The Smiley Smile Message Board

Suppose Brian Wilson was young today. What kind of music do you think he would be working on, and would it be popular? (I'm talking young, ambitious, energetic Brian.)

he'd be a dentist.

or a professional photographer

If it was remotely similar to today's top 40, I wouldn't want to hear it.  Maybe his talent would still show through, but a tasteful use of talent is rare in modern commercial music as far as I'm concerned.  Based on the sound which he in part influenced, he'd probably fare best in the indie rock/pop scene.

Well as The Beach Boys started out by phoning in and voting for Surfin, I guess the modern equivalent would be American Idol or X Factor or one of those pieces of bilge. Their voices would probably be manipulated to sound identical and to take all of the character away from them.

Brian would never be a success in today's music business.
The parallel would be Justin Bieber or Miley Cyrus.
If he was recording his own songs in Garageband and uploading them on Youtube, he'd have a few followers from among his High School buddies and probably a couple hundred views. Some snarky comments on Twitter.
"The Beach Boys" equivalent in today's music is perhaps "One Direction" and they are a made-for-TV creation. It's quite unlikely that a family would gather 'round the piano and sing harmonies together----Dennis would be on Ritalin, Carl would be playing video games, and Mike would be a wanna-be white rapper.

He'd be Bruno Mars minus the charisma

If he had the same tastes, his music would appeal to arty types. I don't understand why some people here seem to think that all modern music = Bieber.

Who's to say he would even be the same person nowadays.

His entire family dynamic would probably be completely different. A less strained relationship with his father, a different sort of relationship with his brothers (like someone mentioned earlier, new technologies and such). That motivation to please his father (which is assumed) probably wouldn't have been the same and he wouldn't have had the same drive. The harmony with his brothers probably wouldn't have really formed at all, either. No one really wants to do that sort of thing anymore.

I don't think he would have landed a recording contract like he did, without any real craze to cash in on. He'd probably just be another guy out there struggling to get noticed.
He might not have even discovered the Four Freshman and Chuck Berry - and where would he be without those early influences?

He could be the guy delivering your pizza. 

Well there are so many factors that could go into this. Considering he would be young now then we would have no Beach Boys ever.
Which means popular music today would most likely be a lot different as many bands have been directly inspired by the beach boys and Brian.

But I think he would probably make some 'indie' music
Meaning he would try to be experimental with sounds and try to make music as organically as possible.
But who knows? Was he ever the type to try to make 'hits' just to have a hit?

Whatever it would be would definitely have 'pop sensibility' but could definitely be experimental
He did love to mess around in the studio.

These are some songs that I could imagine him taking part in.

Let me know what you all think.

http://youtu.be/7jgmgE-QDzA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2nA9gsZDmQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUwfnTdzQSU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyaDTiXH3R4

http://youtu.be/OHTSxw6zN1E

http://youtu.be/tjecYugTbIQ

I think that if Brian would be a young, ambitious musician today, he could be successful, but not in the same way as he was in the 1960s. Image is so important nowadays and I'm not sure if a shy, goofy, introverted kind of guy like Brian could have been a mainstream pop star in 2014. But no doubt he would still be successful in some way, either as a well-respected indie cult figure, or as a songwriter/producer/studio vocalist working behind the scenes.

If he had the same tunes to create the production values would be different but I'm sure the appeal  and success would still be there.

He'd be raising hell with Justin Beiber!

He'd be working on indie hipster music.

They were too ugly and shy to succeed in the modern pop industry in a comparable commerical way as they did in the 60's. Top lists today are dominated by sexual imagery.

I think it's a good point someone made that he might never have started harmonizing with his brothers. Instead of gathering around the piano, Dennis would be off with his friends or constantly texting, and Carl would be in his room playing video games. Brian probably never would have heard the Four Freshmen, which means his music might have taken a different direction. Maybe he wouldn't have even been into harmonies so much. I wonder who in today's music scene would influence him. I still think he would have gotten into music, though. Maybe he would have gathered his friends and formed a band, or maybe he would have started tinkering with music software and posting stuff on YouTube.

I don't think he would have been famous, except he might have had a cult following online, and maybe he would have made it into Paste or some magazine like that.

But there are still singer-songwriters out there who are more about the music.  They're just not as well known.

I think Brian would be successful in any era.  I mean the man lived and breathed music from a young age.  A prodigy with music bursting from every pore in his body.. 

I'm not a religious guy, but I almost feel like people such as Brian or Mozart were preordained to create music for the world to enjoy.  It is a rare gift.

I feel the same way...especially about the Beach Boys. The stars were too well aligned for that to be a random accident.

This is an interesting question mostly because it has so many different approaches.

1) Do we assume a musical personality is who he is, with outside factors as relatively minor influences? In other words, Brian loves vocal harmony and basically takes the body of work we know but in a modern context.

2) Do we assume the person's personality is the key, but musical personality is more heavily influenced by outside factors? So, for example, he is still an introverted kid but instead of grabbing somewhat passe vocal harmony groups as his prime influence, he latches onto something that is similarly passe now?

3) Do we expand the exercise, knowing what we think of as Brian is actually a combination of Brian and his family and friends? Murry's influence is suddenly Nickelback or Maroon 5 or whatever might be lame and popular with some suburban parents; Dennis's extramusical Californian influence isn't surfing, but [whatever rebellious kids in suburban California do]; Carl isn't learning rock 'n' roll guitar with David Marks, but rather making beats or something? If that's the case, it's Brian's gift of synthesizing disparate elements that is key, and the result is something wholly unique.

I think the latter is the most realistic approach, but also we'd have to take into account that certain extramusical aspects are so different that the Brian we know wouldn't exist in the same way. The odds that Murry would have behaved the same way are lower because that sort of abusive father is less accepted: abuse is more likely to be reported and the situation changed. Mental health care is better, and Brian may well have gotten diagnosed and treated more professionally, earlier. With more entertainment options, the odds of the family gathering around an instrument and singing are far lower (as someone else said earlier). And so on.

Further, the music that has happened between the actual Brian Wilson's career and now is hugely influenced by the actual Brian Wilson, so having removed him from it means that we have no idea what his musical surroundings would even resemble. Key elements of pop we take for granted would no doubt have developed differently.

So the most realistic answer is: if Brian Wilson were 19 or 20 now, he wouldn't be recognizable as Brian Wilson.

I don't think all modern music = Bieber, but he's representative of the contemporary successful 19-year-old pop star. Of course, there are indie artists--in abundance--but they are not superstars, by a long shot. As talented as they may be in crafting melodies, they do not have the ear of a generation, and they will be forgotten quickly.

The Beach Boys and Brian Wilson as a musical phenomenon were born out of a special circumstance that does not exist today.

Yeah and one of those circumstances happened to be inability for the masses to have access to information / content like people do today.

People are able to find a lot of different artists that they like so they don't necessarily have to put all their eggs in one basket.

I think if Brian was 19 or 20 in 2014, I think he'd by trying out for Baseball, working on that Curveball  :lol

Considering the most likely different circumstances brought on by living in an different era, I highly doubt Brian would have got the same influences musically and he likely wouldn't have had the same type of upbringing he and his brothers had to endure from Murry. So I just don't see the Wilson Brothers turning to music in 2014

I could see him making music like this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_-cUdmdWgU

Brian sure wouldn't be one of those "phony singing for money" artists.

An incredibly loaded question--but I like it.  :)

Considering Brian's penchant for songwriting collaboration, I wonder who he would partner with today.  A lot of Top40 currently has a lots of duets and "Artist-X featuring Artist-Y"--even bands like Coldplay and Eminem featuring artists like Rihanna.  Conversely, I wonder which artists today would seems out something like Brian to feature on one of their songs...I have no good answers lol--anyone have any good suggestions?  There are probably some sensible pairings we could think of--but what would be a bizarre pairing that might actually work??

he'd be a rapper.  As much as their music sucks, the rappers have the most creative music these days.  Rock & Roll is now rap.  What peple call 'rock and roll' generally is elevator music, Brian Wilson would never make elevator music. 

I agree with the earlier sentiment that 'the magic' wouldn't have happened without him growing up where he did, when he did. 

Hawthorne, California could certainly influence him to be a rapper.  A lot of good acts have come from that area, Compton etc,  maybe that's why "Smart Girls" was so hip hop! ;)

He'd invent falsetto-rap.

I don't think he'd do falsetto again, he was just imitating some of the stuff going on at the time.  None of that is going on, now... honestly i'm not sure he'd get into music either in this day and age.  You have to wonder who he'd be inspired by.  He mentions everybody from Nat King Cole to the Four Freshmen to Chuck Berry to Rosemary Clooney as influences. 

Another thing to ponder since we're getting all crazy with it, is what did Brian ADD to the music scene that's permanent?  It's completely possible that without Brian certain things wouldn't have happened, and the music scene might not sound like it does right now.  Right now, there's not much left to 'invent' or do great that hasn't already been done.  Depending on Brian's contributions and how they affected the way music has changed over the years, it's possible that without him in the early 60's, some things may not have been done musically... which would leave more room for a modern day 'genius' to come along and show the world something new. 

It's really kind of unfair to modern artists, they have to do something creative or new that 60 years of Rock & Roll hasn't given us.  Brian had 5 or 6 years of Rock & Roll to trump; it was easier for him to go places that hadn't been gone to yet. 

Like this?
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zNZ78c-hh1Y

Heaven forbid.

P otm, except one of the biggest breakout acts of last year were three sisters who grew up singing harmony together (Haim!) so it's not entirely out of the realms of possibility, but then again they sound more like Fleetwood Mac, and Fleetwood Mac wouldn't sound like Fleetwood Mac if it wasn't for Lindsey Buckingham's obsession with Brian Wilson...

Just a thought, I'm not sure what the equivalent is today to the Chuck Berry, Four Freshman mix, but 20 years ago perhaps someone could mix Boyz 2 Men style harmonies with Nirvana type rock. Not sure what the Phil Spector of the 90s would be. Moby? Beck?

I think a gen x Brian might be something like Jason Lytle of Granddaddy. Or Daniel Johnston.

Lorde's songs feature harmony.

The Beach Boys are one of the top 4 or 5 acts... EVER, though... so there's only a couple artists today that would be comparable as far as 'star quality' to what Brian was in the early 60's.  So if Jason Lytle or Daniel Jonston for instance have his kind of vibe musically, it's still not even similar because they only have about a hundredth of the star power the Beach Boys achieved.  So we'd be talking about somebody with the star power of Eminem, or Beyonce, or whatever.


So my whole point is, if we take Jason Lytle for example (never even heard of him)... I assume he's fairly creative or you wouldn't have mentioned him.  Now, imagine a world where that guy blows up to the level of Eminem. 

That's what the early 60's were like.  An incredibly creative period for music, where the most creative and talented musicians were actually appreciated on a mainstream level. 

assuming a 20-year-old bw in 2014 would have similar musical tastes if not necessarily background, i imagine him along the lines of the daniel johnston-jason lytle-dent may types already mentioned. he'd probably have already amassed a lot of home recordings, like a lot of introverted, musically-minded millennial kids, and with his brothers he could easily found a successful indie band. but i have trouble imagining him with more than moderately-successful-indie-band popularity; he'd be too involved in creating his own small universe to care.

lol, maybe, yeah, sure.  :)  Fun fact: Danielson was on Tooth & Nail Records for a time, and that record label is/used-to-be my favorite!

I keep thinking about this, even trying to ignore the 'If Brian is in 2014, did the beach boys ever exist? What happens if they didn't exist?' time paradox.

Weird how everyone we are attempting to consider as 'what would Brian sound like as a 20 year old in 2014' is actually in their 30's or 40's.

There are lots of odd things to consider. For example, would Brian learn piano? Would he even have one in the home? It's not as common as it was in the fifties. And if Brian didn't learn piano, what would he learn? Guitar?

Would he be making music on computers? Absolutely. And that changes something that seems to have plagued Brian esp around his production peak - how do I get this sound onto tape? And more often then not coming to the conclusion that it can't. But Smile is easily made on computers... by anybody. I point you to Egon's spectacular remake http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJb8ZQdLTzY which he has painstakingly recorded at home! (stop me if I'm wrong, Egon). But anyone with a free piece of software and some mp3's could make a smile mix. Brian of 2014 could hear all those wild adventurous songs and do them instantly by himself without having to free up channels on a 4 track or losing things in the mix by having to record direct to the master, etc. He wouldn't even need a record deal (More on that in a bit)!

Also, much harder for someone to throw your vocal master in a skip...

Other things - Brian would have been exposed to a radically different musical landscape as a teenager now. The obvious takeaway is that Brian would have heard Jay-Z before he would have heard The Four Freshmen or Chuck Berry (in any event, he would have probably still met Kanye West, a strange constant of the universe). But 1960's teen Brian wanted to be famous at the start. He wanted to be played on the radio. A crucial difference in 50 years of popular music has been the fact that you don't need to actively court the mainstream to be considered a successful musician. The thing is, is 2014 BW's version of success the same as 1961 BW's?

Maybe not - he might actually know more about how major labels will f*** you up all the time and would want to retain his control over his music*, and unlike in 1961, actually have an alternative to that path. He would be able to find out more about how the industry works, how a successful album is rewarded with two years of gruelling stadium touring (and that THAT'S how you actually make your money!) and having your movements followed by arseholes with cameras shouting at you. That'd have a devastating effect on him! But it would have instilled the same competitive streak that made him write his best work in the 60's because that's still how mainstream pop works.

So if Brian doesn't decide to court the mainstream, would he have pushed himself to write as well? He was competitive at that level. I can't imagine BW of 2014 going 'I'm going to write a song that's gonna be so much better than The Arcade Fire!' just as I can't imagine anyone saying that with a straight face. He'd have a completely different set of motivations. If Brian isn't pushing himself to sell more records, when the way he thought to sell more records was to simply WRITE BETTER SONGS, he might not even force himself to write a song as good as California Girls, let alone Good Vibrations and Smile.

Again, I think Haim is the most successful 'Beach Boys in modern times' analogue we have. Musical siblings start band, sing harmonies. No craze to latch themselves onto tho (Selfie USA?), but wildly successful straight off the bat with their first release. They are also totally different to The Beach Boys, so not sure how valid it is.


*Minor thing - Capitol didn't like Pet Sounds, but released it anyway. In 2014, the label would most likely either tell you to do it again with another producer, or drop you. There's a reason Beyonce self-released her album....

Well said.  Another thing to think about is, although it's easier to release music now (put it out yourself on youtube if you want)... and easier to record music now (anybody with a computer can for free, essentially create a halfway decent recording)... in the 60's... once Brian or Murray or whoever convinced Capitol to RECORD a song, they were kind of committed to promoting it and getting it on the radio. 

So I can see a scenario today where Brian records a song himself, and then nobody listens or even cares.  At least when Capitol recorded it, you were guaranteed Capitol would make sure somebody would hear it and it would be pushed a little bit.

Did Murray pull some strings to get them the Capitol records try out?  Even with music being easier to record now, il'l bet it's MUCH harder to get an audition, as an unknown, with a record company.... especially when you're a self taught 'garage band'. 

Good point. I think Radiohead and the Flaming Lips are good examples of modern progressives that are mainstream. But Jason Lytle has a style that has a Brian vibe to me. He also produces his own records and plays all the instruments in the studio
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RIGqUy8gzGY

Daniel Johnston reminds me of Love You era Brian.

Personality wise, today, I think Brian would be like the singer of Sparkle Horse, hopefully without shooting himself. Mike would be Timberlake and Dennis would be like Kurt Cobaine. Imagine those two trying to get along.

They are also all old enough to be hypothetical 2014 BW's father...

He'd probably still be in college and not be making music professionally yet.

iirc, Murry just walked into that office and browbeat Nik Venet into giving them a record deal. A model that barely flew in 1961 will hardly fly now.

Right, but I mean, they are artsy bands that are upper tier popularity wise today. Radiohead at least. Maybe they are past their prime now though, I don't know.

When Brian was 19 or 20, he wasn't 'artsy', though, he was really mainstream Rock & Roll.  So at 19 or 20, he'd be... Justin Bieber. 

So if the model holds true, Justin Bieber is about to get into a HUUUUUUGE Pissing contest with New Direction.

I wonder how his drug use would change if he grew up now instead of in the '60s. Maybe he'd do a lot more ketamine or MDMA than heroin or coke. And how would that change the music he'd end up making!

I have been fascinated with this thread for a while, this post in particular. I agree with this post definitely. Brian would probably be a hip-hop producer, but not mainstream hip-hop. The more experimental stuff.

If Brian was 19 or 20 in 2014...

Thank Almighty God that he isn't, and that he is who he is and was able to accomplish what he's best known for when and where he did. (The reasons I feel this way have already been mentioned in this thread so I'll refrain from repeating them all.)

He'd be obsessed with LOL and living in his parents basement.

Well, in terms of international success, that's not a bad comparison...