The Smiley Smile Message Board

What the..?!  Never heard anything about this before:

http://www.arctictalesoundtrack.com/ (http://www.arctictalesoundtrack.com/)

It's a cool song. I dig it. Love the time signature!

I like it!! If this and What love can do were on a new album that would be a great start! Production is nice, sounds like Brian does the backing vocals too!

I liked it. Good find.

Someone else needs to start singing lead on Brian's songs.

If somebody else sang lead, they wouldn't be Brian Wilson songs.

I agree. I know a lot of people will disagree with me but I think that if you want to hear Jeff or whoever it may be, then go and buy their albums. I cant understand why people dont just do that if they dont want to hear Brian sing lead vocals. Either that or just listen to the stuff that you can actually bear to listen to. Either that or go and listen to Everything I Need by The Wilsons or something (I know Brian sings a bit on that) but if you want to hear someone else sing Brians songs then listen to that etc... So yeh I couldnt agree more with you that they wouldnt be Brian songs if Brian wasnt singing them.

I agree, the quirky crazy slightly shrill thing is kind of what Brian's trademark is.  He sang much better of course with the boys but that's kind of the trademark of a beach boys song, not a Brian Wilson song. 

I don't think Brian needs to be a solo artist. I'd rather the Brian Wilson Band, full of great singers and songwriters, contribute too. Mike was smart, he let his son sing some leads.

Well nobody is forcing you to buy Brian's solo albums/works. So if you don't want to hear them then just don't buy them. Simple.

Well, here's another example of the official BW website not really keeping up to date with publicizing these things. To be fair, the CD won't even be released until July 31st, so I would imagine it'll get a mention on the BW website eventually.

The sample sounds pretty decent. It kind of sounds like it might have been a co-write with somebody else; it doesn't sound 100% Brian-ish in terms of composition. It doesn't sound at all out of character for Brian either, though. The bit where he goes into the falsetto briefly sounds a bit wonky, but the rest of it sounded okay. It sounded polished but not overly so, and it didn't sound overproduced and overarranged like a lot of the stuff on "GIOMH." I sure hope this new track doesn't have a sax solo in it, or sax anywhere for that matter. I just re-listened to a bunch of "GIOMH", and while I'm not as down on the album as some, I can't stand the "honk-honk" saxophone running all through so many songs from beginning to end, not to mention the general overproduced Disney-soundtrack sound (i.e. "A Friend Like You").

It'll be interesting to see who wrote the song, who produced it, and who plays and sings on it. I wonder if this is another track in conjunction with Ramone. I also wonder if it's a totally new recording or if it's something that might have been recorded at some point over the last five years or so. Wasn't there some sort of press release or news story a few years ago about Brian writing with new writer? I can't remember the other writer's name, but I remember some sort of report about that. 

I do want to hear them, but I would rather Brian not sing lead on all of his songs. Doesn't mean I don't want to hear them, though. I listen to Brian alot, I love Imagination and the Christmas album.

Yeh I do understand what you mean. I can understand where people are coming from sometimes, Brian's voice is a bit much sometimes, but when Brian gets it right I would rather him over anybody else in his band. Note: I stress the "IF" he gets it right (ie: what we know Brian is capable of).

This is a fresh sounding song, and Brian sounds energetic and enthusiastic, and not 'tweaked' in any way either!

If I wanted to hear the other guys, I'll listen to my Wondermints stuff.

He wrote it with Van Dyke Parks according to imdb

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0488508/soundtrack (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0488508/soundtrack)

:lol Wouldn't it be nice to li...ahh forget about it.

On the evidence of a 29-second clip... meh.

One of the things he seems challenged to include any more is the great emotional depth that he could convey in his vocals in the good old days. 

To my ear, the vocals seldom seem tied to the emotions represented in the lyrics. He still succeeds some times, but not like when he was a young man with an intact mind.

One of the times I think he succeeded was in the Carnie duet of "You Are So Beautiful." Not my favorite backing track at all (very Carnie, though), but Brian sounded very invested in it. Also, the Christmas album. Few people seemed to like it, but it had many of the elements people have been clamoring for. Brian put emotion into his vocals, for example. "Snow so deep, stars so bright..." He clearly put care into the way he sang it.

Yes, yes, and yes!

Sounds quite alright to these ears. Go, Brian!

Amen. It has nothing to do with not liking Brian's songs, and it is not remotely like listening to a Wondermints album. But Brian can barely sing a lot of his own parts anymore. If when he was at the peak of his vocal powers he was able to dole out parts to others, why shouldn't he do it now? I think the recordings would be far superior if he assigned parts to appropriate voices. That doesn't mean he'd have to sit out this song or that, but he could certainly only take certain pieces. Obviously most of you disagree by your previous comments. But that's what I think.

I also think:

Totally sounds like something from the Believe in Yourself/ GIOMH era. Lots of overdubbing going on here. I'll still be anxious to hear the rest of it.

If Brian is going to dole out parts to other people, he might as well sell his songs to the highest bidder (which might mean nobody). Since he's not with the Beach Boys any longer, I see no reason for him to become part of an ensemble. If his voice is that shot, he should just retire outright.

Why? One thing has nothing to do with the other. He doled out parts in the prime of his career; there's no shame in doing it now.


Fine. You don't have to see the reason. But where is it written that he can't--especially when his voice is pretty mediocre sometimes now. And what's worse, when he uses the benefits of a modern studio in correcting that problem, he gets endless sh*t from people on this and other boards about it. The man is in his mid-60s and a legend, but he can't win...he has to write great new material (no using old fragments, now!), sing all his own songs, sing them WELL, not use the voices of those singers around him whose voices are much more accurate and reliable, and cannot use studio assistance in doing the job. No problem. I'm sure Lucky Old Sun will be the next Pet Sounds...

I don't need another Pet Sounds. I have that already. I've got enough Brian Wilson material to last me until I'm six feet under.

Brian should do what Brian wants to do, period. He gets sh*t from message boards on the internet. What famous singer/songwriter who's still singing in their 60's doesn't? Paul McCartney gets/has gotten more sh*t than Brian EVER will, and his voice ISN'T shot. I can't point you to several message boards/forums for evidence.

I agree. Some of you folk seem to not understand the reason why Brian is even still creating. He isn't out to impress anyone. He doesn't need the money. Maybe he is doing it because he likes it and, most of the time, it is fun.

Everyone got off on putting Brian down for the Norway show. I watched it and had fun watching it partly because Brian was having fun and the people in the band were having fun.

I assume you mean "can." But I don't need evidence to know that McCartney has mostly sucked the past 35 years.

And of course most 60-somethings sound tired and awful, both with their actual voices and material, but since you asked, I'd say both Dylan and Waits are near the top of their games with their past few albums. (Waits never was too far from the top of his, for that matter.)

I don't say this to be an ass (even though I admit that I am one). But...do you know why he is still creating? Of course not: you're guessing, just like everyone else.

Maybe he's creating because Melinda is telling him to create. Maybe he's creating because he doesn't want to jog all day.

Who knows and who cares.

It's funny though. If the internet were around in 1966, Brian would've undoubtedly gotten a massive amount of sh*t for Pet Sounds.

Undoubtedly. The internet is among the best and worst things to happen to pop music. On one hand, it's easily accessible, easier to promote and anyone can give feedback. On the other, it's easily stolen, hard to cut through the clutter and anyone can give feedback.

I actually snorted out loud when I read that. he he

You're right Luther. I don't know exactly who/what is motivating Brian. But I can believe my eyes and ears when I see him smiling and having fun. Notable because even in the early days of the Beach Boys, he never looked like he was really having fun.

Well, if you watch any of his latest shows, he does smile more than, say, on the 1964 Lost Concert DVD.

It's not very scientific though.

 Thank the Gods! ;D

Let's see if it fits well in context with the movie........like when a Penguin gets eaten by a Polar bear.


We are all fanatics, more or less....but if I didn't know Brian from anyone else I wouldn't give a crap about this song.....considering I've only heard 29 seconds of it.

Maybe Brian is giving his merda away for these little projects and saving the good stuff for Lucky Old sun. Maybe not.....

The difference is, that in his prime he was part of a band, now he is a solo-act.

But it seems at least some of the time in more recent years that when Brian has "smiled" on stage, especially when he's on TV or being shot for a DVD, the smiles sometimes seem totally faked and forced. Not that he's having a bad time and faking having a good time. But it seems like he's trying to over-emphasize the smile, and it ends up looking sort of creepy to me.

The best I ever saw Brian was on the 2000 "Pet Sounds" tour. He didn't try to look like he was playing the keyboards, and he didn't do a bunch of hand jestures or fake smiles. He just sat at the microphone and sang, almost like he was concentrating singing in a studio, often with his eyes closed. Not coincidentally, at least in my opinion, that was the best singing I ever heard him do at a show. 

I like it.

But he doesn't have to be. And even under the name Brian Wilson, I doubt he'd be arrested for offering parts out of his range to someone else. I'll double check the statutes...

Exactly. Brian Wilson doesn't have to be a solo act. It is his (or somebody's) CHOICE. After twenty years of being a solo artist, Brian has found out the hard way that his name doesn't automatically generate sales (record or concert) anymore. I would rather see the songs reach their full potential than simply have Brian all over them. I know where he could find a couple of good singers....

(dontsaysurvivingbeachboysdontsaysurvivingbeachboysdontsaysurvivingbeachboys)

No artist in their 60s generates huge sales. Even if Brian hands over the lead singer duties, sales won't go up. They'll probably go down! Now, if Brian became a member of the Traveling Wilburys, that's a different story.

I am not interested in him turning over vocals for sales purposes--I'm interested in it so the parts are sung well.

How about if some of you Smiley Smilers who are musicians record cover versions of these latter-day Brian songs and post them here? Let's hear how they're _supposed_ to be sung.  ;D

Sure. Just ship me Brian Wilson, Darian Sahanaja, Jeff Foskett, Scott Bennett, Jim Hines, Bob Lizik, Nick Walusko and Probyn Gregory. And Mark Linett.

You know me too well ;)

I'm not interested in hearing the Wondermints sing lead on Brian Wilson albums, and I'm not sure I'm not alone. Brian participated in the last Wondermints album wonderfully (no pun intended), but lets leave it at that.

It's clear you're not, and it's clear plenty of others are with you. Others keep stating their wish for a Beach Boys reunion to let some of them do some singing. And a few people say what I say. Either way, none of us really have a lot to say about it.

No, we don't have a say in it. But I still enjoy talking about it, and at least "having MY say", because it's current, it's happening NOW!

So much of our Beach Boys' discussion is based on 20/20 hindsight, based on things that happened in the past.  While it's still a blast to discuss/debate it, it already happened! The SMiLE era, the 67-68 albums, what became Sunflower, the Holland debacle, the "Brian's Back" campaign, the deaths/breakups, the Landy years - most of it was/is discussed AFTER the fact.

Thankfully (?), Brian is recording new music, and it's refreshing to discuss it - even if there are varying opinions - because it is new, it is unknown. Put your best opinion forward. There will be plenty of time to second-guess it later! :police:

I'd rather have the Beach Boys reunion. If Brian's going to share the spotlight, it may as well be with his musical brothers.

I'm with you, except for the spotlight thing. It's all about the music. I'm not interested in who gets the spotlight, I'm just tired of Brian's songs not reaching their full potential - in my opinion.

To me, it's always been a no-brainer. BW88, Imagination, GIOMH, and the Christmas album all would've improved by one full grade with the addition of other lead vocalists. I hope Lucky Old Sun isn't added to that list...

'Other lead vocalists'.

Who did you have in mind?

Just don't tell Luther...

Their initials are Mike Love, Carl Wilson (for BW88 & Imagination), Al Jardine, and Bruce Johnston.

I know this thread isn't about a Beach Boys' reunion, it's about Brian's new song. And, in discussing Brian's new, future music, that's how I feel. Actually, that's how I've felt for the last twenty years.

I don't understand how people got all excited when Al recently toured with Brian, and people were saying how much he (Al) contributed to the quality of the songs. But talk of a BB reunion and people say, "Oh no, Brian doesn't need them". Why can't you take that voice (Al's) into the studio. And people won't admit it, but Mike Love could've done the same thing Al did, probably adding even more to the songs. I admit I'm stuck on this issue, but it's such a no-brainer. I mean, Brian felt the need to keep Carl's vocal on "Soul Searchin". But, nooooooooooo, we don't need Mike's lead on "City Blues" or "Desert Drive". Or Al on "Make A Wish" or "The Waltz". Or Bruce on.... :-\

I'd like to see it happen, I just think there's less than a 5% chance that it will. I won't hold my breath, certainly because all of the majors are over the age of 60.

And two very real majors are dead.

Well, I'm of the opinion that it's really only to get any water that's left to go under the bridge, not that's it an fully-official reunion. That ship sailed out around 1983.

Make it '73 and we're agreed, artistically speaking (and Love You excepted).

(Here's where fans of [whatever] get mad. BBs fans, so easy to rile up!)

I don't disagree with that.

But I view the future (in my dreams) configuration - Brian, Mike, Al, Bruce, and Dave - to not be a better incarnation, but a DIFFERENT incarnation, one that could give Brian's new music a fighting chance.

Carl's death sealed the fate of any future BB album being a classic, but I would love to see what those five old buzzards could come up with. The prospect(s) of solo projects bores me.

I agree with this. Whatever excitement I used to have for solo projects was killed off at GIOMH came out.

Brian already gets credit for stuff he really didn't write/produce as much as claimed. Taking his vocals out makes putting stuff out in his name stupidly ludicrous.

To tell you the truth, I'm all for a reunion. But I think Al is the only Beach Boy who still has a great voice. Brian's ok, at times terrible, and Mike & Bruce are really bad on many occasions that I heard them. I'd rather have Brian sing "I get around" these days than Mike. Don't know about Dave's voice. A reunion for me would be a nostalgic thing with a hopefully big (and great) finale to burry the Beach Boys finally.

I get what you're saying about Mike & Bruce's vocals, but you are only judging them based on their recent live performances, which can be weak. Two points to consider:

1)  On the recent release, Songs From Here And Back, Mike sounds OK on "Cool Head, Warm Heart", as he does on the solo album (did you hear those leaked songs?) he has been shopping for the last five years. I prefer Mike's vocals than Brian's on "The Spirit Of Rock & Roll" or "California Feeling".  And do you really prefer Brian singing "I Get Around" over Mike Love? Hearing Brian attempt to sing Mike's part(s), which he does on almost every song, is very unfulfilling to me.

2) People can say what they want about Mike & Bruce personally, but they've been pretty professional in the studio haven't they? I believe Mike and Bruce, if given the opportunity to sing new Brian Wilson material, would be dedicated and sound quite good. And remember, they would have access to the same ProTools and other studio gimmicry that Brian has been using. I think the results would surprise a lot of people.

Yeah, I heard those tacks and really liked them. My point was on live-recordings I heard. But still I prefer Brian on a good day than Mike on a good one. Brian at times still has some more punch (I hope that's the right word) singing it. But "IGA" was just an example. There are songs that Mike probably sings "better" than Brian although right now nothing comes to my mind. Mike's lower octaves are still good, but he sings very weak in higher grounds imo.
In studio that's another thing.

I guess in any case, I prefer Al over Brian and Mike singing the "Mike"-songs. Bruce though is the weakest of all the surviving BBs I have heard, maybe he'd sound better in a studio.

Hmm. It just seems like a BB reunion would suck. I mean, the band spent its last years making music that was largely mediocre because of bad lyrics that pretended they were still all 22. Now, if they got together and Mike's lyrics were actually pretty decent, maybe that issue would be resolved. But if not, a bunch of 65 year old guys releasing a brand new album about girls in bikinis is just creepy.

Then there's the music. We all know that Brian is still the one most capable of churning out great music. But if you're all unhappy with his solo output, who's to say his output with the BBs would be any better? And it's not like Mike, Al, or Bruce have been incredibly musically producive lately. Would they be able to light a fire under Brian's butt?

And then there's their voices. Al's voice is still decent, but Mike's, Bruce's and Brian's are not what they used to be. Who would sing the leads? Probably Mike, since he's known as the BB voice. Would it sound good? Eh. Actually, I prefer Brian on a good day to _Al_ on a good day. Al's voice is great, but Brian can still achieve that sweetness and subtlety that Al doesn't have. So...yeah. I'm holding out for some good Brian solo stuff. Like I said, he sounded great on the Christmas album.

I love the Christmas album and Brian's solo work has a few shining moments (though sometimes the luster is dimmed by the crappy slick 80's production). But I would be lying if I said I wouldn't have preferred to hear mike singing at the end of BWPS Surf's Up. I think a Beach Boys reunion (with Brian at the helm) would be pretty awesome. Bring VDP for some lyric work and really honest-to-God believe that it is possible to have one more BB classic (even sans Carl and Dennis).

How about we just say "same studio technology." There's no gimmick to it.

Just to muddy the waters, I think the best voice to sing material like "I Get Around" today is Al. I heard Al sing "I Get Around" (the Mike parts, that is) at a benefit/charity show back in 2005 without his regular band. This is noteworthy because when Al's band including his sons plays "I Get Around", Matt Jardine usually sings both the Mike and Brian parts. So it was interesting to hear Al sing it, and I think he does a great job. You can of course hear him on things like "Little Deuce Coupe" on his "Live in Las Vegas" album. I like how Al sounds on these songs. It sounds familiar, yet different at the same time. His voice is in such good shape. While a song like "PT Cruiser" is sort of a novelty sort of thing, if you listen particularly to the vocals-only mix of that song, Al's lead vocal sounds like it could have been flown in from 1965.

I really wish a quality recording of the handfull of Mike-less BB shows from 1990 existed. I've heard a pretty bad audience recording from an Ontario show in 1990 where Mike was absent, and Al handled nearly all of Mike's leads. Al also handled his own regular leads as well (Rhonda, Come Go With Me, California Saga as well at this show), so the show is the closest I've ever heard to a sort of half-way Al solo show with Bruce and Carl singing a few leads as well. This show was even more Al-heavy than Al's current "Endless Summer Band" shows, where he gives some leads to his sons and whatnot. Even though the recording I heard was pretty bad, even by audience recording standards, I liked what I heard.

I agree. Just listen to "Shut down" on Al's live-CD.

Hearing him sing outside of the limitations of his current range wouldn't be fulfilling for anyone.

It never really did. Even in the 60s, nothing that Brian did on his own sold well. The artists he produced, the Survivors single, the Caroline No single (released under his own name) the Getting Hungry single (Brian & Mike)... Nothing of it sold well.

I'm sure that if Brian would release a new album now with some guest vocals by Al and maybe some archive recordings from Dennis or Carl and release it as a Beach Boys album instead of a solo album, it would sell at least twice as many copies.

If you remember back to 1988 (I don't know how old you are), most of the (limited) success of the first solo album was due to "Brian hype" - the Brian is genius hype and now he's going to step out on his own and blow minds. The album came out of the shoot pretty strong because of that, going Top 50 I believe. Of course, one listen to the album dispelled that hype.

Also, weren't the success (ticket sales) of the first solo concerts due to Brian's name/reputation? Granted, it might've been out of curiosity, but the NAME Brian Wilson got a lot of attention. People didn't know what to expect.

Now, to quote the great Bob Dylan - things have changed. I don't think Brian gets that big push with his solo albums and tours anymore because of his name. I think the curiosity factor is over. People are now pretty sure what they're going to get, I think. Is Brian reaching the mass public lately or just the core of diehards?

I think Melinda and David Leaf were on top of this also, which would explain the performance of Pet Sounds live in its entirety, and, of course, the resurrection of SMiLE. Brian has to come up with something new, or enticing, because, unlike The Beach Boys (Mike and Bruce), I'm not sure he could sustain a solo career by simply presenting Brian Wilson.

I also think (but I'm not sure yet; have to get more info) that is why Brian is working on the Lucky Old Sun project. Is this project something he's really into/behind, or is it another gimmick to sell tickets? I read a quote - maybe it was on this board - where Brian said about Lucky Old Sun "I don't know what it's about"...

Edit: While I love Dennis and Carl's work, and feel that they will never receive the credit that they are due, I think the response of their inclusion on a Brian-related project would be minimal, again appealing to Beach Boy diehards only.
 

What I was trying to say was just that a Brian Wilson album under the name 'Beach Boys' would sell a lot better than just a Brian Wilson album. Even if instead of a real BB album it would just be, for example, a BW album with a guest vocal by Al and some archive material from Dennis and/or Carl.

The big public (people that only have one greatest hits CD or something like that) want the Beach Boys, not 'that dude that used to be in the Beach Boys'. And just the name would make all the difference, even if it's an empty shell. Do you think that anyone would want Mike & Bruce to play at their state fair if they'd be playing as 'Mike Love & Bruce Johnston'? I highly doubt it.

My understanding is that LOS was commissioned by a British arts organization.  It was their idea for him to write a new work.  I suppose he could have turned it down, but he decided to take it on (or it was suggested he try it, depending on how cynical your point of view is).  It's actually not that commercial of an idea.  Brian has been working on another album of pop material in the studio, but as of yet, hasn't begun formally recording "Lucky Old Sun."  To me, that indicates he and his supporters find less commercial potential around the project.  Plus, there's the fact he's doing a big tour of Europe in the middle of creating it, instead of staying home and finishing it and/or recording it. 

It doesn't surprise me if he said he's not sure what it's about.  It may not be completed, and it's Van Dyke Parks who is supposedly writing the narration, not Brian.

You know, at the end of the day, the guy who's name is on the record is ultimately responsible for what the output is.  We've been doing this second guessing of Brian's 'collaborators' and co-producers and career choices dating back to Dr. Landy...and probably longer than that.

I will appreciate any new recording Brian puts out, no matter if it's full of 'older' songs that's never seen the light of day, no matter if it has imperfect singing and outdated arrangements, and no matter if his songs and collaborators don't meet the impossible standards that we, as fans, have set up for Brian.

Why?  At the end of the day, he's carved out a nice little second career in his twilight years.  He's toured.  He finally removed the Smile monkey off his back.  He's received the recognition he's long since deserved for his accomplishments from his peers in the music industry and recovered his musical legacy.  Which, by the way, is a big improvement from being remembered as the whacked out, reclusive, drug casualty who stayed in bed all day.

Brian doesn't need the Beach Boys this late in the game and the Beach Boys don't need Brian.

I don't expect him to uncork another record remotely in the same league as Pet Sounds or Smile ever again.  But I could live with another GIOMH because I know there will be enough Brian 'moments' that'll overcome the overall imperfection of the CD.    

Beautifully  said Swamp Pirate.

"TLOS" was commissioned by The South Bank Center as part of its opening season after a major refurbishment. If you'll recall, Smile wasn't "formally recorded" until some two months after the live premiere. As for touring instead of working on it... time will tell, that's all I'll say.

The whole thing is intriguing though, the fact that strange odd songs by Brian (Believe in yourself, Walking down the path of life, What love can do, live let live) are sneaking out, he's doing a maybe 'live only' performance (of which I've now bought tickets - Hooray!) and he might also be doing a new album.
None of this is cohesive or following any kind of linear strategy - obviously in keeping with the standards set in the Beach Boys world! - but the fact that I am excited about what some 65 year old mans next artistic move is, I think, heartening.
I think throughout the 70s, 80s and 90s, there was a feeling that Brian still might be able to pull out one last big one, that feeling receded with BWPS being unleashed because for many that was the big one - however I've got a feeling that he might still have something left up his sleeve...Maybe i'm being too optimistic, but thats how I feel.

Any thoughts? - particularly AGD as he is the resident Beach boys expert (and cynic!).

My, um, instinct tells me that "TLOS" has potential. Probably not BWPS level, but... We'll see in September.

Long as it includes Brian's fave short-cut, that'll do me.  :)

Do you think the 'Shortening Bread' riff will be in it?