The Smiley Smile Message Board

Does anybody have a theory why there are Hawiian chants in Roll Plymouth Rock? I know, I'm missing something that's obvious, right? Any opinions are appreciated....

I always thought it was that whole pan-continental bicycle rider thing. Plymouth to Hawaii.

The lyric may help?

Waving from the ocean liner
The native Indians behind that

Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over
Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over
Ribbon of concrete, just see what you done done
To the church of the american indian ...

Once upon the Sandwich Isles  
The social structure steamed upon Hawaii
Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over
Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over

Bicycle rider, see see what you�ve done,
To the church of the american indian ...

Wa halla loo lay
Wa halla loo lah
Keeny wok a poo lah
Wa halla loo lay
Wa halla loo lah
Keeny wok a poo lah
Wa halla loo lay
Wa halla loo lah
Keeny wok a poo lah
Wa halla loo lay
Wa halla loo lah
Keeny wok a poo lah

Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over
Rock, rock and roll
Plymouth rock, roll over



...and

http://www.sandwichislands.com/

I think the better question is whether it's "wahala lu lei" or "Mahalo lu lei"

I think it's the former.

I'm not a Van Dyke Parks lyrical scholar. Can any of you guys translate those lyrics for me? Specifically, what is the connection between Plymouth Rock and Hawaii? ???

Supposedly the chants are just nonsense made up using Hawaiian syllable sounds. Some people have tried to translate it, but nobody is clear on what it definitely meant, and it doesn't mean anything substantial as far as we know. As for the connection between Plymouth Rock and Hawaii? Well, according to legend, the pilgrims's first colony in America was Plymouth Rock. "Plymouth Rock, roll over..." is talking about American expansion.  American spread westward throughout the continent over next fews the centuries as part of their "manifest destiny".  It's a play on words (personification, as literary types would call this example) imagining Plymouth Rock as an actual rock that rolled westwards, rolling over the continent. It personified the pilgrims, American religious culture, and expansion all at once. America's westward expansion ended in Hawaii, the last state to enter the Union. In other words, it's where the "plymouth rock" stopped. This is the connection.

Maybe it's Hawaiian for "Over and over the crow cries uncover the cornfield..." and was the only way Brian and Van Dyke could trick Mike into singing those lyrics?
 ;D

Great post and explanation of the lyrics - thanks!

That was the way I always understood it as well. Brian just said he wanted something that sounded Hawaiian so they came up with that chant.

Plymouth Rock is also a breed of chicken, poss (poss dubious too) a reference linked to "what a dude'll doo [as in c*ck-a-doodle-do] in a town full of heroes & villains".
Didn't one of Frank Holmes illustrations also feature the words "Rhode Island Red"? (another chicken breed).

You can compare the theme of "Roll Plymouth Rock" to The Eagles' "The Last Resort".  It also deals with westward expansion to the west coast and eventually to Hawaii.   The people were always looking for some place new and better but spoiled every place they settled until there was no place left to go.  "The Last Resort" is an awesome song, probably much more cynical than "Roll Plymouth Rock".

Yep, and rock, followed by roll, is a clever reference to rock 'n' roll, and perhaps also to the song "Roll Over Beethoven", which Rolling Stone called "the ultimate rock & roll call to arms, declaring a new era." It was also the opening track of the Beatles's Second Album (released in the U.S.).

All in one song - got it. Thanks. So, the song is not really taking place in the present, with the Pilgrims landing. It's actually a review (what's a better word?), or a stating of what actually happened. It's not a prediction of what MIGHT happen; it's an afterthought. Is that right?

Exactly. The chorus makes this clear with the question, "Bicycle Rider, just see, see what you've done done to the church of the American Indian" (it goes something like that, anyway). The song is looking negatively at the affect of colonialism, how it destroyed the preexisting cultures. The Bicycle Rider character is interesting in itself. Originally, SMiLE was supposed to be loosely about a bicyclist traveling across America. This opens up several layers of meanings. Albert Hoffman, the creator of LSD, took a now famous bike ride right after intentionally dosing himself with LSD for the first time. During the bike ride he realized the full possibilities of LSD. Bicycle Playing Cards was a popular brand around the turn of the 19th century, and reference in the song is supposed to be a sly comment on the effects of gambling and alcoholism on the native cultures.  The line "see, see rider, see what you have done..." is actually taken from the popular blues standard  "See See Rider", a simple 12 bar blues  song about an unfaithful lover that some people interpret as being about prostitution. This could tie into the girl from "Heroes and Villains", or something else completely. Who knows? But the possibilities are there...

This topic has come up here before.  The Hawaiian chants were added to Roll Plymouth Rock by Brian, not VDP.

Van Dyke gave Brian a book with Hawaiian words; it may have been a dictionary or a book of poems. Brian put the words together, but since he did not understand the language, it may have come out too literal. However, I believe the chant is supposed to be a blessing.

 8)

I find it interesting how Brian would START SMiLE with two songs in the past tense ("Heroes And Villains" and "Roll Plymouth Rock"), almost a review of events. He really doesn't get going in the present until "Cabinessence" (I'll GIVE you a home on the range), or "Barnyard".....

I don't recall anyone (like Brian or Van Dyke or the Vosse posse) mentioning anything about Smile being originally about a bicyclist travelling across America.  Van Dyke has maintained his use of bicycle rider was referring to the cards and gambling, the corrupting influence of European/Western civilization on the native Indians and their culture.  I don't see how a bicycle travelling ties in with the rest of Smile.

I could swear I read it somewhere credible, but I've read so much junk about SMiLE I couldn't begin to tell you where it was from. It was one of those ideas toyed with but ultimately dropped,  like the Barnyard Billy character Brian and Van Dyke came up with. I could see the bicyclist riding across America tripping, and seeing all of these strange things the music is about. A "bicycle rider" could even fit in with the whole health concept Brian also wanted ("I'm in great shape", "do a lot", "I'm gonna be 'round my vegetables", etc.). But maybe I'm misremembering things.

I've read the same thing about SMiLE, on the Internet somewhere, how it's about somebody riding a bicycle...a flying bicycle over America. If so, obviously that concept didn't last long.

I thought Barnyard Billy was a Brian put-on in a documentary?

Yeah, Brian dashes off the improvised line "Oh Barnyard Billy, he loved his chickens" (or something like that) in the I JUST WASN'T MADE FOR THESE TIMES doc simply to illustrate the general tone of the SMiLE snippets. I doubt he was seriously remembering a discarded concept from '66!

As to the "Bicycle Rider" theory, the reference to the playing cards is a relatively new insight provided by Parks in '04. Prior to that, I believe the general consensus was that the term "Bicycle Rider" represented the European (or white man) who took the land away from the native Americans. Logically then, the "Bicycle Rider" travelling from Plymouth Rock to Hawaii is accurate given the assumed metaphor even if it was not actually stated as such by Parks or Wilson.

I think it means both. The playing cards represented European culture - not only were the cards strongly associated with gambling and all of the other Wild West debauchery that went along with it (drinking, prostitution, etc.), but on them are the pictures of kings and queens, frequently along with other colonial images. We can see the effect of gambling on the Native Americans even today, with entire reservations devoted to casinos.

'what a dude'll do' -> c*ck a doodle-do

i'd never spotted this one.  wallop.

i remember first spotting 'hall a cost-' (surf's up), aged about 19, and thinking that was a bastard clever bit of work.  but ever since then (i'm about 135 now) i've been repeatedly tricked by the magician.  truly, parks's level of wordplay is absolutely dizzying sometimes.  i'm sure there are doctorate theses or concordances of his work - if not, there will be, you bet - but i never fail to get a real kick out of stumbling across some hitherto undiscovered helix of vdp wit.

a right clever sod, our van.  i hope he had a ripping birthday bash on sunday.  (he's now as old as the century was when SMiLE was written, significance fans.)

Never saw that before...thanx Boiled Egg

Maybe I'm taking the lyrics to literally, but how does one ride a bicycle on the ocean to reach Hawaii? ???

LSD? Amphetamines? Hash?

I think what we're saying is that the "Bicycle Rider" is a description of the European settler in America (as a reference to their playing cards and to the increased sophistication of their technology, as opposed to Native Americans who didn't ride bicycles, etc.). So, the "Bicycle Rider" travelled by boat to reach the Hawaiian Isles in his goal of Manifest Destiny. The "ribbon of concrete" soon followed (I always thought this variation should have been the second chorus instead of the first), although after the locomotive, of course.

What is striking about this is that Parks is touching on a very serious and damning critique of American history, but doing so in a very light, playful manner. The very term "Bicycle Rider" sounds quaint and harmless until you recognize what it is a metaphor for.

There has to be dozens of these puns in the SMiLE lyrics...

"Hand in hand, some..." = "handsome"

"nestle in a kiss" = "Nestle Kiss" (the brand of chocolate candy)

"Canvass the town" = both going around the town handing out flyers and literally pulling a piece of painter's canvas over the town.

"golden locket" = "Goldilocks" the fairy tale character.

"Have you seen  the grand coolie working on the railroad?" references both the Chinese immigrants who built the railways and  the Grand Coulee Dam.

"Through the recess, the chalk and numbers" refers both to an opening (as in a cliffside) and to children's playtime during a school day.

Those are just a few off the top of my head. Does anyone want to add any others?

"Cart off and sell my vegetables"-I read somewhere that "Kartofen"(sp??) is German for potato.

And its Hershey's Kiss, not Nestle Kiss. The "nestle in a kiss" line must've resulted from VDP getting Nestle and Hershey's confused, unless Kisses were made by Nestle back in the 60s.

Whoops - that one was startlingly obvious! Of course Hershey's made "kisses". I wonder if Parks was trying to pull the two together; one was a chocolate manufacturer and the other was a chocolate treat. Maybe I'm reaching too much here.

Mike sings that part?

"I'm red as a beet 'cause I'm so embarassed"

OK, red as a beet is kinda obvious, but there's a variety of lettuce called Cos ('cause).

Kartoffeln.  :)

In blues vernacular the "rider" is a sexual partner.  Maybe we 'screwed" the natives.

The possibilities are endless.

I was always partial to the bicycle rider as a sort of celestial or distant witness to to the whole thing that transpired...

and since it was us that committed the genocide, we are the bicycle rider.......

But that is the fun of VDP lyrics.......the puns, the double entendres.....right?

Wanted an excuse to post this thought for ages (think I once posted it elsewhere to little response).

My take on the "Rock, rock, roll, Plymouth rock, roll over" line is to link it to the original title of the track, namely Do you like worms. I am impressed by Lou Shenk's interpretation of the overarching theme of Smile (as hosted on the late departed Smile Shop) being a 'return to innocence' (as opposed to Pet Sounds being a lament for the loss of innocence). Roll Plymouth Rock is about the desire to turn back the clock, to undo the wrongs of history (or at least not repeat them in the context of the Vietnam war); but in order to do this you must first face what has been already done. Roll back Plymouth Rock, the foundation myth of America, and see the worms wriggling beneath the rock: the oppression of native Americans, the despoiling of nature (ribbon of concrete), the massacre of a culture. Didn't Frank Holmes' illustration for this track feature the opened 'can of worms' of the cliche. See what the Heroes and Villains have done to the church of the American Indian.

Ultimately Smile, on this interpretation, is redemptive. Adults may recoil from worms, but many childen are fascinated by them. We must face up to the sins of our forebears.  And it is to the children's song that we must attend. Do you like worms?

Not sure any of this makes much sense. The Smile project, in this period  (late '66), is so dense with cross-reference and allusion. Truly brilliant.

That's deep. Very deep. But I like it.

If your theory is true, and I'm not educated enough to judge either way, that makes me respect SMiLE even more for its hipness, deep meaning, and artistic merit.

Holmes' "can of worms" imagery is pretty clear in suggesting that something controversial is being uncovered. Rolling over Plymouth Rock to find those worms is an apt and poetic metaphor for examining the crimes of American history. Apart from the straightforward condemnation of the lyric "see what you've done to the church of the American Indian", we have Parks stating that the "Bicycle Rider" is the playing cards representing the gambling and alcoholism which helped destroy the native American culture. I'd say JCarson's post is right on the money.

I believe that as Van Dykes and Brian were writing, it hit a nerve with the illuminati and masons that have been running America (and the world) for years. So they had to stop them. Thus bugging Brian's house and puting stuff in his drink to make him paranoid.

But, seriously, I think the only way we can figure out what Smile is REALLY all about is to get Mike Love on here to explain it to us. :)

After all of these years, decades actually, I still find it hard to believe, in my opinion unfair (but I'll never win THAT argument), that we, the fans, can't ask Brian or Van Dyke a simple question about SMiLE, and get a straight answer.

That's very true, although you have to wonder how much of that is just due to them not remembering a lot of the specifics? 

Or (more likely) they are just sick to death of being asked about it for the last 40+ years. 

Forget Brian for a moment, because he's so hit and miss, and just focus on Van Dyke Parks. Why, why I ask...No, let me start that over. What would be so offensive, so unnecessary, or so imposing, for someone like David Leaf to sit down with Van Dyke Parks, and simply ask him, "Can you please explain the meaning behind the song, and/or the working title, "Do You Like Worms?" Now, even if it's 2009, and it's ancient history, why Van Dyke Parks couldn't or wouldn't be able to supply a serious, precise, definitive answer, well, I just don't buy it. The way Parks likes to talk, I can't believe he hasn't volunteered to do interviews.

SMiLE is THAT important. And, some day, when Brian and Van Dyke are no longer around to address these questions, a lot of the next generation are gonna ask the question, "How could you not get the answers when you could of". I'd be asking that question, anyway.

Glad you and the Sheriff found some merit in my post. Try as I might, I just can't get my wife interested in discussing the meaning of Smile! One of my chief frustrations with the hoo-hah around BWPS was the lack of serious scholarly examination of the original project. The Priore book was readable but skimmed the surface (and reflected theories long known to be highly tendentious or even falsified by evidence). There have been a number of very good books about Pet Sounds (let alone Sergeant Pepper, the White Album and other greats of the period). Can't we get a decent book about Smile? All sorts of books about weird and obscure byways of 60s pop and rock are published every year. Why so little about Smile, which, despite BWPS, surely remains the greatest lost album in the history of rock music?

You're right, it's unbelievable! Everytime an article about SMiLE is written, it is prefaced by saying how great it is/was; words like groundbreaking, genius, important, legendary, influential, and Wilson's best work are mentioned. Still, so little is known about the actual music, relatively speaking. What do we know about the motivation behind "Look", "Holidays", "Workshop", "I Love To Say Dada", "You're Welcome", "Tones", "He Gives Speeches", "The Old Master Painter", "False Barnyard", "The Elements", "Good Vibrations" (being included), and Barnyard Billy loved his chicken!

I AM going to beat this dead horse. In the last couple of years, I have seen several documentaries, some of them have been those "making of the album" types, with artists like Clapton, Townshend, McCartney, Elton John/Bernie Taupin, Lou Reed, Stevie Wonder, and the surviving Doors. These documentaries have been entertaining, enlightening, and, I believe, important. Assuming the interviews have been factually honest and accurate, they are essential; they are necessary for historical purposes. But with SMiLE - and who would argue it is not as important or as great as those other albums - we have nothing. And, the lyricist/collaborator who has been around for the ensuing 43 years, and hasn't been the busiest guy, Van Dyke Parks, just gives us these fleeting, obscure, incomplete responses; it's almost a tease. I won't address Brian at this point, but, even in his current state, he's still gotta be sitting on a lot of details.

While sometimes I can be as into "serious" examination as the next Smiley Smiler, other times I wish there weren't such examination of Smile or any other records. It can be interesting to dissect pop, but for me sometimes it also just steals the fun out of the whole experience. Pop isn't intended to have--or be--homework. (Cecil Taylor disagrees with me here. Van Dyke Parks might, too. But I suspect Brian Wilson, were he coherent, would agree.)

Intended? Of course not. In some cases, appropriate to lead to that? Yes.

Sheriff I would LOVE to see one of those "making the album" documentaries like the ones you mentioned.  I love when they have the producer in the studio, playing certain cool isolated tracks and giving little anecdotes from the sessions.  Imagine Brian sitting at the board with a H&V tape, or a tape from a "Child" vocal session...how awesome would that be? 

I do like the idea of sitting Van Dyke down, as he would be a lot more reliable than Brian, but how much would he know about something like "Look," "DaDa," "Holidays," or the other more instrumental tracks?  I'm sure he could talk at great length about the songs that he and Brian sat down and wrote together, but a lot of the titles you mentioned in that post problably didn't involve Van Dyke to the same degree as, say "Surf's Up" or "Wonderful."

Unfortunately, a lot of the answers exist only in the recesses of Brian's mind, and as we all know, its damn near impossible to get a straight answer out of him when it comes to SMiLE...especially now since he seems to regard BWPS as his final thoughts on the subject, and very likely sees no reason to re-visit the '66-'67 sessions again.

Every so often in the non-BBs forum on this board, one of us brings up those sorts of documentaries and without fail we start dreaming: what if the Beach Boys had such things, not just for an album here and there, but for EVERYTHING!? Think about the moments in Endless Harmony where Brian does that. Now imagine if Brian, Al, Mike, Bruce, Blondie, Ricky, David, Mark Linett, Steve Desper, or any other living engineer/musician/co-producer/co-writer had a chance to sit in the studio with someone who has the materials ready to go, talking about anything that tickled his or her fancy!

And if you'll excuse me, thanks to revisiting that dream, I now have to change my pants and then cry myself to sleep.

Its hard to resist indulging the fantasy, no doubt.

Like you said,
the various secret societies simply couldn't tolerate such acute insight and exposure of their methods and motives to be completed and released in an atmosphere of peace, so they enlisted John Frankenheimer (I think) to install the
concept of Spector's mind gangsters in Brian's head by saying Hello Mr. Wilson at the start of Seconds,
and actually recruited and paid a real witch to impersonate Michael Vosse's girlfriend and cast a spell
on him so he would think that Anderle's painting had captured his soul. I hate it when that happens!

Uh huh... >:D

I think it was done telepathically by black crows, who as a collective were more than a bit perturbed when Van Dyke uncovered the secrets of their cornfield activities. There's a reason that Mike refused to sing those lyrics in "Cabinessence", and it has nothing to do with the 'fable' that popularly circulates. But that's a story for another day...

I was listening to BWPS (sorry, lost my head again) and I need another interpretation. "In Blue Hawaii".....

OK, is it about finally reaching Hawaii or something? I'm assuming it is. But, when Brian sings, "Aloha nui means goodbye", does that mean he's leaving already?

No disrespect intended, Luther, but I don't think that it has to seem like "homework" and ruin one's
enjoyment of the album to engage in the (admittedly frustrating and inadequately addressed by those involved) intellectual exercise of attempting to dissect the meaning or layers thereof behind a
symbolically rich offering such as our beloved (or indifferently regarded or even reviled, by the minority here) Dumb Angel.

It would surely be among  the most fertile subject for a truly ambitious attempt at a comprehensive
book or other documentary of any single project or period in any band's history, if the principals, chief-
ly Mr. Parks, were sufficiently inspired/mentally present and/or unscarred/financially, historically or otherwise compelled to participate.

Brian has miraculously been able to embrace, perform and internally recontextualize the actual music
itself, given a sufficiently supportive and enthusiastic family and band environment and fan reaction, but not with-
out significant difficulty and courage, and the contemporary experiences and anecdotal memories themselves he is
and always has been both unwilling and now is probably incapable of being a source of (unfair to ask
of him also).

It's a shame that Van Dyke has not been more forthcoming, in his inimitably articulate style, but it's at
least partially out of respect for Brian's wishes, as well as his own painful associations with the abort-
ed project, and they would both obviously have to give it the thumbs-up, have the utmost confidence
and rapport with the author-interviewer-editor, and, in Mr. Parks' case, participate in revealing and
expansive new interrogations in order for other peripheral but vital participants/witnesses to feel
comfortable in signing on.

This is a VERY improbable but not necessarily inconceivable set of circumstances, in my humble, idea-
listic view. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.

JCarson's posts are very interesting (or tedious, subjectively speaking, as is this one). There was of
course a movement in the late 60's, which is now further metastasizing and morphing in this genera-
tion, to peel back the layers of entitlement, manifest destiny and the like to expose the hypocrisy and
fallacy of land and property ownership, seen from this perspective as outright theft of Native American
land, and the need to first somewhat clearly, if lyrically obliquely, expose and acknowledge these acts
as a prelude to them being somehow revised or repealed (a difficult proposition) sounds like a plausi-
ble explanation for the "can of worms" visual, and overall intent of the westward expansion/"American
gothic trip"/Western European exploitative Bicycle card deck-Rider portion of the original 3 part SMiLE concept.

I wonder, though, just how fully fleshed-out the whole symbolic structure was in their own minds by
the time that the quicksilver creative inspiration and stillborn composition and recording period had come and gone.

Thanks, everyone, for tolerating my self-indulgent ramblings. I hope they have had at least some merit and those who have read this don't feel that they have totally misspent a chunk of their
precious time.

 :) :) :) :) :) :)

Err... okay, so did you dislike what I said or how I said it? I guess you're making a point. :-\

I LIKED what you said AND how you said it. Sorry, I just meant that some might find both
my post and yours to be overly analytical and hard to take. I meant no offense and should
probably just speak for myself in future.

I think SMiLE fans should feel free to take this line of thought and analysis as far as we can, in the
absence of first-hand clarification. Really, no offense meant, quite the opposite actually. :-D

Muted, please mail a certified or registered copy of the above post to Brian Douglas Wilson and Van Dyke Parks, return receipt requested.

Also, could somebody tell me, when Brian sings, "Aloha nui means goodbye" in "Blue Hawaii", does that mean he's leaving Hawaii? He just got there!

Amen brother! What blows me away is that after all of the '04 Smile hoopela we *still* don't know if Van Dyke wrote lyrics for the Child verses in 1966, we still don't know what Great Shape was, and we don't know if Look/I Ran had lyrics in 1966. I can't beleive that after the album, documentary and dozens of interviews we stil don't know those things.

Thanks for the support, Sheriff! I don't know the answer to your question but I'd bet that it was just
a random hawaiian expression that happened to fit the meter and syllabic needs of the melodic
phrase, or maybe, to go for a deep symbolic interpretation, it signifies saying "goodbye" to the
traditional Hawaiian culture that was supposedly overwhelmed by westward expansion. How's that
for a theory in the absence of input from the source, Mr. Parks? A more thorough explanation from
him about the whole shebang would be REALLY appreciated, without a doubt! :) :'(

I must say that this is one of the most entertaining, thought provoking discussion's of SMiLE that I've ever read. One question though. Do you think that it's possible that discussion's like these are the very reason that Van Dyke has not really talked much about it? The SMiLE story is kind of like some big conspiracy. We start to ask to many questions, and sooner or later we might accidentally find an answer or two. Melinda wouldn't want that.   :p

I wonder about some of the less discusses SMiLE lyrics, as well. For example, "Barnyard". The first verse is fairly direct and self-explanatory. "The chickens drew their number...", though, could mean a few things. A "number" could refer to  "a tune or arrangement for singing or dancing/ a song" or "a single or distinct performance within a show, as a song or dance". They're drawing a song or performance , within the canvased town and its brushed backdrop, where our doodle lives (remember the line "what a dude'll/doodle do in town full of heroes and villains"?, which also references the phrase "c*ck a doodle do"). Or, I imagine that the chickens could be numbered for slaughter, and thy're picking their numbers to wait in line. The cook, after all, is chopping lumber for dinner. But what about the second verse?

"Jump in the pigpen,
next time I'll take my shoes off
hit the dirt, do two and a half
next time I'll leave my hat on"

What exactly does that mean? "Do two and a half" of what? Some relate this to how much acid Brian took on his mystical trip (didn't he say he took 250 micrograms of acid, which is 2.5 mg, or perhaps 2 and 1/2 hits?). The references to shoes and hats could mean a lot of things. First, we'll look at the reference to hats, by relating them to a couple of popular phrases:

To throw or toss one's hat in or into the ring: to become a participant in a contest, esp. to declare one's candidacy for political office. Perhaps next time the narrator will not throw his hat into the pigpen, meaning that he doesn't want to be a participant.
Under one's hat: confidential; private; secret. The narrator doesn't want to take his hat off and reveal his secrets.
Hat in hand: humbly; respectfully. He went into the pigpen without his hat on, perhaps meaning humbly so with hat in hand?
Take off one's hat to: to express high regard for; praise. By taking his hat off, he was praising the pigpen.

Perhaps the pigpen represents Brian's acid trip, or simply, just returning to nature and country life. Or both? "Hit the dirt" implies that the narrator got down and dirty, perhaps rolling around with pigs (did he roll two and a half times?).

Now, for the shoes:

Fill someone's shoes: to take the place and assume the obligations of another person.
In someone's shoes: in a position or situation similar to that of another: I wouldn't like to be in his shoes. Could it be that the narrator is taking of his shoes so we can take a walk in his shoes ourselves and experience what he experienced?
Drop the other shoe: to complete an action or enterprise already begun. By dropping his shoes for us to walk in, the narrator has made it clear that he is now enlightened, his spiritual journey complete, and we can now join him.
Where the shoe pinches: the true cause of the trouble or worry. Maybe the narrator's shoes were pinching his feet, and he is going to drop his troubles and worries. By taking his shoes off, his feet can really feel the dirt and earth below.

Now, I realize that some of these conjectures may be wildly off the mark, but I'm just shooting in the dark and hoping I'll hit something. "Barnyard" truly is a mysterious song when you really try to analyze it. I doubt Van Dyke thought of all of those phrases when he wrote the song, at least directly. He just knew phrases of the sort existed, probably, and that referencing to shoes and hats would lead to interesting literary allusions.

Wow. I've always come at this from a somewhat different angle.

First, I always heard it as "chickens do their number" - as in the chickens are performing a dance.  Which is just what I picture happening when I hear the slower paced, plucked strings version of False Barnyard on the SoT boot. There has to be a link there, I reckon.

The other verse I always took in-part to be Brian making lyrics up on the spot to indicate the melody, and the VDP would be tasked with some real lyrics later. Or maybe Brian just forgot most of the lyrics during that run-through. I like the "pig-pen" line, and the "hit the dirt" line, but the hat and shoes are ill-fitting nonsense to my ears.

"Hit the dirt, do two and a half": I assumed that was drop to the floor and do two-and-a-half push-ups. After which, I guess, if you did it regularly enough, you could claim "I'm in great shape".

Maybe he's decided to take his shoes off next time he jumps in the pig pen so he doesn't get them covered in pig sh*t again... I know I would!

I really like how folks are mentioning that Brain's & Van Dyke's SMiLE "answers" to SMiLE questions don't seem to really answer our questions. I think they are complicit in this process.

On David Leaf's CD Brian & Van Dyke discuss "Surf's Up." Van Dyke asks Brian "what were you thinking?" when writing "Surf's Up." Brian answers that there was "a lot of love" going around at that time. Got it folks?

When Mike Love asked Brian & Van Dyke about the SMiLE lyrics in 66-67 he basically recieved a non answer. The Vosse Posse doesn't seem to have any illuminating SMiLE observations. And David Leaf is no SMiLE visionary.

One thing I really like is how Brian was hauled off to the hospital prior to the BWPS first performance. It may have been on the Charlie Rose tv show but Brian blamed the LSD still left in his brain as the culprit behind the hospital visit. Hmmmmm. SMiLE & LSD.

In the American Band video (I think it's in Brian's voice) Brian says "I took the LSD and it tore my head off." Maybe that's why he'll "keep his hat on" next time in Barnyard.

I always thought, "Hit the dirt doing two and a half," meant he was running and jumping into the pig pen. As in, when a cop pulls you over, he says, "I caught you doing sixty-seven back there." So you're running and jumping into the pig pen at two and a half miles per hour.

Or is that just ridiculously stupid? I'd never questioned it until now.

"do a two & a half" means two and a half forward rolls.

Hey Dada, when I first started reading this I thought you were putting on everyone who gets
obsessive about the SMiLE lyrics, like Beatles "hidden significance" fanatics, but then realized that
you and subsequent posters were in earnest. Interesting stuff!

Van Dyke Parks certainly has nearly unlimited capacity for allusion and metaphor, but to me, the
Barnyard and I'm in Great Shape lyrics seem more hastily conceived and playfully, light-spiritedly composed than some other sections of the album, and may not lend themselves to too deep an attempt at interpretation. Could be totally wrong, of course.

I could see how Mr. Parks might feel besieged by the "conspiracy"-type intensity of the curiosity
about the lyrical thematic significance and it might add to any natural reluctance he has to discuss this
turbulent period in his creative life, which he must be ambivalent about, in addition to his loyalty to
Mr. Wilson and respect for his desire for discretion and not wanting to bring up disturbing memories
for him.

If only the same supportive family and musical environment that enabled Brian to courageously "face
the music" itself could also be sufficient for him to revisit, reframe and re-integrate the actual exper-
iences of that time in a completely new way which would heal and remove the traumatic, painful
associations they contain and allow him to discuss them in more depth, but again, he's given so much of himself to us already and that's selfish to ask, plus it's probably not therapeutically possible with such strong negative memories.

Perhaps someday when Van Dyke feels more free to expound, for various reasons, we'll get a more complete, even lyric-by-lyric, explanation.

Or not. :-\

I don't think that'll ever happen. Did James Joyce ever go back and explain Ulysses? No, that's just not how literary types work. The air of mystery is purposeful. It allows the work to reveal not only some of the author's beliefs, but some of your own as well. Also, I'd agree that the lyrics to "Barnyard" were playful and off-the-cuff. However, I'm pretty sure Van Dyke, being the erudite young man he was, was aware of the possible allusions shoes and hats can have, and threw it out there for that purpose without really thinking about much more than that. Of course, he maybe didn't, but the rest of the lyrics on SMiLE hint towards such double meaning. Anyway, I just analyzed it such a drawn out manner because I wanted to bring to light all of the various thought processes that may have went through Van Dyke's head, even if just fleetingly, in his amphetamine and hash daze while writing "Barnyard".

VDP has commented on some of the SMiLE tracks mentioned here. Back in 2004 post release of BWPS he gave quite a few interviews.

He did mention that he had never heard the track 'Holidays' until Darian played it for him. Darian himself was unsure that the lyrics for 'Child' that Van Dyke presented for BWPS were from 1966 or 2003. The general opinion is thst they were of the latter date. He has confirmed that he did write lyrics for 'Child' in 1966.

'Look', according to Brian (also in 2004) was originally an instrumental.

I cannot recall him saying anything about 'Da Da' etc.

 :smokin

There are a few techniques that Brian & Van Dyke use to escape the nets of SMiLE questioners.

One way that Brian escapes is by avoiding lyrical questions altogether. And when asked to comment about a song Brian will add only musical insight.

Van Dyke often seems to answer in the micro or macro. The very specific lyrical references don't seem to add up, the lager generational generalities also don't seem to add clarity.

Another, more recent, technique is for Van Dyke to claim ALL lyrical responsibility---thus removing Brian from the "what does it mean?" line of questioning. Good one.

There's a great quote in the Priore book. Van Dyke says "it's as logical as it's ever going to get."

That means that it's up to us & others to figure it out (if that's possible). But that's largely not possible if one considers Brian's original intentions and inspirations for SMiLE.

Brian said it all was about two of his LSD trips & the resulting religious spiritual experience. That's where the answers primarily lie.

Yes, I'd love to have some of the SMiLE lyrics interpreted, which Van Dyke Parks could knock off in about a half an hour, but I'm more interested in some of Brian's 1966-67 ideas FOR THE MUSIC!

Specifically, what was the original intent for "Heroes And Villains", what was the "Barnyard Suite", what comprised "The Elements", and what was Brian's working sequence (assuming he had a rough one)? With the speed in which Brian talks, that would take about another half an hour to answer. Of course, I wouldn't want to send him over the edge with these emotionally troubling questions.... ::)

Well, I have another dumb theory, being the resident Brian Wilson and Van Dyke Parks impersonator around here. My theory is that the cantina version of "H&V" reveals the songs original structure. The "in the cantina..." part replaces the "barnyard" section ("out in the barnyard..." to "in the cantina..."), and the "dum...dum...dum..." section with the distortion replaces "I'm in Great Shape" (I'm inferring this by how both end, with echoing distortion). Brian identified those as sections of "H&V" in the famous demo, and I think the cantina mix was trying to put "H&V" back together after having cannibalized the sections for the separate track "I'm in Great Shape". If you were to follow "I'm in Great Shape" with the early version of the cantina "H&V" fade with the "you were my sunshine" vocals, it makes some thematic sense. But I'm just trying to do detective work without enough clues. Also, something else interesting I found out accidentally:

Threescore and ten: The span of a life. In the days that this was coined that was considered to be seventy years.

There is a use of it that refers to the span of our lives, in Psalms 90:

The days of our years are threescore years and ten;
and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years,
yet is their strength labor and sorrow;
for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

As with many other Biblical phrases, this was picked up by Shakespeare. In Macbeth, we have:

Threescore and ten I can remember well:
Within the volume of which time I have seen
Hours dreadful and things strange; but this sore night
Hath trifled former knowings.

So, besides "at threescore and five..." from the cantina "H&V" dating the narrator as 65 years old, it also reveals that he is at the end of his life and is reflecting on what has happened.

Are you sure about Look? There was a group vocal overdub session for Look that has never turned up anywhere.

Interesting about VDP confirming that he wrote CITFOTM lyrics in '66. Did he hint as to why he decided to write new lyrics? That right there is my Smile holy grail. Seems odd that both Brian and Van Dyke wouldn't remember the lyrics.  I wish Al would give an in depth interview about  the recordings. I bet he remembers stuff like that.

Yeah, why in the world would he write new lyrics for "Child" unless he either forgot
the contemporary ones (hard to believe) or wasn't satisfied with them (possible)?

VERY interesting, if true , about the vocal overdub session for Look. If that's confirmed
in session notes, it seems more reliable than Brian's '04 statement, although I know
Brian still has much more on the ball regarding past events than many think, and I guess session records can be misleading for various reasons. Al AND Bruce may know more than
they let on. That's their prerogative.

True about the writer's desire for some mystery to surround their works. The bottom line
is that we'll probably never know much or any more about it than we do now.

The 1971 Rolling Stone "Beach Boys: A California Saga" article has some expansive
comments about lyrics and song meanings. ???

Well, one thing that's interesting is that there was an article in '66 in which Dennis described "Child is Father..." as a 'cowboy' song. Could it be that "Child is Father..." was lyrically closer to "H&V" in concept in '66, building off the "my children were raised..." tidbit in "H&V"? But, then when "Child is Father..." was made part of a spiritual suite in BWPS, Van Dyke decided to write more ambiguous lyrics? Either that, or the writer of the article got "Child is Father" confused with another song, like "H&V" or "Cabinessence"...

I've always thought that the writer of that particular article was getting "Child" confused with something else...I can't imagine a song with an esoteric phrase like "child is the father of the man" having verses/other sections having to do with cowboys.  It is Smile we're talking about here though, so anything is possible.

As for Van Dyke writing new lyrics, I think it would have to have been a case of not liking the old lyrics (not likely, in my opinion) or not having access to them at all.  Maybe the lyric sheet Van Dyke wrote was lost somehow?  If it had been available in 2003, I can't imagine why Van Dyke and Brian wouldn't want to use it.

It's interesting that Dennis Wilson thought that "Child If Father Of The Man" was a cowboy song. Is that how Brian & Van Dyke were presenting things to the Beach Boys???

After that quote I believe Dennis then states a "throwaway" (article writer's term) line about writing a prayer for song. That seems more in line with SMiLE.

Here's a far-out theory: what if Dennis confused the song titles, and he really played Cabinessece?  Further, what if the "prayer" that he was working on was an early incarnation of his "truck drivin' man" part?

I know, its totally out of left field...Cabinessence isn't really a cowboy song anyways, but I can't imagine "Child" being called a cowboy song, so I'm thinking there had to have been some sort of mix up.

As far as I can recall, VDP didn't tell Darian whether the CITOFM lyrics on BWPS were the original or new. I don't know if VDP was ever asked directly about that. Darian felt that the lyrics were new but he didn't know. It may  
that VDP lost some of his original lyric sheets or that they ended up with his first wife Durrie after their divorce,
along wiith these legendary acetates.

I do remember (a radio interview) with Van Dyke in which he expressed surprise about the actual amount of music Brian recorded for SMiLE of which he was unaware (or couldn't remember).

Brian on 'Look' (saying it was originally an instrumental). Well it is Brian we're talking about. Besides if there were vocal sessions for that track it doesn't necessarily figure that there were lyrics -it could have been simply background chants etc.

 8)

Despite Brian's waivering reliability, maybe "Look" was indeed orginally an instrumental, but then he came up with something vocal to add later (either lyrics or chants).  I think the vocal session took place about 2 months after the track was recorded, so perhaps he wasn't misremembering after all. 

"Look" is actually one of the few tracks from the original sessions that I think works as an instrumental...unlike "Worms," "Child," or some of the other tracks, I don't get the feeling that anything is missing when I listen to it.   

I agree that it does work as an instrumental, but also think that the vocals add SO much to
it. I remember the first time I heard one of the early Smile concerts on CD before BWPS was
released, and the segueway from Wonderful into Look or Song for Children with the lyrics was
one of those treasured Smile moments I won't forget.

Didn't someone say that the Look session mentioned was supposedly a vocal OVERDUB
session? That might indicate actual lyrics, but I guess it could just refer to background chants.

I met Van Dyke a few years ago at Frank Holmes' Smile art exhibit in San Francisco, and was
excited and a little scattered, but I believe that I remember asking him if the lyrics for Look/
Song for Children were newly written, and I think he said yes. :3d

Agree, it's the highlight of BWPS for me. But, it also caught me off guard. I always envisioned "Look" as one of three things:

1) the sun rising in the morning, looking out over a green field or valley, the dawning of a new day
2) a ship sailing over the ocean, somebody spots land, and says "Look!"
3) a continuation of the "Good Vibrations" riff, imagine the girl dancing, "she's still dancing in the night unafraid...."

But, I never thought of children; I suppose it could've been that in 1966. It certainly works on BWPS.....

 

That is a great theory. I also have a theory, if you could all indulge me for a moment. I have always thought that the center piece of Smile is Surf's Up, not H&V. When the song ends with the "a children's song" line, it's the "hero" of the Smile story reflecting on the innocence of life. It's a theme that is touched on in Wonderful. I envision this guy thinking about "a children's song", about the innocence that once was, before the westward expansion. Before it was nothing but "heroes" against the "villians".

Here's a Brian Wilson quote from the Surfing Saints article. It includes the term "look" and refers to the ultimate religious experience.

"The thing you really look for is the moment of clear light. It's only happened to me once--early in the morning alone on the beach with the sun coming up very red. A moment of clear light."

Thanks for the clarification. I know I shouldn't find offense when none is intended. It's just this message board thing - it's hard, sometimes, to tell how posts should be read.

Is it on one of the BB DVDs (An American Band?) where Van Dyke Parks speaks about his run-in with Mike Love re Smile and says something to the effect, "The lyrics don't mean a thing. If you don't like them, ditch them."? Surely a most disingenuous comment if ever there was one (I seem to remember a mid-70s Parks - in the clip - looking really groovy however). I'm no conspiracy theorist, and honestly I don't normally find myself obsessing over pop or rock group lyrics, but I do think there is substance to the concept (and the lyrics) of Smile that you don't find in other great albums of the time. Maybe Forever Changes and electric Bob Dylan are comparable. I don't have the authority to say.

Surely someone here has Van Dyke's email address right? He's probably tired of talking about Smile but it may be worth a shot.  I'd simply ask him if he wrote lyrics for CITFOTM in '66 and if so why did he elect to re-write them in 2004.

I was looking at AGD's site and saw only two session dates for 'Do you Like worms?' (one being the instrumentals, and the other being the vocal session)....was it usual for Brian to go to a vocal session with so few lyrics?

Van Dyke Parks obviously had at least the first few lines penned out for 'Do You Like Worms' so why didn't Brian record them? Or did VDPs pen those lyrics after the first vocal session?

I was just wondering if there could be original lyrics sung by Brian in '66 in a vault at Capitol - or if 'Bicycle Rider', 'Roll Plymouth Rock', and the chant were all he sung at that session.