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Smiley Smile Stuff => General On Topic Discussions => Topic started by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 07:23:03 AM



Title: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - "I'm always blamed! It's horsesh*t!"
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 07:23:03 AM
Someone mentioned in another thread that there's a new interview or feature on Mike in the new issue of Mojo.

Anybody have this or care to post it?

I only have the one-line description from Mojo's website, which is intriguing if nothing else:

MIKE LOVE The unwilling villain of the Beach Boys story returns to right a few wrongs: “I’m always blamed. It’s horsesh*t!”


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: The LEGENDARY OSD on January 23, 2018, 09:03:42 AM
Mojo mentions "Mike Love Gets Angry".  :lol But he's always angry. Will this be a "pre-meditation" interview or will he just be his usual annoying self exclaiming loudly that I did this, I did that, or that was me along with the ever enticing ::) tape loop Beatles story? Readers beware of SOS.



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 10:22:07 AM
I have to admit, Mojo's one-line quote out of context does kind of sound like Tommy Wiseau from "The Room".....


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:13:23 AM
Holy s**t this new interview with Mike is pretty bad. Someone was kind enough to allow me to read it, and it's really just sad.

We're really getting back to early 2000s levels of sniping and negativity. I'll try to post some segments.

It's kind of a fluffy PR piece on Mike. Some good questions are asked. But they aren't followed up on, and some very softball "How are you so awesome?" type of questions are also asked.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:22:00 AM
Here Mike goes into C50. I have plenty of commentary on it, but it's interesting to note that even in this version of the story, it *IS* Mike deciding not to come back to the table and try to work out more reunion shows.

Note: On the first question, the "around that time" is in reference to the Jack Rieley early 70s era.

Around that time a strong alliance emerged,
it seems, between you and Al Jardine.


There was certainly a commonality of interest in
meditation; we were both certified as teachers
of TM in Majorca in 1972. And he was very into
the environment and nature, as I was. Intellectually,
we are very much in sync.

Has that alliance been severed?

Al is also very unhappy. And this leads to him
being very negative. I don’t miss that part. But I
am very fond of the fact that he is a great singer
and intellectually we have a lot in common. But
he is not particularly happy and he hasn’t always
treated people nicely. So I don’t miss that.


What happened at the end of The Beach
Boys’ 50th Anniversary tour [2012]? Is the
public perception different from the reality?


Oh, that’s for sure. It was said that I fired Brian
and Al. That’s horseshit, because I couldn’t fire
them if I wanted to. Contractually, everyone
obligated themselves to do a certain amount of
shows during the 50th Anniversary tour. The
original contract provided for 50 performances,
and although we agreed to add 23 shows, there
was still interest and opportunities out there.
I was already touring as The Beach Boys prior to
that, and I had a licence to tour as The Beach
Boys, and the licence was amended to provide
for the 50th Anniversary tour. So, part of the
amended licence, and part of the 50th
anniversary contractual agreements, obligated
me to continue on as The Beach Boys after the
tour. That was a literal obligation bestowed
upon me by the other shareholders – that’s
Brian, Alan, and the estate of Carl Wilson – they
wanted me to continue. So we received an offer
to perform in Israel as part of the 50th Anniversary
tour. It was quite lucrative. Before I had the chance
to even review the offer, Melinda Wilson responded
in an email and very clearly and succinctly said, “No
more shows for Wilson.” At that point there were
a ton of offers on the table
for my version of The Beach Boys, but we hadn’t
confirmed any of them at that point. So when
we received Melinda’s email saying, “No more
shows for Wilson,” we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do – we honoured
that email, we got on the phone with Terry
Rhodes of [concert agency] ICM and said, “It
looks like Brian’s done, we have to start booking
dates, as Mike’s Beach Boys are obligated
contractually to tour.” It’s very clear.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:24:38 AM
It takes balls to give the interview in this magazine and say it's *Al* who comes across as unhappy. I won't reprint everything, but Mike also goes into... wait for it.... that the Wilsons did drugs and Murry stole the songwriting credits, etc.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 23, 2018, 11:25:01 AM
Seatbelts on, buckle up - This ride will get bumpy.  ;D

Just so the ground rules are clear, if people start posting in replies to what Mike says in this piece, and they're not positive replies up to challenging some of Mike's statements, will that be dismissed as "Mike bashing"?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 23, 2018, 11:28:28 AM
Hmmmmmmmm.....

That's funny reading Mike's answer regarding C50. He doesn't mention risking overexposure (which was his original published "answer" back in Fall 2012), nor did he mention the tour losing too much money (which he, his author(s), and mouthpieces like Mott and that crew took as Gospel truth when that reason started to appear around the release of Mike's book).

So...it wasn't a case of the tour losing money, then? Or does he cite that one elsewhere in the interview? Just so we know.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:30:54 AM
On the "Love & Mercy" film:

So did you ever see [2014 Brian Wilson biopic] Love And Mercy?

No. See, with BRI, a majority vote carries the day. That’s one vote for Brian, Alan, and myself, and one vote split between Carl’s two sons, Justin and Jonah. The film people said they wanted our approval for the movie, but they would never show us a script, and they had things in the movie that I would hear about second hand, like something about how I didn’t like the bass part in Good Vibrations – what the f***? My melody is taken from the bass part! It’s just asinine and stupid to imply that. So we’re supposed to see a screening, but they pulled it on us because they no longer needed us. See, we [Love and his wife, Jacquelyne] were in Puerto Rico and Jonah called us and said, “Y’know, we don’t want to vote on the use of Beach Boys music in the film until you guys have seen it, and I told them they better get someone on a plane or Fed Ex a copy of it to you guys in Puerto Rico.” So we asked them to send us a secure electronic copy, and they wouldn’t do it. We asked them to send us a script, and they wouldn’t do it. So we explained we would alter our travel schedules and fly into Los Angeles after Puerto Rico and view the film. We said we’d be happy to alter our plans and see the film. A day before we were to fly to LA – they had set up a private screening for us – they pulled the private screening, because Jonah and Justin had given into the pressure Melinda had been applying and they no longer needed our vote to OK the use of The Beach Boys’ music. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:33:53 AM
It's been awhile since I watched "Love and Mercy." Did "Mike" in the film say he didn't like the bass part? I don't remember that, but as I said it's been awhile.

So we finally get the long-missing piece of the "they canceled our screening" story (which I had heard some time back), which is that Jonah and Justin FINALLY for once voted against Mike.

Given Mike's attitude towards a film he HASN'T seen, does anybody here think Mike would have EVER signed off on letting them use the music?

That's not even getting into Mike's hearty endorsement of the embarrassing 2000 Stamos-produced TV miniseries.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:36:36 AM
On the future....

Will you ever work with Brian and Al again?

There’s been no talk about that. We invited Alan and Brian to do the National Christmas Tree lighting thing with us [Washington, November 30], but we were told that Brian wasn’t available, and that Alan wasn’t going to come if Brian wasn’t there. So… Merry Christmas everybody!

Will you ever work with Brian and Al again?

Well… there’s been no discussion of any of that.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:38:32 AM
For a man your age to be working that hard (Mike gives MOJO the finger, then laughs), this can’t just be for the licence. You must still really enjoy this.

The way I feel about it, honestly, licence schmicence. BRI [Brother Records International] is the entity that owns the name The Beach Boys, who have licensed to me the name The Beach Boys for touring purposes. And it is just heinous and ridiculous, to make me the villain, while sending in how many million into BRI this year, and the years before? Certainly over 20 million bucks over the last several years.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:39:40 AM
Mike also mentions in the interview that, not surprisingly, it *was* BMG who asked him for the second disc of Beach Boys re-recordings on his solo album.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 11:45:51 AM
You’re still a big Brian Wilson fan...

Absolutely. Not for all the things he did to himself
and did to others, but for the fact that we bonded
so intensely on Everly Brothers, doo wop,
rock’n’roll, Four Freshmen, you name it. We’d get
kicked out of the house because my dad had to
get up so early to go to work, so we’d sit in his
Nash Rambler where the seats go back, turn on
the radio, and listen to KGFJ and the other R&B
stations. There is nobody who was closer, or who
bonded more over music, than Brian and I. And
nobody was better with a group of great
musicians than Brian. He was spontaneous, he
came up with brilliant ideas on the spur of the
moment. No one was better. Nobody.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: RubberSoul13 on January 23, 2018, 11:58:52 AM
He's really living in another world. I don't know how else to put it. He's still a fine frontman and typically has a fine voice (above average for a man in his late 70's). But wow...he's delusional.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Lee Marshall on January 23, 2018, 11:59:56 AM
 ::)   I'll just bite my tongue as 'he' offers up more evidence of why I have been right about him every inch of the way over these past coupla years...dating all the way back to 1966.   ::)   No need for me to call him any more names or point out any more of his shortcomings.   ::)   THIS time...I'll just sit back and let 'him' do the dirty work...all by himself.  ::)  He's certainly qualified, knows the subject matter, and enunciates 'it' all for people to see.   ::)


 :deadhorse


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: rab2591 on January 23, 2018, 12:08:39 PM
On the "Love & Mercy" film:

So did you ever see [2014 Brian Wilson biopic] Love And Mercy?

No. See, with BRI, a majority vote carries the day. That’s one vote for Brian, Alan, and myself, and one vote split between Carl’s two sons, Justin and Jonah. The film people said they wanted our approval for the movie, but they would never show us a script, and they had things in the movie that I would hear about second hand, like something about how I didn’t like the bass part in Good Vibrations – what the f***? My melody is taken from the bass part! It’s just asinine and stupid to imply that. So we’re supposed to see a screening, but they pulled it on us because they no longer needed us. See, we [Love and his wife, Jacquelyne] were in Puerto Rico and Jonah called us and said, “Y’know, we don’t want to vote on the use of Beach Boys music in the film until you guys have seen it, and I told them they better get someone on a plane or Fed Ex a copy of it to you guys in Puerto Rico.” So we asked them to send us a secure electronic copy, and they wouldn’t do it. We asked them to send us a script, and they wouldn’t do it. So we explained we would alter our travel schedules and fly into Los Angeles after Puerto Rico and view the film. We said we’d be happy to alter our plans and see the film. A day before we were to fly to LA – they had set up a private screening for us – they pulled the private screening, because Jonah and Justin had given into the pressure Melinda had been applying and they no longer needed our vote to OK the use of The Beach Boys’ music.  

Mike, while you’re eating your wheaties in the morning reading this board, I implore you to check out this website called Amazon.com. You can actually buy the Love and Mercy movie which has been released on Blu-ray since September of 2015 (what’s going on three years now). No need to pester Lionsgate or Bill Pohlad to get you a screening anymore.

Also, the “something how I didn’t like the bass part in Good Vibrations” complaint...it would actually help for you to watch the movie so you’re not basing your opinion on second hand information that you misinterpreted (or it was told to you wrong). Either way you’ll probably still hate the scene, but when talking about it to the media next time you’ll look like less of a misinformed ass.

It has been like a year since Mike did one of these angsty interviews. I really thought he had turned a new leaf and started acting like an adult for once. But I guess all that has flown out the friggin window. Sad thing is, most people will still continue to see a very bitter unappreciative person when they read these Mike Love interviews. And when Brian does his media stuff people will just see a mellow dude talking about music and Norbit. Newsflash Mike: this is why a lot of people can’t stand you. You made $20,000,000 for BRI last year, you are doing great financially for yourself, have a nice family, yet you complain like a child to the media about how hard it is to be Mike Love. Oh the humanity!

You’re still a big Brian Wilson fan...

Absolutely. Not for all the things he did to himself
and did to others


On this first part, he’s absolutely such a big fan that he listened to Brian’s ‘Right Time’ single and didn’t make a passive aggressive comment about autotune for an email interview....oh wait. On the second part of that quote: He’s gotta get those little jabs in doesn’t he? Does he think that Brian is happy with the drugs he took that shattered his mind? I mean, there is absolutely no reason for the “not for all the things he did to himself” line. It just wreaks of someone with a petulant obsession with needling people.

To those who give Mike the benefit of the doubt, can you please explain why this behavior doesn’t make you cringe? I mean I get that it’s probably annoying when people are constantly ragging on the guy - ok. But that doesn’t excuse the man for giving interviews like these.

Edit; thanks HeyJude for posting these excerpts.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
The "I make so much money for BRI" thing I've always found interesting and a great insight into his frame of mind. He thinks *he's* doing BRI a favor, when it's really the other way around. BRI allows him to use an *insanely valuable* trademark to label his tour with, and he really only has to pay a relatively small fee to do so.

Look at it this way: Who could do more without the other? Would Mike do as well touring as "Mike Love"? Or would BRI do as well giving the name to someone else?

I think a "Beach Boys" fronted by someone other than Mike would make more money than a solo "Mike Love" tour.

I'm surprised, apart from the group dynamics and whatnot, that on the corporate level Mike is being so antagonist to ALL THREE of the other BRI board members. Brian and his wife are dicks who Mike is willing to spite at the risk of tanking more reunion shows, Al is "unhappy", and Carl's sons are jerks for voting to allow the L&M film to use BB music.

Maybe some of those people should bring up this interview at the next board meeting....
 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 12:26:08 PM
Can someone explain to me what Mike's referring to here? What does this have to do with Carl?

As Brian’s ability to functionally lead The
Beach Boys faded, why didn’t Carl step up
and take over leadership of the band?


I think he did, to a degree, but he experienced
his own problems. There’s so much stuff that’s
salacious… we should have that conversation at
another time. Because you cannot imagine how
degenerate and depraved and disgusting the
whole thing became. It’s beyond disgusting.




Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 12:31:36 PM
I have to say that Mike pushes hard on getting really mean about Murry and the "Wilson Family" in general in this interview.

He continues to do this thing where, when it's convenient, he'll kinda point out that the Wilson brothers were victims of Murry and that their substance abuse was caused by needing to "self-medicate" the problems Murry caused them, but then he also wants to criticize the Wilson brothers directly too.

When Mike wants to point out how Murry wronged *Mike*, then he'll use Murry's abuse of the Wilson brothers to back it up. But when Mike wants to criticize the Wilson brothers, then he'll go after them.

There are a series of questions and answers about the Wilson family versus the Love family, with Mike talking about his own children and whatnot, and the whole thing just comes across as mean and cruel and unseemly. It has this vibe of "The Wilson family was and is f**ked up and it sucks to be them. My family is better."


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 12:34:46 PM
I think sometimes Mike's anger and unhappiness (as opposed to Al; when was the last time Al gave an "unhappy" interview?) blinds him to the simple idea that when he's talking about Murry, he *is* talking about Brian's father.

Does he stop and think that maybe Brian has mixed feelings about his Dad and it might just be a tad hurtful to read Mike talking s**t on him, about stuff that EVERYBODY already knows, and in the case of Mike's most ardent complaining (the songwriting lawsuit), was literally adjudicated in Mike's favor over 20 years ago.

For a guy who says he's all about TM, he sure seems really hung up on lost money from 50 years ago even though he lives a life of luxury (have you seen his house on Facebook? He needs a three-story ladder to decorate his Christmas tree!).


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 23, 2018, 12:38:21 PM
I've been accused on here and the Brian Wilson Forum of being a Mike Love apologist.   But, here are my comments on Mike's comments.  

C50: This is not the first mention I've seen about "No more shows for Wilson" email.  So, I don't find that to be very far fetched.   I think a whole book could be written on C50, and I still believe it's far too easy to put the full blame solely on Mike.  

Love and Mercy: While I think there's some validity to his story, the movie's a few years old at this point.   I'm sure it can be easily streamed.   One would think somebody at BRI would have a copy lying around.  So, come on Mike, people are going to keep asking you about the movie.  Take two hours and check it out.  Offer your opinion.   Frankly, at this point, I'd rather read Mike saying he thinks it's a dumpster fire than continually coming up with excuses for not seeing it.  

Working with Brian and Al: Interesting that Brian and Al were invited to the tree lighting.  There's more to that I think.  

On Brian Wilson: We all know about the drug use, and that Brian is no saint.  Just pay Brian the f**king compliment, Mike.  His statement about Brian was very complimentary, and it's good to hear Mike say that, but the first sentence almost negates it.  



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 12:52:34 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologists claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.

Regarding "Love & Mercy", Mike has a track record of going *out of his way* to NOT listen to/view/consume Brian's output. Back over a decade ago he admitted he hadn't listened to the 2004 "Smile." It's ironic that many of the things he has the biggest beef on are the things he *hasn't* actually seen/heard for himself. He sued in part over elements of the 2004 "Smile" project, and yet he didn't listen to the thing. Same thing with "The Right Time"; it's easier to take passive aggressive swipes at the thing if he hasn't heard it. Plausible deniability I guess.

Regarding the tree lighting show, I think by Mike's own stated business strategy as outlined in interviews he gave at the end of C50 in 2012, it would be pretty dumb to waste a "Beach Boys Reunion" on a one-shot, lip-synched event relegated to a b-grade cable TV channel, at an event with a scowling, unpopular political figure heading the event. Imagine if the Beatles had chosen to reunite in 1976 on a local cable access show in NYC, miming to Paul's solo re-recording of "I Want to Hold Your Hand." Huh?

As a semi-aside, I think Al has plenty of reason to stay away from guest spots with Mike's band. Al got fudged pretty badly in that infamous "Jones Beach 2014" debacle. Al has no reason to subject himself to that BS again, all for the sole purpose of, at best, getting Mike's gig a little more publicity.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 23, 2018, 01:05:32 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.  

The email seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind.  



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Pretty Funky on January 23, 2018, 01:06:18 PM
Hey Mike. Can you spare 4 minutes? GV scenes from the movie.

https://youtu.be/noH3E5EAnDs

https://youtu.be/_GLnLUWwc7I

....and I didn’t know BRI forced you to generate income for them? Cry me a river!  :p


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 01:17:52 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.   

The final seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind. 



No, I'm not reading it like that.

Mike says in the interview:

we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do


This indicates to me that Mike believes Melinda and Brian would have been open to discussion if he had come back to the table to try to discuss it. And all of this is just assuming that Mike's interpretation and recounting of Melinda's e-mail is accurate.

Mike is saying he went out of his way to NOT come back to them with the one sentence that just about ALL fans wanted someone to say, which is: "What are you thinking? We should continue to do this!"

That Mike knows what he could have done to make the reunion continue but *didn't* do because he didn't want to give Melinda the response *he* thinks *she* was hoping for, makes Mike come across as a big of a jerk as he wants us to think Melinda is, and by Mike's own words continues to paint him as the guy who refused to discuss it further and started booking his own shows, which would then in turn give him an *even easier* excuse to not do more reunion shows (hey, I have my own shows booked now!).

If Mike had wanted the reunion to continue, he had about 37 easy avenues to make that happen. He chose not to, and to his (relative) credit, confirms this in his new interview.

Now, all that being said, I highly doubt Melinda was just trying to jerk Mike around with some sort or reverse psychology, trying to nefariously get Mike to grovel. I think at some point they sent that e-mail, and then changed their minds, and Mike, who had likely *already* long ago decided not to continue (as evidenced by his litany of complaints in his book), took that further step of not even trying to work something out for more shows.

I also question the details of what specific obligations Mike has to BRI about booking shows. I'm not quite convinced he HAD to IMMEDIATELY start booking shows on his own.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 23, 2018, 01:21:10 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.   

The final seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind. 



No, I'm not reading it like that.

Mike says in the interview:

we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do


This indicates to me that Mike believes Melinda and Brian would have been open to discussion if he had come back to the table to try to discuss it. And all of this is just assuming that Mike's interpretation and recounting of Melinda's e-mail is accurate.

Mike is saying he went out of his way to NOT come back to them with the one sentence that just about ALL fans wanted someone to say, which is: "What are you thinking? We should continue to do this!"

That Mike knows what he could have done to make the reunion continue but *didn't* do because he didn't want to give Melinda the response *he* thinks *she* was hoping for, makes Mike come across as a big of a jerk as he wants us to think Melinda is, and by Mike's own words continues to paint him as the guy who refused to discuss it further and started booking his own shows, which would then in turn give him an *even easier* excuse to not do more reunion shows (hey, I have my own shows booked now!).

If Mike had wanted the reunion to continue, he had about 37 easy avenues to make that happen. He chose not to, and to his (relative) credit, confirms this in his new interview.

Now, all that being said, I highly doubt Melinda was just trying to jerk Mike around with some sort or reverse psychology, trying to nefariously get Mike to grovel. I think at some point they sent that e-mail, and then changed their minds, and Mike, who had likely *already* long ago decided not to continue (as evidenced by his litany of complaints in his book), took that further step of not even trying to work something out for more shows.

I also question the details of what specific obligations Mike has to BRI about booking shows. I'm not quite convinced he HAD to IMMEDIATELY start booking shows on his own.

OK, fair points.  But if you ask me, the blame should lie with the originator of that email.   For had that email not been sent, who knows what would've happened? 

Like you said, I highly doubt Melinda would've sent the email if she wanted Mike to come back and say "oh no, Melinda, please lets's do more shows." 

Neither side really comes out smelling like roses if you ask me. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 01:27:37 PM
It's worth noting that in *Mike's retelling* of the story, neither side comes out looking good. We haven't even really heard Brian or Melinda's side specifically concerning that alleged e-mail.

Given what we know about what went on during the tour, and Mike's own statements in interviews and his own book, I think this alleged Melinda e-mail had ZERO to do with the demise of the reunion and reunion tour.

I suppose it gave Mike a potentially easier "out" for explaining why he wasn't trying to work out more reunion shows. I think Mike's "explanations" for the demise of the tour have continued to shift. His LA Times letter has one set of reasons, his subsequent interviews reiterated some of those reasons and then offered some alternates, and then in his book he went through yet another list of complaints.

But at no point has he expressed either directly or passively that he was all-in to continue the reunion, only to then receive Melinda's e-mail. As is the case with a number of his "reasons" for the reunion ending, I think it boils down to him not liking Melinda and not liking possibly making less money, and then developing a bunch of other reasons/minor complaints that don't actually matter much or at all, to try to back up his decision. (Too many musicians on stage, the "autotune phantom" episode, "giving it a rest" in order to "build up demand", etc.).


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Jay on January 23, 2018, 01:40:15 PM
I try my damnedest to like the guy, I really do. Then he does sh*t like this. *sigh*


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: rab2591 on January 23, 2018, 02:03:21 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.   

The final seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind. 



No, I'm not reading it like that.

Mike says in the interview:

we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do


This indicates to me that Mike believes Melinda and Brian would have been open to discussion if he had come back to the table to try to discuss it. And all of this is just assuming that Mike's interpretation and recounting of Melinda's e-mail is accurate.

Mike is saying he went out of his way to NOT come back to them with the one sentence that just about ALL fans wanted someone to say, which is: "What are you thinking? We should continue to do this!"

That Mike knows what he could have done to make the reunion continue but *didn't* do because he didn't want to give Melinda the response *he* thinks *she* was hoping for, makes Mike come across as a big of a jerk as he wants us to think Melinda is, and by Mike's own words continues to paint him as the guy who refused to discuss it further and started booking his own shows, which would then in turn give him an *even easier* excuse to not do more reunion shows (hey, I have my own shows booked now!).

If Mike had wanted the reunion to continue, he had about 37 easy avenues to make that happen. He chose not to, and to his (relative) credit, confirms this in his new interview.

Now, all that being said, I highly doubt Melinda was just trying to jerk Mike around with some sort or reverse psychology, trying to nefariously get Mike to grovel. I think at some point they sent that e-mail, and then changed their minds, and Mike, who had likely *already* long ago decided not to continue (as evidenced by his litany of complaints in his book), took that further step of not even trying to work something out for more shows.

I also question the details of what specific obligations Mike has to BRI about booking shows. I'm not quite convinced he HAD to IMMEDIATELY start booking shows on his own.

OK, fair points.  But if you ask me, the blame should lie with the originator of that email.   For had that email not been sent, who knows what would've happened? 

Like you said, I highly doubt Melinda would've sent the email if she wanted Mike to come back and say "oh no, Melinda, please lets's do more shows." 

Neither side really comes out smelling like roses if you ask me. 

One thing about this email, I know Doe touts this one line to nauseating degrees, and I have no doubt the validity of the email. But I would just love to know if there were further emails that were sent before or after between the two camps. I mean, we get this convenient one liner, but like everything else in the fandom, it can’t be all black and white.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 23, 2018, 02:11:56 PM
I also think the timing of the alleged e-mail would be important. How far along the tour was it? Which offers were on the table before and after? Did Mike truly have no bookings planned prior to the e-mail? (Remember, rumors leaked pretty early into the tour that non-reunion South American dates were being booked for the Mike/Bruce show). When did Brian/Melinda express a desire to continue?

It looks like rumors started in mid-June of 2012 (less than two months into the tour, and over three months before its conclusion) that Mike/Bruce were booking South America shows for after the reunion. I can only find evidence of two *canceled* Mike/Bruce shows for late October of 2012 in South America.

Remember this: Despite numerous mentions of the e-mails, Mike has NEVER said either directly or indirectly that, had that e-mail not arrived, he would have continued the reunion for any length of time let alone in perpetuity. Indeed, his book details a litany of reasons he almost quit the tour before it started and/or during the tour. So it has never been a case of Mike saying "Everything seemed fine, and then out of the blue Melinda sent an e-mail."

If anything, it seems Brian and Al, whether it sprung from naivety or something else, seemed to be the ones surprised by Mike bailing.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SMiLE Brian on January 23, 2018, 02:48:47 PM
Mike made up for last year with "Quality" instead of "quantity"  interviews..... >:D


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Rick5150 on January 23, 2018, 02:51:43 PM
So we finally get the long-missing piece of the "they canceled our screening" story (which I had heard some time back), which is that Jonah and Justin FINALLY for once voted against Mike.

I am not clear on this. Did Jonah and Justyn vote against Mike, or were their votes enough of a majority where Mike's vote would not make a difference so he didn't have to bother? It seems to me that if there were time constraints and Mike was dragging his feet, they had every right to vote however they wanted.

Anyone know how Justyn and Jonah get along with Uncle Brian?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SMiLE Brian on January 23, 2018, 02:53:22 PM
I try my damnedest to like the guy, I really do. Then he does sh*t like this. *sigh*
Well said Jay....


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: urbanite on January 23, 2018, 05:34:57 PM
When Melinda Wilson sends Mike Love an e-mail that says no more shows for Wilson, Mike Love is supposed to know she/Brian doesn't mean it?  Is Mike Love supposed to think, based on that e-mail, that Brian really wanted to do more shows.  Why did Melinda send Mike that e-mail?  Has anyone ever asked her that question?  I would ask her, when the 50th anniversary tour started to fall apart and went public, why didn't you or Brian call Mike and try to fix things and lay the groundwork for some more shows.

I am no fan of Mike Love, but on this issue he has a point.  If this is an example of what Melinda Wilson is like to deal with, there's probably some other equally stupid things she did during the tour that irritated some of the band.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: willmansell on January 23, 2018, 05:55:11 PM
I can understand how difficult a dynamic it must be between the remaining BB, Brian and Melinda. When Brian is probably quite happy to think about music and creativity and go with the flow, the organisational reality seems to be left to either the BB or Melinda - both of whom have different points of view.

I'm starting to think though, about all the resentment we put down in writing towards and about Mike Love. Now I've bashed as much as anyone, but is it worth it? Does it make us as bad as Mike and this article in Mojo? Whilst we argue that Mike can't understand or appreciate Brian and the Beach Boy's legacy, we also must see as outsiders that we can't understand their own family dynamic. And if anything, to me the way Mike acts shows a need for sympathy not apathy. After all, living with that much unhappiness and built up resentment for so long wouldn't be nice for anyone. Just my thoughts.



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: mtaber on January 23, 2018, 06:27:58 PM
I don't "know" Mike Love.  I don't "know" Brian Wilson or his wife, or Al, or anyone in the band personally.  It's hard enough for me to try to figure out the people I actually DO know personally, much less trying to get a handle on celebrities that I only know from a distance.  All I can say is that Mike doesn't seem to realize that he comes across as the "villain" due, in large part, to his attitude in interviews such as this one.  He comes across as a total ass.  If I had to bet, I'd say that's what he is.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 23, 2018, 06:39:26 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.   

The final seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind. 



No, I'm not reading it like that.

Mike says in the interview:

we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do


This indicates to me that Mike believes Melinda and Brian would have been open to discussion if he had come back to the table to try to discuss it. And all of this is just assuming that Mike's interpretation and recounting of Melinda's e-mail is accurate.

Mike is saying he went out of his way to NOT come back to them with the one sentence that just about ALL fans wanted someone to say, which is: "What are you thinking? We should continue to do this!"

That Mike knows what he could have done to make the reunion continue but *didn't* do because he didn't want to give Melinda the response *he* thinks *she* was hoping for, makes Mike come across as a big of a jerk as he wants us to think Melinda is, and by Mike's own words continues to paint him as the guy who refused to discuss it further and started booking his own shows, which would then in turn give him an *even easier* excuse to not do more reunion shows (hey, I have my own shows booked now!).

If Mike had wanted the reunion to continue, he had about 37 easy avenues to make that happen. He chose not to, and to his (relative) credit, confirms this in his new interview.

Now, all that being said, I highly doubt Melinda was just trying to jerk Mike around with some sort or reverse psychology, trying to nefariously get Mike to grovel. I think at some point they sent that e-mail, and then changed their minds, and Mike, who had likely *already* long ago decided not to continue (as evidenced by his litany of complaints in his book), took that further step of not even trying to work something out for more shows.

I also question the details of what specific obligations Mike has to BRI about booking shows. I'm not quite convinced he HAD to IMMEDIATELY start booking shows on his own.

OK, fair points.  But if you ask me, the blame should lie with the originator of that email.   For had that email not been sent, who knows what would've happened? 

Like you said, I highly doubt Melinda would've sent the email if she wanted Mike to come back and say "oh no, Melinda, please lets's do more shows." 

Neither side really comes out smelling like roses if you ask me. 

One thing about this email, I know Doe touts this one line to nauseating degrees, and I have no doubt the validity of the email. But I would just love to know if there were further emails that were sent before or after between the two camps. I mean, we get this convenient one liner, but like everything else in the fandom, it can’t be all black and white.

I agree.  There are still a lot of questions.  Too many to really put sole blame on either ML.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 23, 2018, 06:41:57 PM
When Melinda Wilson sends Mike Love an e-mail that says no more shows for Wilson, Mike Love is supposed to know she/Brian doesn't mean it?  Is Mike Love supposed to think, based on that e-mail, that Brian really wanted to do more shows.  Why did Melinda send Mike that e-mail?  Has anyone ever asked her that question?  I would ask her, when the 50th anniversary tour started to fall apart and went public, why didn't you or Brian call Mike and try to fix things and lay the groundwork for some more shows.

I am no fan of Mike Love, but on this issue he has a point.  If this is an example of what Melinda Wilson is like to deal with, there's probably some other equally stupid things she did during the tour that irritated some of the band.

All good questions


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Chocolate Shake Man on January 23, 2018, 06:54:54 PM
When Melinda Wilson sends Mike Love an e-mail that says no more shows for Wilson, Mike Love is supposed to know she/Brian doesn't mean it?

What evidence is there that, at the time, she didn't mean it other than Mike Love's assumption that she was being passive aggressive?

Interestingly enough - and I could be wrong here - but the only person who has put forth the notion that she didn't mean it is Mike Love himself. So while you ask, "how was Mike Love supposed to know," his own words suggest that at the time he outright believed that she didn't mean it. So maybe that's a good question for Mike Love - what made you think she didn't mean it?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: rab2591 on January 23, 2018, 06:58:31 PM
I don't "know" Mike Love.  I don't "know" Brian Wilson or his wife, or Al, or anyone in the band personally.  It's hard enough for me to try to figure out the people I actually DO know personally, much less trying to get a handle on celebrities that I only know from a distance.  All I can say is that Mike doesn't seem to realize that he comes across as the "villain" due, in large part, to his attitude in interviews such as this one.  He comes across as a total ass.  If I had to bet, I'd say that's what he is.

This. I don’t know every in and out of the tumultuous relationship that Mike and Brian have. But you don’t really need to examine the relationship in great detail to conclude that the lies told in the 2005 lawsuit about Brian Wilson are not told by someone who needs any sympathy.

The last few months I’ve had a slight change of attitude about how I post, because I do want to see this place more focused on the music and less on Mike Love’s character. So I’m gonna bow out here now, and conclude that I really hope Mike will look back on the past year of pretty tasteful interviews and see that such mellow behavior is what is best for his image and the fandom. He just released an album, he tours with what a lot of people call a great sounding band, he has got financial security for he and his family (something that much of the world doesn’t have), he has his name on some of the most beautiful music ever recorded. Dude needs to chill out and breathe some fresh air for a while.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 23, 2018, 07:03:14 PM
The only question that needs to be asked regarding the "no more Wilson" email is what email(s) came before that one in the email chain.

Ask Mike that one. Hell, ask anyone involved that one. Until that question is answered, the email that has been waved in our collective faces by Doe and now by Mike himself is meaningless without context.

And I'll repeat again, what happened to the reason Mike and others around him gave when his book came out, that C50 was "losing money"? Ask that too.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: tpesky on January 23, 2018, 07:10:54 PM
So if said email was sent and intentions were clear, wasn't that earlier on in the tour? Brian and/or Melinda couldn't have changed their minds? He got more an more into the tour as time went on.  Mike said nope sorry you sent an email, can't go back on it now. No more shows for Wilson. No give backs!


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 23, 2018, 07:12:53 PM
The only question that needs to be asked is what came before that email.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SMiLE Brian on January 23, 2018, 07:23:43 PM
#releasetheemails... 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 23, 2018, 08:35:31 PM
Regarding C50, I don't believe anybody has called the e-mail into question. What I and others have long contended, and Mike surprisingly *confirms* in this new interview, is that he clearly knew that if he had *come back* to Brian and Melinda and tried to work out more bookings (Mike also confirms offers were on the table; remember when some now-departed Mike apologies claimed there maybe were none?) or follow up in some fashion, they could have continued the reunion tour.

So he admits that he was engaging in a pissing contest and rather than sucking it up for the greater good, he balked and scheduled his own shows.

I of course believe he's also leaving a TON of other factors out, about how he just doesn't like Melinda, about how he would probably make more money touring with his own edition of the tour, and so on. He doesn't even proffer his old standby reasons used in his 2012 LA Times article nor those found in his own book.


It seems to me that in this case, Mike didn't want to engage in a pissing contest with Melinda.  

The final seemed pretty final, and perhaps Mike figured it wasn't worth trying to change Melinda's mind.  



No, I'm not reading it like that.

Mike says in the interview:

we didn’t go back to them
and ask, “Oh my God, what are you thinking? We
should continue to do this” – which is what I
think they hoped we would do


This indicates to me that Mike believes Melinda and Brian would have been open to discussion if he had come back to the table to try to discuss it. And all of this is just assuming that Mike's interpretation and recounting of Melinda's e-mail is accurate.

Mike is saying he went out of his way to NOT come back to them with the one sentence that just about ALL fans wanted someone to say, which is: "What are you thinking? We should continue to do this!"

That Mike knows what he could have done to make the reunion continue but *didn't* do because he didn't want to give Melinda the response *he* thinks *she* was hoping for, makes Mike come across as a big of a jerk as he wants us to think Melinda is, and by Mike's own words continues to paint him as the guy who refused to discuss it further and started booking his own shows, which would then in turn give him an *even easier* excuse to not do more reunion shows (hey, I have my own shows booked now!).

If Mike had wanted the reunion to continue, he had about 37 easy avenues to make that happen. He chose not to, and to his (relative) credit, confirms this in his new interview.

Now, all that being said, I highly doubt Melinda was just trying to jerk Mike around with some sort or reverse psychology, trying to nefariously get Mike to grovel. I think at some point they sent that e-mail, and then changed their minds, and Mike, who had likely *already* long ago decided not to continue (as evidenced by his litany of complaints in his book), took that further step of not even trying to work something out for more shows.

I also question the details of what specific obligations Mike has to BRI about booking shows. I'm not quite convinced he HAD to IMMEDIATELY start booking shows on his own.

OK, fair points.  But if you ask me, the blame should lie with the originator of that email.   For had that email not been sent, who knows what would've happened?  

Like you said, I highly doubt Melinda would've sent the email if she wanted Mike to come back and say "oh no, Melinda, please lets's do more shows."  

Neither side really comes out smelling like roses if you ask me.  

One thing about this email, I know Doe touts this one line to nauseating degrees, and I have no doubt the validity of the email. But I would just love to know if there were further emails that were sent before or after between the two camps. I mean, we get this convenient one liner, but like everything else in the fandom, it can’t be all black and white.
i'm still trying to figure out why Melinda referred to her husband as "Wilson". I don't refer to my wife as "Castillo". Just seems odd, and not plausible. Not really buying it.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Rocky Raccoon on January 23, 2018, 11:45:37 PM
I imagine that email was sent from a member of Brian’s management team and Mike just assumed or misremembers it as being from Melinda.  Could have been a an error in communication.  He does seem to hold a weird grudge against her, especially judging from his memoir.  I find it especially odd that Mike would take a fragmented sentence email at its word and nobody brought up adding more tour dates afterwards?  Did these people not talk to each other once they left the stage?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SurfRiderHawaii on January 24, 2018, 12:23:18 AM
I am probably wrong about this but it was my understanding that the email was sent during the first
group of shows.  Brian's back was really bothering him.

Then he had some treatment and he felt better, more shows were added. And then Brian wanted to do even more but Mike put the kabash on that.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Zesterz on January 24, 2018, 01:31:16 AM
SurfRider hits the nail on the head. Easily the most plausible sequence of events and logical cause of confusion


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Amy B. on January 24, 2018, 05:35:39 AM
Yes, there could have been any number of reasons why Melinda or Brian's management sent that email. Maybe Brian wasn't feeling well (physically or mentally) and was refusing to do any more shows, so someone sent the email. (Then Brian later felt better and changed his mind.) Maybe there was an argument or incident between Brian's camp and Mike's camp that led Brian's camp to decide they'd had enough. Why assume it was Melinda playing games? Maybe it was, but there's a possibility it wasn't. 

If we're to believe Mike, he got that email out of the blue. The weird thing is, why, upon receiving it, he didn't follow up and ask what the problem was, rather than go ahead and book shows without Brian? If my estranged cousin makes dinner plans with me and abruptly sends an email saying "Not going," I would reply to ask if everything is OK, especially if my cousin has health problems and a history of not wanting to go out to dinner! I don't just say to myself, "OK, I'll find someone else to have dinner with."

If you're going to tour with Brian Wilson (even taking Melinda out of the equation), you have to expect some unpredictability. That's why I think there's some context to that email that Mike's not revealing. Maybe, as some are speculating, "No more shows for Wilson" was in reply to an email from Mike's camp.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: The LEGENDARY OSD on January 24, 2018, 06:19:37 AM

I'm going with Amy that Melinda was not a game player in the least especially with something like this. And frankly, if myKe luHv's memory at age 76 is anything like mine is, we can all rest assured that it wasn't her that sent that email.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Tony S on January 24, 2018, 06:31:27 AM
Typical Mike Love speak, Agree 100% with Amy.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 06:34:47 AM
As far as I'm concerned, considering how critically *and* commercially successful the tour was, if ANYONE had sent an e-mail, even if the e-mail said "F**k you, eat s**t, we're not doing any more shows! Period, Mother****er!", anybody on the receiving end of that message should have followed up with something along the lines of "But the tour is really successful and it would be crazy to stop now. What's going on? Are you okay? What can we do to work on things and make this better?"

Some of the now-departed "insiders" who trumpeted the infamous "e-mail" indicated as I recall that the one e-mail was out of the blue and had no context. As in, they were just blindsided with a random e-mail saying literally "no more shows for Wilson." This has always sounded preposterous, but if it *is* true, Mike hasn't indicated he did any follow up. He hasn't said he asked if Brian was okay (geez, what if the e-mail meant Brian was terminally ill or something?). No, by Mike's own words, he assumed it was some weird passive-aggressive message from Melinda trying to bait Mike into groveling.

So, to the earlier question of "How is Mike supposed to know what Melinda meant?", I have two answers. One, as others have stated, is that Mike's interview indicates Mike had a really strong idea of what he thought Melinda meant or at least what she wanted Mike's reaction to be. Secondly, Mike could have asked for a clarification. Instead, by Mike's own account, his reaction was to immediately get his tour booking guy on the phone and start booking Mike/Bruce shows.

Let it ALSO be known that Al Jardine nearly BEGGED Mike to come back to the table to discuss more reunion shows and was apparently ignored, insofar as actually attempting to do more shows. Al describes pulling Mike aside at that Grammy Museum event in September of 2012 and asking Mike to discuss it further. Obviously nothing ever came of that.

Mike most conveniently leaves out *any* of the timing of these e-mails and show offers, and fails to mention if, at some point after that e-mail, Brian and/or Melinda came back to him wanting to do more shows.

But let's not fool ourselves. By the final dates, Mike knew he wasn't going back to the reunion and also knew that Brian and Al wanted to continue the reunion. Al had implored Mike back at the Grammy Museum, and I highly doubt Brian's letter to the LA Times was the first Mike heard of Brian wanting to do more shows.

Further, if you read Mike's LA Times letter, nowhere does he mention the infamous e-mail, and nowhere does he indicate that Brian ever expressed that he (Brian) didn't want to do more shows. Mike's LA Times letter seems to acknowledge that it was Mike's decision to break the reunion up. Remember Mike's reasons in that letter? He claimed "vital smaller markets" couldn't afford the reunion tour. What does THAT have to do with whether Brian wanted to do more shows? Mike's LA Times letter reads like "Yeah, I split. Here are a bunch of reasons why." Of course, this is where we started to hear his manta of "Set end date", which was perhaps (in my opinion) the most disingenuous and obfuscating reason being offered (essentially "it ended because it ended").  


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Juice Brohnston on January 24, 2018, 06:54:13 AM
I don't think there is any mystery why C50 ended. Mike probably realized his leaner touring outfit was more profitable to him, and he could control it completely, and be the main attraction. All the other stuff is him offering justification.

I like Mike, but I wish that he would have got some closure when his book was published. Retelling these stories over and over is pretty weak. If it comes up, just say 'I dealt with it in my book, I wish Brian all the success and happiness in the world, and I love doing what I'm doing!'


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 07:18:19 AM
I'm just wondering if maybe it's these interviewers getting Mike going again. I'm not blaming that on interviewers, that would be on Mike for how he interprets it.

But maybe every time an interviewer brings up the same stuff, it gets Mike going again. You can literally see this happening in that Rolling Stone piece from a year or two ago.

Here's a key excerpt from that Rolling Stone piece:

What else? Has there been one thing, above all others, that's required meditation to cope with?

His blue eyes darken to gunmetal gray, and the bristles of his beard nearly stand up and quiver. "Yeah," he says. "The major one of those things is being cheated."

Ah, yes, that, of course. It goes way back to the start. Thanks to the Wilson brothers' father, Murry, who was an abusive, conniving piece of work, as well as the Beach Boys' first manager, Love's name didn't make it onto the publishing credits for many of the early hit songs. For instance, on "Wouldn't It Be Nice," Love says he was responsible for the ending couplet "Good night, baby/Sleep tight, baby," not an earthshaking contribution but significant nonetheless, as were the lines that he wrote for "409": "She's real fine, my 409" and "Giddy-up, giddy-up, 409." And so on, with many other songs, including "California Girls," "Help Me, Rhonda" and "I Get Around."

Brian apparently knew what his father was up to but was too scared of him to do anything about it (Brian Wilson declined to comment for this story). Even so, Love seems to blame both of them, although, on occasion, he does acknowledge how cowed Brian was by his dad. And it doesn't seem to have helped that in 1993, long after Murry's death, Love successfully sued Brian for back songwriting credits, got his name appended to some 35 of the songs, and was awarded at least $2 million in back royalties. The whole thing still pisses him off. And once he gets started on it, there's no stopping him.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 07:20:14 AM
Another keen insight from the Rolling Stone article:

But far from suing Brian at every opportunity, shouldn't Love, with all his years of meditation, have been the one to step forward and try to make peace?

He blinks at the question, rolls his eyes and curls his lip.

"When somebody in your family suffers from a mental illness, sometimes it's gone past the opportunity to have a normal relationship," he says. "I mean, there may be a feeling that, ideally, you would like to see peace in the family. And I have nothing but sympathy for Brian. But when you say 'peace,' that would presuppose everything is peaceful. Well, when somebody has chosen a path or direction in life that has led to some pretty unhappy situations, everything isn't all right."

And he's completely serious. It's out of his hands. There's nothing he can do. It's enough to make you bang your head against the statue of Shiva, the Indian god of destruction, that stands in his house, or turn upside down the framed photograph of him, George Harrison, John Lennon, Donovan and others hanging out with the Maharishi back in the day. Then again, in 1968, Love said, "One of the greatest things [about Transcendental Meditation] that interested me was that [the Maharishi] said, 'You don't have to give up your Rolls-Royce and forsake all your pursuits of material pleasures to develop inner-spiritual qualities.' That sounded real good to me." And maybe all the lawsuits could be considered part of those pursuits, too, and thus fully justifiable, at least on an inner-spiritual level.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 24, 2018, 10:01:45 AM
This is example #1A of why the complaints about rehashing C50 akin to kicking a dead horse ring hollow. If Mike and those around him would stick to one of the "reasons" behind his actions regarding C50, it would be a done deal. From the very first appearance in the LA Times, the press release that caused the firestorm just when the band was about to play the Grammy Museum event in 2012, Mike's reasons have changed. The reasons argued by his mouthpieces online have changed too. From the phrase "set end date" being used to answer any questions, to an email that was first reported and waved in our faces as "no more Wilsons" to more recently "no more shows for Wilson", from Mike saying he was advised not to risk overexposure and give it a year's rest, to Mike's co-author saying this in Fall 2016:

"27:32
The reality of the 50th anniversary tour was that it lost money on the domestic side, because the band was so big, the costs were too high, given the revenue that these concerts were generating. And the concern that Mike had going forward was that well, if we start not just losing money ourselves, but if our promoters are losing money, if the venues are losing money, then we're going to jeopardize the brand. And so those economic factors were very much a part of their concern"


...to Mike saying in a reply to the LA Times, October 2012 that he was contractually obligated to tour as the Beach Boys and had to book the smaller venues out of some kind of responsibility as the torch-bearer of the brand name...then saying he was surprised Al and Brian were surprised by his announcement, after Al and Brian said on the record they requested a meeting to go over all of this with Mike and his people regarding the future booking of Mike's own shows and the confusion caused by it, and Mike's people released the announcement before such a meeting could happen, resulting in the PR shitstorm it turned into...and flip over to around page 402 or 403 of Mike's book to read more details.

I mean, seriously...let's get down to brass tacks here and cut the bullshit.

C50 in terms of business and legal affairs was hinged on a three-way legal partnership that was filed and named as "50 Big Ones", Mike-Brian-Joe Thomas and all related legal parties and business ventures.

An email saying "no more shows for Wilson" or "no more Wilsons" depending on whose account you believe is not going to be a silver bullet that scuttles a three-way business agreement never mind a multi-million dollar tour.

And such a tour would not be designed to lose money.

And such business agreements when all related affairs affect three principal interests of the parent "company" 50 Big Ones, and their interests legal and financial, and Capitol Records, and numerous booking agents, and a road crew and staff of dozens of people, and ticket agencies around the world, etc etc etc...are NOT going to hinge on a single email without a history or context to it, and surely not without meetings and discussions and the like.

That's how a business runs, that's how a partnership runs. If Mike's people went rogue before that Grammy event and released a public announcement prior to having a meeting requested by Brian and Al and ostensibly the other "50 Big Ones" interests involved to hash things out regarding booking shows under the name Beach Boys and other issues surrounding the tour and bookings, then someone should ask Mike what the hell happened.

If there are people arguing or believing that a 3-way legal/business partnership that had dozens of people and millions of dollars at stake would come down to one email, and have no context as to what was sent prior to that email and basically little context at all other than there was an offer to play a show in Israel, you're either misinformed or naive about the way business works. And how businesses and corporate interests, especially partnerships, do not dissolve or make decisions based on a phrase in an email without serious discussions and procedures.

But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

You either see it or you don't. Just make sure you pick one of Mike's more plausible reasons to defend before another interview comes out with a new "reason" behind the C50 mess.

And watch out for shadowy figures sneaking around stages trying to clip Autotune units on microphones before a gig... ;D







Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Juice Brohnston on January 24, 2018, 10:25:39 AM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 24, 2018, 10:30:28 AM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

Also, basically having two full bands onstage for the duration of the tour.   


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Mr. Tiger on January 24, 2018, 10:36:30 AM
If we're to view Brian and Al as two disappointed guys who have been shut out of the touring band, I'm still a little confused about the current status quo. If there are 4 votes in BRI: Brian, Al, Mike and Carl's kids, what's stopping them from nixing the Mike and Bruce tour and demanding that the BB can only tour as a reunion outfit?

Do Brian and/or Al nevertheless vote for the Mike and Bruce show because of the money it rakes in? If so, it's a little more difficult to view them purely as victims. OR, what happens if there is a split vote, with both Mike and Carl's kids voting for the Mike and Bruce show and Brian and Al voting against? What happens then?



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 24, 2018, 10:36:42 AM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

More or less stressful than touring with Mike? C'mon, Juice... :)

What or where were the "a lot of half full venues" on that tour? It was reported as the tour was happening as exceeding expectations on sales and attendance which led to more and bigger offers coming in. The numbers are available. The official numbers after the tour wrapped would not be where they were if it were a flop that played to half-capacity venues. There would be no reason to extend it by adding almost 2 dozen more shows if it were a flop. There would not be such interest and industry buzz if the norm was the C50 shows playing to a lot of half-full venues, unless the expectations and projections were  that they'd play to 1/4 full venues and half-full venues exceeded those expectations. That's #MottLogic.

I'll ask again, specifically in reply to this even though it's repeating the same thing yet again: What was the context of this email, and what came before it in the email chain?

Juice: Do you believe all of this hinged on a lone email, that without context would seem to have appeared out of the blue and hammered the final nail in the C50 coffin rather than as a reply or a follow-up to something else, or at least within a context?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Joel Goldenberg on January 24, 2018, 10:49:38 AM
The Montreal show I attended was fantastic, but unfortunately the venue (Bell Centre) was not close to full.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 24, 2018, 10:51:12 AM
Certainly wasn't half full when I went. Even during a storm it was full of people


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: urbanite on January 24, 2018, 12:51:33 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear.  And then at some point thereafter, Brian's desire to tour changed.  I don't get why Brian or his wife didn't go to Mike and try to work something out for more shows.  Maybe they did and it hasn't been reported.  It seems apparent that Mike and Melinda don't get along, and if Melinda's e-mail was a bluff, it was a foolish move.  Mike Love is strong willed and doesn't want to be second banana to the wife of a rock star.  And the soap opera continues.     


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 24, 2018, 01:12:12 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear.  And then at some point thereafter, Brian's desire to tour changed.  I don't get why Brian or his wife didn't go to Mike and try to work something out for more shows.  Maybe they did and it hasn't been reported.  It seems apparent that Mike and Melinda don't get along, and if Melinda's e-mail was a bluff, it was a foolish move.  Mike Love is strong willed and doesn't want to be second banana to the wife of a rock star.  And the soap opera continues.     

How do we know the email actually exists?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SMiLE Brian on January 24, 2018, 01:21:16 PM
The email is a mcguffen...,


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 24, 2018, 01:26:50 PM
Too bad it is not a macMUFFIN. I'm hungry :D


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 02:08:17 PM
And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

Not trying to sound heavy, but this is mostly wrong.

The "overexposure" argument is completely invalid. Multiple sources have said demand was *building* for more shows. BIGGER shows. Bigger, richer promoters were watching this tour to see how it unfolded. For a tour of this magnitude, 73 worldwide dates over the course of only *five* months is nothing remotely close to overexposure. That's "ending it when it has barely started" territory. If they had booked 150 shows per year for five years straight, then we could maybe start to talk overexposure.

The "set end date" argument falls apart for numerous reasons. First of all, Mike *claims* he didn't book shows until after that e-mail. So at any given point up to that point, the "set end date" was open to being moved, as it already was once when they did a *pitiful* meager 23 international dates, including a skimpy *two* shows in the UK. Secondly, even if Mike had his own dates booked way in advance before that e-mail, those Mike/Bruce dates could have been bought off in a heartbeat and replaced with reunion shows, or postponed or rescheduled, etc. Indeed, I recall one "symphonic" Mike/Bruce date that had already been booked for earlier in 2012 (in Texas maybe?) was canceled once C50 was scheduled.

I also don't believe many dates on the tour were "half full." I recall Pollstar reporting high numbers for the C50 shows.

As to Brian being stressful to tour with, I have no reason to doubt it. But the same goes for Mike. The whole point was for them to actually truly compromise on that tour.

I don't think anybody expected it go on forever. But a second leg for the tour once the amazing reviews were in (and apparently offers were on the table) is far from "forever."


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 02:10:20 PM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

Also, basically having two full bands onstage for the duration of the tour.  

The C50 touring band was no doubt more expensive, but I doubt it was more stressful. *Maybe* stressful for co-musical directors Paul Mertens and Scott Totten. But Mertens has regularly dealt with a large band, and I never sensed Totten felt overwhelmed. But Mike did the same thing on C50 that he does at his own shows. He sang a hand full of songs he doesn't normally sing. Otherwise, he does the same thing whether there are 5 or 12 guys playing behind him.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Chocolate Shake Man on January 24, 2018, 02:13:45 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear. 

If what Mike says is true and that there was some ulterior motive behind the e-mail then it was not crystal clear. Again, Mike seems to be suggesting that he interpreted the e-mail as meaning something other than what it said.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 02:19:54 PM
If we're to view Brian and Al as two disappointed guys who have been shut out of the touring band, I'm still a little confused about the current status quo. If there are 4 votes in BRI: Brian, Al, Mike and Carl's kids, what's stopping them from nixing the Mike and Bruce tour and demanding that the BB can only tour as a reunion outfit?

Do Brian and/or Al nevertheless vote for the Mike and Bruce show because of the money it rakes in? If so, it's a little more difficult to view them purely as victims. OR, what happens if there is a split vote, with both Mike and Carl's kids voting for the Mike and Bruce show and Brian and Al voting against? What happens then?



There are numerous hangups. It is NOT as simple as calling for a vote. First of all, they would need Carl's sons' vote, and the only evidence I've ever heard of them voting against Mike at BRI is that "Love & Mercy" soundtrack vote, and even then they voted without even knowing how Mike would vote.

Secondly, even if they *did* get Carl's estate's vote and voted to strip the license from Mike, it would almost surely be tied up in litigation until the surviving members were deceased. There would be a myriad of ways to tie the whole thing up and argue against that vote in court.

Also, even if they *were* able to take the license away, who is interested in Mike touring literally under duress?

Brian and Al don't "vote for Mike to use the name", as if it's a continual renewal process. There was one vote back in 1998, and it's likely Al voted *against* Mike getting his license. No vote has taken place since then. Brian and Al don't make a ton of money off of Mike's tour. I'm guessing they don't strongly go after Mike's license simply because it would be kicking a hornet's nest of costly litigation. But Brian and Al each make 25% *of* the small licensing fee Mike pays to use the name. They don't get 25% of the whole thing, only 25% of their 5% or whatever it is that Mike pays out to BRI.

We kicked rough numbers around in a thread a few years ago. Mike's tour makes MANY MILLIONS per year. It sounds like at most around $1 million annually is paid out in licensing fees to BRI (based on $20 million over 20 years or so), and then Brian and Al would each get 25% of that $1 million. *As does Mike.* So Mike makes *as much* as Brian and Al off the small licensing fee, PLUS Mike makes millions per year off the touring operation itself.

Brian and Al are co-owners of the trademark. They should get their fair share of any licensing fee, regardless of whether they agree with issuing said license. If you own stock in a company and your stock turns a huge profit despite you disagreeing with the company's decisions, you *still* get to keep your stock/money.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 02:23:18 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear.  And then at some point thereafter, Brian's desire to tour changed.  I don't get why Brian or his wife didn't go to Mike and try to work something out for more shows.  Maybe they did and it hasn't been reported.  It seems apparent that Mike and Melinda don't get along, and if Melinda's e-mail was a bluff, it was a foolish move.  Mike Love is strong willed and doesn't want to be second banana to the wife of a rock star.  And the soap opera continues.    

Even assuming Mike's and Mike's supporters' version of the story is correct, a single one-line email with no context is the exact opposite of crystal clear.

If someone got a text message from their spouse that said "no more marriage for me", would the response be to just go file for divorce and never talk to the spouse again, or would it be good to maybe get some clarification, or *God forbid* actually try to work something out?

It sounds like at some point Brian *and* Al let Mike know they wanted to continue, and Mike balked. As I've already said, Al nearly begged Mike to come back to the table to discuss it and Al was blown off.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 24, 2018, 02:25:09 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear. 

If what Mike says is true and that there was some ulterior motive behind the e-mail then it was not crystal clear. Again, Mike seems to be suggesting that he interpreted the e-mail as meaning something other than what it said.

That's what's fascinating about this new Mike interview. Mike's *own* interpretation of the story makes him look like the one who refused to come back to the table and work out doing more shows.

Seriously, Mike's idea of what he thought Melinda was hoping he would say is actually *exactly* what I think Mike or anybody in that situation should have said/asked. Pretty simple. "This tour is amazing! Don't you want to keep going?" Mike did not do that.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Pretty Funky on January 24, 2018, 03:26:21 PM
Just a reminder from 2012 and a couple of posts from Jon Stebbins.


Its funny that Howie basically relates very truthfully that Melinda and Jaqui are the bottom line, in charge, calling the shots, wielding the power...and Fildepage somehow takes that as an "undertone of disrespect".

Well, that story is a 180 degree turn from last week.  Last week Mike was the villain. Splashed globally.  Now it is the wives?


The villain is the horrible way this was handled as far as inflaming the public perception that the Beach Boys are firing each other etc... It could have easily been avoided, and the Mike press release, the wording of it, the Beach Boys reluctance to mitigate that by giving an explanation that no one was fired etc... All of that was stupid and ugly. The behind the scenes truth is that Melinda and Jaqui essentially pull the levers of the two integrated organizations that have made this reunion possible. If they were currently operating in harmony as they were throughout most of this reunion, this most likely would not have happened. Seems obvious. You are the first person in this exchange to label them as villains. I'd view them as being in charge, and as having done a fantastic job with all reunion related issues...until now.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: urbanite on January 24, 2018, 05:09:20 PM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Amy B. on January 24, 2018, 05:16:21 PM
"When somebody in your family suffers from a mental illness, sometimes it's gone past the opportunity to have a normal relationship," he says. "I mean, there may be a feeling that, ideally, you would like to see peace in the family. And I have nothing but sympathy for Brian. But when you say 'peace,' that would presuppose everything is peaceful. Well, when somebody has chosen a path or direction in life that has led to some pretty unhappy situations, everything isn't all right."

This is why I've said before that Mike needs  to go to therapy. Obviously he has never sorted out his relationship with Brian, nor why he resents him. More than that, he isn't even sure whether to blame the mental illness or the path Brian *chose* (since mental illness is not a choice). And maybe if he dealt with that, with his resentment about Brian, Dennis, Murry, etc., he could get a grip and control his anger in interviews, and stop sabotaging his relationships with his words.

I'm a fan of Rufus Wainwright, whose relationship with his dad, Loudon Wainwright, has been rocky. He has said that in the beginning of his career he made the mistake of using interviews as therapy, or opportunities to vent his anger and frustration. But he learned that it wasn't the time or place, and that it would only fan the fire, making his relationship with his dad more difficult. He learned that sometime in his 20s. Well, Mike Love is 76 years old. It's time to get some help dealing with his anger and resentment. It's been said over and over, but the TM isn't working.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Juice Brohnston on January 24, 2018, 06:23:05 PM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

More or less stressful than touring with Mike? C'mon, Juice... :)

What or where were the "a lot of half full venues" on that tour? It was reported as the tour was happening as exceeding expectations on sales and attendance which led to more and bigger offers coming in. The numbers are available. The official numbers after the tour wrapped would not be where they were if it were a flop that played to half-capacity venues. There would be no reason to extend it by adding almost 2 dozen more shows if it were a flop. There would not be such interest and industry buzz if the norm was the C50 shows playing to a lot of half-full venues, unless the expectations and projections were  that they'd play to 1/4 full venues and half-full venues exceeded those expectations. That's #MottLogic.

I'll ask again, specifically in reply to this even though it's repeating the same thing yet again: What was the context of this email, and what came before it in the email chain?

Juice: Do you believe all of this hinged on a lone email, that without context would seem to have appeared out of the blue and hammered the final nail in the C50 coffin rather than as a reply or a follow-up to something else, or at least within a context?

My thoughts are that Mike made a decision that 'his' Beach Boys was better for him in the long run then the reunited band, and I'm not saying his reasoning is specifically what he has claimed in interviews. I have no knowledge of the email or emails that came before it, but my point is that all these factors MAY have influenced Mike's decision that he was better off in the M&B format.

Yes (just my opinion) but I think Brian would pose some additional stressors to the tour. His back was bothering him early on. I think there was some discussion on whether or not he was going to make it through the tour (certainly was some talk about it here and on other boards, I recall) Great that he did make it, and it seemed to kickstart a more rigourous solo schedule, which is great.

A snapshot of box office data on Wikipedia shows about an 87%capcity for shows. But, for example, The Bell Centre show there is listed at being 88% sold, but the attendance was 5000 in a 20000 seat venue. I guess you can manipulate those numbers any way you want. Again, don't want to make it sound like I'm saying the tour WAS over exposed, but over time one might expect diminishing returns if it carried on.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 24, 2018, 06:24:29 PM
One e-mail from Brian Wilson's wife expressed his unwillingness to continue touring.  Whatever led up to it, that e-mail was crystal clear.  And then at some point thereafter, Brian's desire to tour changed.  I don't get why Brian or his wife didn't go to Mike and try to work something out for more shows.  Maybe they did and it hasn't been reported.  It seems apparent that Mike and Melinda don't get along, and if Melinda's e-mail was a bluff, it was a foolish move.  Mike Love is strong willed and doesn't want to be second banana to the wife of a rock star.  And the soap opera continues.     


Why are you seemingly ignoring the issue of what emails or exchanges could exist which would lead up to this email as a reply or response? The focus is entirely on one lone email with no context. Without context as in before and after, it is impossible to say what could have led to it, unless you're trying to do what Mike and Doe and others have done in citing that email as the Rosetta Stone of what happened, and absolve Mike of being blamed for what happened with C50.

Again, what is the context of that email? If, of course, the email was as vital as anything else that happened.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: SMiLE Brian on January 24, 2018, 06:28:06 PM
It’s a red herring...


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 24, 2018, 06:36:09 PM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

More or less stressful than touring with Mike? C'mon, Juice... :)

What or where were the "a lot of half full venues" on that tour? It was reported as the tour was happening as exceeding expectations on sales and attendance which led to more and bigger offers coming in. The numbers are available. The official numbers after the tour wrapped would not be where they were if it were a flop that played to half-capacity venues. There would be no reason to extend it by adding almost 2 dozen more shows if it were a flop. There would not be such interest and industry buzz if the norm was the C50 shows playing to a lot of half-full venues, unless the expectations and projections were  that they'd play to 1/4 full venues and half-full venues exceeded those expectations. That's #MottLogic.

I'll ask again, specifically in reply to this even though it's repeating the same thing yet again: What was the context of this email, and what came before it in the email chain?

Juice: Do you believe all of this hinged on a lone email, that without context would seem to have appeared out of the blue and hammered the final nail in the C50 coffin rather than as a reply or a follow-up to something else, or at least within a context?

My thoughts are that Mike made a decision that 'his' Beach Boys was better for him in the long run then the reunited band, and I'm not saying his reasoning is specifically what he has claimed in interviews. I have no knowledge of the email or emails that came before it, but my point is that all these factors MAY have influenced Mike's decision that he was better off in the M&B format.

Yes (just my opinion) but I think Brian would pose some additional stressors to the tour. His back was bothering him early on. I think there was some discussion on whether or not he was going to make it through the tour (certainly was some talk about it here and on other boards, I recall) Great that he did make it, and it seemed to kickstart a more rigourous solo schedule, which is great.

A snapshot of box office data on Wikipedia shows about an 87%capcity for shows. But, for example, The Bell Centre show there is listed at being 88% sold, but the attendance was 5000 in a 20000 seat venue. I guess you can manipulate those numbers any way you want. Again, don't want to make it sound like I'm saying the tour WAS over exposed, but over time one might expect diminishing returns if it carried on.

87% or thereabouts - That was the point. Even taking that as conservatively as we can, it's hardly proof that a lot of the shows were "half full", which was what I was responding to. And the numbers are out there, published, in terms of the financial returns on that tour. It was a success.

I would also suggest that bigger, higher-profile booking agents and venues would not have been knocking on C50's door asking to book the show if it were playing to half capacity audiences.

The nature of concert seating is different than sports events too. The Beach Boys had a large video screen and a rather elaborate backline and stage design...the seats behind that stage, for one example, may not have been opened for sale if there would be no view of the band. I remember McCartney at the Vet, almost 30 years ago, and the entire sections of seats behind Macca's stage were closed off because there would be no view if people bought those seats. That took potentially thousands of seats away from the pool, so the capacity was not reached because of the sections being closed, yet both shows he did that weekend were sold out.

Same for C50 I'd imagine.

I guess the fact Mike offered numerous reasons, as I listed above, in response to direct questions about C50 or in press releases, further repeated by people around him, and they're different depending on which version of the answer you read. It doesn't add up, and it sounds like Mike is spinning off excuses yet again to deflect from the criticism he got when his decision was announced.

And I don't think Mike - and this is just opinion - wanted to be second banana on more C50 shows. Second banana not to Brian Wilson, but more second banana to the notion of a real Beach Boys band with all original surviving members sharing the stage. Mike was a band member again rather than the focus of attention, and I think that didn't sit well with him.

Plus, his word on decisions from setlists to including John Stamos in the shows was not taken as unquestionable law, and was instead challenged by those around him. He was not the boss. Again, that's just personal opinion from me...but something to consider.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Juice Brohnston on January 24, 2018, 06:47:10 PM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

More or less stressful than touring with Mike? C'mon, Juice... :)

What or where were the "a lot of half full venues" on that tour? It was reported as the tour was happening as exceeding expectations on sales and attendance which led to more and bigger offers coming in. The numbers are available. The official numbers after the tour wrapped would not be where they were if it were a flop that played to half-capacity venues. There would be no reason to extend it by adding almost 2 dozen more shows if it were a flop. There would not be such interest and industry buzz if the norm was the C50 shows playing to a lot of half-full venues, unless the expectations and projections were  that they'd play to 1/4 full venues and half-full venues exceeded those expectations. That's #MottLogic.

I'll ask again, specifically in reply to this even though it's repeating the same thing yet again: What was the context of this email, and what came before it in the email chain?

Juice: Do you believe all of this hinged on a lone email, that without context would seem to have appeared out of the blue and hammered the final nail in the C50 coffin rather than as a reply or a follow-up to something else, or at least within a context?

My thoughts are that Mike made a decision that 'his' Beach Boys was better for him in the long run then the reunited band, and I'm not saying his reasoning is specifically what he has claimed in interviews. I have no knowledge of the email or emails that came before it, but my point is that all these factors MAY have influenced Mike's decision that he was better off in the M&B format.

Yes (just my opinion) but I think Brian would pose some additional stressors to the tour. His back was bothering him early on. I think there was some discussion on whether or not he was going to make it through the tour (certainly was some talk about it here and on other boards, I recall) Great that he did make it, and it seemed to kickstart a more rigourous solo schedule, which is great.

A snapshot of box office data on Wikipedia shows about an 87%capcity for shows. But, for example, The Bell Centre show there is listed at being 88% sold, but the attendance was 5000 in a 20000 seat venue. I guess you can manipulate those numbers any way you want. Again, don't want to make it sound like I'm saying the tour WAS over exposed, but over time one might expect diminishing returns if it carried on.

87% or thereabouts - That was the point. Even taking that as conservatively as we can, it's hardly proof that a lot of the shows were "half full", which was what I was responding to. And the numbers are out there, published, in terms of the financial returns on that tour. It was a success.

I would also suggest that bigger, higher-profile booking agents and venues would not have been knocking on C50's door asking to book the show if it were playing to half capacity audiences.

The nature of concert seating is different than sports events too. The Beach Boys had a large video screen and a rather elaborate backline and stage design...the seats behind that stage, for one example, may not have been opened for sale if there would be no view of the band. I remember McCartney at the Vet, almost 30 years ago, and the entire sections of seats behind Macca's stage were closed off because there would be no view if people bought those seats. That took potentially thousands of seats away from the pool, so the capacity was not reached because of the sections being closed, yet both shows he did that weekend were sold out.

Same for C50 I'd imagine.

I guess the fact Mike offered numerous reasons, as I listed above, in response to direct questions about C50 or in press releases, further repeated by people around him, and they're different depending on which version of the answer you read. It doesn't add up, and it sounds like Mike is spinning off excuses yet again to deflect from the criticism he got when his decision was announced.

And I don't think Mike - and this is just opinion - wanted to be second banana on more C50 shows. Second banana not to Brian Wilson, but more second banana to the notion of a real Beach Boys band with all original surviving members sharing the stage. Mike was a band member again rather than the focus of attention, and I think that didn't sit well with him.

Plus, his word on decisions from setlists to including John Stamos in the shows was not taken as unquestionable law, and was instead challenged by those around him. He was not the boss. Again, that's just personal opinion from me...but something to consider.

See, Guitarfool, you are getting down to the much more pertinent picture in your last 2 paragraphs. Of course this is the reason. If the tour went off without a hitch, and more money was rolling in and there were no conflicts, Mike would have still reverted back to M&B. I'm sure of it. For the reasons you speculate, and probably a few other ones as well. The emails, the booked M&B shows, the potential overexposure...all of those things are easy for Mike to point at as the reason(s), because it's surely tough for him to say 'you know, even though M&B is not the true band, I like it better because I get the glory and it actually puts more money in my pocket'. And all those things might have added to the incentive to revert back..but the main reason was M&B is Mike's kingdom.

BTW, I speculate (with zero evidence) that Bruce probably longed to get back to the M&B format, and maybe even had some influence in Mike's decision.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: marcella27 on January 24, 2018, 07:07:35 PM
Can someone explain to me what Mike's referring to here? What does this have to do with Carl?

As Brian’s ability to functionally lead The
Beach Boys faded, why didn’t Carl step up
and take over leadership of the band?


I think he did, to a degree, but he experienced
his own problems. There’s so much stuff that’s
salacious… we should have that conversation at
another time. Because you cannot imagine how
degenerate and depraved and disgusting the
whole thing became. It’s beyond disgusting.




I think this is the weirdest Mike Love quote I’ve ever read.  A question about Carl elicits the words “salacious, depraved, disgusting, degenerate”?  Those are some pretty fiery words.  What is he referring to when he says “the whole thing” was so disgusting?  This really boggles my mind. 

As an aside, it’s a weird question, because Carl did pretty much take over leadership of the band...certainly the musical aspects, for a time. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 24, 2018, 07:14:37 PM
But, I digress. If people want to argue for and defend Mike's multiple and sometimes changing "reasons", from Mike not wanting to risk overexposure to the tour losing money to there being a "set end date" to Mike being contractually obligated to play with his smaller band to Mike saying it came down to an email sent in early June 2012 to Mike suggesting anything that might still come out that wasn't in his book or a Mojo interview or an interview in the Kokomo Gazette...have at it.

And all of these things may have played a part in Mike's decision to pull the plug. It might have been overexposed if it carried on. There was a set end date, and maybe Mike had shows booked on that timeline. I know there were a lot of half full venues on that tour. Maybe there was an email.

I loved that tour, but I never got the feeling that it was going to go on forever. And I'll say it...I bet it is stressful touring with Brian.

More or less stressful than touring with Mike? C'mon, Juice... :)

What or where were the "a lot of half full venues" on that tour? It was reported as the tour was happening as exceeding expectations on sales and attendance which led to more and bigger offers coming in. The numbers are available. The official numbers after the tour wrapped would not be where they were if it were a flop that played to half-capacity venues. There would be no reason to extend it by adding almost 2 dozen more shows if it were a flop. There would not be such interest and industry buzz if the norm was the C50 shows playing to a lot of half-full venues, unless the expectations and projections were  that they'd play to 1/4 full venues and half-full venues exceeded those expectations. That's #MottLogic.

I'll ask again, specifically in reply to this even though it's repeating the same thing yet again: What was the context of this email, and what came before it in the email chain?

Juice: Do you believe all of this hinged on a lone email, that without context would seem to have appeared out of the blue and hammered the final nail in the C50 coffin rather than as a reply or a follow-up to something else, or at least within a context?

My thoughts are that Mike made a decision that 'his' Beach Boys was better for him in the long run then the reunited band, and I'm not saying his reasoning is specifically what he has claimed in interviews. I have no knowledge of the email or emails that came before it, but my point is that all these factors MAY have influenced Mike's decision that he was better off in the M&B format.

Yes (just my opinion) but I think Brian would pose some additional stressors to the tour. His back was bothering him early on. I think there was some discussion on whether or not he was going to make it through the tour (certainly was some talk about it here and on other boards, I recall) Great that he did make it, and it seemed to kickstart a more rigourous solo schedule, which is great.

A snapshot of box office data on Wikipedia shows about an 87%capcity for shows. But, for example, The Bell Centre show there is listed at being 88% sold, but the attendance was 5000 in a 20000 seat venue. I guess you can manipulate those numbers any way you want. Again, don't want to make it sound like I'm saying the tour WAS over exposed, but over time one might expect diminishing returns if it carried on.

87% or thereabouts - That was the point. Even taking that as conservatively as we can, it's hardly proof that a lot of the shows were "half full", which was what I was responding to. And the numbers are out there, published, in terms of the financial returns on that tour. It was a success.

I would also suggest that bigger, higher-profile booking agents and venues would not have been knocking on C50's door asking to book the show if it were playing to half capacity audiences.

The nature of concert seating is different than sports events too. The Beach Boys had a large video screen and a rather elaborate backline and stage design...the seats behind that stage, for one example, may not have been opened for sale if there would be no view of the band. I remember McCartney at the Vet, almost 30 years ago, and the entire sections of seats behind Macca's stage were closed off because there would be no view if people bought those seats. That took potentially thousands of seats away from the pool, so the capacity was not reached because of the sections being closed, yet both shows he did that weekend were sold out.

Same for C50 I'd imagine.

I guess the fact Mike offered numerous reasons, as I listed above, in response to direct questions about C50 or in press releases, further repeated by people around him, and they're different depending on which version of the answer you read. It doesn't add up, and it sounds like Mike is spinning off excuses yet again to deflect from the criticism he got when his decision was announced.

And I don't think Mike - and this is just opinion - wanted to be second banana on more C50 shows. Second banana not to Brian Wilson, but more second banana to the notion of a real Beach Boys band with all original surviving members sharing the stage. Mike was a band member again rather than the focus of attention, and I think that didn't sit well with him.

Plus, his word on decisions from setlists to including John Stamos in the shows was not taken as unquestionable law, and was instead challenged by those around him. He was not the boss. Again, that's just personal opinion from me...but something to consider.

See, Guitarfool, you are getting down to the much more pertinent picture in your last 2 paragraphs. Of course this is the reason. If the tour went off without a hitch, and more money was rolling in and there were no conflicts, Mike would have still reverted back to M&B. I'm sure of it. For the reasons you speculate, and probably a few other ones as well. The emails, the booked M&B shows, the potential overexposure...all of those things are easy for Mike to point at as the reason(s), because it's surely tough for him to say 'you know, even though M&B is not the true band, I like it better because I get the glory and it actually puts more money in my pocket'. And all those things might have added to the incentive to revert back..but the main reason was M&B is Mike's kingdom.

BTW, I speculate (with zero evidence) that Bruce probably longed to get back to the M&B format, and maybe even had some influence in Mike's decision.

Bingo, we agree. This is why it has been so maddening, so frustrating in fact, to have to suffer through any number of excuses, red herrings, illogical defenses, filibusters, deflections, and outright bullshit about his decisions regarding C50. Now it just happens to be a lone email...last year his co-author said it was because the C50 tour was losing money...

That's the maddening part. The bullshitting and covering up insults our intelligence, but I doubt Mike has the hardcore fanbase in mind when he's spinning these tales.

And in retrospect, how blatantly foolish and ironic is it for a guy to cite not wanting to risk overexposure by touring C50 too much, way back in that very first announcement...

...when the same guy brags constantly about doing close to 200 live shows a year.





Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: RangeRoverA1 on January 24, 2018, 07:30:50 PM
The nature of concert seating is different than sports events too. The Beach Boys had a large video screen and a rather elaborate backline and stage design...the seats behind that stage, for one example, may not have been opened for sale if there would be no view of the band. I remember McCartney at the Vet, almost 30 years ago, and the entire sections of seats behind Macca's stage were closed off because there would be no view if people bought those seats. That took potentially thousands of seats away from the pool, so the capacity was not reached because of the sections being closed, yet both shows he did that weekend were sold out.
Interesting, didn't look at it this way. It makes difference indeed.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Lee Marshall on January 24, 2018, 08:28:10 PM
I have posted this here at S S dot net ad infinitum.  It has not...as far as I've been able to scan been added here in THIS thread/this go-round.  Love explained WHY he does what he does...and why he did what he did.  For his own 'nourishment and revenge'.  HIS words.  NOT mine.  And, ultimately... ... ...it's THAT simple.  "Nourishment and revenge".  and he twists us all up like a bunch of pretzels EVERY time he goes back for another 'helping'.  Look around.  Ta Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!! I'm sure he would call this "winning".


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 24, 2018, 10:53:24 PM
I think if he had been honest about why c50 ended from the beginning, and just admitted he wanted to be the main guy in charge he wouldn't be getting so much crap.  I personally wouldn't have liked it but I could at least respected it, and I think others would feel the same way.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Needleinthehay on January 24, 2018, 10:57:05 PM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


The email actually was:

"Brians back is hurting, going to take him to the Dr, but please make sure you dont take this email as....no more shows for Wilson! Definitely, do NOT mean....no more shows for Wilson!
-Melinda"

Actually the email was:
"Listen, Brian has been watching too much TV backstage before the C50 concerts so let's get rid of the tvs so there will be no more shows for Wilson!"


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Hickory Violet Part IV on January 25, 2018, 12:43:42 AM
No, it was about the strip clubs Mike was dragging Brian to each night.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Pretty Funky on January 25, 2018, 01:10:33 AM
 Brian’s back was playing up in 2012 and perhaps Mike had bought him some inserts.

Email actually was ‘No more Scholls for Wilson.’


.....I’ll see myself out.  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 25, 2018, 05:16:29 AM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


shhhhhhh....you're ruining the narrative.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 06:11:02 AM
Regarding attendance, the C50 tour *was* hurt by the over-touring Mike had been doing over the years.

Had Mike hung it up in 1998 and toured solo after that, the C50 tour could well have been playing and filling arenas and stadiums.

So to the degree the BB name could have been overexposed leading up to C50 (and thus keeping every show from a hardcore sellout), that was due to Mike's use of the name doing 150 gigs per year, every year.

Also, promoters wouldn't have been offering LARGER shows (e.g. Madison Square Garden) if there was any indication that, on the whole, the reunion wasn't selling well.

If things had moved forward with the reunion going into 2013, all that stuff could have been dialed in. They could have adjusted ticket prices to maximize sellouts and profit, etc.

Keep in mind that C50 had a very different financial setup to a typical "Mike/Bruce" tour. For instance, what if Brian and Mike were given a large up-front advance? That huge lump sum would have to be paid off before the tour "turned a profit." Note that Mike doesn't get into *that* part of the C50 set up in his book.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: The LEGENDARY OSD on January 25, 2018, 06:15:54 AM
Brian’s back was playing up in 2012 and perhaps Mike had bought him some inserts.

Email actually was ‘No more Scholls for Wilson.’


.....I’ll see myself out.  ;D
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 06:22:46 AM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


shhhhhhh....you're ruining the narrative.


Questioning the nature of this cryptic, one-line e-mail, which strangely wasn't mentioned in Mike's *lengthy* letter to the LA Times in 2012, is not to further a "narrative."

I don't question that such an e-mail exists. I also think Mike clearly had plenty of beefs (though the main one was apparently not liking Melinda) that led him to not want to continue the reunion. But I also think that any fan or observer who actually thinks this e-mail had *anything* actually to do with Mike quitting the reunion simply doesn't know enough about the ins and outs of the reunion and its aftermath.

As silly as it sounds to call this e-mail a "red herring", it actually is being presented that way by Mike. He brings it up to imply it impacted his decision-making process, but then has gone on *at length* in numerous interviews describing a litany of *other* complaints about the reunion. I guess he's trying to frame the e-mail as the straw the broke the camel's back or something, but he actually even undercuts that *highly specious* logic in this most recent interview by stunningly admitting that he believes Melinda and Brian *wanted* Mike to come back to them about doing more shows.

Let's be clear. Brian could have sent an e-mail saying "The reunion is awesome. Let's never break up again and keep the reunion going forever!" and Mike could have balked and he (Mike) wouldn't be breaking any agreements or contracts. The "e-mail" is a misdirection because it's a (pretty limp) attempt at putting the onus on Melinda and Brian for more shows not taking place. But Mike undercuts this by admitting he made no overtures to try to make more shows happen, and goes to great lengths to list off in interviews and his book seemingly countless reasons why he would have quit anyway.

Let us also remember that BEFORE the reunion tour even started, Bruce was online telling everyone (gleefully unfortunately) that the reunion was definitely NOT going to continue past a certain date.

Go back and read the board during C50. Word broke *in mid June*, less than two months into the tour, that Mike was pursuing his own Mike/Bruce shows in South America.

This "e-mail" had nothing to do with any of that. Does anyone really think that, had that e-mail not been sent but everything else was the same, that Mike would have continued with the reunion?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Cabinessenceking on January 25, 2018, 06:29:39 AM
Mike Love is the Donald Trump of the entertainment world. Even has the same supporters!


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 25, 2018, 06:33:24 AM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


shhhhhhh....you're ruining the narrative.


Questioning the nature of this cryptic, one-line e-mail, which strangely wasn't mentioned in Mike's *lengthy* letter to the LA Times in 2012, is not to further a "narrative."

I don't question that such an e-mail exists. I also think Mike clearly had plenty of beefs (though the main one was apparently not liking Melinda) that led him to not want to continue the reunion. But I also think that any fan or observer who actually thinks this e-mail had *anything* actually to do with Mike quitting the reunion simply doesn't know enough about the ins and outs of the reunion and its aftermath.

As silly as it sounds to call this e-mail a "red herring", it actually is being presented that way by Mike. He brings it up to imply it impacted his decision-making process, but then has gone on *at length* in numerous interviews describing a litany of *other* complaints about the reunion. I guess he's trying to frame the e-mail as the straw the broke the camel's back or something, but he actually even undercuts that *highly specious* logic in this most recent interview by stunningly admitting that he believes Melinda and Brian *wanted* Mike to come back to them about doing more shows.

Let's be clear. Brian could have sent an e-mail saying "The reunion is awesome. Let's never break up again and keep the reunion going forever!" and Mike could have balked and he (Mike) wouldn't be breaking any agreements or contracts. The "e-mail" is a misdirection because it's a (pretty limp) attempt at putting the onus on Melinda and Brian for more shows not taking place. But Mike undercuts this by admitting he made no overtures to try to make more shows happen, and goes to great lengths to list off in interviews and his book seemingly countless reasons why he would have quit anyway.

Let us also remember that BEFORE the reunion tour even started, Bruce was online telling everyone (gleefully unfortunately) that the reunion was definitely NOT going to continue past a certain date.

Go back and read the board during C50. Word broke *in mid June*, less than two months into the tour, that Mike was pursuing his own Mike/Bruce shows in South America.

This "e-mail" had nothing to do with any of that. Does anyone really think that, had that e-mail not been sent but everything else was the same, that Mike would have continued with the reunion?

I honestly don't think it's possible to know.   They could've done limited runs of "Reunion" Beach Boys concerts while Mike and Bruce did their thing. 

I just think it's far too simplistic to say that it's all on Mike. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 06:52:58 AM
"How do we know the email actually exists?"

Because if it didn't, the other camp would have said so publicly or through their surrogates.


I have no reason to doubt the e-mail exists. But Melinda or Brian not responding to Mike's statements wouldn't prove that in any way.

Indeed, take a look at Brian's post-C50 comments concerning the reunion. Other than his letter to the LA Times in 2012 and I suppose to some degree his book, has Brian really ever directly responded to *any* of Mike's comments? Unlike Mike, Brian has strayed from talking s**t on Mike.

Brian has typically offered quick, at worst slightly terse responses concerning C50. He doesn't do multiple paragraphs on it like Mike does, spelling out a laundry list of wrongs perpetrated against him.

I thought Brian's LA Times letter in 2012 was effective and to the point. It was a case of "Of course Mike didn't fire me. But of course it feels like being fired" and "By the end of the tour we wanted to do more reunion shows and had more offers and Mike didn't, and this bummed us out."

Also worth remembering, and something I think is likely truly incorrect about the typical "narrative" about C50, is the idea that Mike was all for a year-long reunion and then only soured on it after a bunch of wrongs were perpetrated against him. But if you go back to interviews in the several years leading up to C50, Mike envisioned *not* a new album and full tour, but *two* reunion concerts. I think a pertinent question continues to be, what if Mike didn't really want to do the full C50 tour and album project, but someone came up with a big cash advance that he couldn't say no to?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 06:57:40 AM
I honestly don't think it's possible to know.   They could've done limited runs of "Reunion" Beach Boys concerts while Mike and Bruce did their thing.  

I just think it's far too simplistic to say that it's all on Mike.  

Mixing reunion shows in with Mike/Bruce shows would never have worked, unless Mike toured under a different name.

Ideally, they would have kept the "Beach Boys" name only for reunion gigs, and then Mike could still do plenty of other gigs including the lucrative corporate and private gigs, under the "California Beach Band" name or something along those lines.

As far as it all being "on Mike", it depends on what we're talking about. If we're talking about the reason we didn't, in the immediate, get more reunion shows later in 2012 and/or in 2013, then yes, that's absolutely on Mike. Brian and Al (and thus Dave) clearly were amped up and ready to do another album and more tour dates. *Nobody*, including Mike, has contradicted *that* aspect of the narrative. Mike surely has a list of reasons he didn't want to keep going, but it was *his* decision. He chose to quit the band, necessitating it break up, and then to go back to his own band with the licensed name.

That Mike's list of "reasons" for not wanting to keep going range, in my opinion, from red herring/not a real reason, to specious, to silly, to firmly in the neighborhood of "hey, we're all making sacrifices to make this happen", only further undercuts Mike when he does offer those lists of reasons.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 25, 2018, 07:04:01 AM
I honestly don't think it's possible to know.   They could've done limited runs of "Reunion" Beach Boys concerts while Mike and Bruce did their thing.  

I just think it's far too simplistic to say that it's all on Mike.  

Mixing reunion shows in with Mike/Bruce shows would never have worked, unless Mike toured under a different name.

Ideally, they would have kept the "Beach Boys" name only for reunion gigs, and then Mike could still do plenty of other gigs including the lucrative corporate and private gigs, under the "California Beach Band" name or something along those lines.

As far as it all being "on Mike", it depends on what we're talking about. If we're talking about the reason we didn't, in the immediate, get more reunion shows later in 2012 and/or in 2013, then yes, that's absolutely on Mike. Brian and Al (and thus Dave) clearly were amped up and ready to do another album and more tour dates. *Nobody*, including Mike, has contradicted *that* aspect of the narrative. Mike surely has a list of reasons he didn't want to keep going, but it was *his* decision. He chose to quit the band, necessitating it break up, and then to go back to his own band with the licensed name.

That Mike's list of "reasons" for not wanting to keep going range, in my opinion, from red herring/not a real reason, to specious, to silly, to firmly in the neighborhood of "hey, we're all making sacrifices to make this happen", only further undercuts Mike when he does offer those lists of reasons.

We'll have to agree to disagree there. 

I think there are plenty of factors at play with C50, some of which we'll likely never know.   So, I honestly can't think one can say 100% that it was on Mike, or on Melinda, or on whoever. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 07:14:10 AM
We'll have to agree to disagree there.  

I think there are plenty of factors at play with C50, some of which we'll likely never know.   So, I honestly can't think one can say 100% that it was on Mike, or on Melinda, or on whoever.  

Hey, feel what you feel. But you're disagreeing with Mike, who himself acknowledges it was *his* decision to go back to his own band. He has never denied that A) It was his decision and B) That Brian and Al at the tour's end wanted to keep going.

Brian had another bag full of songs, a number of songs already prepped during the TWGMTR sessions, and Brian and Al were ready to do another album. Meanwhile, more offers for reunion shows were coming in. Mike's response was to walk, and do so by taking part in an *awful* series of PR moves (including his compassionless "announcement" that he was going back to his own band) culminating in the incorrect-but-totally-Mike's-fault headlines suggesting he had fired Brian, Al, and Dave.

As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so. He was more concerned with complaining about lazy journalists (whose laziness was prompted by Mike's "announcement").


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 25, 2018, 07:22:13 AM
We'll have to agree to disagree there.  

I think there are plenty of factors at play with C50, some of which we'll likely never know.   So, I honestly can't think one can say 100% that it was on Mike, or on Melinda, or on whoever.  

Hey, feel what you feel. But you're disagreeing with Mike, who himself acknowledges it was *his* decision to go back to his own band. He has never denied that A) It was his decision and B) That Brian and Al at the tour's end wanted to keep going.

Brian had another bag full of songs, a number of songs already prepped during the TWGMTR sessions, and Brian and Al were ready to do another album. Meanwhile, more offers for reunion shows were coming in. Mike's response was to walk, and do so by taking part in an *awful* series of PR moves (including his compassionless "announcement" that he was going back to his own band) culminating in the incorrect-but-totally-Mike's-fault headlines suggesting he had fired Brian, Al, and Dave.

As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so. He was more concerned with complaining about lazy journalists (whose laziness was prompted by Mike's "announcement").

True, he did say that.  But, I think there are other factors that went into the motivations.  Every time he speaks of C50, I always get the feeling that he's holding back something.   More details on the email from Melinda?  More conflicts than we're aware of?  Managers / wives / musical directors.  Who knows? 

And, do you really think another thread like this is better for the board that a year by year Beatles v Beach Boys poll? 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 07:29:15 AM
True, he did say that.  But, I think there are other factors that went into the motivations.  Every time he speaks of C50, I always get the feeling that he's holding back something.   More details on the email from Melinda?  More conflicts than we're aware of?  Managers / wives / musical directors.  Who knows?  

And, do you really think another thread like this is better for the board that a year by year Beatles v Beach Boys poll?  

Yes, I do. Trying to parse out a key part of the latter-day history of the Beach Boys on a BB message board is much more useful than a thread pitting two bands against each other, to say nothing of a thread full of BB fans needing to say their team is better. Some people have more fun making "favorite song" or "favorite band" lists. What I dig is getting into the history of the BBs, as it pertains to this board anyway.

One can argue that a lot of this stuff has been said over and over. But I've also seen about a thousand "vs" and "best this-or-that" poll threads over the years too.

As I often unfortunately have to remind those who aren't a fan of Mike's role in the demise of C50 being explored is that I truly feel my lamenting Mike quitting the band in 2012 is also an endorsement of the guy. He's a big part of a reunion. If I didn't like Mike and didn't like seeing him *with* the entire band, I'd be fine with Brian immediately going back to his own thing after 2012. But C50 was *that* good; it was so good that I think's it's *insane* (and dumb financially and reputation-wise as well) that they didn't keep it going.

I'm sure if you asked Mike if the idea of the band breaking up right after "Kokomo" hit #1 was a good idea, he'd say that's insane.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 25, 2018, 07:34:44 AM
True, he did say that.  But, I think there are other factors that went into the motivations.  Every time he speaks of C50, I always get the feeling that he's holding back something.   More details on the email from Melinda?  More conflicts than we're aware of?  Managers / wives / musical directors.  Who knows?  

And, do you really think another thread like this is better for the board that a year by year Beatles v Beach Boys poll?  

Yes, I do. Trying to parse out a key part of the latter-day history of the Beach Boys on a BB message board is much more useful than a thread pitting two bands against each other, to say nothing of a thread full of BB fans needing to say their team is better. Some people have more fun making "favorite song" or "favorite band" lists. What I dig is getting into the history of the BBs, as it pertains to this board anyway.

One can argue that a lot of this stuff has been said over and over. But I've also seen about a thousand "vs" and "best this-or-that" poll threads over the years too.

As I often unfortunately have to remind those who aren't a fan of Mike's role in the demise of C50 being explored is that I truly feel my lamenting Mike quitting the band in 2012 is also an endorsement of the guy. He's a big part of a reunion. If I didn't like Mike and didn't like seeing him *with* the entire band, I'd be fine with Brian immediately going back to his own thing after 2012. But C50 was *that* good; it was so good that I think's it's *insane* (and dumb financially and reputation-wise as well) that they didn't keep it going.

I'm sure if you asked Mike if the idea of the band breaking up right after "Kokomo" hit #1 was a good idea, he'd say that's insane.

Fair enough, but I think you should see the forest for the trees, and realize that this is a big enough forum to satisfy all fans' needs, whether it be talking about Beach Boys history, discussing current BB news, or having a little fun with A v B lists. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 25, 2018, 08:50:25 AM
As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so. He was more concerned with complaining about lazy journalists (whose laziness was prompted by Mike's "announcement").

The same "lazy journalists" who kept running promo photos showing the C50 lineup to advertise Mike's shows after C50 had ended?


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: pixletwin on January 25, 2018, 08:52:00 AM
True, he did say that.  But, I think there are other factors that went into the motivations.  Every time he speaks of C50, I always get the feeling that he's holding back something.   More details on the email from Melinda?  More conflicts than we're aware of?  Managers / wives / musical directors.  Who knows?  

And, do you really think another thread like this is better for the board that a year by year Beatles v Beach Boys poll?  

Yes, I do. Trying to parse out a key part of the latter-day history of the Beach Boys on a BB message board is much more useful than a thread pitting two bands against each other, to say nothing of a thread full of BB fans needing to say their team is better. Some people have more fun making "favorite song" or "favorite band" lists. What I dig is getting into the history of the BBs, as it pertains to this board anyway.

One can argue that a lot of this stuff has been said over and over. But I've also seen about a thousand "vs" and "best this-or-that" poll threads over the years too.

As I often unfortunately have to remind those who aren't a fan of Mike's role in the demise of C50 being explored is that I truly feel my lamenting Mike quitting the band in 2012 is also an endorsement of the guy. He's a big part of a reunion. If I didn't like Mike and didn't like seeing him *with* the entire band, I'd be fine with Brian immediately going back to his own thing after 2012. But C50 was *that* good; it was so good that I think's it's *insane* (and dumb financially and reputation-wise as well) that they didn't keep it going.

I'm sure if you asked Mike if the idea of the band breaking up right after "Kokomo" hit #1 was a good idea, he'd say that's insane.

Fair enough, but I think you should see the forest for the trees, and realize that this is a big enough forum to satisfy all fans' needs, whether it be talking about Beach Boys history, discussing current BB news, or having a little fun with A v B lists. 

Hear hear!

I like this forum because it has serious threads with fascinating subjects and knowledgeable participants as well as a goofy and fun threads and everything inbetween.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Rocker on January 25, 2018, 08:57:41 AM

As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so.


Just to point it out, Brian said it "kinda feels like being fired"; that's what the journalists picked up and very quickly led to Mike saying that he didn't and couldn't even fire Brian.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 09:17:41 AM

As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so.


Just to point it out, Brian said it "kinda feels like being fired"; that's what the journalists picked up and very quickly led to Mike saying that he didn't and couldn't even fire Brian.

Nope, incorrect.

The "fired" headlines came before Brian said anything.

Mike's letter to the LA Times came first. Dated October 5, 2012, Mike in that letter was responding to headlines that he had "fired" Brian, Al, and Dave.

Brian responded to Mike's letter on October 9, 2012, pointing out that while he was well aware that Mike didn't have the legal ability to "fire" him, it felt like being fired.

The "Mike fires Brian" headlines came over a week before Mike's LA Times letter, and at least two weeks before Brian's response letter. A quick Google search shows an article from September 26, 2012 mentioning "firing", and I believe such headlines came even earlier than that.

Where did the "Mikes fires Brian" headlines start, resulting in "Mike Love fires Brian Wilson" "trending" on Twitter, etc.? That came as a result of Mike's press release, which was issued on or before September 17, 2012, stating that he was continuing on without Brian, Al, or Dave.

One of the big problems PR-wise was that the "firing" headlines broke *before* the C50 tour was even over, because Mike issued the press release before the tour was over. Why did he issue the press release before the tour was over? Simply and solely because he *chose* to book his own Mike/Bruce shows butted right up against C50 shows. He could have taken another month or two (or the rest of the year) off.

As many have said, if Mike was going to quit the band and go back to his own thing, a press release was *absolutely* needed to alleviate confusion among promoters/agents/fans, etc. The problem was the timing and even more so the tone of his press release. It lacked sufficient compassion for the other co-founders, and didn't really show them much respect. It also didn't really address why he was going back to his own band beyond his "set end date" reasoning. Journalists read this statement, and deduced it was Mike's decision to go back to touring *under the same name* without Brian, Al, and Dave, and made the (legally/technically incorrect) leap to calling it a "firing." That Mike also *did not* explain the nature of the "touring license" didn't help things either.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Pacific Ocean Blue on January 25, 2018, 09:20:44 AM
Mike is such a bitter old man


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Rocker on January 25, 2018, 09:25:18 AM

As many will recall, one early Mike move in trying to shift focus/blame in the aftermath of C50 was to continually point out "I didn't fire anyone!", even though none of the band members ever said so.


Just to point it out, Brian said it "kinda feels like being fired"; that's what the journalists picked up and very quickly led to Mike saying that he didn't and couldn't even fire Brian.

Nope, incorrect.

The "fired" headlines came before Brian said anything.

Mike's letter to the LA Times came first. Dated October 5, 2012, Mike in that letter was responding to headlines that he had "fired" Brian, Al, and Dave.

Brian responded to Mike's letter on October 9, 2012, pointing out that while he was well aware that Mike didn't have the legal ability to "fire" him, it felt like being fired.




Really? I'd have to re-check. But I thought that Brian's comment was what was picked up by the press. Well, maybe not and I stand corrected.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 25, 2018, 10:18:52 AM
Brian’s back was playing up in 2012 and perhaps Mike had bought him some inserts.

Email actually was ‘No more Scholls for Wilson.’


.....I’ll see myself out.  ;D
that was awesome


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 25, 2018, 12:13:53 PM
Really? I'd have to re-check. But I thought that Brian's comment was what was picked up by the press. Well, maybe not and I stand corrected.

The "Mike fires Brian" headlines hit in mid-late September before the tour even ended, in response to Mike's circa 9/17 press release. You can see Google results from September 2012 with the "fired" headlines. It's why that Grammy Museum event on 9/18 was apparently pretty awkward. Why Mike chose precisely the day before that event to put out the press release, I don't know.

Those inflammatory mid-late September headlines (and ensuing backlash on the internet) were surely the main reason Mike felt motivated enough to send a letter to the LA Times. Brian's letter was then in response to Mike's letter.

Both letters were no doubt also picked up by the press. But in the case of Brian's letter, he specifically states in the letter that he can't be fired.

Often forgotten is that Mike ended up with extra egg on his face when, during the 9/18 Grammy event, he referenced the Eagles supposedly overextending themselves on tour and having to sell tickets for five dollars. A spokesperson for the Eagles then had to call Mike out, which resulted in Mike's press person having to issue an apology.

Around this time (I believe), Mike also erroneously accused Al of having anti-Mike stuff on his "website", when in fact what Mike was referencing was Facebook stuff and other social media stuff. Someone working for Mike, as I recall, also had to walk back that statement as well.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: MyDrKnowsItKeepsMeCalm on January 25, 2018, 12:30:43 PM
Since we're strolling down 2012 memory lane... 

https://www.google.com/search?q=beach+boys+nutty+jerry%27s&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Dave in KC on January 25, 2018, 06:17:37 PM
After reading all these pages, the one thing that sticks out to me is that Bruce was cheering for the return of HIS shows, and Mike's of course. That doesn't surprise me at all and I felt that way since the dang tour was announced. Two peas in a pod.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Jay on January 26, 2018, 12:02:31 AM
The thing I keep coming back in this interview are the comments Mike makes about Carl. They just come out sounding so...evil. Never have I ever read comments from Mike where he sounds so downright hateful. They come totally out of the blue too. I don't think I've ever even read a remotely negative comment about Carl from Mike. It comes at the worst possible time too, as we're approaching the 20th anniversary of Carl's passing. I think I just lost any and all respect I had for Mike as a person.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 12:18:33 AM
I know what you mean. Sad part is, I *want* Mike to prove us wrong. I really do. I want to believe the best in people, and until the way C50 ended, I was warming up to the guy. I still think he's incredibly underrated as an artist, and even though  I made many jokes about his new solo disc, Ram Raj was fucking badass. But once again he acts like a prick and undoes any good will he may had recently earned. Talking ill of Carl knowing good and well that he's not around to defend himself, well, that really pissed me off. I know there are some elsewhere that will probably talk ill of my post* but it's how I feel, and objectively I can't see how anyone wouldn't feel the same way. 

*There are a few there who seem to agree. I think it is telling that both boards pretty much seem to be on the same page on this with a few exceptions.

And yeah, there's nothing that he hasn't really said before about Brian, just rehashing the same sh*t, but the stuff about Carl just doesn't sit right with me


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Jay on January 26, 2018, 12:27:35 AM
This is probably going to sound weird, but I think Mike needs some professional therapy. No TM or anything like that. Real, conventional psychiatric therapy. He seems to have deep rooted resentment for all three Wilson's, Al, and Murry(but who wouldn't with him?). I'm NOT condoning or excusing his behavior and comments at all. I just think that if a professional worked with Mike, he would be able to get past everything. For a guy who preaches love and harmony through TM, he sure seems like a bitter old man.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 12:42:48 AM
Well said


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 26, 2018, 06:12:38 AM
This is probably going to sound weird, but I think Mike needs some professional therapy. No TM or anything like that. Real, conventional psychiatric therapy. He seems to have deep rooted resentment for all three Wilson's, Al, and Murry(but who wouldn't with him?). I'm NOT condoning or excusing his behavior and comments at all. I just think that if a professional worked with Mike, he would be able to get past everything. For a guy who preaches love and harmony through TM, he sure seems like a bitter old man.

I think there's a lot of truth to that, and Mike is from a bloodline that has a history of mental illness and abuse. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 26, 2018, 07:29:16 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX  
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX  
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO  
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Juice Brohnston on January 26, 2018, 07:40:28 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX  
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX  
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO  
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

Perhaps not really relevant in this thread, but I do  think that Mike probably has a network of venues/promoters that he is very loyal to. If you look at some of those places (Beau Rivage, Mystic) you realize the band plays there pretty much every year. Mike may have been thinking long term, and wanted to get back to the circuit of contacts that he knows will always book him in.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: rab2591 on January 26, 2018, 07:46:01 AM
*There are a few there who seem to agree. I think it is telling that both boards pretty much seem to be on the same page on this with a few exceptions.

Yeah, Mike blows up on Carl in the weirdest way and now those of us at the “other place” are like a school of piranhas eating bacon? What an odd reaction haha. My favorite though: apparently we’re running a “foolish evasive cherry knitpicked speculative disinformation campaign” here. Meh, we’re just kinda discussing the rather weird responses Mike gave in an interview.

But otherwise, yeah, most here and on the PS forum are having a logical outlook on this interview.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX 
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX 
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO 
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

Perhaps not really relevant in this thread, but I do  think that Mike probably has a network of venues/promoters that he is very loyal to. If you look at some of those places (Beau Rivage, Mystic) you realize the band plays there pretty much every year. Mike may have been thinking long term, and wanted to get back to the circuit of contacts that he knows will always book him in.
That could be part of it as well


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: KDS on January 26, 2018, 09:03:13 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX  
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX  
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO  
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

Perhaps not really relevant in this thread, but I do  think that Mike probably has a network of venues/promoters that he is very loyal to. If you look at some of those places (Beau Rivage, Mystic) you realize the band plays there pretty much every year. Mike may have been thinking long term, and wanted to get back to the circuit of contacts that he knows will always book him in.

That's true.  Mike and Bruce seem to play Wolf Trap in VA around mid to late August every summer for a Sunday afternoon matinee show. 


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 09:05:23 AM
*There are a few there who seem to agree. I think it is telling that both boards pretty much seem to be on the same page on this with a few exceptions.

Yeah, Mike blows up on Carl in the weirdest way and now those of us at the “other place” are like a school of piranhas eating bacon? What an odd reaction haha. My favorite though: apparently we’re running a “foolish evasive cherry knitpicked speculative disinformation campaign” here. Meh, we’re just kinda discussing the rather weird responses Mike gave in an interview.

But otherwise, yeah, most here and on the PS forum are having a logical outlook on this interview.
I'm going to use "Evasive Cherry" for a song title lol

If it was "just" the "normal" Mike vs Brian thing I don't think it would've caused this level of reaction. I do wonder if the few defending Mike on this would defend him no matter what at this point.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 09:08:05 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX 
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX 
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO 
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

Perhaps not really relevant in this thread, but I do  think that Mike probably has a network of venues/promoters that he is very loyal to. If you look at some of those places (Beau Rivage, Mystic) you realize the band plays there pretty much every year. Mike may have been thinking long term, and wanted to get back to the circuit of contacts that he knows will always book him in.

That's true.  Mike and Bruce seem to play Wolf Trap in VA around mid to late August every summer for a Sunday afternoon matinee show. 
. I've always liked when an artist does that, just like the Boys were guaranteed to play on 4 July. I'm real big on tradition with bands.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: KDS on January 26, 2018, 09:17:54 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX 
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX 
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO 
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

Perhaps not really relevant in this thread, but I do  think that Mike probably has a network of venues/promoters that he is very loyal to. If you look at some of those places (Beau Rivage, Mystic) you realize the band plays there pretty much every year. Mike may have been thinking long term, and wanted to get back to the circuit of contacts that he knows will always book him in.

That's true.  Mike and Bruce seem to play Wolf Trap in VA around mid to late August every summer for a Sunday afternoon matinee show. 
. I've always liked when an artist does that, just like the Boys were guaranteed to play on 4 July. I'm real big on tradition with bands.

Same here.  I just wish the venue were more convenient, because I love the idea of a matinee afternoon show.   


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: NOLA BB Fan on January 26, 2018, 09:55:33 AM
The Beau Rivage shows are in conjunction with the "Cruisin' the Coast" event that takes place in Biloxi every year, loads of vintage cars cruising all along the Mississippi Gulf Coast.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: CenturyDeprived on January 26, 2018, 10:27:07 AM
Regarding Mike being required to book his own shows back after C50, it's worth actually looking at his tour schedule for the remainder of 2012 and into 2013.

From September 30, 2012 through the beginning of February 2013, Mike booked...wait for it.... NINE shows across EIGHT venues.

He dumped the reunion tour in order to play these shows:

September 30 - The Legacy Concert for the Children, The Santaluz Club, San Diego, CA
October 5 - Extraco Events Center, Waco, TX  
October 6 - The Backyard, Austin, TX  
October 12 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
October 13 - Beau Rivage, Biloxi, MS
December 21 - New Orleans Bowl Friday Night Concert, Champion's Square, New Orleans, LA (Free Show)
December 28 - Pike's Peak Center, Colorado Springs, CO  
December 31 - Mystic Lake Casino, Prior Lake, MN (2 Shows)

Nothing in November 2012, nothing in January 2013. Only FOUR shows in February 2013. Even assuming maybe he booked a few private/corporate gigs we don't know about, and even taking into account at least three canceled gigs (two in South America, plus in the infamous "Nutty Jerry's" gig), I somehow doubt BRI had a requirement that both *forced* Mike to book shows, but then also allowed for such a *light* tour schedule.

This is just my total guess/gut feeling, but it kind of smells like Mike just started booking a hand full of shows to essentially create a plausible reason to say he couldn't do more reunion shows (See? I already have my own shows booked!), and also to start getting his foot back in the door and re-establish his band as the going "Beach Boys" touring concern.

I think this is absolutely a logical explanation for what happened.

In the history of rock music, I'm sure one would never, ever find a case of a brand name being used SO quickly back to back with different configurations, literally a day or two apart, from the highest art of those UK C50 shows with super huge setlists, butted right up against the M&B show that happened right afterwards. It's insanity, with Mike trying to get people to think it's The Beach Boys so, so soon after an actual BBs show. In the words of Vanilla Ice, "it's not the same".


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 10:35:02 AM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: CenturyDeprived on January 26, 2018, 10:50:31 AM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows. It gives the impression, whether intentional or not, that Mike thinks they don't matter one friggin' iota. It seems to very much much be cut from the same cloth of behavior which no less than Al Jardine publicly in an interview called "crass" (I'm paraphrasing) with regards to how quickly Mike replaced Carl with a surrogate and went back on the road. Yes I realize nobody passed away here, but still it's gross in my book (perhaps not equally as gross). Mike's very, very, very afraid of losing control.

I think the shows SO close to C50 were to flex his muscle and pound on his chest like a gorilla. "I AM the Beach Boys! Rawr!"

(http://i68.tinypic.com/2nrhdt1.jpg)

It's like breaking up with your longtime wife and then going on a rebound adventure 15 minutes later, directly after walking out the door.

I guess Brian's album title "No Pier Pressure" is sort of Brian's "You Oughta Know", where (at least to me) the implication is to remind Mike that it was a slap in the face how quickly Brian was replaced, and wondering if Mike is thinking of Brian as he (Mike) f*cks the brand name into the ground.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 11:11:04 AM
Grab a drink of choice, take a leisurely hour or so if interested, and search the previous discussions on these very same issues regarding C50 and Mike's role in it from previous years. Not wanting this to sound the wrong way, but there were a few of us who have been saying the same things for years at this point, again it's all there available to read and research, from what really happened with the Nutty Jerry's booking to the winery charity gig Mike and Bruce flew back to the States to play immediately after C50...and a gig which some in the crowd assumed would have the full Beach Boys band, not Stamos with Mike's band.

More to come as reminders too, from the Israel bookings to the inanity of Mike claiming that a rather paltry list of B-list shows including one freebie in the wake of C50 were the uber-important bookings he had to make. Tell us any of those shows could not have been worked around if not canceled or postponed...

...and beyond that, logistics aside, how fucking cool would it have been to have Mike, Bruce...AND the other C50 guys (i.e. together known as The Real Beach Boys) show up at something like that car show gig? Just for fun, you know? Yeah, it wouldn't have happened most likely, but Mike just had to play that car show as part of his obligation...so do it! It's one gig.

Mike did not want to continue C50 and be second banana to the notion of a reunited band as a whole, whether personally, financially, or otherwise. He thinks he is or wants to be The Beach Boys. That's pretty much it, isn't it?


And as far as opinions on other forums, for some of those people having to face the facts regarding Mike's comments and C50 and the whole ball of wax would be like giving a globe to someone who believes the earth is flat.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 26, 2018, 11:59:09 AM
Regarding Mike's 2012 bookings, I'm sure many of those are his typical haunts. As I mentioned, I'm sure part of the modus operandi was to re-establish his own touring operation, which would include both literally reasserting his version of the band as *the* version, and also keeping up relationships with venues and promoters, etc.

My point was less about those particular venues, and more the general point that he *didn't* play very many shows for the remainder of 2012 and even going into early 2013. Nine shows in the four months after C50 ended. So he didn't even try find some happy medium between ending the reunion cold or continuing on forever.

I think it was Howie Edelson back then that threw out the idea that to counteract the awful PR, they could have reconvened and announced a New Year's Eve "farewell" concert (or some amount of additional dates to round out the year) and at least end the thing on somewhat of a better note.

And again, back to the *number* of shows he did, doing nine shows across the four months after C50 doesn't really sound anything like the "obligation" Mike describes that he apparently *immediately* had to take on to book more shows. I wouldn't be surprised if the license requires some level of activity/booking (either totally number of shows, or some other measure), but I highly doubt BRI would have taken issue with Mike waiting until the new year to start touring again.

Indeed, Mike booking shows while C50 was still going actually created problems, at least indirectly, for BRI when places like Nutty Jerry's started getting confused and used C50 photos to promote Mike's show. These sorts of problems (and certainly the need to issue a press release before C50 was even over to let people know they wouldn't be getting Brian, Al, or David) would have been largely avoided had Mike decided to simply wait a few months before booking shows.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: Rocker on January 26, 2018, 01:15:30 PM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows.


IIRC, that show was scheduled before the extra dates of the Beach Boys (when I say "Beach Boys" I mean of course the "Beach Boys" and not Mike'n'Bruce) were added; that was mentioned in some article or interview during the tour. So, originally there was a longer gap between the last Beach Boys show and the first Mike'n'Bruce show.
To be honest - and this might be nothing to anyone - I think Mike and Bruce not attending the dinner Brian and Melinda gave for the band and the group of musicians etc. was (again: in my eyes) more offensive, especially since John Cowsill and Scott Totten did attend afaik and also made it to the first Mike'n'Bruce show.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: HeyJude on January 26, 2018, 01:36:12 PM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows.


IIRC, that show was scheduled before the extra dates of the Beach Boys (when I say "Beach Boys" I mean of course the "Beach Boys" and not Mike'n'Bruce) were added; that was mentioned in some article or interview during the tour. So, originally there was a longer gap between the last Beach Boys show and the first Mike'n'Bruce show.
To be honest - and this might be nothing to anyone - I think Mike and Bruce not attending the dinner Brian and Melinda gave for the band and the group of musicians etc. was (again: in my eyes) more offensive, especially since John Cowsill and Scott Totten did attend afaik and also made it to the first Mike'n'Bruce show.

I'm sure Mike ideally wouldn't have had his first show butted up right against the end of C50, as in less than 48 hours later. But again, had he simply showed a bit of restraint as far as waiting a little while to book dates, it wouldn't have been an issue.

If they had had better management at BRI, they could have made things a lot less messy *even if* Mike had decided to end the reunion.

As has been pointed out, the band collectively was a laughing stock of the industry for not having their s**t together after 50 years. They could have made the end of C50 *far more* clean even if they all hated each other's guts.

The way C50 ended also scared away promoters with deep pockets who maybe would have considered booking another reunion tour in 2014 or something. A moot issue of course.

I thought it was pretty hilarious that Mike gave that interview in September 2012 saying he had been told by *someone* in the industry that the reunion should "give it a rest" to build up demand, even though he was planning to go back out on his own "Beach Boys" show less than 48 hours after C50 ended at Wembley.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 01:39:50 PM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows.


IIRC, that show was scheduled before the extra dates of the Beach Boys (when I say "Beach Boys" I mean of course the "Beach Boys" and not Mike'n'Bruce) were added; that was mentioned in some article or interview during the tour. So, originally there was a longer gap between the last Beach Boys show and the first Mike'n'Bruce show.
To be honest - and this might be nothing to anyone - I think Mike and Bruce not attending the dinner Brian and Melinda gave for the band and the group of musicians etc. was (again: in my eyes) more offensive, especially since John Cowsill and Scott Totten did attend afaik and also made it to the first Mike'n'Bruce show.

I too found that highly offensive yet also telling


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: HeyJude on January 26, 2018, 01:45:10 PM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows.


IIRC, that show was scheduled before the extra dates of the Beach Boys (when I say "Beach Boys" I mean of course the "Beach Boys" and not Mike'n'Bruce) were added; that was mentioned in some article or interview during the tour. So, originally there was a longer gap between the last Beach Boys show and the first Mike'n'Bruce show.
To be honest - and this might be nothing to anyone - I think Mike and Bruce not attending the dinner Brian and Melinda gave for the band and the group of musicians etc. was (again: in my eyes) more offensive, especially since John Cowsill and Scott Totten did attend afaik and also made it to the first Mike'n'Bruce show.

I too found that highly offensive yet also telling

It was extra ironic a few years later when Mike posted on Facebook about his birthday party, and went to great lengths to specifically mention that Brian had been invited and that he was bummed that Brian had chosen not to attend.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: HeyJude on January 26, 2018, 01:49:16 PM
I know it's always good to be thankful for what we have and not dwell too much on what could have been, but geez, what a bunch of wasted years since 2012 that they could have been recording albums together and touring.

We're four months away from it being SEVEN years since they first reconvened in May 2011 to re-record "Do It Again." We're now up to 20 years since Al was squeezed out of the band. What a waste. I'm glad Brian has put out some great stuff, as has Al.

But man, C50 was a perfect "proof of concept", that a reunion wouldn't just be a novelty thing where we could say we saw them all up on stage together. What they made was actually legit, true art.

For a guy that seems pretty focused in some ways about his reputation and his place in history, Mike has sure done a good job of running that rep and place in the BB story/history into the ground.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Hickory Violet Part IV on January 26, 2018, 02:02:17 PM
7 years, goodness me!

That's sobering.



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 03:46:16 PM
This is almost as bad as the fake Fleetwood Mac that tried to tour in the 70s

It's also literally so incredibly insulting to the other members to play something THAT close in time to the UK C50 final shows.


IIRC, that show was scheduled before the extra dates of the Beach Boys (when I say "Beach Boys" I mean of course the "Beach Boys" and not Mike'n'Bruce) were added; that was mentioned in some article or interview during the tour. So, originally there was a longer gap between the last Beach Boys show and the first Mike'n'Bruce show.
To be honest - and this might be nothing to anyone - I think Mike and Bruce not attending the dinner Brian and Melinda gave for the band and the group of musicians etc. was (again: in my eyes) more offensive, especially since John Cowsill and Scott Totten did attend afaik and also made it to the first Mike'n'Bruce show.

I too found that highly offensive yet also telling

It was extra ironic a few years later when Mike posted on Facebook about his birthday party, and went to great lengths to specifically mention that Brian had been invited and that he was bummed that Brian had chosen not to attend.
thats shitty


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 03:55:52 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/xZcQgqe.jpg)


The photo which sums up C50.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 04:09:05 PM
And for those who missed it, this was the original listing for that show which Mike and Bruce (with Stamos) played immediately after C50 wrapped in the UK:

http://www.usfcc.org/ (http://www.usfcc.org/)
The Legacy Concert for the Children
We cordially invite you to join us for “The Legacy Concert for the Children” with The Beach Boys as they wrap up their 50th Anniversary world-wide tour. This exclusive event will take place at The Santaluz Club on Sunday, September 30th, 2012.
Santaluz Club
8170 Caminito Santaluz E.
San Diego, CA 92127


Anyone at this show? Info/Setlist?

And some video from that gig, where Mike closes by yelling to the crowd "How about a hand for John Stamos showing up?":

https://vimeo.com/50584304 (https://vimeo.com/50584304)

And the related thread from that time:

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,14425.0.html (http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,14425.0.html)

More on Nutty Jerry's to come...



Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 04:23:36 PM
And while Ang argues that C50 was not a bona fide effort, or doesn't agree with what happened post-reunion, notwithstanding the apparently conflicting press releases, the fact remains that there were contractual obligations in place that the Touring Band had to perform on. 

There was a huge outcry when Brian cancelled the UK tour.  Lots of very disappointed fans.  The Touring Band avoided that by honoring those contractual obligations.  They may have remembered an ill-fated cancelled tour in 1968. I surely remember.
What were those obligations that were in place while C50 was happening? If I recall there was a breakdown of Mike's bookings for immediately following the final UK shows, and there was one show on the books for Chile and another planned for Argentina and both were cancelled, there was the Nutty Jerry's debacle which Nutty Jerry's canceled due to the which-band-is-it confusion, and I believe it was either a day or two after flying back from the UK that the touring band did a charity gig featuring John Stamos in California. After that, for the rest of 2012 the band played just over a half-dozen shows in those final three months. Into January/February 2013 until the end of March, they did a combined half-dozen shows until they traveled to Asia, end of March 2013.

So in roughly 6 months time end of 2012 into 2013, there were about a dozen shows "on the books". The two which fans knew about due to news reports during C50 that caused something of an issue with booking them during C50 and confusions about the names and all of that - Nutty Jerry's and Chile/Argentina - were canceled anyway.

Whatever we want to discuss as far as what could have been done or why things were done or whatever else, the schedule shows that in the 6 months or so following C50 the schedule wasn't exactly packed with contractual obligations. And I remember there was even some confusion about that charity gig with Stamos in California they played as soon as they got back from the UK, that was discussed on this board as it happened.

As far as "lots of very disappointed fans", why did the BB's cancel their performance in Israel? I don't believe an explanation was ever given. Why did they pull out of the "Summernites Cruise" which would have happened last weekend? There were a lot of disappointed fans who thought they'd be seeing the band at that event, too, and I don't think I've seen a reason given for the cancellation. Things happen.
GF - my sidelines observation is that the band seems to return for "annual gigs" so that would be booking out a year in advance.  Eg. Some casino in Mississippi seems to book them every Columbus weekend.  I don't do their booking, so I don't know.  I vaguely remember the Nutty Jerry's thing.  Some local promoters use very outdated photos "on their own" while selling tix. 

IIRC, Israel was cancelled and it was during some heavy bombing. Could it have been for safety?  I don't know.  Some friends were in Israel at the time and told me it was not a safe time.

There could be some clause which releases them for "force majeure." It is a common clause in contacts that frees both parties from liability or obligation when extraordinarily events or circumstances beyond the control of the parties, such as war, strike, riot, crime, or under an "Act of God" clause such as a hurricane, flooding, earthquake, volcanic eruption.

But, if the annual booking theory could be correct and they started planning in December of 2011, those "standing appointments" for October were likely in place.  I'm not privy to their schedule and don't represent that I do.

From what I've read that event (if we are taking about the same gig) was canceled months prior.

And, I've "felt the pain" of a cancelled tour. 1968 - a crushed teenager!  ;)

And there is an old exchange on a topic brought up yet again in this thread, just to show the kind of spin that was launched. In this case, the excuse was that Mike had "contractual obligations" to cause him to slam the door shut on further opportunities with the C50 lineup...which turned out to be a paltry number of shows anyway.

And it brings up the Israel booking, which Mike made it a focal point of his reasoning in Mojo...which later did happen but was canceled...under unknown circumstances...more on that too, I guess.

Just read through some of those golden oldies and get a sense of the spin and parsing that was happening.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 04:33:28 PM
When Mike went on CBS and made the comments directed at Melinda, it went out to however many million viewers were watching, listening, or reading that linked transcript from the CBS program. He cannot assume everyone watching had his book in hand, or even knew he had a book on the market until that segment was aired. Therefore, that's the context - what he said on CBS.

And I'll say again, if Mike is going after Brian's wife on a television appearance adding to all of the comments since 2012 placed in his various interviews promoting his concerts within dozens of newspapers and various outlets, not to mention whatever went on via legal actions, is it surprising that Mike isn't getting invitations from Brian to write songs? If Mike goes after Brian's wife, family, etc in public, and it's been ongoing for years, why or how would Mike be disappointed if they don't have a personal relationship? We're still talking about real people with real emotions and feelings.
GF - there is so much in that book, I found to be very informative.  Maybe a thread should be set up to address that.  And keep comments confined to "If you read this..." please comment. 

It is intense to read, I found, after going throat 400+ pages.  The interviews are beyond the book.  Those relationships are like them walking off-stage after a show.  They go back to their own lives.  That is for the parties to figure out.  It can't be "vicariously" worked out on a message board. I think it is inappropriate. That is my opinion.  Blood is still thicker than water. 

If you read the book, I think your heart will be touched as Carl explains to Brian how they were kept away from him and were not rejecting him. I think you will gain another insight into the history of the band.   

I started a thread on the book, and made specific and sometimes extensive comments based on the actual pages of the book, giving my opinions and impressions of those specific sections in the book, with more to follow. As a result, I've apparently been publicly accused of charging the author with plagiarism, which I never did, and in other cases been accused by you personally among others of claiming posters here like you and Cam had a hand in writing it - a charge which is as laughable as it is false since everything I wrote is still on this board...and available to review in the thread about the book.

My most recent comments on the book are specific to what Mike said to CBS, and the notion of why Brian would be expected to invite Mike to write songs or do much of anything else after seeing his wife be the subject of Mike's comments, on top of Mike saying he was being "controlled" and drugged as recent as the past month in a public interview, and a laundry list of comments made toward his family and assorted issues peppered throughout interviews supposed to be promoting Mike's concerts.

My comments on the book have also been along the lines of what I wish Mike had included in the book, among them the lightning-rod issues like Mike giving seed money to fund the PMRC in the 80's, the 2005 lawsuit which Mike lost and lost big, and the lack of more inter-personal inner workings that were at play within the band during the Smile era.

I've also commented on the lack of context given that June 2012 email that we're told scuppered the extension and further booking of C50 shows, specifically what other emails if any correspondence came prior to the oft-cited email quoted in the book, and what was the context in which that email appeared. My comments on that are based on wondering how a lone email within what was a multi-million dollar corporate structure running C50 and affecting dozens of participants on the tour could be cited as if it came out of the blue with no precedent. I'm one who is curious to learn more about what led to it, and what else may have come prior to it within the chain of operations on that tour as of June 2012.

That's context.


GF - The book is over 400 pages.  It is Mike's account and not a reflection of what others think should be in the book.  The section on the lawsuit which was initiated by Landy with his devious plot to have Brian's kids disinherited, was originated by Landy. 

There are two email exchanges and one is from early June and one from late June.  I thought there was only one. 

IIRC  - three and a half weeks seemed too long to "call back" the first email of "no more shows for us" - which looked pretty final to me.  So, what I learned in the  book, is that there were TWO emails. 

On June 1st (it related to shows in Israel) which was turned down (the "no more shows for Wilson") and a June 25th email to "disregard the previous message." That is found on pp. 401-402. 

The info I am relying on is what is in front of me and not legal advice or counsel.***



The 2005 lawsuit had nothing to do with Landy. Why did you just dodge that entirely and bring Landy into it?

2005.

What if anything came before the email you reference from the book?

As a reader of the book...can I not say "I wish he had talked about that?" as a reaction? Or do we just take everything at face value?

Someone asked you a direct question about something that *is* in the book, and you dodged their question, and further gave the answer "buy the book". How about answering their question, since you said you wanted to discuss what was in the book, and someone asked a specific question about what was actually in the book?

Did Mike on CBS contradict what is in the book about this 'partner' confrontation at C50? Simple question...why duck it?

GF - The overall dispute was over C50 - if someone writes an email that says on June 1st they are done, and the other party "relies on it" - and 25 days elapse, that puts the whole situation in a very different light.  I think the retraction was too late. (not legal advice)***

The suit in 2005 did not prevail. It is not in the book.  The book is enough to deal with.  I am not dodging anything,  I am not interested in discussing it or going on some other tangent.  I'd  like to hear what people think about things such as Carl's last days on the concert tour, it's impact on the band, how they carried on post.  Most do not want to discuss that but get into the soap opera/drama mode over "hot words" that got resolved.  It turned out just fine - but that is not drama.

My head is still exploding over how premeditated Landy was.  More than I ever imagined.   

 

Even more parsing, ducking, and dodging from the good ol' days related to C50, and a tactic which I am informed was still attempted very recently, elsewhere, when someone raised the issue of Mike's 2005 lawsuit...focus on Landy instead, then claim ignorance or use the "move along, nothing to see here" dodge. Oh, and more spin on C50 and this email.

Good times!  :beer


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Shady on January 26, 2018, 04:40:02 PM
Can I quickly make a point about the 2012 Mike and Bruce shows.

We were all on here when that news came through. He was booking shows while the C50 tour was still going on. It was a dick move and he made some really unfortunate comments during the tour too. While it was magical and a time I will never forget, he could have easily ruined it.

Mike has a nobody to blame but himself for the perception out there.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 04:56:11 PM
Last one for now (promise...), "Beach Boys cancel their first Tel Aviv concert" thread from October 2014

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html (http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html)

Mike in the new Mojo article puts the email alongside an offer to play in Israel. That of course never happened with the C50 lineup, but a few years later it was headline news in Israel that "The Beach Boys" were booked to play there, November 29 2014 to be exact.

As you'll see in that old thread, the show suddenly got canceled.

The reports said it was due to lack of ticket sales after potential buyers found out Brian and Al (the C50 lineup) would not be there, but this would be a Mike and Bruce show. A follow up report on the cancellation says this wasn't the case, yet gives no reason why it was cancelled, only that the band cancelled it, not the promoters or agencies due to poor ticket sales.

There has - to the best of my knowledge - *never* been an official explanation from the band or BRI given for the band pulling out of this booking in Israel. I've even asked - no answer given. If you read the reports, poor ticket sales was the reason given in press reports when it was clarified that C50 was not playing, and Brian would not be there. I read those articles, and multiple reader comments (some translated into English from Hebrew) line up with that reason.

So if Mike puts the importance of this June 2012 email around a booking in Israel for C50, then books his own show there two years later only to have it cancelled (still waiting for an official reason over 3 years later), isn't it just a bit ironic *IF* this show was indeed canceled because fans there wanted to see the C50 lineup or at least Brian on stage at the show, then balked when they learned it would be a Mike show instead?

Point is, it's not like this didn't happen before with nearly the same results. A venue books "The Beach Boys" for early Fall 2012, thinking it would be something from the C50 lineup. They find out it will not be C50, and cancel the booking because they thought it was an additional C50 show and would not present something less to their buyers, and announced this in a public statement canceling that show. Then Mike's spokesman tells the LA Times that *Mike* pulled the plug on the show, not the venue/bookers.

That was Nutty Jerry's.

So there is no official word or reason why Israel was canceled in November 2014, even though Mike in Mojo hinges the June 2012 email on an offer for The Beach Boys to play Israel, and Nutty Jerry's cancels a show that was assumed to be but wasn't C50 in Fall 2012, yet Mike's spokesman says Mike was the one who canceled it.

So much for avoiding confusion and setting the record straight.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Debbie KL on January 26, 2018, 05:11:42 PM
It's worth commenting when we see the entire email chain.  Otherwise that discussion is all wild speculation.  The possibility of that email chain being released is about 0, since it's part of BRI business- thus, confidential - so NONE of it should have been made public, by the usual whisper campaign or otherwise.  We know what cherry-picked lines from email chains mean - you're probably being misled, for whatever reason.  With all of that in mind, of course Melinda hasn't shared the emails involved publicly - it's frikkin' confidential.  Something she apparently understands.

Re: the licensing of the BB's music to L&M, has anyone asked what Mike made from that transaction? People are making it sound like that worked badly for him.  Really?

We keep hearing how much Mike makes for BRI, yet we have no idea what that is either, as opposed to what he makes from the touring license.  Has anyone seen any real numbers?  I haven't.

It's interesting to see everyone's view on this subject, but nobody I'm aware of here or on that other board (that I haven't seen, but I know some of the players so probably never will), really have enough details for anything conclusive, other than the fact that Mike is relentless in his attack on the Wilsons in interviews, for whatever reason.  Insiders won't be sharing confidential info, so those who make such "insider" claims - well, take it for what it's worth.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 26, 2018, 06:40:45 PM
It's worth commenting when we see the entire email chain.  Otherwise that discussion is all wild speculation.  The possibility of that email chain being released is about 0, since it's part of BRI business- thus, confidential - so NONE of it should have been made public, by the usual whisper campaign or otherwise.  We know what cherry-picked lines from email chains mean - you're probably being misled, for whatever reason.  With all of that in mind, of course Melinda hasn't shared the emails involved publicly - it's frikkin' confidential.  Something she apparently understands.

Re: the licensing of the BB's music to L&M, has anyone asked what Mike made from that transaction? People are making it sound like that worked badly for him.  Really?

We keep hearing how much Mike makes for BRI, yet we have no idea what that is either, as opposed to what he makes from the touring license.  Has anyone seen any real numbers?  I haven't.

It's interesting to see everyone's view on this subject, but nobody I'm aware of here or on that other board (that I haven't seen, but I know some of the players so probably never will), really have enough details for anything conclusive, other than the fact that Mike is relentless in his attack on the Wilsons in interviews, for whatever reason.  Insiders won't be sharing confidential info, so those who make such "insider" claims - well, take it for what it's worth.
Which makes the fact that there are those who have claimed to have seen the emails...well,they're either lying or confidentiality was broken. Otherwise it is nothing but pure speculation and nothing else. I would take more heed of actual first hand knowledge rather than rumor-mongering from "someone who would know" who may or may not have an axe to grind....and nobody with first hand knowledge will be commenting for reasons you just stated. That said the behaviors or those involved since kind of speak for themselves.

And for the record, piranhas  can't digest bacon.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 26, 2018, 07:13:59 PM
And consider this in terms of logic or lack thereof:

If one of the reasons offered was that Mike was contractually obligated to book shows for his band after C50 ended, why would an email in June be the deciding factor or catalyst in Mike booking shows for his own band?

In other words, if the email mentioned by Mike had *not* been sent in June 2012, wouldn't he have been booking shows for his band anyway if he were under contract to do so?

And if he wasn't booking his own shows until that email came in, when *would* he have started booking them if he were under contract to do so?


It's a piece of simple logic that yet again seems to counter the importance of this lone email and also challenges the excuse of being contractually obligated to start booking shows for the M&B band. Why did Mike wait, or what was he waiting for if booking shows was so vital, and the email was the green-light to do so?

Not to mention, the number of shows that actually ended up getting booked.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: Rocker on January 27, 2018, 04:12:40 AM
Last one for now (promise...), "Beach Boys cancel their first Tel Aviv concert" thread from October 2014

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html (http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html)

Mike in the new Mojo article puts the email alongside an offer to play in Israel. That of course never happened with the C50 lineup, but a few years later it was headline news in Israel that "The Beach Boys" were booked to play there, November 29 2014 to be exact.

As you'll see in that old thread, the show suddenly got canceled.

The reports said it was due to lack of ticket sales after potential buyers found out Brian and Al (the C50 lineup) would not be there, but this would be a Mike and Bruce show. A follow up report on the cancellation says this wasn't the case, yet gives no reason why it was cancelled, only that the band cancelled it, not the promoters or agencies due to poor ticket sales.

There has - to the best of my knowledge - *never* been an official explanation from the band or BRI given for the band pulling out of this booking in Israel. I've even asked - no answer given. If you read the reports, poor ticket sales was the reason given in press reports when it was clarified that C50 was not playing, and Brian would not be there. I read those articles, and multiple reader comments (some translated into English from Hebrew) line up with that reason.

So if Mike puts the importance of this June 2012 email around a booking in Israel for C50, then books his own show there two years later only to have it cancelled (still waiting for an official reason over 3 years later), isn't it just a bit ironic *IF* this show was indeed canceled because fans there wanted to see the C50 lineup or at least Brian on stage at the show, then balked when they learned it would be a Mike show instead?

Point is, it's not like this didn't happen before with nearly the same results. A venue books "The Beach Boys" for early Fall 2012, thinking it would be something from the C50 lineup. They find out it will not be C50, and cancel the booking because they thought it was an additional C50 show and would not present something less to their buyers, and announced this in a public statement canceling that show. Then Mike's spokesman tells the LA Times that *Mike* pulled the plug on the show, not the venue/bookers.

That was Nutty Jerry's.

So there is no official word or reason why Israel was canceled in November 2014, even though Mike in Mojo hinges the June 2012 email on an offer for The Beach Boys to play Israel, and Nutty Jerry's cancels a show that was assumed to be but wasn't C50 in Fall 2012, yet Mike's spokesman says Mike was the one who canceled it.

So much for avoiding confusion and setting the record straight.


Pure speculation on my point but I have a feeling that the fairly high profile events Mike&Bruce got in the years following the Beach Boys tour (for instance in Germany the Last night of the proms engagement and the "Goldene Kamera"-award in ZDF, in the UK the Royal Albert Hall) was a direct result of the big success of C50. They just don't get that press in Germany otherwise.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo - \
Post by: guitarfool2002 on January 27, 2018, 09:40:21 AM
Another bit of logic to consider.

Let's assume this June email exists and was the deciding factor or the go-ahead in Mike booking shows for his own band after C50, for the sake of discussion.

Wouldn't that dismiss the notion of a "set end date" in some way?

As in, if as had been reported there was a set end point which everyone knew about going into the C50 tour, Mike could have been booking shows *for* any time after that end date of C50, *at* any time. Mike would not have needed an email from Melinda Wilson in June to confirm a set end date where he could start booking his own shows if such a set end date was already firmly established from the beginning, as has been suggested often.





Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 27, 2018, 10:08:03 AM
Last one for now (promise...), "Beach Boys cancel their first Tel Aviv concert" thread from October 2014

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html (http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,18428.0.html)

Mike in the new Mojo article puts the email alongside an offer to play in Israel. That of course never happened with the C50 lineup, but a few years later it was headline news in Israel that "The Beach Boys" were booked to play there, November 29 2014 to be exact.

As you'll see in that old thread, the show suddenly got canceled.

The reports said it was due to lack of ticket sales after potential buyers found out Brian and Al (the C50 lineup) would not be there, but this would be a Mike and Bruce show. A follow up report on the cancellation says this wasn't the case, yet gives no reason why it was cancelled, only that the band cancelled it, not the promoters or agencies due to poor ticket sales.

There has - to the best of my knowledge - *never* been an official explanation from the band or BRI given for the band pulling out of this booking in Israel. I've even asked - no answer given. If you read the reports, poor ticket sales was the reason given in press reports when it was clarified that C50 was not playing, and Brian would not be there. I read those articles, and multiple reader comments (some translated into English from Hebrew) line up with that reason.

So if Mike puts the importance of this June 2012 email around a booking in Israel for C50, then books his own show there two years later only to have it cancelled (still waiting for an official reason over 3 years later), isn't it just a bit ironic *IF* this show was indeed canceled because fans there wanted to see the C50 lineup or at least Brian on stage at the show, then balked when they learned it would be a Mike show instead?

Point is, it's not like this didn't happen before with nearly the same results. A venue books "The Beach Boys" for early Fall 2012, thinking it would be something from the C50 lineup. They find out it will not be C50, and cancel the booking because they thought it was an additional C50 show and would not present something less to their buyers, and announced this in a public statement canceling that show. Then Mike's spokesman tells the LA Times that *Mike* pulled the plug on the show, not the venue/bookers.

That was Nutty Jerry's.

So there is no official word or reason why Israel was canceled in November 2014, even though Mike in Mojo hinges the June 2012 email on an offer for The Beach Boys to play Israel, and Nutty Jerry's cancels a show that was assumed to be but wasn't C50 in Fall 2012, yet Mike's spokesman says Mike was the one who canceled it.

So much for avoiding confusion and setting the record straight.


Pure speculation on my point but I have a feeling that the fairly high profile events Mike&Bruce got in the years following the Beach Boys tour (for instance in Germany the Last night of the proms engagement and the "Goldene Kamera"-award in ZDF, in the UK the Royal Albert Hall) was a direct result of the big success of C50. They just don't get that press in Germany otherwise.
You're probably corrrect.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: ♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇 on January 27, 2018, 10:09:25 AM
Another bit of logic to consider.

Let's assume this June email exists and was the deciding factor or the go-ahead in Mike booking shows for his own band after C50, for the sake of discussion.

Wouldn't that dismiss the notion of a "set end date" in some way?

As in, if as had been reported there was a set end point which everyone knew about going into the C50 tour, Mike could have been booking shows *for* any time after that end date of C50, *at* any time. Mike would not have needed an email from Melinda Wilson in June to confirm a set end date where he could start booking his own shows if such a set end date was already firmly established from the beginning, as has been suggested often.





Exactly! Either the email or the "set end date"but not both, because they're contradictory.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: Debbie KL on January 27, 2018, 01:20:10 PM
Another bit of logic to consider.

Let's assume this June email exists and was the deciding factor or the go-ahead in Mike booking shows for his own band after C50, for the sake of discussion.

Wouldn't that dismiss the notion of a "set end date" in some way?

As in, if as had been reported there was a set end point which everyone knew about going into the C50 tour, Mike could have been booking shows *for* any time after that end date of C50, *at* any time. Mike would not have needed an email from Melinda Wilson in June to confirm a set end date where he could start booking his own shows if such a set end date was already firmly established from the beginning, as has been suggested often.





Exactly! Either the email or the "set end date"but not both, because they're contradictory.

Yes, I'm loving this thread because it's cut quite a few heads off the seven-headed snake that is how self-serving people twist and "edit" words to suit their purposes.  If this person and his defenders could just let go of the end of 2012, I think all of us wouldn't be giving it a thought. Like Brian (look at his own successful tours w/o the BB's brand before and since), most of us have moved on.

The same with constant comments about some bad periods for various Wilsons (Carl now, eh?).  Why is this an issue decades later? I think if a person still needs to project such issues onto others, they should start looking inward.  You'd think decades of meditation would have handled that.


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: Magic Transistor Radio on February 08, 2018, 06:01:28 PM
Mojo mentions "Mike Love Gets Angry".  :lol But he's always angry. Will this be a "pre-meditation" interview or will he just be his usual annoying self exclaiming loudly that I did this, I did that, or that was me along with the ever enticing ::) tape loop Beatles story? Readers beware of SOS.



I respect your opinion about Mike. But to say he is always angry true at all!


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: The LEGENDARY OSD on February 08, 2018, 08:12:25 PM
Mojo mentions "Mike Love Gets Angry".  :lol But he's always angry. Will this be a "pre-meditation" interview or will he just be his usual annoying self exclaiming loudly that I did this, I did that, or that was me along with the ever enticing ::) tape loop Beatles story? Readers beware of SOS.



I respect your opinion about Mike. But to say he is always angry true at all!

He possesses a massive chip on his shoulder when he should be thanking his lucky stars he was Brian's cousin. If you'll note he has stated on many occasions that TM helps keep his anger in check which I thin is complete bullshit. Read the interviews. Look at the HOF speech. There's your angry myKe luHv.  ::)


Title: Re: Mike Love in New Issue of Mojo -
Post by: Hickory Violet Part IV on February 08, 2018, 10:40:39 PM
Mojo mentions "Mike Love Gets Angry".  :lol But he's always angry. Will this be a "pre-meditation" interview or will he just be his usual annoying self exclaiming loudly that I did this, I did that, or that was me along with the ever enticing ::) tape loop Beatles story? Readers beware of SOS.



I respect your opinion about Mike. But to say he is always angry true at all!

He possesses a massive chip on his shoulder when he should be thanking his lucky stars he was Brian's cousin. If you'll note he has stated on many occasions that TM helps keep his anger in check which I thin is complete bullshit. Read the interviews. Look at the HOF speech. There's your angry myKe luHv.  ::)

Yes, and even when he's happy and laughing, he's usuallly laughing at someone elses expense.