The Smiley Smile Message Board

Terry Melcher produced quite a few of the Byrds albums including the first couple which set the pace in no small way.  He'd be back.  Gary Usher produced a few as well.  And Van Dyke Parks was a featured musician with the Byrds including his keyboard contributions on the Fifth Dimension album.

Obviously they lived in the same geographical area, recorded at some of the same studios...likely employed a few of the same backing musicians...  And...  there's more.  So..."calling" the experts...what else?  Connect more of the dots please.

The dream collaboration between Brian and Roger McGuinn on "Ding Dang"!   :lol

Melcher ripped off Don't Worry Baby's rhythm track arrangement for Mr Tambourine Man.

They both used guitars.

Eerily, both Brian and Roger have 5 letters

Folk roots.

There's also the Roger McGuinn song Draggin' which has Bruce Johnston on backing vocals.

Back when the Byrds were still called the Jet Set, David Crosby brought some demos to Brian for his opinion.

Brian used to hang out with McGuinn, Crosby, and Hillman at Loren's place.

Summer in Paradise (song), U.K. re-recorded version with McGuinn guitar, anyone? The pinnacle of both bands' careers, no doubt  ;D

*ahem*

https://web.archive.org/web/19990203153828/http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/parton/543/byrdboys.html

both bands had a genius songwriter who was somewhat held back by a formulaic frontman.

both those geniuses had a nervous breakdown on an airplane.

both bands have released at least one absolute classic, incredibly influential album that was ahead of its time.

both bands have been called "America's answer to The Beatles".

both bands had chart success with LSD-influenced singles.

both bands became legendary live acts by the early 70s, despite humbler beginnings.



and what about that Byrds reunion/tribute tour in the mid-80s that included Gene Clark, Michael Clarke, and Blondie Chaplin?? (among others)

Gene Clark/Gene Landy
Gene Clark/Clark Griswold (of National Lampoon's Vacation, theme song written by future BW collaborator Lindsey Buckingham - not a stretch of a connection at all)  ;D

In the mid-1980's Blondie Chaplin played in "The Byrds Revisited" (frequently billed as just "The Byrds" by unscrupulous promoters) with Gene Clark, Michael Clarke, Skip Battyn, and Rick Roberts of Firefall.  Blondie performed "Sail On Sailor."  He played the same Les Paul Gold Top that he played in the Beach Boys (and continues to play, as frequently as Brian's Vegas show).

Edit: I see it was on the "Byrd-Boys" list in the link above (#8.)

Lee

So...beyond the REALLY obvious examples...the tracks don't criss-cross as much as I thought they might then?  I was just thinking about it last night and I figured Terry, Gary, Van Dyke, some shared session guys and Jim's...sorry lRoger's...contribution [didn't know about Blondie or Bruce singing something for the Byrds...but then there's the Bruce and Terry connections...so...] that maybe there'd be LOTS more.  Guess not.  Anyway thanks one and all for your posts.

That they "both" used guitars was most enlightening. ;)

David Marks and John York were in a band together in 67-ish called The Tender Trap. It's in the book.

Roger McGuinn was the opening act for the Beach Boys in the mid-'80s. He was backed by the BB's band and Jeff Foskett sang David Crosby's parts. IIRC, Foskett has also been in at least one Byrds tribute band.

Brian and Van Dyke Parks were introduced to each other by David Crosby.

McGuinn was the opening act for the BB when I saw them at Madison Square Garden in the fall of 1974.  He wasn't listed on the bill.  He opened with a few songs solo acoustic & then was joined by a band that I think included David Crosby.

Also, I think Bruce Johnston played piano & sang on McGuinn's debut solo album in 1973.

He did, no doubt because Terry Melcher produced the initial sessions before McGuinn took over himself.

As detailed in my book with Jon the byrds played on the bill with the bbs on a few occasions including a memorable November 1971 Virginia show

Crosby with Graham Nash was an interviewee in the I Just Wasn't Made for These Times documentary. 

Crosby also performed at the All-Star Tribute to Brian Wilson in 2000.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKj6309Gx_o - Singing "In My Room" with Carly Simon and Jimmy Webb.
http://youtu.be/R8IfQUyMxPQ?t=2m49s - Singing "Surf's Up" with Vince Gill and Jimmy Webb.

Roger played on the Boys version of 'California Dreaming' , and appeared in the video.

AND AND AND , Like Brian ! Roger also likes cheese Pizza  :lol

In terms of music, the 1968 psychedelic Byrds release NOTORIOUS BYRD BROTHERS, made primarily by McGuinn, drummer Michael Clarke and Chris Hillman - with a little help from Crosby (who was fired 3 months before the album was released) has a very late 60s Beach Boys feel (in part thanks to producer Gary Usher).  It makes a great double bill with Sunflower.

 Roger played 12-string, and Al, Billy, Mike, and Carl sang backing vocals on TM from Charles Lloyd's Waves album.

...and R&R Music on the Midnight Special 1979.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgFKN1sOuas

Roger plays 12 string, Al Jardine plays several less...

Michael Clarke's drum parts were erased by McGuinn and replaced with those of Jim Gordon (who played of course on Pet Sounds).

In fact, that's the reason Clarke quit the Byrds.

Thanks for all of the input.  This is turning out well.  I just got the whole Columbia Byrd's box delivered yesterday.  That's what sparked the thread.

That plus the site has sort of quieted down since Brian [and Loren] dropped by.  Figured rather that waiting for someone else to do ALL of the work that I should start something.  So...again...I appreciare the info.  It sure adds to what I saw right off the top with my Byrds' box booklet.

[I got the 4 Seasons box too.   That was inspired by the thread we had rolling here a couple of weeks ago.]

Crosby as I'm sure most folks here are aware is a big Brian fan and appeared as a talking head in IJWMFTT, and performed Surf's Up with vince Gill and Jimmy Webb at the Brian Tribute.

Just a guess but I bet Gene Clark and Dennis got drunk together at some point.

Of course! Hal Blaine was just ripping off his own drumming on Don't Worry Baby. Historical fact.

If u go to the right places in Monterey California,  you will get to view Terry Melcher  gold And platinum records form his work with both bands.  Terry' s Mom lives a short drive from Al Jardine.   both left LA for the laid back comfort  of Big Sur and Carmel.   Ryan Lives there and sells real estate.  And so on.  Neil Young recorded with both Al and Byrd man Crosby.  And so on.  And there is killer harmony all over all of it.   I have an obsessive love and collection of Byrds and Beach Boys.
always been a connection of these iconic bands in my life.

Wasn't it confirmed that it was in fact Dennis drumming on "Don't Worry, Baby"?

Yep. I was just goofing off.  :police:

Croz also performed "Sloop John B" at the 2001 tribute, complete with fairly spectacular flub and restart.  ;D

FWIIW, in 1998 McGuinn told me he didn't remember going to any of Loren's "parties" and he didn't think he spent much time at Loren's. He knew they were into Subud, and said Brian didn't go to the official meeting place but started a make-shift branch at Brian's home. He did remember Brian coming to his house in Malibu a few times and they played pool and music but didn't "talk about the big picture".

Crosby, Stills, Jardine & Young singing on Al's A Postcard from California...

According to Daro, and as we've seen, his recall has been proven to be highly imperfect.

I'd figure Bruce and Skip must have been well acquainted through their early days in the Hollywood music industry or via their mutual friend Kim Fowley, but I can't think of any records they both appeared on. Maybe somebody else can point to one?

From Roger( I wish I could still be Jim) McGuinn's RS interview(8/23/90) :
>>For a time, you subscribed to an obscure Eastern faith called Subud. Of all the Eastern religions that were big in the Sixties, how did you pick that one?
 
It was a small organization out of Indonesia, and frankly, I don't know much about it myself. It was a "surrender" kind of thing, where you just release yourself to God and it cleans you up. I thought it was cool, a religion without any responsibilities. You didn't have to learn a whole lot or use any props. Brian Wilson got into it. But he didn't want to go to the place where they had the meetings. So he sort of developed his own brand of it with his friends. That's when he got really weird. He incorporated acid into it and a few other strange things. And drugs were not part of it at all.
 
Speaking of strange, you changed your first name from Jim to Roger because of Subud.
 
They had this name-change option. The sound of your name is supposed to vibrate with your spirit. So I thought I'd see what my Subud name was. And Roger was one of them. I was into gadgets and space, and Roger was from two-way-radio airplane talk, "Roger that." I wish I hadn't done that now. I'd still be Jim. <<

Then there's the other Jim...Jamie actually.  Jamie Robertson.  Who Robbie Robertsoned his way to fame and fortune.  Bu that was a different Band.  [starts with a 'B' though.]

I think I read Roger McGuinn played the opening Guitar intro on "somwhere Near Japan" as well.

Jet without wings

Not according to the (admittedly sparse) liner notes and credits.

Safe to assume that even if it's not him playing on that song, that the guitar work was most likely inspired by his sound, no? Especially considering how they work with him a couple years prior, and a couple years after.

Oh, for sure.

Yeah, my mistake it  was California a Dreaming I meant, as posted earlier. Correct again Andrew

Jet without wings

A factor seldom discussed in connection with either band : sheer depth of singing/songwriting talent.

The Byrds had 4 world-class singer songwriters. The Beach Boys had 6 lead singers, all of whom could write. What other bands had this depth? Moody Blues, Moby Grape. Maybe Jefferson Airplane?

3/4 of the Beatles wrote...and Ringo sang.  The 5 Man Electrical Band...oh wait...you guys aren't Canadians.  [sorry for your luck. ;)]
The Band...Oh wait...same thing.

Which could possibly be the last time Young records with Crosby and Stills ever again.  :-\

One other connection I don't think has been mentioned... The great Derek Taylor did publicity for the Byrds and Beach Boys at one time, though I don't think at the same time. Passed away a number of years ago

Jet without wings

I was there. It was quite spectacular...he messed up because the prompter scrolled too fast. He started the chorus with "See how the main sail sets" instead of "Hoist up the John B's sail". The band kept playing after he flubbed, longer than I expected, before breaking down. David said the prompter jumped a line, and then he said something like, "Look, people, you KNOW who I am! I only have eighteen brain cells left!"

Some people said he had to do three takes, but I only remember two.

And Good Vibrations being used in Vegas Vacation  :o