The Smiley Smile Message Board

I had a dream last night that I was at some old people's house and for some reason they had a cd of American Spring 72. I was listening to it and was blown away, but the cd play volume wouldn't go up very much so I could barely hear it. In my dream it had a booklet similar to the recent POB/Bambu release!

Anyways, I don't know much about this album except for a few songs that have been posted on youtube. The little I have heard of it is amazing! Maybe my dream will come true some day!  :o

CD-R? See For Miles? Bonus cuts? PM.

I don't remember the details to it except for hearing some amazing music in my dream that I've never heard in real life. But now I don't remember the songs I heard at all!

Um, I have the CD re-issue of the album with bonus cuts on the See For Miles label. Care about a CD-R of it?

That's what I wanted to imply in my all too brief message..... :lol

Now that we even got the Kalinich record they really should be considering putting out American Spring once again.

Marilyn has the rights, and the masters - when I spoke with her, oh, two, three years ago, she said she was waiting for the right deal. Between her & SWD, I gather there aren't many - if any - outtakes.

"Now that we even got the Kalinich record they really should be considering putting out American Spring once again."
Jeesus, yes.  If we can have that (What? You're not groovin' to it?), surely we American Spring should be released.

Outtakes: Honeycomb? California Feeling (cleaned up version)? Shortenin' Bread? (mmm, couldn't you just drewl over that version?)

At one point Jackie DeShannon was talking about producing American Spring, after the SPRING album and after "Shyin' Away"... did anything ever actually get recorded?  I remember Jackie talking about her track "Boat to Sail" and saying she sang "California songs are never left behind" while Brian was in the studio and then changing it to "Brian Wilson songs are never left behind" after he'd left, because she didn't want to embarass him.

In any case, the Spring album is an all-time favorite of mine - "Sweet Mountain", "Tennessee Waltz", "Down Home", "Everybody" - just a great lost gem.

I have heard SM and TW on youtube. Those songs blew me away!

Yeah, there are times when I think "Sweet Mountain" may be the coolest thing goin' - love the production, I usually play it about 10 times in a row when I get in the mood.  Whether it's Brian or Sandler, who cares?  If David Sandler could do such a good impersonation of Brian, he should still be making records today.
 

Sweet mountain is possibly one of the most interesting songs Brian had a part in, in the 70s

I know he had help, but Spring is really the last complete LP from Brian that shows him in peak form. Even if he no longer had the mindset to work continuously, the vocal and production skills was still really intact. I love LOS and the 2004 Smile, even part of the 88 LP and Adult Child appeal strongly to me, but you always have to allow for the changes in his voice. Here you don't. Don't think I discount the work he did on Holland or So Tough, or that brief creative spurt at the end of 1974, but it wasn't a whole album worth of Brian. Some would say that about Spring but even if his interest was variable what he did do made that album what it was. That isn't putting down Desper who made it sound so sharp, or the girls who sang so well, or Sandler who got Brian working period. What I am getting at is that it has that pre 1975 Brian Wilson magic. BTW the 1988 CD and LP has a mix of Fallin In Love that features Dennis' music track strongly. The original mix has Dennis' master basically inaudible.

There are two mixes/versions of "Fallin' In Love". One is on the Spring CD, and another is on the Brian Wilson Productions CD. I prefer the Spring CD version; it's actually my favorite Spring song, but, wouldn't you know it, my CD has a flaw/defect in the first two seconds of the song; it bugs me every time I play it. Does anybody else's copy have a defect on that track?

I don't think that's a defect in your CD.  I think it was bad mastering by the compiler(s) of the bonus tracks.  The dropout is right at the beginning of the song on mine, too.

I meant from the actual sessions in late 1971/early 1972 - those tracks were recorded in, respectively, 1974, 1974 and 1973.

Any reissue could also include the promo interview Brian did with the girls, - Just for added interest...

I like some of the things on the Spring album but wasn't blown away like I thought I might be (having read a lot about it), I actually prefer some of the late 70s Honeys/Spring stuff - Do Ya, It's like heaven, Romeo and Juliet, She's out to get ya etc, I can't remember it all but its fun!

Do Ya is fucking awesome to these ears, what a song! It has those silly Love You-style lyrics, a great Brian (?) falsetto part and it's catchy as hell.

"Do Ya" = "How's About A Little Bit" + "Marilyn Rovell".  ;D

I prefer "Do Ya" by the MOVE

Oddly enough, he is, and they're pretty charming records too:

http://www.glacierdisc.com/bio/index.html

OK. does anyone have info on Jackie DeShannon's involvement in the '70's?

whats the story with the vocal at the end of sweet mountain? presume its sandler.
The one that goes "well it rained on the mountain, the mountain of love"

sounds like a voice that should have been in brian's mount vernon and fairway. :lol

I'm pretty sure thats Brian just doing a low voice - oddly not dissimilar to how he would sound a few years later.

IMO, I really enjoy the American Spring material.  I especially enjoy wherever Brian's vocals are sprinkled throughout the songs, the semi-Brian Wilson production, and Marilyn and Diane's voices.

Brian & Marilyn sang bvs on a song of hers, "Boat To Sail". That's it.

I am convinced that that is Brian. It's that slightly goofy 'dee mowntun of love' phrasing that makes me think so. No one else would have done it that way.

It's Brian notice it's less raspy but it's his deep voice. He also sings in his high voice in the song so you here how good his range was in 1971.

I'm pretty sure thats Brian just doing a low voice - oddly not dissimilar to how he would sound a few years later.
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I talked to Marilyn last year about this.  She wants to re-issue it but has NO idea when.

I must put in a vote for the American Spring version of This Whole World.  I like it better than the BB's version.   Sweet Mountain is a real modern sounding track.  When I was playing it at home my wife thought it was Stereolab!

When I first heard it I swore I had heard it sometime in the mid-to-late nineties...I didnt think stereolab buit something,...has it been covered by somebody?

I've actually used Sweet Mountain as a starting off point for some of my hipster friends who also noticed the stereolabishness of the track. Can't believe the BB never did this one!

Yeah, their version of This Whole World is great, especially with the Star Light, Star Bright coda, it's a Smile meets Love You sorta thing....I swear this and Sweet Mountain needs to go on a BW fan-comp called 2nd Stroke of Genius.

Mama Said
Superstar
Awake
Sweet Mountain
Everybody
Now That Everything's Been Said
Down Home
Shyin' Away
It's like Heaven

Who wrote these songs? Did Brian write some of them?

He wrote "Sweet Mountain" with David Sandler and he wrote "It's Like Heaven" with Diane Rovell, I think? The rest are covers, besides "Shyin' Away", which I'm pretty sure is just a David Sandler composition.

There is also a recording of Brian singing "Awake" with piano accompanying him. I think it should be released on some kind of official release someday, thats how good it is in my opinion.

And lastly, there is a recording of a song from around the Spring sessions called "Silly Walls" by Brian and David Sandler. I'm not sure who wrote that one, maybe Sandler, maybe a wilson Wilson/Sandler, who knows....? (AGD probably)

Took me 47 seconds of Googling to come up with this:

"Spring" track listing:
(side 1)

1.) Tennessee Waltz   (Redd Stewart) - 1:59

2.) Thinkin' bout You Baby   (Brian Wilson - Mike Love) - 3:24

3.) Mama Said   (Luther Dixon - Willie Denson) - 2:32

4.) Superstar   (Leon Russell - Bonnie Bramlett) - 3:30

5.) Awake   (Floyd Tucker) - 3:20

6.) Sweet Mountain   (Brian Wilson - David Sandler) - 4:17

(side 2)
1.) Everybody   (Tommy Roe) - 2:20

2.) This Whole World   (Brian Wilson) - 3:18

3.) Forever   (Dennis Wilson - Alan Jardine) - 3:19

4.) Good Time   (Brian Wilson - Alan Jardine) - 2:38

5.) Now That Everything's Been Said   (Carole King - Toni Stern) - 2:19

6.) Down Home   (Carole King - Gerry Goffin) - 2:44


Shyin' Away (Brian Wilson - David Sandler - Diane Rovell)

It's like Heaven (Brian Wilson - Diane Rovell)

So Al co-wrote Forever, huh?

I'm pretty sure the credits were changed on this.  At least in my 1988 self-titled Spring CD from Rhino the credits say that Marilyn, Diane, and David Sandler wrote it. And the "M. Wilson" credit doesn't seem to be a typo, as it says it on the CD and in the booklet.

From BMI.com: 

  SHYIN AWAY (Legal Title) 
 BMI Work #1336311
Songwriter/Composer Current Affiliation CAE/IPI #
ROVELL DIANE JOY BMI 26876948
SANDLER DAVID STUART NA 63447673
WILSON MARILYN BMI 69338937
 
Publishers
BRI-MUR PUBLISHING COMPANY BMI 53071703

Marilyn cut a demo of a (to my knowledge) still-unreleased Jackie DeShannon / Carole Bayer Sager tune, "It's Good to Know You Know," produced by DeShannon.  An acetate exists.

Lee

Wait...what?!

I have that Artisan Sound Recorders acetate in my collection. Do you have more info about the recording? The label states In House Production? Do you have a (approximate) recording date?

Good spot. The site I took that from isn't by someone whose first language is English, I'm thinking.

"Shyin' Away" - the label credit says B. Wilson but of course that could be a typo at source !

I don't know of a cover version that far back but certainly Eddi Reader (ex Fairground Attraction) recorded it, under the title 'Sweet Mountain of Love', on her 2009 solo LP 'Love Is The Way'.

 8)

Again from BMI: 

 FOREVER
 BMI Work #435614 
Songwriter/Composer Current Affiliation CAE/IPI #
JAKOBSON GREGG BMI 63147394
WILSON DENNIS ASCAP 46471283

Any chance you can post it  to give us a listen?

Interesting; then there must be multiple acetates of that one...  :o

Artisan Sound was a well-know L.A. mastering house (as opposed to a recording studio).  A mastering house would typically receive the mixed-down 2-track stereo or one-track mono master, and then add EQ, compression, limiting, etc. to make the master sound best within the confines of a record groove.  All of the acetates I have from Artisan Sound are the final albums and singles, ready for release.  So I would speculate that this was being prepared for release by someone -- but "who" is the question.

Artisan Sound appears to have been the preferred mastering house for Brother Records from 1970 to around 1974, but that's just based on what I have in my collection.  I think there may have been a tie-in between Warner Brothers Records and Artisan Sound, but that is again just speculation.

Lee

SWD told me back in the 80s that it was at Artisan Sound that the Landlocked boot originated, as the songs and sequence exactly match the tape he took there. he wasn't best pleased, I can tell you.

If only our friend at Artisan would release everything that came thru there!

Why did SWD take a tape of the Landlocked material to Artisan Sound?  To have acetates made?  If so, for whom?  While there are some really good tracks on Landlocked that didn't make it to Surf's Up (San Miguel, Big Sur, Lady), overall the collection contains a lot of weak material, imo.  Does the fact that Stephen Desper took a Landlocked tape to Artisan mean that the BBs actually considered Landlocked to be a completed album, ready for release, or at least for presentation to Warner Bros for their consideration for release?

You've not heard the WPLJ tape have you ?  ;D  SWD had an acetate cut so that the band could have something to play during radio interviews. On said station on 2/19/71, they played "Just Got My Pay", "Good Time", "San Miguel" and the version of "'Til I Die" without any lead.

Repeat after me - "Never was a Landlocked album... Never was a Landlocked album... Never was a Landlocked album..."  :spin

While not tryingto be especially contrary, it's easy to see why people think there was a "Landlocked" , whne you have Desper saying it , in essence, originated from him, and he recorded the BBs.

No... Desper never called it Landlocked, because he knew better - even on the radio show, when the DJ asks if the acetate is 'a new album', the answer is 'no, these are some tracks that might be on an album'.
True, the tape box is labelled "2nd Warner Brothers LP", but as we know, it wasn't.

Ok, that explains it!  Thanks.  Yeah, I knew there was never supposed to have been a Landlocked album, so I couldn't figure out why Desper had taken the material that appeared on the Landlocked boot to a mastering studio. 

Any way you look at it, we should all STOP, and thank Stephen Desper for allowing us to hear the  "2nd Warner Brothers LP". 
Thanxx Stephen!!

Should be noted-that the date of the WPLJ taping is now established as February 23 1971.  The day before the Carnegie Hall show-which used to be listed as Feb 20 but we now know was Feb 24 1971.  AGD has it correctly listed at the tours/sessions section of Bellagio.

Memo to self - next time, consult own website and not 30-year-old book.  

That's two self-admonishments in the space of two weeks Andrew...  I think it's the new avatar. Let's have the topper back!

Good point, and it is sad that BW couldn't bring focus to a whole project after this time. I would have to disagree a bit with you on a couple of points, in that while Brian did a great job on Thinking About My Baby, This Whole World, Now That Everything's been Said, Shyin' Away and Had to Phone Ya (though I'd be prepared to admit to heavy D Sandler involvement in some of those if anyone was to point one out) I don't think they showed Brian in anything like 'peak' form, and the performances he coaxes from the girls are for the most part pretty lacklustre and occasionally out of tune. The album shows flashes of BW being great, but is wildly inconsistent and he was clearly not in a position to push himself to greatness. HTPY is a great tune, and an incredibly funky track, but it just fades out unsatisfyingly, and a BW on peak form would never allowed this to happen.

I listen to this album with a real sense of loss for what could have been.

I used to be of that persuasion as well, but as I've discovered more about the album, I've had to admit that Brian's initial enthusiasm faded rapidly: Steve Desper told me back in '85 that the album was "maybe 5% Brian" (and that he - SWD - did the final mix), and when I asked her a few years later, even Marilyn put his involvement at 25% tops, so...

Well they gave me different percentages ;D
She said about half, he said about 20-25 percent. Both said what he did do made a BIG difference.

But that is for me what makes some of the later BB albums interesting.  There will be 6 or 7 pleasant but forgettable tracks and then one that just stops you in your tracks.  Like that reviewer of MIU said-listen to My Dianne and know that the flame still burns.  I kind of agree-I think MIU is pleasant-but pretty saccharine and then all the sudden that song comes on and you realize that the record could have been so much more.  The Night Was So Young on Love You is also pretty intense.  I also think on Brian Wilson-the river section of Rio Grande is pretty amazing

I get what you mean and agree with you on those three example's.

For sure - SWD followed his comment by immediately saying "of course 5% of Brian Wilson is better than 100% of most other people".

So we got the same basic feel from them even if percentages were different.
What I'm thinking is that Brian may have talked to Marilyn and Diane (perhaps David and Steve too) informally about certain ideas and things, even if he wasn't always there. Kind of like the Sail On Sailor session.