The Smiley Smile Message Board

That is a crime

The 2000 CD remaster sounds great.  Doesn't need remastering. A deluxe set with a couple discs of alternates and outtakes? Sure.

I agree that the LP and CD masters are pretty good sounding.  I recall hearing a few remixes of 15 Big Ones back when I was in Beach Boys Land that really did enhance the material, but Love You is a really nicely engineered record.

Shady, what issues do you have with the existing masters?

I am drooling when I think about the cool goodies that could be buried in the backing tracks of 15BO. I have a distinct feeling there are some real undiscovered gems on that album if some backing track only versions were released, or other assorted remixes.

It's flawed but there are definitely some great things in there. I think something like that with new mixes would be a revelation.

I don't have any issues to be honest, it does sound great. I should have been specific, I was thinking more of the fact it hasn't been touched in 20 years.

What really prompted me to make this topic was the fact I was listening to "love you" just today and it hit me, this is a classic record and deserves exactly what hey jude said a deluxe set which obviously would include a remaster, Mark Linett and his team could do a lot with it.

I really take issue with capitols handling of the beach boys later day catalogue. Think of Dylan, the stones,, the beatles, every album gets the royal treatment.

"love you" needs an update and I would love to see it while all the band is still around.

The album (along with all their other albums) were remastered a few years ago for both high resolution and vinyl:

https://store.acousticsounds.com/index.cfm?get=results&searchtext=Beach+Boys+Love+You

I can't see Capitol making The Beach Boys Love You a high priority for remastering. Right now, we are waiting for a box set containing material from the Sunflower/Surf's Up era.

Said it before, will always say it:

The Beach Boys Love You is Brian at his most honest and straightforward. If there's ever one single source that will tell you all you need to know about him, it's that album.

Yeah it's certainly his most convoluted and polarizing album.  The production is horrible, yet at the same time perfectly fits and enhances the material on that album.   :shrug

I personally would love to have a stab at remixing 15 BO and LY. Just saying:lol

What exactly makes the production “horrible?”
Its synthesizers, gated reverb and keyboards.
Compared to some other albums in the 70s and 80s, its produced and mixed very well.
All the vocals come through clear unlike parts of surfs up, it’s not mixed horribly like So Tough, it doesn’t sound cheap like KTSA, and it’s extremely warm unlike parts of BB85 and SIP

I'll put it this way: how would an album like Pet Sounds be received if Brian had used all those cheesy "farting" synthesizers to record it?

I'm beginning to not like remasters at all. The more I listen to them, the more sterile they sound compared to the originals (even if there is some additional clarity). So I'm not sure why one would need to remaster something at all, let alone every 20 years.

Then I guess I don't like him very much.
For starters: Brian, couldn't you coax better vocals out of your brothers, especially Carl?

Carl was going through a lot of sh*t at the time. I actually hated this period of his voice.

If he had released an album like that in 1966 he’d be even more of a pioneer than he already was!

Besides some of us like the production :(

Listening to both 15 Big Ones and Love Ypu on good quality headphones shows to me there were some killer tracks in some cases marred by some poor song choices and backup vocals on the former and in truth both albums could benefit from a remix IMHO. Except Let Us Go On This Way, which was a complete beast of proto new wave. If only Mike had sang better on the bridge...

So prototype Moogs are cheesy? There's a reason they're still used heavily in the indie rock world and still sell well starting at $800+. Hell, there's even a music festival named after the synth/man that invented it.

You would be surprised, but some people actually criticize Pet Sounds for over orchestration. They say that the orchestra’s make the songs overwhelmingly sappy and overimportant.
Now obviously I disagree with those people, but any production can be disliked. It doesn’t make the production horrible though.
I’m not a big MIU fan, but even I can tell that its well produced. I just don’t particularly enjoy the production choices.
Likewise, I love Smiley Smile, even though most people would describe it as underproduced, which it is. Smiley Smile does have horrible production. But that doesn’t make it a bad album. Production doesn’t always equal quality.
I can sit and tweak a songs production until that song is so clean that you can’t hear one little mistake, but the song might still suck.
Or, I could record a song in 5 minutes, pay no mind to the production, and it could be amazing.
Now obviously a well produced song is better on the ears. But as I said, production and quality don’t always go hand in hand

I wouldn’t say Smiley Smile is underproduced so much, as that was the aesthetic Brian was going for. Hearing the backing tracks and works in progress in stereo was a revelation.

does anyone think that the song "rock 'n' roll music" was a hit, in part because of the fuzzy MOOG sound?

While obviously the "love you" album wasn't a hit despite having that sound all over it, the songs were probably just too weird and there was no record company support. But one year earlier, not only was "rock 'n' roll music" a famous cover and the bicentennial during a patriotic time, but I suspect the slightly modern twist that BW gave to it could be what helped the song become a hit.

On the other hand, it's also possible that it became a hit in spite of that sound. What does everyone think?

Actually, the gated reverb on the drums presaged the pop music of the ‘80s.

I would like to see a Brians Back Era cd set, 3 cds remixed, first disc would be 15 BOs with the songs originally recorded for it but were left off as bonus songs, and demos and alt takes. disc 2 with Love You and as bonus tracks all the tracks done as Stack O Tracks and disc 3 more demos,early Love You mixes, single mixes, and Adult Child. but please don't wait for 2027 for an anniversary release , this one should be released within the next couple years, should be an ACTUAL cd, and not just a download only release. HINT HINT!!

I'm pretty sure there are more factors than just one for RNRM becoming the big hit. First, there was a lot of promotion, namely the Brian's back campaign. Everyone was eager to hear new Brian produced BBs material. Second, the song is a beloved and great Chuck Berry tune. Third, the single version is a cool, rocking track. Looking at what would shortly after that happen in terms of punk, this record is actually quite a relevant record, although being an oldie by a group that already existed 15 years at this point.
But in the end, just a great and fun record! Forget the album version, though

I truly do not know why the single mix of Rock And Roll Music wasn't used on 15BO. The single has so much energy- largely due to the Moog and Dennis' drumming- both of which are almost completely mixed out on the album version. The album version lacks all of the life that made the single version a hit. The single version is in my top 10 BBs songs, and the album version is almost unbearable. The single mix is so fucking badass. Love the Moog and compression.

15BO features some of Brian's best backing tracks. Blueberry Hill, Just Once In My Life, Palisades Park, and In The Still Of The Night feature breathtaking tracks. Great layers of guitars, keys, synthesizers... The vocals are dodgy, but the tracks are out of this world.

I think Brian's Moog sound found in the "Brian's Back" era was awesome. Such a fat, monster tone. Makes the whole track come alive. 

Comparing Brian's original Smile mixes with the Smiley Smile version of "Heroes and Villains", Al Jardine called it "a pale facsimile ... Brian re-invented the song for this record ... He purposefully under-produced the song.”
there’s also a quote from Carl I believe, where he says, “this album wasn’t produced, merely recorded.”

Thats the original mono mix, which is superior to the stereo mix. Every other album I prefer stereo, but this one’s different. The mono is so DIY, and sounds almost like it wasn’t meant to be recorded. The stereo mix is so digital and clean that it removes all the charm of the album for me. They removed every pop, crackle, background sound, pretty much anything that made this album unique. The stereo just sounds so sterile.

Every album that was originally put out in mono, I prefer in mono, meaning everything up until Friends. Brian’s more complex arrangements on Today, Summer Days, Pet Sounds, ‘Good Vibrations’ and Smile in particular are  a must in mono to me. So too with the pared down, home made goodness of Smiley Smile and Wild Honey. I really don’t like the clean feel of the stereo remix of Wild Honey. Take some of the soul away.

Its all personal taste. Personally I like the stereo mixes, with some exceptions.
Obviously Smiley Smile I’ll take mono any day.
Little Deuce Coupe, Shut Down, Vol. 2, and All Summer Long all need refreshed stereo mixes.
SDV2 needs to be updated with the 2009 mix of Don't Worry Baby, the 2012 mix of The Warmth of the Sun, the 2013 mix of Why Do Fools Fall In Love, and the 2014 mix of Pom Pom Play Girl.
ASL needs the 2007 mix of All Summer Long, and a new mix for Hushabye.
As for Wild Honey, I love the stereo mix. You can here so much detail thats buried in the mono. Also, Wild Honey was not thrown together like SS, there is extreme attention to detail. Every sound is meant to be heard, the reason the mono mix sounds gritty is clearly just because of limits to 1967 home studio technology.
Also, Friends needs a complete remix

I don’t mind the reissues of Surfin’ Safari through the Christmas Album being in stereo. Today through Wild Honey just sounds better in mono. I’m glad many like the stereo remixes though.

As for Friends, I would agree about the need for a stereo remix.

I should probably clarify...I prefer it in mono, just pointing out that hearing it in stereo revealed that there was more creativity in the production than I imagine many thought was there when it first came out. I’ve always considered it more stripped down rather than underproduced. Hope that made some sense.

I do have a copy of the 45 and the album, but I can't detect a difference. Please explain.

The single uses a very different mix, the instruments are much more punchy and louder and IIRC even some vocals are missing that are on the album version.

Album version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzyLAfOGc4U

Single version: https://youtu.be/9LCEmLw81HQ?t=20

I can’t hear that big of a difference between the two, but that might partially be because I’ve never cared much at all about the band’s version of ‘Rock And Roll Music’, with it’s obnoxious nasally vocal from Mike and the ham fisted arrangement. Now, this is where a lot of Love You haters (probably Lonely Summer...hi Lonely!) come in and point out my apparent hypocrisy because the production aesthetic is essentially the same on both LY and 15 Big Ones (often abbreviated as 15BO, which has led me to nickname it 15 Body Odor, like that’s the level at which the record stinks. On the same scale, SIP would be something like 1000 BO. ANYWAY...). I would argue that Brian as a producer, arranger and writer was more engaged and enthused making Love You, it shows in the music, which is incredibly delightful, or as Brian’s shirt from the period said, Love You is
(https://cdn.beeradvocate.com/data/avatars/l/190/190183.jpg?1390786192)

Sorry, what were we talking about again? Oh yeah, ‘Rock And Roll Music’. It’s forgettable, as my above rant made abundantly clear.

On the topic of "love you", how did solar system make the MIC box set over the likes of honkin' or roller skating child.

Solar system is easily my second least favourite song on the record

Perfect time for me to say this...Shady, every time i think of love you I think of your signature :lol

 :lol

Still one of the weirdest facts I have read on this board  :lol

Sir, there is no limit to the amount of weird facts about our favorite band. I’m sure if the band had ever released Adult/Child, the LP would have included a training bra that you’d have to unfasten just to pull the record out of the sleeve.

I’m assuming this is the same bra that they supplied the little Tomboy with?

That wasn’t a joke???

If someone finds a picture of The Beach Boys Love You condom (not likely), please with all haste post it here. I just Googled it and now I hate having that in my search history.

I sincerely hope that the packaging, if any, included a line from one of the album's tracks as a promotional motto or something. You know, like "We'll make sweet love till the sun goes down, we'll even do more when you're mama's not around". With fine print warning against unprotected underage sex.

Ahem. I have way too much time and weird stray thoughts on my hands, as do we all.

No, Moogs in general are not cheesy.  But they certainly sound cheesy in the context of this album specifically.


Yeah, I tend to doubt Pet Sounds would have received nearly the acclaim it did if Brian had applied the Love You sound to it.  It just doesn't fit the mood.  And as I had stated in my original comment, I think the production totally enhances the quirky charm of Love You.  But objectively speaking, there is a reason this album is polarizing to fans.  You really have to "get" Brian and where his head was at during this time to appreciate the hidden brilliance going on here.  With the clunky, lo-fi production and odd, childish and banal lyrics to most of the songs, this is not an entry-level album I would introduce to folks curious about the band.  Unless of course they happened to be huge fans of the band They Might Be Giants.   :lol

To 37!ws I agree and yet I feel Pet Sounds also has an equal claim to that title. They both represent Brian's honest emotions and interests expressed in music he was fully in control of. However with PS he was trying to impress people and pull out all the stops (professional musicians, hired lyricist), so in that regard its making a deliberate effort to be presentable. While LY is like punk rock Brian, no figs to give, no effort to tuck in the shirt or comb the hair, "come as you are." Its more of a warts and all approach where he even wrote his own words, and while theyre not technically "good" they just kinda work for what hes going for.

To Awesoman I think I know what you mean when you call the production "horrible" though I disagree. Im not a fan of synths and other "fake" instruments either. I expected to hate LY when I first listened to it and was very pleasantly surprised. Its just Brian was THAT talented he could make it sound good despite my bias. To me it just shows that guy was #1 and could make any musical style sound good if left to his own devices. (Ok, maybe not rap if Smart Girls is any indication, but I blame my misgiving for BW88 and Sweet Insanity on Landy, honestly.)

The production of Love You is perfectly functional for the album, synths and all. And that kind of lo-fi production would have been reusable for other works.
Imho, the (only) problem with Pet Sounds is the sheer completeness and perfection of its production. You can do such a thing only once... from the second time, it would be like "copying yourself", or, as it it has been called, "Brian by the numbers".
Indeed, after PS Brian has been at his best with sparse productions, and at his worst with "lush" productions. Just compare NPP with TLOS.

I mostly agree. There is a part of me that would like a "Love You w/ Pet Sounds style production/arrangement" as I think someone in this thread said earlier, but also the album is a perfect 5/5 for me as it is. If given the choice I wouldn't have said "yes, give me a Brian album with farty synths and smoker's voice" but once you hear it, it just works. The perfect definition of wabi sabi.

I disagree though that Brian could/should have only done the full wall of sound thing once. I'd gladly take 3 more Pet Sounds style albums in place of Wild Honey, Friends and 20/20 but that's just me.

As far as using NPP as a negative example against TLOS, I don't think it's a coincidence the former has Thomas as a co-producer and the latter is credited to Brian alone (at least according to a quick wiki search). I know Thomas-bashing is quickly becoming my new niche and maybe Im already wearing it out but yeah. I just don't like his production, what can I say? Im hoping against hope that if any rougher demos exist in the vaults somewhere we might get stripped down remixes of Imagination and the some of the rest.