent interviews have seemed to be more positive,and I truly hope he continues on that path. At all of their ages it’s time to let this sh*t go.

Mike just gave an interview to the Daily Mail this past week...and yes, he once again goes there and brings up the drugs and how his choices were better.

It's sad but at the same time it's almost like a parody of itself at this point. Un-freakin-real.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7154031/Beach-Boy-grew-meditation-helped-pop-star-Mike-Love-78-cope-fame.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7154031/Beach-Boy-grew-meditation-helped-pop-star-Mike-Love-78-cope-fame.html)

A few choice excerpts:

>>>Mike credits meditation with saving his life when addictions were destroying those around him.

'It absolutely saved me,' he says. 'There are many ways to relax. Alcohol, marijuana, other drugs, but they all have side effects.

'I knew quite a few people who went in that direction. But if you learn transcendental meditation you're already relaxed. It leads you to make better choices.

'It was heartbreaking to see my own family members destroying themselves through drink and drugs.

'Not only Brian – his brother Dennis drowned in 1983 with an excess of drugs in his system.'<<<<

And...

>>>A day after Brian Wilson, who has been beset by health problems after a lifetime of drug and alcohol addiction, cancelled a tour because he was feeling 'mentally insecure', Mike Love called me from the health farm where he'd been on a starvation diet of juices ahead of his own tour, which will see him performing at the Royal Albert Hall and the Cornbury Festival. <<<<



So yeah, this article is crap in those regards, as in they had to knock down Brian and bring up addictions he's had beaten and had conquered for decades at this point, and contrast that with Mike calling from a "health farm" in the middle of a starvation juice fast and diet...oh, please. Does anyone care where Mike is calling from, whether it's a health farm's juice bar or at his dry cleaner picking up his Robert Graham shirts and ball caps sorted by the days of the week?

And it's sad because there are positives in the article, some nice sentiments, but the same old Drugs-Wilsons-Bad stuff keeps coming back, and it's Mike saying it ad nauseum.

It's this kind of stuff that is exactly what does Mike no favors.

Yep

Let us also note that the source of the Mike article is a tabloid, so crap is to be expected from them.

It's exhausting. Old people don't adapt well, especially when they cover their own insecurities by maligning others. We have one in a far more prominent position than ML (of course, ML is a supporter of his), and that's the real danger.  I believe Mike isn't going to hurt Brian with this crap. Brian appears to have not cared for years. It's ML hurting ML. While Brian is dealing with issues, ML really needs to let this go. He probably won't.

Speaking of old people, mea culpa. My kids are working me through cell phone issues this weekend.  :hat

I’m politely requesting that this thread stay on topic, thanks in advance. Thanks so much for everyone contributing so far, great to read all the antidotes from this late-70s period!

 :woot for letting go and enjoying the time you have left!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/beach-boys-stars-last-rock-17262151 (https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/beach-boys-stars-last-rock-17262151)

Mike was at it again in the UK press...basically the same interview and answers as the other. No indication if he was calling from a health farm this time, but his stock answers about how his lifestyle choices were better than his bandmates remains constant, along with reminders of how bad the Wilson's messed themselves up in contrast to the clean living, meditating Cousin Mike.

It's not off topic when someone brought it up in the conversation regarding Carl and how Mike mentions the substance abuse and addictions but never the recovery. We see two prime examples this past week.

Why does every single thread end the same around here?

They do not.

Second request to keep this on topic, thanks so much. There are many other threads you can post this Mike Love info in, but please do not make this thread one of them. Interested in hearing more facts and memories from the late 70s era when Brian was more involved than usual on bass and vocals throughout shows! Thanks again for everyone’s contributions!

Obviously, the thread has veered somewhat from the original topic. But it's not like Mike reflecting present-day on the Wilsons' past is completely off-topic.

One of the MANY reasons Brian's activity on tour in the late 70s is less explored is because when people like Mike bring the Wilsons up in interviews, it immediately goes to "they did drugs and drank, I didn't."

The story of the band in the late 70s is unavoidably imbued with rampant drug and alcohol abuse, and also all sorts of other internecine political drama within the band. So, discussing the band in, say, 1977/78/79, easily one of its more tumultuous periods as a live band, is inevitably going to include discussion of who was wasted on stage, who at times was surprisingly *not* wasted or was wasted but still played well enough, as well as discussion of how members dealt with others being wasted. Not too far off from this topic is how Mike (or the other members) view that time period in PRESENT DAY. Mike clearly has little to no time or interest in discussing much of anything positive Brian did in the late 70s (or very often any interest in anything good Brian did post like 1966 or 67 or so), so if one is bummed that we don't get more info about how energetic Brian was on stage in 1978, then maybe it's worth asking Mike about *that*.

That's obviously hyperbole, but to the degree we do end up hashing out another negative Mike interview, perhaps another germane question is "Why does Mike keep harping on the Wilsons' drug and alcohol abuse?", as well as "Why doesn't Mike discuss something positive about the Wilsons out on tour in the late 70s?", and perhaps "Why do media outlets keep publishing Mike going negative about the Wilsons?"

As I said in my previous post, the thread obviously has veered somewhat away from the original prompt (which is obviously quite common on boards; and largely not a problem in my view; if someone has something to add strictly speaking to the original post, they can continue to do so), but Mike in 2019 (and most prior years across many if not most interviews) continuously just lumping DECADES of band history into "the Wilsons did drugs and I didn't" actually is very much a part of why we don't get more info about a *myriad* of topics relating to the band, including Brian's activity in the touring band in the late 70s. Yes, the other members aren't volunteering epic anecdotes about Brian on stage in 1978 either. But when the general topic of that era comes up, there's *one* band member who typically *immediately* skips past any substantive information or context and goes straight to "the Wilsons did drugs and drank."

I'm actually even willing to cut Mike some slack in this area; I'm sure part of why *that* aspect of the Wilsons is so prevalent in his mind is because the Wilsons DID do drugs and drink excessively in that era. But other members have been able to move past that and discuss other things. Al Jardine will discuss "Love You" in interviews. And so on.

One issue at a time.  :)

For the umteenth time, this is an *open forum*, always has been and always will. No cops to crack people back on topic, or no one to send private messages to get someone's head straight when they say something that veers off a given narrative. Post what you want, within reason.

If someone here wants to get back to talking about Brian Wilson in the late 70's...go ahead and post about Brian Wilson in the 1970's! If someone doesn't think Mike Love's most recent UK interviews are on topic, don't read them or comment on them! Ignore them! But this deal with people trying to tell others what and how to post because they don't want it discussed, or maybe it's something they don't want to see is tiring, and it should stop.

Seriously, it's as simple as ignoring what *you* don't want to see or read, and posting what *you* want to talk about. It's not rocket science. It's an open forum where people can talk. It really is that simple. This judgemental stuff about what and how others are posting when those posts directly relate to the discussion at hand isn't and shouldn't be a part of it. If you don't like seeing Mike Love interviews posted as examples when others were specifically discussing Mike Love interviews about the topics at hand...don't read them. Ignore them. But don't try to tell others what and how to post because you don't want to see it. Post *what you want to see* and others can choose to jump in or not.

And this crap about every thread ending the same way...Bullshit. Enough is enough Jay (and others), what you wrote is not accurate and you shouldn't make comments about this forum that are inaccurate and untrue.

Honestly, the reason why this threads end up the same (on EITHER side) is because truth be told right now we have almost nothing to talk about. We're rehashing the same old stuff because, well, right now that's pretty much all there is.

Back to the issues of Brian and Carl et al in the late 70's...These interviews with Mike are the most current on the published record, current as of this past week, and i had not even seen them until this weekend. Someone asked why or if Mike ever talks about Carl's recovery and kicking those habits *during the time period on topic for this discussion*, and here is the most up to date proof that Mike does not seem able to do so. He is still emphasizing the negative, and not bothering to mention the positive aspects, namely that Carl kicked and cleaned up and got back on track to where he was still a key member of the touring band for two decades up to his passing, and Brian also recovered to where he did what was once thought impossible, and became a viable and regular touring musician along with releasing multiple albums both studio and live...not to mention a Beach Boys reunion tour and album that were both successful.

If you read what Mike actually said as of this past week in June 2019, you may see why Mike says what he says and how he says it. Mike's narrative is that his life choices were morally, physically, and whatever other "-ly" you can add *better* than the Wilsons, his bandmates and cousins. Dennis died, Carl died, Brian got all messed up...and they all drank, smoked, and did drugs.

Right, we get that. But incessantly pointing it out in public interviews in the way Mike does and has done while ignoring the *triumphant* next chapters of the story that involved redemption, recovery, and renewed musical and personal activities from both Brian and Carl is to me (and perhaps many other fans) irresponsible coming from Mike, because he's only telling half of the story.

Mike goes right from Carl's issues to him passing away from cancer...how about how he cleaned up and got back to making the live band rehearse and give the fans a good show for their money, musically? How about how Brian beat impossible odds to return to both the stage and studio and start a new life with a wife, children, and grandchildren after nearly everyone counted him out?

That's inspirational, right there. It inspires a lot of us.

So for me, I don't need to hear Mike constantly elevating himself over the Wilsons or anyone else and suggesting he made better life choices. Maybe he could - for once - give a tip of his hat to his cousins and say he was and is happy to see how they beat their addictions and issues and continued to make fans happy with their music, in Carl's case up to his passing from cancer and in Brian's case up to the present day.

I think there is something in Mike's psychology that compels him to keep trying to elevate his own self and status in life by pointing out the flaws and issues surrounding his Wilson cousins. It would be as simple as adding to one of these interviews how proud and happy he is and was of his cousins for tackling their issues and fighting back to recover and continue making music as long as they can or could.

It would be like someone talking about Glen Campbell or any number of musicians on this level (including George Harrison) and constantly mentioning their addictions and personal issues any time their music is discussed instead of mentioning or focusing on the later, positive chapters of the story. We know Glen battled alcoholism and other addictions, we know George smoked, drank, and did any number of drugs...so what. They overcame these things. Just like Carl, Brian, etc. That's the good stuff versus the negativity.

Mike grants two new interviews this past week on the eve of his big UK concerts, which flew under the radar...it's the same old stuff coming from Mike with a few new mentions of his interactions with Brian, but it's something new coming from a Beach Boy that is on the table for discussion. There are also other threads where various new topics from history and the current day are being discussed with some new info, or that which many newer fans may not have heard. So I think it's unfair and wrong to paint this place with such a broad brush as some above and in other threads have been trying to do.

Time for folks to get over it whatever it may be (in one person's case, it's not hard to suss out), and if they choose to dredge up the past grudges and issues they can't let go of, expect a challenge especially if the things being said are untrue. Or just look for greener pastures with forum cops and the like to keep people in line, I don't know.  ::)

True, but me personally, I'd rather see that (referring to these new interviews)  in its own thread rather than on anything that's supposed to be a Brian thread, unless it has to do with the topic at hand. That's my own bias at play, true, one that I can't help and I freely admit that...it pisses me right the hell off to see these "the Wilsons did drugs so they are bad people, m'kay" interviews on a thread featuring a question that I myself have wondered about for years. I'm almost to the point of wishing there was a separate thread/sub-forum for the Mike stuff* because once again it's overshadowing something far more interesting.



*no I'm not doing one

I agree, just in this case there were specific questions and comments about Mike's interviews in the past, and these two new ones (which are basically the same stock answers Mike has been repeating for years minus a few new tidbits) just happened to show up the same week as the topic some had raised.

It has been almost funny in the past to see these interviews show up in similar situations and threads about Mike's touring, or Mike's new music, or appearances, or whatever...and it's like some don't want to see Mike's own answers in his own words when they're directly related to the topics being discussed! If Mike's interviews cause so many problems, and if some circles of the fandom don't even want to see them reposted for others to read, maybe by now he (Mike, and his management) should have gotten the clue and told Mike to either tone it down or change his stock answers. Usually the best way to get someone's take on a given issue is to let their own words speak for themselves, but in Mike's case it seems his own words aren't welcome in discussions among fans, like these cases.

My opinion, again agreeing, is that Mike over the past few weeks is like Jekyll & Hyde: He posted a terrific message to Brian when the announcement of Brian taking time off was made, he revealed some great moments in these two UK interviews, but then he's right back at it trying to boost himself up by knocking the Wilsons down...yet again. It really is like Jekyll & Hyde. If more of the Mike who issued that statement on Facebook wishing Brian well would be the norm, he'd be given more slack I think.

"Past issues they can't let go of". You've been singing the same tune since C50 ended.

I was referring to past issues related to the board and between board members, but if you see fit to take a shot at me about C50, you should demand the truth about C50 from those who have been spreading their grudge and agenda driven bullshit since 2012. You know exactly who and what I'm referring to Jay.

Now that that's on the table, why don't you post on topic about Brian in the late 70's and start some discussion if that's an issue here?

Is that the one that has the semi famous clip of him playing the bass and gyrating? I see a gif of that used as an avatar quite a bit (and not just on BB sites!)

Guitarfool2002, please accept this post as my third request to please keep this thread on its original intended topic. Original topics get lost more often than not when this stuff comes up. Thanks so much.

Also, thank you Billy for posting.

I’m all for an open forum, and enjoy reading most of what is posted here, but as I said above, original topics are far more likely to steer off track when this other stuff is introduced and repeated and repeated. Steers others away from reading and offering their insight into what I think is an interesting topic.

I’m trying to track down any available video of that show when Brian was doing the hula hoop with the bass. Used to be on YouTube, but I’m striking out. How much of that show is available on video?

That’s the one with the Hawaiian shirt and shorts, right?

The one I’m referring to had no sound, and part of it featured him literally jumping up and down and growling (literally) . I haven’t seen it in many a year...I imagine it was from the same tour

The one with Brian doing the weird Hula hoop type motion used to be on YouTube, but not anymore. It had "Roller Skating Child" synced to the film, but it's not the song they are playing.

That’s right...it sure did.

Anybody have any info on the clip I’m referring to?

If I'd been a Beach Boy, I would have been drunk a whole lot, I can tell you that for free.

I totally understand wanting to have your question(s) answered, but three "friendly reminders" across two pages attempting to tightly moderate one thread you've started doesn't tend to add to the on-topic discussion.

I've noticed that you started the thread and haven't posted anything since then in this thread other than your attempts to moderate the thread. I think of this forum as more of a place for discussion rather than simply an "information service" where you pitch a question/topic and then sit back and wait for everyone else to generate discussion. Obviously, folks can post or not post as they choose, and if someone wants to pitch a question and then log off and go on vacation, that's fine. But if you're frustrated there aren't more tightly focused posts in this thread, or frustrated there isn't more discussion specifically honing in on topics raised in your initial post, I'd offer the friendly suggestion of contributing to the thread and posting and discussing.

To your specific question about that clip of Brian on bass, as far as I know it only ever surfaced on YouTube as a very brief clip (not much longer than the animated GIF that still floats around), and the audio laid over it ("Roller Skating Child") was not the audio that matched the footage. I think the footage comes from 1978, and my recollection is that "Roller Skating Child" wasn't even often if ever in the setlist in 1978. It was briefly in the setlist in 1977, and then reemerged in the 1979 setlist.

It would probably help to have a drink just watching some of that late 70s footage.

Al Jardine should get an award for *not* drinking while having to sing "Country Pie."

I think that video clip wasn't much longer than the animated GIF that's floating around. It was very brief 1978 (most likely) live footage with unrelated live audio of "Roller Skating Child" dubbed over it. As mentioned in a previous post, "RSC" wasn't even in the setlist in 1978.

Now, my recollection is as follows: In terms of extant footage from around this time, we have of course the Australia '78 footage, and then they also captured from the in-house video feed the April 14, 1978 Houston show. A bit of this is in "An American Band" ("In My Room", with different audio dubbed over it), and also I believe briefly in "Endless Harmony" (the bit where Brian is energetically playing bass on stage, but not the "hula" bit, seen here: https://youtu.be/55zjnIJtov0?t=5720 )

There is also some footage in the 1978 unreleased "Our Team" documentary from a live show, and I believe that footage comes from December 13 and 14, 1977 shows in Washington state. Seen here: https://youtu.be/-19LFYE4RTQ?t=3478

That animated GIF with the "hula" thing definitely seems to be from 1978 (or possibly very late 1977), but I don't think the clothing matches either the late '77 footage used in "Our Team" or the April '78 Houston footage. But supposedly two nights of shows were shot in December for "Our Team", so that footage may still come from that. It's hard to say for sure whether clothing matches, as most of this footage is like 27th generation VHS dub quality. And it all seems to come from around the same era, as they are often wearing similar clothes (e.g. those hats Al and Mike were wearing around this time).

What would be interesting to know is whether whomever circulated that little "hula" video clip has more or all of that show. It has a timecode stamp on it, so it comes from some sort of raw, production source presumably. But unmatched audio being overlaid suggests it's possible that the footage they had at their disposal didn't have audio, or had poor audio, and/or that it was some sort of "b-roll" type footage that was choppy and/or had only "field" audio rather than soundboard.

But all just guesses of course.

One update: It appears "Roller Skating Child" was in the December 13, 1977 Seattle setlist, and that's one of the two shows shot for that "Our Team" documentary. So it's possible the stuff seen in "Our Team" is from December 14th mostly, but December 13th footage did make it "out there" at some point and someone took audio from that same show and just overlaid it on top of that brief clip. Hard to say.

I do recall someone mentioned awhile back that they "stumbled" across like a bunch of raw "Our Team" documentary footage on one of their old VHS tapes. I think it was mostly the studio and other footage rather than the live shows, but perhaps somewhere eons ago someone got their hands on a whole bunch of video footage used to prep that "Our Team" doc, and that's how the live footage also made it out.

Are any of those the one where Brian is jumping up and down (not gyrating) and actually leaps forward and growls? I remember it being posted here MANY years ago. It’s not the hula one obviously but it might be one of the others mentioned. I’ve been trying to find that clip for years. Has to be the same era based on how I remember Brian looking, and I’m 99% certain he was wearing shorts. I know it’s not the hula show because it was obviously daytime outside.

I don't think this is any of the footage we've been talking about, but here's a bit of footage of Brian on stage from the May, 1978 "Day on the Green" show:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSLclEJ0IAQ

There is some brief footage of Brian jumping around and being overly animated in the Endless Harmony documentary, but it's silent footage with narration over it. I've never seen any footage of Brian "growling" onstage. The closest thing I can think of would be the Maryland 1977 show where he literally screams his vocal parts.

I still have the EH doc somewhere, but I don't think that was it. It was discussed here; I wish like hell I  could remember more about it .  Brian had lept forward and he landed in kind of a half squat-half standing position and maybe growling is a bad description...roaring perhaps would be a better description.

I'll see if I can find the original post here. It'll take me a bit as I think this is closer to the board's formation

By the way, I'm almost positive that the "hula hoop" footage fragment came from Hal Roach. I remember seeing the "RoachClips" logo/url.

It'd be great if it did come from Hal Roach, and that The Boys would've been in some Our Gang shorts 😂

Still can’t find the clip I was talking about but if it helps jogging anyone else’s memory we discussed it back in the days of guys like Ian Wagner, Aegir, and ReRun. I’m up to 2006 on old posts

I saw the April '78 show in Houston and don't remember a Hula Hoop. And "Surfer Girl" would not have sounded as well as it did in that clip. But Brian was enthusiastically playing bass, wearing shorts (I think) and dancing throughout the show in his spot on stage. This was a quickie tour to promote "Almost Summer." Rock concerts at The Summit shown on the screen were videotaped. Ed Roach showed another clip from that concert several years ago on his forum, where Dennis asks the audience if any of the ladies out there like to fool around.

The footage of Brian doing the dance in shorts is from the shows in Hawaii on March 20 and 21 1978-it’s just a brief clip-I don’t think the shows were filmed in full

I'm not sure if anybody has this impression, but just to clarify, there was no actual hula hoop on stage. We're just referring to this footage of Brian sort of gyrating in a circular motion:

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/783f25e0ddd6db0a3a2ee58f039514b4/tumblr_o8xgt5cDiU1sszfb1o1_500.gif)

Ah. that makes sense. The camera angle does seem to suggest it could be news camera footage (the lack of accompanying audio would support this theory); there are a number of shows where several minutes of what we can only call "semi-proshot footage" exists. Meaning, pre-camcorder era, shot by a professional organization (usually local news), but only shot in choppy b-roll segments for a short time. It's sometimes essentially video footage shot from the same press pool area as still photographers.

The timing on that footage would also make sense; they look very similar to their Australian gigs (same/similar hats as I recall); the Hawaii gigs were the first gigs they did after Australia/New Zealand as I recall.

There is definitely some stuff that was up in the early era of YouTube that is long gone. I recall one interview segment with a local news station, from around 1978 or so, where Brian and Al are seated and the interviewer asks Brian a question about Charles Manson, and Al actually gets angry/defensive, seeming to jump to Brian's defense and cuts the reporter off rather brusquely.

So there were a lot of little short clips like that back then that don't seem to have survived (online anyway), as it was often shorter clips being put up on YouTube back in those early days (I think they may have even had a time limit on how long videos could be).

Here are a couple of shots from the Houston '78 footage. You can see the stage set up is indeed different from the Hawaii footage; in Houston they had that slanted backdrop:

"In My Room" from "An American Band":

(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/65919640_2306768829593134_5361798436016357376_n.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_oc=AQlyOClBmxpLShK_xh-oul9F-JshPT4611_OpVQTjKkOooTBSTP1UbckwNvXq-JyCnE&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=87edfbdbd01b05139363f3262f79217f&oe=5DBF3299)

"Endless Harmony" doc footage:

(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/65660848_2306768792926471_3782140736204439552_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_oc=AQlv37w3Bge3wUVp7sQuLWNnV5dTGjDkPIesZOQRMqXqXPnBnWXF2M2XmOMmcPesEbE&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=49f67749704a11ff339a781031d5ed52&oe=5DC4E868)

Australia 1978 - Brian also seems to be hitting the tricky parts on his bass during WIBN at this rather infamous run of shows, standing at the mic but only briefly singing, then the next tune he walks to the backline of amps and plays the next tunes sitting on one.  :lol  Too bad the quality isn't there to hear much if anything from that bass.

The link should go directly to WIBN:

https://youtu.be/cbP8eI3b5U4?t=289 (https://youtu.be/cbP8eI3b5U4?t=289)

My observation between WIBN and IGA is Brian is struggling to hear his bass so is sitting on/next to the speaker. You can hear him strumming and turning his head as though listening.

So cool to see Brian playing WIBN on the bass. That's a tricky line for any bassist to nail, let alone compose, so this clip (among others) show that Bri was not only an awesome composer, but quite the instrumentalist. Even though the quality isn't A+, you can see he's playing the correct bassline (with almost 100% accuracy) by the way his hands move around the fretboard.

Agreed 100%

I always thought Brian looked really cool onstage in the 70's, with his longer hair and moustache/beard.

Especially that black and gold bathrobe

Exactly what I was thinking. I love that picture of him wearing it with the bass around his neck, with his hands up in the air. Like some kind of dysfunctional hippie Jesus.  ;D

Yeah he looked cool as sh*t.