The Smiley Smile Message Board

I don't know how true it is, but I remember reading somewhere that Bruce was witness to a murder or something along those lines. Does anyone have any info on this (if it did indeed happen), like what were the details around the murder.. like what exactly happened, where and when was it, who was the murderer and the victim etc..? Sorry if this is totally wrong, but it's just what I remember reading ages ago.

I'd have to dig out Brad Elliott's interview with Bruce from a 1981 Goldmine issue for the exact details, but yeah it's true.  Bruce was sitting outside the office of some music biz bigwig, waiting for a meeting, when another guy walked into the man's office and shot him dead.  This was prior to Bruce becoming a Beach Boy, maybe even late '50s or very early '60s.

I'm sure Bruce said it was his "first day in the business".

Details in Barney Hoskyn's Waiting For The Sun.

February 2nd, 1958 -  a fifteen-year-old Bruce & Sandy Nelson go to 'Big' John Dolphin's office on S. Berendo Ave. to play him a song of theirs. As they wait, one Percy Ivy, a songwriter, goes into Dolphin's office to collect his royalties (as well as owning Dolphin's of Hollywood record store on Central Ave., Dolphin also ran such labels as Cash, Money & Lucky) and, after a presumably unproductive discussion, shoots Dolphin dead (admittedly, after Dolphin had pulled a switchblade on him).

Yikes.

Yeah...the music biz has been dangerous even decades before gangsta rap!

Check "The Death of John Dolphin" at:

http://rockinsteve.wordpress.com/

Nelson recalled that when he returned with the police to Dolphin’s office, Johnston was making a deal with Ivy to have some songs recorded when he got released from prison.

I don't know why this part strikes me as absurdly funny, but it does.

Good...I'm not the only one!  Just seems too bizarre to picture Bruce (or anyone) carrying on per schedule, oblivious to the rigor mortis behind the desk and the smoking gun! Almost Monty Pythonesque, no?

Would the Rudy Ray Moore in the story be the artist also known as Dolomite?

I'd say... when you're in the same room as a guy who's just shot someone dead and is still holding a smoking gun, you'll say anything he might want to hear.  ;D

Andrew that's a good point. I would of run the hell out myself.

Has Bruce ever commented on witnessing John Dolphins murder? I know in Dominic Priore's book it mentions it but that book is dubious and has one of the worst fact checks ever! It says the singer Percy Mayfield killed Dolphin when it was really an employee of the store Percy Ivy!!

I asked him about it once, years ago, and his reply was along the lines of "when you're in a room with a guy holding a gun and there's a body on the floor, you'll agree to anything he says !"

Haha I can just picture this being Bruce's response  :lol

Bruce recalled the events, at least, to interviewer John Ingham in 1974, and then 16 years later when he appeared on Art Fein's Poker Place, so sayeth Stephen J McParland in The Beach Boys 1961 - 1963, Inception and Conception, From Hite Morgan to Nick Venet.

You can buy an e-copy (locked PDF) from his website.

Slightly OT, and I'm not on his payroll, but SJMcP has done sterling work in documenting the early musical surfin'/car/beach scene in SoCal: I recommend his books, with the caveat that the 1961-63  one mentioned below has, of course, been superseded  by Jim Murphy's outstanding new volume on those very same years (I'm not on his payroll either).

He's also Gary Usher's biographer and, I believe, executor, a fact that enabled me to confirm that a (former) friend had, as I suspected, been lying his balls off concerning his contact with Usher. There was no contact at all. My, but there's some lowlifes in the BB fan world...

Thanks, Andrew - I've ordered Jim's book and am really looking forward to reading it.  As you say, Stephen's work is "sterling" + the prices Stephen is asking for the e-copies are a fuckin' bargain - A

I'm very confused. I have never heard of this before. What happened?

Bruce also discussed this (he brought it up himself) in his interview with Brad Elliott for Goldmine in 1981.

Never heard about it either. here's some inof I just found on the net:

https://rockinsteve.wordpress.com/2007/08/29/the-death-of-john-dolphin/

Bruce was 15, and from a sheltered background, but apparently took it all in stride -- even proposing a record deal with the killer while they chatted and waited for the police.

Bruce was there at the founding of the white LA rock n roll scene with Phil Spector, Kim Fowley, Sandy Nelson, Jan Berry. He'd have fascinating stories to tell if he'd ever join Mike and Brian in writing a memoir.

How 'bout searching 1st before making another topic? All you do is just type "Bruce murder": http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,5260.0.html

Altho, this should of been posed in the Thread for insignificant questions (and many latest threads).

Why do you think you should be the arbiter of where a thread is posted?  Last I checked you were just another nobody

Should I ask your permission what I should say? Mind your own business (c).

Essentially, posting is everyone's business, so I was and did mind my own business.

 For the record, yes, you should ask my permission.( please do so in the future)  Especially as you're so fond of chiding other posters for what they post

Sorry I didn't realise it bothered you so much.....

I said that to return the favor, hence the (c).

SurferDownUnder, you made this thread to know if Bruce commented on the story. It's a mere question that requires a single answer. Looking at your account info, you signed up this year but have already posted on the Thread for insignificant questions. The original post belongs there. If you wanted to know more - for that reason this board has enormous archive that you can go read anytime. Look at the link I brought - it's basically the same answers. Nothing new. It isn't against the rules to revive an old thread. Recent examples:

- BB/BW music in movies
- BB Historical sites
- Carolyn Williams.

Each garnered few new responses. Reasons to post on an old thread are to add sth. new, ask about some quote if it's true/happened for real, to clarify some statement, just agree with smb. or start discussion. That's what search function is for. That, & learn more about the band. Most everyone here started as a lurker - as we couldn't contribute, we read on. Some of us still do. What I'm getting at is it would suffice to read an old thread on the subject you've been curious about instead of starting new one. There is a stickied thread in the Sandbox where we spoke of this - reviving vs. new thread & most people agreed that the former is better. And you have to understand that with all these new threads, the other ones go several pages back. "May" is relatively recent, yet it's gone far back. Some posters can't cope with the threads coming up on a near-daily basis.

Finally, don't feel like you're not welcome. This is usual thing on the board. We're just helping newbies. Pretty Funky, John Manning, guitarfool2002 etc. - all linked to an already existing thread before. Moderators can't check everything, anyone can give advice to a fellow poster.

That's you told.

I seem to have a rival in the arrogance and condescension department.  :-D

SurferDownUnder:  You've been schooled!  Welcome to the gang.... ::)

Well I finally feel like one of the family  :lol

If the Beach Boys were stars of a series of mystery novels, a la the Hardy Boys, "Bruce And The Murder" would be a perfect title for book number 7, because that's what number he is in the Beach Boys chronology.

Volume 5 of the Beach Boys Mysteries series would feature Al: "the Mystery of the Airplane Lavatory"

Volume 4: Mike and the F***ing of the Formula?

Volume 6: Murry and the case of Dave not carrying his equipment.

Volume 3: "The Wilson Boys and the Mystery of Whose My Daddy"

The Diamond Necklace Played the Pawn : a Van Dyke Parks Mystery.

The Uncovering of the Cornfield
Volume 1: The Crow Cried at Dawn


(not sure who Dawn is, but she must have had it coming!)    :lol

Pretty as a midsummer's morn,  They call her Dawn

I gotta say, the title of this thread is hilarious

Bruce is not all Disney Girls and Barry Manilow.
he has a dark side.  and a past

Maybe take off the blinkers & read my post again? What I said was fair, polite & raised many good points. Can't deny it, anyone who has decent reading skills.
I explained to SurferDownUnder mentioning that this question should instead be posted in the Thread for insignificant questions or continued in an old thread on the same subject. What's so difficult to follow this advice, really? It's a common thing here, another recent example is "Carl's grave". Or "Keep It Clean with Al Jardine T-shirt" one.

So take my advice, SurferDownUnder.
I was really surprised to read these weird strong reactions to my post. Like I said sth. really offensive? Funny folk.

It's all good, no problems anyway as far as I can see, point taken  :)

Wow, I didn't know we had a new Moderator!

Volume 10: "Brian and the Case of the Padlocked Refrigerator"

AND

Volume 11: "Marilyn and the missing Peanut Butter from the Fridge"

I've been around this and related boards for more years than I like to admit but it is always good to rehash some long archived topic of interest.    I still ,  hard to believe, don't know every detail of the band and these people.    and I seldom read archives.     sure, some topics are painfully redundant but on occasion, someone brings up a juicy forgotten detail that resonates with more recent topics.   

Volume 12: Al and the Missing Bus.

Agreed.

how did we miss

Volume 2:  "The Hardy Wilson Boys and the Mystery of the First Tours"

Featuring a prologue by Shaun Cassidy interpreting the lyrics to Surfin' USA.

Short story compilation including:
"How Murry Two Stepped Side Stepped it"
"A New Hat for Mike" (frequently cited as Cr. Seuss's inspiration for the Cat in the Hat)
"TM^TM"
and the super popular
"One Vibe, Two Vibes, Bad Vibes, Good Vibes"

It's like heaven.

by about this time Al began to dominate the series.

Volume 13:  "Alan and the Mystery of the Missing Molar"

Volume 14:  Who Murdered Smile?

I will refrain from naming names (don't want to put out any spoilers...you've got to read the book!), but there were one or two suspects, or at least accessories to the murder.  Let's just say they were persons of interest. 

But then we have a testimony from the individual closest to Smile, who claims it was suicide.

However, just a few months after the incident, Smile reappears in disguise, using the name.....Smiley Smile.  Was this the actual Smile....or an impostor!  (Dunt dunt dunnnnnnnnnt!)   

You be the judge.

Over time many begin to believe that perhaps Smile had never existed in the first place.  But then, the plot thickens when body parts of Smile begin to appear a few years later suggesting....dismemberment!  And many years later, Smile appears once again incognito bearing the initials BWPS.   Hmmm!  Once again, you be the judge.

In 2011 forensic evidence that had been circulating underground for many years (save a few tidbits that were brought to light on a boxed set in the early '90s) was published, pretty much in its entirety, officially proving that Smile was real although the actual case of the events of 1967 remains unsolved.

remember when you could read a thread and it was actually pertinent to the title? 

Yeah, me neither

yes, a huge flock of birds darting about in free flight in unison following a mysterious path to a better place;

or a bird in a cage.

- prefer the former  (thread title aside)

Is 'Murder' not in the title?

Gee ,I'm really disappointed that this hasn't been turned into "Mike and the Murder" yet.

Kim Fowley had some interesting things to add to this topic in an interview reproduced posthumously in UnCut (? it has Joni M. on the cover) but I'm not sure how reliable he was in the information department...

Gets hard to sort out where to respond

Percy Ivy should have walked out of there. His hostage would have been the son of the President of Rexall. Should have given him some leverage for cash and a getaway car!

This is from a 1972 interview with Kim Fowley by Richard Williams for Melody Maker, as reproduced in Uncut of April 2015.    

"One day we [The Sleepwalkers] got courageous and decided to make our first record, so we went down to Dolphin's of Hollywood----John Dolphin was the man who wrote "Buzz Buzz Buzz" for The Hollywood Flames [a Murry connection!].
"We were sitting there trembling in our schoolboy boots, when one of their songwriters [Percy Ivy] came in and killed Dolphin right in front of us. ...
"Everybody was scrambling around, there was blood all over the floor, and the guy was dying. Bruce, being a songwriter, went up to him and said, 'Well, I think it's a good idea if you tell me how you feel. I mean, it's your last minute, isn't it.' For a song, you understand. He wasn't being horrible... he was genuinely interested in what a dying man had to say.
"The guy was rapping and Bruce was listening and saying 'Far out...' and then he died. I think we all realised then that rock'n'roll did have its outlaw characteristics."  

Seriously? A man is dying in front of him and his only impulse is to try and get some material out of it? I never had anything against Bruce, but man, I just find that repulsive.

Kim Fowley lied all the time. To paraphrase Mary McCarthy, everything he says is a lie, including "and" and "the."

All you need to know about Kim Fowley:

http://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/the-lost-girls/

Exactly. He also ripped off a number of musicians.

No way Andrew, you're still the tops around these parts!!