The Smiley Smile Message Board

I'm aware of brian's feelings towards several other beach boys albums, but i haven't really heard much about what he thinks about these two (in my opinion) great albums. i know that he was barely involved in the recording process, but he must have made comments about what was finally released.

Wasn't his biggest implied comment about CATP So Tough refusing to appear in the centerfold photo?

In the December 1981 San Carlos hotel room clandestine "interview", Brian was asked what his favorite Beach Boys album was...and he replied by naming not one, but two albums...take a wild guess. 

 :p

Umm...Surfin' Safari and MIU?

"Landlocked" and "Adult Child"?

looking back with love and Pacific Ocean Blue?

Yeah that is weird. Even the two guys who are 'interviewing' him seem surprised (I'd guess because of Carl & The Passions)

Ask again in ten minutes and he might have.

I heard him say he wished he would have made Holland sweeter. Basically in Mojo a few years ago he said he wasn't in a good place during Holland but that he loved recording and writing the Fairy Tale. I asked him about Mt. Vernon myself and he told me that he still thinks people should  listen to it in the dark.

He had some rather nice things to say about Al's California in the Warmth of the Sun podcast series. In fact, he seemed very enthusiastic about that song, as opposed to Sail On Sailor, which he funnily enough once introduced at one of his solo shows as "a song I don't like at all".

Questions like these are why we need a "Song By Song" book by Brian which covers the entire BB and solo catalogue.... I'm sure it would shift a few copies.

Isn't it that he doesn't like singing SOS?

I was surprised that Chuck Britz called Holland a piece of crap in that 1993 interview available on YouTube. Ok, from a mastering point of view, I hear some inconsistencies on the California Saga suite f.e., but otherwise, I don't know what his problem was.

I have to say, Holland remains one of my favorite Beachboys albums.

How they fell from that peak so quickly almost certainly must be attributed to drugs.  Simple complacency just doesn't explain it.

Although I enjoy HOLLAND, it is one of the worst-sounding Beach Boys releases from an engineering standpoint (which probably colored Britz's view of it). SMILEY SMILE and WILD HONEY are in that boat, too, but HOLLAND sticks out because it came after three excellent-to-good releases, engineering-wise. I assume the whole "building a studio in Holland" was to blame, but the album's muddiness can be off-putting. The vocal mixing is especially bad ("California" is about the best; "Funky Pretty" the worst). Even the most recent CD reissue has the right channel dropping out at several points during the early portions of the album (although this could be due to simple tape decay). I suppose the haziness of everything has a certain charm, but it's a long way from the sonic brilliance of SUNFLOWER just three years earlier.

It was Murry's death that disoriented the Wilson brothers. Plus Blondie and Ricky left the group, and Mike and Al cashed in on the "Endless Summer"/oldies aspect of the band.

Most of the album was actually recorded (and mixed) in LA.

"It was Murry's death that disoriented the Wilson brothers. Plus Blondie and Ricky left the group, and Mike and Al cashed in on the "Endless Summer"/oldies aspect of the band."

And the change in management.

Whoops, that's right. No more Jack Reiley, which was unfortunate.

Don't forget Dennis and Brian's vocal decline and Brian's ever worsening mental condition.

Or the fact that Blondie and Ricky quit. The Beach Boys could've had a very good follow up album had the rest of the guys been willing to let Dennis produce/direct it. My understanding is that Carl, who was the producer/director of the last few albums wasn't nearly as creative at this time.

I find the mid 70s to be kind of odd that it seems that Dennis was perhaps the most responsible Beach Boy at the time!!

Endless Summer (1974) didnt come out til nearly two years after they recorded Holland (late 72?). And didn't Murry die at the end of 1973? That leaves a whole year wasted.

Let's not forget the whole "brian is back" fiasco.

IMHO, by Holland the BBs had become a mature and credible modern rock band without Brian's (dominating) influence. They were a viable and valid live act and were something of a cult band at this point. They could have coasted (in the best sense of the word) on this for a few more years and turned out some amazing stuff. But Riley left and Brian was forced back and then Endless Summer and then........ and then....... and then.....

I think Carl needed to work with someone and, for whatever reason, he was most successful - and the results more 'mature' - when he was writing with Rieley.  I don't mind some of his later stuff, but the only one outside of this period that really grabs me is Angel, Come Home.

I believe the main reason was Endless Summer. By making that album such a hit, the mainstream public basically told the band that they prefered them as an oldies jukebox and that they didn't really care for new material. Or at least that's how the BB seem to have interpreted it.

those are tape dropouts caused by deterioration of the master they used on the 2000 CD reissue.  the dropouts appear sproadically through "Big Sur" and "Beaks Of Eagles".  the original vinyl does not have this issue.  not sure if the 1991 CD reissue iss affected or not.  1970s-era tapes are notorious for having "sticky-shed" syndrome, which is essentially the backcoating of the tape turning to liquid.  the tapes then have to be baked in order to be played through and are fairly fragile from that point on.  This occurred with Ampex 456 (as well as some others), which was industry standard.  i don't know what brand tapes were used for HOLLAND. 

I thought as much and probably shouldn't have included tape deterioration among my complaints of the original engineering! Ampex seems to have had some major problems during the 70s/80s. I work in video production and used Ampex videotape briefly in the mid-80s only to discover major dropout and playback issues within the space of a year. I switched back to the Sony brand pronto!

Ummm...every vinyl copy of "Holland" I've heard has those exact same drop-outs, including an original issue with the EP picture sleeve...

Another Warner/Reprise LP with the same problem is the 1975 Fleetwood Mac album...cut one, "Monday Morning"...

Personally I think the engineering was not that good on So Tough or Holland - Stephen Desper not being there is the most likely culprit IMO.

i'll have to listen to my original U.S. vinyl copy again.  The vinyl copy i used to play the most was an original German import and did not have the dropouts.  weird.

Is there a song called "We Got Love" on it or "Steamboat" listed as first song on the label.  :-D