The Smiley Smile Message Board

Good songs but...Never really got into Trader even tho everyone raved about it.

Trader's OK but yeah, it is too long imo.

I love The Trader just the way it is.  Not too long at all for me.  But yeah Heaven is a little too long.  The single edit is more manageable.

Nope, don't find either song too long. More Carl Wilson, please!

Trader is an epic,departure song by the group and perfect the way it was intended
to be presented in every way.

Heaven, yeah - too long.

LMFAO. No.

Songs that ARE too long:

Cry
Tears In The Morning
Strange Things Happen
Deirdre (Going Public Version)
East Meets West
Passing Friend

How about the disco version of Here Comes the Night from the L.A. (Light Album)?

I actually like it the way it is.  The shorter edits feel like they are missing key elements.

Fair enough. I must admit it has grown on me a lot - I used to detest it but now I don't mind it so much - but for me it's still a bit too long.

YES @ "Trader". I've thought so since getting into it. The first section is just a tad too long, the ending section is way too long. But then I struggle to imagine a better structure while still telling the story the same.

"Heaven", yeah, a bit.

Nah, "Trader" is just perfect as it is, to these ears at any rate.

How 'bout "Can't Wait Too Long"?  Is it WAY TOO LONG??  :p

Ba-boom !

Trader is too long for me - not really much of a fan of the song or indeed the album that it's from.

I agree on "Trader" being perfect the way it is. In terms of songwriting, this might be my favourite Carl Wilson song.

I like the live Trader version although in the day I can imagine that was time for a visit to the concession stand during the concert.

The narrative on California Saga: Big Sur/ The Beaks Of Eagles/ California has always grated for me.

Cool concept but I prefer individual sections rather than the whole.

Both songs are the perfect length for me. Also, I just love "Holland"! I play it whenever I feel the need to get away from the current place I am in. I always feel as though I am floating down some lazy river in an old world scene. Just a wonderful mood album!

I'm with Emdeeh, more Carl, please!

Love the Holland album...Think Trader should faded end at the 3:55 mark (the break)-The thought was finished  for me...Funkey Pretty-great song-too sleepy (demo' like) production...Sail On Sailor, Pretty and Trader I like better live...Also wish the great In Concert Lp had a Surf's Up tune and/ or Forever on it...But I guess at the time they went with the current lp...Holland. Love that In Concert album...Kille USA. Vibes & Fun versions.

Love Trader. To me it continues the theme of "see, see what you've done, to the church of the American Indian..."

Personally, Trader is a gem of a song and never seemed to outstay its welcome. My favourite "version" of Heaven is the one Carl sings in Waikiki for their 25th Anniversary. Saw it way before I knew there was a "Carl Wilson" or "Youngblood" and has been a favourite performance of mine ever since.

I used to think the same about Feel Flows. But when I saw the video of them doing it live in 1977, it changed my mind. Feel Flows has a hypnotic kind of flow to it. But for some reason Trader doesn't hook me in the same way. Maybe if I saw a live version of that it would change my mind as well. Heaven is such a beautiful song. I never really considered that one as too long.

I prefer the studio version of "The Trader". It has a very nice groove to it. The live version on "In Concert" is just a wee bit too fast in first section.

Well said! I feel exactly the same way.

Don't get me wrong - I love "Trader", but I still feel like it's too long.

Considering Holland came out in 1973, "Trader" doesn't even qualify as a long track. Come to think of it, that's the year of Tales from Topographic Oceans, when even progressive rock got pompous by its own ridiculous standards. In the early 70s, even when they attempted to fit in with the times the BB never lost their trademark pop senibilities.

Trader no, Heaven yes.

Trader could go on forever as far as I'm concerned. The first movement is much better than the second part though IMO.

In my opinion, Carl doesn't have too many tunes, so they're fine the way they are...Also, concerning Trader, I always thought the length of the songs of this era were just longer (along with So Tough).

Concerning the live rendition of Trader, I'm really surprised they didn't shorten it or Leaving this Town for the Concert LP, being that they're new songs (versus playing older material)...heck, half way through Leaving this Town, the crowd starts applauding before the last movement.

I like the live versions of Trader, SOS, Marcella, Heroes way better than the studio versions too... Let the Wind Blow is fantastic on In Concert-same w/ Caroline No...

Holy sh*t, he has something good to say about a song that the Lovester actually wrote most of the music for, not to mention the lyrics....

The length alone when talking about a song has little to do with it being too long or too short. Some songs are 10 minutes and feel too short, some songs clock in at four minute and would be twice as effective if a minute or two was chopped off.