The Smiley Smile Message Board

Ive been parsing through biographical information on Brian lately and checking out the Honeys / American Spring for the first time ever. It occurred to me to ask a few questions I haven't seen anyone discuss yet.

1) Did Barbara stick around and be a part of Brian's life like Marilyn and Diane? Their connection to him is obvious, but Barbara's just kind of there. If that famous photo of the three of them hadn't been so widely circulated I wouldn't even know there were three Rovell sisters, she's seemingly never mentioned. Was she on the Row Row Row You Boat recording, or serve as a musical secretary in any capacity like Diane?

2) Has Diane ever given an interview, for TV or in print, about her experience with Brian Wilson? She has to know that he really wanted her all along, it's common knowledge among the fandom and biographers. Tony Asher for one has never shied away from saying as much and obviously they had an affair. Plus he put her poor sister through the ringer (even after she warned him not to, inspiring the song "Don't Hurt My Little Sister") and it was a bitter, messy situation for almost two decades. You'd think she'd have strong feelings about the man, good and bad, but I've never seen her weigh in. Did she issue a statement at his death?

3) When the Honeys and later American Spring didn't take off as was Brian's first hope for them as vocalists, did he or anyone else give thought to them joining the Beach Boys? A few female voices, and perhaps fresh collaborators/votes might've given new life to a group that was languishing in the late 60s and 70s (mostly commercially speaking at first, then definitely creatively as well). The BBs used them occasionally I know, like in "Wonderful" and "Let's Put Our Hearts Together" but why not make it an ongoing thing? Their voices would throw off the unique male harmonies, the name of the band itself precluded it? Did anyone float the idea?

4) This last question may sound a bit crass but what did Brian see in Diane that he didn't in Marilyn? Normally in a situation like this I'd assume the desired sibling must've been SO MUCH obviously prettier than the other, but all the Rovell sisters were very beautiful and Diane/Marilyn in particular are very similar looking. (If he had been after Barbara I'd just chalk it up to him preferring blondes, for example.) Is there some famous anecdote, something Diane did or some attested manner she had that made her stick out to Brian as the much more attractive sibling?

Perhaps this is none of my business but, well, I'm curious and this is a fan community.

I always assumed the famous Honeys picture was Marilyn, Diane, and Ginger Blake, but I could be wrong.

Youre absolutely right. Ive since been privately corrected

I'm also very interested in these questions! It's a bit of a universally elided topic, if understandably so. Re: question 2, I don't have my Beach Boys books and bios handy, so perhaps I'm off-base here, but I don't think I've ever seen any evidence that Brian's interest in Diane predated his marriage? I think his lyrics from the period, how quickly they seem to have moved, how young Marilyn was, all suggest that they didn't exactly have a super strong foundation for a marriage. And Brian at least seems to have had motivations a lot more complicated than just "we're in love and want to get married"... All of which is just to say, I'm not sure Diane had to do anything other than exist to become an obvious person on whom Brian could project a fantasy of an easier relationship (or easier life)...

Don Goldberg's autobio THE LOST SONG has some interesting sidelong glances at the Marilyn-Diane sister dynamic in the Sunflower-to-Carl & the Passions period. Whatever "triangle dynamic" that was going on did not seem to affect the closeness of the sisters. I think it's clear that Brian might have liked to be more like Dennis with respect to the opposite sex, but his introverted nature reined any such impulses to a large extent.

All of this feeds into the "family ties that bind" element of the band, an ongoing & shifting situation that was always being tested by Brian's need to escape its smothering aspect that threatened his ability to manage his own creativity. Diane clearly had a thing for Brian, and found a way to participate in his professional life--all of which didn't seem to bother Marilyn. (That clearly wasn't the case with other women, though: Marilyn clearly felt threatened by Debbie Keil's emotional connection with Brian.)

Clearly even the more intimate domestic elements inside the world of the Beach Boy axis had many layers and peregrinations...!  :3d

Both Brian and Marilyn had relationships outside their marriage. Wasn't Marilyn involved with Rocky Pamplin at some point?

It's strange how Brian seemed to find some kind of security in relationships with family members. Not just romantic relationships but various kinds It didn't always work out well.

That's true about her and Rocky, at least I recall reading it

Rocky claims a fling with Marilyn, but Marilyn says not true. In any case, the timing of the alleged fling was post-divorce.

From Wikipedia: 'Pamplin joined the band American Spring for one year in 1977.[citation needed] The band was fronted by Marilyn Wilson, with whom Pamplin was having an affair'....

Brian and Marilyn divorced in 1979.

"Citation needed." Wikipedia can be a good starting point for research or a summary on a topic; but I don't trust it completely in this particular instance, because I am inclined to believe Marilyn's account, but not Pamplin's. (Yes, I've read his book.)

But the way I heard the story many years ago, it was at least supposed to take place after Marilyn and Brian separated, if not legally divorced.

I don't particularly trust what I've read either but I have read before that there was an alleged affair. I'm also not entirely convinced that Marilyn had no problems with Brian's feelings about Diane. I've read other things about that too.  Of course, really none of it is any of our business.

I agree, one hundred percent.

The Steven Gaines book may be icky at times, but it's pretty accurate. I don't think the Rocky/Marilyn situation was completely fabricated, and it certainly went down before the divorce because Pamplin was out of the picture by the time their divorce was finalized.

Every fan is of course going to make their own decision about how much they want to delve into the personal lives of these people, but the point at which you pick up any sort of biography or autobiography of any of these people, you have to know you're going to get some degree of the personal stuff.

I personally don't need to put my fingers in my ears when the icky stuff starts to come up. Rocky Pamplin was a slimy dude across the board. But he unfortunately was there for a period of time and had information and details pertinent to that era. And, some of the people who brought him into their lives were knowingly bringing a slimy dude into the situation.

And, as seedy and dysfunctional as the Rocky situation was at times, the more salacious version of those stories is far from the darkest story involving the Beach Boys over the years. There's stuff that hasn't even been published that's far more icky in my opinion.

And also, these are human beings, who sometimes made bad decisions or did questionable things.

 Diane Rovell and Ginger Blake both gave interviews for the Brian Wilson Biography on a&e network about 20 years ago. However, Diane didn’t discuss anything about a potential intimate relationship with her brother in law. Most likely the details of that will remain private

I'm in agreement with all of the above. When you follow a 'celebrity' or any famous person inevitably lots of personal information comes out. Even famous historical people have their private lives discussed in detail. And though none of our business, of course it is interesting if we have followed the stories.  No doubt there is more that is even worse and perhaps some of that will come out. In a way, I hope not. Rock stars often had and still have colourful private lives and we should also remember the saying 'judge not lest ye be judged'.

Thirded.