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Is the version of Cabinessence from 20/20 sequenced as it was intended in 66/67 or did they put the Home on the Range/Who Ran the iron Horse/Grand Coulee Dam bits together in 1968, i.e perhaps those bits were separate songs previously? The Keith Badman book suggests this (p. 231 Nov 20th 68) but if they were separate songs it surprises me that BW or the BBs would make the effort to combine these pieces into a cohesive song unless it was obvious that Brian intended it that way during the Smile sessions. I mean, why not work on Surf's up or CIFOTM instead of something that is ostensibly 3 separate songs. If anyone can put me straight on this it'd me much appreciated.

It was intended to be in the released sequence. Contemporary acetates bear that out.

PLUS, the vocals are of 1966 vintage, but were given the ol' ADT (Artificial Double-Tracking) by Desper and Carl in 1968.

Thanks - I really thought the verse vocals were freshly recorded in 68. I don't doubt what you're saying but out of curiosity, how do you know that they are 66 vocals?

One of my favorite songs in the world.

I think it is the absolute perfect recording, performance, and song.

Such a beautiful song, with beautiful words, and beautiful sounds.

Mr. Desper said so, I believe. I forget who exactly, but I have a pretty good idea it was Stephen.

Thank you all for the info. Yes I too think it's beautiful the Grand Coulee bit at the end just blows my mind. I never tire of this song but that's true for so much of the Smile stuff. I can't work out if I'm obsessed or if it's because it's incomplete or if it's just because it's beautiful music. I think if it was completed in 67 it would not be such compelling music. That's probably another thread though ...

Does anyone know what prompted Dennis to add the "secret" lyrics underneath "Who Ran the Iron Horse"?

In recent interviews, Brian has said that they were totally Dennis's effort, Brian had nothing to do with it--and not even Brian knows what it was all about.

Interesting that Brian would let someone other than himself or Van Dyke Parks make such a notable contribution to the Smile-related material, especially back then.

The "truck drivin' man" lyrics, as far as I know, are a 1968 addition...maybe Carl's idea?  I'd be interested to know more about this as well...

Dennis said that Brian wrote that bit for him.

Always understood they were Van Dyke's lyrics. Do they look like BW words ?

Don't think so...

Doesn't the Frank Holmes artwork have references to these lyrics? They must be from 66/67.

Those lyrics don't strike me as being Van Dyke Parksish at all, especially in comparison to the rest of the song.  They don't fit in with the Cabin Essence lyrics, so I doubt Brian or Van Dyke would've written them.

The artwork that references these lyrics dates from the late 90s/early 2000s.

Well, I think they kinda fit with the truck being the "modern" iron horse....

Now, don't forget that Mike Vosse interview, where he describes his impressions of the new Cabinessence vs. what he knew it as in 1966.

Those are 1966 vintage as well. Surviving tapes indicate this.

As far as I can determine there's no evidence that Carl or anyone else recorded a verse vocal for this in 66/67 - the session tapes and mixes from 66 indicate there was no lead verse vocal, and we don't have any record of any further vocal sessions after 66 until the 20/20 period.  There might be some clues in the multitrack tape as to when things were done but that's missing - only the stereo mixdown is extant according to Alan Boyd.

The verse vocals were recorded in 1966, but were never mixed down. The bootlegs we have are taken from mix tapes made in December 1966, and Brian had not yet mixed down the lead vocals. The chorus vocals (including the Truck Drivin' Man section) and the tag vocals had been mixed down early on. Brian had all the pieces in a jumble, but Carl put them together. There is a December 1966 acetate doing the rounds that features the same structure as the released version, but does not feature the mixed-down lead vocals. But I have it on good authority (Steve Desper) that they were recorded.

I think Stephen may be mistaken - why go to the trouble of recording the lead vocal and not mix it down, when all the other pieces were mixed down?  His memory is good but not infallible.  And he was not the recording engineer on the Smile sessions - he only stepped in for some of SMiley at the home studio when the engineer they had been using was ill.

Maybe Brian had bigger plans for Cabinessence, didn't know what he was going to do with the track and he just brushed it aside for later. Obviously, he never returned to it, since soon afterwards he devoted himself full-time to Heroes and Villains. The verse vocals on the released version were the victim of ADT (Artificial Double-Tracking), which leads me to believe that what was recorded in 1966 might just have been a guide to be replaced later. If this is the case, it was obviously never replaced and Carl decided that the ADT was the best solution. Plus too, if this guide vocal theory of mine is true, what a guide vocal Carl put down.

I'd hazard that lead vocals were recorded for Cabinessence but were wiped, as they were for most other Smile songs.

Guys, I've asked Mr. Desper about the issue of Carl's lead vocal, he said it was too far back for him to remember, but he said he wasn't certain that it was a 1966 vocal. His memory is a little shaky, but I believe him.

Maybe my info isn't as good as I thought.....Andrew, can you help a brother out?

I've recently been pondering the verse vocals to Cabinessence and I have a hunch they were added in 68 and the above post would seem to suggest this.

Is there any new info on when these vocals were added? As far as I'm aware none of the booted versions of Cabinessence feature the verse vocals.

They seem extremely Parks-ian to me.

"I'm a gas man....I don't believe I got to grieve, I'm out of luck with a buck and a booth"....sounds like Dennis to me.

Catchin' on to the truth
In the vast past, the last gasp
In the land, in the dust, trust that you must
Catch as catch can

but these sound like something from Surf's Up. My money's on VDP

Those lyrics were written by Banana. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

I agree completely...it's the internal rhymes that give it away really.  No Beach Boy was capable of writing lyrics like that.

Can anybody post the exact lyrics for that section? I can't quite make them out, even with the part isolated.

This ain't impossible
This ain't improbable
You are my baby tonight
And I'm your daddy
This ain't believable
This ain't predictable
You are my baby tonight
And I'm your daddy

Truck driving man, do what you can
High-tail your load off the road
Out of night life it's a gas man
I don't believe, I gotta grieve
In and out of luck, with a buck and a booth
Catchin' on to the truth
In the vast past, the last gasp
In the land, in the dust, trust that you must, catch as catch can!

If those lyrics didn't sprout form the brain of Van Dyke Parks I'll personally eat my copy of 20/20.

Ummm, what the feck?  ???

So where the hell does the following fit in?..

    Reconnected telephone direct
    dialing;
    Different color cords to your
    Extension,
    Don’t forget to mention
    This is a recording.’

    ‘Even though the echoes through
    my mind
    Have filtered through the pines,
    I came and found my peace,
    And this is not a recording.’

   “Doobie doo,
    Doobie doo,
    Or not doobie!’

Were these lyrics ever even recorded?

I'm pretty sure those weren't recorded; then again, maybe they were during a 'lost' vocal session. The odd thing about those is, I have no idea where they would fit. They don't match up with the rhythm of the other vocals.

Classic move Runners.

I just listened to the song while reading these lyrics, and was blown away at how these were there all along, but never properly heard by me until now.

Are these lyrics a fan's deciphering, or from some sort of official source?

-Ben

Might these have been intended for the first Iron Horse chorus?   Since it is the second that contains Truck Drivin' Man?   I wish they'd been recorded (if they actually were not) because they're pretty cool.

I have a feeling that those alternate lyrics were from the very early days of the song being composed. It's probably from a melody that was scrapped in the demo stages.

I thought this might be the case, too. If we had never heard the "Truck drivin' man" vocal but had just the lyrics, we'd be wondering where in the foda it fit in, too - the rhythm, syncopation, and melody are all really weird with it. That's why I think it could have been either intended for the first chorus or possibly an alternate for the 2nd.

You may very well be right, but I have another theory.  Perhaps the lyrics belonged to another section that Brian wrote for the song, which he later discarded before it was ever recorded?  Maybe he dropped the section after deciding that the sequence of verse/chorus/verse/chorus/fade was the best, or that adding in another section would make the song too long.  We all know how much he tinkered with Good Vibrations and Heroes, coming up with endless sections and variations, so the idea of another Cabinessence section isn't too far out there I don't think.

The reason I suggest that theory is that to me, the lyrics don't seem to fit anywhere else.  Even if you could somehow sing them over the first chorus (which would be a challenge rhythmically, it would appear), I can't imagine Brian doing that.  What makes the countermelody in that second chorus so special is the fact that it's only done for the second chorus, not both.  Doing the first chorus 'normally" is the best way to set up the variation in the second.  Just my opinion, anyways.  In reality, we'll probably never know.

Or, a section he discarded AFTER he recorded it - the Oct. 11th session with 7 musicians does not match up with any of the released "sections" of the song, which were recorded Oct. 3rd.  So Brian may have recorded the music for this section - a bridge - but it was either wiped or lost as it's not in the Beach Boys tape archive.

These lyrics were important enough for Frank Holmes to incude them as part of his artwork for "Cabin Essence - Lost and found, you still remain there"

In the Dominic Priore book, Frank Holmes mentions the above lyrics and mentions that the Telephone cords in the artwork and also the electric plug going into the cloud make reference to this passage..

It would be great to ask Van Dyke these sorts of questions.  Where these lyrics might have gone, or this section, etc.  He might remember (assuming he wrote the lyrics).  Does anyone here know Van Dyke well enough to ask?

Sorry for reviving such an old thread but I think this is ripe for a lot more discussion. I was about to start a thread asking this exact thing. I am still really wondering if Carl's vocal was from 1966 or not. Apparently there was an overdub in 1968, so I wonder if that's a completely new vocal from that time, did Carl just remember it from when he sang it with Brian in '66? Or was there an existing tape with the exact lead vocal and Carl recreated it? Or the 1968 overdub session was merely just putting the sections together and just ADT'd what he already did? So many questions and I haven't been able to read much info about the authenticity of the 20/20 version of Cabinessence.

It's been over 6 years, so new info may have come out.  Good question

Alas, Carl would have been the person to ask. Vocal sessions were clearly held in '68 which allowed the track to be released, and the common (and still reigning, to my knowledge) assumption was that Carl laid down lead vocal for "Home on the Range" and Dennis added his "Iron Horse" counterpoint at that time. IIRC "Iron Horse" vocals, "doings" for "Home on the Range," and all of the "Grand Coulee" section were in place in December '66 when the sh*t hit the fan over Van's lyrics.

Fixed that for you :)

yes and Dennis described the song as about a 'funky cat up in the woods with his chick'

VDP said it came out different to what they initially had

they definitely cut it together as we know it in '66 but I think when written it may have been different - as happened with H&V

I've wondered if TTGA may have used up some discarded bits of CE - I think it and the chorus of CE are walz-time..?

The verses in the released version are still about a "funky cat up in the woods with his chick." It's a very sensual lyric (and performance by Carl): "nestle in a kiss below there..."

Excellent point, Maggie. And the "Home on the Range" part is only one slice of the song. The impressionistic tone-poem aspect of "Cabinessence," where such completely separate segments snap together like a suite, is what makes it (and, related approach-wise but different in detailed deployment, "Surf's Up," "Heroes and Villains," "Wind Chimes") such a densely packed collision of musical elements.

What I've never seen discussed by those who were there was the compositional sequence of the musical pieces that form the completed version of "Cabinessence." Dennis' description sounds like it's meant to reference "Home on the Range," and it seems to be a perfectly acceptable description, late sixties hip-speak notwithstanding.

I do not recall Paul Williams or anyone else specifically asking David Anderle which piece of "Cabinessence" came first. We heard a lot about "little fragments" and "feels", etc., etc., in this time--including quotes by Mike Love--but we don't know exactly HOW the track took the shape it did. The session tapes we have seem to indicate that the sections were put into the order that is now the accepted flow of the song by the time it was brought into the studio for the Wrecking Crew to tackle, however.

By October 3rd the verse/chorus/verse/chorus/fade sequence was in place, however contemporary accounts and later accounts by the Vosse Posse indicate that Home on the Range may have been a separate song from "Who Ran the Iron Horse" earlier and they were combined. 

As far as the vocals we do know that the lead Carl verse vocal and the Dennis truck driving man vocals were recorded in 1968 for 20/20 - see Craig's sessionography for Smile Sessions.  Nov 20th I believe?  If there were vocals recorded in 1966, they most likely would have ended up on an acetate or tape, as there are multiple mixes of the verse with backing vocals ("doing doing doing"), the chorus Who Ran, and the fade with and without the Mike lead vocal and backing vocals.  Plus edits of the sections.  Surely if a lead had been recorded it would appear on one of these edits/mixes.  So just like there is no verse vocal on Worms but chorus vocals and fade vocals appear complete, the same goes for Cabinessence.  That's what's so frustrating about Smile - it wouldn't have taken much work to complete those songs in 1966, two vocal sessions, but Brian got distracted with Heroes and then Vegetables in the search for a single to follow GV.

The lyrics Holmes used were from lyric sheets provided to him by Van Dyke, many before the songs had been recorded, which explains the "telephone/recording" lyrics never appearing although there may have been another section as I mentioned above recorded Oct 11th to fit those lyrics.  The tape's missing.  Wouldn't that be something if that tape were found with a Brian guide vocal of those lyrics?

I think the Telephone Reconnect lyrics go over the 1st chorus. And I assume that and Truck Drivin' Man were meant as lead vocals for the chorus'. Look at when the lyrics start:

"Who Ran the Iron Horse?
Truck Drivin' Man, do what you can."

You get to hear what they're saying in the background first, then Dennis comes in with the raps.

Btw, I'd imagine Cabin Essence was vocally completed in '66. More than enough long-hours sessions spent on it.

I'd love to hear those '66 acetates where it specifically goes: Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus-Tag
Everything from '66 I've heard goes: Verse-Chorus-Tag-Verse-Chorus
Most people who heard it in '66 remember the tag in the middle too. (I say most people, but I think only Vosse did say that)

I'd imagine the 20/20 version is still the final order, but maybe not. I don't think that really matters as much. There's bigger questions to ask.
Vosse and Anderle both claimed that Cabin Essence connected with Do You Like Worms (Iron Horse and Bicycle Rider). Sure, the song might be: Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus-Tag, but would those long pauses be interrupted by anything? It's like Rio Grande. You could slam the Elements in the middle of this.

It's entirely possible that it was like that at some point--assuming we could be sure that "the Elements" were underway in October 1966, which really doesn't seem to be the case. More likely Brian created these "feels" or "extended riff sequences" and started a jig-saw process with them. But the fact that Van was writing lyrics to superimposed over the "chants" ("Horse," "Worms") indicates that they were trying to create densely-packed songs, which was were Brian was immediately coming from with "Good Vibrations."

So I'm leery of the idea that in October-December he was writing long-form. I think that came about with "Heroes & Villains," and that's where things took a trip down the looking glass.

Why would you say that when the Smile Sessions sessionography states otherwise?

They held 4 vocal sessions for Cabin Essence. October 11th & 12th. December 6th and 17th. Those sessions were hours long. They got the insane background vocals done, why stop then when all you have to do is double track a fairly simple lead vocal? It just doesn't make since.

Lots of sessions doesn't mean a lead vocal was recorded - Brian was a perfectionist and he could have been, in fact apparently was, recording and rerecording and overdubbing backing vocals and the tag lead vocal.  No evidence whatsoever of the verse lead being recorded.  There's another reason why the lead might not have been recorded - Dec 6 was the blow up over the lyrics of the tag with Mr. Love casting shade on Van Dyke.  There's much about the Smile project that doesn't make sense - the Worms verse vocals not being recorded, Heroes constantly changing its structure and swapping out sections and borrowing sections from other songs, Surfs Up remaining unfinished, not putting the pieces of the Smile April Vegetables together as everything necessary to complete the song had been recorded, etc. 

Yeah thats true. I just find it hard to buy. The way I see it; We're missing it, that's why it exists. You have to work with that kind of logic because we do not contain one finished piece of Smile material. Not one finalized, fully recorded and produced song has survived. We shouldn't assume Brian never finished anything because of that. That's too superficial.


Probably not. In the end, Mike Love sang the vocal. So that should prove to us that resistance wasn't an issue (as long as Van Dyke was there for support/defense). It's interesting you mention the lead Grand Coolie vocals were recorded on the 6th... By then the Iron Horse vocals were recorded. So then what was left to sing on the 17th? It couldn't've taken them over 3 hours for the Doings in the verses...


On the surface it might not make sense. But thoughtful observation helps. Heroes changing its structure is Brian reworking it. Heroes swapping out sections is Brian reinventing it. Heroes borrowing sections from other songs is a revelation to the bigger suite encompassing those songs and their sections. There's two sides to every Smile.
 
Surf's Up basically was finished (vocally I'm not so sure). The April version of Vegetables was put together. It was mixed down by Brian on April 14th. Why it wasn't released, I have no clue.

Just because Mike sang that vocal part (and very well, I might add), that does not at all translate to your statement "that should prove to us that resistance wasn't an issue"... we have NO idea how much the repeated resistance could have broken down Brian's confidence and mental well-being, and could very well have had untold consequences when coupled with all the other crap he was bogged down with at the time.

It's not an absurd thought that a highly sensitive person under immense pressure, entangled in a dysfunctional family relationship could lose their footing on a song or project in part due to resistance. It could have caused Brian to procrastinate more on finishing that song - at minimum. Van Dyke himself said that he left the project at the time when he saw how DEEPLY entangled with decades-old previous family drama/guilt trips the band dynamic was at that point, right in the aftermath of being harangued by Mike over the lyrics to this very song.

Sorry for the rant, but it gets tiring hearing people trying to minimize what the potential for a cumulative effect of a bandmate's bad attitude and probable lack of tact - even if said bandmate eventually does his job - could have on a fragile person under pressure. I say that to you respectfully. This wasn't some ineffectual instance of a 1966 Al Jardine toothlessly expressing displeasure. This was Mike, who knew how to push buttons and get what he wanted out of his cousin. And in hindsight, what a dumb, dumb, dumb ego-driven move on Mike's part. The lyrics were great, are widely thought of as awesome, and were in no need of questioning.  

History is not on Mike's side. And he's just as mistaken and tactless about it in present day, mocking the Summer's Gone lyrics in a shockingly tasteless manner. Continually giving the screwjob to Brian's best material for the band (or doing things that put said material at great risk). Continually proving Jack Rieley's quote correct. Ugh. </rant>

But damn, I do wish Van had stuck up against Mike. I wonder what would have happened if they attempted to solve the manner with fisticuffs?

April version of Vegetables was never put together at least not by Brian.  He mixed some sections of the song but no finished song was edited and mixed out of all the sections recorded.  Please post the finished April version if you have access to something the rest of us don't, including Alan and Mark.

"We're missing it that's why it exists" - is it only me that finds this makes no sense?  Missing something doesn't mean it exists, it is' evidence to the contrary.  You have no evidence that a vocal was recorded for the verse of Cabinessence, the evidence (acetates, tapes, partial mixes) is to the contrary.  just because you want something to exist or even that you believe it should exist doesn't make it so.

The blow up over the lyrics is interesting because apparently the tag vocal was recorded BEFORE Dec 6th - C-man posted about this previously.  Because he sang it (Mike had precious few leads on the Smile material so it was unlikely he would refuse, but that doesn't mean he liked the lyrics) doesn't mean he couldn't later question the lyrics when they were working on the song.  After the blow up Van left, Brian had doubts about the lyrics and since the verse lyrics hadn't been recorded and the song was in question, Brian put it aside for later and focused on other things (the single).

Well, the backing track for the second half of Surf's Up was never even recorded, so it couldn't have been "basically finished". 

Are you taking about the "April Assembly" of Vege-Tables?  I think that was just a test edit of the pieces recorded thus far.  It lacked some of the essential pieces like the Vocal Insert, Ballad Insert and the Fade, and the long gaps between the included sections seemed to indicate they were hastily performed for review purposes.  It is very interesting, indicative of Brian's intended structure for at least the first half of the song, but I don't think it was final. 

No, it was.


Hopefully that wasn't done on the 14th. I'd like to think Brian did mix it down. Why not finish the A side when you already have the B side?

The biggest question of Vega-Tables is how the 2nd half went. I can't even figure out where the 2nd chorus goes. Evidence points to somewhere after the Ballad Insert. And once we figure that out, where does the "Fade" into all of this?

I probably was being too assertive by assuming April Vega was mixed. But like everything else with Smile, I assume it happened until proven not. Brian held lots of Mixing sessions at the end, and recorded a lot of Vocal overdubs himself.

Since Brian wasn't gonna release H&V, he had to ask Van Dyke to come back and finish the new Single for Smile; Vega-Tables. If Van Dyke came back, he wouldn't leave until it was finished. Van wouldn't waste his time like that.


It was a joke.

Acetates, tapes, partial mixes? I would agree with what you're saying but we don't have all of them. And the ones we have are mostly copies of incomplete sections/songs.


Did Van leave then? I know he left twice (once after both singles we're "complete"). Double check that, just in case. Ask him on Twitter.

Brian never said he had doubts about the lyrics. Brian said he didn't have lyrics for some parts.

Interesting theory... If that was the case and I was there, I would've told Brian:
"You recorded those insane background parts, why not polish them off with the leads. Mike doesn't even sing those parts so don't invite him."

??? 

When was it done?  What does it sound like?  Why wasn't it featured on the album Surf's Up?

"Like everything else with Smile, I assume it happened until proven not."

I assume this was a joke also?  This runs counter to every rule of logic and even common sense.  Following that through then Brian must have mixed and completed the album and hid the tape under his mattress during his stay in bed years.

According to Anderle there was conflict between Brian and Van Dyke over the lyrics, and not over the lack of them but over whether they were too sophisticated for the music.  So yes Brian had doubts about the lyrics.

its impossible to prove that something wasn't done (unless there is tangible evidence of a claim i.e. I can prove the Empire State building was not blown up in WW2)

this is universally true but especially true with something as fuzzy as session logs etc

Leetwall, I love your optimism.

What we regard as the 2nd movement of Surf's Up (everything from "Dove nest towers" to "a Children's song") was recorded on January 23rd, 1967. It was overdubbed onto Brian's piano track. It included mainly just strings (and maybe some percussion?)(originally there were harps and horns but they were not used). That session lasted several hours (I can't remember if they took a break after). But by the end of the night, they were recording the 3rd Movement (aka the ending) of Surf's Up. This recording was labeled as Part 2. Hal was drumming, there were A LOT of saxophones (just one or two trumpets), Stand up bass and guitar.

To get an idea of how the 2nd movement sounded, listen the BWPS version. To get an idea of how the 3rd movement sounded, listen to this live recording from 1971:
https://youtu.be/A4y4nU41HsM?t=4m20s (https://youtu.be/A4y4nU41HsM?t=4m20s)

In the end the tape was lost/destroyed. I remember Mark or Allen explaining why we don't have the master tapes to Good Vibes. Something about them being left behind at the studio and being cleaned out. This happened at the end of 60s when the Boys capital contract expired. That's one theory why the tapes were gone by 1971.

Hey lovenoize, you never told me if you could isolate vocals on the Smiley Smile version of Wonderful!


We're gonna be great friends.

How do you know it was the Second Movement?  It's not stated as that in the sessionogrophy. 

Also the end of the day sessions was logged as for "sweetening" of Surf's Up PART ONE in the sessionogrophy, not a third movement. 

Sorry, I was unable to isolate the vocals. 

The sweetening session was the 2nd movement (it was listed as an overdub for the December 16th recording (that was Brian's Piano demo)). If you look at the instruments used, they fit the description used for the 2nd movement.

Another recording was made: Part 2. Part 2 included Hal and the saxophones. But it definitley was the 3rd movement since the instruments listed match those heard in the live video.

Just let me know next time.

I get very little time to keep coming back here these days; it's eminently possible I've missed something big. So please excuse me asking dumb 'let's back up a second here...' type questions!

Lee... when and where was there ever a description of what was in part 2 of Surf's Up? Genuine question. I remember Darian saying that Paul Mertens had asked Brian what he could recall about that part, and that Brian had said there were strings. That was supposedly why we got strings (a Mertens arrangement) in the live SMiLE in 2004. But I don't recall anything else ever about what else was supposed to have been in Part 2, much less concrete knowledge that Brian's solo piano recording was overdubbed to create part 2, and, even more specifically, that it was overdubbed with Hal drumming, trumpets and saxophones, and that there were also harps and horns that ended up not being used.

If that's come out lately about the second part of Surf's Up... that's big news. So... what's the source?

If it's just the sessionography, then I think, as sonic l. noize has just said, that those instruments were the sweetening for the first part, not overdubs for the second. But please correct me if I'm wrong. I have been... so, so many times...!

Also, although Brian recorded the solo piano version straight through, and this is what was used for the second movement in the subsequent versions of Surf's Up, my understanding was that this was just because nobody ever found any other kind of backing track for the second part, and that in fact, it's not clear that one was ever recorded. Certainly there was a separate recording made with a full arrangement (Hal, horns, percussion, trumpets etc) for the first part, and so the logical assumption has always been that originally, there were going to be similarly fully arranged recordings of the backing track sections for the other parts of the track, and they were the recordings that were originally going to get vocal overdubs to form the finished track. The impression I got was that the piano recording was just to demonstrate how the whole track went, but that the 'finished' studio track was going to be made up of the more arranged backing track sections with vocal overdubs, as indeed the first section was in the end. But logical as that might seem, SMiLE is frequently extremely ILLOGICAL, so... basically, assume nothing that isn't nailed down. Maybe Brian *was* going to do that... but didn't get round to it. Or maybe he preferred the piano track after he did that, and WAS going to overdub that version. Or maybe he had several plans which kept changing, and in the end, he got around to doing none of them, which just left the part 1 backing and the complete double-tracked solo piano version. All of those events would have left us with the tape library in the state it's in now.

Or... maybe Brian did make those more developed backing track sections back in the day, and lost or destroyed the tapes... or they were stolen. But certainly it seems like if they ever did exist, they were gone by the time of the Surf's Up album, and when Carl tried to pull SMiLE together in the early 70s... because they used Brian's solo piano recording as the basis for all the bits of the song that weren't the first part up to 'are you sleeping, Brother John'. And that's all we have today, too.

All of these things are possible, and I don't think it's possible to say which of them did or didn't happen.

Unless... new info or tapes have come to light?

My understanding has always been that they had a go at more Surf's Up but didn't get anything useable - I might be mis-remembering.  Although I think Lee makes some very interesting posts I think he is extrapolating quite a bit.

Wait, so back to "Cabin Essence"; do we really still not know definitively whether Carl's lead is from the "Smile" sessions or the "20/20" sessions?

While Carl's voice didn't drastically change in those two years, his lead on the track always sounded more "1968-ish" to me than 1966.

In regards to the proof...
BOOM! Directly from the Smile Sessions.
http://imgur.com/a/x7KIb (http://imgur.com/a/x7KIb)


It was noted that the sweetening session was for the December 16th recording (which was Brian's demo). And the ending with Hal and the saxophones was a new recording.


Highly doubt it. I have a theory that explains my view.

The version they use of Iron Horse in the 20/20 version is incomplete. The "Who ran the Iron Horse?" vocals are missing an overdub (Brian's). That last overdub makes it sound 100 times better (Brian blends in with Mike's lead).

If they didn't have that, then I doubt the lead for the verses was from '66.

Where does it say it's Part Two or Second Movement? 

The session with the Drums and saxophones wasn't labeled but you can assume it was "Part Two" because of the Master numbers. I can't remember them specifically, but let's just say that Part One was master number 57076. The session with the saxophones was Master number 57077.


I bought the Look! Listen! Vibrate! Smile! book yesterday. I ran across an interview with Mike. Mike basically said that Brian never intended to release Vega-Tables as a single. He did all the publicity to confuse Capitol. They were always going to release H&V. Mike also said that Brian told capitol that he lost the H&V tapes, when actually Brian just stored them in his house. This all had something to do with the lawsuit. But that explains why the H&V tape boxes are empty.

Oh! And to keep this thread on track, I'd like to mention that the bootleg with the Cabin Essence order (Verse-Choruse-Tag-Chorus-Tag) is a compilation of acetates. I think the best reference to the order of Cabin Essence goes back to the account from the October Party where Brian played everyone some of his acetates. He presented them in a specific order:

• Do You Like Worms Part 1
• Grand Coolie Dam
• Iron Horse
• Barnyard
• Bicycle Rider

Ah, y'see, Lee... it's my opinion (and of course, that's all it is; I'm not pretending it's the cold hard truth or anything) that there are lots of possible other explanations for different master numbers like that. And not just the explanation that the January session is for Surf's Up part II. It could be all sorts of other things.

Brian often did remakes of songs. Lots of remakes, particularly during this period of his recording history (off the top of my head, think of all the different versions of 'Wonderful' recorded between Summer 66 and a year later). Different master numbers were racked up like I don't know what during the Good Vibrations sessions. The existence of a separate master number doesn't mean much, and certainly not something as specific as "this is a different master number from what we have come to know as part 1 of Surf's Up - therefore it must be the session for Part 2". It could have been for a complete track remake, or another section that wasn't used... we just don't know.

Someone (maybe Cam Mott) did say round these parts once that the session labelled as 'Part One' might not even necessarily have been specifically for Part One of the song Surf's Up at all, and that it was ambiguous that it WAS for that song... but perhaps that is old information and the link to Surf's Up for that session has now been proven. But even if that's wrong, that goes to show the level of uncertainty that exists around these sessions and their often spotty documentation. It's definitely a mistake to say 'we know of these sessions [a pile of session sheets], and these recordings [a pile of tapes] - so all we have to do is match one to the other'. There were lost sessions. There were undocumented sessions. There were sessions that took place, but the tapes are now gone for whatever reason: lost, erased, stolen.

Years ago, when I first got interested in SMiLE in the mid-90s, no-one except super-well-connected fans knew what 'I'm In Great Shape' was. There were lots of theories, one of which was that it was the 'Eat A Lot, Sleep A Lot' bridge from Vega-Tables, because it was a booted section that didn't seem to particularly belong to a known song and it clearly had a lyrical theme of physical well-being. But the theories were clearly wrong, as became clear to fans outside the innermost SMiLE circles in the late '90s when (part of?) I'm In Great Shape turned up in the H&V Humble Harv demo and then (some of?) the sessions for a more developed version of the track became available. THAT's the kind of mistake we could be making here. We have a session log for a Surf's Up session, and a lost recording for part of Surf's Up... so the session log must refer to the lost recording. Well, it ain't necessarily so.

In short, to assume that the Surf's Up session that doesn't directly match to any of the existing known recordings is the one for the recording we're also obviously missing — the backing track to part 2 of the song, from 'Are You Sleeping, Brother John' to the start of the final CIFOTM reprise ending — could well be a mistake. It's an attractive idea, and a seductive one, but there are other things it might have been and we can't make assumptions like that without further information. In my opinion, of course!

Hi Matt! Thanks for the opinions!


Yeah, Brian rerecorded: Wonderful, Heroes and Villains, Vega-Tables, Wind Chimes, Child Is Father of the Man, and maybe Love to Say Dada counts. But these rerecords can be easily explained. Surf's Up being rerecorded... that needs an explanation, especially since the track wasn't finished in the first place.


We gotta work with something.


I'm In Great Shape is the enigma of the Smile material (to me). What is it?! Not the Heroes and Villains section, but the other songs that were labeled I'm In Great Shape.

In autumn of 1966, Brian recorded Vega-Tables and recorded 2 chorus's for it (one fast with a kick drum, and the other slow with an organ and dishwashing sounds). That was labeled I'm In Great Shape.

In November, Brian goes into the studio to record I Wanna Be Around and Workshop. This was labeled I'm In Great Shape. Why??

It's the biggest mystery. I've figured out all of the 12 original songs on the track list except that.

An intriguing data point, but hardly dispositive WRT the final order of "Cabinessence." It just bolsters the testimony of Anderle, Vosee etal that Brian was creating "feels" in the studio and figuring out which of 'em would go together. And he would play 'em for folks, which afforded them the opportunity to become invested in certain combinations that might not wind up that way at the end. It seems that a bit further in the fall of '66 (November, maybe?) Brian decided what went with what--though when he got back to H&V he clearly started trying a whole lot of things that were either new ideas, older sections that had been set aside, or snippets from those older sections.

It just seems that "Cabinessence" was abandoned at about 95% of completion due to some kind of contentiousness that ambushed it (and quite probably "Surf's Up" as well) in early/mid December. Clearly "Surf's Up" was not as far along in the production process, and that would certainly explain Brian taking another crack at it in January. Was it strings over a piano solo? Or just strings? Without the tape from that session, we would seem to be at an impasse as just how "Part 2" was envisioned at the time...

Hmmm, passing one's opinions and assumptions off as fact is a dangerous enterprise. 

Generally, separate parts of the same song did not have different master numbers unless they were broken off into new pieces or simply rerecorded from scratch.  Recording chronology suggests that if they were different sections of the same song recorded within one day apart, they have the same master number. 

This was very constructive


It's enough for me. For my Smile mix, I'm going to recreate the 2nd and 3rd movements. I've got the vocals ready. In fact, I'd like to ask you a favor sonic; I've got the vocals to Surf's Up, but I want to bring certain elements of it up front. Specifically, I want to remix the 3rd Movements vocals. Could you isolate certain elements for me if I gave you the vocals?


You seem pretty well rounded with the Smile story, Don. I'd like to hear your opinion on this:
In February, Brian, Dennis, Van and Michael Vosse went into the studio for a Surf's Up session.
What do you think this was for?

Fellow Smile-ologists; is it unanimously agreed upon that- in fact- the December 16th, 1966 recording of "Surf's Up" is indeed a demo?
Also; a further inquiry—if sectional-overdubs for "Part 2" of "Surf's Up" were indeed recorded on top of Brian's "demo," wouldn't Brian have made an acetate of this recording?
My memory now drifts back—recalling what Siegel had written concerning "Surf's Up,"- noting that Brian played him an acetate-recording of this particular song... but was this merely an acetate recording of the December 16th "demo" or something entirely different?
To ensue further—are some-; or all(!)- of the alleged "missing" Smile-recordings are on acetate-records; since the tapes are lost(?)? We are aware of Brian's habit of cutting acetates of his Smile recordings, so the possibility isn't ruled out—is it?

*grabs popcorn*

I'll contact Alan about it. I remember reading that it was an overdub onto the December 16th track. I remember seeing those words.

That is an unfamiliar date for a "Surf's Up" session which I am not finding in any version of the sessionography. Is there an actual date in February for it? According to Andrew's logs at Bellagio, the BBs were on the road for ten days that month (10th-19th) so it would seem to preclude Dennis being in the studio at that time. A "Surf's Up" February session is not logged there.

As for what such a session might have been about...hard to say. Did Brian really want someone else to sing lead? Did Vosse have some sound effects ready for Part 2? Were Brian and Van doing something to the piano sound? Assuming there was such a session--and for the moment it must remain speculative--there are any number of possible reasons that seem impossible to pin down...

Amazing mentality, Don. Skeptical but still open for ideas. Great mindset.

It was on February 8th so it fits into the history. Here's a picture of them (Dennis and Vosse) in the Studio:
http://imgur.com/a/y6Gp8 (http://imgur.com/a/y6Gp8)

Dennis on lead for Surf's Up. Hmmmm, it couldn't have been for the 1st movement. If Dennis was singing lead, I'd bet it was for either the 3rd or 2nd movement. The idea about sound effects with Vosse sounds realistic. It reminds me of those daily sounds Brian recorded on his portable. There was one where Brian took David to a bar and asked him to get in a fight with someone. That didn't happen, so maybe Brian wanted to recorded an improv of it in the studio (like he did with Hal and Michael on Vega-Tables).


Another interesting point. We don't know how long the session was or if musicians were brought in. This must be one of those "undocumented sessions" that Matt pointed out earlier.

It was recorded at Columbia. Did Brian record instrumentals or Vocals there? That would give us a clue.

I wonder if the TM Song fight was an attempt at finally realizing this SMiLE-era whim of Brian's?

There's a clip of Brian in the thread "Brian the comedian" where he's asked what makes him laugh.  He answers "arguments."

"Yeah, Brian rerecorded: Wonderful, Heroes and Villains, Vega-Tables, Wind Chimes, Child Is Father of the Man, and maybe Love to Say Dada counts. But these rerecords can be easily explained. Surf's Up being rerecorded... that needs an explanation, especially since the track wasn't finished in the first place."

The track not being finished could be the reason for a remake - he decided he didn't like how the track came out so of course didn't want to finish it, he wanted to do a remake.

There is no known February session for Surf's Up - where are you getting that information?

The master number for the Jan 23 session Surf's Up session is not sequential from the master track for the 1st movement recorded in October, so that is not proof that the Jan 23 session is the second movement or Part Two although it probably is.  The Jan 23rd session's master number is the next number after the sweetening track recorded immediately after and labeled "Part One."  If the sweetening (strings) track was to overdub strings onto the October session or the December solo session, it should have the same master number, which it doesn't.  Or if it was a string overdub on the just completed Jan 23 session.  The other interesting thing is that Brian has spoken about wanting strings on the second movement, which he did for BWPS - yet this string session is for a "Part One" NOT the second part/movement.

I realize we can't put all our faith in the master numbers revealing what was recorded and what it was recorded for because there is some randomness to the master number process, it's not always logical.  Heroes had three or four different master numbers at different times, if you include the "Part Two" number.  I do not believe Alan or Mark has ever said that the "Part One" string overdub was for the Dec 15 solo piano version - because the tape is missing, there is no way to know that.  It's certainly not impossible, we just can't know without the tape or more missing documentation. 

One possible scenario - the J 23 session was for a remake of either Part One or both parts, and then the string session overdub was for the Part One just recorded.  But why two different master numbers, with the overdub session getting the earlier number?

Another - Brian recorded the Dec 15 solo version, doubletracking his vocal which makes it unlikely it was just a "guide vocal" to be replaced later.  He may have decided at this point to junk the October tracking.  In January he decides to keep the solo version of Part One/1st movement and record a new track for Part Two/2nd movement, which he does on Jan 23rd.  To complete the song he overdubs strings onto the December 1st movement, giving the 1st movement a new master number one below the previously recorded Part Two.

The string overdub could be for another song altogether, although it's hard to imagine what song that could be. 

But remember, this is all just guesswork until the tapes turn up.

So was there a February 8th session held—regardless of it being a "Surf's Up," session?

If so... what was this session held for?

No feb 8th session.  One on feb 7 for Heroes, one on feb 9 for Teeter Totter Love.

Thank you so much for such informative insight, Bicycle Rider

Bicyclerider - when you refer to the "October" version of "Surf's Up", I assume you mean "November" - as in the basic track was cut November 4th, and the horns were added November 7th.
As for the second January 23rd session - which was the string overdub - documentation clearly indicates that was for "Part One", so like you say, whether the first January 23rd session (with Carl, Hal, Lyle, Bill Pitman, plus trumpet and sax players) was for "Part Two" or a remake of "Part One" (onto which the strings were overdubbed that evening) is anyone's guess. You note that the Master # assigned for the evening session (57086) is sequentially lower than that of the afternoon session (57087)...interestingly enough, a similar thing happened with the November version...the November 4th basic track was assigned Master # 56842, while the horn session three days later is documented with the sequentially earlier Master # of 56841 (remember, this is the same piece of music, but with a horn overdub added)! To boggle the mind even more, the day AFTER the horn overdub session, the whole thing was re-assigned Master # 56850!

And, back to the original theme of the post - both Carl's "Cabinessence" lead and Dennis' "Truck Driving Man" part on the same song were definitely added in the fall of '68.

Yes thanks for correcting that October reference - November is correct!

So it does indeed seem we can't just go by the master numbers to suss out what things were done for what.  When were master numbers assigned?  It seems like if there was an afternoon and evening session, the master numbers might have been assigned only after the sessions for the day were finished, so it might make sense they assign a master number to the last finished piece, then the earlier, making them reverse sequential? 

Wasn't there an interview where Brian mentioned Dennis recording that rap from either late '66 or early '67? I can't remember where it is, but I do recall Brian mentioning something about how much Dennis liked doing that part...or something along those lines. I don't think that comment was from 1968. My memory is a little cloudy on that interview, heck it could have been Dennis' interview!

To clarify - and I may be getting these mixed up, it's been awhile - The Dennis quote about Truck Drivin Man is in the Preiss book, with no citation of the source or a time for that quote. But either I'm confusing two issues like the Dennis cupping his hands thing with WIBN, or I actually saw somewhere a Brian interview from 66-67 where he mentions Dennis and that part.

I think you're getting those two things mixed up - I recall the Dennis quote being in the Preiss book, as well - but for the life of me, I can't find it! Would you kindly share the page number?
And the Dennis cupping his hand thing on WIBN - I vaguely recall a Brian quote from '66 or '67 for that, but not sure where, either. I definitely recall a Brian quote from '96 or '97 on the same subject! 

I'll have a look in my archive

Speaking of Dennis, Cabinessence and the Preiss book...on page 93 of the original edition, Preiss describes the song as such: "for which Dennis was to have recorded the lead vocal."

Forgive me if this was asked and answered before, but were the "have you seen the grand coolie", and "over and over the crow cries" lines of original 1966-67 vintage, or were they 1968 overdubs?

recorded in 1966.

Yes, and I'm pretty sure that was sourced from the Michael Vosse "Fusion" piece 10 years prior. Vosse reported the same thing, that Cabinessence was to have been Dennis singing lead.

In my copy of Preiss, the Dennis quote is on page 59.

As soon as I hit the "send" button I remembered the famous(infamous?) story of Mike questioning the particular lyric about the crows.  ::) Oops.

I just took a look at the Vosse piece again to confirm, and he says Cabinessence was going to be "a wholly different trip" than what we got on 20/20. Dennis singing by himself to his girl by a fireplace, supposed to be set somewhere up in the mountains, "very simple" according to Vosse. Then "Who Ran The Iron Horse" was a separate piece which "Bicycle Rider" was going to be a part of, about the Chinese workers on the railroads with the crow cries lyrics.

It's interesting because I can hear Dennis' singing even in the Carl lead vocal which everyone knows, and can picture Dennis' voice doing that lead to a "T" because it sounds like him, phrasing and even tonal quality in some places. Make it more interesting by imagining it as Vosse remembered these as separate parts, and there is Dennis as a lone voice singing to his girl in the mountains about giving her a home on the range, the simple mountain or pioneer life of the 1850's let's say...then the railroads are being built by the Chinese laborers on Who Ran...and somewhere much later Dennis comes back as the narrator voice doing his rap, talking about seeing the truck driving men which was the result of everything that had happened from the time he sang that simple song somewhere up in the mountains and uncharted territory. And the Bicycle Rider theme is there to tie it together.

I'm not necessarily doubting Vosse's account but by Oct 3 Cabinessence was in its' 20/20 form, all three sections recorded and test edits apparently made, and Who Ran/Grand Coulee Dam/Bicycle Rider are no longer a separate song.  So when was Home on the Range its' own song?  Must have been August or September when all the above sections must have been written.  Bicyclerider was kicked out and recycled in Worms Oct 18th. 

Or did Vosse get confused by the acetate party in November (it was November, wasn't it) when Brian talked about shuffling sections around, THIS could go with THIS Or THIS could go with THAT but nothing definitive was planned for a WHo Ran/Dam/BR song.

I think it comes down to the fact that "Cabinessence" needed a tag. And though we don't know exactly how/when each piece was written, it surely does appear that Brian had figured out what made the song work best by the 10/3 session.

I also think he figured out that thematic sequence of--settlers-->railroad-->romantic affiirmation of settlers-->railroad/the escalating pace and alienation of modern transportation in the wake of progress-->??--would be more complete if the "Grand Coulee" section came in at the end, representing an outside look at the transfiguration of the American landscape.

Having a bicycle rider, a truck-driving man AND an iron horse in one song would have been overkill. And the story would be too abstract. Van Dyke's "crow cries" line is structured like the imagery sequences in Chinese poetry, and further lends itself to a wider, more impressionistic arrangement of musical instruments.

The version with Home on the Range, Iron Horse and Bicycle Rider still lacks a credible tag. The last two sections are too much alike in how they function, melodically and rhythmically, to work together in the same composition.

I think Brian proved this to himself when he put the backing vocals onto Iron Horse and Grand Coulee. That confirmed that the backing vocal arrangements in each would work as an augmentation, further trying together the two sections. The stumbling block for the song came when Mike sang the lead lines for Grand Coulee in December and began to question the lyrics.

The deal with Vosse and that Fusion piece is that he really wasn't wrong about any of the Smile recordings he reported which were later found and available for us to actually hear. He's almost 99% or more on the money across the board. He even got the Inside Pop confirmed when the Oppenheim notes surfaced, and sure enough there was a segment filmed in the pool, mentioned in the notes, and confirming what Vosse reported. And no one else, no other source got that - Until Preiss, whose researchers used Vosse's Fusion piece as a primary source for the Smile descriptions.

Vosse wasn't in the loop in August, however I would say he was probably "there" as in next to Brian as much as anyone else in the Fall of 66 into 1967 until he left, and he would have been privy to many discussions and planning sessions Brian was having with these fragments and sections of music. Keep in mind too, "Bicycle Rider" turned up quite a few other places too, I think it was that way by design as a motif, at least at some points in the process.

But I take Vosse's word on these reports of the music and the plans and all of it as high as anyone else's. My point always is, show us where Vosse got it wrong in that Fusion piece and then we can challenge his words from that article. Everything there seems to be backed up by the actual recordings we have heard not to mention whatever plans came and went randomly, as happens in any recording process.

Based on Vosse I personally see this as a suite, not one track, like what turned out on 20/20:
Perhaps the form could be: Verses, Iron Horse/Bicycle Rider or Worms?, Coulee Dam, Truck Driving Man?

I know there are parts missing, but that seems like what Vosse is saying.

But Vosse is saying the verses were a separate song (Home on the Range) and the song was Who Ran/Bicycle Rider/Grand Coulee Dam.  Which doesn't make much of a song.  Unless the "verses" were the "this is a recording" lyric and "Truck Driving Man" over the Who Ran music/vocals, the break or chorus was Bicycle Rider and the tag Grand Coulee Dam.

I can't find the Dennis quote about Truck Driving Man-except for in Preiss-but I am sure he got it from a magazine interview.  But-as far as the Dennis vocal you discussed-it was Wouldn't It Be Nice.  Here's Brian discussing Wouldn't It Be Nice:  "One of the features of this record is that Dennis sings a special way, cupping his hands.  I had thought for hours of the best way to achieve the sound and Dennis dug the idea because he knew it would work."-the quote appears in the Hit Parader Yearbook from winter 66-67.

Cool, I thought I may have been getting them mixed up. But it is frustrating when I swear I had read something and cannot find it! In this case I thought something was also reprinted in LLVS but I don't have the energy to wade through every page.

Or to add to it...I swore there was another quote somewhere specific to that Truck Drivin rap besides the quote in the Preiss book! If i happen to find it in passing I'll mark it better this time.  :)

For the discussion, here is exactly what Vosse said, Cabinessence description in the first paragraph and column.

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n295/guitarfool2002/Fusion_03_zps4o33xl22.jpg)

yeah I looked through the Priore book but didn't find anything-that quote about Truck Driving Man is in the non-Stebbins bio of Dennis-Dumb Angel by Adam Webb but he doesn't footnote or attribute where he got the quote.  I may ultimately find it-but I have so many articles (In 10 separate books I compiled while doing my book) that it can be like trying to find a needle in a haystack

So... any luck tracking down lost acetates?