The Smiley Smile Message Board

Ive read this book a couple times, and i know what ive heard about it how true it is, and what brian says after the law suits.  But i really believe alot of it is from brian, hes the only one who could know some of the stuff in there.  I believe alot of it and disregard most the things that mention landy.  any thoughts?

I think you'll find out pretty soon that you're badly mistaken.  ;) The only redeeming part of that book is the pictures.

The first section does indeed contain much that is accurate: these parts are stolen from the books of earlier BB/BW authors sucjh as David Leaf and Steve Gaines, often word for word. Todd Gold did this because, as he admitted later in a Billboard interview, he had to flesh out Brian's terse responses in the interviews he conducted with him. Brian has testified in court that his only involvement was several such interviews lasting maybe nine, ten hours. He's never read it and in private he's called it "a load of sh*t".

The second section was heavily influenced by Landy.

Now you know.  :)

Glad I wasn't introduced to the Beach Boys through this book, course i might still read it for a good laugh. Thats funny how Brian called it a "load of sh*t" because that is exactly what it is. But at the same time, its the most widely spread book about Brian Wilson around, so thousands of people still think it is true.

I thought I had heard that there were early versions of the book with handwritten edits by Brian, are these fake?

However true or not, it was a fascinating read for me and really got me into Brian and the Beach Boys. Pretty soon I found lots of the stolen passages in LLVS. You can take the book as a kind of novel based on actual incidents.

I was 19 when the book came out, and had been a fan for a few years by then. This was in the pre-internet days, and also before The Beach Boys were re-discovered by genX.
Because of these reasons, I had only heard Brian interviewed a few times, so I believed every word of the book as I didn't know any different.

It was this book that made me very anti-Mike and pro-Brian, and If I'm honest I still have these prejudices though I have reassessed somewhat, and have travelled from outright hatred of Mike, through to dislike and I'm currently at grudging re-acceptance.

Looking back now, I think the anti Mike thing, though hinted at by David Leaf before this, really came into it's own when this book was published. And though I still think a lot of the criticisms against Mike are justified, it's rather unsettling that a lot of these sentiments came from a completely discredited book.

Sh#t sticks eh?

I got it from the library back in the 90's and believed it. I didn't have a reason not to. I'd love to have a copy to have in my library just for the pictures alone.

Just about every book I own or have read about the Beach Boys makes you hate Mike Love. And if that doesn't do it for you, read one of his interviews or listen to his between song banter on a vintage 70's show. Maybe one day I'll meet him (he lives in Nevada) and be pleasantly surprised that he's actually a very nice and humble guy. I'll stop here before I get some "bad vibrations" from all of you.

The anti Mike thing was prevalent among many BB's/Wilson fans in the '70's. It hit its absolute stride in '88 with the rock and roll hall of fame debacle.

Hi Jon -

do you reckon the anti-Mike mood started after the success of Endless Summer/Spirit Of America, and the BBs then slowly turning into a band living ever more off of its past glories (live, at least)? Or was it already present earlier?

IIRC, when it came out, the book was exposed as a fraud in Billboard by David Leaf, Timothy White, and some other BB authors.

I was 15 when I read it, and to me it seemed a pro Landy pamphlet.

Neal Umphred destroyed it in his review (Goldmine, I think).

Oh, and David Leaf was instrumental in spreading the anti Mike Love gospel. The 1977/8 was unbearably biased. And IIRCC the 198? edition ended up with an anti Love statement.

I'm not disputing Leaf's role in the anti-ML movement for one moment, just reporting that he was one of the early whistle-blowers on the faux-BW "auto" bio.

Didn't know that, interesting. For me, the words put into Brian's mouth and pen could never have come from him. There's a lot of therapist's lingo in there... one paragraph struck me in particular, IIRC Brian 'reports' his own symptoms of OCD, and his description seems to be lifted straightaway from some handbook. Some of the photo's are quite endearing... Bri in a hammock, being hugged by mr Landy...

When I first read it, I didn't know much about the circumstances surrounding the book, but even then I took most of what is wriiten in it about Landy with a fairly large pinch of salt.
However, later in the book, there's a part where it basically lays the blame for Dennis' death at Carl's door. Something, which to be perfectly honest I find utterly disgusting.

This book has the cache of obese photos of Brian, apart from the John Tobler book 30 odd years ago.

Just a few thoughts...

First of all, I have to say that while I have to agree that WIBNMOS is a hunk of crap, I do suspect that the day-by-day detail-by-detail description of Landy's treatments probably are accurate; it makes the book serve as a commercial for Landy's services. It is interesting how a lot of the chapters are a bit vague, but then when Landy is introduced suddenly "Brian" discusses everything.

I love how in the list of different tracks recorded for Smile "Brian" actually has "George Fell" in the list!

And the picture of Brian with the dog that's allegedly Banana....uhh, no, beagles don't look anything like that!

Brian laying down a bass track for Pet Sounds?? Sure.

BTW, am I the only one who despises the Timothy White book?? You could probably write a small book just about the inaccuracies in it...

I know a lot of it was plagiarized from other Beach Boys bios.  There are things in there, though, that only Brian would have known so it's either from Brian or Landy or both.  According to the lawsuit testimony, Brian delivered several cassette tapes of his therapy sessions with Landy.  While the claim is that he only talked to Todd Gold for an hour or so, I'm sure Gold listened to those tapes and got some stories/anecdotes from them that are repeated in the book.  Gold also did some interviews with Landy himself, so all the details about events and Brian's life with Landy were new and unique to that book.  The fact that the spin favored Landy doesn't change that fact.  Gold also did some new interviews with people like Van Dyke Parks, so there are a couple of things here and there that while they're not exciting, they are different.  There are also things in there about Brian's relationship with Diane Rovell that aren't in any of the other books.  It was a pretty significant relationship for both of them. 

Got it when it was first published and once I got past reading the pieces lifted wholesale from Leaf & Gaines, there was very little, if anything, in the first part that wasn't already known, could be deduced or reasonably guessed (or invented to order). As for the second part, it's generally assumed that Gold wrote it with Landy looking over his shoulder (metaphorically speaking).

But there are no other accounts of his life with Landy, other than the McParland/Usher book, which is a limited window.  Sure, it's very positive and glowing, but it's an interesting look at a very Orwellian world.  All of the books are basically gossip.  There's nothing edifying about the Gaines book, either.  I'm not sure how accurate some of those stories are and a lot of it is for prurient interest.  The Gold book is for prurient interest, also, it's just that the one mostly original part, the Landy part, is self-serving propaganda.  I wouldn't discourage anyone from reading it.  I think it is worth reading.  I would think most people would be so creeped out by the way his life with Landy is described, that even in the most positive light it's presented,  they would realize something was very wrong with it.

Although I would add that as an "autobiography," calling it that is bogus.  I don't think Brian had or has that great of a memory, even given that some of the material may have been lifted from therapy tapes or a couple of hours of direct interviews with the man.  I think he remembers some things, but there are more gaps than average in his memory due to substance abuse and mental illness.

What I find interesting is that Keith Richards' purported autobiography may not be that much better of a source about Keith as WIBN is about Brian, and that the author of that book was forced to "borrow" as much from previous bios due to his subject's memory gaps from substance abuse and age.  Keith's book is huge, and it's been highly priased, but I think his co-author James Fox borrowed a great deal from previous bios published by Victor Bockris and other Keith biographers (including Tony Sanchez, aka Keith's drug dealer).  I'm not sure Todd Gold is unique in "borrowing" information and stories wholesale from previous works and calling it "autiobiography."

Not read Keef's book, but I'm assuming that his co-author credited the people you mentioned. Gold stole parts of other people's book and not only did he not credit them or even admit to it, he also put the words of other people - Hal Blaine, Steve Desper - into Brian's mouth... and when he was called on it, he said, in essence, that he had to do that to flesh out Brian's mostly terse interview replies.

Brian actually has a fantastic memory, especially when it comes to music and numbers. Dates, names and events as well. In fact you can safely say that if there is one thing that wasn't damaged by drugs it was his memory.

One of nthe few books where I got stuck in the middle permanently. Not because of inaccuracies but because of the writing style. Disgustingly highfaluting, if that is the word.

The only book I've seen with a picture of the SMiLE album with the duophonic bar though.

The LSD related experiences depicted in the book have always been my favorite passages.

Studies have shown that LSD experiences can be vividly & emotionally recalled 40 years after they originally occurred (my source for this is a book about Oscar Janiger's LSD studies). If someone invented these accounts for WIBN they did a great job of faking things.

Reboot of this thread after 11 months!

Just coming down from a LSD trip Bill? ;D A lot has happened in BB land while you were away. ;)

Fill me in.

If believed every word of this book, then I'd have to be not only anti-Mike, but anti-Carl, anti-Al, and anti-pretty-much-anyone-named-Wilson, with the exception of Dennis, who, in spite of his many faults, is forgiven because, after all, he was an out of control drug addict. Carl is blamed for his death, Landy is God.....oh how I hate this book.

WIBN is a sack of crap. And agreed, i don't much like the Timothy White book either. He's almost completely dismissive of stellar albums like Surf's Up and - in particular - Holland, but then he foams at the mouth with praise for Beach Boys '85 (now i actually think BB '85 is a lot better than it's dreadful rep implies, but ''almost as good as Sunflower''...?)

I read up until he meets Landy, and then I stopped, because it gets really creepy.

Landy wrote it.  Although from a couple of old interviews I read from that time period Brian talked like Landy sometimes.  Brian repeated a lot of therapy lingo and said nasty things about his family, but also that he wasn't allowed to see them very much.  Brian was brainwashed.  He seemed like a kidnap victim who started to agree with the people keeping him captive so he wouldn't get in any trouble.

wierd I've just read this on holiday last week (having read 'catch a wave' a couple of years back).

I'd heard it was kinda co-written with Landy a while back so was a bit skeptical.
Defo interesting in a kinda ghoulish way, more so in the latter 3rd.
This book has distorted my head abit so I think I'm going to have to reread 'catch a wave' again striaght off to get some better oversight.

bad example but.. I'd watched this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZSAQX2uuUY
aages ago, but hearin it mentioned in WIBNMOS was interesting.

I don't know whether or what to believe with the relationship with his dad & family, stan love etc, really shockin if the majority of it is true.
It's amusing hearing Landy's various job title's as the book progress's  ::) :lol :police:

It's got me wondering is there another book other than 'catch a wave' i could read to get a more rounded view, sure WIBNMOS is SKETCHY to put it mildly but it's got me keen to read another book that's not so dubious/'managed'/ulterior content as this but diferent from 'catch a wave'

These are the only 2 I've read on the Beach Boys and Brian Wilson & would love to read another, I'd thought I'd throw it out and ask for a recommendation from you if that's okay?

Can't go wrong with this IMO but I'm sure AGD or others can give you there thoughts on whether it rates 5 stars.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Nearest-Far-Away-Place/dp/0805047026


...and you should also consider this.

The Lost Beach Boy. As a bonus, The author Jon Stebbins posts here so thats got to show the quality of the guy!

http://www.amazon.com/Lost-Beach-Boy-founding-members/dp/B005HKVVBU/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1346647141&sr=1-1&keywords=the+lost+beach+boy

Catch A Wave is really the best one. People criticise it for being Brian-centric (it is a biography of Brian expressly, no sh*t), but he gives everyone a fair shot at portraying themselves IMO. Mike's interview is great. It's also the best overview of the career as whole.

Carlin also drops in here on occasion, too.

If you're looking for a different approach, Steven Gaines' Heroes & Villains offers an at times incredibly inaccurate but sleazy and honest portrayal of the group. The Nearest Faraway Place is great in terms of California history.

If Smile floats your boat and you can find it cheap, Dominic Priore's Smile book (NOT Look Listen, Vibrate, Smile - you need to own that anyway) is good for the extensive Van Dyke interviews, less so on little details.

Have you read the David Leaf book Hypehat? I keep hearing good things about it, but a used copy is expensive

there are two stories in the "autobiography" that I've always wondered about, but I never have been able to get a straight answer on here. One is the story of a 1979 gig in Canada, I believe. "Brian" talks about being so drunk that he actually laid down on the stage and fell asleep. The other one talks about Brian totally rearranging a song right in the middle of a concert. Did either of these stories ever actually happen?

I haven't, for the same reason.


Jay, the 'key of BW' quote springs to mind....

The story of Brian chasing Barbara Rovell and her ripping a wart off his thumb has stuck in my mind as something Brain recounted in one of those terse interviews with Todd Gold...sounds  implausible enough to have really happened :angel:

ace, thanks vmuch for this :)

aha!!! I've heard alot of good things about Dominic Priore & 'Look Listen Vibrate, SMiLE' but never managed to discover a copy yet (at least one i can afford when i spot it).
I'll def be checking that bad boy out (Yes I am sadly ANOTHER SMiLE fanatic..).

The other Book by Dominic sounds really interesting, especially for the Van Dyke interviews :)

Thanks for evryone's help on here, great to be pointed in the right direction and be given a fair few options on what to go for  ;D ;D :3d :smokin :hat

In my own story, many things would be funny to hear actually spoken aloud by Brian.
"... he was a skinny kid with a unique perspective and a fondness for amphetamines"

I wouldn't go quite as far as others have and call this a pile of garbage. If you've never read the other Beach Boys biographies that this generously steals from you might find something of value in it up to the point where Landy enters the picture and then it turns into one long turgid infomercial. I knew enough about Brian when it came out to know that he'd be incapable of writing his autobiography so I wasn't fooled.
In fact, the only rock star autobio to not be ghostwritten by someone else that I'm aware of is Dylan's slim volume of "Chronicles Vol. 1" which only goes to show you that what the artist remembers and wants to write about is probably not what the audience wants to read anyway (although Dylan's book is great for what it is).

There are probably a handful of stories that Brian told Todd Gold that made the book, but that's about it. If it were an honest book, it would probably only be enough to fit a pamphlet. 

is this the same book with a different cover? I have the one with the cover of him by the ocean in a black jacket.

http://www.amazon.com/Wouldnt-It-Nice-Brian-Wilson/dp/0747531455/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1346872529&sr=8-6&keywords=brian+wilson

Yeah same book, different cover, I've got the one shown in the link.

when was that photo taken?

It's the very worst book for research purposes I have ever read and almost everything in it is very wrong.

This made me laugh and laugh and I'm not entirely sure why.

We all know Dennis had a big heart, was Brian's biggest musical supporter from within the band during the Smile period, etc., but I think Dennis was "forgiven" because he was no threat to Landy. Carl, Audree, Marilyn, Carnie and Wendy were all anti-Landy, and the book came out at the time of the conservatorship fight, so Landy was trying to trash them and prove that HE was the one who loved Brian, not his greedy family.

The only Wilsons who weren't a threat to Landy when the book came out were Murry and Dennis. He HAD to hit Murry hard in the book because that stuff had all been out there for so many years. But there was no reason to take shots at Dennis, so he didn't.

Yep, it was all motivated by Landy's desire to have Brian as his prisoner forever. Damn those Wilsons for actually wanting some contact with their son, brother and father!

Apart from in the opening chapter when Dennis beats the sh*t out of some girl... Read the book as a spoof and it's great fun, read it as it was intended however and it's frustrating and depressing.

For all that is hateful about the book, I recall a lovely anecdote early on about Mike encouraging an initially reticent and self-deprecating Brian to write a song with him, telling him that (from memory here) "the stuff you play when you're fooling around on the piano is better than two thirds of what's on the radio" - and Brian being forever grateful for it. I don't have my copy to hand unfortunately, but it would nice if somebody who does could confirm that I have this more or less correct.

Yeah, William, that's in the book. For a book that's VERY anti-Mike, it's good that the story is included.

Whatever else you can say about Mike, he was the first person to believe in Brian's songwriting ability, and Brian has always needed someone to believe in him.