The Smiley Smile Message Board

...mind was duly blown to bits last night listening to TSS on vinyl for the first time. To be honest I haven't been listening to hardly any BB's lately. I just hooked up my old yamaha yp-b4 agin and put on the vinyl and was floored.

THIS MUSIC WAS MADE FOR VINYL!!! There is no comparison, really.

Even though the belt turns just a little fast, the music sounded perfect. Brian's production genius, the sound he heard in his head, came through like I've never really heard before. Therein lies a warmth, and a punch that the vinyl delivers that is just not the same with digital.

BWPS and TSS must be heard on vinyl....after that you just might not listen to them again digitally!!   :3d

AMEN.  :angel: BWPS and TSS on a turntable are among the most beautiful experiences I had with music (so far, in my short life).

(http://s.cdon.com/media-dynamic/images/product/music/vinyl_lp/image0/the_smile_sessions-15565266-frntl.jpg)

If there is anybody on the fence about purchasing the vinyl, by all means do it! It is worth every penny!

Have done, and have just shelled out £400 on a deck just so I can listen to it… and now Capitol expects me to buy Sounds of Summer with its free dishcloth?

Edit: this just in from Amazon UK:
Important Message
Please note that the price of Sounds of Summer Merch Kit Lg has increased from £16.97 to £18.85 …

Absolutely. Like BWPS the vinyl absolutely blows the CD out of the water and then some. Not taking anything away from the CDs. But I'll probably never listen to them again. This has nothing to do with the sound quality, but this day in age the CD format is nearly dead. I just listen on my iPhone. I also just realized my belt was turning fast so I just replaced it.  :love

I agree but I think it's mostly the ritual and artifacts of the vinyl that make the experience better.  I'd bet the same master was used for both.  And many (dare I suggest most) vinyl reissues are actually mastered from 16-bit CD files.

Vinyl commands more active and interactive listening.

Just did a back to back of "Our Prayer" 1st digital and then vinyl. Night and day.

I just use a $60 Sony turntable and it sounds fine to me. The high-end 70s turntable with expensive stylus/cartridge is just a little ways beyond my budget.

That's probably correct, although the TSS master is at 88.2khz - so the vinyl is probably a more accurate reproduction of the master as opposed to standard CD (at 44khz/16 bit), but maybe on par or less than HDCD (24 bit/88.2).  A few other variables can influence the vinyl, like the chops of the vinyl mastering engineer, but if there is one thing the BB's usually do well, it's getting the best sound they can out there - and probably more so for this gear.

I like to think that if the original recordings were all analog, it's gonna sound fat on a turntable.

Love your comment about ritual - the music is awesome, the enjoyment of which is enhanced watching the disc go round and round and round....

This music was made more for ears and less for vinyl, imo.

This is what I love about having re-discovered the vinyl experience.  It takes a bit more effort to put a record on and flip it once the side finishes.  I find that even for me, someone who is very dedicated to the music that I love, it's easy to let music fade into the background at times when I can just throw in a cd or click the mouse on the computer.  I find that I pay closer attention and enjoy my listening experience more when I listen on vinyl.

My turntable is not super high quality, but my receiver and speakers are pretty good.  I don't know if I'm getting the full experience, but regardless, I love vinyl.

In the case of BWPS a special mater was prepared for the vinyl, even going as far as to master via analogue magnetic tape. It is a wholly different experience compared to the CD - which in itself is one of the better CD's I own (in that it is actually listenable).

For TSS I'm not sure - purely because I haven't ready anything online or elsewhere about the mastering process. I appreciate an appropriately equalised vinyl master would have been produced, but whether this was generated from the same source as the CD master I don't know.

Either way....TSS on vinyl blows the CD out of the water and I cannot imagine ever listening to the CD. And it is not just 'artifacts' or the experience/ritual of putting a record on. I can hear things that just simply are not there on the CD.

vinyl is a living, breathing thing ... you will hear things differently and it feels more 'real' ... my basic point is this will happen even with the exact same source.  i.e., you could take a CD and press the vinyl from it, and it'll still have this effect.  although it's even better with an all-analog singal chain from microphone all the way to vinyl ...

My first vinyl experience: Herb Alpert's Going Places.

That record makes it sound like the musicians are in the room playing right in from of me. I mean, it's utterly unreal how amazing it sounds on vinyl.

I've yet to really listen to SMiLE on vinyl. I just haven't been in the mood lately I guess. I really can't wait though!

Its a trip with my basement surround sound playing mono pet sounds or SMiLE. Playing phil spector records on vinyl are amazing as well.

I listened to the new Pet Sounds pressing a month ago (been listening to side 2 on repeat for the last few days) - WIBN was kind of a letdown - but the rest of that album....it was like another speaker was hooked up and I could hear things more clearly/distinctly.

I really thought it was hype beforehand...but damn vinyls rule. Can't wait to get a copy of All Summer Long!

All summer long is awesome as well, Side Two of Today in Mono was almost a religious experience.

Will be on the lookout for those! When work picks up again I'm definitely adding quite a few more BB albums to my collection.

I got a vintage Friends pressing last month as well - sounds pretty damn good, I think I'll spin that one tonight.

While what you say is true, there is more to it than that. A well mastered and pressed LP will allow you to hear things you simply cannot hear on the CD. Things that are there on the master tape.

No, it doesn't.

It depends on the person. When I listen to an MP3 album on my computer it's usually just for background noise (even if it's Pet Sounds)....

But with vinyl I sit in a chair and close my eyes and really soak in the music. With the knowledge that vinyls wear out over time, I cherish mostly every listen.

If you do the same thing with a CD or other digital media that you do with an LP, then you will hear most, if not all of the same things. The fact that you have different routines for different types of media doesn't mean that the sounds are not there. Before the CD age, I  just as often put on an LP for background music as I would to sit down and really listen to it through.

Regardless of how I listen to CDs or Mp3s (sometimes I do sit and just listen to an MP3 or CD album) - I find that vinyl has a much deeper and cleaner sound.

That's cool. I was just responding to your post (#20). You kind of said the opposite of what you are saying in this post with no mention of why you prefer vinyl over mp3 (digital). I agree that vinyl has a different sound, whether I would call it a "cleaner" sound, not so sure, there. Definitely a different listening experience, for sure. I am happy to see vinyl making a bit of a comeback. :)

In post 20 I was just agreeing with a poster that said vinyls make for a more interactive listening experience (getting the record from the sleeve, placing the needle, having to get up and change sides). I wasn't really referring to the quality of sound in that post. Looking back my post really doesn't make sense though haha.

But regardless, indeed it is different! I'm glad they're making a comeback too!

I just remembered, I have friends from the Warner two-fers, which are great deals if found in a vinyl store. Smiley Smile after the TSS was odd to to say the least.

Smiley is in Duophonic on that Brother/Reprise 2-fer, as well.

Your right, the sound quality wasn't great, but the real reason I thought Smiley was odd because its stripped down nature after the studio glory of TSS.

Yeah, you really hear the difference in musical direction Brian took after abandoning Smile. I have to say though, I think Good Vibrations sounds great on that 2-fer.

gnerally, unless at school in a free with my iPod, I only really play vinyl. I have every Beach boys album on vinyl U.K first pressings!) (SIP obviously not included, would love one though), and the Pet Sounds stereo mix. Why I listen to vinyl I cannot actually fathom, but i just prefer it. CD's have no real thrill to me, but I still get them!

What I'm getting at is that many vinyl reissues are actually cut from the CD master ... perhaps even most of them.  The only way it would allow you to hear 'more' (as opposed to a different kind of sound and artifacts, etc.) would be if the CD player that was being used to play the CD the laquer was being cut from was better than your CD player, and your record player is of a higher quality than your CD player.

the 3D depth that you're referring to comes from an all-analog signal chain in my opinion.  Beyond that, vinyl sounds better to some (including me) due to the limitations, artifacts and physical nature of the medium as well.  Yes, a digital master can be improved upon by pressing to vinyl (especially if using higher resolution files, or going to tape first), but that very special magic comes from the 'analog only' pressings.

I'm not trying to burst your bubble; I'm just saying a record cut from a CD doesn't contain anything that isn't on the CD except vinyl artifacts and perhaps some differences in mastering.  And we don't know what master was used for 'The Smile Sessions' vinyl.  To my ears, it sounds like the same one used for the CD (perhaps they used higher res files ... but I remember reading somewhere that Capitol actually cuts from 16-bit CDs ... of course they could have made an exception in this case.  Regardless, its a digital master for sure).  I even remember posting on here when I got that Cabinessence/Wonderful 45 last summer that it sounded very 'analog' ... I think they just did a really good job.

I listen mostly to vinyl myself and I record my own music on tape only ... and i've pressed vinyl too.

Donny

The Smile Sessions wasn't cut in-house at Capitol.  It was mastered by Chris Bellman at Bernie Grundman.  In my opinion, it blows the cd away.  Not even close.

Cool, I hope you enjoyed it, was it good - that piece of vinyl  been eluding me (in relation to what I'm willing (allowed) to pay)

Me too! Only seen it once, and it was £40! Now I love Friends.... but damn.

Ah...I don't own many reissues. At least not regular back catalogue reissues. My vinyl collection generally consists of original (or at least within a year or two) pressings, or special audiophile editions.

When I say I can hear things that are not there on the CD....I mean you can sometimes hear instruments in the mix that you cannot hear on the CD. With modern digital masters this could simply be due to the tendancy of most CD's to be compressed more than is necessary.

That Lucky Old Sun is a good case in point, the CD is mastered horribly, the vinyl on the borderline of acceptable.

The "from the vaults" reissues like the Sunflower & Surf's Up re-pressings are definitely from 16-bit masters.  The current Pet Sounds pressing I think is as well, though it might be a higher-res digital source.  Smile on the other hand being cut at Bernie Grundman, it's a very safe bet they cut from high-res files. 

For one thing the frequency profile of the 'son of albion' rip of the Smile LPs does have high frequency information above what you would see on a 16-bit/44.1kHz source.  Conversely when you look at vinyl rips from the 'vault' reissues, they have the a profile consistent with a CD-resolution source.

Good to know!  this is the kind of info that clears up misconceptions.  So yes, there is 'more information' in the Smile vinyl ...  Good for all of us!

I just learned all this techy mumbo jumbo when I downloaded Mackerras and the SCO performing Mozart's 41st. (Which is about as good a version as there is, IMO. Not just saying that. I'm not a big fan of his other interpretations of symphonies, but this is real good!) Anyways, I digress.... The download was a FLAC 24bit 88.2kHz gem of music.

After reading some of the earlier posts it occurs to me now why the vinyl re-issues I spent too much money on just didn't wow me the way BWPS and TSS did...not saying it is the reason why but it makes sense if it is!

Wow!  What was that like?  Was it pretty straight-forward or complicated to get something that resembled the master? And how buzzed were you you played the first thing you cut?

Ah, well still experiencing it actually!  I mean to say, I've pressed vinyl as in, I've released my music on vinyl ... I didn't do the physical pressing myself!  The release date was 1/31 and I'm just now mailing out the records.  It's a 7" ... if you're interested in '60s psych-pop, PM me your address and I'll send a copy to you.

I pushed the limits of what you can fit on a 7" ... the first test pressing was cut too hot, so I had it done again, the 2nd sounds good though!  Definitely a learning experience.  Next time, I'll press 45 rpm instead of 33 1/3 or do a full LP instead of an EP.