The Smiley Smile Message Board

It's Friday.  It's summertime, so I just wanted to start a fun, opinion based thread. 

I had an aside about the song Kokomo in another thread.  I know it's a very polarizing song.  Most people seem to dislike it, but I'm on the other side of the fence.  For a band past their 25th year, that's a pretty good song in my opinion. 

I also said that I'd rather hear Kokomo than plenty of other songs in the BB catalog, some of which were released during their creative years 62-73.

I hope this doesn't evolve into a Mike v. Brian type thread, and I don't wish to be accused of not being a Brian fan for a couple of my choices, but here it goes....

I'd rather listen to Kokomo than:

1.  Sonny v Cassius / Our Favorite Sessions / Bull Session - I know it was a different time, and the full length album was not exactly an art form.  But these tracks mar the otherwise great Shut Down Vol 2, All Summer Long, and Today albums. 

2.  Vegetables - In any form, it's one of my least favorite BB songs.  I think its a weak link on Smile, and for the life of me, I can understand why this song is so well liked. 

3.  Take a Load Off Your Feet - This song might keep Surf's Up from being my favorite Beach Boys album.

4. Rock and Roll Music - I really had my pick of 15 Big One tracks, but I'm going with this because it should have been a classic.  The arrangement is not very rock and roll. 

5.  I Wanna Pick You Up - I could pick a couple tracks from Love You also.  It will never be in my top ten BB records.  I know it's supposed to sound innocent, but I think it sounds creepy. 

6.  Here Comes the Night (LA Version) - There's nothing I can say.  This is just bad, and at 11 painful minutes, it's borderline torture. 

7.  Keeping the Summer Alive - No offense to Carl Wilson or Randy Bachman.  I see what they were trying to do here, but it just doesn't seem to work for me. 

8.  Wipe Out - I suppose The Beach Boys saw the shot in the arm that Run DMC gave Aerosmith and decided to do a track with The Fat Boys.   I'm not a fan of the rap genre, so I can't get into this. 

9.  Summer of Love - Hands down, the first thing The Beach Boys have ever committed to tape.  Although their awful version of Under the Boardwalk gives it a run for its money.  (How did The Beach Boys screw that one up???)  It's so bad, it's laughable.

10. Barbara Ann - Thought I was going to skip this one?  I don't hate this track.  I just like Kokomo better.  And I do like Barbara Ann live. 

11. "Hey Little Tomboy"  (also creepy)

I almost included that one, but I wanted to limit my list to just ten.  I agree though. 

... anything by that sanctimonious twat Morrissey.

Andrew,

I agree with you 150%. 

But, I was strictly speaking Beach Boys tracks. 

 :)

12. "Ten Little Indians"   (Bombay?)

"Bluebirds over the Mountain"

Ah, well, in that case... "Barbara-*******-Ann", of course !  ;D

I'd rather listen to 'Kokomo' than...

1. 'My Little Tomboy', the worst BW-involved Beach Boys song in my opinion.

2. Actually, the entire M.I.U. Album besides 'My Diane' and maybe 'Wontcha Come Out Tonight'

3. 'Here Comes The Night' 1979 disco. I don't think "bleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeccccchhhhh" is a strong enough word to describe that monstrosity.

4. The entirety of the rest of Still Cruisin', minus of course the three '60s classics, and also the entirety of Summer in Purgatory.

5. Most of 15 Big Ones, with the exception of 'Had To Phone Ya', 'It's OK' and on a good day, 'Back Home'.

6. Much of the Surf's Up album. Basically anything that isn't 'Long Promised Road', 'Disney Girls', 'Feel Flows', 'Day in the Life of a Tree', 'Till I Die' and 'Surf's Up'.

7. Stupid filler like 'Denny's Drums', 'Shut Down, Part II', 'Louie, Louie', 'Our Favorite Recording Sessions', 'Bull Session with Big Daddy', 'Carl's Big Chance',  etc., etc., et f*cking cetera.

8. Most of the surf instrumentals on the first coupla albums, even though I like surf instruments and hey they're not that bad

9. Every cheesy, glossy turd of a song on the Beach Boys 1985 album (basically everything but 'It's Gettin' Late', 'Maybe I Don't Know', 'I'm So Lonely', 'Where I Belong' and 'It's Just a Matter of Time').

10. Most of Keepin' the Summer Alive, except the title track, 'Oh Darlin'', 'Livin' with a Heartache' and 'Goin' On'.

I could make a pretty big list, actually, but I'll limit it to a couple per decade.  Also going to ignore obvious novelty songs or clunkers.

60s: Surfin USA,  Surfin Safari

70s: Rock and Roll Music, Sail On, Sailor

80s: Getcha Back, Still Cruisin'

90s: Summer in Paradise, Island Fever

00s: Forever She'll Be My Surfer Girl,  Live Let Live

10s: Strange World, Sail Away

Mind you, these are all songs I like.

Summer of Love for obvious reasons.

When Girls Get Together.  Leaden.

Anything by the Minutemen

"Honey(I Miss You)-Bobby Goldsboro...no, wait a minute..."Sumaha...no, hold on "Everyon...no, I've got it," Anna L...   :whatever

OSD! :lol

... read most "My cousins did drugs" and "My music is about love" Mike/ Brian touring PR bullsh!t stories.

Great thread idea!

I'd rather listen to Kokomo than...

FINDER'S KEEPERS!! (GAH! I HATE THAT SONG! I think it's worse than Summer of Love!)

Literally any song Mike wrote about Transcendental Meditation.

Pisces Brothers

Amusement Parks USA

Barbara Ann

Take Good Care of Your Feet

I'd rather listen to 'Kokomo' by the Beach Boys [but only if it's the version with Carl] than to listen to 'Kokomo' by John Phillips.  First time I EVER heard Kokomo...it was coming out of a speaker just outside of the original 'Sam the Record Man' on Yonge St...in Toronto. I stopped, stood and listened.  [and said "Wholly Shyte!!!  THAT'S a new Beach Boys' song!!!!!!!!!"  T'was the first one in quite awhile.

I liked it.  I was 100% GLAD to hear it.  I was also 100% glad that it was entirely successful.  No poilitics.  Just a great Beach Boys' song.  Summer in Pair of Dice?  Not so much.

I guess that'll NEVER happen again. :(

I'd rather listen to "Kokomo" than "Santa's Got An Airplane".

Passing Friend

Summer of Love

Lady Liberty

Kokomo (Spanish version)

I rather enjoy "Kokomo" (AND my cassette of "Summer In Paradise" and CD of BB'85) so it'll be easier for me to pull this off than most other fans.

I'd rather listen to "Kokomo" than:

1. A Day In The Life Of A Tree-Sheer embarrassment. When I try to turn somebody on to the true talents of the Beach Boys I would NEVER dream of using this track...It's be like trying to turn on somebody to Uriah Heep with "Come Away Melinda" or somebody to the mighty Todd Rundgren with "Emperor of the Highway"!

2. Take A Load Off Your Feet-..........and I'm the guy with the friggin' foot fetish and I STILL can't get into this track!

3. School Day-I've heard rock'n'roll played with more authority on the 80s children's TV show, Fraggle Rock......and that has to be the most retarded sounding background vocals I've ever heard....even if it is on key.

4. When Girls Get Together-Shows that even during the musical highpoint of the Sunflower days there could still be really awful crap that could be recorded. There doesn't need to be an explanation why this was left on the cutting room floor (originally). Maybe they had to have SOMETHING on Keepin' The Summer Alive to make the rest of the album seem better than it is (and half of the album I like....probably all relative after being exposed to "When Girls Get Together")

5. California Calling-From an album I otherwise love. This may be tied with "School Days". Sounds like a pastiche of Beach Boys cliches by session musicians and session vocalists for a car lot commercial.

6. Heroes and Villains-I just never could 'connect' with this track.....and I really enjoy the rest of Smiley Smile!

7. Luau-Cheesy and dorky enough to be something that Opie and his band would play on the Andy Griffith Show.

Tracks like those listed above may account for why I have much more fondness for BB'85, SIP, and TWGMTR than a lot of other listeners do.

I'd rather listen to Kokomo than the rest of "Still Cruisin'"
But I really like Kokomo because it reminds me of Elisabeth Shue's breasts.

I'd rather listen to Kokomo over anything off 15 Big Ones, Love You, BWPS, That Lucky Old Sun, TWGMTR or No Pier Pressure.

You, sir, are a brave man.

All I Want to Do

Be Here in the Mornin'

Disney Girls

Don't Go Near the Water

and a little over half of Smiley Smile

Music shouldn't be about what some of your friends might think about it.

I wouldn't. >:D

Nobody's forcing you to.  ;)

...than get a colonoscopy.

Thanks for the reminder. I need to schedule one for next month.

...than any other song with only K, M and O in the title.

All of the Surf's Up album except for the title track and Til I Die.

All of the 1985 album except for Getcha Back

All of the L.A. album except for Good Timin'

All of the Holland Album except for Sail On Sailor

All of the Party Album

All of the MIU Album

All of Smiley Smile except for Good Vibrations and Heroes and Villains

To be fair, Im a massive, massive SMiLE fan and always felt the same way...until the TSS re-edit of the track. That really made it come alive and sound like a finished, worthy inclusion for me. Until then, mix after mix, it never seemed to *pop* or fit in for me. It always seemed too slow and if the mix was based on BWPS, too jarring a transition. Now I like it a lot more, but its still one of the SMiLE tracks I dont find myself listening to by itself as opposed to the others.

Huh!  Except for the nasty prep, I've got no problemo with the procedure; and I love that waking up time; if only I could take those meds home!

.....Elise Keaton on Family Ties when she'd don the fringe vest and moccasins, dust off the ol' acoustic guitar, gather up Steven and the kids in the living room, and warble any number of 60's folk songs.

Just when I thought I'd discussed every possible subject on this board... :P  Yeah, the actual procedure is easy. The nurse sticks an IV into the top of your hand, asks you to lay on your side, in 30 seconds you're out like a light, and 30 minutes later it's over. Now, the day before...you don't wanna go there...

Right! To boldly go where no man has gone before.....

I'm brand new to this board and I realize I might be making a pariah of myself after all of three posts so far, but for me it's

When I Grow Up to Be a Man

For some reason it has always made me crazy, not in a good way.  There's something about the harmonies in the chorus that's like fingers on a chalkboard for me.  I also find the verses rather plodding. 

Wow dude what do you like?  :lol

Than.....

1. You're So Good To Me - just bland IMO
2. Dance Dance Dance - not sure why I think it might be Brian's vocals in the chorus tho
3. Crocodile Rock - I'd rather gouge my eyes out with a rusty spoon

Finally, maybe unpopular

Solar System - I don't think the lyrics are profound or simplistically symbolic in any way I just think its a weak song

I'd probably put Kokomo in their top 25 songs or so.  It's a very good song in my opinion.  I've never understood why people don't like it.  As a matter of fact, everybody I know DOES like it.  The women I know tend to like it more than pretty much any other Beach Boys song. 

I'd rather listen to Kokomo than Barbara Ann, or Summer in Paradise.

Because it was a hit and Brian Wilson had absolutely nothing to do with it.

A simple way to prove the point...Wipe off all existing credits of the song and insert "written by B. Wilson" or "produced by B. Wilson". Same song, different credit. Do you think the people who vilify the song would then feel differently about it? I can see comments like "he's still got it" and terms like "genius".

I would rather Listen to Kokomo than listen to Kokomo, not the spanish version but the original version because one of my personalities (Bob) Likes it the other (Josh) doesn't, my third (Susan) doesn't care either way and, wait no not right now I'm typing this, I'm not going to Kill right now, remember what happened last time we killed? No leave me alone, no  won't, please I don't want you bothering me! But we made a pact you must do my bidding! But I'm busy typing on this forum right now. You told me you would do it. But I don't want to do it!I'm tired of those virgin sacrifices that you want me to do,, But I need their blood to survive,..sigh, okay, at least let me finish typing this.. Okay Dude just meet me in the ally way in a half hour! Okay see you then.... Now where was I before Bob interrupted me, oh yeah Kokomo is a decent song but Bob likes it better than I I think that I need to go now..Hey Good Looking!! Oh no, now Susan is coming through! What are you doing? well I'm just typing on this Beach Boys forum! You want to have a quickie before you meet Bob? okay meet me in the other room,,, now Kokomo was a pretty good hit song and, wait I hear susan calling, she's the impatient type,,talk to you all later...

1). I actually like the song, minus the sax solo
2) If Brian had written or produced it, it would sound completely different.

Speaking of that sax solo...Oldies 98 in Philly has for years done one of those travel contests where listeners can win a tropical Bahamas getaway vacation or something. I rarely if ever listen to Oldies 98 anymore because their PD at some point decided "Footloose" and "Jack And Diane" were oldies and the actual oldies were scrubbed from the playlist.

But anyway, this contest: Whenever they announced or had the winning listener on the air, they'd run that sax solo in a loop, over and over and over again for as long as the DJ read his copy. That opening note "buuhhhhWEEEEEE...." ad nauseum, stuck in an infernal loop as the bed music for a radio promotion, played throughout the day.

That I could deal with to a point I suppose, but add to it Footloose and Johnny Cougar...ZIP, BOOM, POW...I'm outta there.  ;D

Can we have a SS Kokomo sax solo contest?  :afro

Firstly, I like Kokomo and think it's a cool tune. One of Mike's better lead vocals, and Carl is super on it. I don't think it's anywhere near their '60s peak, but I dig it quite a bit. I do not understand the hate for the song. I rock out to it. I do not get sick of hearing the tune.  I would like the song to be thought of as a solid tune that was an unexpected big hit, and for it to not be dogged on mercilessly.  

That said, I think you are right to a point, that if Brian had involvement, that it would be thought of more highly, because people are more forgiving of Brian Wilson for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that he is a survivor who's been to hell and back, and he also has the attractive underdog quality of modesty.

I think that because Mike Love over-hypes this song to an absurd degree in interview after interview, going well beyond someone having "pride" in their work, that such continued self-praise makes lots of people feel more negatively about the song (the song being overplayed in the '80s doesn't help, either). Just remember the look on Carl's face when Mike comes off as very smug circa 1990 in a Japanese (I think?) sit down interview when he brags about Kokomo. Carl looks embarrassed by Mike's ridiculous self-praise! And pssst... here's a secret: it ain't just Carl that feels/felt that way!

It's simply not a song that's in the same league as their prime material, but Mike (and only Mike) continues to attempt to elevate it well above where it probably should rank in terms of great/very good songs in their catalog. That specific, repeated action rubs people the wrong way, because whether or not Mike intends for it to come off as such, when he makes as big a deal as he does about Kokomo, for decade after decade, it gives the impression that he is bragging about writing a song without Brian's involvement (with that in and of itself being the main bragging point, even if indirectly). Whether or not that rubs you the wrong way personally, you should be aware of how that is a turnoff to many, many people.

If instead of it being a John Phillips-penned song, if Kokomo was a Van Dyke Parks-penned song that Mike happened to write a few extra lyrics for, and it went to #1, would Mike continue to praise and praise and praise it in 10,000 interviews? Somehow I'm not so sure, because I don't think Mike wants to see VDP critically elevated anymore in BB history than he already has. Why wasn't Mike going on in interview after interview about how great John Phillips' work was on the song, which as far as I know was largely Phillips' baby?  It's just a giant ego trip for him, which most people do not want to see, and which makes both the song and him come off as less praiseworthy than if there was more modesty about it. And if TWGMTR had gone to #1 (which it almost did!), we'd also not see the same level of Endless Gushing for that album as we do with Kokomo.

What if Wipeout was a #1 hit, and Mike had written a few new lyrics for it (and had sang on it, without just a wall of Brians)? Would that song deserve to be continually brought up in the same sentence as Good Vibrations by Mike? At a certain point, there should be a line drawn where having pride in one's work can be differentiated from overhype to a degree where most people think the level of self-praise is comical.

Mike really likes the song because

1. it was one of their biggest hits
2. it was years after everyone had thought they'd never have a big hit again
3. it was in a movie

So really, I don't mind him bragging about it.  As a matter of fact, I find it funny when he brags about it, and chuckle to myself, and think "Oh Mike.  there you go again, being all Mike and everything"

WTF?   ??? ??? Really? Those are good reasons to pontificate year after year after year after year after year about one stupid song?? Just goes to show how insecure he is. Creditmonger at best.

... but yet you pontificate on and on and on about your hatred for another man, whom you've never met, year after year after year while you live out the last few months of your miserable life. 

How you don't see the irony in that is beyond me

But I always think "okay, Mike, if you're so talented in a commercial way, where were the big hits to follow up on a worldwide #1 smash?" Any other band would kill for that kind of career momentum. but the Beach Boys being the Beach Boys, they waited a full year to issue a followup, Still Cruisin - which to be fair, went top 10 on the A/C chart, but did nothing on the pop charts. And the album was yet another hodgepodge of new and old songs. Mike did finally get around to releasing his vision of what a post-Kokomo BB's album should be, SIP...and it was their poorest seller ever. Yep, Mike Love sure had his pulse on what was commercial. NOT!