The Smiley Smile Message Board

Hello everyone, this is my first post here! I hope you don't mind that it contains a link or consider it spamming - it's kosher

Basically I've been so excited about the imminent release of the SMiLE Sessions that I've been going back through the Beach Boys back catalogue and, to my reckoning, there are at least ten BB albums other than Pet Sounds and SMiLE (in whatever form) that everyone should have, or at least listen to. So I thought I'd choose ten and 'dissect' them each in turn on my blog, and I'd love to know what you think.

First up is Surfer Girl: http://jonnyabrams.b...beach-boys.html

Hope you enjoy reading and I'll post the others up as and when if you'd like me to.

All the best,
Jonny
Rocksucker.co.uk

http://jonnyabrams.blogspot.com/2011/10/top-ten-underappreciated-beach-boys.html

Nice read and it's good to have youtube links to the tracks. Keep it coming!

Cheers John, will do :)

The premise has me a little thrown. How exactly is one of the best-selling and commercial LP's in the Beach Boys history with several of their most well-known songs considered "under-appreciated"? I can only expect the next nine will have some real "cult" choices like the nearly unknown "All Summer Long" or the universally ignored "Beach Boys Today!" Sorry if that seemed harsh....but these records are all multi-million sellers and have continued to be vastly popular despite their four decades age. From a historical perspective that includes more knowledge than post 1990 revision...I'd say Pet Sounds still ranks as the king of under-appreciated Beach Boys LP's (Sunflower the obvious runner-up), while Smile didn't exist until now. I think the idea of highlighting Beach Boys favorites is always a good idea, and your presentation of the Surfer Girl LP seems genuine. But maybe the premise is actually "Ten Beach Boys LP's other than Smile and Pet Sounds that are good"...or "Ten Beach Boys LP's that people with only minor knowledge of the Beach Boys might under-appreciate"...or "Uninformed critics and modern fans who only acknowledge Pet Sounds and Smile when thinking of the Beach Boys should check some of their other albums out too...here's ten of them." Just a thought.

I think you could use some fresh air.

Just a thought.

Yeah, but aside from Beach Boys fans, who cares about "Today" or "All Summer Long"?  And even though the early albums have popular hits, how many people (including Beach Boys fans) really love those albums as albums?  "Surfer Girl" is a perfect choice.  It's not "Pet Sounds" or "Smile," and it gets talked about less than "cult" picks like "Smiley Smile," "Sunflower," or "Love You."  You have to make a good argument for "Surfer Girl" with non-fans, instead of picking some quirky easy pick like "Love You" to show people how "weird"  and "essential" Brian Wilson is.

Wow, pretty rude for just your third post. So, it's OK for you to write about and critique Beach Boys albums, but not OK to critique your blog?

well being that this is my 2653rd post, I will also say that Jon gets a little worked up sometimes when he's defending something.

I do not know anyone (that I have not met through internet Beach Boys forums) who has heard of the album Surfer Girl. fact. most people only know Pet Sounds, therefore everything else is underappreciated. yeah it sold a lot at the time and there's some popular songs on it, but has it ever been on a "Top Albums" list in a magazine or anything like that? is there a tribute album to it? did Brian go on an entire tour dedicated to the record? Is there a boxset of its sessions?

No.

Well, you tell me how so many young people here on this board alone, know so much about those albums? You start out hearing the hits, and if you are taken by them, you delve further into their catalog. Luckily, they are not so under-appreciated that they cannot be found on CD or even LPs, again. Everything is available if you wish to seek them out.

is there a box set for any of their 30 plus albums other than PS? They are only under appreciated if you know about them. In your scenario they are simply unknown. That is the job of we fanatics; to spread the word about their music. :)

There's a reason albums like Smiley Smile and Sunflower get discussed more on these forums, its because outside of this forum and the more hardcore BB fans no one really knows about them, even in this day and age. Surfer Girl on the other hand is definitely one of the more commercial albums even if just in terms of the songs on it, Surfer Girl, Hawaii, Catch a Wave, In My Room and Little Deuce Coupe! These songs all define the BB image as a fun in the sun surfin band. (Not that there's anything wrong with that! ;))

That's what I'm trying to say, though--most people don't seek this stuff out.  The types of people who do seek it out end up here.  And that's why I think "Surfer Girl" is as legitimate a pick as most of their albums.


Those are singles, though.  Most people don't care about the albums.

Critique away. If you're happy to stay clear of unnecessary sarkiness then I'd be more than happy to engage you in a debate about my blog and/or one of my favourite bands of all time.

Just a thought/Hope this helps/Some other such condescending sign-off ;)

You put it better than I, sir :)

Personally, i tend to overlook (aka-not listen to as much as i should), the following. Shut Down Vol 2, Summer Days and Summer Nights, Party!, 20/20, Surf's Up, So Tough, and L.A Light.
On the other hand, i may over-appreciate a couple....based on some people's thoughts on them. M.I.U., Keeping the Summer Alive and BB's '85.
I'm in no way saying i think certain albums are better than others, just that some get played more occasionally than others.

Genuine question Dr, albeit slightly facetious.

how many posts are considered acceptable before one can start being rude? I'd hate to have exceeded it and still being unnecessarily polite.

Fair question. I probably should have added: Par for this board; you fit right in. Still, it doesn't mean that it is right. I am beginning to think it is the effects of being behind the Internet. I still say if we were discussing topics in a real room, face to face, we would act much more polite to each other. I guess whether being punched in the face is a detriment to acting rude in person versus acting rude in here. ;)

Interestingly, it's got a lot to do with avator use as well (but first let me say I don't think rocksucker was that rude. I read it more as defensive) Anyway, Avator use, anonimity. People act out new personas. Whereas if you use your real name you tend to adhere to social constraints more.

So does this mean Old Surfer Dude is actually a vicar?

Mikie is a shy, suburban housewife?

And me? Well I'm so nice, but that's because Iron-Horse Apples is my real name. Stephen Newcombe is my nome-de-plume

Anyhoo

Surfer Girl

My first Beach Boys album, love it. No filler IMO.

At the risk of being rude, let me say that to call the Surfer Girl LP "under-appreciated" is ill-informed and naive. Shortly after release it went Gold and to this day remains THE ONLY original Beach Boys album to include four songs to be featured on Oldies radio: "Surfer Girl," "Catch A Wave," "In My Room," and "Little Deuce Coupe." No other Beach Boys album can boast that claim. What makes it even more impressive is that most Oldies stations have bracketed their playlists between 1964 and 1985 (Beatlemania to No Jacket Required.) The fact that the Surfer Girl songs have survived is nothing if not a testament to how popular that album's songs remain.

One could make the case that, excepting Pet Sounds and the Smile stuff, just about every Beach Boys album is under appreciated.  Some deserve to be, but most, whether they sold well at the time or not, and whether they are still loved today by a certain segment of the listening public or not, still could qualify as being under appreciated.   For all the reappraising that has gone on about the band and the music it created, they still seem under appreciated to me.  
And even with Smile, I mean here we are just a week or so from the release of the "most famous unreleased album of all time" and things seem pretty quiet, I mean yes, there's a lot going on in the world, but where's the promotion?  They're focusing on lighted boxes and surf boards.  Isn't it something that at a time when the USA is perhaps at it's most f***ked up, when people are beginning to rise up again against the tyranny that has ruled them for so long now, and they're seriously questioning what this country is about and what we're doing, that this music should finally see it's release?  A symphony about America, manifest destiny, heroes and villains, the natural world, childhood, innocence, [i]spiritual enlightenment[/i]....this album is as relevant today as it ever might have been.
Anyway, I love Surfer Girl and think it is an early masterpiece.  Great album.

Not really, unless "most people" are under 40....which they are not. The Surfer Girl album was everywhere for decades...everybody had one in 1965...a ton of people still had one in 1975...it remained in print forever...reissued, etc...it sold multi-millions of copies. It was, and still is greatly appreciated by at least two generations of music fans who made it a giant mainstream commercial success.  A box set from it, that's just dumb...the thought is entirely out of context and has nothing to do with any realistic chronology of music history. Pet Sounds is an artistic peak that was slowly discovered, appreciated, celebrated, and then over-saturated by a generation who eagerly caught on decades after the fact. Box set... of course, that's what '90's people do. Although not among my favorite BB's LP's, I know enough to know that Surfer Girl was a mega-hit album in its time, and remained a favorite for decades. Extremely appreciated it was...and is...unless maybe you discovered the Beach Boys through a Mojo article...or AFTER buying a Brian solo CD. This isn't about getting worked up, its just simple historical perspective. Surfer Girl = A Very Appreciated Record by the Beach Boys.

Surfer Girl - On the U.S. charts for 50 WEEKS
Surfer Girl - 9th highest charting Beach Boys album out of thousands :lol
Surfer Girl - Ties for 4th highest rated Beach Boys LP in Rolling Stone Album Guide
Surfer Girl - Appreciation rating 84%
Surfer Girl - Not all that popular in the Stebbins house, but always appreciated

Just because an album sold well at the time and has a few famous songs doesn't necessarily mean that it is highly appreciated. For example, I have seen quite a few write-ups of the band that list which albums should be listened to and only Today, Pet Sounds and every album from Smiley Smile to Holland are included. The early stuff is considered disposable by many.

Jon Stebbins' misanthropic post was bizarre and I'm not sure why anybody would want to get worked up over a fan writing an appraisal of one of his favourite works. Surely there are other things in the world worth directing your frustrations towards.

He's trying to tell you, quite cordially, actually, that back in the day, Surfer Girl was not an under-appreciated album and neither is it amongst fans today.  It's probably the first fully-realised BB album, one that doesn't rely on isntrumentals (which I kinda like) or weaker songs to beef out a couple of strong numbers. When I saw the title of the thread, I was wondering where you were going with it.  Under appreciated to me would be Carl and the Passions and maybe (just maybe) L.A. and 15 B.O. Even I wouldn't go as far as MIU.

How it sold back in the day isn't relevant to how appreciated it is now though. Same goes for Pet Sounds. Not sure how anyone could sensibly argue that Pet Sounds is under-appreciated in 2011???

Amongst hardcore fans Surfer Girl is indeed appreciated but most music fans will never have heard of it and the same goes for every BBs album other than Pet Sounds and Smile. The exact point of the OP's post.

I think that under appreciated could have a different meaning to different people. For example the Rock n Roll Music single of 76 was a big hit by the masses, but I bet it is not very appreciated on this board. Babarann was a huge hit and one of their most played on the radio but not very many love it on this board. MIU as well. Friends and Wild Honey are highly appreciated on this board but not by the masses. It depends on what point of view I guess. Perhaps to Rock Sucker and in his circle these are under appreciated albums. It all depends on generation, geography and weather or not the fans are hard core BB fans or casual fans.

Actually they are, at least in the U.S. A little over 166 million out of just under 309 million is 39 or under, according to the 2010 U.S. census. http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/cats/population.html.  Unless I'm adding wrong, which, being drunk, is possible.

This was precisely my intention and where I am coming from. Perhaps I should have made this clearer within the article itself, but I was happy enough for it to be left open to interpretation. I'm 26 years-old and mostly deal with 'new' music on my blog, so when I say "underappreciated" I refer solely to its current placement in the world of music at large, not just amongst BB fans.

Most people around my age - even those who are into similar types of music - don't know the Surfer Girl album. I myself only even came round to it recently, despite having been a BB fan for years. I'd just always thought that everything pre-Today! would be mostly throwaway teeny bopper guff and, well, I was very wrong indeed about that. Hence why I decided to write this series of articles. No-one's commissioning me to do this - it's all done in my own time as a labour of love, a celebration of an incredible back catalogue (and of course SMiLE's release) and a genuine feeling that these albums should be reappraised and rediscovered in this day and age, lending it an appreciation that goes beyond the twin factors of contemporaneous sales and a lasting, dedicated fan base.

Without wanting to end this post with a sly dig, I hope that the above clarifies why I was somewhat less than cordial in responding to what came across (and I accept I could be wrong about this) as a haughty and patronising response from Mr Stebbins.

But then again, name one album from 1963 besides 'Please Please Me' and 'With the Beatles' that people your age do know? Younger people generally just don't dig 48 year old music. But for a 48 year old album, 'Surfer Girl' certainly hasn't done all that bad. If you walk into a mainstream CD store tomorrow, there's a chance that, apart from the aforementioned Beatles albums, 'Surfer Girl' is the only album from 1963 that you'll find.

Rocksucker -- Perhaps you should've posted your link with disclaimer that it was written for your music blog which deals primarily with new music and it's ilk. It means (as the fact laid out before for you in the thread) something completely different when you post it  on a hardcore fan board. So if people take exception -- don't get snippy. For better or worse, there are dozens of people here that know EVERYTHING about the Surfer Girl LP (there are some here that were even in the studio when it was recorded.) I'm not saying to NOT post your work, but know your audience.

too be honest with you I think ALL their albums are underappreciated by younger people and the casual listener,let's face it how many people are going to know "the surfer moon" or "busy doing nothing" thay may know "sail on sailor" at the most? most casual listeners really only know the hit songs and "pet sounds" so in the case of what he is talking about I would have to say all their albums (for non fans and younger people) are underappreciated..for fans or people who grew up with them in the 60's/70's they aren't..

I see where rocksucker is coming from, and though i think it's hard to say Surfer Girl is underappreciated, it's probably in the bottom half of my most listened to BB albums.  i think we're all aware that many people think of the Beach Boys as only Mike Love's, pre-f***ed formula Beach Boys, and dismiss them because of that. on top of that, many people who do recognize the artistic achievements of the band nevertheless have a tendency to think of the early, pre-1964 stuff as silly, throw-away, and antiquated. why listen to the basic chord progressions on Surfer Girl when you can follow the musical labyrinth on side 2 of Today! or Pet Sounds? Surfer Girl is viewed as a relic of a bygone era--great for its time, but subsequently made irrelevant in light of their mid/late-60s work

in a sense, listening to the pre-"groundbreaking" stuff isn't unlike listening to studio sessions... it's interesting to see what Brian had to go through to get to the beloved recording of God Only Knows, but most would rather listen to the finished song than the unused take 6. the Surfer Girl-era music is, for some people, like take -247 of God Only Knows. the "before" that makes the "after" all the more impressive, but not worthwhile on its own.

rocksucker's post is just pointing out that Surfer Girl is more than that. it's as timeless as the music that came after it, and stands up as a great album on its own.

that said, it really irks me to see so many references to "waltz" and 3/4 time in that blog post, seeing as how there's not a single waltz or 3/4 tune on the album  :lol

6/8? 12/8? Help me out here...

I don't mind people taking exception but if they choose to do so in an unnecessarily sarky manner then I'll give it short shrift, whether on the internet or in real life (to put that particular mini-debate to bed).

To be honest, I hadn't figured that a blog post about one person's love of Surfer Girl (which is basically what it is, regardless of the finer semantics of how it's packaged) would attract such opprobrium on a Beach Boys message board. Either way, it's nice to see it stirring debate, even if it is the "ill-informed and naive" ramblings of a noob.

Does that count as "snippy"?

6/8 or 12/8 are more like it, but i've always just considered them 4/4 with a triplet feel. a waltz is more like Time To Get Alone or I Went To Sleep.

The Waltz is a dance.

It seems to have become the de-facto term for 3/4 time. Very misleading.

The correct historical term is perfect time. This is because 3 was considered perfect due to it's religious implications (holy trinity) 4/4  time is imperfect time

There is no 3/4 time in Surfer Girl

Gotcha, cheers guys. Whatever it is, it's clear that Brian was very taken with it in those early days. Takes some kind of genius to use basically the same rhythmic formula for a bunch of songs and make them all so distinct from each other.

I've long thought that Brian's assertion that Rubber Soul was a "whole album of good stuff" could be applied to album's like Surfer Girl. There is a bit of filler, but it's quality.

When Brian was given a bit of time to manoeuvre, he'd always make a good album.

wid honey is extremely under-rated even with bb fans :/
the whole album is great it just takes sum time 2 sit in. ;D

Agreed. "Aren't You Glad" is one of the most quietly majestic songs I've ever heard.

Er...I mean, watch this space ;)

interesting thread so far.

This goes to show that some authors don't like or want other authors.

Same thing showed up in the Dennis movie thread.

TODAY

No. What it really means is "Know your sh it." Working writers have to or they don't work. Before joining a message board with "Hey gang look what I did!!!" know what you're talking about. Extra points aren't given because you really love an album or usually write for people that don't know any better. That's what it means. Plain and simple. "Surfer Girl" was/is plenty appreciated. This blogger boy is obnoxious. (HEAD'S UP: Working writers/authors use their real names.)

I'm not sure how you can accuse other posters of being obnoxious when you are making posts like that. 

You state that Surfer Girl 'is plenty appreciated' as if that is a fact when it is only your opinion. As other posters have explained, that depends entirely on your perspective. Yours is an entirely worthwhile opinion but so is the one expressed by people who hold a different view. Just how appreciated this particular album is in 2011 is open to debate and is not a factual thing.

It's not a crime for other people to hold conflicting opinions...

My real name is on the article and website URL, genius. And I have no problem with reacting obnoxiously to cantankerous old so-and-sos like your good self. In fact, it's getting more and more amusing, like devout Christians reacting to someone describing the Bible as "a f***in' bangin' read, that".

Oh, and this wasn't a "working writer" piece - I wrote it in my own time, inspired by the music itself rather than any need to document events that I'm sure have already been endlessly documented by the Right Hon. Mr Stebbins and the like. I then posted it on here, not to educate the already-educated or preach to the converted, but to share the love and drum up some hits for my blog in the process. The latter has worked, but the former appears to have been rebuked by an apparent consensus on here (the likes of which I've not encountered when writing about or discussing other great bands) that The Beach Boys are so sacred that to write about them in anything less than meticulously-researched and sourced academic terms should see the author scalded like an errant child.

I'm not an obnoxious chap in the slightest, but I'm always prepared to bite back (in "real life" as well, I might add) so call me what you like and I'll respond in kind. Deal?

Yours, eagerly awaiting your next reply,
Blogger Boy

Sorry - accidental double post! Guess I don't "know my sh*t" after all :P

My reply (per Stebbins)...

Surfer Girl - On the U.S. charts for 50 WEEKS
Surfer Girl - 9th highest charting Beach Boys album
Surfer Girl - Ties for 4th highest rated Beach Boys LP in Rolling Stone Album Guide
Surfer Girl - Appreciation rating 84%

I don't know what else to say, 'Sucker.

You really can't tolerate another opinion can you?

The first two of those points are not relevant to 2011...only to the past.

The Rolling Stone Album Guide (I presume it was recent) is but so are the guides from other publications where Surfer Girl doesn't rate a mention. As I've said earlier, biogs of the band have listed which albums are worth listening to and Surfer Girl certainly wasn't included.

And I don't think people have argued that Surfer Girl is generally well-liked by the people who know it. The issue of how many people in 2011 do know it is debatable.

Your opinion is entrenched though so there's not much more to be said about that.

Do you also consider Pet Sounds to be the band's most under-appreciated album in the present day btw?

Haha..."appreciation rating 84%"? Was that figure randomly generated by an arcade machine? Oh and I couldn't care less about Rolling Stone's opinion, or even if Surfer Girl was so beloved and successful at the time that aliens landed on Earth demanding to see the great Brian Wilson so that they could whisk him away for the Greatest Surf-Pop Album in the Universe awards ceremony before delivering back to his home planet through an intergalactic fleet of aircraft lined up in a Guard of Honour formation.

These days - ie. now, the present, the world we currently live in - Surfer Girl is never even considered for 'Greatest Albums Ever' lists beyond the realms of Beach Boys fans (or should I say Beach Boys academics?), thus I deem it to be "underappreciated", that being the particular loose umbrella term which I selected as an excuse to wax lyrical about one of my favourite bands. Mr Stebbins' suggestion of "Ten Beach Boys Albums that aren't Pet Sounds or SMiLE but are still pretty good, even though you don't know anything about them, you inferior specimen" was all well and good but unfortunately it won't fit in the sidebar menu on my blog so I had to go with something a bit snappier.

I don't know what else to say, Parrot Man. I just hope you don't enforce such stringent levels of pedantry on your own children. "Let Them Run Free", to paraphrase a great man.

Yours,
Blogger Boy
(Although, at 26, I'm not sure I constitute a 'Boy' in the eyes of the many any more. How about "Blogger Young Man", "Blogger Mid-Twenties Guy" or, to satisfy The Great Stebbins, "Blogger Homo Sapiens With a Y Chromosome Who is Approaching His Thirties but Still Derives Pleasure from Irking Grumpy Old Gits who Must Surely Have Other Things in Their Life More Worthy of Their Attention than the Semantics of a Blog Post Made by a Homo Sapiens With a Y Chromosome Who is Approaching His Thirties")

Whoo, this is fun!

@ Howie and rocksucke:

Different opinions allowed, conflicting opinions ditto. But both please calm down a bit. We've had enough hassle here lately, and I don't want another fuss for no important reason at all. No namecalling (even if the other one started first), and no remarks that could offend others.

Apologies SMiLE. I'll wind my neck in now.

Do they?
Always?
C'mon!
There's enough "insider" bullshite here to doubt that statement.

Besides, I don't think Stebbins needs others playing assistant for him. He's a grown up and articulate guy who can take care of himself.

Gee, this Dennis Wilson faction is so protective of itself!

Let the 26 year old blogger praise the Surfer Girl LP (which ain't no The Wall, or Revolver, or Spector's Christmas, btw)
and move on!

We can continue this discussion for weeks, but this is really all there is to be said here:

I don't think surfer girl is underappreciated because this was the first album where Brian's gift for music really began to stand out. I just think time goes on and people forgot these albums because Capitol put out so many greatest hits albums later on the market that cut out the filler (which i like by the way).

Of course we're going to say this, being the hardcore nuts who own everything on vinyl, 1990 twofer, 2001 twofer, Starline reissue and wax cylinder, but I certainly don't listen to Surfer Girl a lot besides the famous ones. Imo, it's a perfectly appropriate Beach Boys album to write about for that reason. There are hidden depths. And yeah, no-one I know has heard of it. 

Might I suggest for another, more festive approach, The Christmas Album? The dichotomy of the (ropey) band side and the lushly arranged second side is probably worth talking about.

And then, there are the 70's & 80's....... maybe avoid Love You, as that's had a critical renaissance. Although probably still not in the public eye.

As I said earlier, none of those otherwise splendid suggestions will fit into a headline on the sidebar menu of a blog. "Underappreciated" was just a convenient umbrella term/shortcut to a snappier title and, to be honest, I wasn't expecting to be met head-on with extreme pedantry.

I think a lot of people use the internet to take out their irritability on unimportant but easy targets. I daresay I do as well.

I think it's uncalled-for to make people suffer the geek heat every time someone comes up with an essay about a rock group.

It's not the essay, but the promotion of the essay. Using "Underappreciated" (such a sh*tty overused term) without something else attached to the term, makes it sound like it is that way to everyone, and that simply is not the case. Now, "Underappreciated By Those Under 30 Years Old" might hold more weight. Seems to me that the writer should be absolutely clear about what he is writing and to whom it is directed.

I think if one were to write about "underappreciated" Beach Boys albums, they'd have to write about the ones that are almost universally regarded as sh*t, like 15 Big Ones, MIU, Keepin' the Summer Alive, Summer in Paradise, Stars and Stripes...

I love how things get argued out on this board. Yes at times it can be aggravating, and we all have our moments of impatience or overreaction, but usually as a thread winds on there are truths revealed, and even a consensus will occasionally emerge. While doing interviews to promote my latest book I often site the Smiley board as a source of inspiration and fuel. I'm busy, a working writer, with a young family to care for etc.. etc.. However, i routinely take the time to read this board because it simply is the smartest group of Beach Boys fans gathered in one place, everyday. Even though I am considered (by some) to be some kind of expert on the subject, i can often find people here who know something I don't...or who have an enlightening perspective on some Beach Boys minutia, and even insight into things that are essential to understanding the larger popular culture...and art in general. I'm a fan of this forum. And in the case of Mr. Rock Sucker...if I actually engage, and post, that means you got my attention. I think if you read my orig. post there is at least one compliment among the smorgasbord of criticisms, and tongue in cheek suggestions. I do think its worthy to think about things like a flawed premise, or a lack of nuance. Its absolutely subjective, but brings into focus the idea of Frame of Reference. Under-appreciated as in the now, or from a more nuanced and historical perspective. That was my point. I was suggesting a widening of the frame of reference might be in order to truly dial in Mr. Sucker's essay topic. The Surfer Girl LP IMO, and from my frame of reference... is a well appreciated entity. I have a good many reasons to be comfortable with that opinion, the Rolling Stone guide being one of the least meaningful to me. I'm not that old...really...but I remember a time, as a wee lad, when Surfer Girl LP's were incredibly common. The cover image is an iconic sight. The music is known. It was a saturation level commercial hit...yada yada yada. That's my perspective. The thought of it being under-appreciated seems to come from a foreign point of view...again, IMO. There are numerous other worthy perspectives many of which have been nicely voiced. The board doing its job. BTW...Howie Edelson has a valuable perspective on whether a certain vein of oldie is under-appreciated in the real world, as his involvement with national syndicated radio is his day job, and therefore he's aware of the inherent business implications of whether the four songs he mentioned from Surfer Girl are still viable today from a commercial standpoint. Hard to believe with radio formats shedding '60's material daily, but Surfer Girl still has a presence in radio.

What subsequently transpired in this thread is fairly typical of this board, although Mr. Rock Sucker's 15 posts certainly have some notable moments...

I think you could use some fresh air.
Dude I live right on the Pacific Ocean.

Critique away. If you're happy to stay clear of unnecessary sarkiness
Take your own advice brother

Just a thought/Hope this helps/Some other such condescending sign-off
See above


Without wanting to end this post with a sly dig, I hope that the above clarifies why I was somewhat less than cordial in responding to what came across (and I accept I could be wrong about this) as a haughty and patronising response from Mr Stebbins.
First time I've been called 'haughty"

I don't mind people taking exception but if they choose to do so in an unnecessarily sarky manner then I'll give it short shrift, whether on the internet or in real life (to put that particular mini-debate to bed).
See above again

To be honest, I hadn't figured that a blog post about one person's love of Surfer Girl (which is basically what it is, regardless of the finer semantics of how it's packaged) would attract such opprobrium on a Beach Boys message board. Either way, it's nice to see it stirring debate, even if it is the "ill-informed and naive" ramblings of a noob.

Does that count as "snippy"?
It counts as sarky

…inspired by the music itself rather than any need to document events that I'm sure have already been endlessly documented by the Right Hon. Mr Stebbins and the like. … The Beach Boys are so sacred that to write about them in anything less than meticulously-researched and sourced academic terms should see the author scalded like an errant child.
Feeling like a victim?

I'm not an obnoxious chap in the slightest, but I'm always prepared to bite back (in "real life" as well, I might add) so call me what you like and I'll respond in kind. Deal?
If you say so.


Oh and I couldn't care less about Rolling Stone's opinion, or even if Surfer Girl was so beloved and successful at the time that aliens landed on Earth demanding to see the great Brian Wilson so that they could whisk him away for the Greatest Surf-Pop Album in the Universe awards ceremony…
Bordering on sarky

Mr Stebbins' suggestion of "Ten Beach Boys Albums that aren't Pet Sounds or SMiLE but are still pretty good, even though you don't know anything about them, you inferior specimen" was all well and good but unfortunately it won't fit in the sidebar menu on my blog so I had to go with something a bit snappier.
Space is at a premium, we get it

I don't know what else to say, Parrot Man. I just hope you don't enforce such stringent levels of pedantry on your own children. "Let Them Run Free", to paraphrase a great man.

Yours,
Blogger Boy
(Although, at 26, I'm not sure I constitute a 'Boy' in the eyes of the many any more. How about "Blogger Young Man", "Blogger Mid-Twenties Guy" or, to satisfy The Great Stebbins, "Blogger Homo Sapiens With a Y Chromosome Who is Approaching His Thirties but Still Derives Pleasure from Irking Grumpy Old Gits who Must Surely Have Other Things in Their Life More Worthy of Their Attention than the Semantics of a Blog Post Made by a Homo Sapiens With a Y Chromosome Who is Approaching His Thirties")

Whoo, this is fun!

Fun is in, its no sin.

Hoo, boy did you ever come to the wrong place !  ;D

Hey, I come here for ALL my extreme pedantry needs......  ;D

Seriously, as Jon S. and Howie mentioned, there is no doubt that the LP Surfer Girl was a massive commercial and artistic smash in its day.

But, more to Jon Abrams--Mr. Rocksucker's point, what about the under age 30 casual listener TODAY?

Has the "branding" of many of the Beach Boys' LPs been "diluted" by excessive compilations?

For me: I would be unhappy if I thought some of the Boys' most important (early) work was "underappreciated" by younger listeners.  I hope that doesn't happen.

To me, the term "underappreciated" speaks of an album that is generally overlooked by the masses and dismissed by the hardcore. And to me, there is an album in the Beach Boys catalog that shoots right to the top of that list.

M I U

I don't care, dammit. It's good! It's a throw-back to pre-Pet Sounds un-heavy-ness. Fun and sun of teenaged youth filtered through the eyes of creepy old men with addictions to transcendental meditation and cocaine. Aside from a couple of stale croutons, this album is a garden salad of delicious delight. Wontcha Come Out Tonight, My Diane, Pitter Patter, Bells of Paris, She's Got Rhythm, Kona Coast, Hey Little Tom Boy....all good stuff. Sure, Carl and Dennis were sorta MIA, but why not let the sober people take the lead for once? And how about Brian's voice? Nice and smooth like tapioca pudding. Hell, I can't understand how anybody could loathe this wonderful record. It's a trampier older sister of "All Summer  Long", post-hysterectomy.

Don't see it like that. Would you rather have insincere compliments, or honest opinions? I agree that some people can be a bit harsh on this forum sometimes, but in the end almost everyone is here just to share their knowledge and honest opinions. And if you're looking for people who have something to say about all things Beach Boys, you'll find some of the greatest experts and most loyal fans on the planet right on this forum. So just use that for your advantage.

Fair comment. And I'm delighted that Mr Stebbins has decided to base his latest tome on me ;)

Anyway, here's part two of the series in case anyone's interested: All Summer Long...

http://jonnyabrams.blogspot.com/2011/10/ten-underappreciated-beach-boys-lps-all.html

"GRR ALL SUMMER LONG IS NOT OVERRATED IT HAS I GET AROUND DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY KIDS IN THE SIXTIES BOUGHT THE ALBUM JUST FOR THE SINGLE, LISTENED TO IT A FEW TIMES, AND THEN SOLD IT AT A GARAGE SALE THIRTY YEARS LATER"

I'll give you a bunch of fives, you rapscallion! *Puts 'em up, bounds about a bit, shuffles off quietly*

Part three: Today!

http://jonnyabrams.blogspot.com/2011/11/ten-underappreciated-beach-boys-lps.html

Today? LMFAO

You forgot about "In The Back Of My Mind". Also, I love how this album begins and ends with Dennis singing the leads to both songs.

Stay tuned for Part four: Pet Sounds

Sorry, low blow but I was on your side until Today!

Replying to the question, "And even though the early albums have popular hits, how many people (including Beach Boys fans) really love those albums as albums?", I think BB fans are aware of how Today works as an album, with the rockier tracks on one side and the sensitive songs on the other. The latter is often considered a precursor of Pet Sounds. All the other early albums are hits + patchy but Today was definitely a masterpiece album, not just a collection of great tracks.

Underated?, Today was the testing ground for Pet Sounds with deep lyrics and production.

I qualified my stance in the intro with "underappreciated by the world at large". Maybe it's the talk of your town but I'd be amazed if all but maybe two or three people I've ever known know about Today! and how good it is, and do not do so upon my recommendation/insistence.

I post this genuinely in a non "snippy" way by the way :) I'm just very sure of my ground on this one and am more than happy to debate it. Today! is not, by the world at large, held in even a thousandth of the esteem that Pet Sounds - and SMiLE to an extent - is/are. If it was rereleased with bonus material etc tomorrow, there wouldn't be much fanfare beyond these message boards.

Happy to be proven wrong, mind.

Ha! THIS needs to be the blurb on the back of the next MIU CD reissue, if it ever happens!!!!

The only reason I could accept "Today!" as underappreciated is because, as some have stated here, it's a near-masterpiece, but most of the world doesn't appreciate it that way.  Still, with that said, it is one of three albums to make the RS Top 500 (along with PS and Sunflower...pretty sure there's not a 4th), so it does garner some level of acknowledgement, unlike, say, Summer Nights!

You're right - it's better than The Wall and Revolver, although I haven't heard the Spector album.

You should definitely check the Spector Christmas album. One of the greatest albums ever made.

I'm with Jon on this ...

My perspective is a bit in the middle; I was born in '79, but became seriously into the Beach Boys around my 13th birthday in 1992.  In fact, for my 13th birthday, i bought Brian's brand-new 'autobiography' along with vinyl copies of "Wild Honey", "Friends", "15 Big Ones", "Love You", "MIU", etc, etc ... I was poor and the records were $2-$8 each.  This was before the internet, so it was all fanzines, cassettes, etc. (whatever happened the "Friends of Dennis Wilson" 'zine?).

In any case, "Pet Sounds" was acclaimed but in general "Endless Summer" was the standard.  You wouldn't readily find "20/20", "Friends," etc unless you were deep-diving the records bins.

Based on my observation, the popular tide turned late '90s-early '00s with the "Endless Harmony" doc and the '70s reissues.  Keep in mind, you couldn't get a new CD copy of "Sunflower", "Surf's Up", or "Holland" during most of the '90s.  The Capitol albums were always in print.  I would bet money that "Surfer Girl" was still selling more copies than "Friends" during the whole decade.  And worth pointing out, Rolling Stone never really took the Beach Boys seriously until more recent years.  During the '90s, I recall reading their 'bible' record guide and noting how albums like "Sunflower" and "Friends" would be rated at something like 2 stars and "Surfer Girl/Shut Down Vol 2" might have 3 or 4.

In any case, "Surfer Girl" is widely regarded as the first 'serious' Beach Boys album, and is notable for being the first credited to Brian as producer.  Many of the tracks are well known by the general public as identifiable BB songs.  A good bulk of the "Endless Summer" vibe is built around these tracks.  I would even go as far as saying this album (along with "All Summer Long" and "Summer Days") basically represents the definitive popular Beach Boys sound.

The most under-appreciated Beach Boys album?  At this point, "Smiley Smile" ... I wonder what fate has in store for this record?

But he killed folks :O

(Naw, I should.)

(Check out the album, not kill folks.)

Disagree. I appreciate it :P ;)

yes "arent you glad" is what made me want 2 give wild honey an extra listen :) and i grew 2 love it
it stands out so much in the bb catalog :)

4. Summer Days (and Summer Nights!!)

http://jonnyabrams.blogspot.com/2011/12/ten-underappreciated-beach-boys-lps.html

Is it me, or are us Beach Boys fans a dysfunctional lot?  Whilst I don't see the logic in how some of the albums mentioned in this blog are exactly "under-appreciated", why must we get so worked up over this? 

But I'll have some fun with this: I think Summer In Paradise is a pretty under appreciated album.  Largely because it sucks. 

Well, maybe according to rocksucker ALL the BBs albums are underapreciated. Which is true for us hard core fans! I mean think about it, most people just know the hits. A lot of people that call themselves BB fans know 30 plus BB songs, but couldn't name a single album except maybe Pet Sounds.

I would say the MOST appreciated BB albums are:

1. Pet Sounds
2. All Summer Long
3. Surfer Girl
4. Today
5. Summer Days/Summer Nights

Even so, they may not have the appreciation that people give to say:

Sgt Pepper
Rubber Soul
Revolver
White Album
Abby Road

I think the confusion about "under appreciated" lies in the fact that maybe those albums are to the general public under 40 years old, but claiming they are under appreciated on a Beach Boys forum didn't make a lot of sense. The blog's author didn't take kindly to being critiqued, himself. I think when a person creates such a thing, they need to know their audience.

Author here. I don't mind the critique at all - there's been a lot on this thread and I've taken it on board - but I do take exception to discourtesy. Just to clarify, these articles are intended more for the general public/non-Beach Boys fans than for the people on here - it's pretty obvious that these albums aren't underappreciated by hardcore Beach Boys fans - but nonetheless I figured that some people might have got a kick out of reading about Beach Boys albums that aren't often written about beyond these realms. Perhaps I didn't do a good job of presenting it from that angle, but I'm going to keep writing them and posting them because I enjoy it and would love it if even one person who hadn't otherwise considered listening to these records did so upon my recommendation.

If you still take issue with this, then just ignore it. (I mean that in a friendly, non-snippy way by the way!) I like writing about bands and albums I love and thought others might enjoy reading them - that's about it. "Underappreciated Beach Boys albums" (by the world at large, as mentioned in the brief intro) does not mean "crap Beach Boys albums", to answer to one or two others, so expect to be exasperated by the remaining choices if this is how you see it :)

I don't take issue with anything at this point. The poster quoted my October 23rd post, and I was explaining why things started out the way they did back then. Since then I believe it is quite understood what you were/are going for with your blog.

Gotcha Dr BB.

Perhaps a point could also be made that back in 1963, music was much more single oriented then albums. I wasn't alive back then, but I'm guessing that albums weren't a big deal as an entire peace of work until 65 or 66 (?).

I have a hard time finding albums by Buddy Holly, Roy Orbison, etc, they are all greatest hits in the stores today from that period. As for BB albums, there is just about always a copy of Pet Sounds and several greatest hits. The other albums are common, but not always stocked at stores today.

"Kiss Me Baby” flaunts the xylophone and clacking percussion that would become so key to the Pet Sounds experience, but it is “She Knows Me Too Well” that truly sits alongside “Please Let Me Wonder” as the album’s melancholic highlight."

This is crazy to pick PLMW over KMB. KMB is better musically, it's stylistic, the "orchestration" is perfect, a stronger chorus, the back and forth between vocals and guitar.....it's more significant than PLMW.

The "Today" opinion is kinda interesting, considering it's actually one of the few originals currently in print (in an el cheapo edition, mind).  I often see vintage vinyl pressings in a the 2nd hand joints, which usually indicates that it sold well at the time.

I'm always suprised that the "Lost and Found" stuff hasn't been bought back into the fold - legalities and overall quality aside, it provides a historical insight into this band's origin and as well as a document of a sliver of the LA music industry at the time

Found a great mono copy of Today! for two dollars a few months back.

It's taken a while to get there, but *this* is the kind of debate I was hoping for ;) :P

My good man: I wouldn't say it was "crazy" to proffer an opinion, but then I see I did use the word "truly" so I guess we're quits! For what it's worth, I place SKMTW ahead of both of them, as I would "Let Him Run Wild" (I know it's not on the same album but, heck, it could have been).

Also disagree with KMB having a stronger chorus than PLMW. If anything, I feel that its chorus lets it down a touch, at least compared to the splendour of the "late late last night" breakdown.

I bought Today! in vinyl at a record store in my hometown for 18 bucks, newly pressed and in mono.  I was really surprised to see it...it was sitting right next to a vinyl Pet Sounds!

@ the author, I love the blog by the way.  I feel bad for the harsh criticism you've gotten here, being sixteen and constantly struggling to convince my "musically oriented friends" to embrace the Beach Boys leads me to sympathize with your cause.  So many people my age, and into their twenties, who may even call themselves fans, simply know nothing of the beautiful albums the Beach Boys created.  It's really a shame some of the older members on this board jumped at you so quickly.  Personally, knowing your intention to inform the "outside" world of some of the Beach Boys work and exposing the modern record buying public to the music, I think your choices are great.  I'm looking forward to seeing Surf's Up, do you think you'll end up writing about that one?

Thanks Zach. It does seem unfair that these albums weren't 'canonised' in the way that, say, The Beatles' back catalogue has been (not that that didn't deserve to). Each album is quietly monumental in its own different way, none more so than Surf's Up which is indeed on the list. In fact I'd wager that most on here would be able to predict the remaining choices quite easily!

By the way, in a totally non-patronising way, well done for having such fine taste so young :) Think I'd have been closer to 18 when I first ventured past Pet Sounds and started listening to Sunflower/Surf's Up. I remember I was doing work experience at a book publishing company, photocopying, that kind of thing. The work was stultifying but the music makes that week strangely significant in retrospect (it's when I first started listening to Pixies as well).

This reminds me that I was likely switched onto Sunflower/Surf's Up after seeing them mentioned in conjunction with my favourite band at the time (and still one of them), Super Furry Animals. Anyone else here a fan?

You can't compare any beach boys albums to beatles albums. The only ones that can stand up to what the beatles did are pet sounds,smile sessions & today.

Good god, yes!  ;D

Ditto that!!

[/quote]
(it's when I first started listening to Pixies as well).

and lovin' that too.  I hit an initial wall with the BB's around '88 and gap-filled with Black Francis and Mrs John Smith et al

You mad? I say even the best songs on Pet Sounds are not in the same league as timeless classics such as "Maxwell's Silver Hammer", "All Together Now" and "Within You Without You".

Stick to your BB guns, Zack, it's great to hear about your unconditional passion and enthusiasm.  I have similar memories about arguing with purveyors of fine music, and as I drifted towards the indie music scene, I despaired and bailed on our Heros for a couple of years (but we are talkin' around the Still Cruisin' and BW 88 era, so I did not need much prompting).

Give me Friends and Wild Honey over the White Album.

The early stuff is better when you combine the best tracks together onto a single album instead of three album for each year.

lmfaoooooo  :lol ..thank you i needed that :)

White album was quite a few classics and some filler material but wild honey as a whole is a great album. :)

I appreciate all the support guys! I have to say though, with many credible people (like Pitchfork) citing the Beach Boys as one of the most influential and respectable artists during the past decade or so, it's become easier to convince my friends of their artistic talent. Especially when I can pull out a 9.1 review Pitchfork gave Smiley Smile or the respectable 8.5 they gave Pacific Ocean Blue. There's plenty of other sources they give deserving praise to Brian Wilson's music as well. I particularly enjoy telling people that Thom Yorke cites Pet Sounds as a major influence on OK Computer.  

Also, @ rocksucker, you've hit the nail right on the head with your statement about Beatles albums compared to the Beach Boys'.  I love the Beatles, but every single one of their albums is glorified as revolutionary and spectacular. The Beach Boys just receive no where near that amount of praise, especially when Help! was released the same time as Today!. I mean come on! Today! IS underrated, because 99% of people have heard of Help!, and 10% (ha. Probably not even) of the record buying public has not heard Today!. How about when With the Beatles is glorified? Now THAT particularly irks me...because an album like Sufer Girl is just leagues better. The list goes on and on...but you get the point. The Beatles are music gods, and, unfortunately the Beach Boys are a classic oldies group that continues to suffer due to poor marketing and representation.

Oh, and by the way, love the Pixies. @ Alholio, yeah, I'm an indie guy too...and I can't imagine facing the indie scene in the late eighties with Still Cruisin being released. Being a Beach Boys must have been REALLY trying. I don't blame you.

But I was comparing the BBs to the Beatles of the same period, not other BBs albums. I would say that Sgt Pepper, Magical Mystery Tour and Abbey Road were all better then what the BBs did the same year (Unless SMiLE was released in 67 then it beats SP and MMT) Outside of those, I take the BBs every time.

I meant that the combined early material is better than the beatles' early stuff.

ok lets compare albums by both at the same time. which ones?

I happen to quite like Maxwell's Silver Hammer

wow! you're one of the very few that does like it.

I think the whole catalog bar the hits, Pet Sounds, and Smile is under rated by Joe Average.  I think Surfin USA, Shut Down 2, All Summer Long, Today, Summer Days, Pet Sounds, WIld Honey, Friends, 20/20, Sunflower, Surf's Up, Holland, POB, and the two LP or single CD version of the Smile Sessions belongs in every good music collection that covers the period. Others like Surfer Girl, Little Deuce Coupe, the 3 live albums, Party, Smiley, The Flame, So Tough, Spring,  BWPS, and TLOS, are great additional items to get if you love those. As fans it's a different thing I suppose. For example I think the early LP's are really over looked, while too much time is spent on the 1976-80 material. That comes down to taste though as I love rock and roll before it was just "rock".

I like it all right too.  It's just a catchy little, fairly inconsequential ditty - but so what?  It's silly, stupid fun.  Nothing wrong with that really.  I think part of the stigma of it is that it's McCartney.  If it were a Lennon song I bet people would be more approving.

I don't hate it but Abbey Road has better songs.

But then again, everything you listed was from at least a year later the Pet Sounds. If you are going to be fair, compare it to the two albums it was chronologically between, that being Rubber Soul and Revolver.

What beach boys albums and beatles albums were released at the same time?

Don't feel bad, RS.  It wasn't till my 50's that I FINALLY got into Sunflower and Surf's Up.   ;D  OOF!

Thanks for clearing that one up ;) :P

Each to their own, eh :) How long had they sat with you before they clicked? It has to be the sign of a great band, when so many different albums/songs change so many people's lives at so many different times.

Check this thread   http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,11806.msg233971.html#msg233971

Yeah solved a 42 year mystery there!

I like Maxwell's Silver Hammer a lot. not everything has to be a grand artistic statement. it's a fun song about MURDER!

Thanks :)

The hammer sound effect is cool as well in that song

So...when can we expect the next update?  ::)

5. Smiley Smile...

http://jonnyabrams.blogspot.com/2012/01/ten-underappreciated-beach-boys-lps.html

Happy new year everyone :)

I like your sentiments on Smiley Smile. Definitely a great album. But according to all the critics it's the point where Brian went off the deep end never to return, therefore allowing the Beatles to claim victory to the "best album ever" title. That's what feeling i've gotten from every Smiley Smile critics review (except maybe Pitchfork). I hate that. Rolling Stone even made a point of it in the "50 years of the Beach Boys" article. That's why Good Vibrations is the last good thing they ever did in most people's minds. Glad it's not absolutely everyone tho  :) good review

RS - I just noticed this thread and am happy to see younger people approaching the study of the great BB music.  I was about 8 albums behind when I was hit with the "coup de foudre" of the music.  So I can't tell you much except I did  not have the frame of reference of experiencing the music, during the early 5 years or so of the music.  

What I can suggest is that 4 of the 5 albums you include contain about 60% + of the Touring setlist for the Band. You might check out Eric Anniversario's setlist archive and some other websites, where setlists are posted.  Mike does I'm So Young, with doo wop origins, and those 1965 and prior albums are huge and by no means underappreciated.  I bet that people will download some of those older albums, as this whole Celebration of the 50 years heats up. I downloaded a couple just week.  At $4.99 for a double album, it is actually cheaper than $3.00 when they were originally released.  

That said, I will tell you that my own kids, who are in your age bracket, know the music content, but not the historic context , in terms of an "album" - in other words, they know the "setlist" of about 40 or so songs.  Mike Love often talks about writing The Warmth of the Sun, with Brian, the night before JFK was assassinated.  Mike puts it in an historical context.  Otherwise, we work in a vacuum.  We don't know where we are, if we don't know what was happening at the time, the music was composed.  It is a big picture.  Music, Art and History all fit together, somehow.  

There are some pretty informed people on this board, some who have even written books.  I'm just a hack fan.  But, I was listening to the Beach Boys instead of doing Geometry, so it was important to my "formation" as a teen, and in college and grad school.  The music has a message, I guess even now, as young people such as yourself embark on its' study. But you might look with a larger lens, at the music, in terms of what was happening at the time, with respect to both composition as well as lyrics.  And have fun with it...if you have fun, it isn't work!  ;)

Fun is in; it's no sin!

Thanks for the message, fdp. I completely agree about historical context being intrinsically linked with any music - it can't help but seep into the appreciation one way or another, helps you to look past facets that are a bit dated, emphasizes others as being 'ahead of their its time' and therefore that much more dazzling. It's something I've always wandered about with music, even from a much younger age when I used to treat it with suspicion.

That's perhaps not what you meant - just thinking aloud :) But I appreciate your comments, and shall endeavour to do a little more digging. I will say that each of my remaining 'underappreciated' selections is liable to attract howls of derision...

Well I can't check out the article as it is a dead link now  :-\

So here's my Ten underappreciated Beach Boys albums, in chronological order:

Surfin' Safari
Surfin' USA
Shut Down Volume II
Smiley Smile
Wild Honey
20/20
Carl And The Passions: "So Tough"
L.A. Light Album
The Beach Boys (1985)
Still Cruisin'

Try this:

http://rocksucker.co.uk/?s=10%20Underrated%20Beach%20Boys%20LPs (http://rocksucker.co.uk/?s=10%20Underrated%20Beach%20Boys%20LPs)

Very Interesting, Thanks for the Link!

Surprised at some of the choices as some of them aren't underappreciated at all, in fact the only ones I agree are underappreciated are Smiley Smile (to some extent) and Wild Honey.

LDC  was underappreciated by ME until fairly recently.  with all of the comps and rereleases, boxes, and various twofers etc, It had benn many years since I actually played all LDC straight thru as an album.      pardon the pun, But that album Is a GAS!    Great theme, great music, production, and oh, those harmonies!     If you have not listened to this lp as an lp unto itself in a while, do your self a favor and put this on and listen some eveniNg, alone, puttering around the house or chilling with a brew or cup of tea.

Well, the blogger shouldn't have responded to Mr. Stebbins with the "I think you could use some fresh air" comment. It's not rude but it definitely sounds like he is good friends with the latter, thus is allowed to talk so. That said, I'm with you, Dr. Lenny & others who don't find anything remotely bad about these kind of lists. They can be accurate or not, we can disagree or agree with the author's POV, but I myself don't care; I read blogs for entertainment, it's fun to me compare my own thoughts with the writers'.

I don't know if I'd call any Beach Boys under appreciated. Pet Sounds is their only album that really deserves classic status IMO. Smiley Smile, Surf's Up, and Love You are all favorites of mine, but I recognize they are fundamentally flawed works that can't really be recommended to the unconverted.

What about Smile Sessions, Wild Honey or Sunflower?

The same.