The Smiley Smile Message Board

What gives?  Did Dave not sing anywhere on this album?   I thought he was at least audible on TWGMTR....

perhaps they decided it wasn't worth it? Dave is the electric guitar virtuoso in the band so I guess he's happy doing that.

Is that Dave doing the fills in between the vocals on "Beaches In Mind"?  Whoever it is, the blues licks are mighty distracting and stick out like a sore thumb  :-\

The only two places where guitar is prominent, "Spring Vacation" and "Beaches In Mind", it's being played by Jeff Baxter from the Doobie Brothers. Makes you wonder what, if any, contribution Dave had on the album. Saw him sing Hawaii a few nights ago, and his performance was pretty good.

I was too lazy to look at the liner notes--thanks.

I figured it couldn't have been Dave...I just don't see Dave deciding to insert these Chuck Berry/blues licks all over "Beaches In Mind" like that.  It's my only complaint of the album that's worth complaining about.

I hope he will be more present on the next album. Yes, I think there will be a next album...

I didn't bother reading the credit either but I agree with Justin that guitar fills in those two songs are pretty cliche and unimaginative.

I hear David singing in the "that's why God made, that's why God made" part of TWGMTR.

there is absolutely no way David would sing on the album and not be credited for it in the liner notes.

Dave is not credited with any vocals on the album. Given the rumors of his relatively late addition to the reunion, it's certainly plausible that his contributions to the album are limited to a few tracks of nearly inaudible rhythm guitar.

I read in one of the interviews that he and Mike had worked on a few tracks and presented them for inclusion on the album...so I figured he was there from the beginning. But perhaps not?

I think that was mentioned as a possibility -- but I'm not sure they actually put anything together. Remember, the Beach Boys' actual involvement came pretty much at the end of the recording process -- Brian had written most of the songs and recorded full vocal arrangements with Jeff. The group's contribution was basically replacing Jeff's parts one by one. As they spent time in the studio, they worked on some other stuff, but none of it -- apart from "Isn't It Time" -- made it on the record.

Oh yeah, there's gonna be a next album....

Is anyone eve disputing that? It slipped up in some interview somewhere that the Beach Boys' deal with Capital is for 3 albums. So I suppose we'll get at least 2 more.

Not at all. The album deal was with the EMI catalogue division. In other words, the two other albums are likely the latest greatest hits set that's coming (with new material) and the new box. All done within the year.

If there is another album, I wonder if the other Boys will want more creative input, as this one seems to be essentially a Brian-dominated album (surprisingly so, in fact, with their vocals effectively phoned in after the main work was done) with one Mike-written song. If they do want more input another time, let's hope they all keep on getting on and the quality control is maintained. It would be nice to hear a full Bruce or David lead vocal on a future album though.  

OH ok, that makes sense.  ;D

(crosses fingers again for WIBNTLA and CF)  >:D

Or maybe a live document of the current tour.

I wonder about the chances of a holiday re-issue of the album with included documentary / live show as the second disc. And maybe some bonus tracks. Just a guess.

Me too. Mike said David had some songs of his own to offer to the project as well.

If they do make a next album, I hope Bruce gets a lead - or at least a few lines. I saw him do Disney Girls at the Hollywood Bowl the other night and he was pitch perfect - even better than Al.

They screwed up the lyrics in a number of places that have already been discovered. Who's to say that some of the credits aren't also inaccurate? This booklet could have been a bit of a rush job, even though it looks very nice I must say.

There are definitely inaccuracies. But I doubt that would extend to the point of having one of the five principals not credited with any vocals if he sang them.

The only thing that saddens me a bit about the album is the lack of any Beach Boy on instruments, other than Dave. That will continue to feed detractors of the band who love to say the guys didn't or couldn't play any instruments on their records. I would love to hear just the 5 BB's write, sing, and play at least one song all by themselves [okay, maybe with a drummer]. But they would have to get out of their comfort zone first...

I think he plays a fair amount of guitar on the CD, and is credited on about 8 of the tracks. Its just not a very guitar heavy production in general so most of his parts are, shall we say, subtle.

Anyone notice there's a very obvious electric guitar on "Strange World"...but the credits, at least on my advance copy, say there's no guitars on that song. Just sayin'.

that's the accordian you're hearing

My feeling is that David is THE musician in the current group so he played to his strengths.

I'm hearing an electric rhythm guitar in the chorus of "Isn't It Time", mixed quite low.  Dave's the only guitarist credited on the song, so that's one sighting!  He's credited on six other tracks as well, but most of them have a whole bunch of guitarists on them, so it'll be tough to pick him out.

Actually, I've been wondering:  can anyone point to an identifiable David Marks part on any Beach Boys track?  Given that he was generally playing rhythm, and Carl was usually doing a second rhythm part when he wasn't soloing...

Cheers,
Jon Blum

Well, for accuracy's sake, Carl was not playing a second rhythm part or a similar rhythm part on most of the tracks David is on. They tended to play very different parts "Surfin USA" is a great example...no similarity in what they're playing other than it compliments the other guy. David is the first guitar you hear on "Your Summer Dream" ...the first higher register guitar you hear on "Surf Jam"...he's real prominent on "Shut Down", "Surfin USA", "Surfer Girl"...totally obvious on "Miserlou"...hard to miss on "Catch A Wave"...the loudest guitar in the mix on the last third of "In My Room"...definitely there on "Little Saint Nick"...you hear his rhythm clearly coming out of the guitar break on "409"...he's totally obvious on "Surfin Safari"...easily heard on "Ten Little Indians"...loud as hell on "Let's Go Trippin'"...umm...he's real easy to find on just about all the tracks from the first four albums.

No

http://consequenceofsound.net/2012/06/audiography-episode-040-al-jardine-and-david-marks-of-the-beach-boys/

About 49 minutes in David said he was pretty much given free rein to play what he wants on the album. No specifics though.

Those palm muted notes around :44 is an accordian? Interesting. Can someone upload a youtube video of an accordian doing that?

I remember initially Dave's accent/pronunciation on the word 'Gawd' on the TWGMTR  single being discussed in depth here.   Is it now the official word that Dave does not appear vocally anywhere on this album?  Say it ain't so...

that was "the professor" saying that David, who grew up across the street from the Wilson brothers, has a distinct California accent. pffft

Fair enough -- I didn't mean to say he was inaudible!  It's just that in most of those tracks, I couldn't listen to the two guitar parts and say that one's Carl, and that one's David, just by the characteristics of what they're playing.  Which is probably why I can't tell which one out of four or five different guitar parts on the new tracks is David...

Cheers,
Jon Blum

Dave plays the little descending lead lines (sliding his finger down the fretboard) in the final chorus of "Surfin' USA" and the little lead lick in the fade of "Shut Down" (the final thing you hear on that record).  Thanks to Jon for including that info in his Dave book!

yes the professor's ear was accurate, but that voice must be someone else; when I heard where Dave grew up, I doubled down on my attribution because I was sure I heard  that "dennis miller sounding" flat a vowel (On "that's why Gad made" in refrain), transported to the Southbay, but it looks like that must be Jeff; I wrote in an earlier post  that I was wrong--just stone cold wrong, but I am sure confused that that's not Dave, as he sings that part in the sizzle real, and, asp. after hearing Hawaii in concert,i thought it was he.  The official record is that I was wrong; he is not singing anywhere.

he plays guitar on 7 tracks. Doe she not play the solos in both "beaches" and "Isn't it Time"?  I think Baxter is doing a background, fripertronics track

sorry for my error on Dave, but the greater sadness is that he's not singing.

Right, we saw him singing in the studio in various promo clips - what's up with that?

Simple - all those promo clips were faked. The Beach Boys are a singing group, they had to make it look like they all sang.

I don't know about that. We've seen Dave in all kinds of situations standing next to the singing guys while just playing the guitar, most prominently at the concerts. Why should they fake it for bits of promo clips that just show seconds of the guys? Sure, the promo clips might have been entirely faked, but usually you do something you are used to or mimic something you have already done for this kind of thing.

Anyway, it's a shame, since his voice is really okay and would easily have found its place in the (studio) blend.

It's the same reason Jeff isn't shown singing in most of the promo clips... it's not part of the image they want to be portrayed.

I understand what you are trying to say, I'm just not convinced it's true.  ;)

Again...Anyone notice there's a very obvious electric guitar on "Strange World"...but the credits, at least on my advance copy, say there's no guitars on that song. Just sayin' (again).

Yeah. So who knows.. maybe Dave's somewhere there in the mix on some tunes, vocally. Maybe we'll never find out.

if David sang an ounce on any of the tracks they would've gone out of their way to make sure it said it.

Jon, why don't you ask Dave about his involvement on the record?

Sorry...no comment.

Until I hear a full, official bibliographical analysis from an official source, (I would never pressure Jon in this regard) I will continue to hope to be hearing Dave all over the 7 tracks for which he is credited, playing his classic punk obbligato and taking some tasty leads and breaks. Dave loves the Beatles: is he playing the Beatles-style guitar prominent at the end of Shelter?  That's certainly him, is it not, in Beach in Mind, when Mike sings "south bay surfin again"?  He's on "Summer's Gone" playing those plaintive riffs, no? 

Some us so are so deeply fond of Dave. His participation is the main engine of my pleasure and interest in the reunion, so those of us so dedicated to his work with the BB simply want to be able justly and accurately celebrate him.

I should add:  I just read the MOJO article, which distinctly witnesses Brain vocally directing all the BB, named, including Dave, at the mics, on the chorus of Shelter. I remain at a loss for understanding his lack of a vocal/vocal credit. And I am dying to know his exact guitar part(s) in each song, if anyone has to sonic chops or historical knowledge to supply such an inventory.

Any Smiley-Smiler's on deck for a meet & greet?  I'm sure Dave would be happy to clear this up.  Please pose the question on behalf of his loyal fans?

Yes, there is absolutely an electric guitar on that track.  It's so obvious that I've gone over the credits a few times to make sure that I'm not missing anything.  So, the credits for the album are not entirely accurate--this is fairly typical in my experience (of various bands, not just the Beach Boys).  It's some very nice, subtle stuff, too--would like to know who does it. 

The points made above about it being unlikely that Dave would not be credited if he did any singing make sense.  But it may be that he did so little singing that they didn't want to give him equal credit with the other 5 (including Jeff). 

Note that in his discussion with the band in Australia and while on a thread reviewing one show, Jon Blum today reports that Dave is, in fact, singing on Radio (the track and perhaps on more songs, which Jon did not get a change to confirm) and is playing on BIM: the professor had been long maintaining this.  If this is true the liner notes are useless. Now I don't know if it's Dave singing that line I had fixated on, in the refrain, "That's why god {pronounced like the first syllable of "gadget"} but if Dave would sing that line it would sound just like the record. His accent must be a mix of his adopted home in the South Bay and Western PA, where he grew up to 7 (thanks Jon).  Much of the "LA" accent is the product of such middle american migration. Listening to Dave's interviews on "Doing it again" and everywhere else confirms my sense of this. My focus on the topic arises from a desire to perceive correctly the complete participation of all the BB and to make sense of all those promotional videos of him singing.

But of course, just because he IS singing on the song does not mean he's doing that part.  He may be elsewhere and/or low in the mix.

As far as BIM goes, I conclude today that the solo is just not loud enough; the mix is just not right; Dave needs to be way up and the drums down. I love that song, but it needs some doctoring.

In any case, here's to you Dave, my favorite BB. Good to see the true attribution of your labor finally coming to light.

Yeah, Dave specifically said there were errors in the credits.  Sorry, didn't get any more detail than that!

Cheers,
Jon Blum

Thanks Jon, we scholars want answers and precision, which I hope we get in detail somehow soon.  As far as the next album, I can't imagine that they would not go it, with I'd go anywhere, waves of love and other cuts--Dave's Stowaway, etc., sitting in the can. Capital would demand a new album, I would hope. In any case, I will not rest until I hear "we are going back in the studio to work on a follow up to TWGMTR," with Bruce saying, "this will be a home run and not a bunt.

It sure does add that, and I'll bet it's David Marks playing it.

At the very least, if Dave is singing on the 'IIT' reissue he gets a credit plus any new pressings of the 'Radio' album.

If you don't mind professor, could you stop referring to yourself in the third person?

I've always imagined that when he reads the threads, he forgets which one of the posters is him, and accidentally winds up agreeing with himself.

Just how many of these "professors" are there ?

This country was founded on a love of freedom and speaking in the third person.

Altho, some people with clipboards call it Third Person Communication Disorder!

http://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Communication-Disorders-Lifespan-Perspective/dp/0205487874

Either that or you're Mr. T...

... or Salvador Dali.

Still, ontor pertawst is reportedly glad to hear more details of Marks' contributions.