The Smiley Smile Message Board

Musician Jeff Slate and Brian seem to get along which means we get far more interesting and much longer answers than your typical "Yes" and "I don't remember" run-of-the-mill interviews:

http://www.esquire.com/entertainment/books/q-and-a/a49469/brian-wilson-memoir-i-am-brian-wilson-interview/

Thanks for that! Another good interview

.

Probably another misspelling of Jerry Weiss

.

So, the latest title for the rock and roll album is "Sensitive Music for Sensitive People." It sounds ironic to me. Could that be one of those legendary BW put-ons that Brian's brothers would reference -- Brian joking with the press? Or is he serious?

Probably a joke, although he did it in two interviews.

Thinking about naming my band's next album "Easy Listening for the Hard of Hearing" :lol

Fun fact: "weiss" is the german translation for "white"   ;D

Ahhhh, that's reiss, er, right.

:lol

VDP posted to twitter that he's pissed that Brian said he didn't want to work with him again.

 ‏@thevandykeparks  8h8 hours ago
Wilson sez he won't work with lyricists Asher or Parks again, as he's "moving on". No good deeds will go unpunished.

Van Dyke Parks ‏@thevandykeparks  55m55 minutes ago

Van Dyke Parks
I agree with that Tony Asher and I are better than that. So is Wilson. We all appreciate your kind attention!Kindness is key.

Then a couple of quotes about loyalty.

He seems to overreact sometimes, doesn't he? I guess he's still angry about Love & Mercy.

Not a fan of Parks, and this certainly adds to this. Completely blown out of proportion by him.

Also  notice he posted the BB shred video after the first tweet...

And it continues.

‏@thevandykeparks  11m11 minutes ago
Art Tatum, born Oct. 13: didn't hire a publicist to call him "genius". He simply played.  "I Got Rhythm" (solo,1940)

He is so bitter. What happened between them?

Brian has appeal beyond hipsters and music critics...Parks is jealous.

I've been confused about the "genius" tag originating with Derek Taylor. On that infamous Help Me Rhonda session in early 1965 Murry made his "I'm a genius too" remark. That indicates to me that the term was being used to describe Brian and his work well before Taylor came on the scene.

Anybody here who was around back then...can you confirm? I was under the impression that he was.

I follow VDP on Twitter. This is typical Parks. He reads or sees something in the media and he goes on a Twitter rant. I really disliked him for a while, but now I've learned to just let the crazy rants roll off my back. Some people should just REALLY not be allowed to go on Twitter.

Just ask Trump! ;)

Truth be told...much of the time, I respect Mike more than VDP. Why? Because at least he's consistent. Most of what he says and does is BS, but at least he's not wishy washy or a phony.  

I hope Brian sues VDP.

(http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/2014/article/mike-love-memoir-good-vibration-my-life-as-a-beach-boy-due-in-2016-20141120/175165/medium_rect/1416498213/720x405-453647250.jpg)

For what though.

A great interview----thanks for sharing!

With all due respect, IMO you (and others) are being rather hard on Parks. If I remember correctly, he got upset a few years ago about not being mentioned or credited for Smile in some context or other, and there may have been some additional bad feeling between them, which I suspect Van doesn't hold against Brian personally, knowing how much he is influenced by those surrounding him, and VDP is venting about it in recent years, mostly sending a message to those others. It's true also that Parks had him do the vocals on OCA, contributed old & new lyrics to BWPS, and has always up until recently consistently expressed his gratitude to Brian for giving him opportunities way back when. Stating it as "moving on" is also a little insensitive. Yes, Parks is not handling  with consummate grace, but who of us is perfect? There may also be a touch of envy, he is after all human. Of course, as my username here indicates, I might be slightly biased, but I strive for objectivity.

How is it insensitive? It's Brian's right as an artist to move on from past collaborators...artists do it all of the time. I mean, even Elton John and Bernie Taupin had a break from each other (granted, it was a huge mistake).

I think there might be other people from whom we could rightfully assume intended far more subtext to saying something like "I'm moving on" and not working with someone.

But I don't think that's the case with Brian. He's just not the type who will offer some generic, PR-friendly platitude like "There aren't any plans to work with Van Dyke or Tony, but they're great."

I don't think (and Brian's music of recent years certainly wouldn't justify) that Brian meant that he is presently doing more advanced music than what he did with Asher or Parks.

I think, much like the issue of Brian writing with Mike from scratch, Brian just doesn't want to write with these guys. I think there is something different to the situation with Mike compared to Asher and Parks. I think with Asher and Parks, Brian just doesn't want to write with them right now. Sort of like not wanting to eat pizza for dinner, or not wanting to put this song or that song in the setlist. He says nice things about Asher and Parks all the time. He doesn't want to write with them right now. In both cases, he pretty much did one singular project with each of those guys around 50 years ago, and then in both cases did a few other things with them on occasion since. Pretty much just one other song with Asher, and then a couple of projects with Parks.

They have even less "precedent" for feeling they should have an ongoing writing partnership with Brian than Mike does, and I already think Mike doesn't. So they certainly don't.

Well put

Gosh I love Van. I love his music, his personality and his words. I will listen to anything he has to say just so I can catch a glimpse of that encyclopedic brain he has stored under his noggin. But he does get big sometimes. But that's him. And what's great is that he just wipes the mud off his chest and walks away maturely. I mean he and Brian had some arguments back during Smile. Brian would put Van in his place, and as a fellow musician, he wasn't just gonna forget about it like Tony Asher. I think that's why he was the first to go. Too much buffoonery. I think you can best sum up Van's patience from that Fire sessions. Brian was sitting in his car, waiting for the vibes to get right. Van kept coming out saying "This is ridiculous. You're acting like a complete amateur."

And I totally agree with what he said about Love and Mercy. It was too much of a Melinda Wilson biopic. Plus, they TOTALLY pushed him aside in it.

The pool scene in L&M with Mike and VDP was brilliant in its symbolism.

Are you serious?! I mean, she basically saved his life. Would you prefer she was either a) not mentioned or b) sued to have a fake name put in instead?


I thought you were Mujan, but now I'm wondering if you're VDP or Loren Darro.

Now, Billy...don't get oversensitive like VDP!! And I really can't imagine that either of those two (Parks and Daro) are looking to troll their way in here...unless the PM system is showing signs of strain again, that is.

L&M is maybe just a little too Melnda-centric, since there was cooperation with the Wilson family in order to vanquish Landy and that is pretty much left out of the film. (Though I suspect that to do so would force additional scenes and length which would disrupt the narrative flow.) But her story line, when you think about it, is really compelling: you fall in love with a man who it turns out is being held prisoner by a so-called "licensed professional" without enough will power to undo what's happened to him. That part of the film, as played by Cusack and as reacted to by Elizabeth Banks, is as strange a story as just about any you could ever imagine--and it's all true. Living through that period must have been infinitely more surreal that anything we can imagine from the outside looking in. You need Melinda's perspective to get the best sense of just how strange it all was, and what it took from the inside to bring it to a halt.

As for SMiLE, VDP was correct in his assessment of what was going on, but he was no diplomat at that time, and such has never been his strong suit. He's not mellowed with age, which (strangely enough) makes him more like Mike than Brian. So that tells us that Brian looks for something in someone that he doesn't think he possesses when looking for songwriting partners. Often that "something" involves competitive elements--often, but not always. It could be that Brian has relied on his gut feelings when meeting someone, which sometimes produces shaky and untenable collaborations. Of late Brian seems to have figured out how to put more boundaries around these things, which may not have him scale the heights of creativity to the extent many fans would like to see, but it's clearly produced a more stable life for him.

We have just about all of SMiLE now from so many perspectives, and it's still a mystery. Thank goodness for that. It should remain "beautiful in its obscurity" and be a siren call for all those who want to climb it, like Everest, risking all in the thinnest air on earth in hopes of solving its riddles.

Darro actually has before, under more than one username (in fact was banned before registering under his own name)


Some things were condensed in the interest of time, yes, but the film did show Melinda contacted Audree and Carl and making them aware.

Yeah that's great, but that's not why I like Brian. I wanna see him recording H&V and California Girls in his biopics. Chewing vegetables with Paul and karate chopping Elvis.  

I think Melinda would only work in the type of Hybrid movie love and mercy is. But I'm still waiting for a Biopic about Brian in his prime. Love and Mercy focused way too much on the bed stuff.


 :lol :lol :lol :lol


Really? Why didn't you guys let him in? Everyone from the 60s never wants to talk. What did he do?

Because that's what the movie was supposed to be about...it was about Brian being a prisoner of a complete psycho and how he got out of that situation. The young/classic Brian stuff was set-up for that...showing how he got into that position in the first place!


His first account was banned for many reasons, one of which was trolling. Didn't realize it was him until after he registered under his own name (one can say he had the "purr"-fect alibi...), although it made purr-fect sense afterwards. . As far as the second time, he left of his own accord once it came out how utterly full of sh*t he was. He really thought he was the "cat's meow". ::)

Mujon.

Right.  And there's handling that with grace and then there is handling that like a baby, which is what Van and Mike have both done in their respective ways.

And at least Mike had more reason to be bitter (the whole past credits thing which he should REALLY let go).

Well said.

I dunno. I give a pass - to a degree - to VDP for being bitter, more so than Mike.  At least Mike has so, so much money in the bank. I get the feeling that Van most certainly does not, and he must feel that having been actually pushed out of this project (partly his fault for letting himself be pushed out) must have cost him untold riches,  not only in terms of what the album might have done for his career if it had come out, but how he would have probably been set for life monetarily.  I feel for Van, yet I won't deny he isn't handling feeling slighted very well.

At least with Mike, he has so much money to fall back on, despite his absurd reputation. But of course it's apples and oranges.

Seems like VDP has deleted most of the tweets...

Yeah I was looking for those. Do you think he reads the forum?

I know for a fact he does, as he's taken shots at me and some others previously.

Really? Can I get some examples?

One of them called me an "anti-intellectual", and there were some other shots...gonna try to see if they're archived...one moment...

Well hey, if SMiLE Brian is apparently Melinda, then anything is possible I guess!

:lol

I did see this thread...
http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,12345.50.html

in regards to VDP blowing up over the BB reunion...and said something about Brian , but that he'll be "moving on"...

The original article is now offline, but is used as a footnote on his wikipedia page. It's the same one he took a shot at Mike Eder on.

Insensitive in that, from him "I'm moving on" are blunt words that may reflect an adopted attitude that has been instilled, at least to some degree, by those around him, as has whatever fuel was the grounds for the ill will that seems to currently exist between the two, or, more likely, their proxies. Which is not to say that Brian is incapable of thinking for himself, just that there is still plenty of suggestibility and malleability there, if one has an agenda.

Why does it always have to be that he was "influenced" by those around him?  If Brian wanted to work with Van Dyke Parks, he'd be working with him. End of story.

We need the fear to stop album with BW! :-D

8)

Billy in Texas sounds! 8)

Saying one is "moving on" from a collaborator may be meant to be a dig, or may be innocuous. What such a phrase *doesn't* even slightly suggest is that someone "around" Brian is instilling that sentiment.

Maybe people around him do instill sentiments or attitudes. But nothing specifically regarding saying "I'm moving on" from a collaborator has one iota of a suggestion about where such a sentiment originated, anymore than anything else Brian ever says.

Exactly.

I think that you are probably incorrect in your assumptions . All I'm going to say, not going to get into it further here, waste of time.  Not claiming any inside knowledge either. BTW I agree with most of what you've said here in the past and you seem like a nice guy, peace.

How is anything he said an assumption? Nothing in that phrase suggests someone is pressuring Brian to feel that way, at all.

I really don't know where you're getting this idea from, but it is incorrect. That's not an assumption, either, but rather a statement based on knowledge.

I get the general idea, which is that some fans feel what Brian says is molded/formed/influenced by those around him.

I don't even 100% disagree. I think *all* of the Beach Boys have people around them (including but not limited to wives) who help to mold what they say, how they feel, etc. This isn't unique to the BBs or Brian. Most of us who have people in our lives have this going on to some degree. It doesn't mean we're all "whipped" or anything. And maybe some of us are that, too.

I just don't think this "I'm moving on" interview comment is a case where Melinda or someone is whispering in Brian's ear, in the eventuality that the specific topic of Van Dyke Parks comes up, to get a little dig in on VDP by saying he (Brian) is "moving on."

The whole thing where people "on the outs" with Brian will immediately assume it can't *possibly* be anything to do with them and it must be someone "around" Brian causing it, that's never going to end. I don't think anything so nefarious is always going on, but certainly politics are at play. Sure, there's probably a general vibe in the "Brian camp" that VDP has not been so nice to Brian or the people around Brian lately via VDP having zero impulse control on Twitter. But this isn't unique to Brian.

Does anyone think Jackie Love or anyone else around Mike, let's say in the late 90s or early 2000s, was trying to explain to Mike why Al Jardine was an okay guy and Mike should ease up on him? No, a bunch of lawsuits were flying and in Mike's camp, Al was on the outs.

If Brian was saying in interviews that VDP was an a-hole, and was saying that in retrospect he feels VDP's "Smile" lyrics are garbage, etc., then I'd be troubled by what's going on with Brian and his camp.

But yeah, "I'm moving on", at *worst*, might be a result of VDP not being the most positive guy about Brian and his family/operation in recent years.

Lest we not forget...anybody else recall VDP saying he was "victimized by Brian's buffoonery"?

I just don't think that Brian himself would ever say something like "I'm moving on" without some form of reinforcement from his camp. Not that they have "nefarious" motivations as such, but they keep close tabs on loose cannons or those people that they feel are lacking sufficient genuflection, which is a kid of ledger-keeping that Brian himself is not all that concerned with, by nature. I imagine that whatever went down with David Leaf being excommunicated probably falls into that category as well, without direct knowledge of the specifics.

Yes, I suppose that "you are incorrect" does imply first-hand knowledge, but I just meant that I felt strongly that it was likely that the statement was not just completely spontaneous, and had been inculcated or incited to at least some degree by other interested parties, and still do. I was also in a terse, grumpy and intolerant mood that A.M., which played a role in my unusually absolutist phraseology.

I think the VDP issue just isn't prevalent enough in the BB world or political sphere that, even if Brian were being "prepped" before interviews, that VDP would be one of the topics to go over.

I wouldn't be surprised if some sort of PR person at some point came along and suggested that Brian just avoid talking about, say, Mike Love as much as possible. Similarly, while thankfully interviews haven't brought up the Scott Bennett issue, I would imagine someone, especially earlier this year, probably helped discuss how to handle that topic if it came up.

But in the case of VDP, that would be like topic #37 for a PR person (or anyone else) to go over. I don't sense that Brian is the personality type that's going to do Presidential Debate-style prep for interviews and remember a huge list of talking points and buzzwords.

Another reason "moving on" actually does sound Brian-esque to me is that it's a weird turn of phrase to use when it comes to VDP, and seems like the very slightly idiosyncratic type of phrase Brian would use. Such a comment makes more sense when talking about an ongoing writing (or other) partnership that has just very recently ended. It would be like Brian being asked in 2008 if he's going to tour more with Al and answering "I'm moving on." That would make sense. But a collaborator who you mostly worked with 50 years ago, whom you've only occasionally worked with in recent years or decades? Even the post-1967 work Brian did with VDP wasn't often a collaborative co-writing enterprise. There were a few tracks VDP added lyrics to. But "Orange Crate Art" wasn't a co-writing situation. VDP's work on the 2000 orchestra suite wasn't either. Even his 2003/2004 "Smile" lyrics were more like a finishing job on the old work from 1967.

Much like Mike Love, VDP hasn't sat down to write a lot of songs "from scratch" with Brian in eons.

but they keep close tabs on loose cannons or those people that they feel are lacking sufficient genuflection

That is a strong statement and one which could be interpreted as a pretty low blow to hit whoever is the target with - Are you suggesting that whoever "they" might be have a scale of justice for anyone who doesn't bow sufficiently enough to Brian? Or am I reading it wrong?

Clarification may be in order.

Keep in mind too - as another poster mentioned - how many shots were fired across Brian's bow via social media posts and other outlets in recent years and what effect those could have.

I dunno, Mike in interviews and other public statements has been repeatedly more negative and sometimes insulting regarding Brian and Brian's wife than most anyone, and Brian still says complimentary things about Mike in interviews.

If there were a *strong* proclivity to actively go after "enemies" in interviews, then I think Mike would be among the first and most prominent targets.

I will say this...Mike is family, VDP is not.

A good, and interesting, point!

I don't intend to gratuitously denigrate anyone, and I don't think it's a "low blow" as such, just calling it as I've seen it over the years. Admittedly not phrased in the interests of diplomacy uber alles. You are reading it correctly. That being said, it's a delicate balance. Who knows whether Brian was "prepped" to dis VDP or not, in the end, none of us does, except insiders, who will refrain from speculating here if they want to remain insiders.

in regards to the last sentence...if they are insiders, would it still be speculation?

OK then, commenting. ::)