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Smiley Smile Stuff => General On Topic Discussions => Topic started by: Azmo on July 19, 2012, 10:14:54 AM



Title: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Azmo on July 19, 2012, 10:14:54 AM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on July 19, 2012, 10:17:01 AM
It is "Bygone, bygone".


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Azmo on July 19, 2012, 10:19:58 AM
 :) Thanks!  I'll live a fuller life from now on...


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on July 19, 2012, 11:24:23 AM
 :) :) :)


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: hideyotsuburaya on July 27, 2012, 06:29:20 AM
no , the SU vocal response at the end of initial verses is

"BLIND A, BLIND A"

it's a typical VD Parks style punnish response,
reversing the words of the first verse.

that is, "A BLIND..."  becomes "BLIND A".  (in either case A is of course short vowel)

BTW in similar VDP manner the first verse line can  be reworded
from "A DIAMOND NECKLACE PLAYED UPON"
to "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"



Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: EgoHanger1966 on July 27, 2012, 06:51:50 AM
no , the SU vocal response at the end of initial verses is

"BLIND A, BLIND A"

it's a typical VD Parks style punnish response,
reversing the words of the first verse.

that is, "A BLIND..."  becomes "BLIND A".  (in either case A is of course short vowel)

BTW in similar VDP manner the first verse line can  be reworded
from "A DIAMOND NECKLACE PLAYED UPON"
to "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"



I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, but none of that is correct.

"Bygone, bygone" and "A diamond necklace played the pawn" are what is being sung.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on July 27, 2012, 07:38:43 AM
They're serious, I think, but still wrong.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: hideyotsuburaya on July 27, 2012, 11:57:09 AM
what i posted earlier is perfectly correct


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: EgoHanger1966 on July 27, 2012, 12:11:30 PM
what i posted earlier is perfectly correct

It's really not. Check your Surf's Up (album) or SMiLE Sessions lyric booklets.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on July 27, 2012, 12:43:53 PM
what i posted earlier is perfectly correct

As anyone who's heard the vocals isolated out will confirm, you're wrong.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Roger Ryan on July 27, 2012, 12:46:51 PM
Given that this was "hideyotsuburaya"'s first post doesn't bode well for future contributions  ::)


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Zach95 on July 27, 2012, 12:50:30 PM
I think this thread ought to be deleted now that the OP's question has been answered.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: petsite on July 27, 2012, 02:52:39 PM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"

And for the record (pun intended) Carl got the lyrics wrong when he copied them down listening to Brian's demo. Its:

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome mannered baton

I believe Mark L. has Carl's handwritten lyrics on the wall in his studio.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on July 27, 2012, 03:09:58 PM
Also, F*skett once actually told someone it was "bygone, bygone" when asked.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: EgoHanger1966 on July 27, 2012, 03:26:30 PM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"

And for the record (pun intended) Carl got the lyrics wrong when he copied them down listening to Brian's demo. Its:

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome mannered baton

I believe Mark L. has Carl's handwritten lyrics on the wall in his studio.


The second line sounds a lot like "drummed a long ode" which sounds pretty Van Dyke Parks-ian.

There's a cover version of Surf's Up on Youtube of a guy and his piano, he's getting words incorrect all over the place, but the funny thing (to me, anyway) was he was singing "Michael, Michael" instead of bygone!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: ontor pertawst on July 27, 2012, 04:34:16 PM
Quote

The second line sounds a lot like "drummed a long ode" which sounds pretty Van Dyke Parks-ian.

It sounds pretty dang clunky against "baton," tho.

Plus VDP would know what an ode was and how it has nothing to do with drumming. If you'll excuse me, I have an opera to perform on this clarinet.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 28, 2012, 07:50:36 AM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"

COMMENT:

Here are the words >>>  http://www.songmeanings.net/songs/view/80399/

Here is Brian Explaining the words (see page eight)   >>>
http://books.google.com/books?id=_uEXXP86DcMC&pg=PA10&lpg=PA10&dq=goodbye+surfing+hello+god+beach+boys,+At+home,+as+the+black+acetate+dub&source=bl&ots=pwyoGN_E7I&sig=Shr03KlF5pRw8AxfRv1USjSS6fI&hl=en&sa=X&ei=M_kTULP7M-q90QGztIDgCg&ved=0CEsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=goodbye%20surfing%20hello%20god%20beach%20boys%2C%20At%20home%2C%20as%20the%20black%20acetate%20dub&f=false


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Mikie on July 28, 2012, 08:14:29 AM
Also, F*skett once actually told someone it was "bygone, bygone" when asked.

What's up with the "F*skett" spelling.  You can't say "Foskett" here?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 28, 2012, 08:32:43 AM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"

And for the record (pun intended) Carl got the lyrics wrong when he copied them down listening to Brian's demo. Its:

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome mannered baton

I believe Mark L. has Carl's handwritten lyrics on the wall in his studio.

COMMENT:  I have the original handwritten manuscript sheet, both sides. I removed it from the music stand to which it was taped at the end of the session. At one time I loaned it to Mark for reference, but he has since returned it. I am holding it in my hand and it reads "to a handsome man and baton"  with Brian's overwritting to correct the spelling of "baton."

See my last post. Look up the links. You will find it interesting.


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: SMiLE Brian on July 28, 2012, 08:59:18 AM
That's awesome you have hand written lyrics!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: sockittome on July 28, 2012, 09:34:40 AM
I've known for years that it was 'bygone, bygone', but there was a time when I thought it was 'right on, right on', which would have been a fairly hip addition in 1971!  :smokin


And for the longest time I was trying to figure out what was meant by 'Color made it ruins....domino'    :lol


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 28, 2012, 09:42:41 AM
That's awesome you have hand written lyrics!

COMMENT: 

Complete Words:

SURF'S UP

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along, oh
To a handsome man and baton
(Michael, Michael)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin'?

Hung velvet overtaken me
Dim chandelier awaken me
To a song dissolved in the dawn
(Michael, Michael)

The music hall a costly bow
The music all is lost for now
To a muted trumpeter swan
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin', Brother John?

Dove nested towers the hour was
Strike the street quicksilver moon
Carriage across the fog
Two step to lamp lights cellar tune
The laughs come hard in auld lang syne

The glass was raised, the fired rose
The fullness of the wine
The dim last toastin'
While at port a do or die

A choke of grief hard hardened I
Beyond belief
A broken man too tough
To cry

Surf's up
(Hmm, hmm, hmm)
Aboard a tidal wave
Come about hard and join
The young and often spring you gave
I heard the word
Wonderful thing
A childrens song

A childrens song
(Child, child, the child, child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
The children say
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
(That's why the child is the father to the man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
A child

As it was explained to me as I recorded it, Michael, Michael is a "spiritual plea" to Archangel Michael.

Yes, I have the manuscript handwritten by Carl (with some corrections by Brian). This was the lyric sheet read by Carl as he recorded his part of Surf's Up. Some of the lead is also Brian. On the back side is Brian's handwritten part that he read when he sings at the end -- a children's song... .

It's in a fireproof safe.


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 28, 2012, 10:10:31 AM
I've known for years that it was 'bygone, bygone', but there was a time when I thought it was 'right on, right on', which would have been a fairly hip addition in 1971!  :smokin


And for the longest time I was trying to figure out what was meant by 'Color made it ruins....domino'    :lol

COMMENT:

Those of you hear "by gone" or "my god" or "rise up" or other phrases, you need to do the following.

Play Surf's Up with the volume low.

Getting away from room reflections will help to understand the recorded word.
 
Put your ear very close to one of the stereo speakers. Say a couple of inches or so.

Now listen.

It's  "Mike, ell" or Michael. It's hard to make "Michael" sound musical. They did it by changing the emphasis.


You can also play the psycoacoustic game of thinking what you want to hear. Like "by gone." If you think you hear that, you may seem to hear it.

The reason it's on the lyric sheet as "Michael" is because that is the lyric.


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: sockittome on July 28, 2012, 10:21:38 AM
That's awesome you have hand written lyrics!

COMMENT: 

Complete Words:

SURF'S UP

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along, oh
To a handsome man and baton
(Michael, Michael)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin'?

Hung velvet overtaken me
Dim chandelier awaken me
To a song dissolved in the dawn
(Michael, Michael)

The music hall a costly bow
The music all is lost for now
To a muted trumpeter swan
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin', Brother John?

Dove nested towers the hour was
Strike the street quicksilver moon
Carriage across the fog
Two step to lamp lights cellar tune
The laughs come hard in auld lang syne

The glass was raised, the fired rose
The fullness of the wine
The dim last toastin'
While at port a do or die

A choke of grief hard hardened I
Beyond belief
A broken man too tough
To cry

Surf's up
(Hmm, hmm, hmm)
Aboard a tidal wave
Come about hard and join
The young and often spring you gave
I heard the word
Wonderful thing
A childrens song

A childrens song
(Child, child, the child, child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
The children say
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
(That's why the child is the father to the man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
A child

As it was explained to me as I recorded it, Michael, Michael is a "spiritual plea" to Archangel Michael.

Yes, I have the manuscript handwritten by Carl (with some corrections by Brian). This was the lyric sheet read by Carl as he recorded his part of Surf's Up. Some of the lead is also Brian. On the back side is Brian's handwritten part that he read when he sings at the end -- a children's song... .

It's in a fireproof safe.


~swd

Thank you for posting this, Mr. Desper!  Straight from the source, it clears up a number of questions.  I had heard for so long (on this board, even) that it was "by gone", that's what I thought I was hearing.  Guess I was wrong again! 


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on July 28, 2012, 10:37:36 AM
That's awesome you have hand written lyrics!

COMMENT: 

Complete Words:

SURF'S UP

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along, oh
To a handsome man and baton
(Michael, Michael)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin'?

Hung velvet overtaken me
Dim chandelier awaken me
To a song dissolved in the dawn
(Michael, Michael)

The music hall a costly bow
The music all is lost for now
To a muted trumpeter swan
(Michael, Michael)
Columnated ruins Domino

Canvass the town
And brush the backdrop
Are you sleepin', Brother John?

Dove nested towers the hour was
Strike the street quicksilver moon
Carriage across the fog
Two step to lamp lights cellar tune
The laughs come hard in auld lang syne

The glass was raised, the fired rose
The fullness of the wine
The dim last toastin'
While at port a do or die

A choke of grief hard hardened I
Beyond belief
A broken man too tough
To cry

Surf's up
(Hmm, hmm, hmm)
Aboard a tidal wave
Come about hard and join
The young and often spring you gave
I heard the word
Wonderful thing
A childrens song

A childrens song
(Child, child, the child, child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
The children say
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
Have you listened as they played
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
(That's why the child is the father to the man)
Their song is love
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
And the children know the way
(Child, child, the child)
(A child is the father of man)
A child

As it was explained to me as I recorded it, Michael, Michael is a "spiritual plea" to Archangel Michael.

Yes, I have the manuscript handwritten by Carl (with some corrections by Brian). This was the lyric sheet read by Carl as he recorded his part of Surf's Up. Some of the lead is also Brian. On the back side is Brian's handwritten part that he read when he sings at the end -- a children's song... .

It's in a fireproof safe.


~swd

Thank you for posting this, Mr. Desper!  Straight from the source, it clears up a number of questions.  I had heard for so long (on this board, even) that it was "by gone", that's what I thought I was hearing.  Guess I was wrong again! 


Excellent thread sockittome. Thank you Mr. Desper  for setting the record strait on this. It makes me love this song all the more.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Custom Machine on July 28, 2012, 11:10:57 AM
Thanks, Stephen Desper, for this info.  I've always heard it as "Michael, Michael", but until your explanation I never understood why the lyric was written as it is.  A fireproof safe is definitely a good location for that lyric sheet.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: runnersdialzero on July 28, 2012, 12:39:09 PM
It's "Bacon, bacon" as per Jeff's performance on BWPS.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: hideyotsuburaya on July 29, 2012, 02:31:33 PM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: EgoHanger1966 on July 29, 2012, 02:36:23 PM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well

Stephen Desper WAS THERE and owns THE ORIGINAL LYRIC SHEET.
I've never heard it as "Michael, Michael", but the man gave us the information and provided proof.
'Nuff said.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Paulos on July 29, 2012, 02:43:43 PM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well

I agree that you are talking nonsense, unless you are seriously hearing those words during Surf's Up in which case I would suggest a visit to an audiologist.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: FatherOfTheMan Sr101 on July 29, 2012, 03:32:43 PM
"Michael, Michael"

I always knew that Brian and Van Dyke wrote this about me!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on July 29, 2012, 03:42:13 PM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well

Well you can go merrily on believing what you want. Doesn't bother me none. You are wrong though and it shows a great lack of respect to Steven Desper to insist that you are right when the man was actually there when it was recorded and possess the lyric sheet Carl was working from.

You're idea of word play isn't even particularly interesting or clever imo. But there it is. Hey ho.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: FatherOfTheMan Sr101 on July 29, 2012, 04:53:11 PM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well

Well you can go merrily on believing what you want. Doesn't bother me none. You are wrong though and it shows a great lack of respect to Steven Desper to insist that you are right when the man was actually there when it was recorded and possess the lyric sheet Carl was working from.

You're idea of word play isn't even particularly interesting or clever imo. But there it is. Hey ho.

Ignorance is Bliss.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Chris Brown on July 29, 2012, 06:07:18 PM
Wow, never expected this thread to result in a mind-blowing revelation like that - many thanks as always to Mr. Desper!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on July 30, 2012, 04:15:25 AM
i disagree -

lyric resonse as stated earlier:

"A BLIND...."

becomes

"BLIND A"

and "A DIAMOND NECK LESS PLAYED UPON"  just as well

Disagree until you're blue in the face, but it won't change the simple fact that you are wrong (as at least three other posters on this thread will attest).


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: buddhahat on July 30, 2012, 04:42:28 AM
Wow what fascinating input from Mr Desper, thank you. I have always thought it was Bygone, Bygone.

Whilst we're on the subject of Surf's Up, I can't remember what the exact story is regarding who wrote the tag? As far as I can remember Brian was upstairs in his bedroom, heard the group recording the tag, and ran down to instruct them in either a) the melody b) the vocal arrangements or c) everything including some of the lyrics. I have a feeling it was the melody of the 'children's song' part, plus the "Child, child" backing vocals with input from other group members (maybe Jack Rieley) on the main tag lyrics.

If SWD is still active in this thread, I'm sure his recollections of the recording of the tag and Brian's involvement would be much appreciated by all, unless he's gone over this before in which case somebody please steer me in the right direction!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: petsite on July 30, 2012, 06:51:29 AM
Can anyone help me with the lyrics that the chorus whispers at the end of the first two verses?  One lyric site says it is "Michael, Michael" but that makes no sense.   ???

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome man and baton (Michael, Michael?)

A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see
The pit and the pendulum drawn (Michael, Michael?)

For 40+ years I thought it was "Rise up, rise up" but I don't think that is correct either.  It is driving me nuts...Thanks for the help!

Also is it "..a handsome man and batton?"

And for the record (pun intended) Carl got the lyrics wrong when he copied them down listening to Brian's demo. Its:

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along
To a handsome mannered baton

I believe Mark L. has Carl's handwritten lyrics on the wall in his studio.

COMMENT:  I have the original handwritten manuscript sheet, both sides. I removed it from the music stand to which it was taped at the end of the session. At one time I loaned it to Mark for reference, but he has since returned it. I am holding it in my hand and it reads "to a handsome man and baton"  with Brian's overwritting to correct the spelling of "baton."

See my last post. Look up the links. You will find it interesting.


~swd

Thanks Stephen for the clarification on both points. Van Dyke says on the Beautiful Dreamer DVD (as do the lyric sheets for the 2004 SMiLE by Brian) that the lyrics were suppose to be "To a handsome mannered baton". I think it must be like when Tony Asher wrote "Carol I Know" and Brian heard "Caroline No".


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: rn57 on July 30, 2012, 07:19:48 AM
Well...now that Stephen Desper informs us it's "Michael" someone should email Van Dyke and ask him: does this mean the lyrics really are addressed to Dr Love (or, keeping in mind VDP's addicion to wordplay, Mike/Al)? Because if they are we may be talking about a sea change in Smile studies.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 30, 2012, 07:38:07 AM
COMMENT:

I am not a lyric expert. All I know is that when I ask Carl about the meaning of

Michael, Michael, that's what he told me. Maybe Carl got it wrong, I don't know.

It made sense at the time. And it still does.

Last minute word changes happen from time to time. Especially when you're dealing with complex Vandyke Parks lyrics.

No matter what the author wrote to be sung, if any last minute changes are performed, any changes from the lyric sheet then become the new and correct lyrics for the song. Whatever lyric is performed is designated to be the correct wording. To say "Carl copied the words wrong" is not exactly what happened (or happens). Better to say, "Carl modified the words as he was copying them from the lyric sheet."

Mike does this all the time. I have seen Brian completely change every word of a song. Even when the lead has been in place for months, nothing is set in stone until mixdown time.  Look at what happened to Til I Die.  Total replacement.

Here is another example, this is a quote from my book, Recording The Beach Boys on Feel Flows.


"Soon we hear inverse-reverb begin building to an ethereal forming of the first words of Carl’s vocal, “Unfolding, EnveLOPing.” EnveLOPing. The word enveloping was a mis-read.  It was supposed to be the adjective-form, enveloping, i.e., enclosing or encasing completely with or as if with a covering.  But it was read as a gerund form envelope-ing, i.e., A flat, folded paper container, especially for a letter.  EnveLOPing seemed to flow together better with unfolding and more appropriate to the lyrical intent, so it was modified at the time the vocal was recorded..."

Hope this helps,


~swd
 


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: petsite on July 30, 2012, 09:08:01 AM
COMMENT:

I am not a lyric expert. All I know is that when I ask Carl about the meaning of

Michael, Michael, that's what he told me. Maybe Carl got it wrong, I don't know.

It made sense at the time. And it still does.

Last minute word changes happen from time to time. Especially when you're dealing with complex Vandyke Parks lyrics.

No matter what the author wrote to be sung, if any last minute changes are performed, any changes from the lyric sheet then become the new and correct lyrics for the song. Whatever lyric is performed is designated to be the correct wording. To say "Carl copied the words wrong" is not exactly what happened (or happens). Better to say, "Carl modified the words as he was copying them from the lyric sheet."

Mike does this all the time. I have seen Brian completely change every word of a song. Even when the lead has been in place for months, nothing is set in stone until mixdown time.  Look at what happened to Til I Die.  Total replacement.

Here is another example, this is a quote from my book, Recording The Beach Boys on Feel Flows.


"Soon we hear inverse-reverb begin building to an ethereal forming of the first words of Carl’s vocal, “Unfolding, EnveLOPing.” EnveLOPing. The word enveloping was a mis-read.  It was supposed to be the adjective-form, enveloping, i.e., enclosing or encasing completely with or as if with a covering.  But it was read as a gerund form envelope-ing, i.e., A flat, folded paper container, especially for a letter.  EnveLOPing seemed to flow together better with unfolding and more appropriate to the lyrical intent, so it was modified at the time the vocal was recorded..."

Hope this helps,


~swd
 



Right again. Not that Carl got the words wrong. They were changed. Brian could have said "handsome mannered baton........hows about handsome MAN and BATON?"

Al to Brian (on session tape): I need another word...since she put me down......Brian: WELL since she put me down....Al:That works...

It was only last year (and I have been following since being 14 in 1973) that I got one of my questions finally answered. Mike DID finish the couplet for the second verse of GV. Brian just cut off the last line. SHE GOES WITH ME TO A BLOSSOM WORLD.....WE FIND". Mike said Brian cut it to allow the bassline room to catch the listener.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on July 30, 2012, 09:12:24 AM
I'm willing to believe that the background vocals sing "Michael, Michael."

But I made a silly mistake after reading SWD's response incorrectly, so this sentence was actually a much more ignorant sentence before I edited it, yo.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on July 30, 2012, 09:13:28 AM
Also, F*skett once actually told someone it was "bygone, bygone" when asked.

What's up with the "F*skett" spelling.  You can't say "Foskett" here?

Oh, nothing...just didn't want to upset the seemingly huge number of people here who think Jeff is Satan.  :eyeroll:


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: onkster on July 30, 2012, 10:10:59 AM
Just when I thought there was nothing left new to learn about SMiLE, along comes "Michael, Michael". Amazing.

But I'm still willing to let bygones be bygones...ahem.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: rn57 on July 30, 2012, 11:56:32 AM
COMMENT:

I am not a lyric expert. All I know is that when I ask Carl about the meaning of

Michael, Michael, that's what he told me. Maybe Carl got it wrong, I don't know.

It made sense at the time. And it still does.

Last minute word changes happen from time to time. Especially when you're dealing with complex Vandyke Parks lyrics.

No matter what the author wrote to be sung, if any last minute changes are performed, any changes from the lyric sheet then become the new and correct lyrics for the song. Whatever lyric is performed is designated to be the correct wording. To say "Carl copied the words wrong" is not exactly what happened (or happens). Better to say, "Carl modified the words as he was copying them from the lyric sheet."

Mike does this all the time. I have seen Brian completely change every word of a song. Even when the lead has been in place for months, nothing is set in stone until mixdown time.  Look at what happened to Til I Die.  Total replacement.

Here is another example, this is a quote from my book, Recording The Beach Boys on Feel Flows.


"Soon we hear inverse-reverb begin building to an ethereal forming of the first words of Carl’s vocal, “Unfolding, EnveLOPing.” EnveLOPing. The word enveloping was a mis-read.  It was supposed to be the adjective-form, enveloping, i.e., enclosing or encasing completely with or as if with a covering.  But it was read as a gerund form envelope-ing, i.e., A flat, folded paper container, especially for a letter.  EnveLOPing seemed to flow together better with unfolding and more appropriate to the lyrical intent, so it was modified at the time the vocal was recorded..."

Hope this helps,


~swd
 


Thanks very much for explaining this, Mr. Desper. I guess that "Michael, Michael" could just as well have been added by Carl or Brian to what Van Dyke had written. In which case, I suppose it could be tht no reference, or no conscious reference, to Mike Love was meant - just that the words had the right sound. (Which they sure do, I'd say.)  And what you say about "Feel Flows" is also very enlightening.

Speaking of Carl - here is something I was discussing on another thread, and I thought you could clear up this question.

Today is Tandyn Almer's 70th birthday and that set me to thinking what other Beach Boys material he might have co-written besides Marcella and Sail On Sailor. I remembered looking at a list of unreleased BBs songs online which mentioned a song called "Then I'll Be Someone," written by Almer and Carl. I did some Googling and learned that David Cassidy had performed the song on British television in 1976. One of our fellow SS'ers pointed out this performance was online:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmP0L_Yy9E8

It turns out that in March the song was discussed at the Beach Boys Britain board and at that time Billy Hinsche said he knew the song - Almer had personally taught it to him on the piano, and Billy later made an as-yet unreleased recording of it. But Billy said he had not heard anything about Carl co-writing it until it was mentioned on the board.

Since Almer was involved I would guess the song dates from 1971 or 1972, so I was wondering if you might recall working on a track by that title, and if so, who played and sang on it. Many thanks in advance for whatever info you might have.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: startBBtoday on July 30, 2012, 01:27:58 PM
COMMENT:

I am not a lyric expert. All I know is that when I ask Carl about the meaning of

Michael, Michael, that's what he told me. Maybe Carl got it wrong, I don't know.

It made sense at the time. And it still does.

Last minute word changes happen from time to time. Especially when you're dealing with complex Vandyke Parks lyrics.

No matter what the author wrote to be sung, if any last minute changes are performed, any changes from the lyric sheet then become the new and correct lyrics for the song. Whatever lyric is performed is designated to be the correct wording. To say "Carl copied the words wrong" is not exactly what happened (or happens). Better to say, "Carl modified the words as he was copying them from the lyric sheet."

Mike does this all the time. I have seen Brian completely change every word of a song. Even when the lead has been in place for months, nothing is set in stone until mixdown time.  Look at what happened to Til I Die.  Total replacement.

Here is another example, this is a quote from my book, Recording The Beach Boys on Feel Flows.


"Soon we hear inverse-reverb begin building to an ethereal forming of the first words of Carl’s vocal, “Unfolding, EnveLOPing.” EnveLOPing. The word enveloping was a mis-read.  It was supposed to be the adjective-form, enveloping, i.e., enclosing or encasing completely with or as if with a covering.  But it was read as a gerund form envelope-ing, i.e., A flat, folded paper container, especially for a letter.  EnveLOPing seemed to flow together better with unfolding and more appropriate to the lyrical intent, so it was modified at the time the vocal was recorded..."

Hope this helps,


~swd
 


Hi Stephen, thanks as usual for your contributions. Did you regularly grab lyric sheets from sessions or was this a special occasion because you knew that Surf's Up was a special song?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: LostArt on July 31, 2012, 07:54:50 AM
Thanks very much for explaining this, Mr. Desper. I guess that "Michael, Michael" could just as well have been added by Carl or Brian to what Van Dyke had written. In which case, I suppose it could be tht no reference, or no conscious reference, to Mike Love was meant - just that the words had the right sound. (Which they sure do, I'd say.)

Mr. Desper has already explained what the meaning of "Michael, Michael" was.

As it was explained to me as I recorded it, Michael, Michael is a "spiritual plea" to Archangel Michael.


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on July 31, 2012, 12:59:31 PM

Hi Stephen, thanks as usual for your contributions. Did you regularly grab lyric sheets from sessions or was this a special occasion because you knew that Surf's Up was a special song?

COMMENT:  I always picked up and put away any lyric or song sheets left by any beach boy. These were usually kept in the tape box until their usefullness had passed.  This lyric sheet, however, was written on manuscript paper, too big to fit into the box and too thick to fold. So I put it away in the studio's maintenance area. I found it much later (after release of Surf's Up) and thought it might be a nice keepsake. I reprinted it at the end of my book Recording The Beach Boys.

I've not been one to collect memorabilia from the studio. I even frowned on taking pictures in the studio. This was a place for creativity.  I have been known to give over a disposable cup or two that Dennis may have used to a female fan at a show's intermission. Dennis gave me one of his old stage shirts which I still have, but that's about it.
    ~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on July 31, 2012, 10:13:22 PM
SWD - how does one get a copy of that book?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Shane on August 01, 2012, 12:10:23 AM
One quote from Mr. Desper seems to have been overlooked so far on this thread:

"On the back side is Brian's handwritten part that he read when he sings at the end -- a children's song... . "


The previous consensus on this board was that Al sang this part, but I'll take the word of someone who was there.  The fact that Brian stayed downstairs long enough to appear vocally on the 1971 version is blowing my mind at this particular moment.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Andrew G. Doe on August 01, 2012, 01:52:09 AM
One quote from Mr. Desper seems to have been overlooked so far on this thread:

"On the back side is Brian's handwritten part that he read when he sings at the end -- a children's song... . "


The previous consensus on this board was that Al sang this part, but I'll take the word of someone who was there.  The fact that Brian stayed downstairs long enough to appear vocally on the 1971 version is blowing my mind at this particular moment.

Much as I hate to contradict someone who was there, in 1985 Steve showed me the lyric sheet in question and while there is an unreleased couplet added in pencil - "the father's life is done yet the children carry on" (recall may not be exact but maybe 95%) - it's definitely not in Brian's hand. Jack Rieley claimed he added it but as I've never seen his cursive, I couldn't say... but it's not Brian's script. Way too neat. Much too angular. There's an image in Steve's book (excellent read, btw), check it out.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: hypehat on August 01, 2012, 04:28:46 AM
Also, the acapella to these ears sounds like Al singing those lines - and when Brian ever say 'Holy Mackerel'?

But it is Desper....


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: runnersdialzero on August 01, 2012, 04:35:26 PM
Not to fan the flames of an age old debate, but yeah, I'd bet my testicles that's Al singing the "A children's song" part, at least on the finished, available version. Al even said it was him, did he not?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on August 01, 2012, 11:41:16 PM
The thing is, the only lyrics that SWD actually specifically quoted as being sung by Brian were "A children's song" -- which Brian absolutely did, right before the group came in at the end. Even clearer than the aforementioned "Holy mackerel!" isolation that was going around a few years ago is the isolated vocals from the Endless Harmony DVD 5.1 mixes...if that's not Al singing the "and the children know the way..." lyrics, then Brian sure did a good job of imitating him. And somebody didn't know how to pronounce the word "children," or as sung in that little coda, "chill-ren."


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Quzi on August 02, 2012, 06:09:20 AM
I've known for years that it was 'bygone, bygone', but there was a time when I thought it was 'right on, right on', which would have been a fairly hip addition in 1971!  :smokin


And for the longest time I was trying to figure out what was meant by 'Color made it ruins....domino'    :lol

COMMENT:

Those of you hear "by gone" or "my god" or "rise up" or other phrases, you need to do the following.

Play Surf's Up with the volume low.

Getting away from room reflections will help to understand the recorded word.
 
Put your ear very close to one of the stereo speakers. Say a couple of inches or so.

Now listen.

It's  "Mike, ell" or Michael. It's hard to make "Michael" sound musical. They did it by changing the emphasis.


You can also play the psycoacoustic game of thinking what you want to hear. Like "by gone." If you think you hear that, you may seem to hear it.

The reason it's on the lyric sheet as "Michael" is because that is the lyric.


~swd

Mr Desper, is there room for a possible revision that took place between the lyrics being written down and the vocal tracks being laid down in your opinion? Because I can say with 99.95% certainty that the following isolated track reveals to me that "bygone" is what is being sung, not "Michael". It's a shame, I was really hoping to hear Michael  :( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqMwMvnDmbY


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on August 02, 2012, 06:53:21 AM
Hmmm. Sounds like "Bygone" most conclusively to me also.  :-\


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: 37!ws on August 02, 2012, 12:19:51 PM
(FWIW, I always thought it was "Cal-gon, Cal-gon" -- as in "take me away." Prove me wrong, fellas!)


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: AndrewHickey on August 02, 2012, 02:11:10 PM
Yeah, whatever's on the lyric sheet, the backing vocals definitely actually sing 'bygone, bygone'. Possibly a last-minute lyric change that Mr Desper forgot?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: willy on August 02, 2012, 10:23:00 PM
Never mind what's on that handwritten lyric sheet, what does it say in the lyrics on the sleeve of BWPS?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: runnersdialzero on August 02, 2012, 10:30:40 PM
Never mind what's on that handwritten lyric sheet, what does it say in the lyrics on the sleeve of BWPS?

Not especially relevant - there are known fuckups from what appeared on BWPS in comparison to the original recordings. "Out in the barnyard, the cook is chopping lumber" instead of the original "Out in the farmyard, the cook is chopping lumber", for instance. Not knocking BWPS, just saying, there are a few examples where there are accidental differences.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: willy on August 02, 2012, 11:15:47 PM
Hm.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on August 03, 2012, 10:35:35 AM
I've known for years that it was 'bygone, bygone', but there was a time when I thought it was 'right on, right on', which would have been a fairly hip addition in 1971!  :smokin


And for the longest time I was trying to figure out what was meant by 'Color made it ruins....domino'    :lol

COMMENT:

Those of you hear "by gone" or "my god" or "rise up" or other phrases, you need to do the following.

Play Surf's Up with the volume low.

Getting away from room reflections will help to understand the recorded word.
 
Put your ear very close to one of the stereo speakers. Say a couple of inches or so.

Now listen.

It's  "Mike, ell" or Michael. It's hard to make "Michael" sound musical. They did it by changing the emphasis.


You can also play the psycoacoustic game of thinking what you want to hear. Like "by gone." If you think you hear that, you may seem to hear it.

The reason it's on the lyric sheet as "Michael" is because that is the lyric.


~swd

Mr Desper, is there room for a possible revision that took place between the lyrics being written down and the vocal tracks being laid down in your opinion? Because I can say with 99.95% certainty that the following isolated track reveals to me that "bygone" is what is being sung, not "Michael". It's a shame, I was really hoping to hear Michael  :( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqMwMvnDmbY

COMMENT:  I don't post here to fan the flames of controversy. I posted what I remember about the Surf's Up that I recorded. That version was issued on V-Groove LP from an analog source. There was no digital mass distribution system in place when Surf's Up LP was released. I oversaw the original release from inception to release. The LP test pressings were approved by Carl, as producer and myself, as engineer/mixer. When digital misdistribution was introduced into the general public with the CD, the transition of the LP demand to the CD demand was rather swift. Capital Records’ engineers made the first analog to digital conversion. Nothing special was done. Capital was transferring thousands of titles, there entire library, from analog to digital. Later on, other masterings were issued that tried to undue the LP EQ used at the time of mastering. Some more recent masterings do a fairly good job. Unfortunately, none of them complete the matrix. More later.

Frankly, forty years later I also hear "bygone" on the first pass, but I know what happened during the session, as I posted. I suppose you could go back and listen to the multi-track from that period. I did listen to your vocal distillation, but wonder if this is from (1) The SMiLE album version rather than the Surf’s Up album version and (2) a digitally converted source. If so, the vocal distillation is beyond my engineering input. Still, Carl's comment would be only a memory in my mind and proves nothing, except to me. As for revisions, the recording of the song on the SURF'S UP album was under my complete control, with the exception of the some tracks left over from Columbia Studios and The Ed Sullivan show. I wonder why, with all the various re-issue albums that contain Surf's Up and the copyrighted lyric sheets that are published with them or separate to them; that in the last forty years no editor, manager, singer, writer, or A&R department has modified the lyric or questioned its accuracy.

To be copyrighted by the US Copyright Office the notes and lyrics must be submitted following certain government guidelines. It is a serious matter. Correctness of all lyric content is of paramount importance. The Beach Boy office did maintain a secretary, one of whose duties it was to submit lyric copyrightings in coordination with the artist. Did Carl, the producer, make a mistake when he approved the lyric sheet submitted to the Copyright Office? These things are checked and double-checked before submission -- it is important to the artists and the record company. These are legal documents.

Surf's Up (the Carl Wilson production) is such a bizarre construction of an unfinished song, perhaps this Michael/Bygone episode is yet another escapade in the weird saga of this mystical song. Maybe Carl misunderstood my question, or I his answer. But then the lyric sheet, that is the copyrighted and published lyric sheet, agrees with what I understood at the time.

I have tried to remember any other situations concerning the recording of that phrase. I can only remember what I posted. I did not mean to open a can-of-worms with several opinions crawling around this thread. If you are comfortable hearing "bygone" then go with that. There is no rule here. Neither word appears on the handwritten manuscript since it's a background vocal. 

As I said, listening all these years later it sounds like "bygone" to me, if I want it to be, and "Michael," if that. It's a fascinating dilemma for me, having recorded the damn phrase in the first place. I’m trying to be accurate here as I know how important it is to some of you. It is frustrating when you can’t remember a detail when you know it’s in your head somewhere.

After pacing around my house for several hours trying to remember anything that might shade some light on this dilemma, I did remember one thing. And don't get all crazy with this. But in the course of my tenure with them, I do recall a couple of times where two different vocals were recorded, either at the same time or on separate tracks (later combined). That is, two different sets of words were sung to the same notes at the same time and given equal weight in the mix. Or one mixed down to a subliminal level, but still an influence. I don't recall which songs were treated this way, but it did happen. Maybe this is one of those times -- I just cannot remember. I recorded it when I was 28 … now 70. I recorded so many songs and even more tracks of vocals, keeping all the details straight for this group is beyond my powers of recollection.

NEXT DAY

After sleeping on it, this morning I got out my LP copy. Put it on the turntable and listened. Again, I can hear it either way. Then I got to thinking, you-all are listening to the stereo versions. That version is the version always released. However, it is the unresolved-matrix version. On the other hand, I’m always listening to the resolved-matrix version, since I have the playback matrix in my playback system. So I got an idea.

I got up close to one speaker and adjusted the matrix from no influence to maximum influence. Low and behold, I could make what sounds like “bygone” come out or go back into the mix, and the “Michael” come out or go back into the mix by adjusting a couple of the matrix’s controls. The influence in rather subtle, but it is there. Dare I think that this is one of those cases of dual vocals and I can’t remember doing it that way. It behaves as if the “Michael: vocal is in the matrix and the “bygone” vocal is not. So the “bygone” vocal would seem louder in the stereo release. Now I’m just speculating here. I’m trying to solve a dichotomy that I created, but can’t remember.

Please don’t read into this anything definite. It’s all speculation at this point.

What is interesting to me is that Surf’s Up is already a song shrouded in mystery … mystical beginnings, mystical suspension, mystical resurrection, mystical lyrics. So why not add to this mystery a mystery sounding background vocal track. It fits the song just as much as the super-natural powers Brian ascribes to it. If what I’m hearing on playback is any indicator, at least I know how I would have treated a dual-vocal track for this song. I would have put the Michael (prayer) part into the matrix so as to make it sound more ethereal and less mortal. I know my own habits and how I would have approached it, if any of this is true. Again, I do not remember. It’s all speculation about a part we all hear one way and then another way, a part shrouded in mixing mystery, a part of lyrical conundrum as enigmatic as the entire song itself. Seems fitting in a strange way. 


 ~swd

PS :: Brian sang the Father of the man ending in his pajamas.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on August 03, 2012, 10:59:17 AM
Thank you Stephen for your much appreciated and valuable input. How fascinating indeed! 


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on August 03, 2012, 11:09:09 AM
The thing is, the only lyrics that SWD actually specifically quoted as being sung by Brian were "A children's song" -- which Brian absolutely did, right before the group came in at the end. Even clearer than the aforementioned "Holy mackerel!" isolation that was going around a few years ago is the isolated vocals from the Endless Harmony DVD 5.1 mixes...if that's not Al singing the "and the children know the way..." lyrics, then Brian sure did a good job of imitating him. And somebody didn't know how to pronounce the word "children," or as sung in that little coda, "chill-ren."

COMMENT:

Y'all are confusing yourselves. Either stay with the Carl Wilson supervised production of Surf's Up, or don't. There is only one version I worked on.  All other versions are someone else's product.

Here, in its entirety is page 31 from my book Recording The Beach Boys . . .

SURF’S UP UNDER SIEGE   By way of the 5.1 remix issues, Surf’s Up is being torn apart and reconstructed for the sake of today's technology and profit motive. As I said on page one, “The business aspect of the entertainment industry played a major role in the development of The Beach Boys’ music…” It looks like business as usual. I assure you, Carl would never approve of any re-mixing of this production of Surf’s Up, nor would brother Dennis or Al Jardine. Remixing certainly nullifies any claim by the crafters of such mischief to the new production being “Produced by The Beach Boys.” It removes an essential part in the process. It unravels the very fabric of the creative soul these great artists gave to us through this technical art form.

The six Beach Boys who created Surf’s Up were not mere singers, they were creative artisans painting with the brushes of the mixing console on a canvas of two-track stereo and matrixed recording tape. The paintings they produced are completed.

It is not for The Louvre to touch up the Mona Lisa with acrylic paint in the interest of an update, just as it would be wrong for RKO to colorize “Citizen Kane” because they can. Should we reconstruct the Taj Mahal or Saint Peter’s Basilica because we can now build with steel? Would it be our place to make them more grandiose in keeping with the times? Is it Capitol Records’ place in history to re-arrange Surf’s Up just to appease the current surround fad? When he was alive Carl insisted the re-issues of Pet Sounds be made in mono, the way Brian originally mixed it. This was Carl setting a precedent; don’t change the original. 

What an insult to and disrespect of Carl Wilson! He lived to give rise and finish the recording we all know and love. Carl’s untimely death does not usher in the right to re-engineer his master tape, his final statement of Surf’s Up. If any re-mix claims to be the real production of Carl Wilson’s hand, it is a fraudulent copy, a counterfeit, a fake of the real Surf’s Up.

Technically it is impossible to remix Surf’s Up to 5.1 from the 16 track original multi-track. Many of the sounds on Surf’s Up were created on the fly or by way of acoustic ping-pong and were not preserved on the master multi-track. To add insult to injury, inferior vocal tracks were left intact on the original multi-track but not used for the mixdown. Only Carl and myself know which tracks were used (I doubt I could remember the idiosyncrasies of each track anyway). So remixes to 5.1 will undoubtedly contain mistaken tracks while also not contain other original tracks, thereby not mimic the original work nor its mixdown.
 
Re-mastering of the final two-track masters for release on the CD medium offers a chance for improving the sound since the originals MASTER TAPES were optimized for the LP medium. Re-mastering, unlike re-mixing, does not disrupt the producer’s intent and often accomplishes his true objective which was limited by the earlier technology.


The songs of Surf’s Up were produced by THE BEACH BOYS
1971 group members included: Brian Wilson, Carl Wilson, Dennis Wilson, Alan Jardine, Michael Love, and Bruce Johnston
 
 


~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: petsite on August 05, 2012, 02:36:09 PM
Very very very well put, Mr. Desper. Got a little choked up reading that.

SURF S UP (Legal Title)
BMI Work #1434517

Songwriter/Composer:           Current Affiliation    CAE/IPI #
PARKS VAN DYKE              ASCAP                  23519307
WILSON BRIAN              BMI                  33029517
 
Publishers:
BROTHER PUBLISHING CO.        BMI                  33957469
CROW CRIES MUSIC          BMI                  486641519

Artists:
BEACH BOYS
WILSON BRIAN


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: GeorgeFellInHisHorn on August 05, 2012, 03:40:30 PM
NEXT DAY

After sleeping on it, this morning I got out my LP copy. Put it on the turntable and listened. Again, I can hear it either way. Then I got to thinking, you-all are listening to the stereo versions. That version is the version always released. However, it is the unresolved-matrix version. On the other hand, I’m always listening to the resolved-matrix version, since I have the playback matrix in my playback system. So I got an idea.

Mr. Desper, is it possible for a studying Audio Engineer such as myself to achieve this playback matrix at home?


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: pixletwin on August 05, 2012, 03:58:44 PM
Maybe I am just listening selectively, but I can hear the "bygone" and the "Michael". I would venture a guess that "bygone" is sung and "Michael" seems to be what is whispered.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: ? on August 05, 2012, 05:05:28 PM
Maybe I am just listening selectively, but I can hear the "bygone" and the "Michael". I would venture a guess that "bygone" is sung and "Michael" seems to be what is whispered.

I was thinking the same thing.


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Stephen W. Desper on August 06, 2012, 10:33:54 AM
Mr. Desper, is it possible for a studying Audio Engineer such as myself to achieve this playback matrix at home?

COMMENT: It's quite complex; many years of development, the subject of two court-tested patents, a 150 page white paper with 108 references to pear reviewed research papers and other patents. Beyond this are added improvements that include transient restoration techniques. However, an alternative solution for fans, such as yourself, is in the works.  Please Stand-By. 

~swd


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: Fall Breaks on August 06, 2012, 12:38:48 PM
What is interesting to me is that Surf’s Up is already a song shrouded in mystery … mystical beginnings, mystical suspension, mystical resurrection, mystical lyrics. So why not add to this mystery a mystery sounding background vocal track. It fits the song just as much as the super-natural powers Brian ascribes to it. If what I’m hearing on playback is any indicator, at least I know how I would have treated a dual-vocal track for this song. I would have put the Michael (prayer) part into the matrix so as to make it sound more ethereal and less mortal. I know my own habits and how I would have approached it, if any of this is true. Again, I do not remember. It’s all speculation about a part we all hear one way and then another way, a part shrouded in mixing mystery, a part of lyrical conundrum as enigmatic as the entire song itself. Seems fitting in a strange way.  [/size]

 ~swd

PS :: Brian sang the Father of the man ending in his pajamas.

This paragraph, and the post scriptum, together and apart, are among the most beautiful pieces of writing I've ever read on this board. Thank you, Mr. Desper!


Title: Re: Surf's Up lyrics - assist
Post by: GeorgeFellInHisHorn on August 06, 2012, 02:23:28 PM
Mr. Desper, is it possible for a studying Audio Engineer such as myself to achieve this playback matrix at home?

COMMENT: It's quite complex; many years of development, the subject of two court-tested patents, a 150 page white paper with 108 references to pear reviewed research papers and other patents. Beyond this are added improvements that include transient restoration techniques. However, an alternative solution for fans, such as yourself, is in the works.  Please Stand-By. 

~swd

Amazing to hear! Thank you, and looking forward to it!