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Smiley Smile Stuff => General On Topic Discussions => Topic started by: WonderBill on July 06, 2018, 07:32:31 PM



Title: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: WonderBill on July 06, 2018, 07:32:31 PM
The recent thread about God Only Knows reminded me of a similar question I've been meaning to ask...

Who sings the verses of Be Here In The Mornin'? To my ears, I'd swear it's Al on the verses and Brian in the chorus.

Al is not listed as a lead singer of this song in the Wikipedia article on Friends; Brian and Carl are. I actually added Al as the lead singer in that article last year because I thought a mistake was present, but it was soon changed back.

Anyone know?


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 06, 2018, 07:38:39 PM
When I was younger I thought was all Brian, but then I was told it was Al & Brian...


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: WonderBill on July 06, 2018, 07:47:10 PM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.

One example I can think of that I mistook one for another was Bruce during the coda of God Only Knows. I used to think that was Mike.

I guess if anyone on this board has Al's email address, they could ask him.  ;D


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: c-man on July 06, 2018, 07:55:22 PM
It's Al on the verses. Compare his vocal there to that on "Loop-De-Loop". And it's Carl on the choruses.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: John Brode on July 06, 2018, 07:57:35 PM
I've always thought the verses were Al. It can be hard to tell him apart from Brian, but when they go into falsetto, I think Brian's voice sounds a little more "sweet."


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 06, 2018, 08:21:30 PM
It's Al on the verses. Compare his vocal there to that on "Loop-De-Loop". And it's Carl on the choruses.

I hear Carl on the choruses, but it's not Brian on the "ahhh haaaa" part after Carl sings?


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: RangeRoverA1 on July 06, 2018, 08:24:15 PM
2WonderBill: Hello. Check this post in Definitive Vocals List thread: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,5525.msg69787.html#msg69787


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 06, 2018, 08:46:51 PM
^ Yup, and according to that thread my ears are correct :lol


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: zatch on July 06, 2018, 08:49:40 PM
I've always thought the verses were Al. It can be hard to tell him apart from Brian, but when they go into falsetto, I think Brian's voice sounds a little more "sweet."
Yeah. Al has always been a little less confident and a little more careful sounding in his high register than Brian was back then, as though he has to try really hard to hit the right notes. Compare his lead here to Brian’s on Let Him Run Wild, for instance. The songs are in roughly comparable registers, but Al is clearly trying to sing softly so as not to strain his vocal chords while Brian’s lead is in much fuller voice. And that’s on a song where Brian thinks his own lead is too shrill. All of this being said, I don’t think Al sounds/sounded bad up there at all. Just distinctively different in that way.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 06, 2018, 08:51:58 PM
I actually love his voice on it


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: John Brode on July 06, 2018, 09:32:02 PM
I agree. Both sound great singing falsetto, and I think here it's clearly Al due to that distinction. When they sing high notes normally without going into falsetto, they can sound exactly alike. (I always thought Brian sang IKTTA).


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 07, 2018, 12:33:09 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: wjcrerar on July 07, 2018, 02:34:10 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM
Desper's made a few mistakes in terms of vocal credits in his study videos - those are the same vocals heard in the final mix with Brian, Carl and Mike joining Dennis.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: c-man on July 07, 2018, 07:02:06 AM
On "Be Here In The Mornin'" - Dennis DOES sing the wordless "uh-uhhh-uh-uh"s at the start and later in the song. And yes, that's definitely Brian on the falsetto chorus responses. But I would credit the "lead" simply to Al and Carl, and consider the other two parts as backgrounds. Same with Murry's low "whole"s in the choruses.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Awesoman on July 08, 2018, 07:55:17 PM
It's Al on the verses. Compare his vocal there to that on "Loop-De-Loop". And it's Carl on the choruses.

+1


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: wjcrerar on July 09, 2018, 05:37:09 AM
On "Be Here In The Mornin'" - Dennis DOES sing the wordless "uh-uhhh-uh-uh"s at the start and later in the song. And yes, that's definitely Brian on the falsetto chorus responses. But I would credit the "lead" simply to Al and Carl, and consider the other two parts as backgrounds. Same with Murry's low "whole"s in the choruses.

Pretty sure the wordless "uhhhh" part at the start of the song is Brian, it's only Dennis when it returns later.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: B.E. on July 09, 2018, 08:32:20 AM
On "Be Here In The Mornin'" - Dennis DOES sing the wordless "uh-uhhh-uh-uh"s at the start and later in the song. And yes, that's definitely Brian on the falsetto chorus responses. But I would credit the "lead" simply to Al and Carl, and consider the other two parts as backgrounds. Same with Murry's low "whole"s in the choruses.

Pretty sure the wordless "uhhhh" part at the start of the song is Brian, it's only Dennis when it returns later.

Woah, I'm pretty sure you're right. Dennis' "uh-uhhh-uh-uh"s later in the song have always been a highlight of the album for me, so I may have just assumed the intro was him by association.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 09, 2018, 10:54:20 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track.  So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

As to 'Mornin'  The song is fairly-well structured.

uh-uhhh-uh-uh   Dennis

[Verse 1]
It's been such a long day so you better hurry home     Brian
Lit all my incense and I wish you were home     Group
Only five minutes and you walk through my door     Brian

[Pre-Chorus]
Be here in the morning     Carl  & Alan (a-ha’s)
Be here in the evening     Carl & Alan (a-ha’s)
Be here and make my life full     Carl

[Chorus]
Be here in the morning     Carl & Brian & Alan (a-ha’s)
Be here in the evening     Carl & Brian & Alan (a-ha’s)
Be here and make my life     Carl & Brian

[Verse 2]
Stay here on the weekend and unplug the phone     Brian
(Alright then)
No calls from Korthoff, Parks, or Grillo     Group
I only hope that you come here alone     Brian & Brian

[Pre-Chorus]
Be here in the morning     Carl through Lesley & Alan (a-ha’s)
Be here in the evening     Carl through Lesley & Alan (a-ha's)
Be here and make my life full     Carl through Lesley

Repeats

[Vamp]

uh-uhhh-uh-uh     Dennis

Repeats  … (no Lesley)

 
~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 09, 2018, 01:59:30 PM
So the verses are actually Brian singing and NOT Al?


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: wjcrerar on July 09, 2018, 02:51:25 PM
Stephen, while I have absolutely no authority to doubt you (since...you were actually there and I wasn't) and this response isn't meant to be disrespectful in any way, to my ears Brian, Carl and Mike are present in the Hawthorne CA mix of Forever in the same places I hear them on the Sunflower mix. Dennis singing most of the vocal parts including the "together my love" response, Brian at the top of the harmony stack throughout and the high "na-na-na"s in the coda (surely that has to be him speaking at the end?), Carl occasionally in the harmony stack and singing the initial "my-my-my"s before a higher response by Brian, and Mike on the low "baby" parts. That's just what I hear though. There's every possibility I'm wrong.

As for Be Here in the Mornin', I think your notes may have the parts Al and Brian sing mixed up, with Al on the verses and Brian on the high "ahh-ha"s in the chorus. Actually, to me it sounds like Carl (or maybe Al?) sings the high "ahh-ha"s in the first chorus with Brian harmonising above Carl's lead, then Brian takes over the "ahh-ha"s in the second chorus when the Lesley effect on Carl enters, with the final chorus being back to Carl on "ahh-ha"s when Brian is once again harmonising with the lead. Again, that's just what I hear.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: John Brode on July 09, 2018, 03:42:47 PM
Pretty sure the wordless "uhhhh" part at the start of the song is Brian, it's only Dennis when it returns later.
[/quote]

I agree; I've always noticed that the first one sounds completely different from Dennis later in the song. I've never doubted that that part was Brian.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 09, 2018, 03:49:15 PM
Stephen, while I have absolutely no authority to doubt you (since...you were actually there and I wasn't) and this response isn't meant to be disrespectful in any way, to my ears Brian, Carl and Mike are present in the Hawthorne CA mix of Forever in the same places I hear them on the Sunflower mix. Dennis singing most of the vocal parts including the "together my love" response, Brian at the top of the harmony stack throughout and the high "na-na-na"s in the coda (surely that has to be him speaking at the end?), Carl occasionally in the harmony stack and singing the initial "my-my-my"s before a higher response by Brian, and Mike on the low "baby" parts. That's just what I hear though. There's every possibility I'm wrong.

As for Be Here in the Mornin', I think your notes may have the parts Al and Brian sing mixed up, with Al on the verses and Brian on the high "ahh-ha"s in the chorus. Actually, to me it sounds like Carl (or maybe Al?) sings the high "ahh-ha"s in the first chorus with Brian harmonising above Carl's lead, then Brian takes over the "ahh-ha"s in the second chorus when the Lesley effect on Carl enters, with the final chorus being back to Carl on "ahh-ha"s when Brian is once again harmonising with the lead. Again, that's just what I hear.

.

COMMENT to wjcrera:  I don't take offence or anything like that with fans who wish to voice their opinions.

Forever is covered in the study-video on Sunflower (Recording The Beach Boys part one). . Most vocals Dennis originally sung for his demo (to the group) remained. There is some sweetening, but very little. The Hawthorne mix sounds the same as the Sunflower mix because both are gleaned from the same multi-track and both were made by me.

I am very familiar with the multi-track of BHITM, but again the last time I played the tracks separately was 50 years ago.  Some of the vocals I recorded, but most were already recorded by engineer Jimmy L. And of course, the singers you hear were several decades younger. Aside from listening to the overtones of each vocal for identification, try to visualize the singer's mouth in your mind as the words are formed. How they phrase and how they shape each word, especially the endings of each word. Note the nasal sound of the a-ha's - typical of Alan.

The liner notes credit the lead vocal to Brian and Carl, but I think in this case "lead" means "featured" -- trading "featuring" between the verses and choruses. However the liner notes mistakenly label the orchestra bells as Glockenspiel, so can't always be trusted to get things correct.

This was a time when some choruses that are the same, were actually just recorded once and then copied and edited into the correct place. I can't recall about 'Mornin', but you should suspect that technique, i.e., Dennis

I'm certainly open to making mistakes and bad calls, so your analysis may have some merit. At any rate, although the song is not complex and even harmonically frugal, it is inarguably well structured.
 ~swd  


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 10, 2018, 05:05:32 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track. So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

 ~swd


That's why I brought it up. It wasn't meant in a sarcastic way.
Apart from the lead (obviously) I seem to hear Dennis on the Mike-part ("baby") and on the Carl-part ("my my my my my"). The Brian-part is difficult for me to say. It sounds vrey much like Brian but after the song is over and the same voice says "Let's hear that back" (or something along those lines) it could very well also be Dennis. I probably need to listen to it a couple more times.


On another note:
Is it correct that Murry is on "Be here in the morning"? I think that was mentioned in the liner notes of the Friends/20/20 twofer.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 10, 2018, 08:25:48 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track. So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

 ~swd


That's why I brought it up. It wasn't meant in a sarcastic way.
Apart from the lead (obviously) I seem to hear Dennis on the Mike-part ("baby") and on the Carl-part ("my my my my my"). The Brian-part is difficult for me to say. It sounds vrey much like Brian but after the song is over and the same voice says "Let's hear that back" (or something along those lines) it could very well also be Dennis. I probably need to listen to it a couple more times.


On another note:
Is it correct that Murry is on "Be here in the morning"? I think that was mentioned in the liner notes of the Friends/20/20 twofer.
COMMENT to Rocker:

Sorry Rocker, nothing personal. I appreciate your comment quoting me. That comment you made in BOLD was just me reacting to other posters who said I wasn't always right in my study-videos. It rubbed me the wrong way. I know it wasn't you, but made the comment as a broader response.

Although there is a disclaimer about accuracy in the study-videos, I make every effort to be accurate. The study-videos may bear my name, but more then myself is involved as the credits state. Each study-video is review by two historians, one has written several reference books and the other person is a professor of rock history. If they think further checking is needed, I will ask Alan or Bruce for their opinion. Many times fans believe they have the facts because they read it in a book, a book based on interviews of other people who claim to be in-the-know because they hung around the action -- but were not in the action. This "false news" becomes the base-line so that when the "real news" is stated, brings about an accuracy challenge.

When Dennis says to "hear it back" that's from the multi-track on one of the overdubs.

Murry could have sung in the background parts, but I cannot say one way or the other. He did visit Brian during the time of those sessions and has been known to insist on singing with them. But whether on that song or another, I can't say with certainty.


~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 11, 2018, 05:46:27 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track. So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

 ~swd


That's why I brought it up. It wasn't meant in a sarcastic way.
Apart from the lead (obviously) I seem to hear Dennis on the Mike-part ("baby") and on the Carl-part ("my my my my my"). The Brian-part is difficult for me to say. It sounds vrey much like Brian but after the song is over and the same voice says "Let's hear that back" (or something along those lines) it could very well also be Dennis. I probably need to listen to it a couple more times.


On another note:
Is it correct that Murry is on "Be here in the morning"? I think that was mentioned in the liner notes of the Friends/20/20 twofer.
COMMENT to Rocker:

Sorry Rocker, nothing personal. I appreciate your comment quoting me. That comment you made in BOLD was just me reacting to other posters who said I wasn't always right in my study-videos. It rubbed me the wrong way. I know it wasn't you, but made the comment as a broader response.




Yeah, I thought so. I just wanted to make sure that nothing I said offended anyone. All is good.

Thanks for the infos!
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 11, 2018, 06:32:43 AM
Quote
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.

COMMENT to Rocker:
Murry Wilson würde unangemeldet bei Aufnahmen auftreten. Sobald er ins Studio kam, würde Brian sich verkrampfen und seine kreativen Fähigkeiten würden schrumpfen. Aus Respekt würde Brian Murrys Dringlichkeit ertragen, dass er mit ihnen singt oder viele Vorschläge über die aufgenommene Musik macht. Murry war zu niemandem höflich. Jeder war glücklich, ihn gehen zu sehen. Wenn Sie Brian und seinen Vater zusammen sehen könnten, würden Sie ihre Liebe / Hass-Beziehung in Aktion sehen. Brian hatte den ganzen Erfolg, aber Murry wollte Kredit für alles. Ich schätze Brians Mutter, Audray, für seine freundliche Art. Sein Vater wollte alles kontrollieren, aber der Erfolg des Strandjungen kam in die Quere. Dies erzeugte die Spannung, die Brian überwinden wollte, aber aufgrund Murrys unruhiger Persönlichkeit nicht konnte. Gutes Hören
~ SWD


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 11, 2018, 07:20:15 AM
Quote
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.

COMMENT to Rocker:
Murry Wilson würde unangemeldet bei Aufnahmen auftreten. Sobald er ins Studio kam, würde Brian sich verkrampfen und seine kreativen Fähigkeiten würden schrumpfen. Aus Respekt würde Brian Murrys Dringlichkeit ertragen, dass er mit ihnen singt oder viele Vorschläge über die aufgenommene Musik macht. Murry war zu niemandem höflich. Jeder war glücklich, ihn gehen zu sehen. Wenn Sie Brian und seinen Vater zusammen sehen könnten, würden Sie ihre Liebe / Hass-Beziehung in Aktion sehen. Brian hatte den ganzen Erfolg, aber Murry wollte Kredit für alles. Ich schätze Brians Mutter, Audray, für seine freundliche Art. Sein Vater wollte alles kontrollieren, aber der Erfolg des Strandjungen kam in die Quere. Dies erzeugte die Spannung, die Brian überwinden wollte, aber aufgrund Murrys unruhiger Persönlichkeit nicht konnte. Gutes Hören
~ SWD



Not too bad, sir  ;D ;)
Thanks for that post. It must've been a strange situation to have Murry in the studio, especially after Brian and the Boys fired him.


And for some reason I really have to wonder what a session of Manson with Murry producing would have looked like. If it wasn't for the cruel murders, this kinda would make a great skit for SNL - can you imagine.... "Well, Charlie, you have a wonderful song here, but you need to sing from your heart"  :lol


- I hope this doesn't sound disrespectful to the victims of the murders


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 11, 2018, 12:07:12 PM
Quote
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.

COMMENT to Rocker:
Murry Wilson würde unangemeldet bei Aufnahmen auftreten. Sobald er ins Studio kam, würde Brian sich verkrampfen und seine kreativen Fähigkeiten würden schrumpfen. Aus Respekt würde Brian Murrys Dringlichkeit ertragen, dass er mit ihnen singt oder viele Vorschläge über die aufgenommene Musik macht. Murry war zu niemandem höflich. Jeder war glücklich, ihn gehen zu sehen. Wenn Sie Brian und seinen Vater zusammen sehen könnten, würden Sie ihre Liebe / Hass-Beziehung in Aktion sehen. Brian hatte den ganzen Erfolg, aber Murry wollte Kredit für alles. Ich schätze Brians Mutter, Audray, für seine freundliche Art. Sein Vater wollte alles kontrollieren, aber der Erfolg des Strandjungen kam in die Quere. Dies erzeugte die Spannung, die Brian überwinden wollte, aber aufgrund Murrys unruhiger Persönlichkeit nicht konnte. Gutes Hören
~ SWD



Not too bad, sir  ;D ;)
Thanks for that post. It must've been a strange situation to have Murry in the studio, especially after Brian and the Boys fired him.


And for some reason I really have to wonder what a session of Manson with Murry producing would have looked like. If it wasn't for the cruel murders, this kinda would make a great skit for SNL - can you imagine.... "Well, Charlie, you have a wonderful song here, but you need to sing from your heart"  :lol


- I hope this doesn't sound disrespectful to the victims of the murders
COMMENT to Rocker:  I was stationed in Deutschland for 3 years.

"Well, Charlie, you have a wonderful song here, but you need to sing from your heart." Manson replies, "Yea, well I have something for your heart if you don't shut the f-ck up !!"


 :-D  ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 11, 2018, 12:07:37 PM
:lol


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Jay on July 11, 2018, 09:24:39 PM
I think we're all going to hell for laughing at that one.  :lol


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Jay on July 11, 2018, 09:29:37 PM
While we're on the subject of BHITM, I have a question for Mr Desper(or whoever may know the answer). My question is regarding the line "Be Here and make my life full(or is it whole?)". The words "Be here and make my" are treated with a Leslie speaker sound effect, but the rest of the words are not. Was this a mistake in editing? Or was it intentional? I've been wondering about it for years.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 12, 2018, 12:06:46 AM
I think we're all going to hell for laughing at that one.  :lol

Sad part is, hell is only about three degrees warmer than Houston


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: c-man on July 12, 2018, 05:16:15 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track. So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

 ~swd


That's why I brought it up. It wasn't meant in a sarcastic way.
Apart from the lead (obviously) I seem to hear Dennis on the Mike-part ("baby") and on the Carl-part ("my my my my my"). The Brian-part is difficult for me to say. It sounds vrey much like Brian but after the song is over and the same voice says "Let's hear that back" (or something along those lines) it could very well also be Dennis. I probably need to listen to it a couple more times.


On another note:
Is it correct that Murry is on "Be here in the morning"? I think that was mentioned in the liner notes of the Friends/20/20 twofer.
COMMENT to Rocker:

Sorry Rocker, nothing personal. I appreciate your comment quoting me. That comment you made in BOLD was just me reacting to other posters who said I wasn't always right in my study-videos. It rubbed me the wrong way. I know it wasn't you, but made the comment as a broader response.




Yeah, I thought so. I just wanted to make sure that nothing I said offended anyone. All is good.

Thanks for the infos!
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.

That source was Carl Wilson, in his conversation with Geoffrey Himes (the full version, as printed in Kingsley Abbott's "Back to the Beach: A Brian Wilson & The Beach Boys Reader", page 250):  "My dad sang the big deep note on 'Be Here In The Morning'". Elsewhere (I believe it was either the 1974 BBC radio special, or the 1976 "Best Summers of Our Lives" radio special), Carl mentioned that Brian made the Friends album with Murry - on some of the session tapes I've been privileged to hear while researching the MIC sessionography, Murry is heard in the control room directing proceedings like in the "good old days".


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 12, 2018, 05:41:44 AM


That source was Carl Wilson, in his conversation with Geoffrey Himes (the full version, as printed in Kingsley Abbott's "Back to the Beach: A Brian Wilson & The Beach Boys Reader", page 250):  "My dad sang the big deep note on 'Be Here In The Morning'". Elsewhere (I believe it was either the 1974 BBC radio special, or the 1976 "Best Summers of Our Lives" radio special), Carl mentioned that Brian made the Friends album with Murry - on some of the session tapes I've been privileged to hear while researching the MIC sessionography, Murry is heard in the control room directing proceedings like in the "good old days".


Ah yes, then I'd read it in "Back to the beach" (btw, a very cool book, there should be another one imo). Thanks for the reminder!





COMMENT to Rocker:  I was stationed in Deutschland for 3 years.



May I ask, where you were stationed?


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 12, 2018, 07:47:11 AM
While we're on the subject of BHITM, I have a question for Mr Desper(or whoever may know the answer). My question is regarding the line "Be Here and make my life full(or is it whole?)". The words "Be here and make my" are treated with a Leslie speaker sound effect, but the rest of the words are not. Was this a mistake in editing? Or was it intentional? I've been wondering about it for years.
COMMENT to Jay:   I posted the words in an earlier posting (reply #17).  The Lesley effect was applied intentionally as indicated in the post. It was applied to the entire line, even though it may not sound like that. Could be that last word just happened to propagate from the Lesley speaker when it was in alignment with the microphone and thus sounds as if direct.  ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 12, 2018, 07:59:29 AM
They all of a distinctive ability to sound like each other if they really try to. All except for Dennis, I guess; he has the most different voice from the rest of them.



Not too fast, IIRC according to Stephen Desper this is all Dennis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHA65ZadrjM

COMMENT:   The A Cappella in the above clip from Hawthorne album was mixed by myself for my own pleasure. Some years later, BBI made copies from my tape and eventually it was released on this album.

The song is almost all Dennis Wilson singing. Some vocal sweeting was added later, but only a couple of voices toward the end.  I've recorded Dennis for years. I remember leaning over the harp of the nine-foot Baldwin Concert Grand Piano as Dennis played this song -- leaning over the harp so I could hear Dennis singing the song, to me, while looking me straight in the eyes. Just he and I in the studio for morning sessions. From thereon the song evolved with the addition of track after track. So don't tell me I can't recognise a vocal! You can collate all the comparative vocal sounds you wish and argue among yourselves. I was there, it is Dennis front to back.

 ~swd


That's why I brought it up. It wasn't meant in a sarcastic way.
Apart from the lead (obviously) I seem to hear Dennis on the Mike-part ("baby") and on the Carl-part ("my my my my my"). The Brian-part is difficult for me to say. It sounds vrey much like Brian but after the song is over and the same voice says "Let's hear that back" (or something along those lines) it could very well also be Dennis. I probably need to listen to it a couple more times.


On another note:
Is it correct that Murry is on "Be here in the morning"? I think that was mentioned in the liner notes of the Friends/20/20 twofer.
COMMENT to Rocker:

Sorry Rocker, nothing personal. I appreciate your comment quoting me. That comment you made in BOLD was just me reacting to other posters who said I wasn't always right in my study-videos. It rubbed me the wrong way. I know it wasn't you, but made the comment as a broader response.




Yeah, I thought so. I just wanted to make sure that nothing I said offended anyone. All is good.

Thanks for the infos!
Regarding Murry's participation, I was sure that it was written he sang on the song in the booklet of said twofer. But I just took a look and there's no mention of Murry. So now I don't remember where I heard about that and therefore I can not say how reliable that source is/was.

That source was Carl Wilson, in his conversation with Geoffrey Himes (the full version, as printed in Kingsley Abbott's "Back to the Beach: A Brian Wilson & The Beach Boys Reader", page 250):  "My dad sang the big deep note on 'Be Here In The Morning'". Elsewhere (I believe it was either the 1974 BBC radio special, or the 1976 "Best Summers of Our Lives" radio special), Carl mentioned that Brian made the Friends album with Murry - on some of the session tapes I've been privileged to hear while researching the MIC sessionography, Murry is heard in the control room directing proceedings like in the "good old days".

COMMENT:  Carl is an impeccable source for session events. His recall has always amazed me.

I attended and sometimes ran about 25% of the Friends, Wild Honey, and Smiley Smile sessions. Never saw Murry during those sessions. In other sessions where Murry did show up and presume to direct as in the "good old days," but after he left most, if not all, that was recorded while he was visiting was erased. This is not to discount what Carl said in the interview, but just letting you know how it was usually handled. Not everything you may have heard may have made it to mixdown.
  ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 12, 2018, 08:19:39 AM
Quote
May I ask, where you were stationed?

COMMENT:  The US Army has two Mothon Picture Studio facilities. A US operation New York City and the European operation in Kaiserslautern, southwestern Germany.

My MOS was as a Motion Picture Sound Man. I made training films, travel films, "The Big Picture" (a popular TV show of that time), and Congressional Reports. This took me all over Europe, but was always fond of Germany.

However the Germany of today is not the Germany of the '60s. But change is part of life.
  ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Kid Presentable on July 12, 2018, 08:52:21 AM
Ach, der Desper spricht Deutsch.  Schön. 

Ich habe den Beitrag von Rocker mit der Phrase ,Thanks for the infos' gesehen, und ich habe vermutet, dass er Deutscher ist.    :)


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 12, 2018, 11:33:36 AM
Ach, der Desper spricht Deutsch.  Schön. 

Ich habe den Beitrag von Rocker mit der Phrase ,Thanks for the infos' gesehen, und ich habe vermutet, dass er Deutscher ist.    :)

COMMENT to Kid Presentable:  Seine persönliche Seite zeigt, dass er in Deutschland lebt. Aber spricht gut Englisch. Dachte eine Antwort in seiner eigenen Sprache wäre klarer. ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: hideyotsuburaya on July 12, 2018, 11:35:01 AM
Herr Desper -

why do you place a tilde before your initials instead of over?


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: CenturyDeprived on July 12, 2018, 02:16:19 PM
Herr Desper -

why do you place a tilde before your initials instead of over?

Tilde I Die



Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 12, 2018, 02:49:54 PM
Herr Desper -

why do you place a tilde before your initials instead of over?

Tilde I Die



Awesome lol You win one free internet...

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3198/3129500936_d2f9c7afdc.jpg)


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: CenturyDeprived on July 12, 2018, 04:06:10 PM
Herr Desper -

why do you place a tilde before your initials instead of over?

Tilde I Die




Awesome lol You win one free internet...

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3198/3129500936_d2f9c7afdc.jpg)

 :lol 



Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: SMiLE Brian on July 12, 2018, 04:34:17 PM
I love Billy, CD, and others!


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on July 12, 2018, 04:50:22 PM
Anytime 👍


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 12, 2018, 05:05:15 PM
Herr Desper -

why do you place a tilde before your initials instead of over?

COMMENT to hideyotsuburaya:

A long time ago in 1873, two fellows named Sholes and Glidden came up with a keyboard layout, called the QWERTY in America, and sold it to Remington. Named after the first letters on the upper row of keys. They based their design, through years of trial and error, on which letters were used the most and what words were used the most. Mechanical typewriters require strong hands and fingers because all the energy use to impress the ink-coated ribbon to the paper comes from you, not a motor. So to facilitate speed typing with little hand fatigue an energy efficient layout was a good selling point.  

With the advent of electronic computers, finger strength was no longer a factor, but since folks had learned the QWERTY layout, that layout continued to be used.

It use to be that the tilde, placed on a little used key position – upper left – , was used to facilitate typing foreign words. What you did was type the letter, then backspace and retype the tilde over the letter. The same for the accent mark below it on the same key and the caret symbol above #6 key.

Now you can go to the symbol menu and select from hundreds of foreign words, and symbols. In modern computers the so-called tilde has been dropped down so that now it is actually used as a swing dash or wave dash. To find a tilde you must now go to the symbol menu.

This symbol “~” has many uses. In math, if placed above the equal sign, it means approximately equal. In the dictionary it is used as a pronunciation guide. In logic notation it means a negation.  

But you ask me why I use it.  I don’t use it as a tilde because it’s not above a letter.  I use it as an artistic expression when I “type" my name or initials in the electronic medium. I see it as sine wave or sinusoidal waveform, i.e., a smooth periodic oscillation … or one cycle or 1Hz. I see it as representing one cycle of a sound wave.

I thought . . . that little symbol is on my keyboard, I think I’ll use it before my name to represent that I’m connected with sound. I started using it a long time ago and, as I said, I took a little artistic freedom with the symbol and attached it to my name. And that's the story.
 ~swd


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 13, 2018, 05:00:39 AM


However the Germany of today is not the Germany of the '60s. But change is part of life.[/size]  ~swd



Yes, that's how it goes. I'm afraid though that, just as in seemingly every other western democracy, times are changing right now pretty fast - and not necessarily for the better if we are not very careful.
Anyway, I enjoyed the chat, thank you. Now to not spoil the thread, back to the Beach Boys.  :police:


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Magic Transistor Radio on July 13, 2018, 07:04:38 AM
I just want to say that I am amazed at how much the boys can sound alike. I remember when I discovered that there are 3 different lead vocals on I know There's an Answer. I can definitely tell, now that I know, but never would have guessed. I probably picked up on Mike at the beginning with Brian on the higher Parts, but Al in there so seamlessly is amazing. Be Here In the Morning is another as well as many others. To my ears, Al sounds more like Brian than even Carl. They switch leads on Take a Load Off Your Feet and California Saga so seamlessly. Compare the lead vocals of Help Me Rhonda and Wouldn't it Be Nice! Also, I know Brian sings Winter Symphony, yet at times I swear it's Al!


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: hideyotsuburaya on July 13, 2018, 08:29:01 AM
"This symbol “~” has many uses. In math, if placed above the equal sign, it means approximately equal. In the dictionary it is used as a pronunciation guide. In logic notation it means a negation.  "

for 'approximately equals' expression in math I've used just the equals sign, but curve both (parallel) lines, not place a tilde above a normal equals.  simpler


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: the captain on July 13, 2018, 08:38:08 AM
I just want to say that I am amazed at how much the boys can sound alike. I remember when I discovered that there are 3 different lead vocals on I know There's an Answer. I can definitely tell, now that I know, but never would have guessed. I probably picked up on Mike at the beginning with Brian on the higher Parts, but Al in there so seamlessly is amazing. Be Here In the Morning is another as well as many others. To my ears, Al sounds more like Brian than even Carl. They switch leads on Take a Load Off Your Feet and California Saga so seamlessly. Compare the lead vocals of Help Me Rhonda and Wouldn't it Be Nice! Also, I know Brian sings Winter Symphony, yet at times I swear it's Al!

Absolutely agree. And while it seems understandable enough that the brothers might sound similar, as you said sometimes it's Al, or Bruce, or even Mike who is sounding like one another or like a Wilson. Then when you add that they not only sound similar, but are often doubling one another or trading lines, it becomes almost an unsolvable puzzle sometimes.


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: CenturyDeprived on July 14, 2018, 09:26:27 AM
I love Billy, CD, and others!

Aw shucks, thanks SMiLE Brian!


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: Rocker on July 25, 2018, 06:08:24 AM
Just wanted to point out that C-Man mentioned Murry's involvement in "Be here in the morning" in the "'til I die"-thread:




Well...Mike's absent from a few Friends songs like "Little Bird", "Friends", "When A Man Needs A Woman", and "Be Here In The Mornin'" (his spot on the latter was filled by Murry). And on the Sunflower album, all of the vocals on "Forever" were reportedly sung by the Wilson brothers initially (then Mike was added in a few spots for the final mix), while on "Our Sweet Love", I just hear Brian, Carl, and Al. 


http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,26021.msg637997.html#msg637997


So, there we have some pretty solid information I'd say  :)


Title: Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question
Post by: stillwell on August 01, 2018, 07:57:23 AM
My ears have lied to me before, but I think the lead vocal on the verses of BHITM has been sped up a whole step. Slow it down so that the key drops a whole step, and it definitely sounds like Al. I believe all the other vocals and instruments on the official release are at original speed. (I feel like such a fool giving my opinion on a thread that Stephen Desper is involved in!) I've not met most of you here. I'm Jason from Oklahoma.