The Smiley Smile Message Board

Hey everyone,

Here's a question...

Say for the sake of merdas and grins that Still Cruisin' and Summer in Paradise were re-released as a two-fer.  While this might be some fans' worst nightmare, here's my question.

a) Would you buy it?
b) What would you like to see in it in terms of artwork/liner notes, etc.  Who would be the right person to write liner notes for Still Cruisin'?  Summer in Paradise?

Let's have a discussion.
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Truthfully, I think if they re-released it as a two-fer, it goes without saying that I'd like to see reproductions of all the SIP artwork and possibly the "Still Cruisin' indeed" blurb that's inside the CD booklet for Still Cruisin'.  To me, it really wouldn't matter who wrote the liner notes, though I bet Terry Melcher could have written some interesting notes, but since he's dead, I guess it's a moot point.

I'd love to see this. Mostly for Still Cruisin, which aside for the moldy oldies, is a pretty decent record. I'd like to see them remove the old hits and fill out the album with other non-LP cuts that haven't been collected properly on CD, like "Rock and Roll to the Rescue". Plenty 80's material floating around. Would be a pretty good package. It should be done, for the sake of completion. Let the world know that the Beach Boys recording output did not end with BB '85 (although in some cases, maybe it should have!  :D)

1) I would buy it.
2) Let Mike write the notes and explain himself.

I agree with Bubba, a Still Cruisin' plus all those other eighties tracks that are scattered between singles, soundtracks and Made in USA would be fine. I even compiled a CD like this. There's enough decent material so that the die-hard fan can program a 35 minute album out of that mess.

Good idea.  There's a lot of shite on it but I'm a completist and I don't have Bummer, for some strange reason... I have a lot of the 'extra' tracks floating around from that period on bootleg.  Love to have the alt version of Somewhere Near Japan as a bonus track!

Uh oh, could be trouble!?  :o LOOK OUT BELOW!!!
Perhaps a CD single with one bonus track?  ;D

If they added a bunch of bonus tracks I'd probably buy the damn thing. 

Yeah, I'd definitely like to see a release of a two-fer! There could definitely be lots of bonus tracks. But most likely, the non-album rarities rate inclusion on a future compilation. How about the movie versions of the Still Cruisin' tracks featured in movies? A lot of them are drastically different.

i'd buy it for sure...uncle jessie didnt have a poster of SIP in his room for nothing!
no but seriously, Still Cruisin was my first bb album (on cassette) and i loved it...
i'd love to hear some better quality versions of In my Car & Still Cruisin.
i've never heard SIP ever...im wonderin what the Surfin sounds like...
there's a small clip of them singing surfin' on a documentry, seems like it was set around a campfire or something...seem very 80s...bruce forgets the words or something

I'd definitely buy it, but then again I'm lame and enjoy most of the tracks I've heard from the two albums.

As for who to write the liner notes? Anyone but John Stamos!

What's that like?  Didn't know it existed...or am I missing the joke?

I'd definately buy it because Summer In Paradise is the only official BB album I don't have.

Papa John’s original version of “Somewhere Near Japan”, called “Fairytale Girl”, is an even better song. The Beach Boys should have recorded it as it was. Japan was not the main topic of the song, but they ‘Boys took that one line and ran with it. It had a very different chorus.  Many of the original elements are there, but juxtaposed around.

Does anyone have a recording of this? I heard it one time, on the Howard Stern show, just that one time, and it’s stuck with me ever since. It was incredible. It’s that kind of song. The kind of thing you wait forever to hear again.

It's a shorter, punchier mix. Superior to the album version, in my opinion.

"Fairy Tale Girl", along with the original John Phillips version of "Kokomo" is just released on the CD "Many Mamas, Many Papas" on Varese Sarabande. Great listening!

http://www.amazon.com/Many-Mamas-Papas-John-Phillips/dp/samples/B003KNDMAO/ref=dp_tracks_all_1

Has to have liners by AGD

That would truly be a "for collectors only" reissue.

Only if this is the cover (without text), the back (with no tracklist), and the image on the disc (with no text):

(http://www.healthandbeauty.net.au/images/john-stamos-mullet.jpg)

Otherwise, my interest in this is about at 0%.

Nausea (Latin nausea, from Greek ναυσίη, nausiē, "seasickness" "wamble"[1]), is a sensation of unease and discomfort in the upper stomach with an urge to vomit.

I would buy it for sure. Even if those albums are scorned for the most part, there's still Carl Wilson's voice on it and that's good enough for me.

TIME TO TURN INTO A GIIIIIIIIIIIIIRRRL

See, it's threads like these -- where people actually think there is something salvageable about the Beach Boys beyond (very charitably!) 1980 -- that I question whether I am, in fact, a Beach Boys fan...

No way, man - that's up there with GIOMH. The check that big hasn't been written yet.  ;D

Of course there's good stuff after 1980. Gets hard to find at times, but there are good tracks on BB85, and Still Cruisin has "Somewhere Near Japan." SIP is pretty tough going, but Al has some nice moments, and the title track had a good live version in the late 90s.

I guess it comes down to -- basically -- if you like the BBs for their brilliant work alone. I think a lot of folks here -- myself included -- crossed a barrier when it comes to albums like Love You and some of 15BO, when you begin to love them for the whacked-out moments too. And it's a short distance from there to listening to "Problem Child."

Nobody said the liners had to be kind. You're telling me you wouldn't take up the offer if given free reign!?

I'd buy it!

Honestly, instead of just remastering Still Cruisin', they could simply make a compilation of their 80's/90's material.  In addition to the Still Cruisin' stuff, they could add the following songs:

California Dreamin'
Problem Child
Chasin' The Sky
Crocodile Rock
Rock & Roll To The Rescue
Lady Liberty
Live version of "Runaway"
Happy Endings (with Little Richard!)
Don't Worry Baby (with the Everly Brothers)
California Girls (live)

Am I missing anything?

I'd buy that too!  I'd buy anything 'new'.

See, the thing is that I can get behind Love You and Smiley Smile -- surely their most contentious albums -- and even Adult Child (and I do like BW88, but it's not a BBs album). I especially adore Love You, actually, for think it combines the freewheeling nature of the pre-Today! Beach Boys with the meticulous (more or less) studio-craft Beach Boys of '65-'67 remarkably well. Thing is: do people honestly think things like "Match Point of Our Love" or "She Believes in Love Again" or "Livin' with a Heartache" are good songs? I mean, sure it's odd to use tennis as an extended metaphor for a troubled relationship, for instance, but it's not done well nor is the song compelling in any way beyond the novelty value of that conceit -- and not much of a good novelty either; one which wears its welcome out pretty quickly. And I say this as someone whose first purchased Beach Boys album was Surf's Up (because it showed me that they were far more versatile than their imagine obviously suggested) while thinking "Take a Load off Your Feet" is an enjoyable song!

[As a side-note, I will mention how I am in awe that Brian Wilson appears to be having a third (fourth? fifth?) renaissance: the "product" has been at least compelling from Smile onwards...]

I think there's just a certain point in fandom when it stops being remotely objective. (Of course people can and do argue whether enjoyment of any art is ever objective. We'll skip that for now.) And so once "you're in," sometimes it's just grasping for what's there. My opinion is that's the case with Beach Boys fans and their lesser material. Because at the end of the day there's always that Carl Wilson vocal or that good-time, summer feeling that is enough to remind a listener about the better material through which s/he fell in love in the first place. I'd say most people on a board like this are guilty of that to some extent ... but some more than others. Count me in the camp that would not pay for a SC/SIP twofer.

Part of it is learning to ignore the lyrics. If you ever take latter-day BB lyrics (and this is from Pet Sounds on, really) seriously, you're listening to the wrong band. So on matchpoint, yeah, the lyrics are stupid. But hey -- Brian sounds great! And the little "matchpoint -- matchpoint" backing vox are killer.

But, you know, "Feel Flows" has really stupid lyrics too. As does "Long Promised Road." And any number of other BB classics. And try playing "Solar System" to anyone who's not a fan / doesn't know the story. They'll laugh at you.

And no, "She Believes in Love Again" is not a great song. But "Where I Belong" is excellent. And "Matchpoint" may fall short, but "My Diane" is awesome. And much of Still Cruisin is dreck, but I can't ignore SNJ, and I love hearing Carl sing on an late-80s BW track (In My Car) -- one can fantasize about him on BW88.

But yeah, it is interesting how much less cringe-worthy BW has been as a solo artist. He's really only put out one clunker (the dreaded GIOMH, although I've spent dozens of posts defending it). Most of his stuff has easily eclipsed those latter-day BB albums.

I'm always surprised how many German words the English language has!  ;D

Yeah, I get that aspect. Yet it seems to me that if you're listening to a song with scraps of "that Carl Wilson vocal" or a "good-time, summer feeling" which only serve to remind you of their songs where there are these qualities in abundance rather than in mere deposits... you could also just as well listen to the superior cuts by that band and forgo the stuff that is merely 'okay' if not worse.


There are lyrics from any Beach Boys albums (1962-77) that are worthwhile even if they're not as on-point as Today! or Pet Sounds; you don't need to ignore the Beach Boys' lyrics to enjoy their music and I think for the most part they did a surprisingly good job with their words. Both of the songs you singled out from Surf's Up do have terrible lyrics, but "'Til I Die" and even, say, "Disney Girls" have fine lyrics. (Similarly, "The Night Was So Young" and "Airplane" on Love You have good lyrics.) Obviously, none of the BBs profess any particular affinity for lyrics, if they cared at all -- they were, after all, a pop group so the sound or "feel" was more important ultimately -- but they could write at least passable direct lyrics much of the time. My point, however, was more that there was something about songs the Beach Boys released that (for a time) made even their slightest material compelling, and that this was lacking from 1978 onwards. Sure, "Solar System" has bad lyrics, but they're at least ridiculous and married to a highly inventive and interesting rhythm + melody. The same cannot be said of "Match Point of Our Love", unfortunately...

No, good list but it would be better if RRTTR would self destruct immediately.

O -- you're doing a great job in distinguishing between a person who enjoys the Beach Boys for their good stuff and someone who is a diehard fan.

That is, between someone who is sane and well-adjusted and has genuine musical taste and standards and someone who seeks out alternate mixes of "Smart Girls."

The first group sounds like you, and that's fine. You will be a much happier and more fulfilled person. I, on the other hand, am going back to listen to the "Make it Big" sessions five-CD set.

Hey, I'm more or less with you on this. But for a certain type of fan, what's there is never enough: people want there to be more, so once they've consumed Pet Sounds, they don't necessarily want to listen to Pet Sounds again--they want there to be Pet Sounds in another album. (Actually this was the genesis of my Beach Boys fan experience, starting from PS/Smile material and expanding in both directions, first to find the hints or leftovers of those, but later appreciating what quality I found elsewhere for its own sake.) And so every new release, every newly exposed unreleased track, is going to be THE ONE.

Pfft, everyone knows the only worthwhile version of "Smart Girls" is the one with sampling in it. :lol


I get this -- I do, after all, still listen to stuff released both before and after Pet Sounds. Holland, for instance, has virtually no Pet Sounds/Smile vibe to it but it is still an excellent album. I think that is part of the problem with the Beach Boys, however: there will not be another Pet Sounds, ever, and when people keep measuring everything up to that one album (to say nothing of the mythos surrounding Brian Wilson), it is to an extent pernicious for the artist(s). I think it is safe to say that there were an innumerable number of conditions which all obtained at the same moment that produced this beautiful work which cannot be separated analytically (completely and also) profitably (this is born out by, e.g., the tomes dedicated to the history of the music of this group, let alone just Brian Wilson, as well as forums like this one). Such conditions will not obtain again, I also reckon. Though there might be glimmers of this in both pre- and post-Pet Sounds material (including Smile) but to pine for something that might attain the nigh-perfection of that album after 1966-67 seems misguided and belies a grasp of the historical record. Brian Wilson Reimagines Gershwin might be the best thing since Pet Sounds, but no one is saying it is equivalent to it, and I think that is telling.

I feel, however, that I should remind y'all that I do still care about things like the unreleased (c. 1969?) recording "Won't You Tell Me?" because has a wonderfully gauzy feel to it that manages to make an otherwise slight song quite compelling and an interesting listen. Essentially, my point is something roughly like this: I think Pet Sounds and Smile are wonderful and Brian Wilson surely proved his gargantuan, genius talent with these projects but I also, at the same time, appreciate that he is no longer completely capable of equalling them but can still make extremely good music even if it is not perfect in the same way -- things might come close, but there will never be "another Pet Sounds". I don't think this is bad, however, and frankly I think Brian would probably like it if people stopped bringing that mythology of his former self up too.

But his management wouldn't. It's harder to sell records without it.

I think artists that are Brian's age tend to succeed best when they do something that is quite distinct from their youthful work -- Dylan really set the mold with his 90s-00s albums, which are great but totally different from his 60s LPs. Tom Waits, though somewhat younger, has also reinvented himself as ancient avant-gardist.

Brian has just never had the interest (or concentration) to move into something entirely different. His personal struggles probably influenced this, but he's still largely interested in the sounds and forms of music from the 60s. This means he interacts with his old work all the time -- but it's an older, sicker dude doing it. And that's tough. The Gershwin thing -- for the first time -- has him really working with music from another time, with different stylistic requirements. It might be why it engaged him so much.

Would like to hear a version of Happy Endings without Little Richard on it.....

wonder if there's a version in the archives like that?  Still not a great song but uggh, can't stand Little Richards voice on that one.. :o

Summer in Paradise with bonus tracks would be like going to the dentist to have all your teeth pulled and then finding out you actually have 8 extra teeth you never knew about...

...and no, I still have never actually listened to SIP...

This right here is a sensible post (especially the bit about Gershwin's music and its effects on Brian). I had got the impression about Brian though that he was perfectly willing to work within the constraints of '60s pop because, honestly, that's what he does best. At the same time, however, he would presumably like it more if people were concerned about That Lucky Old Sun -- or, now, Brian Wilson Reimagines Gershwin -- than how he wrote "Surfer Girl" in his car on the way to the studio to work with THE BEACH BOYS. Then again, we saw how well Howlin' Wolf and Bo Diddley "adapted" to funk and psych rock music; at least Brian's management isn't making him do something analogous!

He has already done "something analogous": BW88.

word

Oh, I think he does the 60s thing best too. But you see in Smile and immediately after a searching for something different, structure wise. And some of the 80s material -- at times -- seems to be stretching in a different direction (I always wonder about songs like "Walkin' the Line" and "In My Car" -- they sound impossibly ambitious and driving yet stupid at the same time, and I wonder if Brian didn't have something great in him in that style).

But if the current day Brian ultimately makes music that is comfortable and familiar, then it means writers ask about the earlier music it resembles. And it's partly his fault -- I personally interviewed the man and tried to get him to talk about his work of the 90s and 2000s. He refused. Not interested. You can see it in his interview about TLOS with Scott Bennett -- Scott talks about all the inspiration of "Forever She'll Be My Surfer Girl," and Brian just says: "It's about how I still love my wife." And that's it.

Hmm, guess I need to do more research before runnin' my mouth, haha. If he didn't want to talk about his new stuff or his "reawakening" stuff... what does he like to talk about, his-own-music-wise? Surely not The Beach Boys for the rest of his life?

Norbitt.

I don't think he's especially verbal about music to begin with, and writers -- because we have to write something -- will use what we can. And sometimes he says more than other times -- he talked quite a bit about certain aspects of TLOS, but never in the detail that fans would appreciate.

But yeah. I thought I would do a different kind of interview, with different kinds of questions. And so I asked him about his recent work. I asked which of his recent songs were his favorites. He said none, he liked them all. I asked what had inspired him to be so creatively active in recent years, and he said, and I quote: "My keyboard sounds so good it makes me write good songs."

(That being said, he's far more aware than people think. I remember an interview he did with All Music in the early 2000s, and he talked about BW88 and said "I know some people think I sabotaged my voice on that album, but I did the best I could" -- and I was like, "Wait. That's pretty self-aware, Mr. Wilson. Have you been sneaking off and reading reviews of your work online or something?")

How do either of those songs have "stupid lyrics"? Unremarkable, maybe, if it's not the style you're into. But stupid???

If you actually think "Feel Flows" or "Long Promised Road" have lyrics that are not just meant to sound cool together with the music at best or are psychobabble at worst... well, you just might be a true fan! :P

Feel Flows has some of my favorite lyrics. I can't relate to them and I think they're about heroin or something and I have no idea what they mean, but they do sound SUPER COOL!

All Beach Boys songs are about drugs - duh.

How about a Barbara Ann compilation disk that collects all of the released studio and live versions? Now that would be a nightmare.

I want a disc (if not a box set) of the recording session(s) for "Ding Dang"!

Now that we have Smile and Bambu, we have come to this.

If Still Crusin' and Summer In Paradise were released as a twofer, I'd buy it as long as it had bonus tracks. Maybe an alternate take of Still Cruisin' or Somewhere Near Japan would be cool. It would also be nice to get the Wembly 1993 version of Summer In Paradise, or maybe something from the Paramount Theater show. Although, I'd prefer getting that entire show released, but that's another topic altogether. It would be nice if a few "odds and ends" were released as bonus tracks, like Lady Liberty for example. It would be nice if the U.S. and U.K. versions of Summer In Paradise were released as a twofer, if only as a limited edition. The U.K. version of SIP is the only major work in the Beach Boys catalogue that I do not own.

With or without bonus tracks, if both albums were remastered, I would most definitely purchase this twofer.  What's $15 in the grand scheme of things, really?

go here... http://www.thesmileshop.net/index.php/Jack_Rieley_Speaks

scroll down to where jack talks about "feel flows". this is what he says the song is about...
"The middle part, with Carl's unfuckinbelievable solo followed by the synth and flute, is the sound of orgasm, plain and simple. My favorite things on the song are Carl's "ah-yeaahhh-yeah-yeah" rounds during the solo and my "aaaah" exclamation. It's all about orgasm, dewdz.

- Jack "

Also in the "Til I Die" section some interesting quotes about the "death" of "Burlesque". Makes one  wonder  how many other pieces were killed because they were written by a Wilson. :o

I have heard SIP finally, and I've also heard the European mix, not too bad really....not too great either  ;)

I would say if there was a two-fer released, I'd want both SIP album mixes plus bonus tracks of the era (ie: Problem Child, Crocodile Rock, etc.) as I would expect the STill Cruisin' album to release bonus tracks like R&R to the rescue, California Dreamin', etc.




"I'd buy that for a dollar"   ;D

What in the flying f***?

Food for about 3-4 days, which I prefer over SIP.

Or in my current state of penury, almost a week.

Who needs food when you can hear Mike rapping?

Touche, Paulos. :(

Maybe we could also get a release of Sweet Insanity so we can hear Brian rapping!! And where's that double sided Smart Girls/Summer of Love 45 on 180 gram vinyl???!!!!

If Sweet Insanity comes out, you can definitely color me shocked. Considering Brian claims that the tapes were stolen and the general poor taste of the album (not so much quality, but it should really be credited to Landy), it would seem very unlikely. And even if the tapes were to turn up, Warner would still have to get behind it and they rejected it twice. I don't see anything wrong with releasing the album as I do think it has a few great moments, but, it would seem in poor taste to do so. Besides, the bootleg copies are pretty much release quality to begin with except for the first version.

A major record company rejects an album by a "high profile" artist, and one that was fairly heavily promoted in said artists "autobiography", to boot. Then the tapes are suddenly "stolen". I don't buy it. It's just way to convenient of a story. Somebody, somewhere, knows exactly where those tapes are.  ;)

If so, this person is, with excellent reason, making no effort to release them. (Hint: it's because Sweet Insanity is ridiculously embarrassing and terrible!)

Maybe the Sweet Insanity tapes have been locked away in the same place as the Manson sessions.... >:D

Sweet Insanity was not that great of an album; nor has it aged well production-wise.  All the best songs off that album have been re-recorded and released.  Although I wouldn't be against it seeing the light of day (officially speaking), it is definitely an album I can live without seeing a public release.  Even though it was pretty cool to have Bob Dylan singing on a track (an unmemorable song, but still).

I was just joking... :lol :lol :lol

Do you Have any Regrets is one of those that should be released, I love Brian's cut

I know. :)

I was just expanding on said joke and the real implications of it. :)

I think it is interesting about the difference between the casual and die hard fan.  I must admit that as time goes by-I  listen to MIU more than I used to.  My brain tells me that "Matchpoint of Our Love" is slight but emotionally I am drawn to a late 70s song with a pretty decent BW vocal.  So I guess I am listening more because as a fan-I know that BW had recovered his vocal chops to some extent by late 77 but that by 1979 he was again smoking too much and less interested in singing a solo.  So-MIU is the only chance to hear BW sing some solos in a decent voice in the late 70s-What I mean is-that if I wasn't a fan-it would just be a banal song-but my knowledge of BB history gives it more weight.