The Smiley Smile Message Board

When Al returned in ’63, I wonder how much the band dynamic shifted. One might perhaps assume it could potentially have been a bit odd for Al to be in the band with the guy (Dave) who took his place when Al left, especially since Al lost out on being a corporate member (with Dave being the one who benefited from that). Not that Al would have had anyone to blame but himself for that decision, but I still wonder if it was at all of a slightly weird thing for Al and Dave during that brief period of time they were together in the band (prior to Dave’s departure).

I wonder if it felt like any sort of completion between the two guys – and/or if it was discussed what would have happened to that 5-man live lineup if Brian decided to go back on the road – if Dave hadn't quit, would it have shifted to six members (the way it did on occasion when Bruce and Brian were both in the live band), or would Al have been asked to step down, and only be around for tours when needed?

And was Al welcomed back warmly, or did he get ribbed for being the guy who left, and was now a diminished, salaried member?

One other thing that also occurs to me, is that that brief '63 period with Dave and Al in the band would have been the only time (up until then) that either of those two guys had anyone who shared the common ground of being a Beach Boy not related to the Wilsons... so maybe they bonded over that.

There's a book on the subject called The Lost Beach Boy that delves pretty deeply into this era. If you have not read it yet, I recommend it. But briefly, In 1963 Dave considered Al a savior because when the group heard that Brian did not want to tour they felt that things might end right there...enter Al, he played bass and could cover Brian's vocal parts during the live shows. Problem solved.

Murry, on the other hand, was not pleased. He preferred that Brian perform at all the shows, and it was his insistence that Al not be welcomed back as an "official" member but instead as a salaried extra hand.

And to answer your other question, there were many times in '63 after Al "came back", but before David left, that Brian did go back on the road, he toured some and normally played certain high profile concerts especially on the west coast...and during those shows Al always stood down. There's plenty of photo evidence of the live lineup being Brian, Dennis, Carl, Mike and Dave after Al had already played many gigs subbing for Brian.

Bottom line is that Al and Dave got along fine in the early days although they are opposite personalities in a way. There was some tension between them when Dave returned in 1997, but that was due to confusion and weird band politics. These days David and Al are very good friends, and it's all positive.

Another thing to ponder is if Dave never quit would Bruce have ever been a Beach Boy? Was any of the other guys able to play the organ live in 1967?

Thanks Jon, and yes I certainly need to dust off my copy of The Lost Beach Boy! It is quite fascinating to think about how history might have played out differently if Dave hadn't left.

When you mentioned that Al "stood down" during the 1963 shows where Brian played, did that mean that Al didn't attend the show at all, and that he just took a few days off the road when Brian would replace him? I'm assuming these were full shows that Brian returned for, and not just a few songs where Al would just leave the stage?

I guess that type of arrangement did continue inconsistently, occasionally, during the Bruce era, where you have Bruce not travelling to Hawaii in 1967 (was he invited and just declined?) with Brian replacing him, although I guess there were shows with 6 BBS (both Brian + Bruce) in the ’60s? I’m sure some of this info is also in the In Concert book (which I own and have read), I’ve just forgotten a bunch of the tidbits :)

I would think Carl would be the most likely candidate, since he was playing some keys live in the 70s.  I can't say whether or not he'd be proficient enough to cover the organ parts at that point, though.  Would Dennis be the only other member that could have possibly done any of the keyboard work at that point in time?  I'm sure he wouldn't have really been considered for that role, being the drummer and all, just thinking out loud. 

Hey now...pretty sure that David didn't just "quit".   Murry pretty much turfed him or at least encouraged him to walk away from a bad situation.  David's recorded influence and participation includes a few of the songs on 1964's Shut Down Vol II.  Then that was it 'til the later 90's.  If HE'D have not been fired/chased away...Al would have been Mr. Bass guy...and Brian's fill-in.

So?  No Nearest Faraway Place. :3d

He definitely quit. There's no question about that. Dave parents toxic relationship with Murry was one reason, but there were others of equal weight. He just wanted out, and actually stayed months longer than he wanted to due to  the boys wishes.  Ironically he was a contracted official Beach Boy until 1967, which was a revelation to Dave that came to light in later years.

Thanks Jon! Do you ever wonder how the Beach Boys would have been different if he stuck around? If he would have endured til the Murray firing he might have stuck around. Then hopefully his song writing skills would have been used starting on 20/20. I know we would be missing out on the Marksmen and Moon in this alternate history, though.

Unless, of course, those side projects could potentially still have happened regardless. Not saying there would have necessarily been enough time in Dave's schedule for those projects to happen in the same manner as they did... but I wonder if Dave still could've been part of those bands in some abbreviated fashion if he had stayed with The BBs (after Murry's exit). After all, Mike's side projects happened in the late '70s while the band kept touring.

It's crazy to realize that Dave had just turned 15 when he quit. If he had stayed, he might well have developed into a songwriter on a par with Carl and Al.

I would argue that he already did!