The Smiley Smile Message Board

Besides the smile fiasco, I'd like to think: What if Carl made a solo album around 72-74 era? Think of his songs from Surf's Up, they're fantastic (and the Trader is great as well!)...I could see him collaborating with Jack Rieley again, which is a good pairing...maybe use The Flame or at least Blondie/Ricky as a backup band. Perhaps his bro-in-law: Billy Hinche coulda helped out...anybody else for a what if fantasy off the top of your head?

What if Brian decided that he needed a change of bandmates and paid Al and Mike to leave the group after Smiley Smile, leaving just he and his brothers as The Beach Boys.

Yeah, I always thought Carl was very capable. But then he released some pretty bad solo albums in the early 80s. They might have been better if he produced them himself.

I do think that the Wilson brothers would've been great, but I think that Mike and Al were just fine until around 1974. However, I do think the touring group might have been better in the late 60s if they brought David Marks back in place of Bruce.

But if David toured, who'd sing falsetto on the road? Bruce did it most of the time, right?

How would David's vocals fit in per harmony? I dont think i really know how they fit in originally when he was in the group at the beginning.

PLUS, wasnt Bruce the main keyboard player on the road as well? Guess Carl coulda taken the lead on that.

My understanding is that they had asked David back in the early 70's to play bass, and take the place of Bruce. I think Bruce did some falsetto, but Alan sang it more often than not.

We all know how great David sings Dennis' songs, so I think he would have helped fill out the lower register like the early records. But...if you add David and Billy Hinsche in the same line up; there's a winning combination!

Then there would be no Wild Honey album or Wild Honey, Darlin, Do It Again, or Cottonfields, their 4 biggest hits nationally/internationally of those years not to mention a drastically different Friends album, no Add Some Music or All I Wanna Do ( 2 beautiful songs), and no one to sing falsetto on the road.

What if Smile was completed in 1967 and Brian was so impressed with it he paid the Wrecking Crew to tour as the Beach Boys backing band (and he rejoined the band on the road)?

Back to Carl's solo album in the 70s...I've heard Jack R's Western Justice album, and I actually really like it...I dont know how much he did musically, but it's all his lyrics (I think) and a well themed album....I think that album plus the talents of Carl Wilson at the time would have been magical....

On another topic, what if Brian was so inspired by his American Spring experience that he had them do backing vocals on the groups albums and on tour...prolly wouldnt be too much of an impact, but certainly interesting to ponder.

I think I've heard/read somewhere that Carl just wasn't that prolific as a songwriter, at least 'til he got clean in '78/79.  The output on the '70s albums would seem to bear this out, also the fact that "Long Promised Road" and "Feel Flows" are basically the same song played at different tempos (don't believe me?  Play 'em!)

Here's a what if...

what if Brian hadn't have wrecked his voice?

An album of Feel Flows/Long Promised Road/Trader type of songs would've been great, but Carl was never a very productive songwriter so I doubt he would've been able to make an album like that.

That's something I have thought about numerous times. If only... :'( In fact I'll go one step further and say I wish he had never taken drugs or experienced mental problems. What if Brian had been 100% confident in himself and had no serious problems, what would he have been able to achieve?

That's an interesting thought but of course I don't think the rest of the guys would have been happy about being replaced on the road. If anything maybe Brian could have taken Hal Blaine and a few of the other key guys on the road but kept the other Beach Boys playing their instruments as well. So basically what happened anyway, except with the Wrecking Crew guys. But yeah I too wish that Brian had never stopped touring with the band. So okay, they were a great live act in the early 70s and even in the late 60s they were pretty good, but I still feel that the vocals don't sound quite right without Brian.

The fragile mind that brought us the delicate Pet Sounds and the wondrous SMiLE is the same eminently breakable spirit that succumbed to multiple substance abuse.

In other words: Kenny G might be a teetotaller.

Ah but you see, this is all about 'Fantasy'. You wouldn't know about those songs and albums, because they wouldn't have existed.  And if Brian would have decided to kick Al and Mike out of the band, he more than likely would have had others in mind to fill their role on the road.

How about this one: In late 66/early 67, Brother Records was going to be signing new artists with various Beach Boys having an active role in their output. How about, as the first Brother Records artist, Mike Love? Brian could have told Mike: "The Beach Boys are going to make Smile my way. If you don't like it, you can leave and you'll be a solo artist with a nice deal from Brother. I will write music for you, you can do the lyrics, and Terry Melcher can produce. You'll sell a lot of records, and so will we." I think that could have been the best for all concerned.

Other what-ifs:

What is Sunflower had been the huge hit it should have been, restoring the BBs to prominence and earning Dennis recognition as a great songwriter (and pretty darned good singer)?

A 1973 conversation from Audree to Brian and Dennis: I know you have a lot of reasons to resent your father, but you disappointed me by not going to the funeral. You both should see psychiatrists now, so that these unresolved feeling don't rule your life and jeopardize your marriages to Marylin and Barbara?

And maybe the most painful one to ponder: What is Dennis hadn't drowned when he did, and lived for the planned Jan. 1984 intervention led by Carl and Guercio. Maybe Landy wouldn't have been able to save Dennis, but maybe Landy sobers up Dennis, but Dennis sees Landy's bullshit and helps Brian see what Landy is truly all about and gets him away to someone else who can keep them both clean.

Going on the Brother thing.....

Mike doesn't cut Brian short on Redwood. 'Darlin' b/w 'Time To Get Alone' suddenly becomes the hit of Christmas 67, and Brian has the Spector group thing he's wanted since 63...... Brian becomes withdrawn from the group, but not the music biz, and The Beach Boys have to work at Brians home studio in the gaps left by Redwood, 'Amy', Stephen Kalinich, Van Dyke Parks and various other signings taken mostly from Brian's social circle and the odd suggestion by the group.
Dennis and Carl step up to the plate a few years early, and the Beach Boys 1968 offering is a curious mix of atmospheric ballads, Hendrixesque rock and the occasional contribution by Brian, who instead of staying in bed, signs The MC5 and makes them millionaires.

Bruce Johnston, crucially ignored in this relatively hip Beach Boys, is sidelined until he is adopted as an unlikely hero for the 80's underground movement.

 ;D