The Smiley Smile Message Board

All the best Ramones tunes have a BBs tinge to em...its been said before but when you listen to Rocket to Russia they were totally channeling the mid 60s and rejuvenating rockNroll in a way it hadnt been in years...

 :'(

Where they left off in 63 or 64.

I do not agree.

To some degree. The parallels between 'trend' songs like Surfin' U.S.A. and 'Sheena Is A Punk Rocker' for instance are striking. Both Joey and Brian worshipped Spector. I also think girl groups and 50's music had a marked influence on the whole Ramones/Heartbreakers/Thunders thing - in Thunders' case he has specifically cited his sister's record collection growing up, The Shangri-La's etc. To say the Ramones 'picked up where they left off' is overstating a little for my tastes, since the Boys were never really headed in a hard rock direction.

I'd also argue for some of the Ramones later output, particularly Dee Dee's songwriting contributions. Always very heartfelt and thought provoking: Poison Heart and I Don't Want To Live This Life Anymore. I guess as the most obviously doomed, hard-ass and possibly sensitive member of the group he could be looked at as their Dennis.

Well I dont mean literally but in the sense of the BBs golden era in 64-65 then skip to the Ramones in 77&79-81...great eras in pop/rock..

I absolutely love the Ramones, but I don't see them as the band that picked up where they (the Beach Boys) left off at any point. The Ramones were influenced by the Beach Boys...they've said it themselves a million times. But the Ramones are their own thing, not the 'second' Beach Boys. Or the 'second' Vagrants, Seeds, MC5...

I hear ya. The Ramones are certainly partly born of the Beach Boys and if the Beach Boys never existed the Ramones would sound remarkably different if they even existed as it all. And I'd wager having someone take what you did as a starting point and run with it in their own direction is as good a compliment as can be paid to an artist or group.

I think it's great that you like punk rock kook, but I think your threads linking The Beach Boys with the punk movement shows that any connection between the two is very, very tenuous at best. Brian and The Beach Boys were had lush and luxurious arrangements worlds away from punk rock. Although I suppose early stuff like "Surfin' U.S.A." does have that energy.

My good man, I don't know what hallucinogenic you're doing but dammit, I want some.  ;D

"Rockaway Beach" is a natural one to connect to the Beach Boys. The Ramones covered "California Sun" which is obviously a vocal surf number in the style of The Beach Boys.

Manager Seymour Stein saw and is on record as noting the musical connection between the two groups.

The Ramones recorded with Brian's hero Phil Spector and Joey Ramone had a Ronnie Spector-like vocal quality which the Beach Boys lacked.

Musically, Ramones songs like "Oh Oh I Love Her So" could easily be a Beach Boys song.

The Ramones' lyrics often could easily be Beach Boys lyrics as they often feature similar themes and sentiments.

Brian Wilson once remarked that he'd like to work with The Ramones.

Both groups have been referred to as "America's Band."

PUNK magazine's biggest selling issue was MUTANT MONSTER BEACH PARTY which features Joey w/surf board and was made in the style of Warren Publication's HORROR OF PARTY BEACH mag. This all can be traced back to the surf craze which The Beach Boys were obviously a big part of as far a spreading the word about the sport.

The Ramones did a better job of "Do You Wanna Dance" than The Beach Boys did IMHO.

The Ramones did the movie ROCK 'N' ROLL HIGH SCHOOL and the title song is basically in The Beach Boys style. The Beach Boys also did films that featured their songs.

My last point is that I can't pin any Beach Boys feeling on any other punk rock group. The Ramones were the only group that "got it" and could give listeners that Beach Boys type thing!!!!!!!!

There are Ramones-like groups that play upon the Ramones/Beach Boys connection.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2QAelJOwCA

Here's another.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjqZZmDSilI

The Ramones' finest moment may well be their "Sheena Is A Punk Rocker" single which reeks of the Beach Boys' style.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Huo_KNYUFZw

Have to make a correction. Seymour Stein was not the manager of The Ramones, Danny Fields was. Stein was Sire Records. The record label guy made the Ramones/Beach Boys connection.

I don't think anyone is denying that an influence exists, but influence is a far cry from "picked up where The Beach Boys left off".  If anything they went back to the beginning and picked up where the BB started.  But picking up where The Beach Boys left off, not at all.  Their sound is, what, 63-64 Beach Boys?  But after that came Today, Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile, Holland, etc.  I don't hear much beyond the surf/car stuff in The Ramones.  I like them, I get what they were doing, but they didn't pick up where The Beach Boys left off, unless you mean The Beach Boys left off with 15 Big Ones, or the Endless Summer compilation, and just ignore Pet Sounds, etc.

EoL

The Ramones did a better job of "Do You Wanna Dance" than The Beach Boys did IMHO.

I like both versions but no, just no! The collage of sound in the Beach Boys' version is incredible. Nothing wrong with the Ramones approach but I prefer the Beach Boys' version.

Disagree strongly.

No. The world doesn't revolve around these two bands as you seem to think. The Beach Boys influenced many other bands and The Ramones were influenced by many others bands.

3 bands! He likes Surf Punks too  ;D

From my point of view The Ramones were my generation's Beatles.

They got lots of folks forming groups which is similar to what happened in the sixties when The Beatles arrived on the scene.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/the-beatles-top-spin-magazines-list-of-the-50-greatest-bands-of-all-time-75378722.html

But musically and lyrically The Ramones were much closer to The Beach Boys than The Beatles even though The Ramones took their name & fashion sense largely from the early Beatle's sensibilities.

The Ramones were three chord oriented but they weren't blues oriented. The Beatles were blues oriented. The Ramones were major key oriented. The Beach Boys were major key and three chord oriented too. The Ramones & The Beach Boys weren't as Blues as The Beatles. The Ramones & The Beach Boys were more POP. At least that's my uneducated musical guess.

This is it in a nutshell. After The Beach Boys' initial glory days musical nods back to those days were always tinged with a sense of nostalgia. It was different when The Ramones looked back & emulated The Beach Boys' style. It wasn't nostalgia. It was different! It was new! It was NOW! The Beach Boys' basic aesthetic became Punk Rock. How forever cool. Thanks Ramones.

So while groups like The Raspberries and The First Class were nostalgic in their honoring of The Beach Boys' style The Ramones took it somewhere else forever and I think that's basically the point that the author of this thread was trying to make.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8HxnhD4c6k

nope

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDm8aWzO3fU

Certainly not where the Beach Boys left off when there Ramones started.  The latest Beach Boys studio. album at that time was Holland. Certainly nothing like the Ramones.  I agree that there are similarities with the early Beach Boys though.

I think that while you made some interesting points, I don't think it's anywhere near the point that the original poster was making. It seems that he really just likes punk rock (a lot of which suck, beyond The Ramones, The Clash and a few others) and The Beach Boys and he wants to feel there's a major tie between the two for whatever reason.

Obviously early BBs are one Ramones influence.  A parallel between the two bands' earliest albums and connections to a particular style, place, image, tongue in cheek humor could also be made.  Fairly rudimentary but energetic self taught instrumental prowess (BBs vocals notwithstanding), Southern California/New York, surfing/Punk Rock, Pendleton shirts/leather jackets, "Chug-a-lug"/"Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue"...as well as the image becoming constricting as time wore on.

I hear a lot of similarity between The Beach Boys (yes, beyond '63 or '64) and The Ramones. It'd be best to calm down a bit about it, though.

some of you make me wonder if humans are still the most intelligent mammals on the planet.

I don't agree.

On a sidenote, I think that Dennis would've been a better drummer for the Ramones than he was for The Beach Boys.

I don't think Dennis would've been able to handle the constant double-time on the hi-hat that Tommy and Marky Ramone had to do at break-neck speed. It's not as easy as it sounds. Dennis was a great drummer though, I'm certainly not knocking his talents. Dennis was a powerhouse on those skins.

On a sidenote, even though I'm a big fan of 70's era Punk, these Beach Boys/Punk threads are silly. Aside from a few punk bands from the 70s (like the Ramones and the Dictators) most punk is noisey hardcore with very little melody or anything lush and romantic. I doubt that bands like Crass, Discharge, GBH and Conflict care for beautiful Brian Wilson music. Early punk rock musicians loved early rock & roll, hence the appreciation of BBs from some of the early bands. But punk (real punk, not new-wave) became aggressive street music. You're not going to see too many guys with green mohawks and studded leather jackets with that official Beach Boys logo painted on their punk garb. Beach Boy music has no safety pins stuck in it.