The Smiley Smile Message Board

http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/whats-on/music/music-interview-mike-love-on-the-beach-boys-endless-summer-1-8527766

Nothing terribly new here, though he still says Brian's "life is pretty much dictated by others."

No, nothing new whatsoever. Just the same old I did this, I did that crap from the King of All Ungrateful Scumbags.  ::)

This is the same old interview and was almost not worth even commenting on, but I find this rather amusing:


Okay, so in this very same interview he talks about how he wrote the lyrics to a number 1 song during a 30 minute drive to the studio without Brian in the car with him. So I guess I'm confused why the "problem" with the 2012 album was that Mike wasn't allowed to sit in person with Brian writing lyrics when he gives evidence in the same interview that he is perfectly capable of writing number 1 lyrics without Brian present.

Honest question here: Does Mike seriously have a legitimate gripe about not being able to spend time alone with Brian?

If your cousin sued you, your wife, friends, and business partners over a laughably trivial matter (re the 2005 lawsuit), said "you better start writing a real big hit because you're going to have to write me a real big check." to you after a deposition for said lawsuit, is it THAT far out of the ordinary that your management would shy against you writing alone with this person just a little over 5 years later?

At this rate I will have stock answers to Mike's stock gripes about life.

The other thing, also well hashed out in past threads admittedly, is that Brian and Mike were out on the road for months in 2012 without Melinda. Mike was spending more daily time with Brian than he had since 1981 or so. Yet he never broached the subject of writing a tune with Brian pre-soundcheck or something? We have accounts from people who were there that have said nobody was keeping Brian from Mike. They were on tour, a keyboard was always within quick reach. Why didn't Mike instigate something songwriting-wise?

I'm not sure if it was in Mike's book (never read it and won't) or the Rolling Stone interview, but I read somewhere that Brian was alone in a car with Mike and Jackie at some point on the tour, and that they had a great time during that drive. Seems like that would be an opportune time to bring up collaboration.

In fairness to Mike, talking about a collaboration is of course different from actually doing it. I sense (and one would think Mike would realize this too) that Brian may well not particularly want to work with Mike, but when the topic comes up, he may kind of give vague, open-ended answers ("oh yeah, we should maybe do that some time").

Now, it's Brian's right to answer any such questions however he wants to.

I think if Mike would specifically say that he approached Brian with a song while on tour and Brian turned him down or something, then at least we would know Mike actually tried. But if he did that, two things would happen: He wouldn't be able to hold up various "handlers" as the reason he's being kept from Brian. Secondly, he'd maybe get a negative answer that he doesn't want to hear. I don't think Mike has often if ever been rejected, to his face, by Brian. As in, "no, I don't want to write songs with you." I don't think Mike thinks Brian feels this way. It's way easier to assume somebody else is keeping Brian from Mike.

But we're now on nearly five years (if not more) of Mike's "get Brian alone in a room" supposition, and not once have I seen him even pose the question or even slight possibility that maybe *Brian* doesn't want to write with him. Who wouldn't at least *wonder* about that?

Indeed, Brian basically says in his book that writing alone with Mike in a room just isn't how he does things anymore. Pretty simple.

Someone brought up a possible reason for Mike's usual "alone in a room" response a while back: it's an easy excuse to explain to people why the C50 didn't continue.

Right now, to the average person who reads these interviews, Mike has a legitimate gripe as to why the Beach Boys are not together anymore. To those of us here who know more about what goes on it seems like a really flimsy excuse. I mean Mike basically says it himself in this very interview: I can write #1 songs by myself in 30 minutes but the problem with the C50 album was that I had to write songs by myself. It's a flimsy excuse to us but it makes Mike look like the victim to most.

I would want nothing more than these guys to be together again. But there are SO many factors at play: the history of Mike with lawsuits against Al, Brian and those close to him, etc. Brian's current mental health issues. Mike's ongoing public critiques of Brian's current mental health and physical shape. Management on both sides. The issue of having to lay off band members from both bands if the two sides stayed together indefinitely. Clashes between Mike and whoever Brian chooses to write with for future BB albums.

It isn't as simple as a room with a piano in it.

It's like BW sitting at a piano with Mike staring at him with a baseball bat.

One would think that 'he' would have gotten used to it back when Brian was writing songs with Jan Berry...and Roger Christian...and Gary Usher...and Tony Asher...and Van Dyke Parks...and Joe Thomas and Scott Bennett.

Even back when 'who's his arse' held some semblance of sway in regard to the lyrics and the added bow bow bows ... Brian frequently wrote  W / O  him.  Then Brian decided that he wanted the Beach Boys to provide a more mature, total package, musical option for the fans to sink their brains and souls into and at that point what's his face got all pissy and 'nourishment and revengeful'.

That he gives the impression that Brian doesn't want to or is not being allowed to 'create' with him is just so much smoke and mirrors.  Really?  It's NEVER been that way.  Brian was pulling away from the early-on 'formulatic' creativity and he was actively trying out different collaborators well before Pet Sounds.  That he had less and less time for the 'do it again'...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and again...and, yet, again offerings oozing from the pen of 'his knibbs' speaks directly to why they no long play piano cheek to cheek.

THAT is the truth of the matter...and 30 years of bitching and moaning will never alter the FACT that 'the wizened old Sniveler' is only barely a nostril hair north of being merely a one trick pony.

Yes they wrote a number of hits and even more songs together.  No they are not [even though HE thinks they are] Lennon and McCartney.  [But then again even THEY stopped being THAT.]

In the RS article while working on one of the new songs, Mike holds a imaginary gun to his head and pulls the trigger.  A good enough reason to NOT write with the guy right there.

Add some, can you get me and OSD backstage to interview Mike? >:D

They couldn't fit the piano in the car...

iPhone apps Billy! ;D

Just looked at the RS article from '16, couldn't find the instance you refer to (though admittedly I didn't read the entire thing again). But Mike's line referring to Brian's first autobio "At the risk of being facetious, it's my favorite book I never read, because what books have you ever read that paid you a million dollars?" is also enough to not want to write again with this guy.

It's one of the most unfortunate circumstances in the life of a musician: being held captive with pills and abuse by a therapist who is supposedly there to treat decades of drug abuse and mental health issues and it's apparently a joking matter that Brian got sued for 7 figure digits because of a pathetic "auto"biography (that I am under the impression that Brian had little to do with the writing of it) released during this era of abuse?

Mike had/has every right to be bitter about being misrepresented (and had/has every right to set the record straight), but in joking about this he makes it appear that he completely misunderstands the seriousness of the situation Brian was in at the time. It's probably this same misunderstanding that had/has him talking about Brian's current prescription drug regimen as if it were a bad thing that Brian's schizoaffective/bi-polar disorder is being treated with modern day medicine.

Just imagine for a moment that the roles were reversed and it was Mike under the "care" of an abusive therapist and Brian were cracking jokes about making money suing Mike during a very unfortunate time in Mike's life....we'd all think Brian was a heartless SOB. But because it's Mike we're so used to these remarks that it almost goes unnoticed.

:lol

"Chuck, would it be possible to bring a piano in here?"
"Beg pardon?"

LOL :lol

Dude... Mike SHOULD be under the care of a therapist (just not an abusive one)... but someone who would tell him that his special brand of "sarcasm" is disgustingly off-putting. Despicable and beyond immature. Even with the empathy of realizing that he was screwed out of credits unfairly for years, it doesn't give him a free pass to act like an ass for the rest of his life without being called out on it. Miming a gun blast? Anyone who acts and talks the way he does, and then publicly bemoans and complains over and over again, wondering why in the world people don't like him is seriously off his rocker. I mean literally, this is not behavior of a mentally well person, despite the fact that he keeps up all sorts of other appearances. I say that sincerely and respectfully, not as a joke or an insult.

People generally don't like other people who regularly act insensitively. Why is that hard for people (like the ones who left this board) to grasp?
 
It's very, VERY hard to like or have empathy for people who are like that (anybody know anyone like that in your own personal life? I do! It's not fun)... but I'll try to have as much empathy as I can for Mike, while firmly believing with every fiber of my being that he has been in dire need for decades to regularly see a therapist to deal with his massive narcissism. His nonstop touring is just a band-aid for the problem, but nobody in his inner circle wants to call him out on it, just like 45 and his throngs of yes men/yes women relatives who don't want to be cut out of his will.

The "imaginary gun to his head" account is from the 2012 Rolling Stone article written and published during the reunion tour.

Here's the pertinent part:

One afternoon in February, the Beach Boys crowd into the control room at Ocean Way to listen to the suite. John Stamos, the actor (a serious Beach Boys fan who often performs with Mike Love's band), stands in the back, twirling his sunglasses. When the music ends, the room falls silent. Finally, Stamos breaks the ice. "Magical," he says. Love, sitting next to me on a leather couch, has another reaction, which he demonstrates by putting his fingers into the shape of a gun, placing it under his chin and shooting himself in the head. "It's brilliant, beautiful, but I didn't write it, so it doesn't have that silver cloud on the cumulus nimbus," he says. "It's more cumulus than I probably would do."

Full article: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/the-beach-boys-last-wave-20120621

Seeing as Mike thinks this is appropriate behavior to do in public (with an interviewer from a major publication present), I suppose he'd have to be ok with a scenario where Al and Brian sit in the room while listening to Looking Back With Love, and mime a jackoff or handjob, while rolling their eyes, saying "it's cool, but we didn't write it, so it doesn't have that special touch".

I should mention that not being able to immediately connect to a song that one didn't write is not a totally invalid point. But Mike has regularly recorded and performed on tons of stuff he didn't write, both "covers" as well as tons of BB songs he didn't have a hand in (Surfer Girl, Little Deuce Coupe, Shut Down, Don't Worry Baby, most of Pet Sounds and Smile, and so on).

In this particular episode, Mike comes across as he often does and I think many of us have experienced. The guy in the room kind of making a joke but still kind of being serious about it, who does or says something clearly inappropriate to the tone of the situation and other people present, who probably just thinks people don't "get" his "sense of humor."

If this is the type of stuff Mike did in the mid-late 60s with Brian's material, doing this weird passive-aggressive thing where he *does* sing on the material, and might even *say* it's "brilliant", but then do or say something clearly indicating intense negativity, then it's not surprising Brian isn't chomping at the bit to work with Mike again.

This goes back to the issue of, if this is what Mike does and says in interviews and in the presence of writers, then WTF could be going on behind closed doors sometimes?

Keep in mind, Mike is doing this *in front* of a Rolling Stone reporter who could be writing a cover story to help promote the reunion tour/project, and doing this *before* the album is even finished or tour begun. This is where everybody is on their best behavior and even then he can't hide some level of contempt.

I can only imagine how indignant Mike would have been if Al had derided, say, "Summer in Paradise" upon playback.

Exactly. Brian, of all people, has been mind-f*cked every which way from day 1 by people who show him love... then sh*t on him... show him love... then sh*t on him. It's the worst thing, because it would be easier to give Mike the boot if he were just rude and a jerk all the time. I'm sure Mike means well in many ways lots of the time, and I'm sure he has his caring side and legitimately loves Brian. And I'm sure Brian knows that.

But Mike's also unaware that this behavior pattern can really screw people up. Of course, it's the actions of a screwed-up person who would regularly act that way in the first place. I know these guys were all screwed up for many reasons, but again... it becomes a situation where it should not be rocket science to understand the toxicity of dealing with a person like that, especially when they are family. I do not get why people think it's smart for Brian to be involved in a toxic relationship with a songwriter who literally will never learn or never change.

I feel quite confident in thinking that if Al had the temerity to act out in the same super-sarcastic, petty and immature way back in 1992 IN PUBLIC, in front of a major reporter, that he'd be given the boot for good.

And I have little doubt in thinking that Mike believes that a double standard is perfectly acceptable because he likely thinks that everyone in the band OWES HIM big time for cowriting many hits, and that he deserves special treatment to act however he wants to act.

I seriously think this thought process drives his every action within the band, and has for decades.

I should also say that Brian isn't above constructive criticism, and he maybe doesn't get that often enough.

If Brian is putting together something potentially sub-par, he shouldn't be above criticism. But the guy giving the criticism can't be Mike Love, because he doesn't have the temperament or credibility to do it. And of all the things to criticize, that ending suite on TWGMTR isn't one of them.

Someone should have been telling Brian that some of GIOMH stunk, or that "Little Children" was blargh, etc.

What nobody should have any business doing is mocking suicide to Brian's melancholy (and really, even the suite on TWGMTR isn't nearly as "emo" or melancholy as plenty of other stuff out there) songs, and complaining that they can't connect because they didn't co-write it.

Fans of bands seem to connect just fine. I like "Pet Sounds" and as far as I know I didn't co-write any of it (though Tony Asher *did* take bathroom breaks, so how would he know for sure?  :lol )

Ain't that the truth. With the incredible hardships that both Brian and Denny experienced in their lives, with as low as both of those guys got... I cannot fathom how their first cousin can make jokes about suicide.

Anyone who doesn't think that's truly sick and inappropriate behavior needs to really think about it for a while.

And now that I think about it, I'll add John Stamos to the list of yes-men who are enabling this crap behavior. I normally don't really have anything particularly bad to say about Stamos as a dude... but seriously, he should have said to Mike that this suicide joke is incredibly f*cked up sh*t to do. I don't care if it was his boss, or a musician he idolizes and is starry-eyed for. F*cked up is f*cked up.

And Stamos should've said that while the Rolling Stone reporter was present!  

Well said HJ and CD. Mike's ego is a disease of the mind at this point.

Imagine the hell there would have been for Al to pay if Al had hacked into Terry Melcher's Mac Quadra computer in 1992 (by guessing the password to be MikeRules), and hacked it to make this image the screensaver:

(http://i67.tinypic.com/eupvl2.png)

THIS 100%. I think people get disillusioned because The Beach Boys are basically seen on a much higher pedestal than the rest of us. But these guys are human just like the rest of us, humans with special gifts but humans nonetheless. Your comment about being around someone like this in real/personal life really brought to home exactly why Brian probably doesn't want to work with the guy anymore.

I know someone who is sometimes a complete joy to be around, but sometimes they can be real pricks that can ruin even the nicest day with a flippant comment. These are people you just can't be around because it brings out so much negativity in your day....and for someone like Brian that can be detrimental to his mental well-being...anyone here with depression issues can probably fully relate. Just based on the comments Mike makes about Brian/Melinda in the media and the mock-suicide incident written above, it makes one wonder if this is exactly why Mike isn't too welcome around the Brian camp anymore.

I have no doubt these guys could make some great music and have some great times together. But there is also obvious room for headaches and negativity, which I doubt is something Brian needs at all right now in his life.

edit: :lol great photoshop, CD.

Keep it online with Al Jardine! :lol

:lol

(http://i68.tinypic.com/9svwy0.jpg)

Oh my god! :lol :lol :lol

2CenturyDeprived: cool Al pic! Can you tell what from it is?

It's yoinked from the 2011 Hall of Fame induction, apparently. If you look really closely, you can tell from his slightly devious smile that Al is remembering back to the time in 1992 when he made that screensaver  ;D

http://www.reuters.com/article/entertainment-us-beachboys-idUSBRE83N1FN20120424

Al's trying to hack into TRON, I just know it.

More like BRI with Mike as the master computer! ;D