The Smiley Smile Message Board

Perhaps you might remember the discography I posted a few months ago that featured all the songs that I believe Al Jardine played String, Fender or Danelectro bass on.  I'm trying to do the same thing for Brian, sort of so I can officially see who ended up playing more bass on record, but really just for fun.

What I need help with is pretty much entirely for the first few albums.  On the first three of four LPs, I suppose it would be easier to say which cuts he didn't play bass on, and go from there.  Starting with the All Summer Long LP, I'm pretty much all set.  If anybody remembers anything, I'd love all the evidence I can get.

As a bassist myself, I've made it my mission to settle the bass credits on every Beach Boys song recorded.

We'd all love to help, aeijtzsche, but this is a little like having Albert Einstein say "can you come over here and give me a hand with this equation?"

The other issue in my mind is, which songs did Brian vs. CARL play bass on on the early albums.  Listen to UM 3 and I think Surfers Rule. It's a song that has a long session track.  It starts off with a fairly weak bass, stops (tape shut off) and then a piano that wasn't there before starts up and the bass playing jacks up noticably in quality.  I have always interpreted that as Brian moving to piano and Carl (the better guitar-type player for any guitar in the band) taking the bass.  I could be wrong as there is no audible evidence.  And any AFM sheets will only list names, not instruments.  So all you have is SOT type stuff and that is limited in this time period.

I think this is a noble endeavor..Craig Slowinski is the guy who really keeps track of this stuff with impressive accuracy...but i can help a bit.
The first LP would probably be all Brian on bass, despite that photo on the back of Carl playing bass, Dave told me CW never played bass on the sessions he was invloved in. Carl did play the drums on Moon Dawg.

Second LP...again its more than likely all Brian.

Third LP...Al plays bass on Surfers Rule, Catch A Wave, Boogie Woodie...the rest I'm thinking is most likely Brian...Al may play on one or two others.

LDC/Surfer Girl single...Brian.

LDC LP tracks...sorry no session evidence really exists.

Shut Down Vol. 2...by this time Al is playing more rhythm guitar and Brian is adding more session people. Session logs will clear this one up...but I don't have them.

So it was Al who took over on bass on that Surfers Rule session then.  Interesting.  I was under the impression that Al didn't rejoin until the LDC album sessions.  Anyone know when he came back by at least month?

Indeed.  He's got enough on his plate with the upcoming SDSN project, so I thought I'd open it up to the general board here.


I don't know exactly when, but it's interesting that as time goes by, the shorter and shorter amount of time it turns out Al was gone.



Al has taken credit for Don't Worry Baby a few times, and recently talked about playing quite a bit of bass for LDC LP, which he lumped in with the christmas album in terms of where he was fitting in, instrumentally.

You know, I was going to suggest you take some of this to Carrie Marks or Jon, for reference to David.  I would think he and Al would have the best chances of answering these questions of anyone left.

Al's first gig back as Brian's road replacement was the very end of March '63. There was a lot of overlap in the Dave Marks/Al Jardine eras...but Al was kind of an auxilary Beach Boy until Dave left...meaning he didn't play all the gigs or all the sessions...TV and high profile stuff saw Brian in the lineup with Dave still there...Al did a lot of session stuff starting with the Surfer Girl LP...that and the LDC LP have both Al and David on many of the tracks. 

Was Al singing on Surfer Girl LP or just playing?  I've thought I've heard his voice in there.

He's definitely singing...not on the song Surfer Girl, that was recorded prior to his return...but he's singing on In My Room, Catch A Wave, Surfers Rule, South Bay Surfer...probably at least a couple more.

The bass on "South Bay Surfer" is either Al or Carl...I used to think Carl, but I'm more inclined to think Al now, especially in light of Dave's comment (reported by Jon above).  Al definitely sings on it, and cowrote the lyrics....but it's been awhile since I've listened to it...I am kinda up to my ears in the "SDSN"sessions now.  On that album, I think the only bass Al did was "You're So Good To Me".   Brian played bass on "Girl Don't Tell Me" and "Then I Kissed Her".

Oh, and to return to the "Surfer Girl" album for a moment, I think it's Al's bass playing on "The Rocking Surfer"... and all the new stuff on the "LDC" album.  And "Cassius Love vs. Sonny Wilson"!
And "Do You Remember", "We'll Run Away" and "Carl's Big Chance".

Crag

And "I Get Around".

OK, I better stop now...

Craig

Question --

Is it a bass or a guitar plucked on the low E string that opens Miserilou on SUSA? 

I have always assumed it was a bass as my guitar doesn't go that low (I think -- my ear for that is bad).

If it is a bass, is that Brian or Carl?  I could see Brian playing the main bass part that undergirds the track, but not the solo bass part.

Well, I haven't totaled everything up yet, but I bet Al is in the lead for who played more bass between he and Brian.  We'll see.

I never knew Brian played bass on 'Then I Kissed Her'.

Awesome. :)

Miserlou is Carl on his Fender strat(including the opening low notes, he may have tuned down for the "fat" sound)...with Brian on bass, Dave on rhythm, Dennis on drums. I love this track!...so primitive, so darkly cool. I realize Dick Dale's version is tighter etc... but the BB's version is raw garage rock. They played this live throughout '62.

I had everything else on that track as you indicate.  I just didn't know a Fender could tune down that low.  I figured that Carl was playing whatever it was.

And while I still prefer Dale's original, the BB take is nice and primitive in a good way.

Yeah, it was an overdub.  He played piano on the basic track.

Did Brian play any other bass on SD/SN besides those two cuts?

Also, I'd like to really know if Brian played the bass on 'That's Not Me' on Pet Sounds.

Nope.
and...
Maybe...

Yeah, about "That's Not Me," there are two bass overdubs, a Fender and also what sounds like a Danelectro 6-string bass.  There's really no way to know who played those other than trying to analyze the playing style.  I think the way they layed down that cut seems very much to be classic self-contained Beach Boys, I'd be surprised if there were any session musicians on it.  Assuming it's Brian on Organ, Carl on Guitar, and Dennis on Drums for the basic track, allegedly plus Terry Melcher on Tambourine, I think it'd be a pretty safe bet that there was just an instrument switch and the same personel did the overdubs.

But I think Al's name is on the AFM sheet?  I can never remember because of all the mistakes in the various Pet Sounds liner notes over the years.  Perhaps Al overdubbed one of the basses.

Yep, Al's on the AFM sheet, and Bruce too.  There's a couple of different percussion parts...a tambourine and what I remember as temple blocks or something of the sort.  Brian probably did do one or both bass parts.

Craig

The bass on Cukoo Clock rules



Try hearing it on SOT #1. Heaven  ;D

I'd like to know what songs after Pet Sounds Brian played bass on, besides 'Vegetables' and 'Susie Cincinnati'.

Hard to say with certainty.  It's likely Brian played bass on a few other Smiley cuts, Wild Honey is a horrible mess, bass credits-wise, at least to me, but I don't really hear Brian on there.

After the boys got the Moog, any impetus to play Fender bass was gone for Brian and it was pretty much keyboard bass from there on out.

He did play on "Add Some Music," according to Steve Desper, although I think Bruce says he plays on that.

??

Certainly by Holland that was true, but they had the Moog at the start of the Sunflower sessions and I hear no keyboard bass on that album.  Surf's Up has a bit but not exclusively.

I'm saying that when and if Brian himself wanted to play the bassline, it was much less likely that he'd play a bass guitar after they got the Moog.  Obviously Al, Carl, Daryl, Ray, Bruce, etc, would still lay down Fender Bass throughout the Early 70s. 

That's unfortunate. I always thought Brian's playing was pretty good. He should have played more, but I can also see why he used session guys like Ray.

How many big-time bass players used their thumbs exclusively? I would venture not many?

I know this is old, but while poking around I see that there's a misconception about 'Miserlou'

Jon Stebbins correctly identifies the opening notes as played on a Fender Stratocaster, but Jeff Mason needs to know that the deep bass sound was not achieved by "tuning down" the guitar strings. The guitar is tuned normally. The reason it sounds deep and bassy is because back in the day surf guitar (and most all guitar) was played on heavy guage flat-wound strings, not the skinny round-wound strings found on your typical Stratocaster these days.

Try putting a set of heavy guage Flats on your Strat (or Jaguar, if you are blessed to have one) and you will get the sound of the opening measures of the Beach Boys remarkably subtle reading of Miserlou. Of course having a vintage Fender amp will contribute too.

While on the subject of Miserlou, it's interesting to note that it was recorded at the Capitol Records studio around midnight, and it took many many 'takes' to get it right, evidently. SOT #2 proves that the 'boys' were having a grand old time and if you listen with headphones you can hear the 'off mic' whooping and hollaring and sax playing that didn't make it to the release version.

If they'd had the foresight to mic the room, I'm sure the Beach Boys version of Miserlou wouldn't 'appear' so subdued.