The Smiley Smile Message Board

I've just been kicking around an idea, since I was disappointed with the results of Priore's SMiLE... what would it sound like if one put together a 'proper' version of Smiley Smile?  Well, take a look at the track list, you'll see what I mean:

SIDE ONE
01) Heroes and Villains - 'Smile Sessions' version, spliced to single version (so that the last chorus fades)
02) Vegetables - 'Smile Sessions' version without opening segue
03) Mrs. O'Leary's Cow - 'Smile Sessions' version
04) He Gives Speeches - obviously standing in for "She's Goin' Bald", it's short but it fits.
05) I Love To Say Da Da - since there isn't a Smile equivalent of "Little Pad", this seems to be the best fit, complete with Water Chant at the start.

SIDE TWO
01) Good Vibrations - 'Smile Sessions' version with hum-de-dums.
02) With Me Tonight - 'Smile Sessions' version??  Doesn't that one end rather abruptly when someone knocks something over, though?
03) Wind Chimes - 'Smile Sessions' version without opening segue
04) ...................no clue.  I need to fill the spot left by "Gettin' Hungry".
05) Wonderful - 'Smile Sessions' version
06) You're Welcome - Seems like a reasonable replacement for "Whistle In", another round chant.

Side two track 4 … how about Cabinessence, seeing as there are no Smiley artefacts on your Smiley anyways???

I was thinking of an additional instrumental (PS had 2), you could use "Tune X" or "I don't know" in place of Gettin Hungry.

It seems like your 'Smiley Smile done right' is just Smile - which I guess sorta makes sense...

Am happy to see this thread appear, as I was collecting my thoughts on this very subject last summer but, under the influence, lost my train of thought  in a cloud of smoke...

Here's where I left off, with the track listing of the compilation I have been enjoying for a couple of years now:

 I have, filed away somewhere, an article entitled “Smiley Smile is Smile,” written by I can’t remember who and don’t know when, but posted somewhere on-line sometime around the year 2000, plus or minus 4 or five years before or after.

OK, so there’s my bow to the citation gods, but what follows is not really about that article.

Well, yes it is, insofar as what I’m about here takes the idea that Smiley was not merely a poor substitute, but in fact a perfectly logical, internally consistent, culmination of the Smile project. And that as released was poorly mastered, improperly sequenced and, despite the fact that all the pieces were readily at hand, inexplicably incomplete.

An incomplete album, the pieces of which can now be brought together to reveal a coherent artistic statement, on a par with Sergeant Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band, which must remain the benchmark against which all others are measured.

Guitars have been almost wholly removed, producing a minimalist aesthetic that is nevertheless “musical” – these guys were not simply producing an aural account of their hash parties – although the sweet, dreamy aroma of hashish does indeed permeate

The 1967 production is muddy, the 2012 Stereo Remaster reveals, not a stoned out indulgence, but rather a masterwork.


 1. Well, You’re Welcome (Smile Sessions)
 2. Heros and Villains (2001 Stereo Mix) edit sections sequence from 1,2,3,4 to 1,3,2,4
 3. Wonderful (2012 Stereo)
 4. Gettin' Hungry (2012 Stereo) edit out 1st instru section to “I wake up in the morning…”
 5. You're With Me Tonight (Previously Unreleased)(Hawthorne)
 6. With Me Tonight (2012 Stereo)
 7. She's Goin' Bald (2012 Stereo)
 8. Whistle In (2012 Stereo)
 9. Good Vibrations (Concert Rehearsal) (Previously Unreleased) (Hawthorne)
10. Mama Says (2000 Wild Honey)
11. Vegetables (Stereo Extended Mix) (Previously Unreleased) (Hawthorne)
12. Wind Chimes (2012 Stereo)
13. Fall Breaks And Back To Winter (Woody Woodpecker Symphony) (2012 Stereo)
14. Cool, Cool Water (Track)/ Water [Stereo Mix] (Unsurpassed Masters)
15. Little Pad (2012 Stereo) edit out
16. Surf's Up (1967 Solo Version)(Bonus Track)(Smile Sessions)
17. Cabin Essence (Smile Sessions)
18. Cabin Essencence Tag (Unsurpassed Masters)

Running Time: 42:22


Well, You’re Welcome inviting us in and down the rabbit hole


Heros and Villains a trip to the frontiers of the American psyche, circa 1967

“won-won-wonderful” sexual innuendo

“god vibrations” interlude

Getting’ Hungry cut

Wood blocks over a left-handed whirligig on organ

You’re With Me Tonight with a smile

On and on she go down-be-do - sexual innuendo

She’s Goin’ Bald – the Coasters – silent movie damsel in distress motif recapitulates the western theme

Coming up for air Whistle In

The single most important change in this reconfiguration is the removal of the studio hit single version of Good Vibrations. The dry rehearsal in its place fits perfectly the minimalist aesthetic of the album                              at the heart of the song cycle

Mama Says childhood admonitions placed here the track serves  in contrast to GV and affords a short interlude between what might have been sides one and two had the album been realized

The Elements – earth, air, fire and water – has been denied, but here it is Vegetables assumes a gravitas or   

The eight bar bass-throb

Wind Chimes the delicate “whispering wind…”

Who knew that Fall Breaks and Back to Winter (Woody Woodpecker Symphony) is in fact the legendary lost Fire from Smile, reduced to the flickering flame of a candle.

Cool, Cool Water the purist psychedelic vocal soundscape

We surface within landfall and the refuge of a Little Pad “…in Hawaii”

The portentous Surf’s Up pulls together, elevates and deepens all that has preceded.

Cabinessence is truly majestic, as stepping into a vastness, cathedral-like

Must close the song cycle as nothing can possibly follow it

Except perhaps a snippet of the vocal tag, minus vocals, that miraculous reveals a delicate Arabesque dancing as thru a window

Smiley Smile was done right. It's one of the most perfect little albums they ever made. To try to 'improve' it is to completely miss the point of the record, which revels in its imperfections and invites us to do likewise. Oh, and She's Goin' Bald is way more fun than He Gives Speeches, so why swap 'em over?

I agree with that 100%. There isn't one thing  I would change about Smiley Smile. Just thankful that we have both the Smile Sessions and Smiley.

My recommendations: Replacement for Little Pad should be Cabin Essence - Call it "Little Cabin" if you want to ;) Replacement for "Whistle In" should be the Hawaiian chant section of DYLW.

I like this much better but ditch Cabinessence - too grand for this stripped back statement. I always though Gettin Hungry stood out like a sore thumb, like SDT on Surfs Up.

You're right about the 2012 remaster too, one of Mark Linett's finest achievements to my ears and sets the original album up for a complete reevaluation.

This, entirely. Smiley Smile was meant to happen, and is perfect the way it is.

Honestly, if Pets Sounds did as bad on the charts as it did, the likelihood of the aborted Smile album doing much better than Smiley Smile is pretty low.....

People seem to forget The Beach Boys' Smile is just an idea, not a completed, cohesive artistic statement like Smiley Smile ended up being.

Really surprised no one agreed with swapping "You're Welcome" for "Whistle In"!  Ending the album with a repetitive chant song?  Hmmmm?

As for "Smiley Smile" being a cohesive artistic statement......... isn't it simply 'we threw together lousy stoned versions of Smile songs instead of just using the amazing Smile versions'?  I mean come on, "Wind Chimes" on SS is truly, truly spoiling a wonderful song.

It's odd that you should pick "Wind Chimes"; that's the one song, in my view, where the Smiley Smile version blows the Smile version out of the water.  The "whispering winds" section at the end is one of the most beautiful and haunting harmonies that the band ever did, to my mind.

As others have hinted or pointed out, I'm curious how your version of "Smiley Smile done right" is different from just offering another possible Smile track listing.

couldn't agree less!  Maybe Smile could have been a cohesive statement that showed bw to be far ahead of the pack, except it never was any kind of statement since it never was anything at all...
though wind chimes on Smile is amazing, i would pick the SS version any day, always and forever. all those voices...and then the whispering winds...come on!

Don't be messin' with my Smiley Smile!  Wind Chimes was only ever a pleasant little tune until Smiley Smile - THEN it was (and is) an effin' Masterpiece!   
oh, and btw, you're under arrest!   :police: lol (where the heck is Surfer these days?)

The biggest clue to the fact that Smile is far more a construct of fans' imaginations and an artistic ideal than an album is how easily Brian Wilson's artistic choices are disregarded on Smiley Smile. Particularly on Heroes and Villains! He finished the damn song! That some don't think it is good enough is entirely irrelevant. The only real Smile is the one created after the fact in 2004 and on the box set, essentially a piece of work about the concept of what a real version of a fantasy album would sound like.

"The biggest clue to the fact that Smile is far more a construct of fans' imaginations and an artistic ideal than an album is how easily Brian Wilson's artistic choices are disregarded on Smiley Smile. Particularly on Heroes and Villains! He finished the damn song! That some don't think it is good enough is entirely irrelevant. The only real Smile is the one created after the fact in 2004 and on the box set, essentially a piece of work about the concept of what a real version of a fantasy album would sound like. "

I agree completely.  And the stereo mix of Smiley Smile also turned that album around for me.  As was said above, the muddy mono release from 1967 was an interesting curio; the stereo mix turns this album into one of the Beach Boys' greatest and most interesting albums.

I didn't take it as "fixing" Smiley Smile but rather creating a SMiLE variation using Smiley Smile as a template. I admit, the thread title doesn't reflect that.

Here's the link to the article that had set me to thinking:


http://earcandy_mag.tripod.com/rrcase-2.htm


Quote: In his book “Look! Listen! Vibrate! Smile!” (1988), Domenic Priore reasoned that, "even though the world missed SMILE, SMILEY SMILE is not without merit. Actually, the reason most people didn't care for SMILEY SMILE is that it came out in place of SMILE." But the bizarre truth is: they got Smile. The finished version. Only, they didn’t like it. Or didn’t “get it”.

Makes sense to me, Smiley is the distillation of Brian's creative process during "The Smile Era" (which may or may not have been effected along the way by various things, like Beatles, Mike Love, Drugs, etc.).  It is Smile.

In an alternate universe Smiley was followed by an EP entitled Dumb Angel with the following track list:

A: Prayer
    Do You Like Worms

B: Cabin Essence
    Surf's Up

This is accompanied by an animated film, shown as part of a televised live in concert special, called Lei'd In Hawaii

Parents in Salt Lake City note the title with some disapproval but still feel the Beach Boys are more acceptable than the Beatles, but less so than the Osmonds. 

I gotta admit I'm quite intrigued by the polarization over Smiley....on this board (I say on this board because the outside world doesn't even know what a Smiley Smile is....and probably never will).  The folks who are big fans of Smiley seem to be at odds with the actual SMiLE material.  "Don't mess with my Smiley!"  Wow, take it easy, man!  Nobody's going to confiscate your beloved.....er, whatever it is!

If Smiley Smile was such a statement, how come nobody in '67 got it?  C'mon!  '67, man!  They got Piper at the Gates of Dawn, Sgt. Pepper, and uh....Incense and Peppermints!  And a bunch of other stuff.   :smokin

Because it was the Beach Boys doing slooooooow, whispered versions of songs that everyone heard were supposed to be grand and majestic, thus major boner-kill?

I thought stuff like that was age related.

It's more like Lifehouse ---> Who's Next, an attempt to salvage what was accomplished during the project by disregarding the original concept and bringing the finished pieces into a serviceable whole.

What month was Smiley smile released?  I have September stuck in my mind.

You are confusing a few things here. Seeing a piece of work as intentional - as opposed to say an album of out takes put out by a label as with Dylan's A Fool Such As I -on the part of an artist does not require in any scenario an audience understanding or appreciating it. It also doesn't require the work to be good. That Smiley Smile is not the greatest thing of the 1960s and the realisation of every high ambition of Brian Wilson is entirely irrelevant as to its legitimacy as the literal end result of the song-writing, recording and production work undertaken during the Smile sessions.

Is it Smile? No. Smile in the sense of how most people mean it doesn't exist and can't exist, except as a rather brilliant post-modern commentary on the concepts imagined at one point and collecting together the songs that were recorded. And of course the mythology behind the album and what it would have meant and how it would have changed the world and so on. Smiley Smile is however quite clearly how many of the central songs written and conceived during that time were completed and more importantly released to the public.

In the mind of many Smile myth obsessives the possibility of Brian Wilson making a decision to take this project - the collection of songs that would form the album - and change the direction and change their sound can ONLY happen if it coincides with what they value. That one does not understand or value something Brian Wilson created does not prove Brian Wilson didn't mean it, and that really he meant to release the versions the listener happens to value most. A lot of things happen during such intense work. Consider how Terrance Malick completely altered the narrative and focus of The Thin Red Line by almost entirely removing Adrian Brody who was initially intended to be the LEAD character. Whether you want to prefer the possible version of that movie is your preference but The Thin Red Line as released is the only one that Terrence Malick released and the only one he wanted to release.

The initial Smile concept was cancelled or altered or abandoned or whatever. I don't really care what process he went through. If you want to hear how Brian Wilson completed Heroes & Villains, Wonderful, Wind Chimes and Vegetables for public consumption you listen to Smiley Smile. (This is one clear reason why it is very silly that the Smile sessions box did not take these into account on the session side of things.) I see the appeal of the Smile mix and the music from that time. And the 2004 Smile is amazing, as is the box set version. That music deserved to be released. It is great! But it is foolish I think to be under the illusion that some Dominic Priore cassette or any of the countless fan mixes are somehow a more legitimate statement or closer to Brian Wilson's vision for these songs. Mash up Heroes & Villains sections all you like, but personally I care more about the actual version made and released by the artist in 1967. Like it or not, that is the only genuine article and the closest to the truth you are ever going to get.

Maybe after this you can make a Pet Sounds done right......

Oh come on, I can't be the only one who considers the single/SS edit of "Heroes and Villains" to be butchery.

In my opinion at least, the Cantina section should never have been removed.

I see your point but I don't entirely agree. The Smiley Smile versions are great but I wouldn't necessarily say that's how Brian "completed" those songs. Those songs were re-made entirely because the project had changed.  Brian was no longer making Smile - he was making something else. This is why nobody calls Smiley Smile the completion of Smile.

There are early versions of, say, Beatles songs before they were re-made. And Your Bird Can Sing for example was, largely re-arranged after being officially recorded in the studio. But I wouldn't call the re-arrangement a "completion."

There are artist who re-record already released tunes, like say, Little Richard. But those re-recordings are not a completion of earlier released versions and they're almost always viewed as being the inauthentic version.

Your example of The Thin Red Line doesn't quite work for me. Yes, Terrence Malick substantially edited the movie. What he did not do was re-shoot the entire film and give it a different title, like The Thinner Red Line.

So I do think that there are nuances to this that you might be overlooking.

I think it's fair enough to say that when you record a song, mix it and release it, it can be considered a finished song. When it stops changing and ends up in a final released form, it can be considered a finished song. Seeing as there were no previous versions of these songs released on any album AND several conflicting versions of the same songs, I don't think the cover analogy works.

I think it would be absolutely possible for a film to be wholly or partially reshot and still be considered the same film. Anchorman is one that was nearly completely different before being rewritten and reshot with different actors. Is that the real Anchorman? Or the one that was decided against because of a series of practical and artistic decisions? If it was called Anchoryman Anchorman or otherwise re-titled is it the same thing or an entirely new, inauthentic version of the original?

The name change is an important point. Is there any way that Brian Wilson could have put ostensibly less good versions of these songs on an album called Smile? Smile as it is discussed is seen as the best thing that could have possibly happened. Smile cannot be considered as anything less than a grand and epic, perfect thing. There is zero potential that the Smile in people's heads could ever have turned out less than great. I think it is entirely possible that Brian Wilson could and did consider the songs on Smiley Smile as the end of his tinkering. If the name was a case of Brian deflecting expected criticism and from the impossibility of what he wanted to do, it further cements Smiley Smile as the real world, actual result of the Smile Sessions. The concept changed and so did the songs. That so many feel this is not the desired result of that work and simply not good enough is again a distraction. It is quite arbitrary to think that more instruments, more production and more words make one thing more finished or more complete. It involves a value judgement that has a whole mess of problems that can't adequately address what makes this inauthentic and that a big stinking pile of credibility.

As do I. Like I said, though, it's a nuanced issue.


I never made a "cover analogy".


As do I. Just as I think it would be absolutely possible for a filmmaker to use elements of a scrapped film to make an entirely new film.


It is entirely new, yes, in the sense that it is not the same as the old. Authenticity is another matter and nowhere have I argued that the Smiley Smile tracks are inauthentic. I just don't agree that the songs on the album are the completed versions of the Smile-era songs.


This seems like a lot of conjecture.


He wasn't "tinkering" - he re-made the songs entirely in what was a very marked transition from studio sessions for one album to studio sessions for another album. And is there any evidence for what you are saying is "entirely possible?"


Well, in that sense, then Pet Sounds is the finished version of Summer Days Summer Nights.


Again, this has nothing to do with anything I've said.

<<I think it's fair enough to say that when you record a song, mix it and release it, it can be considered a finished song. When it stops changing and ends up in a final released form, it can be considered a finished song. Seeing as there were no previous versions of these songs released on any album AND several conflicting versions of the same songs, I don't think the cover analogy works. >>

An interesting premise, but at odds with history.  Fact of the matter is, everyone in the Beach Boys organization, including the five principals, said they scrapped Smile.  Smiley Smile was the "bunt," as Carl put it... taking a group of songs recorded for another, completely project, and re-recording them for a new one.  Music history is filled with examples of projects written and/or recorded for projects that were never completed.  I think the Lifehouse/Who's Next analogy is perfect.

As for the argument that the first version released is the final version... Be True to Your School... Fun Fun Fun... Help Me Rhonda... Cottonfields... Susie Cincinnati... Cool Cool Water... California Saga: California... Rock & Roll Music... It's OK...Here Comes the Night... School Days... California Dreamin'... Summer in Paradise... just a few Beach Boys examples...

Honestly, I think there's a few other albums that need a "done right" before Smiley Smile, such as MIU, Keepin the Summer Alive or some might even suggest So Tough.

Well, these theological disputations are beyond the comprehension of this simple fella.

But for those of you Smilers out there who might be interested, I repeat - you can readily assemble an extended Smiley Smile from various tracks that lay ready to hand.

Enjoy.

Seconded.

'Cause I can't stand "She's Goin' Bald"? :-P

Anyway, irregardless of what the haters think, this is my 'new' Smiley Smile...

SIDE ONE
01) Heroes and Villains, Part 1
02) Heroes and Villains, Part 2  (note - these aren't the Smile Sessions single versions exactly, because I don't 100% agree with their editing choices; the ending of Part 2 is a mess!!)
03) Vega-Tables  (Smile Sessions sans segue)
04) Mrs. O'Leary's Cow
05) He Gives Speeches
06) I Love To Say Da-Da

SIDE TWO
01) Good Vibrations  (with 'hum-be-dum's)
02) With Me Tonight  (Smile Sessions)
03) Wind Chimes  (Smile Sessions sans segue)
04) Cabin Essence  (Smile Sessions)
05) Wonderful  (Smile Sessions)
06) You're Welcome

Tee hee.

(https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10275921_10152657491692107_5390304714959377531_n.jpg?oh=572b232b104c727ed3f6e68ea49d73a6&oe=54C8FB74)

I really like this track listing. Even for a regular Smile mix....though I'd have to add Surf's Up and CIFOTM somewhere.

Count me in as someone who dislikes She's Going Bald as well....it just gives me bad vibes, I don't find it fun at all. But to each their own.

Thirded.

Why not step into the Smiley Smile Shop? :-D

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10455089_10152657576812107_4489504734300031573_n.jpg?oh=b372eae6ac25e6c0b130fc3ef4ffed3c&oe=54B48A4D&__gda__=1420551474_40ab8789348bcbc61f7408b684f76cda)

Stepped out onto the deck behind my house last week and heard Smiley Smile playing.  My 23 year old daughter had was listening on her I phone to a subscriber website playing the album.  She could have been listening to  the Brian SMILE or the SMILE box which are just inside and ready to pop into the player.  She seems to actually prefer Smiley Smile.    I think she likes it because its more light hearted and fun than SMiLE.  She also likes the elephant 6 stuff.
Go figure.

I replaced "I Love To Say Da Da" in my line-up with "Cool Cool Water" - the June '67 version, rather than the more familiar version in the SMiLE box (which was recorded after 'Smiley Smile' actually came out).

It brings the side to a much more satisfying close.

Already done.  It's in stereo now.   8)

I moved "Heroes and Villains Part 2" to the end of side one.  I don't necessarily like this (it spoils the Smiley Smile flow of "side ending watery song, then Good Vibrations") but eight minutes of H&V right at the start seems like overkill.

Besides, the "Gee" intro after "Cool Cool Water" just... works.

Define "butchery". I can go as far as claiming that wasn't the best possible version by a long stretch...

It can only be considered butchery with the benefit of hindsight. Way back, it was the only version in the public domain, and therefore definitive. For many years. But for the twofers, GV30 and a cew boots etc, we'd maybe never have heard different.

How about this?  "Smiley Smile done right.... if it were held off until 1971." :-P

SIDE ONE
01) Our Prayer  [20/20 version]
02) Heroes and Villains  [stereo Smiley version]
03) Cabinessence  [20/20 version]
04) Wonderful  [stereo Smiley version]
05) Little Bird
06) Surf's Up  [Surf's Up version]

SIDE TWO
01) Vega-Tables  [stereo Smiley version]
02) Mama Says  [stereo bootleg version]
03) Wind Chimes  [stereo Smiley version]
04) Fall Breaks And Back To Winter  [stereo version]
05) Cool Cool Water  [Sunflower version]
06) Good Vibrations  [stereo Smiley version]

Try it, it works great! :)

All these 'Smile/Smiley Smile/whatever other albums or tracks spring to mind'-hybrids that people are posting up sound like incoherent messes to me.

Fire (in the middle of side one?), followed by He Gives Speeches, then Da-Da. I mean... huh?
 
But each to their own...

The cover of my new alternate universe idea! :)

(https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10365941_10152671474312107_1801339655259119401_n.jpg?oh=ba911a82df2421b013995c27d9d97a06&oe=54B05368)

Smiley-Wind Chimes and Wonderful in '71???

Now yer just being silly!  :lol

Well to be fair, I replaced Da-Da with the 1967 "Cool Cool Water".

Also, if you dislike that line-up - Fire in the middle of side one, He Gives Speeches - you do realize that's Smiley Smile, right? :-P

I see what you're doing there - but no, it isn't. Still, quality reply :)

That is won-won-won-wonderful!

You know... this is, like, Smile, not Smiley smile??!!
Ok, fill in CE and Su and that´s it!

I think in some ways Smiley represents a natural evolution of the original project and in others it's a completely separate album.

First of all, I have to agree with some of the other posters here who take offense at your assertion that Smiley wasn't "done right" the first time around. The only problem with it as it came out is the inclusion of Good Vibrations (arguably Heroes and Villains too) which doesn't fit and completely ruins the mood. But, that's on the record company not Brian. Otherwise, it's one of the most cohesive, interesting releases in the Boys' catalog. As far-out and ahead of the times as SMiLE would've been had it come out in January.

As a near-obsessive SMiLE mixer, the idea of remaking SMiLE using the Smiley tracklist as a guide intrigues me. I've come to believe H&V and Veggies were meant to go back-to-back on the original album because of how similar they sound, so maybe some other aspects of the Smiley tracklist were meant for SMiLE too. But then the problem arises when you notice how many songs on Smiley didn't exist in SMiLE. Maybe Tones and He Gives Speeches became Little Pad and She's Goin' Bald, but would the former two have really been on SMiLE as it was originally conceived? Would you even want to listen to such a mix, when you have songs like Surf's Up, CIFOTM and Cabin Essence just begging to be heard instead? I know I don't.

And that's really the problem--these two albums are interrelated, but not completely interchangeable. Smiley has the flowing, pseudo-concept album structure that I know SMiLE would have. I think the mistakes and goofy bits left in represent Brian trying to recreate the Psychedelic Sounds skits. It's just my intuition that they would've been in SMiLE, but it is a fact that Brian said spoken word humor between the tracks would've been in there. Given that he had Hal Blaine record those Veggie Fights and some other session musicians record George Fell, he was obviously serious about that idea at least for awhile. So, there's undeniably some seeds of the SMiLE project in Smiley. Brian still wanted to make people laugh, still wanted to convey the elements in musical form, and still wanted to push the envelope. Sure, Smiley is more stripped down and less complex...but nothing else by any band sounds anything like it. It's still very progressive stuff.

Where Smiley fails to live up to its cancelled predecessor is in its dropping of the session musicians, major themes (aside from health and humor) and the rather haphazard tracklist. Not dissing the man, but I don't think anyone can argue with the assertion that Brian was digging up anything he could quickly finish to throw together for this thing. It seems he gave Mike the opportunity to write lyrics for the unfinished stuff (which gave us Whistle In, She's Goin' Bald and Little Pad) and redid the most "finished" SMiLE material in a new style. It was all about getting it out fast, because they were already almost a year late. The original SMiLE vision had been lost, gotten too convoluted, and had missed its opportunity once Sgt Pepper and so many other Psychedelic albums had already come out. So Brian decided to start over with something simpler, done only by the Boys (to alleviate any hard feelings, and again, because it was faster than using the Wrecking Crew.) This lead to a completely new project with its own distinct sounds and feeling, even if it did recycle a lot of the old SMiLE material.

TL;DR: Smiley is its own beast. It cannibalized some aspects of SMiLE because that's what was lying around and the Boys had to get something out quick.

Brilliant. Shades of what could have been.

I don't know if I got you right, but if you insinuate there once was an original conception of SMiLE that was later deviated from, I disagree. There were ideas which were toyed around with, some of which were scrapped, new ideas added, kept in a limbo, revised, and at some point junked in a big batch, and then the rest was finalised with a completely different approach (an approach you described very well) as Smiley Smile.

If there was something you could have called an original concept, that was already junked when the album was renamed from "Dumb Angel" to "SMiLE".

Maybe I got you wrong, as I connect well with everything else in your post. :)

I dont mean a detailed, set in stone conception...but as you say there were a lot of ideas. Ideas which were later scrapped, like the Americana suite and the Psychedelic/Aquarian vibes. Someone once said that if SMiLE was musical acid/shrooms, Smiley was musical weed/hashish. The former intended to be the ultimate mindfuck album while the latter, by design or not, ended up being very relaxed and stoned-out. I'd hazard a guess that the Americana stuff and covers of old standards was more VDP's idea. He seemed to really believe in the idea of the Boys as Americana in and of themselves, and based on Song Cycle, that kinda stuff seemed to be his schtick in any case. Makes sense then, why that angle would be ditched when the project shifted to Smiley. H&V still appeared on it, but only because it was released as a single.

I'd argue SMiLE was dead by mid-december 1966. I believe that's around when VDP left the first time, thats when the Boys came back and didn't like what they heard, thats when Brian gave up on The Elements, that was the last time work was done on anything except the potential singles. Paradoxically, that's also when the Capitol list was written up, which gives us our best (though still flawed) insight into the original idea for the album. Was this when the album was renamed? I'm a bit fuzzy on that detail?

Buh? No.

I wouldn't be so completely dismissive of the idea. It's a well known fact Brian reused sections of tracks left and right around this time. Smiley is still primarily a collection of SMiLE leftovers, and while it's often forgotten about, there's a case to be made that Tones was slated for SMiLE. Obviously it wasn't even written when most of the other songs were, but I think it's possible it could've been a last minute replacement for the scrapped Elements or something similar.

Anyway, while the connection is not nearly as strong as that between Speeches and Bald for example, there's some evidence to be made. I believe Carl shares a writer's credit on Little Pad, and it's well known that Tones was his baby. Also, consider these two videoes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7CW9ZzbTYE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7CW9ZzbTYE)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHAf8zavRG8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHAf8zavRG8)

Carl wrote "Tones" but has no credit on "Little Pad" and, above all else, there's only really a similarity in rhythm. That's it. Occasionally a chord will line up with the melody, but you could do that with hundreds of songs - there's a ton of dissonance in the videos you've posted.

Yes, Brian reworked scrapped Smile pieces into some Smiley Smile tracks and some later tracks, but it sometimes feels as though people try too hard to hunt for earlier origins of tracks when there is none. "Gettin' Hungry", "Whistle In", and "Little Pad" are examples of songs with no known Smile origins. There aren't a lot of drastic reworkings like this, anyway - "She's Goin' Bald" is a Smiley arrangement of "He Gives Speeches" with new lyrics and a new end sections, which isn't too far off from any other Smiley arrangement of Smile tracks.

Ah, my bad about the credit on Little Pad. I guess you're right then. And I definitely agree with Getting Hungry being an original. But wasn't Whistle In derived from Worms?

I'd get rid of Heroes and Villains and Good Vibrations as I've always felt they just don't belong. I'm gonna start it off with You're Welcome just for the fun of it. It's a 21 minute trip.

You're Welcome
Vegetables    
Fall Breaks Back To Winter
She's Goin' Bald    
Little Pad    
With Me Tonight    
Wind Chimes    
Gettin' Hungry    
Wonderful    
Whistle In

Anyone who tells you that is a liar. The bridge of "Worms" with the chanting has more in common with the guitar solo on "Santa's Beard" than "Whistle In." Again, the similarity is solely in the part of the rhythm of the melody, but the actual melodies are different and then go in totally different directions after four, erm, syncopated syllables.

From the SS/WH twofer notes:
A version of this was recorded on 1/27/67, the same day as the "Cantina" section of "Heroes and Villains".  It is possible that at one point, "Whistle In" was part of "Heroes and Villains".

Ipso facto.....

IT IS POSSIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

Plus, nothing like this has ever been booted or put on the Smile Sessions box, so hrrrm. :\

Above all else, I guess I meant more that "Whistle In" wasn't derived from anything we'd heard.

Try adding "Be Still". You might be surprised.

Smiley Smile IS done right :'(

... I might toss the Smiley Smile-esque "Good Vibrations" Hawaii rehearsal from the Hawthorne comp in place of the album version, tho. I MIGHT. The single version of "Good Vibrations" just feels so firmly cemented to Smile, for me, where as "Heroes" at least has some Smiley session overdubs (teh organ, most notably). Has the Wally Heider recording of "Good Vibrations" ever surfaced? It's not on any Lei'd In Hawaii bootlegs that I've ever heard, but it might be even better given the after-the-fact heavy reverb of the Hawthorne mix (WHHHYYY).

Thank you, runnersdialzero, for clearing that up. Gotta say, that really changes my feelings on Whistle In. So, it wasn't a SMiLE--offshoot, but rather another chant recorded in the SMiLE Era? And yet ANOTHER Heroes fragment? Damn. I wonder how many songs eventually spun off from that? It really was an album in itself, that last dynamic Brian moment...

I'd love to here the original SMiLE version. I wonder if it was like the SMiLE With Me Tonight, in that it was faster, less "depressing-sounding" and perhaps more fully orchestrated? This really just goes to show that there will ALWAYS be more SMiLE material out there, and that just when you think you've got it figured out, someone throws a wrench in one of your theories.

For what it's worth, I think Whistle In would have made a great fade to Heroes. A lot of those other tangential Heores segments are really hard to imagine fitting in with the more "mainstream" segments, but this one I can see it. There's a "Part One Tag" on the boxset, but to these ears it seems kinda subpar and not punchy or interesting enough to close out such an interesting track. Some people think Barnyard was gonna be the fade, but to me that just doesn't fit. It just has nothing to do with anything. Neither does Great Shape, which then explains why they were taken out (and perhaps spun off into the track, "I'm in Great Shape.") I know it never would've been canon, but I really liked the fade I made for H&V1 in my Aquarian mix. I think the new Barnshine fade was meant for H&V2 or the single version of H&V1 once the album was sold for scrap for the single. Whistle In works great though, in that conveys a sense of sadness and loss, yet "whistling through the day" and trying to get over your problems with a tune. It fits the idea of what H&V became, getting over Margarita who was brought down by bullets. I believe H&V most likely would have lead into Cabin Essence, Vega-Tables or OMP on the album, and Whistle In works as a lead in to any of those. Whistle...like a train? Whistle...the the literal whistling in Veggies? And that same feeling of loss would be brought to a head in OMP.

Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Brian put much stock in this fragment since it wasn't in any working version of the song and hasn't surfaced at all. Damn shame.

I thin that SS/WH notes indicate that "Whistle in" has origin in Smile´s "Whistling bridge", perhaps even in "All day"?? For this second  just lyrically, but "Whistlin bridge" is certainly origin of SS Whistle in.
Just my opinion.

goshdarn, imagine the Whistling Bridge/Tape explosion transitioning to Whistle In as the fade of Heroes? I know what I'm trying the next time I rearrange that song!

No, "Whistling Bridge" has been released and isn't "Whistle In". The Twofer (which means this is 15+ year old speculation) only says "it's possible" that "Whistle In" was a "Heroes" section, but nothing like this has been booted or released on the Smile box set, so I'm not sure.

Oh look, another wrench...

I know "Whistling bridge" isn´t "Whistle in" , but SSWH notes say that "version" of "Whistle in" was recorded on 27th January 1967, and therefore I´m convinced that this "version" is "Whistlin bridge".
But let´s remember that "Bedroom tapes", if we can call them that way, started with "Whiste in"! Here´s qoute:
""Whistle In" (alternate versions) - Alternately, one could argue that a number of spirited takes of "Whistle In," from summer '67, are characteristic of the way Wilson attached himself to a basic riff and noodled with it endlessly during the 'Bedroom' years. "
http://www.laweekly.com/music/brian-wilsons-secret-bedroom-tapes-a-track-by-track-description-4479099

Performed with a similar feel, but not the same music.  "Whistle In" is the music from the chorus of "Look" combined with what is basically the vocal melody of the end of "Do You Like Worms."  That's how "Whistle In" comes from "Smile."

So...it is (loosely) derived from Worms? This thread is really throwing me for a loop. I still like the idea of Whistling Bridge into Whistle In as the fade to Heroes though. Sounds like a beautiful new idea for a song that's already been remixed a hundred different ways.

I really, really don't think any of this is true.

Ah, gotcha - that totally makes sense and, looking at Andrew's site, "Whistling Bridge" was indeed recorded on January 27th.

You genuinely hear no resemblance at all?  "Wahala loo lay / Wahala loo la" v. "Remember the day / Remember the night..."? 

Since being a fan in 1968 I've often thought that SS was the worst piece of crap the BB's ever put out. It almost single-handedly destroyed their career.They were constantly playing catch-up from this point on. Bad judgement and decision making led to the release of this album (which can happen when you're smoking too much hash). When you consider what Brian was working on and then this comes out, well , that's no way to compete with the Beatles. Now of course I have changed my mind about SS, it's no longer the worst piece of crap the Beach Boys have put out; Summer in Paradise is.

Slight.  I hear similarities with the music style, tempo, the number of syllables, etc.  but not the melody so much.   Don't forget that EVERYTHING in SMiLE is related in some way. 

I think everyone goes through an anti-SS phase in their Beach Boys fandom. I think it was the shelving of SMiLE and no-show at Monterey that killed them though, not so much releasing this. Ironically, if they waited a few more months, Smiley may have fit right in with the back to basics movement of mid to late 1968. It was just too ahead of the Times.

Welcome to the SS board Gerry!! I can see by your post that you've got excellent taste. Keep up the splendid work, dude. This is a three wooter if I ever saw one! :woot :woot :woot

And also "well it rained on the mountain --". Similar rhythm and identical intervals. Nobody says that Sweet Mountain came from Do You Like Worms.

The more repetitive Smile / Smiley Smile compositions can be so ridiculously simple (I - V - I - V and I - IV - V7 left and right) that it's inevitable some songs will sound like others. Because they're the same common progressions used millions of times before, and not just by the Beach Boys.

It's only a similarity in rhythm, and only for all of about three notes - after that, the melodies and rhythms go in totally different directions. Like I said a bit ago, the bridge of "Worms" sounds closer to the solo of "Santa's Beard" than "Whistle In" - where are the claims that "Worms" is totally derived from "Santa's Beard"? It's just a coincidence, that's all.

Smiley Smile was the album that took me from curious to being a fan. Hearing someone say, "That's no way to compete with the Beatles!" makes me want to HEAVE. FROM MY ASS :'(

Probably because they really don't resemble each other.  Even if you don't fully agree with me, you must admit there is a much larger resemblance between the three songs I discussed in comparison to any resemblance between "Worms" and "Sweet Mountain." 


I see what you're saying, but of course the "Santa's Beard" seems derived from "Jingle Bells."  I'm not saying the melodies between "Worms" and "Whistle In" are an exact match, but they seem far more related.


Not once. 

Heaving can be good for the soul... if you have one

I have six.


I see what you're saying, but of course the "Santa's Beard" seems derived from "Jingle Bells."  I'm not saying the melodies between "Worms" and "Whistle In" are an exact match, but they seem far more related.
[/quote]

So you're telling me "Whistle In" is just a big ripoff of "Jingle Bells." I can totally sing "Jingle bells. Jingle bells... jingle all the way" over the "Worms" bridge.