The Smiley Smile Message Board

I had this years ago on VHS, but has it ever been released on dvd?

I don't have a copy of it anymore, and havn't seen it in Years!...... I remember ML making an appearance, but that's about all I remember of it...

is it available online anywhere?.....

anybody seen it and have any thoughts on the movie?

I can't even remember if it was any good or not......

Cheers, RickB

I recall seeing it released on DVD a few years ago.  Seems to me it was pretty expensive.  Have you done a search?

In an effort to be helpful, I did a quick search on ebay, which only turned up one vhs copy.   :3d

By the way, to anybody who can remember, how's the film?  Any good?

I got my DVD copy a few years back, directly from the J&D Official Website - signed by both guys (sadly, not an option anymore) - but it may be worth checking out there, or contacting the site to see if they are still available ...

Unless there's a bunch of signed ones still sitting there

I used to have a VHS copy. In fact, I may have it around somewhere. I'm not sure it's still playable, though.  I tried transferring it to a DVD-R a few years ago and had to give up because of tracking problems.

I thought it was a good movie for a TV movie of the week. Richard Hatch is impressive in the role of Jan, as is Bruce Davison as Dean. I always knew Davison could act, but Hatch was surprisingly good. It's a superficial feelgood movie, especially given the dark topic. I don't think Jan ever recovered as well as they showed in this movie and his life was pretty terrible, at least according to Dean. But who knows, because I once saw Jan and Dean in concert, and Jan looked really happy. Mike appears in a concert scene at the end. It's worth getting if you can get it for a reasonable price.

Thanks for the mini-review, KittyKat.   :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8nao_z9NSs

Hey, thanks!  That was cool! Not only did this sequence have Mike Love of the Beach Boys and Bruce Johnston playing themselves, but a there was a great message to all recording artists to not agument your singing voice with pre-recordings or other technology and the fans will go bananas for an honest performance, no matter the ala mode quality.

Around the 2:40 mark, I half expected Mike to change from his Pet Sounds coloured suit into to his superman suit and spirit J&D away from humiliation - glad Mike kept a cool head.

At least it was somewhat understandable with Jan's situation, unlike Milli Vanilli which was due to a complete lack of talent!

As I'm not up on my Jan and Dean history, I have a couple of questions for you guys.


What I know:

- I'm familiar with the duo's best-known numbers.

- I know he guys were closely linked with the BB.

- I know that Berry suffered a terrible automobile accident.

- I think I know that Brian both wrote and performed on "Surf City," and it sounds, to me, as if Brian had a hand in "The Little Old Lady from Pasadena," as well (in fact, while growing up, I fully believed both were Beach Boys songs).  Am I on base with this?




I did not know that a scene similar to that depicted in the Deadman's Curve link above actually took place.

Wikipedia states "In 1973, Jan and Dean made an appearance at the Hollywood Palladium, as part of Jim Pewter's "Surfer's Stomp" reunion, in which the duo attempted to lip sync "Surf City," and the record failed. They were booed off stage."

I guess my question is, did the remainder of what was shown in the film (specifically, Jan's moving words to the audience, followed by a noble attempt at a true 'live' performance) actually occur, or is this a case of taking some 'artistic license,' in order to allow a "Hollywood ending" for the film?

Does anybody know?

Little Old Lady is one of the few Jan & Dean hits that Brian *didn't* have anything to do with. He co-wrote, among others, Drag City, Ride The Wild Surf, Dead Man's Curve, The New Girl In School and Sidewalk Surfin'...

Wow, see, I wouldn't have guessed BW had a hand in quite so many of J&D's numbers.

Though no citation is given for the quote, Wiki also says of "Surf City": "The first draft of the song, with the working title "Goody Connie Won't You Come Back Home," was written by Brian Wilson of The Beach Boys. He gave it to Jan Berry and Dean Torrence of Jan and Dean who finished writing and recording it with Wilson in the early 1960s."

So I guess while this is suggesting that Brian was a factor in the recording of the number, it doesn't state in which capacity he would have been involved.  He is singing on the recording, right?

I don't mean to pile on with the questions, but there is no recording of a Brian demo of "Surf City" (or "Goody Connie Won't You Come Back Home," if you will) which circulates, correct?

Thanks for your time.

That's right -- he's singing on there, one of the two falsetto vocalists (the one that's lower in the mix, and in tune). I don't know offhand if he's on any of the other Jan & Dean hits as a vocalist.
As far as I know there's no demo of the track circulating, and from the way the story's told -- that Brian played an unfinished version of the song on piano to Jan, who finished it off -- there may never have been one recorded.

From what I have heard-the happy ending of Deadman's Curve is artistic license.  Jan and Dean were booed off stage and didn't return that night.  Film was finished in late 77.  But.....They did make a somewhat triumphant return in 78-guesting at about 10 BB shows.  Jan's singing wasn't perfect-but apparently at times it sounded good enough (

For the most part, the Deadman's Curve movie is fiction. It is based on a 1974 Rolling Stone article, which goes into much more--and accurate--detail about Jan's post-accident recovery. The movie, among many things, almost completely ignores Jan's work as a producer, both during the heyday of Jan and Dean and after the accident. Though he couldn't sing and could barely speak, Jan actually started producing within a year of the 1966 accident, the end result being Carnival of Sound, which was finally released in 2011. Jan also recorded on his own regularly in the late 1960s and throughout the 1970s. He was probably best vocally post-accident during that period. He also started touring again on his own in the mid-1970s. By the time the Deadman's Curve came out in 1978, Jan had been recording and touring for the better part of a decade. (The movie ignores almost all of this, particularly, as I said, the production stuff.) The ending of the movie is based on an actual event, but from what I understand, it was meant as a joke. J&D were supposed to lip synch during their appearance, and Dean--without apparently telling Jan--made it so the record they were lip synching too intentionally skipped, to make fun of their appearances in the 1950s and 60s when they would lip synch. The audience didn't get the joke--or understand what was wrong with Jan, as the DMC movie was still five years away and not many people knew about his condition--and they were booed.

The Jan and Brian relationship is more complicated and less one-sided than most people make it out to be. Yes, Brian was definitely more creative and a better songwriter and singer than Jan. However, Jan, in 1963, 64, was a far better producer than Brian, which shows when you listen to the backing tracks for Jan and Dean records of the time, compared to BB backing tracks. (Of course, the BB had the harmonies.) I think Brian learned a lot about production from Jan, which fully blossomed on his 1965 work and Pet Sounds. (Brian used the same Wrecking Crew musicians that Jan used for J&D records.)

Whenever I hear a J&D song, I think of how much better it would be were the Beach Boys singing it.

I have a fond memories of this movie but there was one scene that always bothered me. It's a scene where some girl is hanging out with Jan and Dean and "Surfin' Safari" is on the radio. She comments "That's my favorite Jan and Dean song!" and the guys respond despairingly "No, that's not us, that's the Beach Boys".
I was watching this movie with my Dad at the time. For some reason, my Dad interpreted this as proof that The Beach Boys stole everything from Jan and Dean. To this day...he still insists that the Beach Boys were nothing but Jan and Dean wannabes.  :o

Brian sings on the Drag City LP version of Dead Man's Curve (not the horn-laden single version).

I am curious as to why Brian didn't get a credit on the Surf City retread Folk City.

All in all the J&D music is well worth exploring, including (especially?) Save for a Rainy Day.

Great stuff here today, guys.  Thanks for answering my questions and sharing your thoughts.  I can say I've learned some interesting things here, which I never even knew I'd be all that curious about before today. :)

So, relx, I quoted you, specifically, because after trading posts with Andrew here earlier, I took a look at some Jan and Dean videos on youtube, and I came across this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTf2MehizWI

In this video, Brian himself speaks with an interviewer about his relationship with Jan (and he recounts some funny stories, too), and at 3:19 and 3:42, Wilson mentions Berry's abilities as a producer and talks about the things Brian learned, as a producer, from Jan.  You guys have all probably already seen this footage, but if not, maybe you'll find it of interest.

Wow . . . The lack of context on this board is amazing.

Jan & Dean had 16 Top-40 hits on the Billboard and Cash Box Charts between 1958 and 1965 (not counting the lesser chart records over their entire pre-accident career).

Jan & Dean had seven Top-10 records, only three of which were co-written by Brian Wilson.

When you look at the total range of Jan & Dean's Top-40 hits, Brian Wilson only co-wrote six of them.

In 1962, Jan & Dean's "Tennessee" peaked slightly higher than the Beach Boys' debut single ("Surfin'").

In all, Jan and Brian wrote nine songs together . . . 11 if you count "Sidewalk Surfin'" and the various incarnations of "Gonna Hustle You."


TOP TEN (10)

1958

     Jennie Lee
     (Jan Berry - Arnie Ginsburg)
     CASH BOX #3 -- R&B #4 -- BILLBOARD #8 -- (JAN & ARNIE)

1959

     Baby Talk
     (Melvin Schwartz)
     CASH BOX #7 -- BILLBOARD #10 -- R&B #28

1963

     Surf City
     (Jan Berry - Brian Wilson)
     BILLBOARD #1 -- CASH BOX #1 -- R&B #3

     Honlulu Lulu
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Lou Adler)
     CASH BOX #10 -- BILLBOARD #11

1964

     Drag City
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Brian Wilson)
     BILLBOARD #10 -- CASH BOX #10

     Dead Man's Curve
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Artie Kornfeld - Brian Wilson)
     BILLBOARD #8 -- CASH BOX #9

     The Little Old Lady (from Pasadena)
     (Jan Berry - Don Altfeld - Roger Christian)
     BILLBOARD #3 -- CASH BOX #5


TOP TWENTY (20)

1961

     Heart & Soul
     (Hoagy Carmichael - Frank Loesser)
     CASH BOX #16 -- BILLBOARD #25

1964

     Ride the Wild Surf
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Brian Wilson)
     BILLBOARD #16 -- CASH BOX #23


TOP THIRTY (30)

1963

     Linda
     (Jack Lawrence)
     CASH BOX #26 -- BILLBOARD #28

1964

     The New Girl In School
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Brian Wilson - Bob Norman)
     CASH BOX #26 -- BILLBOARD #37

     Sidewalk Surfin'
     (Brian Wilson - Roger Christian)
     BILLBOARD #25 -- CASH BOX #28

1965

     You Really Know How To Hurt A Guy
     (Jan Berry - Jill Gibson - Roger Christian)
     BILLBOARD #27 -- CASH BOX #42

     I Found A Girl
     (Phil Sloan - Steve Barri)
     BILLBOARD #30 -- CASH BOX #39

1966

     Popsicle
     (Buzz Cason - Bobby Russell)
     BILLBOARD #21 -- CASH BOX #24


TOP FORTY (40)

1960

     We Go Together
     (Shelly Haims - Perry Stevens)
     Cash BOX #39


B-SIDES & ALBUM CUTS
Co-written with Brian Wilson

1963

     She's My Summer Girl -- (B-Side)
     (Jan Berry - Don Altfeld - Brian Wilson)

     Surf Route 101
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Brian Wilson)

1964

     Surfin' Wild
     (Jan Berry - Roger Christian - Brian Wilson)

     Move Out Little Mustang
     (Jan Berry -  Brian Wilson - Roger Christian)


As for the 1978 film Deadman's Curve . . . It's bogus . . . a highly fictionalized and slanted portrayal.

The official Jan & Dean Sessionpgraphy is nearing completion for publication.

Well, that's why I'm asking questions, and why we're discussing it, no?  In order to get a better handle on the working relationship between Brian and Jan and Dean?  I don't see the problem, myself.

If Brian has a co-writing credit on 30% of J&D's top-ten hits, and 37.5% of the group's top 40 hits, this means Wilson shared in creating roughly one third of the group's more popular output.  I think that's noteworthy.

That said, I don't think anyone here has been guilty of suggesting Brian alone is responsible for the success of the group.  Okay, Andrew stated "Little Old Lady is one of the few Jan & Dean hits that Brian *didn't* have anything to do with," but if he had omitted the word "few," would it have made such a difference?  After all, his point was to correct a misconception I had held, by pointing out that Brian was not involved in that huge hit of Jan and Dean's.

relx, of course, saw fit to point out that Jan had a hand in helping to shape Brian's career as a producer.  All in all, I think the discussion has been pretty even-handed.

I thank you for taking the time to write up the list of records that you shared.  It does help to shape my understanding of Jan and Dean as a musical entity!  :)

edit:  I forgot to ask a question about your quote "As for the 1978 film Deadman's Curve . . . It's bogus . . . a highly fictionalized and slanted portrayal."  Why were the guys involved?  According to the movie's wiki entry, Jan, himself was in the movie and "Papa Doo Run Run featuring Dean Torrence went into the studio to record some additional songs for the soundtrack."  Was the film an 'authorized biography'?  Have any of the guys ever commented on the nature of the finished film?  I'm curious how they may have felt about it, if it was so inaccurate.

Oh, and the sessionography, will it be published online, or in a book?  It sounds like something fans of both Jan and Dean and The Beach Boys might enjoy.

The film was based on a 1974 "Rolling Stone" article by attorney Paul Morantz. It was a detailed and fairly accurate piece . . . but even Paul's article totally ignored the "Carnival of Sound" sessions.

Dean teamed up with Paul to get the movie made. They were both USC graduates. The film bore little resemblance to the article.

Dean wined and dined the screenwriter and producers. I've interviewed the screenwriter and director, and Richard Hatch (who played Jan).

Jan had little or no input on the film. As others have pointed out, Jan's creative relationship with Brian Wilson and Jan's production of the music were left out completely. Why? . . . Because Dean was the film’s primary consultant.

Dean got clips of his own post-accident music inserted into the film. But when it came to Jan’s post-accident music (which Lou Adler would gladly have allowed), they didn’t use any of Jan’s period solo singles. Instead, they made up a stupid fictional song, and portrayed is as something Jan was never able to finish.  Completely bogus.

Papa Doo Run Run was Dean’s band. That’s how they got into the film.

By the way, Hatch's post-accident portrayal of Jan is powerful and accurate. Jan was on the set daily, and Richard was able to mimic him brilliantly.

Jan was not happy about the film, and neither was his family. He supported it publically (as he should have) for the greater good of Jan & Dean.

The film got them back out on the road as an oldies nostalgia act . . . a money-making venture . . . but it did severe damage to Jan’s actual history in the process.

Any film portrayal will have faults; but the supporting characters in this movie were nearly all fictitious or composite characters.

Jan was in the audience for the film’s final sequence, as was his father and conservator Bill Berry, his mother Clara Berry, and director Richard Compton.

The Sessionography will be published in book form.

Thanks for your detailed reply, Mark.  This is all new to me, so what may seem common knowledge or mundane, even, is a bit fascinating, from where I sit.

Shame the film couldn't have more closely resembled the RS feature, if this article was as that much more true to the band's history.

It seems odd to me that if Jan was on the set daily, he wouldn't have been tempted to ensure a more fair and accurate depiction.  As you said, though, the 'greater good,' and such.

I noticed the link to the "Carnival of Sound" site in your signature.  Is this an endeavor of yours?  I'll be checking it out straightaway.

The Carnival of Sound website is a sub-site of the official Jan Berry site. It just has its own URL.

I just want to point out that BW does NOT sing the falsetto on Surf City but DOES sing a unison lead with Jan. Same with Ride the Wild Surf.

Correct . . . They doubled the leads.

The session takes of Jan and Brian doubling the lead vocal for "Ride the Wild Surf" survive as part of Jan's personal collection.

A full transcription of their studio dialog between takes will be included in the Sessionography book. It's pretty revealing.

He has a clear solo "surf city, HERE WE COME" that's not a double, though.

for anyone who has not read the 1974 rolling stone article and wants to read it, that article is in the media section under magazine scans.

Awesome.  Thanks, Steve!

Picked up Deadman’s Curve on VHS the other day from a thrift store for a grand total of $0.35... Was looking at the cover and noticed a weird error! They mismatched the names to the heads. Does anyone know how common this issue of the VHS is?  :lol
(http://i.imgur.com/owBKNHR.jpg)

I think that was the original VHS issue... if it has photos on the back including one of the real Jan & Dean.

they need to release this on dvd... it's one of my favorite Rock movies,,, I'm surprised it hasn't been released yet..maybe they can release it with a Jan and Dean concert or documentary kind of a two fer type deal...

The entire TV movie is on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRrwhEF1czc

It really portrays Jan as obnoxious just before the accident, not including Dean as a partner in a planned Jan production company, cheating on Jill Gibson, mouthing off to the officer in the army office, etc. I heard in a documentary, though, that the cheating part (with two women) was accurate. And they used a different name for Jan's girlfriend, not Jill.
Strange how the opening sequence dates a J and D concert as July 1966. Wasn't Jan's accident in April '66?

<<Strange how the opening sequence dates a J and D concert as July 1966. Wasn't Jan's accident in April '66?>>

The film plays fast and loose with dates.  It also notes Dean's visit to Jan to play him Save For A Rainy Day as occurring in 1970.  In fact, it happened in the fall of 1966.  This is standard telescoping with biopics.

they need to release this on dvd... >>

I looked into this about 13 years ago when acquiring titles for Retromedia Entertainment.  There's a great deal of confusion as to who owns the rights to the film.  Reportedly Paramount, but they weren't sure at the time.  And due to this confusion, it may have slipped into the public domain in 2006.  Unfortunately, the only transfer out there is the one that came from the VHS, which in turn, I believe, came from a film transfer to 3/4 tape back in the early 80s.

The book "When We Get To Surf City" by Bob Greene offers a great look at Jan & Dean touring in later years.

http://www.amazon.com/When-Get-Surf-City-Friendship/dp/031237691X

Jim

There's an old argument in there, but half of the argument's been deleted.   :lol

 A great rock & roll movie.

Transcribed from JanandDean.com, Biography Chapter 3:
(I'm flipping between browser windows since JanandDean.com doesn't allow for copying.)


"A week later, Jan, Brian, Mike, Carl, Dennis, David, and I all got together at Western Recording Studio in Hollywood, California and we recorded the two surf songs and it felt like magic once again!  After the recording session was over, Brian wanted to give us a preview of his next record.  He belted out "Surfin' USA".  We were floored.  Jan immediately tried to talk Brian into giving the song to Jan & Dean but Brian wasn't about to give it up but he did say that he had a similar song that was only partially completed and that he would be more than happy to give that song to Jan & Dean.  The title of that song was "Surf City".  We snapped it up!  It took a couple of days to finish writing the incomplete song.  Jan then went into the studio and produced a brilliant basic instrumental track with his hand picked studio musicians which included the use of two drummers.  When we were ready to record the vocals, Jan called Brian and invited him to the studio.  Once in the studio, Jan and Brian sang lead together (in studio vernacular, this is called doubling).  Then Brian and I sang some of the background parts plus a falsetto part that Brian and I had written.  Brian then suggested that he and I sing the very same vocal part a second time and see what that sounded like, so we did.  Now we had four vocals all singing the same melody.  The result was very unique because of the differences in the sound of our falsettos.  Brian's falsetto was mainly midrange in sound but mine was mostly top end (treble), mixing the two voices caused a strange but interesting harmonic.  Everybody in the studio loved the final result!"

Of course one must read the biography from that site with a heavy dose of salt.  Mental reservation is heavily at work: Dean frequently misleads by failing to mention the full story (as shown above, he doesn't say WHY Jan tried to talk Brian out of "Surfin' USA"), or crack a joke rather than mention something uncomfortable (such as in Chapter 5 when he jokes how they were relieved to not be in "Ride the Wild Surf" and how other surfers had a hit on them, and something about that thing with a surfer's girlfriend and how she wasn't right for him anyway).  But sometimes Dean does get so detailed that you can't help but trust what he says then.