The Smiley Smile Message Board

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ag5nt9581g

(http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/512x.jpg)

“I am not here as a serf or vassal.
I am not begging my lords for mercy.
I’m a born free American woman,
wife, mother and citizen.

And I’m telling my government that you’ve forgotten your place.

It’s not your responsibility to look out for my well-being,
and to monitor my speech.

It’s not your right to assert an agenda.
Your post, the post that you occupy,
exists to preserve American liberty.

You’ve sworn to perform that duty.
And you have faltered.”

NSA Said to Cull Millions of Verizon Records Under Court Order (http://www.newsmax.com/newswidget/verizon-wiretaps-nsa-guardian/2013/06/06/id/508343?promo_code=EACE-1&utm_source=GatewayPundit&utm_medium=nmwidget&utm_campaign=widgetphase1#ixzz2VReCA16Y)

Senator Mark Udall, a Colorado Democrat:
“widescale surveillance..."
"should concern all of us..."
"Americans would find shocking...”

Jameel Jaffer, deputy legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union
"It is beyond Orwellian..."
“basic democratic rights...surrendered in secret..."
"unaccountable intelligence agencies.”

President George W. Bush’s administration began the so- called Terrorist Surveillance Program in the aftermath of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks... The Obama administration had refused to disclose how many U.S. citizens had their communications monitored by the NSA.

NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden: 'I don't want to live in a society that does these sort of things'

(http://img.ibtimes.com/www/data/images/full/2013/06/10/377840.jpg)

Is this real!?!?!  This is most amazing developing story that I've ever seen in my life!!

Watch this interview... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2013/jun/09/nsa-whistleblower-edward-snowden-interview-video)

What makes it even crazier is that we know during the IRS revelations who in fact the powers that be have it out for...   

(http://i42.tinypic.com/md2n39.jpg)

A joke that residential customers should be under Big Brother like this. In order to get a residential install you need to identify yourself, with a Social Security number, etc., and, most of these terrorists are using disposable cell phones, not a land line.  God Bless him; he is a hero.  Both political parties are wrong.  Now it is out in the open. Good. 

Hope he is better treated than the more recent whistleblowers were.  No need for more martyrs in the name of free speech and transparency.   

Full-blown, textbook case of Unlawful Searches and Seizures.  Blatant.  Nobody (and I mean NOBODY) can make a case that this isn't a giant F-you to the 4th Amendment.  On a scale so MASSIVE, it's like blowing up Mt Rushmore on live TV or something.

Verizon:  Hello, gov't relations dept, how may I help you?
Gov't:  Hi, give me your customer records
Verizon:  Ok, on which individual --
Gov't (In a screaming German accent):  All of them!!!  Now!!!


It's beyond comprehension to me.  I'm having a hard time believing it.  I'm sure it's true.

I just feel like everything is fake.  But, if it's real... if this really happened and if this is the guy -- he's like Paul F-cking Revere.

His treatment?  Who knows.  You know the Gov't will come after him.  We The People will need to decide his fate.  The problem is:  can "We The People" still have a voice?  Do we have the balls for what that means!?  Recently, when "We The People" got together to fight Big Brother -- they were destroyed.  In classic Saul Alinsky fashion...

1) Isolate - Lump them together as one entity:  "Tea Partiers."  Done.
2) Marginalize - Vilified as racists, extremist, crack-pots.  Done.

It's simple to do, and it seems to work.  So... we'll see.

Bean Bag - more details are emerging. The guy seems to have fewer credentials than earlier reported.  It is bad enough when the govt. takes your privacy, but in my view, dumb on the citizenry end, "to tweet, Facebook your location, and rely on the "cloud" rather than the more discrete hard drive in your own possession.  It seems the Patriot Act was promulgated for the right reasons, but too much leeway has been taken by the govt., under the umbrella of national security. 

People can be responsive and responsible. Your wallet sends the biggest message.  For example, the TV "cable cutters" have changed the industry.  It can be done.  Go Roku!  The "pen is mightier than the sword." (SDT!)

The smart people in Scandinavia now have HBO as a stand alone internet subscription.  HBO Nordic; online.   No cable, no satellite dish.  Small steps with big results.

People get sloppy and let someone else speak, and lose their own voice.  At least the Smiley people here, speak up!   :beer

What have you heard?
Seriously, this story is just weird.  Right?  It's crazy.  Too perfect.  Too Hollywood.  Could be a ruse.  Frankly, I don't know -- not sure I care (??)  :lol 

Regardless, the NSA thing is just plain nuts.  Wide nets.  Monitoring EVERYTHING.  EVERYONE.  I feel like I'm in the matrix.  And I've never seen the matrix, cuz it looked stupid, just like this!  :lol

Surprised our socialist friends haven't made themselves known here...unless believing in a right to privacy somehow makes us members of "the extreme right".

Only intolerant people advocate privacy. Maybe it should be called hate-privacy from now on, we've already got hate-speech.

Bill Maher indirectly spilled the beans and may have answered the question: This seems to be more about who is in power when it's being done than what's actually being done, relative to the level of outrage versus the calls to "remain calm, there's nothing here".

And that is scary.

For the same reason why I believe you haven't engaged with the lengthy discussion on the history of free markets and capitalism thread that I started.

I think about 0.00000000000001 of all Smiley Smilers read your way too long OP. Make it shorter next time.

That's quite insulting.... I read each and every word RockNRoll contributes and I read each and every brief sentence Bean Bag offers, and I look at his silly pictures... I even read each and every word of Dr. John Becker's rant: several times before responding.... I think I represent most of us in that.

Any socialists want to give me 130$$?? It's, uh... for a good cause.  :lol

They won't give you their own money. They only like to spend other people's money. :)

Exactly--- How many rich liberals write checks payable to Uncle Sam--- skip the taxes, if you want bigger gov't just send them your money... or better yet.... not so rich liberals who nickel and dime for every tax deduction possible. Why not just give them your money??

My days of saying it's a Repub or Demo thing are done. I'm so pissed at the Repub party for selling out it kills me.

ACLU - American Civil Liberties Union filed suit today. Lots of back pedaling going on with lawmakers calling it "metadata" calls coming and going and not "content" or the conversation.  The complaint alleges that the surveillance carried out under section 215 infringes upon First Amendment rights including the twin rights of "free expression and free association."

Stay tuned - this is big.  ;)  

No.... Most "liberals" just pay their taxes like everyone else....

I can understand this but this is exactly my point. The influence of both the mainstream media which relies on a structure of concision and also new media like the internet has had a very negative impact on political discourse. When you privilege brevity what ends up happening is that people end up with a very narrow perspective on complex issues that require historical background and ample evidence in order to be understood in any real way. So what happens is that people begin to take all sorts of positions without knowing really what those positions are, or what the consequences of those positions are. The fact is that real, serious political positions require lots of information, which is why in the age of the internet "capitalism is good" or "government is inherently bad" will inevitable sound better than far more legitimate political positions because those legitimate political positions cannot be reduced to a sound byte in any real way. But people have been conditioned to privilege an unnuanced discussion over a nuanced discussion since a nuance discussion might actually produce results, and such a view would ultimately be quite harmful to the central power structure. This is why I have a hard time contributed to most of the political threads here, since most of the posts require another post a mile long to explain how the original post is borne out of false assumptions about the way the world works and then when I try to do that I get criticized for not staying on topic.

So that's why my answer was what it was. The reason why I'm not "chiming in here" is the same reason you haven't engaged with the lengthy discussion on the history of free markets and capitalism thread that I started. Namely, you (and not only you) are quite simply unprepared to actually engage with the real issues nor are you prepared to accept why you engage with the issues you engage with.

My "Capitalism is good" line was 100 % tongue-in-cheek. You wrote a long original post and my response was short with no facts to back up my claim.

Even though I like debating people right now I do not really feel like it, so I won't write lengthy replies. If you want to know where I stand please read Rothbard and other Austrians. I can of course rehash their arguments and post them here when debating you, but what would the point of that be?

I wouldn't say "new media" has had a negative impact on people's political understanding, to the contrary it has made more people aware of the monetary system, financial power structures, corruption, anti-"terror" agendas and corporatism. New media highlights the fact "democracy" is just an illusion power elites use to control our societies. Nobody talked about the Fed and debt-based currency systems 15 years ago for example. Now it is out in the open.

This is what I mean when I say that new media has had a negative impact on people's understanding. That people think that "the Fed and debt-based currency systems" and "democracy" represent the real problems that people are facing (and people genuinely do believe this) is a consequence of the misleading unnuanced uncritical and poorly sourced information that floats around and clogs up the internet.

Oh boy... here we go again with the Politickin'.  You guys made me do this!!

Well, yes, YOU DO -- you pay taxes.  But Swedish Frog is actually right.  Here's why. (Without pictures!) there's 3 types of "liberals" (there's 3 of anything, don't you know!)

#1 Them.
The Ruling Class.  The "elitist."  The ones who "steal" your money (taxes) AND get credit for being charitable with it, as they pass it (very little of it) to Group #3.

#2 You.
The bumper sticker liberals.  The tax paying liberal.  The one's we all know and love.  The whole enchilada.  The host with the most!  (And just cuz you're #2 on this list, don't think you're "close" to #1.  You ain't.  They laugh at you.  And not how I laugh at you.   ;) )

#3 The Mystery Box.
The expendables. The permanent underclass (as they see it... not me).  The "low Information voters."  Bused in on election day (and in some places, like Chicago, this includes the deceased!).  Soon to include the amnestied as well.


UNDERSTAND THIS:  The goal of the Democrat party is to put YOU (and as many as they can) into the Mystery Box, Pinder.  For reals. Once they got you there... it's bye-bye Group #2 -- and they are royalty for life.

I think I'm right about this.  All joking aside.  #3 don't pay taxes.  #1 might, but c'mon! -- they just steal it back.  And YOU?  Well... welcome to the club! Have a seat! You're the target.  I'm the target.  You, me and everyone on this board -- targets.  Regardless of our "political banter" -- we're the target.  We're the whole game.  It's all about us.

The game is to squeeze us out.  Bottom up/Top down.  #1 knows we outnumber them, so they want us "middle class trash" (with our SUVs, incandescent light bulbs and affordable healthcare) -- out of the game and lost forever in group #3.  So they're taking our money, our jobs, our future -- and our common sense -- away.  They send just enough stolen loot (aka "bread crumbs") down to #3 to make them thirsty.  And here's bottom up part... they tell the #3 folks to HATE YOU and ME for not giving up more.  For holding them back.  We're greedy!!  Bottom Up.  

That's the game.  Squeeze us out.  We should actually join forces and put #1 permanently out of business.  But... no.  That's not gonna happen, is it?  They keep you "educated."  They keep you and me divided.  Racial, gender, skin-color, orientation, geography, whatever.  Just stay divided.  

And what are the real problems according to you?

Well, again, you would actually have to read my post on "A Long History" to figure that out.

Jailed filmmaker vows to finish film wrongly blamed for Benghazi attack (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/10/exclusive-jailed-filmmaker-vows-to-finish-film-wrongly-blamed-for-benghazi/?test=latestnews#ixzz2Vx63oEyd)

(http://www.usnews.com/pubdbimages/image/43088/FE_DA_0123_Hillary_Clinton425x283.jpg)
“we'll make sure that the person who made that film is arrested and prosecuted.”

Go gett'm Hilldawg!!



The 1st American Revolution... 237 years later.   :'(

Classic- Thanks for that.

Thanks!
I love the photo.  She's angry -- grrrr -- fist-pounding, but glancing down reading the "script!"

Ahhh- I missed that she's reading the script....

She is such a phony baloney politician. People are in for a rude awakening with all the shennanigans going on.... the bubble will burst....

They ignored their own intelligence reports (among other things) and monitor residents with landlines.  Makes no sense.

(http://i41.tinypic.com/1hqg7a.jpg)

You're still preaching your right wing, paranoid claptrap to me? I've long since left the "discussion" .... Keep the hot air blowing, windbag.... You have "liberals" down pat yet you still have no clue what a true conservative is..... Very pathetic..... The dirty little secret is: someone like you will never, can never, and never has been happy with anything. We could cut all social programs, abolish the Democratic party and you'd still be bitching and crying yet, of course, offering no logical solutions.... And the hilarious part is: once Obama's out of office, we'll likely never hear a peep from you again.

Oh, you think "socialists" like having their phone calls listened to and their electronic communication followed 24/7? ... Um, no...... And do you guys REALLY think this is a "liberal/conservative/socialist" issue? And what in God's name made you think this hasn't been going on since the dawn of time, in some form or another? ..... But of course, it's easy and lazy to just use your pathetic, 2nd grader shorthand: "socialists" "liberals" .... You guys are sad...... I really really really hope they install a "Republican" in the White House next time out so you'll all go back to sleep happy and content.

BAM!!!  Well said.

Having experience working with government, I can tell you... when something fails they do more of it.  Let me say that again -- when something fails... they do it more.  Insanity, defined.

As in... "what?  we're not reacting to the data and intelligence reports?... well, by golly... we must need MORE! data and intelligence reports!!"

And that's how you get the PRISM program.  I'm telling you.  That's EXACTLY how it happens.  It's total insanity, and no one is stopping them!

:ahh

Windbag?  Me?


Oh yeah?!  I've got solutions.  Actually... I don't.  That's kind of my point.  My solution is for the gov't to stop with the solutions.  

and then what?

Of course this is not a left-right thing. Power elites have done this throughout mankind no matter their political affiliation.

Buy affordable health insurance, buy cheaper gas, have more money in their pocket to be able to take care of their families and loved ones, find good paying jobs. The Federal Gov't is so bloated that I don't think we can fathom how bad of a cancer it is. Seriously- no, seriously- I could use 145$ of my money paid in whatever tax of your liking they i have paid this year that went to God-knows-what, and bought this box set. It is sickening.

Don't get me started on Monsanto... or the regressive income tax...


It's both party's, but the Democrats tell you in your face they want bigger gov't, while Repub's act conservative until they get into DC... then it's back to political correctness and big gov't.

Yes, absolutely! I can't help but think that the only way we can change this: or one way is to shake off FINALLY these ridiculous terms because people like Bean Bag get so hung up on them that they can't think beyond them..... Think about it: every four years we vote in some jackass and INSTANTLY about 40 or 50% of the population puts up another bumper sticker and goes to sleep happy.... That's about 40 or 50% of the population who the powers that be can
 be content are politically ignorant and fast asleep.... Of course there's the other 40 or 50% who are angry and vigilant, however, they're focusing all their rage on that other 40 or 50% ..... It doesn't take a genius to see how this just plays into the gram scheme.

I think you're wrong.  Mostly.  Heck, I've talked to "like-minded" people, who are fine with this program.  The whole country is fried man.


No.  Nobody does.  I think you're just obsessed with politics.


See what I mean?  I don't know how many times us "right wingers" have said the Republican party sucks.  Does saying it again help?  No.  Why?  Cuz you're obsessed with politics.

Hating the Republican party is #2 on the list of 3 things the left does.  (1. Steal/tax  2. lie about republicans.  3. win elections)

I personally hate politics.  Hate it.  I wish it didn't pop-up every damn time I make a good point.  But you leftist are obsessed, as you should be.  Cuz that's all you're programmed to do.  Politics.  Support the team.

I know it.  So I go after it and poke fun...

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_L5EFG-vZEHo/SioCTJF-vYI/AAAAAAAABAw/mZaTt35gyPs/s400/OTatt.bmp)

 :grouphug

I'd say the guy who gets himself off by posting in political threads 24/7 and spending a whole lot of time and efforts with his silly pictures might be the one who's obsessed with politics.... Then again what ARE politics and what would a lack of interest in them demonstrate exactly? ..... Though no one could ever accuse you of having a distinct lack of interest in them..... Therefore, what's the point in trying to insult me for having an interest in them? Or sorry, an "obsession"

And yes, there are always idiots, Bean. Anyone "left or "right" who would support such things as we're discussing has much bigger issues than what politically party they vote for.

Yep.

To me... (by and large):  The Democrat Party is terminal.  While, the Republican party is telling you, "you're fine.  f-ck sunscreen. have a cigarette and hop in my x-ray spaceship."


It's the nuthouse.

THIS I agree with!

Is this supposed to be me?


I want to stop politics.   :wall

An interest in saving the country from thieves and madmen... sh-t save myself!  Save my money!  My familiy!!  The f-cking country!!!

That interests me, yes.

and replace politics with what?

why not go live in Somalia?

no thieves or madmen there, right?

I get what you're saying though, but we need to envision a logical scenario for a better way before we plunder the world into the middle ages all over again.... What would you likely do if thieves or madmen burst into your tent out in the middle or nowhere? You'd probably go "Here, take these meager valuables and don't hurt us"! ..... So, we'd really be back in the same boat.

Yes, there's a ton of left-wing nutz that haunt the interweb, spewing mindless propaganda, because, well... they don't have souls.  Or jobs.  But let's stay focused...


What are politics?  Bill Clinton.  He was pure politics.  Lick finger (or other appendage).   Stick in air. Detect wind direction.  For 8 years.  Total opposite of leadership, by the way.

Obama is always campaigning, even when he's not.  No substance, just politics.  Always.


My hope is that we get a Truman.  We really need one.  NOW.  We don't need another celebrity President like this turd.  We need a workingman's president.  A stiff who just does the job.  But... most Americans don't even know what that job is anymore.  They think it's TV soundbites and politics.  No one trust politicians because of this exact issue.

So no... I have NO interest in politics.  I'm a horrible politician.  Just because I am interested in exposing the frauds that they are, doesn't make me "like them" or "interested" in their art.  It's so the opposite.

I knew it was a matter of time before someone brought up Somalia.

Dr. Ben Carson

when the shoe fits.....

If I had a dollar for every time someone tossed the word "liberal" around....

Found this article on Michael Savages website... Pinder and RnR might like it...err, not like the news, but know that there are people reporting it...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/12/house-approves-derivatives-deregulation_n_3429678.html

I'm not a huff po kinda guy though...but news is news

Thanks Mahalo!

Interesting quote: Rep. Michael Capuano (D-Mass.) said: "This bill is not about American jobs. This bill is all about foreign swaps. If they're going to create jobs, they're going to be in foreign countries.

No idea if it passes senate- seems like it may... and to be honest, this stuff is a bit too complicated for me to totally give the energy to want to understand... at least I can admit that, unlike way too many Americans.

I couldn't agree more... This is part of why I rail so hard against the two party system and throwing around words like "liberals" "conservatives" .... Of course I'm guilty of it myself, but I think these things ARE hard to understand and we make it easier on ourselves to be OK with not completely understanding or comprehending them because we simply decide what "side" we're on, left or right, and then allow that distinction to shorthand our own thought process...

After the last election, I changed my party to conservative and left the Republican party for a whole host of reasons....now let me shortly explain to you what I mean by calling myself a conservative...

I try to be conservative with my money- see my zillion posts about the MIC box set

I try to be conservative with my garbage/waste- with my energy use, with my shopping choices, which businesses I like to support (local, organic)

These are things that I think many people agree with, no matter what political party...

Now, when it comes to "conservative" politics- I feel strongly about states rights vs. Federal law- I know that's vague, and I WILL NOT blindly vote for a politician just because there is a "C" or and "R" next to their name... I've done that before, played the role, and have learned...not that it really matters on a national level becuz I'm a New Yorka- one of the blue-ist states... but just for a short post...

I am not pro gay marriage, but more or less indifferent to it...however I have deep concerns about sexual morality in many ways, especially with what is taught in schools with taxpayer money, gay or not.

I believe Christianity has it's virtues to teach people but unfortunately it is now seen as taboo and wrong/misguided, and often under attack. It's really too bad, because while I am a Christian I am wise enough to know that the church has brought upon itself much of it's criticisms...but not all.

Most of all I am 110% against national heath care- this is a states rights issue AFAIC. If NY decided to pull a Romneycare, I would be against it BUT CONSTITUTIONALLY I could not argue against it. I will not defend insurance comapanies.

I could go through any number of issues... and these are just my opinions. I do not feel a need to fight. So when I see things through a "conservative" lens, I see things as less power granted to an over-reaching federal gov't and more personal responsibilty...especially with regards to the states. Conservatism does not mean, to me, downright de-regulation to allow big money rule D.C. and it's many many offshoots. How do we stop that? Don't know.

It iis unfortunate how IMO the label is hijacked by hypocrites and liars. However, it is nothing more than an adjective at best, a label at worst... and again these are my opinions.

Now I should get back to my art...if I don't respond right away it is not to be evasive but know I am trying to make some cool stuff.... I've actually been making highly detailed drawings of The Four Elemnts since August of 2007- a rough draft and final copy of each element. I've done them for The Water and The Earth, and now I am working on the Rough Draft of The Air. I have no pictures to show yet... I will reveal them all at once when I'm done. It is conceived as one piece... an "Airy" piece of BB music? The BV's to Breakaway found on Harmony Friends Boot. It is good stuff.

It is a pleasure to discuss these matters without negativity. I know I am guilty of it, but we live and we learn.

MOST people's opinions on MOST issues are "conservative."  Americans, by definition, are.  This is what drives me nuts.  We're not big government.  We like to be left alone.  To do what we want to do -- and we defend each other's right to do it.  We like choices/competition and a good, fair deal.  We like free markets and love common sense.  There's 3 grocery stores in my small town... not one, drab "government food exchange" 25 miles away.  Choice.  Freedom.  Free markets.

Most people aren't stupid by default.  Quiz your friends.  Would you rather pay $3 for a gallon of milk or $6?  Change milk to "gasoline" -- and a few might opt for $6, but still, not most.  Stupidity has to be "taught."  Politics.

It's in our blood as Americans to be right -- to be above politics -- and to want justice and to right wrongs.  We're a moral country.  Right/wrong, good/evil and all that.  We have no DNA in royalty and no business in being elitist snobs -- that's not who we are.  Despite what some may tell you -- we're not elitists.  That's their path, not America's.

Most of us are neither conservative nor liberal, or rather, we are a combination of both... Wanting to be left alone and to respect others rights to be left alone is more liberal, as in respecting the liberty of others. Though, we recognize that in order for this to work, we must be conservative in other areas... Nor does everyone want to be "left alone" .... Many want community. We should be free to indulge in both... and It's not rocket science, but it becomes some new form of dumbed down math when you are only able to process life through the prism of "am I left or right" .... Though, I have quizzed my friends about such things, and most would happily pay $6 for a gallon of milk at Old Farmer John's family market rather than $3 at WalMart, and they would also like to know that a government food exchange is down round the corner over there for those who are bad off... We are not stupid and cruel people by nature, and most humans do not look at the world as just one big "market" .... That's coerced thinking: an acceptance of Capitalism. A respect for Capitalism maybe, but still not normal human thought. Though, I don't judge you for that. A free society should be both a market and an exchange in varying forms. Think about it......

Bean, you are spot on with the point "  We have no DNA in royalty and no business in being elitist snobs -- that's not who we are.  Despite what some may tell you -- we're not elitists."

I quite seriously take issue with a lot of people calling themselves "conservative" on this board. Here, it becomes quite crucial to understand what the terms mean. Note that traditionally, conservatism generally meant being very critical of capitalism and market-oriented societies. This tradition was taken up by the early Republican party and figures like Lincoln who understood capitalism as a form of wage slavery. This was largely because traditional conservatives valued freedom above all else and correctly understood capitalism as exploitative, as a system that created dependency on power, and as a system that largely diminished tradition in favour of commodification. Thinkers such as John Crowe Ransom, Allen Tate, Frank Lawrence Owsley, Lyle H. Lanier, Andrew Nelson Lytle, and Donald Davidson are prime examples of key figures behind the conservative movement, and all of them were deeply critical of capitalism.

The term was hijacked by statists during the Cold War and at that point the term lost whatever meaning it had held. Now the term is frequently used in order to evoke reducing the role of government for the majority of population whilst enlarging it significantly for the ruling class. Take the poster above, Mahalo. On another thread, Mahalo both self-represented as a conservative while at the same time praised Reagan's Star Wars program which was openly acknowledged by the framers as a public subsidy for private corporations to better compete with Japan for tech products. That's essentially the conservative platform - indoctrinate people to the extent that they abhor the things that will help them, and support the things that will hurt them. This is why Reagan, a huge statist reactionary who presided over an enormous welfare state for the wealthy, is hailed by conservatives today.

Take the furor over Obama. There's a lot of bad things to say about Obama, of course but the fact that people talk about being afraid about Obama's Big Government when in reality he has slowed government spending down more than any president since Eisenhower and has reduced the deficit is a real achievement for the propaganda team that has succeeded in largely making the public delusional. So why DO people fear Obama's government? Well, largely, because of the fear that he might change the system where the welfare state is redirected towards the population from the monied class who own the country. Of course, this is ludicrous. Obama is as pro-Big Business as any other President but there is a fear amongst some in the business community that Obama COULD help the people rather than help the ownership class and that's a no-no. And so we're supposed to hate the fact that the population might possibly get the kind of help that the ownership class has received for so long and thus you get all sorts of stories about how terrible it is that Obama might redistribute wealth.

Of course, wealth has always been redistributed, largely towards protecting Big Business interests, in programs that conservatives have been largely indoctrinated to believe are entirely justifiable. But wealth re-distribution only becomes a bad thing when there is the possibility that it might flow towards the pockets of the needy rather than the people who essentially control 88% of the financial assets in the country. Again, a real achievement of propaganda that people are outraged and that they believe their outrage represents a conservative point of view.

There's too much literal weight applied to the terminology "conservative" and "liberal."  It doesn't mean "tight-wad" and "wild n' free" respectively.  It doesn't mean Republican or Democrat.  It simply refers to one's focus, tendency and starting point when thinking of how to best resolve societal issues.  Which is either...

Correct.  A pyramid -- people at the base, feds tiny at the top.
OR
Incorrect.  Inverted pyramid - people tiny at the bottom, feds do it all at the top.

In a classroom, liberals will likely deny this definition, because they are in the red -- they are incorrect.  But watch them in action.  Get your safari hat on, your binoculars out and watch the liberals in their natural habitat.  They choose incorrectly nearly all the time.  Obviously, they will not openly admit to any of this.  Because they are incorrect.  And everything that follows (aka:  their entire ideology) is a never-ending series of conflicting theories, loopy crises, deception and convoluted drawn-out talking points -- to buy them time to come up with something else.


My comment that "people want to be left-alone" is correct.  It ALLOWS you to be left alone to form communities, or whatever that means to you.  That's why I always say "Conservationism ALLOWS for Liberals to exists, but Liberalism DOES NOT ALLOW for Conservatism to exist."

Correct or Incorrect.  That's the only eternal issue here.

In a free land, if you want to create a socialist paradise (or whatever) in your small town... do it.  No profit -- everything goes to the community.  Fine!  Enjoy!!  But in a socialist, top-down nation, I am not free to create a capitalist paradise for my peoples.

It's statements like that, that I hope are profoundly eye-opening to the lefties and "moderates" on the board.  Liberalism is intolerance.  Liberalism is inferior.  If one realizes the divine superiority and human perfection that Conservatism is and allows for -- it should be enough for people to NEVER allow Liberals anywhere near the top of the pyramid.  Liberalism is incorrect.  It's the opposite of choice.  And it will damn us all to hell.

what makes you think anyone wants a top down socialist country ..... or whatever.... just because they're not half crazed with right-winger-ness?

that is the eternal question......

I don't think anyone (or very many) do.  That's kind of my point.

then on this point we agree

But do you agree that we're moving more and more to the inverted pyramid model -- putting more and more control at the top?

The power is already at the top and it's always been regardless if it's the government or corporate power, or thugs with more weapons than you.....

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jun/18/black-louisiana-senator-flees-democratic-party-fre/


Will this air on CNN tonight?? Will the Daily Show crowd get this??


I wonder about lefties getting their news from admitted socialist Jon Stewart (a comedian doing a comedy show).... Maybe I should start getting my news from SNL.


I'll add this comment from the comment section to the article...


A Short Course on Democrats and Republicans

Democrats are the party of the poor and those who chose to remain poor.

Republicans are the party of the rich and those who aspire to become rich.

Democrats actively seek to create more poor (in order to have enough votes to win elections).

Republicans actively seek to create more rich (in order to have enough votes to win elections).

Democrats favor economic policies that make it more difficult to get ahead.

Republicans favor economic policies that make it easier to get ahead.

Democrats have faith in redistribution and anti-business policies to create more dependency and more Democrat voters.

Republicans have faith in freedom and free enterprise to create more prosperity and more Republican voters.

Democrats believe in and promote the idea that those who take risks to create jobs and opportunities are greedy Robber Barons who should be publicly scorned and heavily taxed.

Republicans believe in and promote the idea that those who take risks to create jobs and opportunities are productive Entrepreneurs and Investors who should be admired and emulated and keep their profits so they can reinvest them to create more jobs and opportunities.

If redistribution and anti-business policies do not create enough poor to win elections, Democrats are willing to import (legally or illegally) additional poor to expand their power base.

Republicans would love to see more immigrants participate in the economy but understand that the welfare state created by the Democrats now makes an open immigration policy impossible without bankrupting the country.

According to left wing pollster Zogby, the less economically literate one is, the more likely they are to be a Democrat while the more economically literate one is, the more likely they are to be a Republican.

http://econjwatch.org/articles...

Yawn..... Just more pandering to empty words, definitions to keep us fighting with each other...... Though there is some truth here.... Though, the "comments" seem to be regarding politicians and not people

You're right.  Throughout human history this has been the case.  America's been the attempted exception -- the inverted pyramid.  That was the concept -- the "great experiment."  Which is what prompted Jefferson (?) to say "... if we can keep it."

237 years later.  We haven't kept it.  We can get it back, we haven't lost it totally.  That's why Americans are appalled with the constant tinkering of our rights -- the 2nd Amendment, the 4th, the 10th, etc. -- and this desire to replace them with things that aren't "rights" -- free health care, food stamps.  Those are services not rights.  Cotton picking is a service... not a right of the slave owner or the person wanting a good price on cotton-goods.