The Smiley Smile Message Board

Was listening to Hawthorne CA  today, and I feel that we are reaching a stage of urgency for Wild Honey to be fully mixed into stereo.

But I just gotta ask the people with the know how and a foot in the beach boys camp.

Will this ever happen?

Wild Honey and Darlin should get stereo remixes if a Complete US singles Vol 2 get released!

A state of urgency? I'd like to see it happen, but I think that may be overstatement.

It might happen someday, but you have to keep showing that you're interested in the Beach Boys to EMI.  It probably won't be all-in-one, but more of it might come out on comps, boxsets, etc.  There are some great candidates for remix on WH, for sure.

There's a stereo remix of Country Air out on bootlegs, whose mix it is, I don't know.

On a related topic... it seems that every time Capitol puts out a new compilation, it features new stereo mixes of more Today/Summer Days tracks.  How close are we getting to having stereo mixes of both albums?  I think its just a few more tracks that haven't been remixed yet.

The two albums that most need a stereo remix are Smiley Smile and wild Honey - the mono mixes are really lackluster IMO and good stereo remrixes would prompt many BB fans to reevaluate where they would place those two albums in their greatest albums list.

Unfortunately with the collapsing CD market the only place I can imagine these being released is on itunes!

Can you remember the title of the CD this is on? I can't recall it...

Thanks in anticipation...

It was released on the All This Is That bootleg. To be honest I'm not that big a fan of this mix. In saying that I agree Wild Honey+Smiley Smile need to be mixed in stereo. I especially like the Let The Wind Blow stereo mix. But I still like the mono mixes over the stereo mixes in some cases (eg: Please Let Me Wonder)

An iTunes set of all the albums, with as many as possible in stereo would probably do pretty well.

iTunes? No, no, no... it's got to be tangible, touchie-feelie silver disc, so we can hold it as well as hear it!!!!! To be honest I forget what I've got in iTunes...

 ;D

It took two moves between countries for me to finally give up on physical CDs...when your album collection is scattered across the continent, digital releases start to make a lot of sense.  :P

The 'cover flow' feature definetly helped win me over though...at least I can feel like I'm browsing a physical collection, even if it is a relatively poor substitute for the real thing.

The Beach Boys actually have a pretty nicely designed page on iTunes too.

I vote for tangible CDs. If I want to hear something in iTunes, I'll rip it from my own (extensive) collection.

Agree- these are the two albums that would benefit the most from a remix.  As a complete non-fan of SS, I've love the chance to reevaluate it.


We just need a good nation-wide power surge to wipe out everybody's hard drives.  That'll show 'em!

Until ITunes finally commits 100% to lossless (ALAC in their case), it can never replace the real thing...

Yep.  Itunes will never completely take over until they offer lossless for just about everything in a variety of formats.

Some of the 'unoffical' and 'fan' mixes of the SS/WH stuff that i've heard over the years sound really great, the original albums are so murky sounding (part of the appeal to some I should imagine) and frankly i'd rather hear what was recorded in as best quality sound as there can be - sod purism!
The 'Let the wind blow' remix is so good the rest of the album could be transformed.

I hope this will never happen. Wild Honey is one of my favorite BB records, but compare the stereo remix of Let the wind blow to the mono album version. There's an organ part missing or buried deep in the mix so the original effect isn't there anymore, Carl's vocals are way too loud, the dynamics of the original creation are destroyed. It's rewriting history and not even in a good sense. They obviously put a lot of effort in mixing back in 1967 and it shows. The one thing I would love to hear is the original mix without the technical noises, for example in Country Air or the fade of I'd Love Just Once To See You. But please, stop with those stereo remixes. Please let me wonder + Then I kiss her in stereo also fail to recapture the original magic.

HoneyBee, I understand your view but if you don't like them you aren't forced to buy it or listen to it (if it's on a set like Hawthorne, CA). I do agree with you that some of the stereo mixes fail to reproduce that magic in the original mixes (as I said before Please Let Me Wonder is one of the main ones that I prefer the mono version by a LONG way - not even close) but I still find them interesting listening experiences and of course if I don't like them then I just listen to the original. Easy.

I'd go beyond the stereo and put in a call for more 5.1 mixes. If it can be done with Pet Sounds, then can it not be done for most if not all post-PS releases? I love the Pet Sounds 5.1 and even Imagination comes alive in that format.

I must be in the minority, because I like the stereo mixes for both of those songs, perhaps even better than the mono versions.

I definitely agree at least with respect to "Please Let Me Wonder". It's not perfect (too "wet", etc), but at least the song finally has some bottom end. There is ZERO bass response on the original. That's rare...

Yeah, why would hope that would never happen when you don't have to listen?  Hearing new stereo mixes of Beach Boys tunes has often rescued me from the precipice of depression, so I kind of hope they keep coming.  But if you want me to kill myself, then by all means go protest outside of EMI.


And as I mentioned somewhere else not very long ago, the producers of the stereo remixes have always been very upfront about the intent of them: to present the recordings in a new way.  They have never intended to replace, replicate, or be anything other than an opportunity to consider the recordings in a new light.

And I live for that.


As for 5.1 DVD-A, the popularity of that got so low that it's nearly a dead music format before it started.

I love the 5.1 Pet Sounds, and would have loved the projected Surf's Up one, even without Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again, which was supposed to be added.

I'm with you.

I'm not bashing the remixers, but for me it's like repainting Mona Lisa with 3D effect, removing one eye and then sell it as Leonardo da Vinci's work. Combining two instruments on one channel creates a special sound, just a small separation creates another sound. Let the bees make honey organ missing, that's one eye. The contrasts, expressions of the mono mix are part of the song's identity and in this case not reproducible.

It's not at all like that since those responsible for the remixes have taken pains to explain that they are by no means trying to pass the remixes off as Brian's work.

 
Exactly.



If you miss the organ, listen to the original mono.


I disagree.  Those contrasts and expressions you mention are not part of the song's identity but rather part of the identity of the production peculiar to the original Wild Honey LP mix.  For instance, there are several highly-praised live recordings of "Let The Wind Blow" that lots of fans would take over the LP version.  Is performing a song live taking away an "eye"?  Would a recording of Brian simply singing the song with his own piano accompaniment be an abomination to your ears?

I don't understand the sacrosanct exclusivity that you require.  It would be another matter if the original mono masters were burned and listening to the original mixes were prohibited by law, but they're still there--in print, at your local record store, and presumably nobody's forcing you to listen to the stereo remixes at gunpoint.

So why complain?

I know what you mean aeijtzsche and I also enjoy listening to new stereo remixes of products in process.
This was meant in context of the complete Wild Honey album. I buy an album and then want to hear the untouched message the artists wanted the listener to hear. A recording is more than just a song, it's art. Good Vibrations is still a great song performed on Banjo, no question.
I'm sure most people don't care for such details, just my unchangeable view. :)

That would be a cover.

When Pet Sounds was remixed into stereo, this groundbreaking music was heard in a new and wonderful way.....people complained.

When a few key BB songs made their stereo debuts on some well compiled, uh, compilations new light was shed on the workings of these old favorites....people complained.

When the Beatles Yellow Submarine Songtrack came out with those much needed remixes, some of us stereo fanatics hollered out for more (and still do)..........people complained.

"That's not how I remember it growing up!"    "They ruined the feel of the songs!"  "There's too much reverb!"    "There are instruments missing!"    and on and on.

Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with anyone making observations about remixes.  Heck, I've got a few myself, but they are so minor, they don't ruin my appreciation of what I'm listening to.  I just get a little rattled when some folks seem to imply that the engineer messed up.  Believe me, he knows what he's doing. 

And if these new mixes don't do it for you, like Josh said, nobody's forcing you to buy them. 

I've often seen these two boots claiming to be "stereo" - does anybody know the story??

Link to "stereo" Wild Honey: http://asia.geocities.com/nikjo1818/beach-honey.htm

Link tp "stereo" Smiley Smile: http://asia.geocities.com/nikjo1818/beach-smile.htm

Hmmm.  Never seen those before.  Keep in mind that these two albums were originally marked on the album cover and labels as "stereo", even though they were reprocessed.  I'm wondering if these are simply those fake stereo versions.  The ad mentions it as originally being available as an open reel tape, which would have been the fake stereo version as well.

Hit the nail on the head there.

Yes, these are the "fake stereo" versions that were originally released on LP along with the mono versions.  I believe these were "electronically reprocessed" instead of duophonic - if I remember correctly, duophonic involved one channel having delay/reverb while reprocessed was simply directing the low frequencies (bass) to one channel and high frequencies (treble) to the other.

Hey, I didn't find an answer in this thread, if an answer is somewhere else please post the link.
Is it possible to remix WH into stereo without losing too much of the original tracks?

Broadly speaking, yes.

I also perfer the mono mix of "All I Want To Do"...omg it sounds killer in mono! So much raw energy!!!

As the author of 3 or 4 sparsely-commented on "Beach Boys in 5.1" threads on this here board, I agree with you. I would love to hear more Beach Boys / BW mixed in surround. I love the differences between the Imagination surround mix and the original stereo mix.

Unfortunately, it's not something we're going to see any time soon, at least not on legitimate releases. Surf's Up was scheduled to be released as a DVD-Audio at one point, not to be confused with the "Surf's Up" compilation released circa 2005.

Luckily, there are 5.1 mixes of albums like Surf's Up floating around out there, and they're pretty well done for being unofficial and existing only in my imagination.

b00ts

Strictly speaking, there is no mono mix of "All I Want To Do" - the 'mono' 20/20 released in the UK isn't a pukka mono mix but a simple fold-down of the stereo mix. That is to say, no-one mixed the master in mono from the original 8-tracks.

Beach Boys songs remixed in stereo can be hit or miss, but it's always nice to have them available.  I love Brian's original mono mixes, but on albums like Wild Honey, they can be quite muddy.  Stereo mixes bring out more of the details that are lost in mono mixes, details which are usually really cool to hear. 

I say bring them on whenever technically possible.

Pukka?

Genuine, authentic, proper, etc.

Ahh...okay :lol

That's good. But since the album is so short I guess if there ever will be a release of the whole album it has to be maybe the mono version plus the stereo mix and session outtakes. I'd love that.

Thanks I didnt know that!

You understood that, it's like french to me..

Wish I could talk music  ;D

Tunestony has just posted the following at the Hoffman board:


I think he posts here. If so, Tunestony - any further info on the above?!!

he'll be posting his Linett interview soonish, he mentioned it in another thread.

I just made a thread about this but let's use this one because I made this one too


I'm so happy!!!  ;D

Here comes the Night and Let the wind blow in stereo!!!! ;D   

I tell you, Smile AND a Wild Honey stereo mix?  :thud

Edit: Sorry to get hpes up. This may not be happening according to TunesTony:

Let me clarify, so there's no confusion...

I asked Mark about what was left in the archives, now that SMiLE is coming, and the rarities collections Endless Harmony and Hawthorne, CA have unearthed a lot of things. He mentioned that fans have been clamoring for true stereo mixes of albums that have only been available in mono.

Then he mentioned the recently-found Brian demo of "Surf's Up," which was a result of them archiving the Wild Honey tapes. There were 4 or 5 takes of Brian running through the track at the end of a reel marked for "Country Air."

Because that was all mentioned together, I inferred that they were related. However, after replaying his quote, he didn't specifically say that a Wild Honey stereo mix was next on the agenda.

Sorry, I am new to this board, and don't want to put words in other people's mouth. The interview will be up soon.

Thanks,


Tony

Ah,

Well that was fun while it lasted

Back-pedaling faster than Alan Jardine.  :-D

Exactly what I thought too!  :lol

Yep. Still, it does suggest that stereo mixes of some of the mono albums are at least on their radar.

Hope they try to mix 15 Big Ones properly for the first time as well because Mark Linett has said that album is better on the raw tapes.

The fact that he used the term "first-ever stereo release" still has me wondering if this really is in the works.

The second you mention is already on the Hawthorne CD bro.

My mistake, need to buy that one :P

Oh man, I hope so

There's another option to issuing stereo remixes on silver CD's or iTunes:  hi-def downloads through specialty sites like HDTracks, which boasts the Rolling Stones' Decca catalog, available by track or by album.   Also lots of hi-rez versions of audiophile-recorded albums like Wilco's latest, etc.  That might be one way to do this without incurring all the manufacturing costs.