The Smiley Smile Message Board

I have it on extremely good authority that a Beach Boys session was held at Abbey Road studios yesterday, produced by Nick Patrick and Don Reedman. No members of the BBs were present, but in a similar fashion to the Arethra Franklin and Elvis Presley releases, the boys voices will be retracked with backing from the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra.

Yesterdays session was just for the percussion.

You heard it here first.

It's just a tragedy what's being done to the work of these artists. No matter if the Beach Boys will also get this treatment or not (I hope not!).

And a hologram of all of them ????

Sickening

Roy Orbison gets the whoe works this week...hologram and all the Orch. It barely enhanced Elvis to have tbe Orch " applied" to his works. I fear what Brians writings could become in the wrong hands in the future.

I don't understand. What's going on?

http://media.rhino.com/press-release/aretha-franklin-royal-philharmonic-orchestra-available-november-10-rhino

I'm actually looking forward to this although a little apprehensive. I've always enjoy seeing Mike & Bruce playing with orchestras.

Ya know, I don’t mind this idea if it’s done right. That BBC version of ‘God Only Knows’ (https://youtu.be/XqLTe8h0-jo) from a few years ago was a great glimpse into what Beach Boys songs could sound like done with more symphony-like arrangements. Not to mention the London Symphony Orchestra covering that same song (https://youtu.be/lIpVInJdQkQ).

For my Beach Boys Love album, I did a mashup of the Vitamin String Quartet’s cover of ‘You Still Believe In Me’ and the vocals from the actual song and it wasn’t half bad. Something like that done professionally could sound really good...especially with a full orchestra behind it.

And the Beatles very own Love album had a phenomenal overdub of strings on ‘While My Guitar Gently Weeps’ (https://youtu.be/FDLBBn9n6yw).

But I just listened to some tracks from Aretha Franklins version of this very project. The strings sound amazing but those drums/percussion just kill any organic flow those tracks have. I don’t get why they go to all the trouble of string arrangements when they just become overshadowed by some poorly mixed, plastic sounding drums. I am really hoping The Beach Boys version doesn’t sound as disjointed.

Hickory Violet, thanks much for the heads up about this!

So they're using the original BB vocals straight from the multitrack, a la Aretha... usually, the industry waits for the singers to be dead before attemping something like that. This is really the beginning of a new phase.

Maybe not yet the hologram

Ugh! These kinds of Frankenstein creations have become all the rage and, at least in the case of Elvis Presley, they sell reasonably well. I can't imagine anyone wanting to listen to a Beach Boys release like this but I'm continually proven wrong.  :-\

“ a Beach Boys session was held at Abbey Road studios yesterday......No members of the BBs were present”


Sad times, but I will search out the Aretha album on Spotify or the like for a listen.

Yeah, the more I listen to the Elvis and Franklin releases, the more I’m really disappointed in the idea of it. I really hoped it would be more artistically interesting, but those projects sound so bland and lifeless. What I hope to hear:

The Lonely Sea (4 string quartet, no drums)
Don’t Worry Baby (String section, heavy cello use, and French horns, no drums).
In My Room (violins plucking the intro riff, harp, a huge climax during the “laugh at yesterday” section, no drums)
I Get Around (heavy emphasis on the piano, have some violins play along with Brian’s falsetto, no drums)
Caroline, No (harpsichord, flute, basically what the Vitamin String Quartet did to this song only add the original instruments)
Etc

But we’ll probably end up getting a greatest hits package track list, there’ll be some cool moments in the symphony playing but you’ll be so distracted by a godawful sounding drums that you won’t even notice. But please prove me wrong.

The issue for me - conceptually AND aesthetically - is that Brian's original arrangements were PERFECT. Brian arranged those records in his 20's to where both heavily layered vocals and dense instrumentation and orchestration could coexist within their own sonic spaces in the final mix. There was a sympatico relationship between how the vocals and instruments blended to create *that sound* which everyone is still trying to figure out how did Brian do it consistently.

Messing with that in terms of grafting the original vocals onto modern orchestrations...you don't normally put a prime cut of filet mignon on a seeded bun, put ketchup and mustard on it, and call it a "burger".

If this is what BRI has in mind in terms of expanding the audiences and uses of the BB's music in a modern sense, count me out.

And there is also my pet peeve about trying to improve on a stone-cold classic record decades after the fact by "fixing" it, as Bruce and Mike tried to do by writing a new bridge to "Please Let Me Wonder" to replace Brian's instrumental break on the original, or even Brian and Joe redoing Let Him Run Wild with late 90's production flourishes. neither did a damn thing to improve the originals, in fact they actually effectively whitewashed what made the originals classic.

I personally don’t mind hearing new takes on songs, as long as they’re done right. The Beatles Love album for instance was a new take on those songs (though I do realize those were 99% reworked with original instrumentals), and in one case even had modern strings overdub an original (that sounds better than the original if you ask me). But that project was meticulously worked on by people who had a great artistic vision. And actually an even better example of this is Atticus Ross’ Love and Mercy soundtrack - I wouldn’t say he made things sound better but he put a new spin on ‘In My Room’ and ‘Til I Die’ that will forever be played on my system. Or take Boyd and Linnet’s take on ‘Sail Plane Song’ for the MIC release - I know that got hated on a bit, but to me it sounds fuckin awesome with those drums and reverb heavy vocals. So I really don’t mind it when someone with a good vision and an overall creative respect for the original work does a mashup or adds some strings to original vocals or tracks.

That being said, the differences between the projects I just mentioned and what we’ll likely be getting with this release are staggering. Those Franklin and Elvis projects just seem like a cookie cutter form of making easy money. No heart, no soul. I mean, with this project you’d think they’d invite Brian and Mike into the studio to consult and give ideas...maybe they will, but for some reason I doubt it. From what I heard, like Guitarfool says, it really is like putting a prime rib on a seeded bun. Again, prove me wrong though.

I don't really mind the added strings / orchestrations on those records, which are guilty pleasures of mine.

I do mind the re-recorded rhythm sections. They make the whole thing seem cheap.

I agree with rab's post, and there is a very fine line between what was done with The Beatles' "Love" project for one example, and what seems to be the goal of this current project if the Aretha project was a precedent to consider. With "Love", you had Giles Martin among other notables within the Beatles circle deeply involved in the project, and I think with an eye toward maintaining that high standard regarding the original recordings. That's why I think "Love" worked so well.

Also, considering the remixes and reimagining of the original tracks as done by Atticus Ross with L&M's soundtrack and Rab's own work (which is superb - have a listen! ) in creating sound collages out of existing audio, that is a different kind of goal and outcome (and vision) being presented versus what seems to be the outcome of this current project. Again, if the previous examples like the Aretha and Elvis projects are considered a template or even a precedent for what will be done with the BB's.

And I have to "go there" with one element in rab's post. Mike and Brian input into this? What input can or would Mike have in terms of the musical arrangements which would serve as the bed for the original vocals? We just heard what Mike does or wants to do with the original tracks, courtesy disc 2 of Unleash The Love with the BB's remakes, and most specifically Mike's Do It Again remake with McGrath and Stamos. It's a disaster, to be blunt. It felt like Mike's goal was to recast the BB's original recording legacy in the form of his current band, and do these songs as a means to Mike's end rather than something to help enhance or boost the *music* itself. It's blasphemy when a triggered sample of McGrath saying "do it" gets in the minds of listeners rather than the original recording, as much as when Forever becomes more of an Uncle Jesse song than a Dennis Wilson song...and that seems to be Mike's goal all along.

So maybe one benefit or bright spot is that Mike wasn't consulted on this if that's the case, because we can all easily hear what Mike's vision has been for decades regarding remaking and recasting Beach Boys classics to suit himself. I can picture a scene where Mike would want his band, featuring Stamos on drums or percussion, laying down tracks at Abbey Road while mcGrath stood at an old U47 in the vocal booth and improvised various grunts and groans while the orchestra played.

The Roy Orbison one sold ridiculously well in the UK - been in the Top 100 since release, spent 8 weeks in the Top 10, and is available in all the supermarkets.

Still I can't see a Beach Boys one having half as much promotion or sales.

Unless someone proves otherwise -- this could be BB original vocals cut over and supported by someone elses orchestral ideas. Unlikely to be a rocking surf sound or match let alone exceed BWs vision. It seems to be.....not Brian. Not the BB in any real sense except "old" vocals. Why would I waste money on this ?? My message is this ---  Brian is still alive. Mike is still alive. Record as much new stuff as you can....alone or together, but just do it.

Anybody can pay for the rights to record cover or tribute versions of any artist's work. Add strings, horns, bagpipes, whatever...and pursue that vision and goal.

But using the *original* vocals from the master tapes, grafted onto arrangements and orchestrations that the original arranger and composer is not involved with, though he's still alive? I don't see it.

And repeating my earlier example, a filet mignon on a bun with ketchup and mustard can be called a burger according to someone's vision, but who in their right mind would do that to a prime cut of beef that is best enjoyed in the specific way it should be served?

Agreed. Could it be any worse?

Brian write and arrange in advance, leave the wives distractions in the states, get together for a week, a few publiclty stills and get the hell out of there. No shows or tour.

Egos won’t allow it to happen but could do ok.

To Pretty Funky........I meant together or separately.......but no bullying

COMMENT:

Elevator background music in the making.  Cha-ching $$$ for Brian.  (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLudTR8vTFs).  ~swd

yes Stephen, regrettably yes

Yeah, and the Elvis ones (all three volumes) were smash hits.

Who's buying these things when the original recordings are sitting right there next to it on the shelf?
People who are so burnt out on the originals they they're trying to recapture the freshness they experienced the first time?
People who say "Y'know, Don't Be Cruel really could've used an oboe. I've said this all along and now I'm vindicated!"?
The people who bought those Hooked On Classics albums?   

(Lady in checkout line at Walgreens)

"Hey my husband loves The Beach Boys! Might as well surprise him with this!"

I have a feeling it may be Pet Sounds, or at least that makes sense to me.. Although what I want to see is a 2 disc release with Pet Sounds and highlights from Smile on disc 1 and hits and underrated classics on disc 2...

The only thing we know is that if any actual work is being done with the original, vintage recordings, it has been signed off on by presumably at least three of the four BRI board members.

Projects like this one, like the recent Orbison album (the album, not so much the tacky hologram tour), are mostly innocuous at worst. As with any side project targeted at the masses, if the idea is that these wide releases help fund/promote interest in more archival projects, then I'm all for it.

Unfortunately, as with countless hits packages, it never really works that way particularly. These other projects happen either independently of archival releases, or arguably *instead of* such releases.

But hopefully more archival stuff is being prepped separately from whatever might be going on with any off-shoot orchestra overdub album.

It *is* a bit weird to do such an album when many of the principals are still alive and still touring/recording (and when there is a TROVE of unreleased material in the archives including MANY game-changers in terms of quality). Orbison has been gone for 30 years and died young, and one could envision he may have done an orchestral album himself had he lived. So, while Orbison's estate also needs to open up his archives more, I cut such releases more slack when we lost out on 20-30 years of new potential Orbison albums. 

Also worth noting is that this project was and is apparently NOT a big secret. Patrick and Reedman mentioned working on a Beach Boys project to follow up on the Orbison and Aretha albums all the way back in this November 2017 interview:

http://www.soulandjazzandfunk.com/interviews/5157-a-brand-new-aretha-the-interview.html

For better or worse, most if not all of the surviving BBs/BRI members are probably easily talked into following up on a new trend like these orchestral overdub albums. I still think it's a bit creepy that they might be tracking this album in the same fashion as the Orbison album, essentially outsourcing the project as if the band members are deceased.

I can indeed make things sound a bit rinky if not done well. The Orbison album has a mixture of some vintage rhythm section elements (especially on the latter-era stuff like tracks produced by Jeff Lynne) along with some new, to mixed results. On something like Orbison's "A Love So Beautiful", the original backing track has very bombastic drums (recorded at a faster speed so they would sound extra bombastic when slowed down to original speed), so I can understand why they would not want to use those on a more delicate re-arrangement of the song.

The Orbison album is okay (I think the non-ballad songs sound pretty goofy with an orchestra generally speaking).

What I'm hoping the BB album either avoids or at least duplicates from the Orbison album is the use of modern singers to create "virtual duets." They did this with one Orbison track ("I Drove All Night"), and the duet version sounds pretty awful. However, they included two versions of the song, one with and one without the new singer. I appreciated that.

my own opinion is....if no new vocals or harmonies, I wont buy. Especially if no original BB is involved with the orchestral side