The Smiley Smile Message Board

So, am I the only one who can't get this to work? I see visual but no sound. When I click anywhere on the page (like the volume, or if I try to skip ahead) everything goes black. Anyone else seeing this? I rebooted, and same result.

Springlake Amusement Park, Oklahoma City - either July 9th, August 28th or August 29th.

Great interview footage.

Edit - if "WIGU(TBAM)" is the latest 45, it's one of the August dates.

So, am I the only one who can't get this to work? I see visual but no sound. When I click anywhere on the page (like the volume, or if I try to skip ahead) everything goes black. Anyone else seeing this? I rebooted, and same result.

Did Brian take credit for too many J&D hits?

That's what I was thinking.  I mean, he co-wrote a few of them, but Berry and Christian and Altfield also had a big hand in them too!

Some reminiscing on the July 9th 1964 show and:  

http://newsok.com/article/1937770

I wonder what that lady had with "Little old lady...". Brian didn't write any of it...



But the guys seem so down to earth and nice. None of them acted like a c*cky as$hole. I kinda like hem.

They may have played Little Old Lady in the set that night. I assumed that was why she kept mentioning it.

I wonder what that lady had with "Little old lady...". Brian didn't write any of it...

Correct. And this interview was in August of '64, right after they recorded "Little Old Lady" in Sacramento, so Brian (or Ida) probably thought he contributed to the song in some way. In fact, there's only two songs where Brian and Jan shared a 50/50 writing credit - "Surf City" and "Gonna Hustle You." And after "Surf City" in '63, Brian was never a primary writer for Jan & Dean. His name came last on his other contributions to Jan & Dean songs, which was mainly chords and melody and harmony. But I think Brian sang background on a couple of them, didn't he?

Compositions co-written by Jan & Brian:

Surf City
She's My Summer Girl
Gonna Hustle You (Get A Chance With You)
Drag City
Surf Route 101
Dead Man's Curve
The New Girl In School
Ride the wild surf
Surfin' Wild
Move Out Little Mustang
Sidewalk Surfin'

So.........did Brian take too much credit for Jan & Dean songs in this '64 interview?

Nice avatar, Rocker!

Oh, and Mike lost his sax along the way... I don't think he ever did find it again did he?

But, with that comment by Mike, even as far back as 1964 did weird things come out of Beach Boys' interviews. So, Mike lost his sax and that meant they could no longer have a sax part for the live songs? I guess they never thought about carrying along a backup sax, or God forbid, stopping at a music store and buying a new one, or renting one, or borrowing money from Al's mom to get another one, or anything!!!!!!!! OK, Mike lost his sax, no more live sax. Only in the world of The Beach Boys...

I heard Dr. Evil stole Mike's sex...

(http://thinkingscifi.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/dr-evil.jpg)

I haven't found anything yet as far as a Kingston Trio 60's tour date listing, nothing near as complete as Andrew's or Eric's setlist archive, for sure! I was trying to peg the timing of the footage - obviously it's Oklahoma as "Ida B" was a local TV personality and wouldn't have traveled outside to do stories on folk singers, I would assume.

Like I said in about the third/fourth post of this thread, Springlake Amusement Park, Oklahoma City, August 28th or 29th. Jeez, why do I bother if no-one bothers to read it ?

Interesting, though, how when Ida asks whether the music or lyrics come first, he says, "The music comes first, then I write the lyrics." That's taking a bit too much credit.

Correct. And this interview was in August of '64, right after they recorded "Little Old Lady" in Sacramento, so Brian (or Ida) probably thought he contributed to the song in some way. In fact, there's only two songs where Brian and Jan shared a 50/50 writing credit - "Surf City" and "Gonna Hustle You." And after "Surf City" in '63, Brian was never a primary writer for Jan & Dean. His name came last on his other contributions to Jan & Dean songs, which was mainly chords and melody and harmony. But I think Brian sang background on a couple of them, didn't he?

Compositions co-written by Jan & Brian:

Surf City
She's My Summer Girl
Gonna Hustle You (Get A Chance With You)
Drag City
Surf Route 101
Dead Man's Curve
The New Girl In School
Ride the Wild Surf
Surfin' Wild
Move Out Little Mustang
Sidewalk Surfin'

So.........did Brian take too much credit for Jan & Dean songs in this '64 interview?

Nice avatar, Rocker!

I didn't pull the J & D credits above out of my butt (or off the records). I got them from a very reliable source. I also have Steve McParland's books and trust his instincts and knowledge.

But.

Per Mark A. Moore, whom I also trust with his vast J&D research and knowledge:

For the backing vocals on "Surf City," Jan brought in a trio consisting of Tony Minichiello, Manuel Sanchez, and Vic Diaz. In the absence of Dean Torrence (who did participate on backing vocals), the prominent falsetto parts on "Surf City" were handled by Tony Minichiello. The subtle falsetto in the line, "Surf City, here we come," was sung by Brian Wilson.

Well, he did write quite a bit of lyrics on his own and without Mike, if that's what you're referring to.....

They may have played Little Old Lady in the set that night. I assumed that was why she kept mentioning it.

Was that song really popular? In my ears it is utterly awful. Was music about grannies considered 'hip'? people really were square back then if they liked stuff like that. No wonder they had a square image from playing tunes like that when they could've played their own material which was usually far better.

"The little old lady from Pasadena" was a kind of folk archetype in Southern California in the mid-20th century. Early in the century, many white couples from the Midwest had moved to the region, especially to Pasadena, California. The trend was accelerated by the Dust Bowl, the Great Depression and World War II. Since men tended to die earlier, Pasadena became known for its high percentage of elderly widows. As political columnist and language expert William Safire has noted, the phrase "little old ladies in tennis shoes" was used in the 1960s to refer to social and political conservatives in Southern California.
Part of this lore was that many an elderly man who died in Pasadena would leave his widow with a powerful car that she rarely if ever drove, such as an old Buick Roadmaster, or a 50-some-odd Cadillac, a vintage Ford, an old Packard, Studebaker, DeSoto, or a La Salle. Used car salesmen in California, so the story went, would tell prospective buyers that the previous owner of a vehicle was "a little old lady from Pasadena who only drove it to church on Sundays," thus suggesting the car had little wear. This joke became part of the material of some comedians based in Los Angeles (notably Johnny Carson, who often used it on his frequent trips to tape The Tonight Show in L.A. before settling there permanently), and because of television, the phrase "little old lady from Pasadena" became familiar to a national audience.

We have discussed a bunch in the past-in his Goldmine interview in the 1990s Mike was quite honest about his contributions-he sometimes wrote all the lyrics, sometimes just wrote a few lines, sometimes wrote a hook-he did not deny that Brian also wrote lyrics to many of their hits.  By the way-the footage is most surely from August 29 1964-BBs played three shows at Springlake that day than had a 3 day break.  During that break-according to Brad Elliot-they held a secret session to "fix" the concert album.

As for the concert footage, I only recognized (the dancing gestures are similar to Sacramento performance) Fun, Fun, Fun.

True. Didn't even think about that.
Even today you read very often that "The little old Lady..." is a Beach Boys song or that Brian wrote it so I figured the questions had something to do with that

That's what I was thinking.  I mean, he co-wrote a few of them, but Berry and Christian and Altfield also had a big hand in them too!

Like I said in about the third/fourth post of this thread, Springlake Amusement Park, Oklahoma City, August 28th or 29th. Jeez, why do I bother if no-one bothers to read it ?

Where Mike's lost sax goes - Jon Stebbins said someplace else on this board that he was still playing one into '65 so I guess he got another one after this interview. As for the lost one - wonder if it'll ever turn up on eBay...

 My guess:  whoever took it was trying to do the rest of the world a favor, and probably stomped it flat and threw it in the trash.

Yeah that was interesting, he made it sound like he was doing all the writing.  Probably just came out the wrong way, but still.

Correct. And this interview was in August of '64, right after they recorded "Little Old Lady" in Sacramento, so Brian (or Ida) probably thought he contributed to the song in some way. In fact, there's only two songs where Brian and Jan shared a 50/50 writing credit - "Surf City" and "Gonna Hustle You." And after "Surf City" in '63, Brian was never a primary writer for Jan & Dean. His name came last on his other contributions to Jan & Dean songs, which was mainly chords and melody and harmony. But I think Brian sang background on a couple of them, didn't he?

Compositions co-written by Jan & Brian:

Surf City
She's My Summer Girl
Gonna Hustle You (Get A Chance With You)
Drag City
Surf Route 101
Dead Man's Curve
The New Girl In School
Ride the Wild Surf
Surfin' Wild
Move Out Little Mustang
Sidewalk Surfin'

So.........did Brian take too much credit for Jan & Dean songs in this '64 interview?

Nice avatar, Rocker!

Where Mike's lost sax goes - Jon Stebbins said someplace else on this board that he was still playing one into '65 so I guess he got another one after this interview. As for the lost one - wonder if it'll ever turn up on eBay...

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n295/guitarfool2002/mikesax.jpg)

At least he got another sax just in time to pretend to play it in the Kokomo video.

I found this by accident, thought it was pretty funny. Mike 'Sax' Love (how that sounds..) reincarnated:

(http://www.mikeratza.com/www.mikeratza.com/Biography_files/Gasparilla%20Dual%20sax.jpg)


 :hat

I guess from your list Mikie if you define "hits" as Top Forty then he was right with "several" and nearly right with "all". I guess from Surf City through Sidewalk Surfin' [I think that is the period] there were 9 singles and 8 would qualify as hits. Brian did not have a hand in Honolulu Lulu at #10 and Little Old Lady at #3 which he clarified and disclaimed credit for specifically. Seven out of eight is nearly all.

Right, for the completists, there is plenty of evidence of Mike using the sax as an occasional "prop" in the '80's and '90's, and even honking out the two note solo on Shut Down. But I think the sax was a constant from early '62 until summer '64 at which point it disappeared for a decade or two.

I found this by accident, thought it was pretty funny. Mike 'Sax' Love (how that sounds..) reincarnated:

(http://www.mikeratza.com/www.mikeratza.com/Biography_files/Gasparilla%20Dual%20sax.jpg)


 :hat

D'oh to me for not reading the whole thread. I may be thinking of Jack Benny talking about Cucamonga. There's something about the name of some Southern California towns that lend themselves to being jokes. Also, I do remember seeing an episode of the old Andy Griffith show where Barney buys a car from Ellen Corby, playing a little old lady who only drove the car to church and didn't need it anymore (and it wound up being a scam she was pulling with junk cars). The little old lady and her car trope made the rounds in the '60s.

Was that song really popular? In my ears it is utterly awful. Was music about grannies considered 'hip'? people really were square back then if they liked stuff like that. No wonder they had a square image from playing tunes like that when they could've played their own material which was usually far better.

From it I found out that balance (3/4) & the guts (another quarter) are what surfer needs to have.

It looks like he's trying to play both the "Kokomo" solo and the "Shut Down" solo at the same time!  :lol

OK, question - how old does everyone here think Ida was at the time of the interview ?

OK, question - how old does everyone here think Ida was at the time of the interview ?

OK, question - how old does everyone here think Ida was at the time of the interview ?

OK, question - how old does everyone here think Ida was at the time of the interview ?

This contains a recent photo of Ida B. Blackburn:

http://www.baptistvillage.org/docs/April%20AL%202012%20Newsletter.pdf

2) Could a boy band containing two guys with Brian and Carl's fondness for comfort food be popular today? They are both carrying some poundage.

 

Wow, great stuff! It would be fascinating to hear a more in-depth interview with Brian from that era on his approach to songwriting. But this will do.

Yeah that was interesting, he made it sound like he was doing all the writing.  Probably just came out the wrong way, but still. 

The whole thing was awesome to see.  Does anyone else hear "old" Brian while listening to "young" Brian talk?  Obviously you know it's the same guy, but it's so odd to me hearing the same speech patterns and style coming from a young clear voice.

I realized that I have ads for these shows and they show that the Kingston Trio were playing on August 30 1964-one day after the BBs-so it all makes sense now

Now the question is whether the Boys and the Trio ever met up there, or crossed paths anywhere else on that tour. Al was a big fan, for one, I'm sure they would have tried to meet up.