The Smiley Smile Message Board

Time to settle this. On her website, she lists this Beach Boys song as being a hit she plays guitar on, and further claims the late Billy Strange played lead, citing a "Union contract" as the source. However, according to the American Federation of Musicians contract for this recording, and the memory of David Marks, neither of them did.

So, to settle this once and for all, I call on her to post this contract on her site - or here - and prove her claim, and prove me wrong, in which case I will humbly and unreservedly apologise for stating in the past that her claims in this respect are false. If, as she claims, this contract proves she does play on this Beach Boys recording, then surely there can be no reason whatsoever to withhold it.

Whose recording of "Surfin' U.S.A." was she on? Was it The Hot Doggers (aka Bruce Johnston) version? Or some other thing of that type?

I don't get why this is a big deal to keep fighting an old lady. I think both carol and you would be much happier avoiding each other.

Don't know for sure. The Hot Doggers is as good a guess as any. Hopefully we'll see when she posts the AFM sheet. Tha date of the session and the studio will be instructive.

The why is simple, but I'll explain anyway. She claims to have documentation that proves she's on a Beach Boys hit single that currently existing documentation states she isn't. Be this so, I can see no reason for her not posting it and making me look a prize tit into the bargain.  ;D

Yeah. No offense, our all-knowing guiding light (no sarcasm whatsoever here, you know you are), but where's the constructive side of this bickering? We the hardcore fans more or less already know the truth, and Carol claiming something outlandish doesn't really sway anyone. General public doesn't care. People writing books on this stuff know better. So what's there to gain. This is like old lumberjacks or sailors reminiscing - year by year, their stories of past adventures get bigger and better... Old age does that to you.

A friend of mine who actually took lessons from Carol Kaye told me she produced union contracts for "Surfin' USA" and showed them to him. However, one thing he could NOT confirm: that it was actually a Beach Boys session.

My thoughts exactly, BUT: she actually sent lawyers after people who disagreed with her.

the way is clear: All of us should join together to sponsor AGD for lessons from Carol; he can then view the contracts personally and clear this up once and for all

Yeah. No offense, our all-knowing guiding light (no sarcasm whatsoever here, you know you are), but where's the constructive side of this bickering? We the hardcore fans more or less already know the truth, and Carol claiming something outlandish doesn't really sway anyone. General public doesn't care. People writing books on this stuff know better. So what's there to gain. This is like old lumberjacks or sailors reminiscing - year by year, their stories of past adventures get bigger and better... Old age does that to you.
[/quote]

I'm not bickering... just asking, politely, that she post this contract, prove herself right and me - not just me, granted, but me in particular - wrong. 

Assuming the lessons are on guitar or bass, not how to fool the public for 50 years, then, yes, by all means.

i'm behind Andrew...set the record straight once and for all.

Yeah, time to put it to bed. Might take some doing though on AGD's part, but maybe it's time to set the record straight.

And while we're at it, is everything else agreed upon as far as Carol playing on other Beach Boys songs, i.e. the Good Vibrations bass part and bass on I Was Made To Love Her?

I have to agree and with Jukka's post too. The more you challenge her the more likely she is to dig her heels in anyway - she strikes me as quite a proud woman. Why don't we just appreciate her for what she contributed to the records and accept she may misremember a few sessions here and there? This all seems a bit petty to me.

It's a case of giving the right credit to the right people. There are a lot of people who seek to minimize the musical contributions of the actual Beach Boys to their own records. As a fan of the band, I don't see how letting these people off the hook benefits the Beach Boys' legacy. If I were Carl, for example, I'd be pretty ticked off that tracks I worked hard on are slowly being credited to other people and my fans are seemingly okay with it. If AGD can set the record straight, then more power to him. 

Smile Brian - The Wrecking Crew story is an important one, and I saw the movie a few years back, which I really enjoyed, seeing these gifted musicians working on the background music for these mega stars we know and love.  It is amazing how so many broke out on their own to be mega stars in their own right.  

But, I'm with Andrew on this and do respect his scholarship. Tell the story correctly and I guess that means historical accuracy. It isn't about "fighting an old lady."  And, I bet she wouldn't appreciate a reference as such.  She did make a real contribution, but reliable history always demands accuracy.  

What is the point of AGD trying to do it?

The two haven't gotten along for years and its more a feud between people at this point. AGD should be happy that the fanbase general knows the what the BBs played on, meaning all the work of scolars like him wasn't in vain.

It isn't about getting along.  It is about historical accuracy.  He is an historian.

What does that mean? The "fanbase knows what the BB's played on?" Why should he be happy about that? 

Do you mean he should "settle" with that, and not seek to see that writings are accurate?

The Wrecking Crew story isn't just about The Beach Boys. 

But, as it relates to The Beach Boys, it is important to Andrew.

If I want to read a fairy tale, I'll read Hans Christian Andersen. 

Historians! Now with extra gloating for those hard to reach problem stains.

Act now and we'll harass a senior citizen for YEARS about confusing some recording sessions amidst thousands of others half a century ago at NO COST TO YOU!

Hey! Mike should get her to play bass on Good Vibrations at the RAH. Then you guys can sort this out face to face. Bring seconds and weapons of choice.

Did you see the film?

It is not just about The Beach Boys. 

Cher was involved, as many others. 

You might be satisfied with sloppy or speculative journalism, but we aren't all in that category. 

And, news flash, a great deal of the fanbase are "senior citizens" since the demographic is generally considered to be over the age of 55!  But contemporaries of the band are in their late 60's and early 70's. 

Filmakers need to be accurate and not biased. Unless they are telling a fairy tale, and everyone knows that it is.  And, despite the fact that the film is very entertaining, and generally informative, and the music fantastic, there have been questions raised about the full accuracy. 

Can't that be corrected? It is sloppy, otherwise. 

Doesn't Carol go nuts if she hears the words "Wrecking Crew?" You guys should settle this with weapons. Get Tedesco's son to document it then suddenly Carol can turn on him after she dispatches Doe. She's got the stamina to withstand his relentless assault of logic and ample documentation, plus she'll swing the bass when he produces the documents with a flourish.

It'll be a bloodbath. Think of the headlines.

Ha Ha Ha Ha! sh*t. Ontor, you oughta open for the Mike & Bruce show, man!   ;D

Whatever moniker is used to represent the group of session musicians is of no real consequence.  The point of Tedesco's telling the story of his dad's life, and others, is an important one. I saw him in person a couple of years ago at a screening.

The story is an important one; one which is very exciting, especially to those whose music was of that generation.  I don't know if she "goes nuts" and it is of no consequence.  I've read where other musicians were credited for session work actually done by The Beach Boys.  

So, authentication is a problem.  Providing the documents should not be a big problem to refute a contention of working or not working on a particular recording.  

I'm sorry that more people don't think it's a big deal. No matter how old, or how talented, or how crazy, or how whatever Carol is, her claim about SUSA disrespects and diminishes the Beach Boys as musicians on their own iconic hit record that was recorded a year before she played on her first Beach Boys session. She is essentially saying that on Surfin USA, the record that gave the Beach Boys their first massive hit, Carl is not playing the lead guitar, that I'm sure at 16 he worked very hard on and was very proud of, and David is not playing the rhythm that at 14 he performed brilliantly. She's taking credit AWAY from the people who made the music, and you'd be surprised at how many people buy her claim. I've had so many people tell me that it's her and Billy Strange on the record, as if I needed to be educated about it. Where do you think these people get that erroneous point of view from?  From her constant reminder to people that it's not the Beach Boys on that record even though it is. I'm happy AGD will call her out on it, not much upside for him, he'll get told he's on a fool's errand going after an old lady, and that no one cares, and that he's disrespecting a legend etc... The ONLY upside is that he's fighting for what is right and what is true.

Print the facts, publish the books. Correct the record! Sure. I can see your side and agree. You're clearly right. But the baiting and gloating gets a bit much and it sometimes seems like this is more personal than about recording contracts.

Then, as much as I like Carol (we communicated back and forth for a few days in the early 2000's and she signed a couple things for me) AGD needs to step up and "go for the jugular" this time. I don't really like that term, especially when we're talking about a senior citizen and a nice lady to many, but it really needs to be put to rest somehow. The SUSA session sheet needs to be produced, and maybe two or three people (including maybe Dave Marks) who were actually there at the session, to back it up. Since Brian and Mike don't remember for sure (or do they?) then those are the only three who were there who aren't deceased, including Nick Venet, Carl and Dennis, Murry, and maybe Frank Devito.

There is no doubt that Carol made her many contributions and we admire her for it.  No doubt she deserves respect but she can't claim prizes she didn't win.  The older I get the sharper my failing memory gets.  I wouldn't think that I'm the only one who makes mistakes about what happened way back when.

I'd prefer that Andrew set the record straight.  It's what he's always done and what he should continue to do...just to keep everybody credible.  I would think that Carol would ultimately want that too.

But you know us 'seniors'.  Sometime we can be such dicks.  [well, in this case maybe not :-[ ]

She also claims to have played guitar on Jan & Dean's "Surf City" despite the AFM contract of the session not listing her presence.

I think it's not the misremembering that bugs Andrew but rather her not showing the decency to even consider she might actually misremember.



Exactly! There you have it yourself. :)



Exactly!



Yeah, let's rather harrass an old man who won't stop bragging instead... ;D

:lol :lol :lol  This is about as important as what color socks we wear. Let it be for Christ's sake. The world ain't perfect and neither is the self- proclaimed monarch of this and other boards. :shrug

Show me where I'm baiting or gloating in this thread. I've just asked, politely, that she produce this contract she states she has which proves she plays on the BB recording of "Surfin' USA". She does that, and it IS for the BB session, and I will unreservedly apologise. She has everything to gain, and I a lot to lose. Exactly how is that baiting ?

The truth does matter.

If it was just the memory of a session player who played hundreds of dates fifty years ago, I'd chalk it up to the ravages of time.  But since she contends there is an AFM contract, I would like to see it.

I see no meanness, no animosity, no harassment there.

She purports to have a document that changes our understanding of the history of the Beach Boys in the studio at a critical session early in their career.  Let's see it.

Agreed - establish the facts but do so politely and respectfully. It's AGD's reputation - not Carol's - that will be diminished by these belligerent 'Let's settle this' threads. 

Belligerent ?

Where, exactly ?

Clearly, the problem certain people have here is with the poster, not the post.

Well, not Andrew's reputation, but maybe David's and Carl's, if they played on that recording. Several BB historians, including Stebbins, have worked hard to "un-spin" lore about who did what during those early years.  

And if David Marks was about 14 years old or even 15, at the time, it is a pretty amazing feat, and sort of the work of a prodigy.  As time goes on, I'm appreciating his early and important role in this band more.

JMHO

If I were Carol Kaye I would find the following quite challenging and confrontational. It's belligerant in the sense that you come across somewhat like a prize fighter goading his opponent into the ring:


It strikes me that historical inaccuracy seems to be one of your biggest bugbears. When people get their facts wrong here you're often quite withering in the way you call them out and I don't see your treatment of CK as any different. By all means strive for the truth and flag up inaccuracies where you see them but I don't see why you can't treat the subjects respectfully in the process. if I were an ageing principle player with shakey recollections of the BB golden years, you're the last person I'd be sharing those memories with, despite your credentials as primo BB scholar. Don't burn your bridges, AGD!

I'm all for establishing the facts and giving the correct people their credit but my argument is that AGD's confrontational stance does more harm than good. CK is not going to read this thread and weigh in with her contract is she? If she has anything to do with this it will be to parade it as an example of AGD the troll and bully and other reliable sources may be inclined to give AGD a wide berth in the future. If he wants the truth from Carol a polite approach would be more effective imo. Aesop's Wind and the Sun and all that ...

It would be one thing if Carol Kaye was just claiming "Surfing USA". But she is notorious for claiming to have played on records that she either didn't play on or work that ended up not being used ('Good Vibrations' being a good example. Unless my eyes deceive me, according to the GV session credits in the Smile box, none of her work ended up on the master recording.) Her early Motown claims are notorious and have been disproved by the master tapes with session chatter from the Funk Brothers preceding the released takes. She has also claimed such songs as Elvis's "Suspicious Minds" (Cut in Memphis with Mike Leech on bass), Del Shannon's "Runaway" (Bell Sound Studio in NYC w/Milt Hinton on bass) Dusty Springfield's "Son Of A Preacher Man" ( Memphis with Tommy Cogbill on bass - this one pisses me off the most because it's my favorite bass performance of all time.) "Last Train To Clarksville" by the Monkees (Larry Taylor on bass), the Doors' "Light My Fire" (Larry Knechtel on bass) and many more. She has been confronted with these discrepancies on more than one occasion and her sessionography may have been altered accordingly in the ensuing years (one would hope so). But at one time or another, she has claimed to have played on way too many songs that she wasn't on for her to be let off lightly.  Again, this isn't just about "Surfing USA."

She's lying but do you think she can be convinced to stop lying?

Probably not. But, really, she doesn't have to be. As Carol has said many times, all of her claims will be proven when the Russ Wapensky book comes out. Release date - The 12th of Never.

In that case, I fail to see the point of taking this issue directly to her.

I likewise have no interest in debating conspiracy theorists.

Great post.

Well...yes. When one is an historian that tends to be the case.

I've been waiting for that book to come out for years. Carol even said she contributed info to Russ. I understand now that it's not going to happen.

"I Was Made To Love Her" was another one she said she played on.  She's got a few Youtube clips in interviews and stuff playing the Good Vibrations bass part. Did she invent it? The way she plays it and describes it, you would think she invented it AND that she played the final take on the record.

I wouldn't go so far as to say she's LYING -- what would she have to gain? I will forever maintain that she's simply played on so many sessions over the decades that they're a blur to her and she may honestly believe she was on the ones she wasn't.

What does bug me, though, is that she is so stubborn about it....again, to the point that she has actually sent lawyers out to attack those who question her.

Does one also value context too?

It is my, admittedly non-precise, opinion that because the majority of people out there still don't know that the band themselves played on many of their early recordings (the perception that the "wracking crow" played every session still dominates) it IS important to make sure that these credits get assigned rightly.   Assigning credit correctly is important.  It is.  
I don't think this has to be a case of impoliteness or beating up on an old lady (and I doubt this is what the Doester is doing, least I hope not), it is simply just a push for credit where credit is actually due (or Doe, if you prefer  :lol)  
I bet if someone else were claiming credit for playing bass/guitar on a session Ms. Kaye had actually played those instruments on - she herself would be crying foul too, so ya know....

This seems more like a pissing Match than finding real historical context at this point. We know Carol's memory is faulty, just state the facts and move on.

Glen Campbell said he played on 5 different sessions of Good Vibrations (that he knows of). It has been determined that it wasn't the case. Speculation is that he was "egged on" by the interviewer to say that. Obviously he wouldn't remember it today......

I agree. I remember when I was younger, my parents (somewhat fans at the time but not really) told me that The Beach Boys didn't play on any of their hits. These are just two average fans who have this perception about the band.....and it seems to be a common perception. The record should be set straight and I don't care how it's done. The people who spout this misinformation should be called out on it.

I'm 100% with Andrew on this one.

If Carol has been making false claims (apparently the case) where credit is not due concerning Beach Boys classics, shrugging it off as a who cares or picking on an older woman with a faulty memory is BS. A lot of stuff on this board is nonsense.... this however DOES diminish the Beach Boys legacy and as Stebbins pointed out the Beach Boys themselves DID play on many hit records and getting their rightfully deserved credit for it matters. Facts don't always matter, but in this case they do. If she IS wrong and has been taking credit for years as it seems....... then that is rather pathetic.

Wapensky's contract was cancelled in 2003.

This isn't about memory. She says she has a union contract proving she played on The Beach Boys recording of "Surfin' USA". All she has to do to prove she is right, and many BB historians are wrong (and make me look something of a fool), is to show it to someone. It's that simple.

An issue might be, whether there is some alternative means of verifying "independently" whether the band members played on this.  Is it possible the union kept any kind of records? Or whether they could exist on microfiche elsewhere?

It is always better to find a non-confrontational way to find the answer, if that is possible.

I've been on youtube listening to chunks of both the Brian Wilson songwriter, and the outtakes of the Wrecking Crew.  Even if the answer is not there, it is interesting. 

That doesn't/won't solve the basic problem of CK claiming, wrongfully, she played on SUSA. As many many others have stated, if she won't put up, she should shut up.
 But at this point, it's fairly obvious there's no way she will. Too embarassing to admit she's wrong after all this time


I don't see ANY pissing match; I see AGD trying to set the record straight for posterity. AGD, Jon, practically everyone here has stated the facts, but "we" can't move on without getting  CK to admit her mistake, which, sadly for her, is part and parcel of getting the facts laid out to the general public

Bgas - if "independent evidence" is located, and authenticated, her claims become moot. 

Memory...it doesn't work well for me all the time.  My time frames aren't what they used to be.  Carol USED to post occaisionally on the blue board.  This would be maybe 8 or 9 years ago?  Andrew?

At any rate something went down where she was no longer welcome to participate there.  She did or said or claimed something that didn't 'fly' and all those years of working together and all of the good will accrued was tarnished.

Could it be that there is something wrong with her?  Maybe some issues that could/should eventually be revealed and this behavior will  be excused further down the path?  sh*t happens to many of us. :hat

As this thread suggests, independent evidence has de-legitimized several of her claims already, but that hasn't stopped her from making them as far as I'm aware.

Correct!  And she has the bigger voice/notoriety for spreading 

f*** yes. That's why I care deeply about setting the record straight regarding who really played on the records... precisely because it enhances context while loving the music.

For the record (pun definitely intended) - Jon, Andrew, and I are are all of one mind when it comes to this.

That's all fine and good, but what are you guys going to do to put this to rest?  Let's get down to brass tacks instead of chattering about it and continually bouncing it all around on a public forum. 

Exactly.

The problem is that her version of things sticks. A friend of mine who is deep into jazz once said to me: "Hey, I've just watched this TV documentary and had to think of you. I didn't know it was Carol Kaye who played bass on 'Good Vibrations'!" I then had to explain to him what has already been stated in this thread, that none of her takes were used in the final version.



This is a mean joke, and I'm indignant at myself that it made me grin! :o

There's an AFM contract listing the musicians for that session as Brian, Carl, Dennis, Mike & David.

Fourteen. She stormed off when several posters, myself included, politely pointed out that her claim that Ray Pohlman didn't play on a Pet Sounds track was contradicted by the AFM contract, the box set liners and the session extracts therein. When I quoted said contract I was accused of stealing it.

Done. I've posted here, which she monitors, requesting the supporting documentation be posted, or shown to someone. All she needs to do to make me look a complete tool, and re-rewrite BB history by proving her claim is to comply. Work of minutes, if not seconds. Then I unreservedly apologise, and we move on.

And, there's Frank Devito's recollection of playing on the session with The Beach Boys (not other session players) - Devito was paid with a check from Murry, hence the absence of his name from the AFM contract - plus David's recollection of playing on the session (rhythm, plus the descending low staccato slides in the fade), and his clear recollection of playing the date with Devito, and his assertion that Carol Kaye never played a Beach Boys session while he was with the group. Finally, at the end of the unfaded "Surfin' U.S.A." session tape, Brian's voice can be heard in the background exclaiming, "That's it, Carl got it!" - obviously indicating his pleasure with Carl's guitar solo.

There's only one vowel difference between Carl and Carol.

Just sayin'....

 :)

I was thinking the same thing. Let's listen to that session tape, it could be a game-changer!   :lol

Thanks to Andrew and c-man for that info.  

First, it is refuted by "Devito," paid separately by Murry.  Second, an AFM contract.  It that was in someone's possession, or otherwise locatable, and scanned, and perhaps even posted (after having been appropriately "redacted") that document should be all that would be necessary to extinguish this nonsense.  Third, David's recollection.

Claiming that work does diminish the contributions of a then 14 year old (David) and a 16 year old (Carl.) Both minors.  

This is notwithstanding the fact that as a woman, in that era, she was sort of a pioneer, and deserves recognition for "what she did." However, not for "what someone else did."  

No one can take that feminist legacy from her, but those "young" Beach Boys shouldn't lose this authentication, either.

Sort of taking candy from a baby, retrospectively.  Just sayin'... ;)

The AFM sheet has been published, by Stephen McParland.

Good. And FWIW, maybe a couple of e-mails to her from fans wouldn't hurt, referencing this board if she hasn't seen it already. Seems to me the original AFM sheet tells the whole story already, unless she can produce some other "union contract" which would supplement the AFM info and create more confusion. I mean, the AFM IS a union contract! I think you're safe from being a Tool, AGD.  :-D

Thanks, Andrew, I didn't know that. 

But it does sounds like very credible evidence. 

The kind that is hard to refute.

It's not a joke at all. Glen states it in the American Band video. What I was trying to say is that (disregarding that he currently has Alzheimer's) that his answer might be different today concerning his belief that he played on GV. Or maybe not. Maybe somebody told him he did and he went with it.

P.S. No, Alzheimer's is nothing to joke about!

That being the case, it aappears to be stalemate. McParland's publishing wouldn't seem to be recent unless it's in a recently published book, so the information has been available.
CK has been making her SUSA claim for a long time, so unless she's willing to admit a mistake (which she seems unwilling to do) if "we" want her to change her tune, some way has to be found to make it appear as tho the error lies somewhere other than in her court.
If this can't be accomplished, seems to me it will always come across as a grudge match between CK and AGD

Getting really off topic now, I think it is ok to make jokes about the disease itself to a certain extent, but not about people who actually have it. That's why I'm indignant about myself finding it funny.

And thanks for the tool joke, I was fighting myself not to make a complete tool of myself myself by once more pointing out a poster's little typo which is a nasty habit of mine. I'm still trying to imagine what a complete tool might be. :)

Now back on topic.

"I'm still trying to imagine what a complete too might be. "

 ;)  Also?  ;)

Darn! :lol Fixed it. :-[

How do you know she monitors the forum?

AGD monitors her house.  :-D

 

You sure about that?? Gle's in neither the VHS nor DVD copy I have of said documentary...

It's either in "American Band" or the '76 "It's OK" special.  Maybe in the latter now that I think about it.

sh*t.  Maybe I have Alzheimer's........

Have you tried calling her, AGD? Might be more successful than creating threads online.

It's in the 20th anniversary special.

Because she does, just as she does any BB/Crew-related forum or website.

Yeah, that's it.  The one where a Swedish interviewer accuses Dennis of having Beatle hair, and Dennis denies it, saying it's his own hair.

Yes...but Carol never claimed to have played the solo on SUSA, just the rhythm guitar...!

That's not a logical answer.

I'm barred from her forum, but in the past I've been shown posts where she's commented on posts about her on other forums. Including here.

I'd love to see this turn into some sort of boxing match. Then again, I'd rather not see some middle-aged man knock out a senior citizen.

I'm sure though, a stubborn old woman would much rather live in lalaland where what she believes is correct, than have to admit she's wrong and her memory is failing.

That's a logical answer! :)

I'm sure she doesn't give two shits about the likes of AGD.  She's got far more significant people and projects to tend to.

I know she DID claim to have played a solo on one of the early songs in which it's been long-established that it was most definitely Carl. Her "proof"? She can still play it to this day. (I guess by that logic I also played the solo on Donovan's "Atlantis" despite it being released six years before I was even born.)

Well then I guess I played guitar on 'Give A Little Bit" by Supertramp and ROCKED IT!!!!

how do you know that she wouldn't knock HIM out...lol...

It's important to remember that Carol showed up online very early. If I recall correctly, she began posting in online forums in 96 or 97. And at the time, it was relatively unusual to hear from people who had worked with Brian. So her initial welcome from the online fan community was very warm. Especially because she still did some very cool sessions at that time. She was on Everything I Need by the Wilsons and on a Matthew Sweet album in 98.

In those early years, she was also very open about admitting that she couldn't remember most of the songs that she had worked on in her session days. She didn't seem to think that they were all that important, musically. What's more, I seem to remember that she was fairly open to a back-and-forth discussion about the dates she played and what they actually were. But eventually something changed. I think she realized how important those 60s songs were to people, and I think she ultimately decided, having looked at some old AFM sheets for covers albums and the like, that she had actually played on all those hits. And eventually, she wasn't interested in a back-and-forth, or even admitting that she couldn't remember most of those years. She had decided what was true, and that was that. And any attempt to draw her out was met with withering scorn.

This all took several years to unfold, though. I liked her a great deal for much of the time. But eventually, you just couldn't take her seriously anymore. And that's a real shame, because she certainly has enough genuine accomplishments, enough actual musical legacy, that she has no reason to claim tracks that aren't hers.

Far more gullible people.

The case for her being a forgetful senior citizen might hold up except for the fact that she's been making the same claims for at least the last 25 years or more.

I respect Ms. Kaye's musical ability, but I don't like how she takes credit for other bassists' work, particularly James Jamerson's.

This. I'm in total awe of her musical achievements. Hell, if the only thing she ever played was the iconic bass line to the Mission: Impossible TV theme she'd be a legend, and justly so. But...