The Smiley Smile Message Board

Out of all the Beach Boys stuff I've ever read & collected and seen online there isn't a single shred of credible coverage of SMILE as far as that project is concerned dealing with the insight and illumination & religious philosophy possible via LSD. I've never seen this stuff mentioned ever! Yet this is clearly the mind-set and goal of Brian Wilson during the SMiLE era (see Bri's quotes to Tom Nolan for proof).

Seems to me that it's high time for folks who write about SMiLE to get a clue and realize that Brian Wilson had it going on in a big way during that era. There needs to be a sensitivity to the religious acid experience applied to this art.

If you write about SMiLE and are clueless psychedelically (as I am) you need to state so (as I have) and you need to become acquainted in some way to speak on such topics (I read a lot of stuff). And in the future any point of view regarding SMiLE that is devoid of the influence & philosophy of the psychedelic experience should not be regarded as an informed view on the subject of SMiLE.

Wow! You need to be commended on brass balls, at least,  for slathering yourself in honey and jumping into the bear cage ....

But here's the thing: LSD affects different people differently ..... When I used to do it in my early twenties, my acid-head friends would have all the classic experiences: strong visual hallucinations, seeing neon patterns/grids n such, while I experienced basically none of that. It was more mental with me. Like simple thoughts resonated differently and everything seemed deeper. Every stray sentence uttered took on gigantic meaning ..... I remember putting on Sgt. Pepper with headphones and feeling like FINALLY I get this album! It was like someone opened a doorway and I was able to experience the album from the inside and in candy coated technicolor .... However after putting on The Floyd's Umagumma and then SMILE (the triple colored vinyl boot) my nice trip when completely off the rails ....... Playing music (as in playing an instrument) is amazing on LSD. Repeated patterns, or "feels" as Brian calls them are pure magic, so I can see how the drug might have caused Brian's imagination to expand and how by simply playing the two "feel" chords of Heroes & Villains over and over and over and over could have set him on his course .... Lyrically, I don't so much pick up an acid influence. I mean, they certainly don't seem to be related to or about the LSD experience, though the imagery conjured up via the Surf's Up lyrics might likely be an exception .....But if Brian's compositions were LSD influenced, VDP's words certainly fit like a glove.... This is something that would probably take Brian or VDP expanding on in detail.

Sorry to be so blunt, but what a big, dangling pile of bollocks.

Quote - "It was like someone opened a doorway..."

There it is in a nutshell.

I expect this'll be one hell of a ride, so I'm climbing aboard early.

If you are not "experienced" you should maybe stand aside and pay attention to what'll be said here.

 

Pinder...Maybe you should have played Smile first.  :3d  Trips always zigged and zagged.  It was never a straight line from start to finish.  Can't say too many I ventured out on...w/o my suitcase...were religious-like.  It sure as shootin' wasn't ever as it was religiously portrayed in the movie 'Easy Rider' for me at least.  Although other 'bits' did ring true to some degree.   :brian  And no two ventures into 'wonderland' were ever the same.

The religious 'thing' would have been at least as influenced by Brian's life growing up as it would have been by LSD.  'Cause if that happened to him in a meaningful way while tripping...I'd bet it only happened once or twice.  [Unless he was always fixated on 'it' anyway...and I don't think he was.   Was he?]

Ah, Bill, you had me right up to there. The only thing that's "clear" is that it's your opinion it's "clearly the mindset and goal of Brian Wilson". You're presenting your pet theory as established fact. Won't fly, Orville.

Bill - the "Intellectual Dishonesty" is a joke. The whole "myth of LSD" is rooted in "intellectual dishonesty" beginning with self-proclaimed expert Tim Leary using his undergraduate students at Harvard as a "cohort" to experiment on. It got him fired. Imagine sending your kid to Harvard, and having a "person, in a position of trust" give your kid LSD...

However,  I won't call him a "doctor" because he wasn't an MD, and the term infers a certain confidence, which he most brazenly breached, but a PhD who exploited students, inmates, and theological students.  It is a repeated attempt to give "credentials to study." He was a predator.  It was b.s. fifty years ago, and it is b.s., now.

And, I'm with Andrew. 

Ray Thomas is coming for your ass, Filledeplage, and he's pissed!

"It was like someone opened a doorway....... to my increasing mental illness, paranoia and delusional behaviour. Whooo-hoo, thank you LSD".

A very belated welcome back, Pinder!  :beer

Oh well, I just call it as I see it!  :lol

I don't think it's too far of a stretch to say BW had some religious/spiritual connection and/or longing within him prior to acid, and for him (IMO) it was all in and about the music he loved and the music he made - always.   It could be said he was attempting to work this into his music since (nearly) the beginning of the groups career.   Acid could maybe only be said to have widened that canvas, shown him new possibilities (as well as raising new questions).   So, acid wasn't the seed, it was only an aid (out of many) which assisted in the direction/means of how the seed grew (meaning "religious/spiritual" informed music).   I think people get bogged down on the "acid" part of all this, as if the acid itself was the point BW was getting at by making this new church music.   I honestly don't think the core spiritual message/theme (whatever) was the acid, yet there's no denying it's influence in the music created.   I don't know if I am expressing my thoughts clearly, and probably doesn't matter if i am or not, I guess.

Wilson was correct when he said that the future of rock/pop music would be spiritual, or at least he was correct for a time, as the late sixties/early seventies is rife with songs/albums that are certainly exactly that.   

Like Potatoehead alluded to, the acid may have opened up new horizens, but if any drug had great influence on Brian, Van Dyke, and SMiLE music, far and away it was the hash. The pot.

Oh no.. Bill is back.

There is more happening at any one moment than our senses can handle, or even register - think of radio waves. Think, for a moment, of the acute sense of smell possessed by a dog, or the eyesight of an eagle - smelling and seeing way beyond our capacity. These are evolutionary adaptations that ensure survival and reproduction, the necessary drives of life.

There are some excellent studies on the properties and effects of LSD on Youtube. One is called Dr. Hoffman's Elixir, or some such.
One point discussed is that the drug turns off "inhibitors" in the brain that normally block the flood of stimuli that would otherwise overwhelm its functioning - one cannot successfully hunt wabbits while contemplating the depths of eternity. So, it is not the drug, but the universe itself that is manifest.

I don't know what kind of rat poison may have been mixed with whatever "acid" you once tried, but I will stand witness anyday to the fact that there is more in heaven and earth than are dreamed of in your philosophy my dear Harvard - a decayed institution given over to ratifying the status and privileges of a worthless, incompetent, hereditary ruling class.

I've lately begun to reflect on the fact that I have been reading this board and it's precursors for going on 20years now! And wondering why? I think Mr. T may have provided me the key to the answer to that question with this posting. Because in our youth we were granted visions of a new dispensation, and our poets sang a new kind of song. And tho we've had to live and work thru our lives in the day-to-day world, we've never forgotten the fires that illuminated our youth. Our leaders have been gunned down, ridiculed and marginalized, but many of us are still here. And wondering why...MacArthur's Park is melting in the dark... 

I guess Brian Wilson & VDP should not have been writing/singing about the Sandwich Isles if they'd never actually been there... 

Nothing sensationalized in these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgUFqAdGN24

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpSLjdPiSH8

Funny how people talk about religious experiences on LSD.. I grew up catholic and was an altar boy and never had that experience.. Neither did any of my friends that I know.. And I droped acid mescaline and peyote many times.. Im not saying it doesn't happen because obviously it did to many people.. Sometimes ive felt short changed on that end.. The weirdest experience I ever had was I was sitting in a chair with a fan behind me and the sunshine started coming on and I got paranoid because the fan suddenly was inside my head.. Terrible nite and never took acid again..LOL. Funny now but not back then..!!

curiouser and curiouser....

Perhaps you've just blocked those experiences out with the altar boy stuff? 

So has anyone here NOT done acid?

me. :angel:

I've never done acid either. I did do some shrooms though!  ;D

I'm just not really interested in altering my mind's perception with drugs. However I don't condemn people who enjoy that any more than I would condemn, say, motorcyclists.

Same here...

Not your cup of tea.  :p

Don't feel left out.  Between 1968 and 1971...exclusively...I took more than enough "trips"  for all of us.  Took me three years of tripping, particularly in 1969, to figure out that I'd "been there/done that" ad infinitum and that there was really nothing more in THAT regard that was going to contribute to any meaningful cognitive recognition in terms of who I was or where, in the whole wide universe, I was likely to find myself at any time going forward.  

As it turned out...life still had to be lived and further mistakes still had to be made.  Pretty sure 'gawd' didn't ever take ANY acid though...'cause, as it turns out, "he" has yet to find me. >:D

Gawd told me he found you long ago, but decided you're better off left to your own devices

I've always wanted to try acid but Brian Wilson scared me into thinking I'd start hearing voices after a week or so and then have to spend a lot of the 1970s wearing a bathrobe.

Done both, preferred the shrooms - better inflight entertainment and smoother touchdown.

It's just a plant man.

Add Some, you can trust him this time.

Ever tried the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

THEY TOLD ME CRACK WAS JUST A ROCK TOO.

Not really...hope this copies...

http://people.cst.cmich.edu/Alm1EW/Bioterrorism.html

Reference: Eitzen EM, Takafuji ET Historical Overview of Biological Warfare.
In Textbook of Military Medicine, Medical Aspects of Chemical and Biological Warfare, 1997.
Published by the Office of The Surgeon General, Dept. of the Army, USA, Pages 415-424.

Ergot is the first entry, from 6 B.C. "Assyrians poison the wells of their enemies with rye ergot."

Alright boys...now go to your room and play quietly.

The grown-ups want to talk about something:


The Trip Treatment

Research into psychedelics, shut down for decades, is now yielding exciting results.

By Michael Pollan
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/02/09/trip-treatment

Hell, SMiLE is literally what made me interested to try psychedelics in the first place. What happened to Brian afterwards served as a powerful warning to take it seriously, though.

I have come to view My Only Sunshine as incredibly significant rather than just a throwaway recording of an old standard. The reason is because OMP comes first, and is a song about God. After that, we have YAMS sung in the past tense. Why such an odd pairing and odd change to YAMS which completely changes its meaning? I suspect it's because it's Brian obliquely stating that he's lost faith in traditional organized religion and accepted Western morality/ethics expectations. I think he was gobbling up alternative mythologies like numerology, astrology and so forth as an attempt to find a new ethos to follow. Whether acid opened that door or was yet another attempted ethos I cannot say. I think even the album name SMiLE could be a reference to Timothy Leary's philosophy of S.M.I².L.E. Also, I think the "canvas the town and brush the backdrop" lyrics in Surf's Up are meant to tie it in with My Only Sunshine. The fact that that song ends with the revelation that "the children know the way" could mean that in all the things Brian tried out to find inspiration, the innocence of children was the most powerful. Or something.

^Obviously that's all just speculation. But really, once I came to that revelation about OMP/YAMS, it really tied all the otherwise conflicting songs together into one amazingly unified message for me.

Anyway, I think LSD should be discussed when talking about SMiLE. That was one of, if not the big inspiration for the whole album. Out of all the trippy '60s LPs, SMiLE best captures the feeling of a psychedelic experience, in my opinion. All the contradictory and somewhat unexplainable discoveries, all the amazing experimental sounds... I could go on. That's why it's such a shame this album in particular didnt come out in 1967. It really was perfect for the times and what the public needed to hear.

I also prefer shrooms to acid. Shrooms' visuals are more "natural" and it's easier to focus on. Acid has a distinct synthetic feeling to it, and it's too crazy. It makes it hard to focus on any one thing or idea for long. I've never had religious epiphanies on psychs either. I was an Agnostic before them and remain one now. I have had many in-depth personal epiphanies though. Which I wont share here for various, hopefully obvious reasons. Just my two cents on the matter.

In short, LSD is integral to any meaningful discussion about SMiLE's themes and inspiration.

I also believe that a review of Smile and the experience Brian had in the Sixties cannot ignore the pharmaceuticals....not just acid but other stuff as well.

Peter - I'm of the mind that strongly feels that the privacy factor should kick in for Brian (and everyone else) but that those who hold or purport to hold credentials in academic or medical/research contexts should be held to the highest standard.  Having been in an academic setting for many decades, I've seen lots of fakers and academics who behave more as politicians than scholars, who use their students as lab-rats, and that is a problem.

Harvard-spurned Leary took his "show on the road" evangelizing in another geographic area with different "subjects."  It sounds harsh, but the ethics are lacking.  My larger question is whether Leary just made a geographic change for his "classroom." Did he use the West Coast as his lab? Would he get away with this today?

And, TM in the PM's article was very informative. (there are boys and girls, in the house!)   I follow Nora Volkow's work, as it is aided by MRI and other "controlled" dosing.  And it is far more transparent than Leary's work.  As a professional, you realize the difference as between "recreational" use and, bona fide work with an "agent" in a clinical, supervised situation with "neutral oversight." (Not Leary's method of getting the Concord prison psychiatrist on the Harvard payroll, which creates a huge conflict of interest and taints his work.)  Some of my earlier posts on this subject keep the door open for medical context, brain-scanner accompanied work in transparent settings.  Not "pharmaceutical grade" uncontrolled on the street.

Lots of essentially "bad" chemical or fungal agents can have medical benefit.  Chemo for cancer is exactly that.  It doesn't mean that one uses it "recreationally" and without supervision.  And a message board is probably not the best place for this discussion. 

What Brian (and the BB's) worked on, in my view, is largely God-given talent, fostered by a family atmosphere that was music-based.  And that would be the combination of God-given talent coupled with old fashioned "elbow-grease."   ;)

I'm probably a good bit younger than most here, certainly not around in acid's prime,   but I'll share my SMiLE experience.

I had always heard Brian lost his mind because of the amount of LSD he has taken,  and despite BB's being one of my favorite bands of my childhood, I had never heard Pet Sounds or SMiLE as of 2012.   One night, when the roommates were out, I rolled up a nice J and smoked alone for the very first time.   I have no idea why but I put on Pet Sounds, and it really did change my life, at least how I hear music, and as a musician that is life.

Fast forward to fall of 2013,   my interest in the BB's has once again sparked, I read about everything surrounding SMiLE and I watch Beautiful Dreamer, but still had not yet heard SMiLE.   For some reason, after the documentary I just decide "I'm doing LSD"   Come January,  a friend and I had both our first experience and about 2 hours in we listened to the SMiLE Sessions LP for the very first time.

I can't explain what happened, as those who are "experienced"  may understand, but I can say I had the most spiritual experience of my life, not religious (as someone who grew up engulfed in religion, church, Private schools and even a religious University at the time)    Cabinessence and Wind Chimes took me to a place I had never been and have yet to return.

I've only had 2 LSD trips and 1 Shroom trip, the shrooms seemed void of any meaning, couldn't think or focus on anything, had the most pointless thoughts that in the moment seemed so insightful.  Shrooms seemed like I had simply poisoned myself and now I was gonna have to deal with the side effects of being loopy, like being stoned and drunk at the same time.

LSD on the other hand really revealed me to myself, I feel.  I was able to sort out a lot of issues I was going through at the time,   I struggled with depression and anxiety, but not anymore, started taking much better care of myself and realized what I feel to still be my life's calling.   Both I credit equally to SMiLE and LSD, though I would never recommend Psychedelics to anyone.

I began doing a lot of research on different types of psychedelics and how they interact with the brain to better understand what was going on.  I have only had very positive experiences, but what most do not understand is that it's all between your ears.   People get themselves in the wrong environment and aren't nearly as cautious as they should be.  Also Timothy Leary made some inexcusable mistakes that are unfortunate to those who truly could find a benefit from the psychedelic experience (LSD is a proven cure for alcoholism and as of last year atleast 1 paralyzed man regained the ability to walk after clinical psychedelic treatment)   

The most important thing to remember for anyone with anything,   as Alan Watts said "When you get the message, hang up the phone."  Luckily any type of habit forming relationship with psychedelics has alluded me.


SMiLE is definitely the most psychedelic album I have found though, followed very closely by Revolver.

VanDykeParksandRec, I think it's really interesting that you and me hold the opposite view on shrooms vs. acid. Just shows how the Psychedelic experience is different for everyone.

I tried listening to SMiLE on psychedelics but honestly I just thought of it as a distraction. Any music really. It just feels too overwhelming.

I think it's a bit of an overstatement to say no one should do psychs tho. I absolutely agree it's nothing to take lightly and not for everyone. But as long as those interested do their research* seek out other people's experiences to read about and know what to expect, and adhere to proper set and setting, I think most level headed people would be ok. The problem is too many people nowadays have no idea what they're talking about and see it as a party drug or rave drug. Horrible idea.

I think the source and state of the 'item' being used is likely to change up...place to place...even time to time.  It's not like you're buying the brand name and guaranteed 'item' at your local chain store.  I'd imagine there are qualitative moments which vary.  LSD twice?  Schrooms Once?  Not the final analyses.  I do agree with the idea mentioned about 'getting' the message and then hanging up.  I just kept calling to see if the message would change.  It did yet it didn't.  As it reached a point where it seemed there was nothing new to hear I stopped using the phone.

The ONLY lp I ever remember hearing in its entirety while on acid was Their Satanic Magesties Request.  It just happened by accident.  The place we went to...THAT'S what was playing.  I heard it start to finish...HEARING things I had NEVER heard on it before..  Then sometime after the album ended...we were gone.  Dropping acid and staying inside was not something I recall doing.  Being inside was always just short part of the 'trip'.  Mostly I was on the move, secluded outdoors or at least situated away from ongoning contact with straights.  I found they basically got in the way of my being comfortably "on the road to find out".

I had acid quite a few time in my early 20's.  If my friend wasn't with me I didn't want to have it, I felt safe when he was with me and really enjoyed the effect.  Laughed pretty much the whole time.  No negative reactions at all.  I read the NY article and found it fascinating.  I have had episodes of very bad depression and would have really liked to try these kinds of drugs with a guide and therapist at hand.  I am glad that scientific studies are being done with these drugs, there has to be more help than the endless array of antideps and anxiety drugs that are pushed on us.

I can't second guess Brian Wilson. However, one of the titles for SMiLE was 'A Teenage Symphony to God' so it seems pretty obvious that Brian had some religious beliefs at the time and it is a known fact that he took LSD. Whether whatever experiences he had under the influence included a religious one I have no idea but I have read before that LSD works by affecting the inhibitors in the brain, thereby allowing a rush of information which I suppose many would find an enlightening experience and might be taken, depending on their personal beliefs, to be of religious or spiritual significance.

I would be interested to know if it is possible to learn to some extent from the music created under such conditions or if it is necessary to actually take the drugs oneself. I make this comment simply because SMiLE has some decidedly weird effects on me, a non user.

Beg to differ, but that was what he told Van Dyke on Terry Melcher's lawn: "I'm writing a teenage symphony to God". It was never a title for Smile. That was Dumb Angel.

Fair enough - it wasn't actually a title but the fact that Brian described SMiLE in this way does suggest that it had some religious significance for him.

Had the lysergic on occasion back in its day.    sometimes scary and sometimes disconcerting but occasionally bringing intense amp ing up of sensation and leaving behind some very strong and pleasant memories of interpersonally shared existential ideas.   Music was always experience as intense and magnificent.   sometimes odd but often quite beautiful.  I still remember the sun coming up and dropping the needle on Jefferson Airplane Crown of Creation.   I was smiling ear to ear and I felt Joyful and alive.       But personal experiences differ during the course of altered states and personality and environment are strong variables.    I guess I turned out ok.   It was several decades before I began stumbling around the home place  wearing a bathrobe like Brian Wilson or  Jeffrey Labowski.     Brian just got there quicker.    Hey, drugs were part of the L.A culture when SMILE was birthed .   was SMILE psychedelic?    Maybe.   Not necessarily I. Think.

I listened to Smile once on 4 grams of mushrooms and it was one of the greatest experiences of my life. The visuals reminded me of a cross between the paintings of William Blake and Disney's Fantasia. And another note, psychedelics don't cause schizophrenia, schizophrenia causes schizophrenia. Don't hang onto yr ego and you'll be fine.

It's been proven that psychedelics don't cause mental illness in healthy people. But they *do* "awaken" and exacerbate mental illness in those with a genetic predisposition to it. And there's such a thing called HPPD that can be caused in all individuals seemingly at random. I'm a huge advocate for opening the third eye, but there *are* dangers one should be aware of before diving in.