The Smiley Smile Message Board

What would they have to do to follow up "Summer's Gone"!?!?! That song was perfect where it was!

"Summer Come Back"?

Autumn's Here?

December Vacation

"Fall Breaks and Back to Winter"? oops, been there, done that.

Just let Brian do a rock 'n roll album. No pressure, just a talented group of musicians following the lead of the worlds greatest songwriter.

+1

Yes please, the R&R album. The suite will be hard to beat though. It may not have been a full albums worth but those last 3 or even 4 tracks are the home run we've waited eons for.

By the way rab2591, I assume you are a fan of 2001. Did you ever notice that Smile is a lot like 2001? It's hard to put into words but if I had to pick a film most like Smile it would be 2001. They both seem simple but are anything but, they both make total sense and then you can't describe it. The more you hear (Smile) or see (2001) the more you want to hear or see it again. They are both a vast Journey and they both leave you amazed and wondering.

That's why the R&R album would be great, no pressure trying to top the Life Suite or making another one as good, just a cool and fun rock album with the guys! then prehaps later try to release the rest of the Life Suite on another record and put on it some other stuff from the sessions of TWGMTR and Waves Of Love (please!)

A cool cover of XTC's "Harvest Festival"...I'd pay for that!

we know there's a good deal more to the Life Suite... they gotta release it.

I'd buy a turd, I think.

But an unpretentious, upbeat album, even if full of cover version, can do it for me.

I think the key to the potential follow up album is choosing the right collaborator for Brian.

Joe Thomas had some very valuable assets - songs! - and the production chops (arguably) to help pull off TWGMTR.

Nursery Home USA!  But seriously, I trust the Beach boys and Brian Wilson to do quality work these days. I trust they're judgement if they choose to do another album. If it were up to me, and going on the lines of Brian's 'rock and roll' album, I would like something in the vain of Love You or Shortnen Bread.

Love You pt. II sounds fine to me, as does a return to some Spectorian style stuff like the first side of Today, or some of the more upbeat stuff on Summer Days, or even some of the really early Chuck Berry style stuff.  I just hope that "rocking out" doesn't mean A).  Boppy pop-rock as in "Beaches in Mind" (not a bad song, but it's not exactly interesting from a musical point of view) or (much worse) B).  Some of the hideous tracks with loud guitar that they did in the 80's and 90's. 

I also hope that they can ditch "we gotta get back to the beach" stuff--hopefully they got that out of their systems with Beaches in Mind and Spring Vacation (though with Mike Love's track record over the past 30 years, I won't hold my breath).  Songs about love, mercy, sunshine, dancing, sailing California, or Brian's strange obsessions are fine. though--it's just that we already get the point that they still love beaches and summer.  If Mike is going to write the lyrics, fine--just hope that Brian makes him spend some time on them and come up with some new themes already. 

Is that a Winter Symphony to God in your Teenage Pocket, or are you Happy to See Me?



A home full of babies?

(http://i50.tinypic.com/5ycmxv.jpg)

Totally agree, i really expected some of those (or at least songs with guitar solos) on TWGMTR.

Oops! I meant Nursing Home USA!!  :lol

If everybody had a wheelchair
Across the USA
Then everybody'd be a rollin'
Like Californi-a
You'd seen 'em wearing their IVs
Sensible shoes too
A thin receding gray hairline
Nursing Home USA

(Had to do it guys  ::))

double album.  the mythical rock n roll album, then disc 2 is the finished summer's gone suite  ;D

Food for thought.

Less autotune and more treble.

Do a lot of people have a problem with the album not having enough treble? To me it seems on the high side, acceptable, but pushing it. I'm very surprised to hear that complaint. (no offense)

I don't hear a lack of treble at all. However, It suffers from a lack of air and dynamics.
It sounds better than That Lucky Old Sun, but not by much.
Although, in both of these albums, the music far outweighs the sound issues - they don't bother me too much.

Am I right in saying that the Gershwin album is generally better mixed than TWGMTR? I'm no audio engineer, but I was listening to Someone to Watch Over Me and afterwards That's Why God Made the Radio came on and I was disgusted at how suddenly everything lacked breathing space in comparison.

I was just listening to the Gershwin album the other day and it made me realize that I liked how some songs sounded: a tiny bit more organic.  But the vocals were still too processed much like TWGMTR is. 

I hope Mike Love doesn't read this. He just might do it!! He might be filing a law suit for claiming he wrote those words right now!

When you say it lacks "air and dynamics", if you look into why that is, it's because the top frequencies are not as present as the bottom ones and it makes everything sound mushy.  It doesn't mean there's NO treble, but the lack of a balance of frequencies is a lot of the reason why you get the sensation of no dynamics...and, likely, overuse of compression on the individual tracks which also robs them of high end.  I ran an analysis of the tracks in ProTools just to be sure.  It's mostly lower midrange, with the frequencies tapering off rapidly going into the upper midrange and treble.  I did a little remastering on one of the tracks at home and to my ear, it made a huge difference in restoring dynamics and making the vocals really present, but unfortunately it also made the autotune a lot more obvious.  The mixing and processing of the tracks certainly played a role, but as I was able to clean up some of it with mastering software without much trouble, it's not all the mix.  I'm actually puzzled by this because Bob Ludwig did the mastering and he is a very well-respected guy in the field.  I have to ask myself if Capitol didn't play a role here.

I like the new album a lot, but the sound really screws it up for me.  I'm happy, though, that it hasn't done that for everyone, because I think a lot of it is really good.

Songs with Tony Asher and/or Van Dyke Parks lyrics.

You might be younger than the people complaining of not enough treble and better able to hear the treble.

I had a feeling someone was going to say this...so...

If what I'm experiencing is a result of loss of high frequencies in my own hearing, it magically goes away when I'm listening to other albums.  ;)  It's a miracle!

Now, snarkiness aside, I do hear spots on the album where there are certain elements (e.g. Mike Love's vocals, some of the toms) where it sounds like the very top is EQ'd up, so on smaller systems, it could sound excessively trebly in those spots.  Which is also not good.  But it's not the same as the overall sound of the record.

Also, let me ask the person who posted above, have you actually heard the album, or just the stuff posted on youtube?  Because the EQ on the youtube videos is much brighter than what's on the album.

But as I said, to me the album itself is murky, and I checked my impression both in ProTools with a frequency analyzer, and against other records, and both confirmed my impression...try the A/B test yourself!  I first noticed it when I was listening to the NPR interview with Brian and Mike and hearing the new album against the older ones.  After that, I couldn't stop hearing it.  And as I said, 20 minutes in ProTools playing with the bus compression and EQ made a world of difference to the clarity and presence of the one tune I worked on.  But, y'know, only me and about 3 other people have commented on it, so...whatever!  Having noticed the difference between the youtube videos and the CD mastering, I'm wondering if this isn't a deliberate decision based on assumptions about how people are going to listen to it, and how the files are going to be manipulated online.  That's above my pay grade, but it would at least make sense to me.

To complain about a Joe Thomas recording not having enough treble is a dream come true for me. I actually like the overall sound of the mix, and I'm not that easy to please in this regard.

Love it.

Lack of top or too much bottom?

I still use an old high current (read 30A to the speakers) amp with bass & treble controls - whereas I realise that the fashion among audiophiles for some time is to dispense with them.

I am a *big* fan of bass...but controlled bass. With TWGMTR I turn it down a little because that aids the rest of the music to come through the blend. It's entirely possible that CDs these days are not mixed for halfway decent hi-fi systems but in the knowledge they're going to be ripped to MP3 and put on phones, laptops etc. IN the 60's Brian was mixing for AM radio through transistor radios and 4" speakers. Today perhaps for MP3 and headphones....sad...

There's plenty of dynamic range but little space or air. But then that tends to be a bugbear of digital recordings anyway IMHO.

Hmm...maybe I should just record the CD to 1/4 inch tape.

I would love an album helmed by a Rick Rubin type where the guys write and sing uninhibited about their real lives and not the Beach BOys fantasy. An album made without thinking of commercial interests (possibly wishful thinking).

TWGMTR is as close as we will get to a finale of the Beach Boys dream. I would happily take a raw and spontaneous acoustic appendix to it. Love You meets Friends.

I hope the touring stops as planned, I personally don't want Brian to feel obliged to tour after this year.

I agree.  I don't mind them breaking out the "back to the beach..." themes and "Do It Again" remakes  -- if it's ever been warranted it, this was certainly the time.  But, yes, I've always longed for a more "rick rubin-esque" and honest treatment.  Ever since Don Was and "I Just Wasn't Made For These Times" actually.  I'm not holding my breath.

But, I'll take the punchy and smartly produced Joe Thomas sound for as long as they'll do it.  I think it fits them perfectly too.

I assume "Life Suite" refers to the last 3 or 4 songs on TWGMTR?  Those tracks are astonishingly good.  The best thing they've done, since...geez...Love You?  I didn't realize there was "more."

So after reading some of the comments on this thread I put the album on and whacked up the treble on the EQ, I never noticed that 'Bill and Sue' had finger clicks in it before, it certainly makes the album sound fresher and less tired. Although I have kind of spoiled it for me now, going back to the proper levels it sounds muffled and lifeless  :-\ :lol

Possibly wishful thinking? Try having no conception of reality. BW works with people he likes and is comfortable with. His decision.

And he's the one who wants to keep touring with the band through next summer.

Try the hi-res HDTracks version...
https://www.hdtracks.com/index.php?file=catalogdetail&valbum_code=HD5099946320056

Sure, but reality went out the window when the BBs got back together for a world tour and a new album in 2012.

Make it like "Today". Rock songs on the first side. Ballads and Symohonies on the second.

I think everything you wrote makes a lot of sense.  And after hearing how it sounds on youtube (that is to say, a lot better), I'm wondering if you're not right, that it was mixed deliberately in a muffled way.  I just got done with an album project that sounded terrific, and I wasn't happy with how the first track sounded on youtube at all...too much top.  So it may be there's a deliberate compromise being made by the mastering engineers to factor in peoples' listening on compressed files.

If so, then....yeech.  We've really devolved back to the 45 days, haven't we?

You have a point!

Who's to say what the 'proper' levels are?

THat's what EQ controls are for....to tinker with the sound a but until *you* get the most from what's on the CD (tape, record, MP3, alien cube device).

Given that I listen to recordings from the 1920's right through to today, by countless artists involving countless recording engineers, producers, masterers, various recording media....the notion that there is any "proper' equalisation is not one I have ever really entertained.

If you cannot hear that finger clicks on Bill & Sue, and assuming that you wish to hear them, then the "proper' EQ for that track is one that allows you to hear them.

None of us, no matter what equipment we have, will hear the same as the producer heard on the studio monitors. So why the phrack worry about the "right" equalisation? Play with it, I often find I change the EQ between tracks as it suits my tastes better.