The Smiley Smile Message Board

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/17386/183831 (http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/17386/183831)

Great. Al is gonna mess this up before it even happens. At least Mike speaks in hypotheticals.

I wonder, though. Sure seems like the Jardine and Love camps are trying to pressure Brian's people through the media. Wonder if that's gonna work out for them.

It sounds to me more like it's something that has been talked about, but Brian's people don't want that to take away from the Gershwin album coming out. I really hope that Brian's people don't blow this thing. Unless of course the guy is 100 percent against doing it.

I was wondering the same thing, if the idea wasn't to create a fait accompli before the fact...

I liked the part where Al talks about his album, referring to a hopeful release on CD:
>>"Beach Boys fans would rather have something they can touch," he says. "I thought I'd get it out now and then take advantage of the second opportunity when the anniversary kicks in next year." << 

Don't forget, the actual date of the 50th won't be in the ballpark till 2011, so that's plenty of time for BWRG to make its stamp before then. And even Brian's crew are bound to see the money inherent in a Beach Boys quinquagintennial (is that the proper word for 50 years like "centennial" is for 100 years?). That is, assuming Brian himself likes the idea.

This is getting confusing. Can the guys not just keep their moths shut till something official happens.

Apparently not, although these are the Beach Boys we're talking about here...their track record in this department speaks for itself I think. 

I won't believe a damn word of what anyone says until they're all up on that stage and they start their first song.

I hope (assuming it comes together) that it's not still an extreme cause of anxiety for Brian to perform with the others (Mike & Bruce specifically) and he doesn't have to deal with the kind of extreme nervousness and panic in facing this potentially (definitely) fraught reunion that he did temporarily during the recording of Smile 2004, when he had to go to the emergency room.

It's one thing to make an appearance with the others on the Capitol rooftop, but another thing entirely to be on stage together, with expectations high. It could be looked at as an opportunity for him to confront and conquer a final demon, now that the Smile baggage has been overcome and transformed into a positive association for him by the warm reception it received. It will be a moment (if it occurs) that could be a career-capping triumph, but he deserves not to have to go through anything more, EVER, that is too stressful for him. Hopefully his support systems are strong enough now that it wouldn't be too traumatic for him. ???

Ha, I had the same thought.  Kind of like a couple of old heavyweight boxers trying to goad each other into one last big payday regardless of the consequences for the participants.

I thought the Capitol rooftop was in 2006, and that Brian went to the hospital because of the stress of Smile and not because of a BB reunion.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.  It seemed to me that BW was pretty cool about the whole Capitol rooftop thing, probably because it was a one-off photo op and nothing more.

From where I sit in the fan community, I don't see anything Brian can do with the surviving Beach Boys (and their sons) as a "career-capping triumph".  That honor goes towards Brian finishing Smile and even going beyond that to produce even more music on his own terms...and also touring around the world for more than a decade now.
I don't see Brian viewing the Beach Boys as any unfinished business...there's a difference between completing a personally challenging work of music and walking away from a potentially poisonous situation.  Remember, Brian was not active in the live act after the first year or two of the band (IIRC, he was touring sporadically even before the nervous breakdown of December '64), and used session musicians almost exclusively starting with the Surfer Girl album.  He worked in his own way, and as we all know, the other BBs didn't always agree with his ideas and visions.  You don't see with the BBs the kind of unity and teamwork that existed within, say, the Beatles.
That's why I don't really care about any kind of reunion talk.  As a fan of 35+ years, it's not something I need to see.  It's not a popular opinion in this community, but it's how I feel.

Feels like 2006 again. Al talked about a reunion then too and afterwards got himself at least touring with Brian.

The first part of this comment is true...but the second part about using session musicians "almost exclusively" starting with the Surfer Girl LP is so incredibly far from the truth its laughable. Although anyone who knows how many tracks, and hits, the BB's actually played the instruments on (for years) after the Surfer Girl LP will not be laughing, they will feel like I do, sad. Sad that there are still well meaning fans out there who believe this long ago debunked myth about Brian replacing the BB's in the studio in '63. The truth again, sigh, first two LP's 99% BB's...the Surfer Girl LP has Hal Blaine on timbales on one song, and drums on one song...other than that its pretty much all the Beach Boys. Next LP Little Deuce Coupe has session musicians augmenting the group on a few of tracks, but its 95% BB's, next LP SD Vol 2 has session musicians on Why Do Fools Fall In Love, but the rest is pretty much all the Beach Boys. All Summer Long LP is MOSTLY the BB's too, Today LP is about half and half, Summer Days is the first LP with a clear majority of session people but still features the BB's on at least four or five of the tracks. So, the FIRST LP where your "almost exclusively" description of Brian's use of session musicians is actually factual is Pet Sounds.

Cripes, if all Jardine needs is national distribution to get a physical CD out, he should give me a call...it isn't that hard to accomplish!

This just makes Al (and Mike, when he talks about a reunion) look rather pathetic, repeatedly talking about reunions with a guy who appears to have no interest. These guys (outside of Brian) haven't made much of an effort to do much outside the Beach Boys realm, have they? It's been decades, and what have they done? A few solo albums, a few things on other people's albums, but never a big move to a different realm. I mean, aren't they musician/lyricists? Wouldn't they like to do more? Many of their contemporaries have tried working with others, whether writing, recording, or performing. I know the Beach Boys is their big thing, emotionally and financially, but it seems to me that they could have done something else to show that $$$$ is not everything to them.

Maybe I'm being too harsh. Maybe I don't know enough of the facts. But this weird game-playing Al is doing by preemptively confirming something rubs me the wrong way.

I continue to have mixed feelings about a reunion, but I'm glad Brian has a great album coming out this year, and I'm happy for Al that he finished his album.

The more things change, the more they stay the same...

The article has hit spinner.com now...so it's getting around, and it's being reported as a done deal.

The thing I get out of all this is just how unprofessional these guys are all coming off as.  With the exception of Brian, who I think is coming off as more professional probably because most of his stuff is filtered through a handler or something.  No offense intended, just saying that he's a special case and has people around him who handle things, lol.

Mike, Al, even Bruce on the other hand are in an interesting position.  Here are three guys who are still referred to as Beach BOYS... I mean it's kind of their job to still be in High School.  They HAVE to stay in High School, that's what everybody wants from them.  Nobody wants to hear Mike Love sing songs about growing old and reminiscing on his life working at the automobile factory or whatever, they want to hear him sing about how he has a hot rod and he can drive faster than everybody else and blah blah blah. 

So you've got a handful of Rock Stars here who never had to grow up, at least professionally.  When you talk to them about business, business is all about how they felt when they were 18.  So they handle things immaturely and unprofessionally... they ruin promotion plans, they spill secrets that millions of dollars hinge on, etc. because they've never had to be professionally mature. 

Ironically, Brian who is likely the most immature of them all, comes off as an intelligent, professional, serious composer largely because he's SO immature that over the years he's had conservators appointed who handle his business dealings! 

The whole thing is really interesting.  I love all these guys though, it's always fun to see what's next. 

That post was basically genius, especially the point about Brian looking like the most mature due to him having to go through that filter. Because without it, we would probably probably hear the same kinda stuff from him, just like Al and Mike.

Oh, and just to clarify, so I hope everybody gets my intention... Brian IS an intelligent, professional, serious composer.  I'm talking about perception and image here.  Brian comes off looking like that... despite his immaturity... because he has a management team, record companies and the lot who make sure that the right image gets out there.

On the other hand, the others, who I also have deep respect for  (seriously, I deeply admire Al, Bruce, and especially Mike Love) come off looking like teenagers because that's how they handle their business.  They're very, very unprofessional in the way they conduct themselves.  I mean Al saying things like "You heard it here first!" is just so stupid of him.

Al;... Al.  When the Beatles made the Anthology series, it was a serious, professionally marketed and handled 'reunion' scenario that earned each member of the band likely tens of millions of dollars.  The smart thing might be to let the pros handle it, and maybe YOU TOO can make tens of millions of dollars.  Or, you can have bragging rights of who spoiled the thing first in the press, and piss Brian off so he decides to be comfortable with the 100 million or whatever he's already got in the bank, and spends reunion day at home watching the Tonight Show and eating Yummy Carob Cookies.

After comments by both Mike and Al over the last month or so I think Brians people are now in the position of king maker. They have the track record to negotiate a concert,record and DVD deal so I would not be surprised if Team Wilson put together a one-off reunion.

I could imagine his higher profile band with Mike, Al and Brian singing leads with Bruce and Dave backing up quite easily.

Perhaps we need a "FAQ - READ BEFORE POSTING" section so that (especially) Jon and Andrew won't have to feel like Bill Murray in Groundhog Day so often.  ;D

I SAID in my post that Brian went to the hospital because of the stress of taking on the task of finishing Smile, not because of the Capitol rooftop reunion. He WAS very cool about that appearance, and I was pointing out that it might be a little more emotionally risky for him to perform with them again than just make a public appearance. I think that he is probably self-assured enough now that it likely wouldn't be too much of a problem, but it's well-known that he doesn't relish their (Mike's) company and it has made him VERY uptight in the past. You're absolutely right, it IS a potentially poisonous situation, and he should avoid it if he feels overwhelmed by the prospect. He doesn't owe anything to anyone but himself and has more than paid his dues. Perhaps characterizing a potential reunion as "career-capping" is an overstatement (that distinction goes to the completion of Smile, the Pet Sounds tour, TLOS and the forthcoming much-anticipated Gershwin album) but if he were able to fully inhabit his role within the band onstage in a joyous way, singing well on an ambitious selection of songs, it would have an element of "triumph" and closure. It would probably be a somewhat false and hypocritical unity, unless some real, spontaneous breakthrough was made between the group members (unlikely). There IS some unfinished business there, IMO. Whether it really NEEDS to be finished is debatable. I'm on the fence about whether the reunion would be a good thing overall, but if it's done right I think I would be on the side of those who would like to see it happen.

Al mentioned 'Live Nation' is interested in a reunion. Perhaps he should read this first.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/theticket/2010/0723/1224275248448.html

The Irish Times - Friday, July 23, 2010Is Live Nation's day of reckoning approaching?
ON THE RECORD: JIM CARROLL on music

The bigger they are, the harder they fall. As the music-business story of the summer continues to be about cancelled shows and underperforming gigs, industry big cheese Live Nation has found itself in a huge stock-market slump.
Last week the company lost $432 million (€333 million) of its market capitalisation as shares collapsed by more than 20 per cent after a warning about weak ticket sales.

The dive was accelerated by a botched investor presentation. As the company attempted to blame the media and dismiss Pollstar data (while simultaneously citing stats from that company in another part of the presentation), investors got nervous. Live Nation boss Irving Azoff’s strop about “short-sighted” investors didn’t help the mood either. Cue a massive sell-off.

Live Nation’s day of reckoning has been on the cards for some time. The problem for the company is that its business model is flaky and the numbers have never added up.

The company has operated as a music-biz Pac-Man in recent years, gobbling up everything in sight, including venues, promoters and Ticketmaster, as well as moving into non-core areas such as labels and artist management.

But the current slump in the music market means Live Nation’s revenue projections are off, and its core concert-management business has consistently been in the red since 2005.

It’s worth noting that Live Nation’s exposure is not just confined to the US market. It is a significant European player, controlling a large chunk of the UK market via its partnership with MCD boss Denis Desmond’s Gaiety Investments.

In a recent interview with IQ magazine, Desmond revealed his business plan: “In England, we’ve got Live Nation/Gaiety, which works great, and the plan is to recreate that in Ireland. We are talking; we are nearly there.”

Yes, Ron, this is basically what I was getting at in my post. I'm exasperated that they act so unprofessionally. Although much is made of Brian's handlers, I would think that the majority of artists in pop music have them to some degree, just to keep them from saying something impetuous or stupid. You'd think Al and Mike don't have managers to control their "message." Of course, the Beach Boys have a track record of embarrassing public moments that make Kanye West look incredibly tame. But you'd think that by now, in their 60s, they would have wised up. They really owe it to themselves to protect their legacy by keeping their matters private until the right time instead of ruining it with the diarrhea of the mouth we've seen periodically.