The Smiley Smile Message Board

I just saw this on the BBB board.  Apologies if you all have seen it already (I know that some have).  Typical Bruce.

Album idea for Brian from me:
As Brian's voice sounds very relaxed and unstrained on his Gershwin album, I'd recommend a fully orchestrated 'next' album along the lines of Natalie Cole's seven times platinum "Unforgettable: With Love".......
Brian's album could be a mix of 'standards' and a few great classic Beach Boys songs ("Warmth Of The Sun"...."God Only Knows"....and possibly one more BW/BB song). I'd expect Brian to record the BB songs in much lower keys for 'extra' warmth to his vocals. We all love his great falsetto voice from the early days but the lower range would be much more appropriate for this kind of an album. I would hope that the album's orchestral arranger would be at the level of a Nelson Riddle. I'd expect Brian only to focus only on his singing (and not arranging & producing). Finally, I'd have David Foster as the producer. David would be my first ten choices!
I know Brian would enjoy the great songs, beautiful orchestral arrangements, and a top world class producer. There would be zero pressure on Brian....All he would have to do is sing in his warm natural 2010 voice.

Bruce Johnston
Montecito
September 7, 2010




AGD:
My 'mind set' about a new Brian Wilson album is from my early days as a staff producer at Columbia Records (pre-Beach Boys!).....
I was wondering what recording direction an almost seventy years old (....I'm just weeks younger than Brian myself!!) beloved super music success story like Brian Wilson could take.
I think Brian could successfully record a 2011/2012 album not unlike Willie Nelson's 1978 Stardust album (but updated in the approach and song selection). It would be very wise to have a producer like David Foster for Brian. David is so amazing at everything he does and perhaps Brian would please all of his fans with a 180 degree music direction change (along the lines of Michael Buble......David is Michael's producer). As I mentioned in an earlier post to you, I know Brian would enjoy just singing while everyone else does the 'heavy lifting' of arranging & producing this project...........A music icon like Brian starts to become ageless now (like Willie Nelson) and a project like this could really work.
Andrew, this idea of mine is not new or even original but it's worth considering. My 'production ears' heard the 'relaxed' Brian Wilson vocal range on his Gershwin album and it really got me to thinking about a one or two future album recording direction. As you pointed out, Brian has one more Disney album to record and perhaps he could give my album idea a try after that.
I was very successful suggesting to Mike Love to use his soft baritone voice for singing the lead on "Kokomo" instead of having Carl Wilson singing the verses in a higher key. Most people don't realize that Mike has three vocal ranges: a very commercial higher lead voice, a quasi bass doo wop voice, and his soft 'Kokomo' voice. This is a vocal band and it's important to know everyone's vocal range.
Back to Brian: With so many Brian Wilson solo albums released over the recent years, you need to take great care in the artistic direction. Perhaps Brian could invite Tony Bennett to duet on "The Warmth Of The Sun"....Could you imagine Brian & Tony dueting with that great song over an amazing full orchestral arrangement? (I am such a fan of "The Warmth Of The Sun" and there is a sweet Beach Boys recording of Willie Nelson an us singing it together).....

Bruce Johnston
Montecito
September 8, 2010



Rick:
Thanks for the compliment but there are much better orchestral arrangers than I could ever hope to be. Whoever arranges the music must be at the level of Nelson Riddle (I'm not even close!) and anyway, there should be no Beach Boys connection other than a couple of very known Brian Wilson 'classic' songs from the early days.
Brian will do better standing alone in front of a great microphone singing classic world class songs (with amazing arrangements and being guided by a brilliant producer on the 'other side of the glass' (but guiding Brian ever so slightly).

Bruce Johnston
Montecito
September 8, 2010

I know Bruce is being sincere and earnest here...but this just makes my stomach churn! A number of reviews already think that Brian has gone the lazy "standards" route with BWRG; David Foster producing Beach Boys remakes so Brian can duet with Tony Bennett would be the most dismal sort of career-ender imaginable.

Attention all former/current Beach Boys: as attractive as the idea may seem, no further classic BB song remakes are required!

Like you said, I feel Bruce is being sincere, and I think he's a really nice guy so I'm not going to argue with his opinion. 

After reading Brian's remarks about David Foster and "Fairy Tale", I doubt that Brian is too anxious to work with him. Maybe vice-versa too.

If a "Beach Boys connection " is needed for an arranger, how about Rick Henn?  He works as an arranger/conductor with an orchestra in Southern California and he and Brian have history! 

i'd pass on that one. 

I reckon even an 80-minutes album of Brian singing the Hokey Pokey over and over again would be more interesting than this.

Sounds dreadful.

Buble?  Henn?

I think we're more likely to get an 80 minute Shortnin' Bread CD than an 80 minute Hokey Pokey CD

also, I'm not too fond of Bruce's idea.

I'm not a fan of "standards" (especially with orchestral backing) at all.....

Welp, here's another terrible idea from Bruce Johnston. Is anyone surprised given his contributions to The Beach Boys?

Bruce.........Bruce.........Bruce. 

Best thing anyone could encourage Brian to do right now is a good Rock & Roll album.

Write your own stuff and get it released, Bruce. Please.

What did he say? I've never heard this!

Get B-Dub to sing "a few" classic BBs tunes, eh?  And then (just for the sake of bridge-building of course) bring in Johnstone, Love and Jardine for backing vox?  Maybe do a few shows?

I still hope Brian records that rock'n'roll album he's been talking about for years. I think he has already covered, or will cover, "Proud Mary". I know Brian still has a competitive spirit and wants a chart hit again. Bruce's suggestion is fine, and it will sell, like Rod's albums have, and I would buy Brian's, being a fan, but I didn't bother with Rod's albums. Natalie Cole's album was very successful and I might buy that, mainly for the Nat King Cole connection.

Rock and roll album (or at least quite a few tracks for one) is already recorded. If it will be released -- open question.

Are the other BB's on it, or is it by Brian and his new band?

My understanding is that Brian kept recording with Scott after TLOS. Heck, he even talked about it in some interviews. "Proud Mary" version number four (following ones cut with Landy, Don Was and Joe Thomas) is already done.

Of course there's already a lot of unreleased tracks anybody here can compile and make a Brian Wilson Rock & Roll album!

Maybe Brian can just wait til he's cut enough versions of Proud Mary, and then release them all as a Themed Rock and Roll Album, "Brian Wilson Reimagines Proud Mary"

or maybe he could release the four he's done now as an EP...

First, Mikie - What kind of tracks are you talking about?  Are they Brian's "solo" tracks?  Or, are they unreleased Beach Boys tracks?

Second, If they are Beach Boys tracks, do they have lyrics?

Third, One thing I always marveled about was how the lyrics for Good Vibrations evolved.  What seems to be "generally accepted" is that Mike Love wrote those lyrics, while he was touring.  Only someone very "gifted" would be able to accomplish such a task.  If there were no lyrics, would/could Mike be the lyricist? 

Brian has teamed with many different and talented people during his long career, but there is a certain "punch" (a metaphor) that Mike has been able to "apply" to music which makes it "available" to the listener. This was an enormous success and lyrics were done away from the "composer."

Beautiful music, in the old "classical" sense, does not have words which accompany it.  But rock has the combination of the two.
Is it even possible if Brian has melodies written, whether if sent to Mike, in the same manner as Good Vibrations was, in order for
lyrics to be coordinated with them?  Brian has worked with lots of people but it has not come close to the Lerner-Lowe or the Menken-Ashman (RIP)(The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast) partnership that was Wilson-Love.  Mike seems to be able to "get his arms around" what the music is "saying" to him, looking through a different lens.  People have been singing Mike's words for nearly 50 years.   Brian's solo work, while accomplished and fine, does not have people walking down the street who can sing something like I Get Around.  It is the "glue" that hold the melody to the lyrics.  No one is bouncing down the street singing TLOS, even though it is a magnificent work.           

The thread of ranking (according to another thread) has Brian's Gershwin in second place for jazz.  It is interesting that this is the category where the work is "shining."  Jazz and orchestration is not my area.  Maybe Bruce sees a potential for Brian that other people aren't looking at, from a different kind of lens and perspective, and seems to know who in the business might be a good fit, for a different type of album where Brian is the star, in a completely different dimension from the Beach Boys, or the leader of his own band, in a manner that would relieve Brian of the "heavy lifting." It might be nice.   

Most of us (the greedy ones) would love to see that type of joint work done again in some capacity by Brian and Mike even if done like Good Vibrations if the face-to-face is not possible.  I don't know if that is possible or even advisable. (I am only a fan.)

But, it might be a real epiphany for Brian, if Mike were to set some words to Brian's music "independently" that made Brian's melody "rock."  AGD may have a more pessimistic (and probably, correct) view of this.  JMHO   ;)           

Is Bruce being serious? He's taken the piss out of the hardcore fans in the past -  remember his tale about burying a H&V acetate in a time capsule beneath a new tower block somewhere?

The guy does have a sense of humour.... then again, didn't he block the release of a concert vid cos he was wearing an un-hip shirt?

Go figure, we're on Planet Beach Boys here...

Interesting idea!  I loved Davey Johnstone's backing vocals on the '70s Elton records!  Maybe we could get Nigel Olsson in there as well?

All I remember was reading an interview with Brian during GIOMH, talking about "Fairy Tale", saying he was pissed about what David Foster did to his song. Apparently, the song was given to Chicago, given a new title, new lyrics and arrangement. I can't remember which track or album, though. Maybe a Chicago fan here knows more?

Edit: I'm sure it's on one of the Foster produced albums.

This from the man who thought the LA LIGHT album would benefit from a giant disco song right in the middle....

Say what you will about disco, but Here Comes The Night has some of the best vocals that The Beach Boys have ever graced on a record.

Oops.  :lol

Gershwin covers. Disney covers. Now an idea floating around for an album of duets of old standards? Has the ship sailed on Brian writing new music of his own?
However I could see the benefits of a completely new outside producer, someone who is not a big Brian Wilson fan who can bring a fresh take on Brian's work. Looking back on Bri's solo body of work you can begin to see the cliche of using the "Pet Sounds period" style as the basis for everything he does. The equation for each new release is always Pet Sounds + ? = New record.
Here's my overview of this theory -

Pet Sounds + 80's synth production = BW88
                   + utter shite = Sweet Insanity
                   + elevator muzak = Imagination
                   + Smile = That Lucky Old Sun
                   + Gershwin = Reimagines Gershwin

If Brian does get round to doing a rock record I hope it is with a producer who hasn't got PS on the brain, if not it will just end up as more of the same. I'd love to see what Rick Rubin could do with him.

Why do they always want re-recordings on their album ?!

Yeah! Like Joe Thomas!

 ::)

I mostly agree with you though. i would rather have a fan producing Brian's records, but someone who likes other things as well - Sean O'Hagan was a bad choice in this respect, as he has 'PS on the Brain' as you put it. The thing is though, Rick Rubin was a huge fan of Johnny Cash, but he has a completely different sensibility of Cash's music than most of the country establishment.

I don't know who I'd like to see produce a new Brian record - Jason Falkner would be cool, he did good things with Daniel Johnston. or David Fridmann, but i can see that becoming a massive failure quite easily. David Sitek would be a really interesting choice - Brian Wilson goes noise rock!

Good call. At the time I thought Sean O'Hagan was a superb choice; now I don't anymore. O'Hagan, with his own band, was sort of a musical curator; I like the Llamas' music, but more as a sort of nice background music. I'd think now that he would have tried to frame new Brian music within the soundscapes of 'Friends', or 'Sunflower', which is never a good starting point for creating new fine music. See it this way: Wishbone Ash are what they are nowadays. They will never create a successful new 'Argus' masterpiece.

I think that Jason Lytle, the writer and producer of Grandaddy would make an excellent choice. A synth trippy style. The feeling of Friends, Love You and some punk rock sprinkled in there.

Protected from the Rain
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHu43y4FBo0

MGM the Grand
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvoZfVabcog

That H & V acetate time-capsule story I never heard, but, I donated an 8-track Beach Boys tape for a time capsule for my law school in 2000.  The Dean loved it (also a fan) and held it up for some of the students to see the "technology" for music of that era and thought it was cool for their time capsule.  One might draw the analogy that it would be like my seeing  a "Victrola" (which played 78 rpm records, when I was a kid, and which was old technology.  Of course the students (mostly CD babies) thought the 8 track cassette was hilarious and that we must be ancient!

The 8 track was the predecessor of the cassette player and probably the first technology for you to "take your music with you" in your car.  This changed the whole approach to music because you did not have to be glued to your stereo, or record player, and could "zone out" and shut the world out while your were driving.  "In My Room" could become "in my car."    It is an interesting discussion to hear someone talk about using older analog for a more pure sound.  There is  probably a limited group of people who are expert in this area, who have a facility with this method.

"Planet Beach Boys" - I love it!!! ;)

Brian's solo tracks. There's quite a few in the can. I'd really like to see him hook up with Paley again. Those were some real productive sessions, even though much of it was Paley. If he's got some newer stuff ready to go (or even half done) with Scott, Darian, etc., that's good news. If it's true, then he's got a jump on an album that'll hopefully mean something.

Anyone but Rubin!!


Ah, why not Dave Fridmann? He could get Wayne Coyne and the Lips and the guys from MGMT, maybe even his Mercury Rev bandmates to guest on a couple tracks.

Give Brian a synth, a steak, keep Sir. Von Mertens Esq. away from it and lets have some fun.

I was just going to post something very similar!

Brian Wilson doesn't need a producer. What he needs is a Moog synthesizer and a snare drum. :smokin

What's wrong with Paul Mertens? He's good!

I find his arrangements pure cheese. Plus what kind of dude does a freaking extended flute solo in Caroline No? And wheres a Kimono? I mean come on.

Charles Lloyd.

I LOVED it when Brian did the extended "Caroline, No," he almost always did a great job on the vocal.

I agree -- I'd love to see Brian do a new rock album, without any PS-influenced tracks! The PS-esque tracks on his other albums are the ones I play the least.

Small point: probably the first "take your music in the car", was the car record player. Don't think it was a big hit, tho.
then of course there were 4 track tape players, MUNTZ! before there were 8 tracks too.  

Yes, By all means; a Brian album without any Brian input.

was about to reply the same, but you were ahead of me...  ;D

Bgas - I never heard of a car record player or a four-track either...Wow! In any event, it was probably unaffordable for me at that time.  By the time I had a "real" job, and a used  VW Bug, having an FM radio was a big deal, as most of them only had AM's factory installed, but they were playing the Boys on the FM stations, more Surf's Up, etc. 

And, I felt like a rich girl when I got an 8 track and could have the Boys on whenever I wanted, and not hostage to the taste and judgment of the DJ's! 

Thanks for that info  ;)   

A Brian Wilson album without any input from the man himself would be pointless agreed - but Pet Sounds wasn't the only good album he ever made. My point was that every person he works with on a solo project ALWAYS tries to make the music somehow connected to the PS mould of songwriting.

Effin A!  I'm high fiving you, mentally.

What if that's just how Brian Wilson sounds?

I personally love HCTN, but that said, you have to admit it calls judgment into question thinking that that would have been a good idea.

This is one of the things that happens with industry-insider types, even ones with good intentions (and I hear nothing but good intentions in this idea)...it's very easy once you grasp that optics and canny marketing are 80% of what constitutes success to forget that the other 20% which is about what Rivers Cuomo once called "making it cool" does come into play.  To properly sell out, you need to make it look like you're not selling out.

I think it's a bad idea, but I salute Bruce's enthusiasm nonetheless.

Exactly my point. Maybe Brian's input just makes it always sound PS-esque? Not saying it's a conscious plan.

As much as I love BWRG, I don't think Brian should continue down that path for the remainder of his career.  The Disney album will be enjoyable I'm sure, but it seems odd to me to suggest even more projects that don't involve any composing (the two "collaborations" on BWRG notwithstanding).  Brian is a songwriter, after all...if he still has the desire to write, why keep him doing covers?

I do like the idea of bringing in a "non-obvious" producer, just to bring a different feel to Brian's music, but that can really go either way (as we've seen in the past).  At the end of the day, Brian should be allowed to write and record whatever he has interest in writing and recording, whether that turns out to be more Pet Sounds-type songs/arrangements, a rock n' roll album, or just Brian by himself with a Moog.

Brian needs to work with Steve Albini :lol

Brian as composer faces five major challenges.

1.) He's intermittently inspired these days. When he is, he can turn out song after song, but when he isn't, he just produces fragments.

2.) He could be inspired by a collaborator, but that almost inevitably leads to problems with publishing / control / etc. with the wifeandmanagers. So he'll work with Scott if he's inspired, but Scott generally restricts his role to lyrics and some demo instrumentation because of the aforementioned reasons (just my guess).

3.) If Brian was truly inspired or found a kick-in-the-pants co-writer, the material itself wouldn't necessarily be any good.

4.) Raiding the vaults tends to not work so well. Brian tends not to be into recutting old songs (GIOMH vox compared with SI vox on the same tunes provides the evidence here).

5.) Lack of record company interest. If he has a project or some themed idea, they'll try. But I don't think a major label would go for a non-concept collection of BW songs. It already exists, but Disney would rather release a Gershwin album. Them's the facts.

Take that all together, and I'd say the prospects of many more major label collections of new BW songs is pretty dim If he wants to put out a BB album, that would work. And any indie would be more than happy to put out originals.

Right!  Just your guess.  ;D

Do you think Brian would -- or could, for that matter -- make the transition to a (medium- or major-sized?) indie label that is perhaps more willing to give him some leeway as to the end result product? I'd be very surprised if there were not any indie labels willing to do this -- I don't have one in mind off the top of my head or anything -- considering he is basically the darling of much independently-made pop music (although that is, of course, '60s-myth Brian and not so much 2010 Brian). Frankly, considering his albums don't sell too much and he is constrained by what the major label wants (or doesn't want), would it not be a better fit? Independent labels, especially the bigger ones, are (I assume) able to move 12,000 units easily just as well as Disney's labels are. And presumably an indie label, depending on which one it is, would be fine releasing a Brian Wilson album that has no conceptual conceit: just new Brian Wilson originals [with or without Scott's involvement, I guess]. While I think this would be neat, I don't have an axe to grind in thinking Brian Wilson is some sort of indie figurehead so I ask out of curiosity regarding how he would feel about it... or, I guess since that's probably a useless question, how his inner circle would feel about it, more accurately.

Oh, I think there's any number that would jump on it. Absolutely. The prestige factor alone. Tom Waits has been on an indie since the late 90s, and his albums sell more than his ones on major labels. The differences are pretty cosmetic at this point anyway.

The issue, I think, isn't one of interest. It's one of ego.

It is, actually. But knowing the history of Paley et. al, it's not a difficult one to make. And honestly, Brian is also kind of flighty with his collaborators anyway -- ask Usher and Asher and Parks about it.

Gary Usher's dead.  But I did read Steve McParland's books.

For Brian himself or for his circle? There was that recent interview where Brian remarked rather off-the-cuff that the way the music industry works today is outmoded and is busy doin' nothing [ha! I should be a rock journalist!]. Maybe it was an inconsequential remark but I'll take it at face value for what it's worth: it at least seems like Brian realises no majors care about his music -- and maybe that he returns the favour? Perhaps he personally would be receptive to working with, I don't know, Yep Roc or Mint or whoever, but his people would see it as a loss of prestige going from Capitol or Disney to that. And we're back to where you (Wirestone) mention Brian's lack of self-determination; back to square one.

Nice call. But he would have to get independent himself before addressing an independent label. I think Anti, or Sub Pop gladly would give him the opportunity to work. But the budget would be limited, and Brian would have to respect a certain schedule. To do that, he'd need a close collaborator/friend.

I suggest Mike Love.

A big problem with all the constant Label hopping is that it's going to be nigh on impossible to ever release a comprehensive "Best Of" compilation of Brian's solo material.

Nah. We just have to wait 70 years. Then everything will be Public Domain.

maybe he should sign to that Starbucks label with Paul.  lots of older artists there, carly simon, james taylor, elvis costello.

I do believe Hear Music has effectively folded.

iF BWRG is Pet Sounds + Gershwin, I'm hoping the Disney album is Smile + Disney, as the "cartoon consciousness" of the Smile music would really fit with the Disney tunes.  Simpler, more idiosyncratic/strange arrangements.  An eerie quality to it all. 

An album of standards similar to "Deep Purple" on Adult Child?  I would love it, along with a couple of originals recorded the same way.

On my wish list for Brian producers?  I know it will never happen, but . . . Spector.  Maybe if he can get out on bail if he gets granted a new trial.  Unlikely, I know.  He would also be a great songwriting collaborator, except neither is good with lyrics.

I don't see Spector as a great songwriter, never have. I think he added very little to every song he claimed.
I just lump him in with all the other label owners that added their names to the credits, or they wouldn't release the records.
 Most of a hit royalty, is better than no royalty

Brian readily admits that he hears Phil Spector's voice in his head and also believed for a long time that Phil was trying to kill him. I doubt Phil would wish to spend any time in a room with Brian Wilson.

The idea of two elderly men in one room, testing their pugilistic skills on each other, appeals to me. I would suggest Bill Murray as the referee.

Brian : What did you just say Phil?

Phil: I didn't say nothing.

Brian: Yes you did just then!

Phil: Dammit Brian I havn't said a word for the last ten minutes!

Bill Murray: Phil put the gun down before someone gets hurt.

Actually, the "trying to kill" part seems fairly well founded considering.

I respect Bruce as a musician, I like a handful of his songs as a songwriter, I think his surfin' round the world  album really rocked...but this idea of his is retarded.

Bruce said he likes the new,natural 2010 Brian voice.with out the falsetto highs and such.  I agree.  On that he is right, IMO.  But I think an all covers lp with an outside producer arranger would invite comments such as "Brian's singing is only so-so and he is no longer writing, arranging, or producing."

At this point, I'm not sure what I would like to hear Brian record.  But go with the natural voice whatever it might be.


I would like to hear a duet with Taylor Mills at some point.  At least a line or two in a song or two.

Maybe Its Over Now or Lets Put Our Hearts Together...as live numbers or remakes on a studio effort.

My initial response would be that yes, there is a new maybe untapped side of Brian that we have seen but my sense is that the Gershwin thing was more about his Beach Boy "approach" and "sparkle" (I think of Tinkerbell!) to the music, not his vocal talent, which is not bad.  And, I don't think that Brian is another Perry Como, Dean Martin or Ole Blue Eyes.   Brian has a nice voice but does not have that "voltage" which comes with early vocal training and practice.  I am not in the business for my whole life so my "uninformed opinion" is much off-to-the-side as a fan. 

The fact that Brian has moved into another surprise jazz dimension, should be a huge boost for him.  There is nothing like approval and success for your confidence. It is good for school kids and good for adults.  It may open other doors Brian did not anticipate were open to him. Whoever does this project, should be competent and trustworthy.  Enough charlatans wormed their way into the Beach Boys organization, and alienated good, "credentialed," and talented musicians along the way, notwithstanding the conflicting biographies and autobiographies, and career "chronicles" authorized or not.   

It should flattering that Bruce, whose opinion everyone may not share, does "know something" about the business, and perhaps has a "vision" - with an "informed opinion" which is different from "talking out of your butt," not knowing Brian, but having worked with him, should not be "blown off" as pie-in-the-sky.  He did studio work with Brian, and knows his capabilities, what his "adult" vocal range is, and areas where he should not tread or tread lightly.  I could say - Whether it is a good idea or not;  what do I know?   

The Gershwin album does sparkle but I am careful not to drive with it as it is so dreamy you could nod off with it...Just let me hear some of that rock and roll music!

But, it this is often a "hit or miss" business, and what is a blockbuster one year, can fail terribly the next, so it is like medicine, a lot of experience, testing and a little guesswork and a lot of luck... ;)

I don't understand this point - are you saying that an album / or demos of original material was original offered to Disney but that they instead opted for the Gershwin album? If so, I'd like to hear more about this - it's news to me...

I believe Brian has enough songs knocking about from the last few years or so to constitute a solo record. At least, that's the impression i get from posts here. I don't think he's been offering them to labels, though. Could be wrong, although I imagine someone would have picked them up.
Brian appears to have wanted to do Gershwin on his own, and Disney let him with the proviso he do the Disney record too (The truth probably involves the wife&managers a bit more, but i think that's the gist).

I sure do get tired of being half-right all the time...

Or Rick Rubin. Or Nigel Godrich.

Nothing was offered to Disney, but Brian has enough quality songs/demos in the can to put together an album of original material. This isn't anything new, or restricted information, hell, I've been saying it for over a year. Disney approached Brian with the Movie Songs idea and he said "sure, but I want to do this (Gershwin) first": they swallowed hard, then said "OK". Artistically as great a move as it was a commercial disaster.

Seems to rather overstate things, no? If Disney didn't print up many albums (as seems to be the case), I doubt they lost much on it.

The product was great, the reviews were stellar... and you couldn't find the thing in the stores with a magnifying glass, no in-store promotion, while amazon.com sold out of the #1 seller on the first day. On top of the production costs, Disney paid Brian $250,000 up front and then got Al Schmitt to (needlessly) remix it (and he doesn't come cheap). Someone mused to me that maybe it was a tax writeoff and all they really wanted Brian for was the movie songs album... and you know, that makes more sense than what actually happened.

ya really gotta love the strategy then! 
Give the artist what he wants, "promise" promotion but don't do it and don't stock it, but make sure he's locked into the Movie album.
Take a HUGE writeoff that will more than pay for Gershwin and the Movie album.
But will Brian be unhappy enough to break the deal? 
and if he does, does he face the wheel?

Andrew, I meekly ask, is this one time where one can't put the blame on Brian's ahem management? Has that day truly come?

Sorry, but the reviews were not stellar, they were mostly okay, but not as good as TLOS or BWPS or BW88.
http://www.metacritic.com/music/brian-wilson-reimagines-gershwin/critic-reviews

i'm gonna be bracing myself for that disney album once it gets going. *shudder*

Sorry Jon, going by Metacritic is a pretty sloppy way to gauge critical reaction. You're using it to prop up your personal response to the record, but the site only uses a few reviews, and assigns relatively arbitrary numerical values to otherwise complimentary pieces.

A few reviews?  They quote/link 17 for BWRG.  Though I don't understand how they do their scoring system.
It should be noted that they note 11 Positive reviews, 5 Mixed and one Negative.

It has 17. There have easily been twice that many pieces about the album published. Many of them, however, are also profiles about Brian / the record, and thus not included in Metacritic's numerical summation. I recall fewer such pieces about TLOS. In terms of rating, Metacritic's 1-100 system is primarily used to gauge video games (the game industry is by far the biggest user of the site), and video game sites tend to review releases on a 1-100 or 1-10 scale that translates almost exactly to the aggregating site.

Records tend to be reviewed on a 1-4 or 1-5 star system. Take Rolling Stone, for instance. It almost never awards five stars. A four-star review from them tends to signify an excellent album. An A minus, let's say. 3 and a half stars (what BWRG received) tends to be the equivalent of a B-plus or B grade. Yet Metacritic translates that into a numerical grade of 70.

Given that TLOS got an average of 70 and that BWRG (currently) averages at 68 -- to say that this proves, somehow, that critical reception for one was notably better than the other -- based on a partial selection of reviews and numerical values different from those of the original reviews -- well, it doesn't add up. I think it might be fairer to say the album got solid-to-excellent reviews, with U.S. critics reacting more favorably than British ones.

17 is a lot for that site. Heart's new album has three.  David Gray's newest 12.  Katy Perry has 17 (and she's one of the biggest stars around these days).

But all in all Wirestone, a stellar review of Metacritic!

Also it's worth mentioning that BWPS is the highest rated album on Metacritic...so to say that the new album isn't getting comparable reviews is setting way, way too high a bar, because almost NO album is.

Seems safe to say the critical response is fairly positive.

The record is good to excellent, and that's a commendable achievement for Brian and his team at this stage of his career.  But its clearly not a critical home-run. Metacritic or any other evaluation of the average critical reaction to this record will rate it that way. Its arguably Brian's third best rated solo record by the music press. In the UK it probably rates lower than that. That's the way its playing out. I think BWRG is a very good record that charted decently. I know it won't make me popular here, and even less popular on Brian's board...but IMO that's just the reality of BWRG. Very good, not great.

Re:  IMO that's the reality...Opinion and reality are easily confused, but they're not the same thang...seems like the original point, that it's a critical success, is a valid one.  How much is a big critical success as opposed to a modest one...that's a tough thing to quantify, even using Metacritic.  Particularly since these things tend to evolve over time.

Seems like a pretty minor point to quibble over to me.

I stand corrected-ish. The initial reviews were mostly stellar. Oddly, the UK reviews were mostly "eh, whatever", which was beside the point anyway as there was even less promo for the damn thing over here and accordingly it charted for one week at #55 then fell off the radar.

Commercial disappointment maybe. Now GIOMH....THAT was a commercial (and artistic!) disaster!

:D

Just messin'.... :lol

Seriously, though, I could give 2 shits what anybody else says...I LOVE the album, and I'm not even that big into Gershwin!

I'm betting GIOMH, even though it charted for one week at #100, still sold more than BWRG has to date.

What?! That....wow...seriously?! That is just...again...wow....that doesn't just blow my mind...it freakin' sets it on fire and puts it out with used cat litter.

Your emotions are too much for me. I just collapsed under the collective weight of all your 100,000,000,000 neurons unloading all that dopamine, serotonin, and glutamate. I made an appointment with a brain surgeon for urgent work. This afternoon I will be a different person.

You promise?


I kid, I kid....
:D

Don will be like Jack Nicholson at the end of "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" by the time you all read this.