The Smiley Smile Message Board

Any news on this getting released?  Didn't Al initially announce this album sometime in 2007 by asking people to join his mailing list?  Is this project dead in the water?

Thanks,
Matt

It's never going to come out. It's inappropriate music. The tapes have been destroyed.

Al is considering completing it in 2044. And do a première run at the Royal Festival Hall in London.

Touring with Brian has hurt him emotionally. No release date till he recovers.

I hear he's contacting a well-known shrink-to-the-stars with musical aspirations. Name of 'W.C. Handy' or something to that effect. On the Fiji Islands.
Stay tuned.

Maybe the Postcard has been returned to sender. Who knows? At any reate, I hope Al manages to get it released.

I wanted to make a joke about a song causing a building near where Al lives to burn down, but it probably wouldn't be funny considering there were actual wildfires in Big Sur within the past year.

Watch it become the truth!

What does that mean anyhow?  A Postcard from California? Don't f*** with the formula, Al.

It's a title suggested by Mike. It went thus:
Van Dyke Parks compared the finalized SMiLE in 2004 with a small set of beautiful stamps from California.
Enter Mike, 2007. He's on the phone with Al.
'And hey, Al', sez Mike, ever the philantropist, 'while we're at it: don't call that album 'You Can Call Me Al'. Who'd ever call a piece of music that?
Name it: 'Postcards From California'. If Fat Brian and that little Nerdy Perfester Friend of his bring stamps to the world, then you'll bring Postcards. Got that?'
Al: 'Gee, Mike. That is great. I appreciate that, I really do. You are so good. Thank you Mike, thank so ever so much!'

I really hope it'll come out soon. I'm looking forward to it.

But I don't see what's taking him so long to just bring the thing out. It's 2008, it's very common nowadays to release a CD by yourself and 'distribute' it through your website. Sure it won't sell millions of copies (probably not even a five digit number), but I'm sure there are quite some Beach Boys fans (and maybe a few CSNY/America/Steve Miller/Red Hot Chili Peppers collectors) who'll get it...

Odd - Al may well be the one remaining original Beach Boy who kept his vocal chords in the best of shapes. Am I right?

Believe the album is done and Al has been looking for a record company deal.  I imagine there was a pause by people to see how TLOS sales went.  Maybe Al will be forced to do it independently like "Live in Las Vegas".

I have a feeling it could go the way of Unleash The Love. Maybe he wants to wait a while so he can redo Help Me Rhonda into a 2009 version. This could be the biggest hurry up and wait job since Ed Macmahon cancelled his tour.

It's so good that it makes Pet Sounds stink! :hat

(seriously, hope you're able to find a label, Al. Hey, I rhymed! I'm depraved on account of I'm deprived!)

C'mon Al, get it released.  Can't wait to hear the full Don't Fight the Sea!

I'd be happy just to hear his remake of "Honkin' Down the Highway."  That's the only reason I want to hear the album, and I hope I can download that track somewhere (paid, of course).

I'd really like to hear that as well.

Alan Boyd persuaded him to play it live once with him and it was pretty damn good! :)

I hear it was returned to sender - insufficient postage.  :)

Re- Honkin' Down The Highway

I saw Al perform this track three times in Vegas earlier this year.  Wonderful to hear it live.  The first night they flubbed the structure of the song (only slightly).  All the vocalists were cracking up as they hadn't rehearsed it that much.  Al talked about Brian coming in and helping out with vocals on the new studio version.  Sounds liked they both enjoyed themselves.

I hope Postcard does come out soon as I am looking forward to it.  I know Al has taken some shots for the retreads on the cd, but am I the only one that thinks the new version of Lookin' Down The Coast is killer?  I love it.  Great production.  This new version has a majestic sound that is IMHO much better than the already good 70's version of the track.  I am not a big fan of the new Help Me Rhonda, but Don't Fight the Sea has me excited too.  Nothing wrong with a little Carl Wilson vocal.  Nice.  Trisha Campo was kind enough to let me hear the then unreleased Dennis Wilson POB/Bambu as well as a bunch of Al's new cd and I think Postcard from California will be an enjoyable listen.  No revolutionary new musical statement or new ground breaking effort, but does it need to be?  His vocals are still top drawer, great stuff.  Bring it on!

I have told Trish that Al's voice and spirit have not changed since the 60's. An honest observation. Heck, if you listen to him over the years, he really never did sound different.  ;D He obviously takes good care of his voice.

As for the album, I have already reserved both dollars and a space in my collection for it. Whenever the "powers that be" make it available, I will gladly buy it. There is a lot of things that an artist needs to get done to get their album released. Especially when they are not already on a label.

It's going to be launched here.....eh...soon!


http://www.beachboyscentral.com/



 :p :p :p

in ......2030 ! ;D

I'd like to hear the remaining boys get together with some of the best of their new material over the past years.
There is a new BeachBoys album just waiting to happen.  They don't have to tour together.  They could just release a BeachBoys album.   Would sell better than the sum of al their solo stuff!  They could guest on each others tours and promote the songs in three seperate bands and tours.  With the combined talent in those 3 bands you could get one hell of a sound on a record!

Now that Mike and Al are friends again, they are probably working on it and that's the reason for the delay....  ;)

In January.  It's certain to move 1 million copies...in January! :)

?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????etc

You just never know?

http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2008/oct/19/beach-boys-co-founder-not-ruling-out-reunion/

 :-\ Note the subtle "dig" at Melinda at the end of the article. I always hold out hope, but something like this, needs to be wholly on THEIR terms. No PR stunt. There has been so much bad blood in the group over the years if it doesn't happen by them, it might drive them further apart.

you call that "subtle" !!!

OK, I was trying to be nice to Mike. I'm like that. I try to show respect to everyone.

I'd love to see Mike and Al get back together, not just for professional reasons, but also personal ones. We discuss Mike and Brian's relationship a lot, but Mike and Al were very close for many years, and probably shared more together than any other two Beach Boys. I think it will happen.

Actually, it just might. I'd be way more likely to see Mike Al and Bruce than I would Mike and Bruce.

I'm not interested in the touring entity either way, but (while I am afraid of the production possibilities, neither of them having impressed me in that capacity in about 35 years) I'd gladly give a chance to another Mike-Al-Bruce collaborative album, whether it's Beach Boys or just in their names. I wasn't too thrilled with most of what I have heard from Postcards From California. Maybe a reshuffling of performances on it, or some new songs injected into (or taken from) it would help. (So would production that doesn't sound like 90s adult contemporary, but hey, that's my own taste.)

Yes, an album of some sort would be great, but I think it's more realistic that Al (and, hopefully David Marks, too) will reunite on the road. Which creates a bit of a problem - too many guitar players! :police:

That last sentence in the article – "Brian is on a solo path pretty much masterminded by his wife," says Love. "But if Brian and I are alone together with a piano, nature just takes over" -  troubles me.

I mean, when was the last time these two sat at a piano together?

Nature might have taken over a couple of decades ago but how does Love know what would happen if the two sat at a piano today?

(At their age I guess the CALL of nature would take over!)

But keep in mind, both Al and Mike have albums that are complete. It's a lot easier to make an album when you have two completed sets of tracks as a starting point. It might even cut down Al's "refinement/production" period to, say, another nine or 10 years, rather than the otherwise prerequisite 30.

Jeez, I hope not.  I want Al's album now.

Maybe he means they do it.

It's funny, the article doesn't even mention Bruce as being part of the touring band!

Mike and Al used to be pretty close, check out this video at around 5:30 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uehyh57k2_E

Any idea just what kind of line-up would legally constitute the group to be able to use "The Beach Boys" on a album cover? Does it need the ok from Brother?

Remember the Nascar deal was "of the BBs".

If I remember, there has to be at least 1 Wilson in the group to be called The Beach Boys. AGD can correct me on this though.

C'mon, Al, release the damn album!

There's no holdup on Al's part. He wants the album out. The trouble is is that he's going for a major label release and the labels (what are those again???) that are showing the most interest want it for a Spring 2009 release -- nothing sooner. He wants it to have distribution above an "indie" only release. Trust me, he's more frustrated about the situation than anyone on the board.

Has Capitol no intrest in releasing it ?

I can't believe that any major label would want to have anything to do with an Al Jardine solo release.  I don't meant that as any disrespect to Al, but let's face it, his name doesn't have the same industry power and doesn't garner the same respect that Brian does or that a Beach Boys album would at this time.  I really want this to get released, so I wish Al would let it see an indie release. 

Oh, you don't think Al deserves attention from major labels? Did you forget that he sang "Sloop John B" and came up with extra chords for the song? Or did you not notice how his new album's production sounds like a modern MIU, which Al produced, the very same brilliant production that brought to life some of Brian's last great songs for the Beach Boys ("My Diane","Wontcha Come Out Tonight?", and several others) ? This is a masterpiece.  Don't fight the sea, man. A tidal wave of Al Jardine love is coming to us all.

It's ludicrous for Al to think he in any way deserves a new release to have the financial backing of a major label. Fewer and fewer artists have that kind of backing, and most who do are flash-in-the-pan hitmakers or longtime stars (Dylan, P. Simon, etc.). Al was in a band that fits that definition, but that band no longer makes new music for commercial release. He ought to bite the bullet, swallow his pride and get the best deal he can. Besides, it's not as if indie labels suffer from poor distribution. Many have distribution through (their parent-company) majors anyway.

I have to agree.  Brian is the only member of the band who warrants major label backing, and even that doesn't come too easily for him anymore.  As much as I like Al, his music has extremely limited appeal...not exactly what any label (let alone a major label) is looking for.

If the 'legend' himself had to sell his own Roxy CD to get things moving I'm afraid Al is going to have to do the same.

Howie, don't know if you have inside-information (being close to the source, but is there a reason an "indie"-release is out of the question? What are the selling-expectations for a (major) label release? Is it a guarantee for better sales than on an indie-release? And do the labels that are interested in a Spring-release fall under that category "major"? Just curious ...

Frustrating as it is, if Spring 2009 is a realistic date, I guess I can wait ...

I can wait too, but an indie label would be more sensible - although there are clearly assholes out there who aren't interested in any kind of release...

First, Al has to consider the album finished before it gets released. We're assuming it's finished, but maybe it's not yet.

I've interviewed many alternative and punk rock bands through the years, several of those bands were on major labels, had been on major labels or had rejected offers by major labels. And it seemed that almost all of them agreed that, unless you sell hundreds of thousands of copies of an album, you're much better off on an indie label than a major label. Cause if you're not Beyonce, Mariah Carey or Kanye West or someone like that, they will let you know you're not a priority but just a number in their catalog. And what's worse: if your album doesn't sell, it could go out of print forever within a couple of years because the labels that owns it simply doesn't care about it and probably forgot it ever existed.

An Al Jardine solo album won't sell big. I wouldn't be surprised if it would sell less than 10,000 copies. I really can't wait to hear it and I'm sure I'll like it, but I think that's how it is. So I think Al would be MUCH better off at a dedicated indie label where people sincerely care for his music...

I just wish that Al would take the time in order to go back to the studio in order to record one or two more original compositions to be placed on the album instead of Help Me Rhonda. Well, wishful thinking...  I'd even prefer dodgy rewrites like PT Cruiser over a remake like that. Honkin' Down The Highway however, there's no need for that one to be replaced, of course.  :)

I would've thought the Christmas buying season would've been better than Spring 2009. Does a Spring release mean a tour or trying to link it to the "summery" Beach Boys' music?

It probably just means that all the labels have their schedules full until Spring.

Don't the major labels pretty much only put out "greatest hits" albums and other stuff they know will sell a lot during the holidays?

According to Bruce, Mike added his vocals to "Don't Fight The Sea".

Pity Bruce didn't add his vocals - and David.  Once last time...

Don't Fight the Sea sounds great (from what I heard), they should really go all out with this song...!

Come on! Make it the new Beach Boys single! It has the potential to be their last great song. Maybe that's what Al had in mind all along - he's always been the most enthusiatic about a hypothetical reunion.

Let's hope the lawyers don't get in the way!  :P

Whoa, this is huge! Now we're getting somewhere!

Huge is right! It's the actual, honest-to-God Beach Boys. Man, I'm pleased to be able to say that.

Awesome news!

I feel proud for having given him impetus to give an official word on that.

These are great news ! Can't wait to hear the new Beach Boys-song (man, it feels good to say that)

I must admit, I was a little worried that Carl's unreleased recorded vocals weren't used for something like this. Brian did "Soul searching" erasing all the other BBs voices and I feared that this would be the case with DFTS too

Al is a genius. What a concept, a Beach Boys reunion and Brian isn't back in bed. Wow.

Bruce is a really tough guy to talk to online, he always sells himself short. Everyone's asking him why he wasn't on the track and he says that the Beach Boys vocal blend sounds better without him. From reading his posts, it seems the only thing from his entire musical career that he's proud about is Disney Girls.

I saw that.

Also, I can't register on that board for some reason, but I thought it slightly odd that he hasn't seen an outtake picture from the Summer Days cover...I'm sure there's on with him on it in the CD booklet, and on the "Back Through The Opera Glass" there definitely is.

Yes, it's exciting that we have a "new" song with the Beach Boys' vocal blend on it. I'm extremely excited about that. No offense to Al's sons, but I'd rather hear a song with Brian, Mike, Carl, and Al, than the same song with Al, Adam and Matt. I've been beating that drum for years; enough of this solo stuff.

Anyway, when I said it was huge, it had more to do with the prospect of true reuniting. This "vocal engineering" on "Beyond The Sea" or whatever it is is nice, and I'll take it, but it's not really a reunion. I'm not even sure I want to call it The Beach Boys. It's huge because Mike and Al talked, and Mike acted. It opens the door, and yes, it is a little healing. Just a little. It's huge because of what it can ultimately lead to.

I wonder if that is the response they are looking for now as they shop around for a deal. Not a bad selling point.

I don't want to negate the joy of having some living and dead BBs on a song again, but I wish the vocals could be recorded all at once. The BBs sound much better that way than each one on his separate track(s).

I am very much looking forward to Al's album, but I in no way want a BB reunion. The BBs are dead. By all means collaborate together, but leave the name and "brand" alone.

Except the name and brand isn't left alone.

Even if this wasn't happening, there's still been a "Beach Boys" schlepping Be True To Your School around the world for the last so many decades; it ain't gonna make Mike and Bruce stop. In that case, I'd rather have a Beach Boys consisting of Brian Wilson, Mike Love, Alan Jardine, David Marks and Bruce Johnston.

maybe al will turn this into a beach boys album?

THAT is what I suspect I've felt for a while without realising it. Very good post.

I think most folk agree that the Beach Boys ended when Carl died but time has past and it's no longer unusual for a band as long in the tooth as the Beach Boys to have had one or more members pass away. Look at The Who, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd...  no-one complained/complains when these guys reform despite their toll. Get Brian back in The Beach Boys and their reunion would be valid too.

I'd still love for Ricky and Blondie to be there as well but that's a personal preference. I liked the rock-style of the early 70s BBs and would hate for Brian to head-up a "California Fun Fun Fun Around" that does litle more that Mike and Bruce have been doing, and indeed Brian himself occasionally gets away with.

Was that meant as ironic, or are you just not aware that a lot of people complain?

No, I wasn't aware. But who complains, the die-hard fans like those of us who post here? I don't remember reports of protests outside the O2 arena this year, or at Live8 in 05.

I'll be at the RFH when The Beach Boys perform SMILE in its entirety in June 2009!   ;D

Hmmm...when Pink Floyd reunited at Live 8, all the members were still alive & there...at least all the members who recorded the songs they peformed that day.  So I can't imagine what the complaint would've been about.  It was as authentic a reunion as anyone could've hoped for.  As for Led Zep, sure Bonzo's gone, but his son was there...the only people I'm aware of complaining about that reunion were the ones who couldn't get tickets (and maybe Dave Grohl, who had hoped to drum for them!).

Aye, I guess no-one complained about Syd's absence!

Would a BB's reunion bolstered by sons of Dennis, CArl and Al work?

Well, Matt was a great (!) addition when he toured with the Beach Boys. Carl B. (I believe, maybe Justyn)) said that he would like to be part of a BBs-reunion

thats a great idea Carl's son Justin filling in with Mike, Brain, Al, and Bruce does Dennis have any sons I don't recall.

Yep. Dennis' son Carl B. play drums in "In bloom" with Justy on guitar

But, you already have an real Beach Boy in David Marks, who happens to be a great guitarist. And, there's a couple of good ex-touring Beach Boys' drummers who could fill that slot, including the current drummers in Mike & Bruce's band, as well as Brian's.

Or Ricky?

I'm from the K.I.S.S school of thought.

For a band almost 50 years old, to have the possibility of 5 members from its first 5 years still in the biz is quite incredible.

Yes, it is incredible. And I find a potential group consisting of Brian Wilson, Mike Love, Al Jardine, David Marks, and Bruce Johnston quite intriguing. They all have different musical styles, don't they? With no slight to Carl and Dennis, if you told me in the 60's, 70's, 80's, or 90's that I was going to a Beach Boys' concert that featured this group, I would be very pleased.

The way I see it is it is the last monkey on Brians back.



Get healthy and have a reasonable mental outlook. Check.

Stable home-life. Check.

Make music again. Check.

Get onstage. Check.

SMiLE. Check.

Work with Mike......

If it comes to even a new Love/ Wilson tune that gets nothing more than a few outings at a Mike and Bruce concert. For Brian it could be quite beneficial and deal to some demons.
Problem though when Brian said he can't spend more than 5 minutes in the same room as Mike, however they always wrote fast together so that might be enough.

Those five guys would be a interesting mix. I think I am right in saying they have never done anything together. All and any combination could be new project. I think most would expect those five guys singing, however a Brian tune done by a orchestra or a Bruce tune with say just his vocal, keyboard and few Davis riffs could be simple but just as interesting. How often have we heard various group members say it was 'Al that did that song' or 'Carl recorded that one' and few Beach Boys, if any were involved?


   

+ Make another really good album of brand new song material: check.

Works for me.

A new article on Al Jardine from uncut magazine. 

http://www.uncut.co.uk/blog/index.php?blog=6&p=1015&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

Fleet Foxes and Al Jardine
2008-11-13 10:53:18

As you may have seen elsewhere on our website, the first winners of the Uncut Music Award have just been revealed as the Fleet Foxes. I spoke to Robin Pecknold last week to get his reaction, and found out a couple more things from him. One, he’s as anxious to hear the new Animal Collective album as many more Wild Mercury Sound regulars.

Continued...

And two, his personal highlight of the year was meeting Al Jardine. Here’s his story.

“We played a show in Big Sur. I’d never been there and it’s pretty small. There’s not a town, there’s a gas station and then these five million dollar houses, and then a really big national park. It’s pretty cool. The guy putting on the show said, ‘Hey do you wanna go to Al Jardine’s house? Al has a studio and he wants to know if you guys wanna check out the studio?’

“We were like, absolutely, it was a huge honour. So we went there and got to meet him in his studio. He had Brian Wilson’s piano, and knick-knacks that were really interesting to me, like a Beach Boys flight case with the Brother Records logo on it from 1973, and old reels of tape with the Brother studio logo on it. It was kinda crazy stuff. My eyes were definitely wide open. It was a beautiful house.

“He was awesome, he was so sweet.. I don’t know if he’d heard our music before; I think the guy who put on the show told him we might be a band that he’d like or something. We played him a couple of songs off the EP in the studio ‘cos he wanted to test out these new monitors he’d got for his mixing desk. Then he cancelled something so he could come to the show.

“The show was at this crazy place wth a Buddhist spirit garden, very small town Californian weirdness. There were nests you could sleep in overnight – made out of wood. You climbed into them like a hammock, but they were like big gigantic bird’s nests.

“He played us a couple of songs off a record he’d recently made, he had a duet between him and Neil Young recorded last summer that no-one had heard. It was going to be on his next record. He had a lot of good advice. Carl and Dennis are passed, and if I were to meet Brian I don’t know how substantive the discussion would be, but Al told us how they did this thing, that we should hold on to our publishing. That was a definite glowing moment.”
John Mulvey

Every living member of the pre-1971 of the Beach Boys is open for a live reunion -- except for Brian. Mike told me that he wanted a two show reunion to be taped at the Hollywood Bowl and Wembley for PBS and released on DVD -- with special guests (e.g. McCartney and Clapton) -- to be done for the band's 50th. Bruce, when in the room with Mike, was all up for it, but a year or so prior was pulling his same old schtick saying that that he'd be there, but that he'd be in the front row enjoying the show, etc... ("I'm just a fan like you are!!!")

Obviously Bruce would be on board (I doubt he'd sit THOSE gigs out but NOT the back to back one-nighter county fairs), I know David would be there in a heartbeat, as would Al. Carl B. has even told me that he would absolutely love to be in on it. Billy H. too.

I think Mike's virtual addition to POSTCARD is an amazing step. I don't know what it'll lead to. It's certainly an incredible and unexpected olive branch. Not that any of you DIDN'T know this, but be it live or studio -- a reunion LITERALLY all comes down to Mike and Brian's camp ending this cold war -- which would then be followed by them coming to terms on every aspect of everything else. It's as easy and impossible as that.

I don't see it as a cold war between Brian's and Mike's camps. I like the idea of the guys guesting on Al's record, but i don't want a Brian-BBs reunion and maybe he feels the same way. No hard animosity, just artistic reasons.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cold%20war

Main Entry: cold war
Function: noun
Date: 1945

1: a conflict over ideological differences carried on by methods short of sustained overt military action and usually without breaking off diplomatic relations ; specifically often capitalized C&W : the ideological conflict between the United States and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics during the second half of the 20th century — compare hot war
2: a condition of rivalry, mistrust, and often open hostility short of violence especially between power groups (as labor and management)

Brian has not recorded one solo album that could not have been - artistically - a Beach Boys' album. Not one.

And, Howie, I like your summation of the Brian/Mike situation - "It's as easy and impossible as that." That pretty much says it all....

Get healthy and have a reasonable mental outlook. The latter is up for debate...

Stable home-life. 15/16/17 dogs ?  Plus, always remember that from 1964-78, his home life was stable: it was Brian that was the disruptive element.

Make music again. Check.

Get onstage. Niot by choice, originally.

SMiLE. See above.

Work with Mike......  Y'know, given a free vote, I think he would.

I think, IMO, that the evidence to date shows that it's Brian's management/people/wifeandmanagers who are digging their heels in over a BB reunion, not Brian himself. I further feel that when his solo 'career' finally grinds to a halt, then a BB reunion will happen so fast our heads will spin.  ::)

What if by the time "his solo career finally grinds to a halt", one of them's already passed on? It's not inconceivable for men in their late 60s to have a sudden heart-attack or something.

Mitch Mitchell, for example, is younger than them and just unexpectedly passed. And let's be serious, after what Brian has put himself through, he could go at any time.

To clarify; Brian = Brian's Camp.

And I agree that in a year or so, A Wilson/Love reunion is absolutely possible, because I do believe -- like AGD -- that Brian would do it in a second if given the choice. Also the revenue for a "comeback" -- and all that entails, the press, the live products, a revamping of the catalogue, etc. would be the major windfall that BRI needs. Never forget, once Mike leaves the road -- all that bread that BRI collects from touring revenues re: the licence is gone (or depending on how it goes down if "it" carries on -- GREATLY diminished.)

For the most part in the U.S., Oldies radio at this point STARTS with 1964. The Leslie Gores, the Spectors, the Del Shannons are slowly being erased from the airwaves. Aside from literally 5 songs, the founding fathers of Rock are gone from the radio. As it stands now, the Beatles, Beach Boys, and Motown are still among the bedrocks of the genre -- but never forget that Oldies radio is now ALSO Fleetwood Mac, the Eagles, Journey, Hall & Oates, REO, Pat Benatar, Springsteen, Petty, Mellencamp, the Police -- even Men At Work. Radio is shifting, and it's safe to say that apart from a major new comp every decade, the CD/digital royalties will dry as airplay fades (the '63 BB singles are getting less-and-less airplay.) It's a given at this point that any returns that the band were ever gonna get on "Holland" have already been earned.

I've never broached the topic of Mike with Brian to any great detail other than musically and creatively, and on that level the bond seems to there and real. I have spoken to Mike at length about Brian, and his issues are solely with Brian's camp. I honestly believe that if there was a Wilson/Love reunion it would be a heartfelt and spiritual thing, but the bulls*** in and around BRI is as deep as the ocean -- and can all be traced straight back to Murry.

I really think it will eventually come to a negotiation between Mike and Melinda. There are certain conditions that Mike will insist on and the same for Melinda/Brian. Mike will probably insist on being the executive producer,  Brian's sole lyricist/collaborator, and will have a hand in choosing the co-producer. And there will be a co-producer. I would assume Melinda will take the position that "look at how well Brian did in his solo career without Mike Love, The Beach Boys, and the baggage that goes with it", and will make sure there is as much of Brian's current "team", including band members, in the picture. Then the ball will be back in Mike's court. There will have to be compromises. Mike knows it will be his last chance. Brian probably doesn't care nearly as much. It could get verrrrrry interesting.   

Not to be a pessimist, but it's most likely that it would get verrry uninteresting. So much negotiation, so much business, I just can't imagine anything remotely artistically noteworthy coming out of it.

With the possible exception of one song, "Male Ego", I like everything that Brian Wilson and Mike Love ever did. Now, some more than others, but everything.

Including Male Ego, I like everything that Brian and Mike ever did, together or separately. I'm one of those "die-hard fans".

I think I'd have to go back a long way to find a Love / Wilson composition that didn't stink. Many maybe would disagree with me, but I'd say Let Us Go On This Way was the last time that the collaboration didn't totally disgrace itself - and this despite the bit about Extra Sensory Perception that Mike apparently tacked on.  If that makes me a lightweight fan, apologies. I worship three-quarters of the BBs music and abhor the rest.

This isn't saying that all is currently good with Brian - as I really don't know about that - but I'm with people saying that there is no evidence for the Wilson/Love writing partnership forming a strong basis for a reunion and new material. If we're asking whether alternatives exist, then Al and a whole bunch of Brian's former and future writing partners may know...

Is Goin' On a Wilson/Love? I'd guess that's the last good one, before that it's Let Us Go On This Way, and before that, It's OK. It's probably the Sixties before that though. All I Wanna Do, probably, which was recorded in '69, I guess.

If a person likes everything, so be it. If not, so be it. As long as you really like what you like (as opposed to making yourself like it out of some kind of sick devotion), knock yourself out. Me, I'm fine not being "die-hard," defined by Merriam-Webster as "strongly or fanatically determined or devoted ... ; especially : strongly resisting change." I think plenty of Wilson/Love is great, but plenty is mediocre and some is dogshit. I don't feel the need to like the dogshit.

And the scary thing is, she believes this to be true, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Check out these US chart placings (and approximate sales, where possible):

1988 Brian Wilson - 54 (450,000)
1995 IJWMFTT - didn't chart
1998 Imagination - 88
2002 Pet Sounds Live - didn't chart
2004 GIOMH - 100 (100,000)
2004 BWPS - 13 (400,000)
2005 WIRWFC - 200
2008 TLOS - 21 (50,000)

And the biggest seller of those is either the 1988 album, or BWPS, neither of which has gone gold yet (officially). BWPS is of course a special case and should really be discounted, thus in a 20 year solo career, Brian has cracked the US Top 40 album charts with precisely one LP of new material. If he'd not had the BB back catalog & royalties to fund his solo outings, he'd be in deep financial trouble long before now. Yes, Brian has immense critical respect and engenders more unalloyed affection than any other figure of his era, but he is no more than a cult figure in terms of sales, and his live shows very rarely sell out.

AGD replied

Stable home-life. 15/16/17 dogs ?  Plus, always remember that from 1964-78, his home life was stable: it was Brian that was the disruptive element.

Point taken. I was thinking more of the weird coming and goings at all hours in the Wilson home of the 60s. Somehow I can't see Melinda letting Brian and Iggy Pop sing 'Shortnin Bread' at 3am. ;)

Yeah, their last good one was written 28 years ago. How many ever since? One?  :-D

I don't know if Brian's MUSIC will sound better or worse with Mike writing the lyrics. Does having the Lovester side by his side at a piano affect Brian so much? Bollocks. Unless we start giving Mike much more credit for the songs written between 1961 and 1980. I wonder if the reception to "Forever She'll be my surfer girl" would be way worse if it featured a Wilson/Love credit.

Anyway, it doesn't take a lot of effort to achieve the heights of Bennet's lyrics. I just googled Midnight's Another Day's lyrics, and they stink. I get it, Brian's been through a lot and now he's back, yeah, I know that since 1976. I'd rather have some lyrics about a senior citizen scoring with a 17 years old in a drive in and getting a nasty disease in the process. Some entertainment for a change. Bring back Doctor Love, I say. He's got the hooks.

You're preaching to the choir, sometimes a choir of just a few, however.

Luther, addressing your point about being a "diehard"....I am a diehard, but I like the B. Wilson/M. Love compositions because I genuinely like the songs, not just because I blindly (or deafly) decide that I'm going to like anything they do. That applies to the post-1975 stuff, which obviously isn't as strong as the early days. Yes, Mike can write a few eye-rolling lyrics, but I do think they possess(ed) a certain chemistry, and, like I said, I enjoy it all. I really don't find any of it revolting.

I don't force myself to like anything. In fact, I find it amusing that the songs I love are disliked my so many!

Re those last two posts, that's cool. I don't mean to insinuate that any particular person doesn't like what he likes, or shouldn't like what he likes.

Talk of any new BB album would be greatly premature. A live concert and DVD would be a great start.  See how all the egos meshed.  After all,  Brian and Al together didn't last very long.

^ Very true. I think to expect anything is premature, but if something were to happen, what you described is the most likely result: a couple of shows with a resulting live album/DVD. I can't imagine them actually spending the time it would take to make a truly new album of new material. A few songs, maybe. A hodge-podge of semi-solo stuff, maybe (possibly with group vocals added in to give it a more coherent feel). But a truly new project? Seems far off ... maybe unreachable.

Ha!

I've said it before, and I'll said it again - the one lyricist who would totally fit in with Brian's weird Americana vibe is Robert Hunter, who used to write with Jerry Garcia. Hunter's not doing anything that I can see at the moment, that's who he needs to get in contact with. He's like a slightly more straightforward version of Van Dyke; in the main you can understand his lyrics. Mike could add some hooks to the song after that still. Hunter's the same age, went through a lot of the same stuff with an infighting band, etc.

I think the best/most we could hope for would be an approach similar to 'Songs From Here And Back' capping off a 'Hawthorne"-type set (with a decent commercial cover, and an intelligent promo campaign.)

Totally doable.

That said; a live CD/DVD would make 19 times the amount a new studio project ever would. Studio tracks can also be included on live LPs.

I wonder what changes will occur at BRI if Dennis scores a Grammy (or two) and TLOS gets shut out? I'm curious, what are the numbers thus far on the Singles Box Set???

Funny thing is, in this day a new album would be the easier to do IMO. No two members need to be in the same city let alone the same studio! Compare to the preperation required of a concert or tour.

Of course the result would be hardly a 'group' album. I read somewhere that MIU was phoned in in part. True?

Good point. That is the most recent history we have. And with The Beach Boys, I think it's safe to say, "The more things change, the more they stay the same".

Obviously, with any kind of (contractual) reunion, all the details have to be spelled out precisely, with all the t's crossed and i's dotted. And, even if they are, there's no guarantee things will go as planned; just read any Beach Boys book! Maybe if they treat it with the same attitude they had with Stars & Stripes. That appeared to be an honestly good reunion, if you can judge by the video, which you can't always do....

It would largely depend on how they go about it. In my post above I noted that they could do solo tracks with group vocals. They could do that, either all together in a short time frame (they always did prefer to do group backgrounds as an actual group, from what I understand) or even apart. But if they intended to write the new material, it would require a little more actual cooperation. But certainly BBs albums (like everyone else's, for the most part) hadn't consisted of a bunch of guys going into the same room at the same time and making music since the mid-60s, with exceptions here and there.

The other interesting possibility could be some new pairings. While comment both good and bad has been made about Al's writting ability, put him together with Dave for a few hours and anythings possible. How about Bruce and Dave? Also another Brian/ VDP tune  with band vocals isn't unrealistic is it?

One point not discussed. The roof-top reunion two years ago. Brian had a deal with Capitol for TLOS. It seems someone at the label has a soft spot for the band. They could say to Brian TLOS was ok but now they want a new Beach Boys album or nothing. Certain parties in Brians 'management' seem to like the spotlight Brian receives and it would be hard to say no I think.

Beach Boys Return To Capitol: New Album And SMiLE Boxset Soon has a ring to it that some folks on that roof-top in 06 may find hard to turn down.

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.

Mike has an album in the can, Bruce is putting one together (anyone have info on this - some has been on BB Britian), Al's "Postcard from California" is being recorded, and Brian has "The Lucky Old Sun" coming down next year.  Not sure where David is at on new music but I imagine he has something in the works.

Take two or three of the best tracks from each, plus maybe three from the vault (do I hear Dennis Wilson?) and bam, you have a very interesting new album!  Not only would it be a 'new' Beach Boys album but also an excellent sampler/promo for the solo albums."

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,4721.0.html

I would still like to hear Mike sing 'Desert Drive"!

Yes he does.  Al  has already contributed vocals to one of his tracks and I know he'd like Mike to sing on another track, so maybe that will happen since collaboration seems to be in the air! 

Fact is Brian isn't up for it, so he won't give Mike his songs at an early stage. And that is entirely his decision. Brian is cool with Scott writing the lyrics. What we think doesn't matter (and yeah I would have preferred VDP for most of Lucky Old Sun, but there you go. I can't see that Mike would have improved it greatly.)

Having said this, if Mike and Brian did suddenly start writing upfront songs based on their real lives, the results would be great, like an Ian Dury album unhinged by sunstroke.

Very cool Carrie!  David's involvement in any new Beach Boys project(s) is essential!!!!

And maybe with David there, everybody would be on their best behavior.  ;D

Hmmm...'Best Behavior'.  Sounds like a perfect album title.

It probably is indeed. That said, I can't help but feel that a project like that might end up as some kind of Songs From Here And Back Vol. 2.

But is Brian not up for it? You can't tell by his interviews because he doesn't tell the truth all the time. I'm too lazy to look up the thread, but, at the reunion on the Capitol Records rooftop, didn't Brian tell Mike that he (Brian) had some songs that he wanted Mike to hear? But, again, maybe he had none.

As far as it being ENTIRELY Brian's decision...With all due respect, carl r, aren't we being a little naive there. I don't think Brian makes many, if any, decisions that are entirely his.

Somebody previously posted that since Brian resigned with Capitol Records, they might get involved in something Beach Boys related. Now, that wouldn't surprise me. I'm not sure they pursued Brian entirely for his solo output; there might've been some ulterior motive(s). I mean, it's not too far-reaching for some executive at Capitol Records, who is a fan, to look down the road a bit. I'd be surprised if they DIDN'T.

There is a way to avoid this. It would be similar to the recording of MIU and Keepin' The Summer Alive, though, Now don't cringe, hear me out.

Maybe the group could retreat to Al's barn/studio and work on the tracks TOGETHER, like a real band. Brian and Mike always worked fast, so it wouldn't have to be a marathon. Those kind of situations (including the Holland debacle) didn't always work well in the past, but there were a lot of substance abuse issues during that time.

Unfortunately, the substance abuse was replaced by big egos and addictions to lawsuits.

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

It seems that Brian has worked outside the group since KTSA period.

Ascrodin, if Brian's wife and manager decided that a Beach Boys reunion is the next step in Brian's career (aka the last ace up their sleeves), would you be still against it?

How much of a role did substance abuse play during the Holland sessions? I reckon Brian used to be pretty fried during this time, but other than that? Never heard too much about what Dennis was up to around '72. Was he already into drinking heavily around then? I've heard he wasn't even around for most of the sessions. Just wish there was a book or even a documentary film about that whole project... (But then, I'd even buy a book about KTSA in a heartbeat. Come to think of it, now THAT could be quite illuminating.)

What about BB85?


If it means Brian sitting in a back corner of the stage at a piano and being trotted out like a circus bear, then yes.

Damn, I always try to forget about the 1985 album.  :)

Yah, what about it? "Crack at Your Love", "I'm So Lonely", "It's Just a Matter of Time" and "Male Ego". Good question. Why are those songs below Brian's standards? (I believe California Calling is mainly Alan)


Hmm, what are the odds of that happening in 2009? What were the odds that if Brian remarried, he'd suggest Melinda a threesome with Tandyn Almer, give Daria cocaine and have an affair with his sister in law?

People change. Not only Brian.

These days it would probably be a 3-way with David Leaf.

From what I have read about the aborted 95 sessions, Brian was giving as good as he got from Mike.

However, the fact that Brian appears to be pushed into defensive mode around Mike would affect him, not necessarily resulting in bad outcomes -  he might, however, simply think "I can't be bothered."

Families can be hard work ... and I think Brian finds Mike hard work, and possibly has trouble forgetting the many things that have gone on.

Whether you think Brian now makes his decisions about writing partners autonomously depends on how you view his health. We don't know, but there's no indication that anyone pushed Brian into his car to work with VDP, or Scott, or Andy Paley. Perhaps the Joe Thomas link was prompted by outside factors. It certainly seems Brian needs both people around him who are patient and supportive (much as I rate them, do Mike, Bruce and Al fall automatically into that category?) and the ability to work with new collaborators. And with the history of it all, it's unlikely, in my opinion, that Melinda would push Brian beyond his support structure. I'd rather have Brian with a more-than-half-decent solo career than struggle for months with former colleagues, none of whom have been prolific, on a project which would possibly become a real pain in the arse.

I know that there were plans for a Dutch documentary on the 25th anniversary of Holland. Several people involved recording overhere were asked to participate. But the whole project was shelved when it became clear that virtually no Beach Boy involved at the time was interested to cooperate on such a documentary. And when you think of it, 1997/98 maybe wasn't the best moment to get in contact with the group; Carl's illness and passing, Al thrown out of the band, etc (although I do remember that Al might've been the only one at the time that gave it a thought). I think no particular interest from Blondie/Ricky either.
But too bad anyway, as it would've been very interesting.

I've seen several interviews in which BB-members recollect their memories on being in The Netherlands. Pretty superficial perhaps, but always positive. I particularly remember a part of a Dutch "Story of the Beach Boys"-docu from the early 80ies in which Carl recollects his fond memories on living here. And a couple of years ago there was a short docu on the group with memories of some Dutch fans (a few local celebrities and a then-neighbour of Carl in Hilversum). Last year (or was it 2006?) with Brian et al performing in Amsterdam, during the concert Billy Hinsche - the special guest that replaced Al Jardine - also shared his memories on his stay in Holland with the audience.

So - in all - enough people who could fill up easily a very interesting documentary. Again, too bad it never happened.

Do you think that 'Brian Wilson Presents Smile' was a bad idea, then?

No, a great idea... and Smile was originally his idea, with a trusted collaborator, and part of his asserting his right to create on his own terms. Just the release of Smile itself made the reunion less likely I reckon, as it is usually thought of as his project... and he got a big confidence boost from finishing. No internal squabbles this time. I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way, with no disrespect to anyone. If I'm wrong, and there's a reunion with a great new album and candid songs with no rehashing, I'll be delighted, and very surprised.

I don't know, BWPS seems to be more important for David Leaf than Brian. Ok, so a reunion would also be more important for the fans who want it to happen.... But Brian will never be healed or anything like that. At least Sheriff John Stone will be happy, damn it.  :-D


No arguments about that. But the best songs in "Unleash the Love" and "Postcards" are better than the worst in TLOS, so there's always a balance that could be made.

I think if the rest of the Beach Boys agree to be Brian's dutiful servants and everyone has their hearts in the right place, we'll have at least an OK album. Even something like Gettin' in Over My Head with Mike, Al, Bruce and Dave on it would be that much better.

Carl R wrote "I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way."
No. There's unreleased Dennis Wilson music left in the can that's better than anything coming out of Brian's camp. And don't say that isn't new...because Brian's "new music" often isn't new either.

Goin' Home, SMiLE, half of GIOMH, 4 songs from Imagination, for starters.

I absolutely see the point people are making. It depends what you like, but Brian's solo career...

Love and Mercy, Melt Away, Theres So Many, This Song Wants To Sleep, Rio Grande, Must be a Miracle, My Mary Anne, I'm Broke, Lay Down Burden, Getting In Over My Head, Live Let Live, Oxygen to the Brain, Midnight's Another Day ...

theres a lot of tunes there which I think are great. He can and has produced the goods as a solo artist. Once again, I hear what people are saying... there are no consistently brilliant albums, just a splattering of brilliance to a greater or lesser extent.  IMO it beats most of Dennis' work (what I've heard so far, POB mainly) - and that's saying quite a lot.

Close, but no cigar. With the exception of Midnight's Another Day, Brian hasn't been able to capture raw emotion with his voice like Denny could since the SMiLE days. I do like most of Brian's solo stuff (BW88 is an enjoyable listen), but it just doesn't hit me with the same kind of wallop that Dennis' stuff does.

Solo Brian is surrounded by folks who are paid to be his dutiful servants, and yet... Pretending that Brian is the same hands-on guy from 1965 (or 1976) doesn't make it true. It doesn't work, as Leaf'n'Melinda have painfully learned by trial and error.

Obviously it's a case of apples and oranges, but in MY OPINION to think that Brian's post 1980s work is on par with the best (or even not-quite best) of Dennis Wilson's is just ill-informed.

That said, I rather have Mike Love write new lyrics to 'Sunflower'-era outtakes than anyone else.

Everybody sing along...

"My folks have a friend who knows a little old lady..."

It's even unfair to Brian. Just "River Song" destroys any song Brian wrote in the last 30 years.

A better deal could be:

- compare their works from the same year, Brian'77 vs Dennis'77
- compare Brian's first decade as a songwriter ('61-'71) with Dennis' ('68-'78)

More like ALL of GIOMH save A Friend Like you.  HCWSBD is an Imagination Outtake. Soul Searchin, GIOMH, and SMITC are Paley tracks. Fairy Tale (formerly Save The Day aka The Power of Love), You Touched Me (aka So Long), Rainbow Eyes, The Waltz (aka Let's Stick Together) &DLHKSAA are  from Sweet Insanity (and was actually written a few years earlier), and City Blues dates from the hamburger sessions.

Jon - What are the latest sales figures on POB/Bambu?  Is there any movement/talk from BRI/Capitol for a Beach Boys "Dennis" collection yet?  Alan Boyd posted about the 'thought' some months back.

A major part of the Beach Boys' legacy is all those beautiful voices singing together.

Let's face it, Brian's voice is pretty much shot!  It pales in comparison to even his early 90's voice.  Imagine 'TLOS' with Brian's 60s/70/s voice, Carl's voice, Al's voice, some Mike leads.  It would be a mind blower! It would even have sounded a lot better as a 2008 Beach Boys album.

I'd like to see a happy ending to the story.  A live DVD, releases from the archives (there is tons of great stuff), and fun collaborations like what Al is doing, what David is doing (it's Beach Boys together without the pressure).  You could compile that together even for a new Beach Boys album.  Worked pretty well for the Beatles on the 'White Album'.

Worked pretty well for the Beach Boys on 20/20, too.

I believe a lot of Brian's solo work is as good as or better than Dennis's. I must be ill-informed. Wow, the shame I feel.

I don't have any updated sales figures for POB/Bambu, I do think its safe to say that it outperformed whatever sales projections were expected. The number 16 placing on the UK chart blew the minds of a few record execs, as well as the number 8 on the Billboard Internet Sales chart in the U.S. It sold well over 20,000 units worldwide in the first week. Everyone thought the LP would do well as a cult classic, but no one thought it would compete with new pop releases, which it did for a couple weeks there. Once that initial rush subsided it has performed pretty much as expected.

Admitting it to yourself is half the battle. If you need to, find a meeting in your area. There are plenty of examples of Brian solo fans who have not only survived the shame, but have recovered to live productive lives.

I wouldn't call myself such a "Brian solo fan." More a Dennis non-fan. I know I may as well be insulting your mother saying that to you, but it's the truth. Sometimes I like it. A lot of the time I'm ambivalent. Plenty of times I dislike it. Such is life.

Hey Luther --

You can keep "Market Place" and I'll keep "Cocktails" -- and we'll call it good.

My mother and Dennis are both dead...but Brian's Back... again. Truthfully i kind of like TLOS. Its nice to hear Brian singing something with an emotional and compositional quality that surpasses most of his post '88 stuff. And yes, Dennis blows my mind with each new revelation, and 25 years after his death there's still stuff in the can that is among his very best. Wish we could say that about Brian because listening to it would be so much fun...but the cupboard is pretty much bare in comparison.

Of course, part of the reason for that is that Brian's cupboard has been continuously raided for the past 30+ years. Maybe 40, considering the back-material being used from the non-appearance of Smile onward. Conversely, the exact opposite was going on with Dennis from when he began recording to the end of his life, pretty much.

I thought it was from the Paley era. Dancin' the Night Away aka Baywatch Nights.

I'd say that's pretty much the whole reason, which is very frustrating for people like me...considering the underlying reasons are more political than commercial. I can't believe we're hashing this out on a Postcards from California thread.

I'm not too worried about it; it's far from the first thread to go way off topic for a few pages here or there. I'm sure it all makes sense somehow in the big context. Let's see ... vaults raided a la Brian? "Don't Fight the Sea." Ignored talent a la Dennis? Hmmm ... not so much. Postcards From California pretty much shows me Al got what he deserved in terms of songs per album. Or more than he deserved.

Don't you mean '64-'74 as Dennis' first decade? Denny's Drums, anyone?!

Yeah, but was that really Dennis?


Just that one part of the song. The rest is from Imagination or the period immediately after.

That was Dennis, he played on most of the 1964 sessions. Hal did a few but it was really on Summer Days that the Wrecking Crew became more dominent.

If anything, it was at least written by Dennis. I consider it to be his first song. I love Denny's Drums, and if someone considers it to be filler, that's their loss.

I've heard both TLOS and POB countless times and it's my opinion that TLOS is a better album than POB. If you think that means I have bad taste: no problem. But how exactly does that make me ill-informed?

Everyone is entitled to their own subjective opinion. It's comparing apples and oranges, of course.

I feel compelled to add mine: POB (especially with bonus tracks) is a devastatingly melancholy,
sometimes joyous (Rainbows), above all timeless and richly emotional (and completely idiosyn-
cratic and original) slice of ethereal brilliance. TLOS has strong points and is a very good piece of work overall but I don't think it really stacks up favorably against POB.

It's kind of ridiculous to make an attempt at objective judgement in these matters, but there it
is, that's my opinion. Dennis' solo work is almost uniformly excellent, except for much of "Bambu"
when he was palpably deteriorating, but the pieces that were restored to it in the reissue are,
I think, the best things on it, and very powerful. Brian's solo work is a little more inconsistent.

Dennis' music is very intense, some bordering on maudlin, and can be depressing if you're sensitive or just in the wrong mood, but its intrinsic quality can't be denied. :-\

I think it's ill-informed because Dennis Wilson is more than just POB, and POB is the work of a man's life and Brian's post '80s work, although a lot of it is amazing, is churning out product. Although I know there were MANY, MANY, inspired musical moments for him, I do not believe that Brian Wilson -- between 1980 and 2008 -- was ever as passionate about any music he made as Dennis Wilson was from 1975 to 1978 while making POB/BAMBU.

TLOS is, well, LITERALLY an LP cobbled together with trace elements of Brian Wilson. Let's call it for what it is. It's like, imagine if GIOMH was a "grand slam" instead of a "bunt." And it sounds great... and it's as nutritious as a marshmallow peep.

BRIAN'S BACK, SHELTER!!!

As far as Dennis' output, there's a multitude of great stuff from his work with the band (literally everything he did with the BB's is major) -- as well as POB/BAMBU -- and another ton of great unreleased stuff as well. It's MY OPINION that if all of that material was considered against TLOS it would be an insanely comical no-brainer. I guess not. But, like George Harrison sang, "It's all up to what you value."

Apples and oranges: You dig Scotty Bennett. I dig him too. I just dig Dennis Wilson a lot more.  There's room for us all.

Dennis' work remained consistently great in my eyes. not counting the last five years where he was too burnt to do much of anything. He coped with the loss of his voice better then Brian, mainly because he was never a pristine singer but a soulful one. Sure I like his vocals before 1974 or 75 better, but the songs didn't decline whatsoever. In fact he continued to grow as a writer and producer.

Brian...well since 1975 the loss of his voice has hurt his records. Even something like Barbie works for me because he sings it so darn good. He's been professional vocally since he resumed touring, but the singing can't be called spectacular too often. Beyond that though if you take 1975-2008 and average it out the consistency just hasn't been there for me. There have been highlights. Adult Child had some very creative moments and some passion in the big band numbers. The 88 LP and the Paley sessions had some very good compositions. Smile was better then I could of hoped. and so was LOS. Heck even the Xmas LP wasn't too shabby. Yet for every LOS there are five Sweet Insanity's or Beach Boys 85's.

I really do like LOS a lot, to hear an artist his age win over a live audience with new material is something rare and special. On most standards I think LOS is in all ways successful, but if you pin me down and ask me if Brian as good as ever I would have to say no. Dennis while he was an active writer still was able to do things as important as when he first started. Again his vocal damage did hold him back a little, but with rare exception (like say his leads on Love You)  he made it work.

Speaking of Dennis' output, how did the POB/Bambu set do in sales? Enough to possibly make more of a demand for DW?

Speaking of Dennis' vocals in that late 77-78 era, I can think of all his vocals as somewhat of a treasure and how he made them work. Songs like It's trying to Say, My Diane, I wanna pick you Up, Sea Cruise (actually 75-76 era) and Mona

for part of the answer, check page 8 of this thread:
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,6226.msg103167.html#msg103167

Churning out product is often every bit as important--if not more so--than awaiting that damn inspiration that too many people believe in. I prefer the Bob Dylan / Lou Reed / Andy Warhol / Prince / Frank Zappa approach: go to work. Do your work. People who believe themselves to be inspired tend to create overly dramatic sh*t. (Kind of like Dennis often did, in my opinion, which I realize is in a minority.) Music, like all art, is largely craft. Acquired skill. Not just hanging out till some god breathes into you. Now, I'm not saying it isn't beneficial for someone to throw himself into his craft, and if you call that inspired, well, ok. Terminology. But passion only takes you so far, in my book. And I'd rather have a Brian Wilson putting out "cobbled together" albums than Dennis's inspired one. But I don't see the need to call anyone else ill-informed for disagreeing with me. 


Calling all of Dennis's BBs output "major" just means you're the Dennis version of a Brianista, as far as I'm concerned. "It's About Time" is major? It's crap, as far as I'm concerned. And I think similarly of almost all of the Bambu stuff I've heard. Insanely comical no-brainers? I agree. I'd take Brian Wilson's output of the 1970s against Dennis Wilson's, no doubt about it. And I'd say TLOS is right up there near POB in terms of quality: pretty good.

Y'know Luther, there are Beatles fans out there who actually prefer RINGO RAMA to ALL THINGS MUST PASS. Are you a Beatles fan too?

Ahem:

It's About Time is great. Now, carry on, folks.

It's not about preferring Ringo Rama to All Things Must Pass.  

Mike Wheeler (the founder and creator of surfermoon.com) used to hate Dennis'a music with a passion, ESPECIALLY the ballads (he found them to be as sincere as Joey Tribbiani pick up lines). And this was the guy who created the first really good web site on the Beach Boys.

That's right. And there are Beach Boys fans who prefer MIU to BB's Love You. Its a mad mad mad mad world. There's a website I'm forgetting the name...sorry...but it takes all the reviews, from all the major magazines and newspapers, and all the websites and all the professional music critics who have published extensive reviews of a particular release and this website AVERAGES the total score from all of those varied sources.  As I recall POB/Bambu was a clear winner over TLOS last time I checked...and TLOS reviewed really well...it was no slouch...but POB/Bambu got consistently better reviews. But those are just opinions...the opinions of a lot of people whose job it is to evaluate new releases. However, there are some people who just don't dig DW's style or whatever...at least "the stuff they've heard" which usually means they haven't heard much, or they heard it once or twice...or its not Brian so they don't care.

Another thing I've mentioned a few times before...Time does a funny thing to opinions. I remember in 1988 when BW 88 was being touted as on a par with Pet Sounds and Smile...really...by some really respected BB's historians who would turn red at the mention of that now. BWPS...now that was the masterpiece to end all...oh...yeah most people have changed their minds about that and prefer the BB's versions of those songs now. TLOS will be remembered as a good record...just not as good as people thought it was when it first came out. And POB? It only gets more popular and more respected throughout the industry and throughout history as more time goes by. That's just a fact. Love it, hate it, ignore it...doesn't matter. Its bigger now than yesterday, and it will be bigger tomorrow than today...that is what has happened to Pet Sounds, and Smile. The best art grows in stature, the over-hyped art shrivels with time.

Howie: don't be a fucking asshole.

it's a bit disingenuous to say "in my opinion... you know nothing" - reminds me of politicians saying "with all due respect" which kind of means a prelude to  "go f*** yourself"

I don't think anyone is saying POB or Dennis' stuff is rubbish. For me there is a separation - sonically the songs Dennis cut are streets ahead of anything any of the BBs were doing. Funk rock. And nobody would say that Brian's solo career has been particularly innovative.

But I only enjoy Dennis' work in small doses. This may be because I can never be in the right mood.

I'm reminded of Brian's lyrics from melt away:
I won't let you see me suffer
Whoa not me
I won't let you hear me cryin'
Whoa not me
I won't let you see me sighin'
Whoa not me

Landy or not, that has been the difference since 1988 - you're right, in that Brian's put himself into the songs, but hasn't bled into them as Dennis did.

Dennis was a star, underemployed by the band, all of this is true. But the question about both Brian and Dennis is whether they could make it outside the band. It's taken a while, but you can finally argue Brian's solo body of work is building up in quantity and quality.

I've heard GIOMH and WIRWFC called many things, but 'quality' wasn't one of them (excepting on the Bloo, natch).  Brian's solo 'career' has two high peaks (one almost entirely composed of material some 37 years old) while the rest is only of interest to the likes of us.

I'm eagerly awaiting the release of Last Wilson Standing: The Best Of Brian 1987-2008, if only to see what Capitol consider representative of those 21 years.

Yeah yeah yeah... You can go on for hours and you still won't change the fact that I simply enjoy listening to TLOS a little bit more than listening to POB. Or the fact that I listened to TLOS at least twice as much last year. My favorite music is simply the music I enjoy listening to most, no matter how much effort did or didn't go into it. It wouldn't even matter if POB would've been made by two dozen monks who slaved over it  for 16 hours a day for twenty years straight and if TLOS would've been made in five lunch breaks.

If you think I have incredibly bad taste in music: fine, no problem, we're still cool... But if you think that I'm 'ill-informed' because of my taste (I still don't see how that's even possible), I find that somewhat offending.

So who would've thought Mike Love and Flea would be on the same album?

I know you consider Smile one of the two highlights but what do you think is the second?

 ;D

That Lucky Old Sun - I feel it will age far more gracefully than the 1988 album.

Pacific Ocean Blue and That Lucky Old Sun are both great albums!!!

Amen Lance.

I agree Andrew. The 1988 album is good song wise, but I know two casual fans (my girlfriend and a friend in New York) who both think LOS is really good. To me that says something because it reached people who are outside of the real fanbase.

It wouldn't be 'Metacritic.com' by any chance Jon?

http://www.metacritic.com/music/

You'll see that Brian's 'SMiLE' is number one in the 'All Time High Scores', so they must know a thing or two over there ;).

Is it safe to assume you expect this to be a double CD, coupling BWPSMiLE with TLOS, and Rio Grande as a bonus cut?   :lol

And don't forget about Neil Young!

let's see what could be exhumed:

Cd1

Caroline, No
Sherry, She Needs Me (70s version)
Games Two Can Play
Shortnin' Bread
Still I Dream Of It
Lines
It's Over Now
Oh Lord (remastered/recorded)
Yeah
Love and Mercy
Melt Away
Little Children
There's So Many
Meet Me In My Dreams Tonight
Rio Grande edit

CD2

Getting In Over My Head (Paley version)
Proud Mary
You're Still A Mystery
Chain Reaction of Love
Must Be A Miracle
It's Not Easy Being Me
This Song Wants To Sleep With You
Soul Searchin'
My Mary Ann
Lay Down Burden
That Lucky Old Sun/Morning Beat
Good Kind Of Love
Message Man
Live Let Live
Midnight's Another Day


It wouldn't fly off the shelves initially, but...

Nice, but you're outside the dates:

Last Wilson Standing: The Best Of Brian 1987-2008

Oh my God, I am sorry, but Last Wilson Standing is just a terrible title.

That's not so weird. Mike always used to tell that anecdote about singing Good Vibrations on the bus with Buffalo Springfield. Or do you mean Neil Young and Flea? That's not so weird, either.

That's right Metacritic...great site. I don't think its a matter of them knowing a thing or two since its just a compilation of all the major reviews averaged together. To me that's what you call consensus.

http://www.metacritic.com/music/artists/wilsondennis/pacificoceanblue?q=Dennis%20Wilson

From the BBB Board

Re(1): Al's CD

Posted on November 21, 2008 at 02:14:03 AM by Paula Bondi - Springer

Although Al’s new CD has not yet been released, coming soon to aljardine.com, as a concession, Al will offer to the fans that have been so patient a free download of a new Christmas single.

Happy Holidays from all of us at Jardine Tours.

It would include more than a few "Beach Boys covers" from the live albums, and certainly a huge chunk of BWPS too. The idea that it wouldn't, like the list above, is far too unrealistic.
If it contained the title track of OCA, Melt Away and the Wonderful suite from BWPS, I'd buy it definitely.

Agreed Andrew...I love a lot of the songs on BW '88, but the production dates it horribly.  TLOS doesn't sound like it belongs to a particular decade; it has a timeless quality to it I think.

Buddy (Holly) Beware!

"Santa's Goin' to Monterey" ?

...with Stamos on bells! ;D

Jardine Tours? Must be a tough job!

With all the remakes on 'PFC', I'm betting "Little Saint Nick".

Maybe his first early vocals tune from the Christmas BB album? (Christmas Day)

"Christmastime Is Here Again"?

Nah, it's Santa's Got An Airplane of course. Took him 30 years to complete it.

There is some strong hate in this thread. Happy Holidays everyone! :lol

More like complete indifference.

Maybe Santa's gotta Airplane with the H.E.L.P. backing track, because it improves the song that much more!  ::)