The Smiley Smile Message Board

http://thecalifornian.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070530/LIFESTYLE/705300302/1024

Maybe we'll just have to wait for the 50th anniversary of Pet Sounds? 

I'm sure they'll sound and look great.  ;)

Typical answer from Brian.  My guess is he's waiting for Mike to stop suing him before he even considers a reunion.

BTW, I'm going to that show they mentioned in Monterey.  Good to see the local press hyping it.  8)

My guess is he's sick of people asking.

Did anyone ever hear through their inside sources the mood and what was said in the Capitol offices prior to the roof-top reunion?

The mood was excellent - as Jon has said here, for those few hours, they were The Beach Boys again and happy to be so.

""You never know," Wilson said. "The Beach Boys could get back together, but it's not very possible. It's not probable.""

I'll bet a small sum that the question preceding that quote went something like -

"Do you think The Beach Boys will ever get back together ? Would that be probable, or possible ?"

I still wait for Brian to answer such a question with:
"No, we burned Mike Love plus some parts of Bruce, too."  ;D

I love how Brian states once again that he likes working with computer-assisted recording because it can correct the pitch! He has no qualms about admitting it, so he must get a big kick out of using the technology to perfect his vocals.

I found the writing in the article to be confusing in parts (where have all the copyeditors gone?). The interviewer should consider herself lucky that Brian was answering in sentences and not just single words!

"Computers make it a lot easier to take your time and get the pitch right and get the songs right," he said.

That doesn't say he uses pitch correction, necessarily. There are plenty of advantages to computer-based recording that allow you to "take your time and get the pitch right." For example, rather than punching in on tape or doing difficult editing, you can quite easily redo segments and easily and cleanly edit them in. However...


Why should he? It is completely industry standard to use the technology available to some extent or another. I have never heard anyone complain about it other than on boards like this one. It isn't as if using pitch correction (when appropriate) is the same as being Milli Vanilli or anything.

I seem to remember Bruce I think discussing the benefits of this kind of programme (or the equipment of the day) in a interview. I think the subject was one of the early 80s albums and he said it was great for their old voices to get a boost when needed.

I still feel that Brian using autotune or anything like that is no different than Brian using a reverb chamber or messing with the tape speed on past albums.  it all goes together to produce an un-natural sound that couldn't be humanly reproduced.  Nearly everything he's ever recorded has something in it that's not truly what he sounds like, that's what we love so much about modern music.  Anytime you record anything you've got somebody tinkering with the sound in one way or another, even spoken word albums are covered up in reverb.  I don't see a problem with it. 

I don't have a problem with it either.  Face it, Brian's 65 year old voice is not what it used to be, and he knows it.  I'm glad that he recognizes his vocal shortcomings, because frankly there have been times when I've scratched my head over some of his performances (Gettin' In Over My Head) and wondered 'Does he not here how out of tune this sounds?'.  They did a great job with his voice on What Love Can Do, and given the choice between in-tune processed Brian vocals and natural unprocessed out-of-tune vocals, I'll take in tune every time.  I may get flamed for saying this, but I wish he would dole out leads to different singers, as he did with the Beach Boys.

The problem I, and many others have with topics like auto-tune is the attitude of Brian's camp in (initially at any rate), denying it was used (wanna hear what he sounds like without it ? Listen to GIOMH). Brian's keyboard ? Of course it's plugged in and of course he's playing it, it's just mixed low (disproved by the Boston 1999 balcony video, unless he was playing the same chord all night). The lyrics aren't on Brian's autocue, just the song titles ('course not...). Of course, the biggest teminalogical inexactitude of all is still trundled out, but not for much longer.  ::)

I don't understand why folk feel Brian would be so diminished if he wasn't playing keyboards live (you don't need a balcony video to see that) or if he uses pitch correction in the studio. Brian is one of the greatest living composers and when he sings live he sounds great considering the abuse his voice has undergone over the years.

Does it diminish Pet Sounds to know that most of the tracks were played by non-beach boy musicians?

Of course not. Neither does it diminish Brian that he operates things the he does, live and in the studio.

I attended the debut show of Brian's first solo tour in Ann Arbor (1999) and posted a lengthly review on the old Cabinessence board in which I casually mentioned the unplugged keyboard and teleprompter. Although the review was very positive, I was taken to task by Mr. Foskett (or someone posing as him) for suggesting that Brian didn't play the keyboard that night and read the song lyrics from the teleprompter, two aspects of the performance that didn't bother me one iota. I also mentioned that Brian did not even open his mouth during the first number ("The Little Girl I Once Knew") which was, again, dismissed as inaccurate. I remember watching Brian being "walked out" on stage by an assistant which suggested to me that Brian had more than a little stage fright. When he didn't actually sing during the opening number, I feared the concert would become a tribute show with the guest of honor seated immobile at center stage. But as soon as "Little Girl" segued into "This Whole World", Brian immediately starting belting out the lead and delivered the goods for the remaining two hours. I believe to this day that Brian needed to soak in the atmosphere for those first few moments before committing himself to a performance. None of this detracted from what I still remember as a wonderful, triumphant evening.

Like AGD, I'm turned off by the fact that the "official camp" felt it necessary to lie about such inconsequential things.

I've never thought he played that keyboard live, nor have I ever cared. I think Al should be singing a lot more in the live show - for instance, You Still Believe In Me was a live Jardine vocal for years and should be again. Likewise, Billy Hinsche and Sail On Sailor and I'm Waiting For the Day. Foskett should sing more too. Brian's been on tour long enough now that it shouldn't matter that he doesn't sing every lead.

The comment of Brian being led out to the stage. The SMiLE tour show I attended that happened twice. The lead-out prior to the campfire set then the fade during the intro to Sloop and I viewed it as nothing more than a 60+ year old being escorted around a dark and dangerous stage.

Lots of interesting discussion.  It seems a big part of the negativity surrounding the use of technology (in this case, I mean auto-tuning software, although the use of teleprompters, etc., or BW not playing his keyboard, amount to the same thing) is the official line out of the Wilson camp. And that negativity does make some sense, in that many casual listeners probably wouldn't otherwise give a second thought to how albums are actually recorded--and for that matter, how they have been recorded for four decades. (Meaning that what you hear isn't what was played. Period. In 99.999% of cases.) Yet when attention is drawn to something, it's suddenly like a big deal, a monstrous cover-up of strange issues. In reality, these terrible crimes are nothing--they're absolutely commonplace and long-since have been.

Based on this kind of talk--Andrew's and Roger's comments--it seems as if the inexplicable and inexplicably strong defenses against non-issues create issues, possibly in some cases among people who really otherwise would neither know nor care.

I strongly agree with John's post that there would be not only just no shame in Brian doling out leads to the others sometimes, but GREAT BENEFIT to the music. I think that new recordings (and for that matter, the past several albums) would have greatly benefited from Brian Wilson treating his band as the Beach Boys, and picking his own spots. That song's a Jeff lead, that one's a Nick, Darian, Taylor, etc. It can still be "Brian Wilson." The quality would be inestimably better. (Even GIOMH could have been good--or at least sung in tune.)

Endlessly fascinating subject, that man and his environment.

Edit: It occurs to me, this wine I'm drinking at the moment may cause my posts to be less comprehensible than usual. Or just plain stupid. If either of those is true, sorry.

Is that something cryptic, or something that's commonly known?  I'm not sure what you mean by that line, AGD, and I certainly respect your inside knowledge.  Is it having to do with Brian's role in the studio, or is it something to do with Brian on a personal level?

I've no problem with Brian using auto tune, using his keyboard as a security blanket, having his parts doubled/tripled on stage or reading his lyrics from a teleprompt. However I have a huge issue when someone, anyone, in his camp or anywhere else, tells me the evidence of my eyes and ears is wrong. That's insulting my intelligence*. Won't have it.

[* - such as it is.]

Brian's camp insults my intelligence a lot. HE is basically honest though.

A lot of that stuff - teleprompters, auto tuning, inaudible keyboards, vocal shadowing - used to kind of bother me. I don't know if I'm just getting old, or mellowing, or both, but that stuff doesn't bother me like it used to. Brian's solo career, which is so plotted, orchestrated, staged, and strategized - FOR HIM - has numbed me. At this point, I only care about two things. First, that he be able to sit down and write an entire album of new material. And second, that he record that material with Mike, Al, Bruce, and Dave. Quite frankly, I no longer look forward to any solo music from any of the guys. It's boring. Other than Pacific Ocean Blue, which was a one-off, The Beach Boys have proven that the sum of the parts is stronger than any one individual - or something like that....

I think there is still bits and pieces that have a bit to offer. But yes I generally agree with you that most of the solo stuff (not including POB) isnt great except for BW 88 (just my opinion) and I know the synthesizers etc.. get a bit annoying but the material is still good and it is still an enjoyable album for me anyway...

As far as the autotune thing goes, I really don't care. Most everyone uses it, and hasn't Stephen Desper said that even in the old days, some of those "great old falsettos" we all yearn for now were actually enhanced by speeding up the tape? I think the reason autotune has a bad rep is because it's used by some artists who really can't sing, like J. Lo or Britney. The fact is that Brian can sing. His is still a good voice. He proves it in concerts when he's "on."  Regardless of what some people seem to think, I still hear warmth in his voice, I still like the quality of his voice (I think it's got more character than Foskett's, by the way) and I can still hear him intoning and phrasing songs with rare skill... when he's in the mood to do so. So it's not like they're trying to pretend he can still sing-- he can. He just needs some help every now and then. I wouldn't assume that he ALWAYS needs autotune, either.

Doling out the lead vocals? Personally, I like hearing Brian do all (or most, when Al is there) of the leads. Because when he nails a vocal, there's nothing like it. But I prefer a little rust and character in vocals anyway. I'm not sure I really would want to hear Darian do Please Let Me Wonder or Jeff do Surfer Girl while Brian sings BG. Brian's camp probably feels that most of the audience wants to hear Brian Wilson sing, and they're probably right.

As for the keyboard thing, I agree with AGD about trying to pretend he plays live, but that deception seems to have stopped, so why complain about it? Brian no longer even puts his hands on the keys unless he actually IS playing, and he does play a short bit for Marcella and a short bit in Smile. And it's not like he can no longer play. He has demonstrated his continued ability to play in various DVDs, as well as the Warmth of the Sun podcast. I don't know why Brian's camp went so far in trying to cover up the truth about teleprompters, etc., but I can only give them the benefit of the doubt and say they were trying to protect Brian's reputation. With so much to enjoy (the music, the band, the excitement of seeing Brian live), why harp on the behavior of Brian's camp and let it ruin the few performing years we have left with Brian?

God, thats a depressing thought.  :'(

Errrrr...sorry.  "Few" is a relative term-- the man continues to amaze me and considering his penchant for surprising his fans will still be giving concerts into his 90s. I'm just saying that people argue so much about little issues, and I just feel lucky to be around at a time when Brian is still performing.

I don't see Brian performing too much longer. He's 65 this year, and I think the new work/album and the reception thereof could well influence the future. I'm not alone in this view.

Wasn't Brian planning on retiring with "SMiLE", then changed his mind?

Maybe Brian was planning on retiring after SMiLE but his "Management" had other ideas.
Look at it this way. Success in London in September and it's more of the same for Brian.
If not...it's back to the Beach Boys. They have all bases covered. Brilliant! ;)

Yeah, but his wife and managers talked him out of it.

Just to give the wife and managers the benefit of the doubt for a minute...  Isn't there a legitimate concern that if Brian were to retire, he would sit around feeling depressed and start overeating? Maybe the touring/working on music keeps him feeling useful? It's not as if he plays golf or something.

Anyone everr asked him what he'd like to do ?

Exactly.


I was wondering about that too,

Re: what Brian wants to do - isn't the point of everything we've seen/read lately this: that what Brian wants to do is that others "suggest" what he do?  Very much a benign form of passive/aggressiveness, being "supervised" in one sense but exercising ultimate veto power if he really doesn't want to do something?   As in: others propose what to do, or they do the "scut work" for him, and he gets the credit.  Peter's book and the BD docu suggest it, even Brian himself repeatedly says "my wife" or "someone" suggested he do one thing or another.  I'll defer to you scholars but that's certainly the impression I've been getting these past couple of years, with all the renewed historical interest.

I don't see this as sinister or praiseworthy, just how things are being done, the "analysis" can be left to the flame-throwers on all sides.

Well, exactly. Doesn't the Carlin book talk about how it's almost an insult to him to suggest that he's simply a robot doing whatever anyone tells him to do?  I think leaving it up to him would just leave him doing... nothing. Instead, it's probably like, "Brian, you want to tour?" "Okay." "Brian, you want to make a record?" "Okay." "Brian, you want to stay home?" "Okay." I think he's more in control when he's not in  control-- when he can react to others' decisions, rather than making all the decisions himself. I think he LIKES that his wife and manager make the decisions, and he knows that the ultimate decision is really his.

I think Brian probably doesn't mind if whatever is proposed turns out okay, such as finishing "Smile."  Or the relatively mild touring schedule.  I do wonder what he thinks about some of the studio work (with some isolated brighter spots) of "original" material of "Imagination" and afterwards.  I think it's wrong to push him on that if he doesn't have anything new, or if what's new isn't up to his standards.  I do think he has standards, and only should put out a record of "new" stuff if it is indeed new and something he feels is decent material.  I can live without ever hearing a new Brian Wilson record if he's not 100% behind what he's doing (or other people are suggesting he do, however it happens).   That also goes for anything he might do with the Beach Boys in the future, if that ever were to happen.   

I see what you're saying, but I think you have to elaborate just a little bit more. Yes, the questions are probably put to Brian like, "Do you wanna do this?" or "Do you wanna do that?"

But I also think there's some selling or bargaining going on. Use the recording of a new album as an example. After the initial question - Do you want to record a new album - there's probably a "So and so would like to collaborate. So and so could get the musicians together. So and so would be great producing the tracks. So and so can do the auto tuning. So and so can sequence it. All you have to do is sing the lead vocals. The guys can work out the backgrounds. The actual amount of time you have to put in is a couple of weeks max. What'd ya say?"... OK, sounds good.

And we get a Brian Wilson "solo" album... :(