The Smiley Smile Message Board

This Whole World has been one of my favourite Beach Boys tracks for some time, and I encourage you all to take a new listen to it sometime if you haven't lately.

It's a very unique track in the Beach Boys catalog.  The next time you listen, take a very careful listen in the far left and far right of the stereo picture for the guitars.  The guitar work is very unique for a BW type of thing.  David Cohen, in particular, is just let loose to do whatever he wants, and he really turns in a virtuosic display of county-inspired licks and fills.  I believe he's in the right channel.  On the other side, Jerry Cole plays crunchy, power-pop kind of eighth-note power chords, which I don't know if the Beach Boys had really done up to that point.  But then on the chorus, David steps it up with fills and licks of his own, and the two guitarists lock into a pretty thrilling interplay.  Check it out.

Also of note is a return to a BW favorite technique of using two electric basses in unison. 

I just really like the sound that this particular group of people got together. 

What a track.

Maybe the unusualness of this track in terms of production has something to do with Carl producing it?

Well, I thought Carl produced it too, and maybe he had a hand in arranging it, but I can tell you that Brian was calling the shots from the control room while the tape was running, at least.

The guitar work is really sweet. I love how 'in the groove' they are.

Interesting - since Alan mentioned how Carl was listed as producer for the session.  So it would be at the very least a coproduction.

Dating back to the days of Brad Elliott I've been under the assumption that the only track fully produced by Brian was Add Some Music - as you get more definitive information from the tapes as to who produced what, please share with us!

Doesn't Brad's notes on the Brother GH disc say that Brian produced the basic track with Carl finishing it?

I love and admire the track, too. It is probably my favorite production of the Desper years, and one of the first to really jump out at me. I remember having first bought the twofer and being amazed. It is one of the BBs best uses of the entire stereo spectrum to really make a full sounding production, as opposed to stereo for stereo's sake (I'm thinking Beatles as a nice example of that...Pepper, etc.). The background vocals, too, sound just brilliant. It is all so sharp.

The other night Alan agreed with statements by Peter Reum and Peter Carlin that Brian didn't finish what he started after the Friends album, letting Carl pick up slack.  I could see Brian start production and therefore being on the tracking tape but leave it to Carl to finish.

From what I can ascertain, and I'm sure Mark or Alan could clarify, but I bet  after Brian produced the basic track (which was actually quite minimal) to 8-track, Carl did the dub over to 16-track and produced the overdubs and perhaps the vocal sessions as well.  I believe the notes that list Carl as the producer are on the tape box that contains the 16-track second generation.

You know, while I love Desper's engineering with all of my heart, in some ways it's too bad that they're such full, sonically rich mixes...haha, because you tend to not hear some of the neat individual stuff sometimes as you're washed over with the waves of divinity.  That's what could make a Sunflower Box Set or something so neat.

I absolutely love this song.  The backing vocals are wonderful, is that Marilyn on it too?  Was this recorded in Brian's home?   

"The other night Alan agreed with statements by Peter Reum and Peter Carlin that Brian didn't finish what he started after the Friends album, letting Carl pick up slack"

I thought Peter has said that Brian didn't finish what he started with Wild Honey and Friends either, Carl and Murry picking up the slack.

Murry!? More info please.

It's been fairly established I think by Peter that Murry helped out on the Friends album.  I didn't mean that Brian finished the total sum of WH or Friends alone, but rather that he may have been able to polish off individual tracks on the Friends album but afterwards couldn't even do that.  The watershed track seems to have been "Old Man River" which meant a lot to Brian but the group would not support or realize to his satisfaction.  Around that time Brian also was institutionalized and put on Thorazine.  From that time on, so these insiders say, until even today, Brian has never finished without help and outside prodding, ANY track of any sort.  Even on Love You, Carl had to take very rough demos and mix them extensively to be releaseable.

Why is that? Is it just because the studio makes him nervous or does he have brain damage and can't keep track of what he's doing?

Possibly both.  I do think that Thorazine could have that impact -- Thorazine changes you forever when you take it.  That's why it isn't given as often or as quickly anymore.  Peter was very specific -- those around Brian say that he was NEVER the same after that institutionalization, and the medication is a sufficient explanation.

Peter would know, being trained in that field.  And this may also explain Dennis' comment (to Pete Fornatale in '76):  "I could tell you atrocity stories of things that have happened to Brian". 

Craig

Murry 'helping out' on Friends explains a lot about that record. I thought that Brian often listed it as his favorite BB's album because it was the only one that the rest of them helped him finish (or something like that.) Could Murry arrange? What would his suggestions have been, other than in aspects of 'feel'? If there's any specific info out there, I'd love to hear it - Friends has been puzzling me for some time now.

I had no idea Brian was institutionalized.

Was that common knowledge back then, or was it kept secret?

This must have been around the time of 20/20, right?

I also think it's important to note that the whole "Brian never again finished a track on his own" business coincides with the general trend in recording to delegate more duties as the recording process became more complicated. Certainly the studios of the mid 60s were far different from those of the 70s, 80s and 90s. Brian, once he left that environment for a time, may never have felt the need to learn how to "do it all" again.

I'd have to think there are many reasons why Brian seems to have been unable to have completed a track without help for several decades.  I don't think it's all attributable to taking Thorazine.  Psychosis unto itself causes brain damage, especially acute psychotic episodes, at least from what little I've read about those types of illnesses.  The theory goes that anti-psychotic medication should be administered early in those illnesses to prevent brain damage from the illness. Whatever damage they do on their own is another issue.  Brian also took a lot of street drugs, of course.  All of which can cause permanent damage if you take enough of them, and short-term damage in the form of  reducing productivity and motivation.

That said, even if you take those things out of the equation, there are a couple of other factors with Brian.  One is the success factor.  He could never equal that early monster success, so that may have made him unmotivated to try harder.  He felt rejected as early as "Pet Sounds," which went to #9.  Maybe he just didn't want his name associated with things that didn't have the potential to sell large quantities, so he withdrew.  The nature of studio work also changed drastically, as claymcc noted.  Just for starters, it went completely stereo, which Brian was unable to do on own because of his partial deafness.  His productions were also very arrangement-dependent and mostly live.  Maybe he just never had a big interest in multi-tracking, punching in each part, extensive overdubbing, and the laborious mixdowns of all those elements.  Look at the hassles he went through in putting together "Good Vibrations," with all the sessions and editing involved.  It was done incredibly well, and he actually was a pioneer of the form, but perhaps that method of putting together music left him drained.

That combination of the hassle of modern recording technology and the lack of incentive for his extra effort in the form of huge commercial success may have left Brian with a lack of desire.  It's also possible he sort of gave up on it because he just doesn't personally like the sound of modern-method music.  It's hard to complete things when you don't really enjoy what you're doing.  Though as far as his work ethic in the studio in recent years, it must be good when he's onto something he actually enjoys doing, or he wouldn't be able to do all those self-overdubbed harmonies.

Well, how is Brian not finishing 'Old Man River, 'Can't Wait Too Long', or 'Walk On By' any different than not finishing the tracks on Smile? Maybe it's the same phobias?

Friends was an attempt to move past Smile, an attempt to get back to the old ways and forget Smile.  While it was successful during that set of sessions, with lots of help from the band, during Old Man River it came apart again, this time not to come back together at all.  This was when Brian began his retreat in earnest.

So what happened during the 'Old Man River' sessions? The band said they hated it and thought it was lame and Brian was in such a fragile state he just said "Ah, foda it."  Is this similar to what happened with 'Fairy Tale Music' during Holland?

It's amazing how the band lost so much faith in the guy who was responsible for all the hits. Even if he was acting pretty weird, it's strange they didn't trust his musical instincts. Up to that point they had never done anything except take orders from him.

Yeah, but come on.  We have to cut the band some credit; they went along with A LOT of his musical ideas.  Just because a few songs didn't get finished (or several, whichever) doesn't mean they weren't supportive or didn't trust him.  They did plenty of work on plenty of songs that to be frank are either pretty wild out of the box stuff or just plain bad music. 

No one has publicly told us the details of what happened yet at that period.  Hints have been dropped.  I think that Peter Carlin's book will tell the story in more detail (I hope).  Alan Boyd made some comments, which I won't repeat, but basically he said it was a tremendous chore to edit together the vocal only version of OMR because of the issues at the time.

Not going along with two of his best post Good Vibrations songs? 'Can't Wait Too Long' and 'Old Man River'!?! Couldn't they recognize the greatness in these tunes?

I think Ol' Man River was one of Rodgers and Hammerstein's best songs from the musical Show Boat. Particularly like Frank Sinatra and the Jeff Beck Group's versions, as well as the 1936 film version by Paul Robeson.

  Didn't his writing really start to dry up during this period..I always wondered why he could'nt knock out a song like he did a few years before..I figured he just dried up and thats why he retreated from being a force in the band..even his filler in 64-66 wasn't shabby..I'm probably wrong..but thats the impression I always had at the time.

                      Wayne

I think they were always looking for songs that sounded like the songs on the charts to be succesfull, while Brian always tried to achieve great musical heights. I seriously doubt that Mike liked "Good Vibrations" even though he wrote (part of) the lyrics. 
And stuff like "OMR" and "Can't wait"  didn't sound like the other contemporary songs...

I think Rocker is on the mark here - when Smiley SMile failed commercially, and the subsequent albums and singles failed (well, wild Honey did OK), the band, which were taking more of a role in songwriting and production, no longer trusted Brian's musical instincts in terms of making a hit.  They weren't interested in struggling to complete Brian's passing fancies that didn't seem to be going anywhere and had very little potential to become a hit.  This was a dark period of unpopularity for the band, the Maharishi tour was a disaster, and they really wanted a hit song.  I'm sure they recognized the musical brilliance of some of what Brian was doing, but it seemed to them out of touch with the music market of the day (heavy, guitar driven music - Hendrix, Cream - or the more poppy stuff) so  they went to outside
producers (Rick Henn, the Seasons in the Sun guy).  They were desperate.