The Smiley Smile Message Board

Obviously we have the two potential singles from SMiLE pictured here, H&V and VegeTables.

Just wondering what the VegaTables single will be. I'm hoping it's not the '93 boxset mix. This doesn't sound like a single to me.

I really hope they've found the April mix.

And please no one jump on here saying a vintage finished VT doesn't exist

You don't know anything for sure.

Seems to me they'd only include a Vegatables single if a Vegatables single had been found.

I love the mixing session on SOT, and I love the little tease you get at the end of the Smiley version

Please please, I hope they've found it!

Wonder what the flip-side would've been, and indeed now is.

I seem to remember a theory that "Wind Chimes" and "Vegetables" were meant to be single titles - perhaps the same single - which would explain why "Vegetables," which was guessed to be the "earth" segment of "The Elements" (and basically serves as such on BWPS), and "Wind Chimes" ("Air") were listed separately while "Fire" and "Water" weren't.

It's a very weird pairing - with everything that has been written about Smile and with all the speculation, never has a single release of Surf' s Up been suggested as a possibility back in1966 or 1967.   wonderful, yes.  maybe With Me Tonight, or Dada since they were worked on and weren't on the album track list.

I'm hoping for April '67 version of "Wonderful".

The two singles are

Heroes and Villains (part 1) b/w Heroes and Villains (part 2)
Vega-Tables b/w Surf's Up

I'm so curious what the structure of Wind Chimes is going to be.

What about singles 3, and 4? Or did 4-5 singles per album not become standard until later on?

Anyone think Vega-Tables would've tanked as a single? It's too dry to be a single. The 1971 live acoustic version would make a better single than the Smile versions I've heard. Smiley's is cool but still not good single material.

Brian seems to have really lost his head after Good Vibrations. I mean... that version of Heroes?! Brian devastated when it didn't do as well as he hoped? It's like he got too deep into it, he couldn't see clearly anymore. Or he was so tripped out on that droning organ sound that he thought the world would be too. It's nice being in the car listening to classic rock stations realizing that, were Heroes and Villains to be played, it would sound like the most abstract art rock ever featured on radio compared to the safe stuff.

I think the Smiley H&V single was and is a great single. I don't understand why it gets slammed so much around here. What's wrong with it? And answer that without factoring in what it could have or should have been. Look at it as if you had never head a single scrap of Smile material and then heard that single. I've played it for people that don't know anything about the Beach Boys or don't care about them (or think that they don't care for them) and it invariably blows minds.

I agree. SmileySmile's H&V was the better single than the Smile versions (that we know of). With the Cantina-section, etc. it probably wouldn't have gotten much airplay

Same here. I find it to be superior to the "Cantina" version in every way. The "Cantina" version sounds goofy and odd. The single just sounds awesome, and very "cohesive" even though you can distinctly hear the different sections.

While I liked the H&V chorus at first for using a harpsichord, the vocal arrangement now sounds kind of stale to me. Just my opinion, folks! I like Brian's vocals on the verses of the cantina version better, too. The cantina version could use a couple of more sections, though. So good I can compile my own version! :)

Taken in isolation, perhaps you're right, but really, given that we know there were several other versions at various points, it's hard for me to not consider it a let-down.  All the excitement and promise of the Humble Harv demo is gone from the single mix.  The "Cantina" version is favored, I think, because it's closer to what Brian originally intended - a "three minute musical comedy."  The song doesn't exist in a vacuum - it's disingenuous to disregard prior versions and Brian's original aspirations. 

That's not to say that the single mix doesn't have it's merits - I prefer the "my children were raised" section from this mix to its "Cantina" counterpart, and I love the "I've been in this town so long" bit near the end.  But the chorus is boring and unneccessary, and the "la la la" verse is pointless too.  Everybody who was around at that time (aside from Brian) knew that the version that he eventually put out had been watered down and tamed to the point where it was no longer a worthy follow up to "Good Vibrations." 

The chorus is not boring to me. It's got mushroom backing vocals, droning Baldwin organ... what's not to like? The final blast of organ drone in the last chorus is better than anything on Smile.

The problem is, SMiLE version or Smiley, how do you follow up a single like Good Vibrations and make any song sound good?. In some respects I think Brian should have sat on Good Vibrations for longer and let the post Pet Sounds anticipation build a little more, also allowing him time to figure out Heroes and Villains and get that released before the public lost interest. I think that SMiLE had been announced as shelved before Heroes and Villains was released probably done damage to the sales of that single too since after all the hype surrounding the album releasing something which wasn't from it was probably always going to be a difficult task.

You're absolutely right, following up "Good Vibrations" was probably an impossible task from the start.  And of course, Brian never planned on taking as long as he did to finish "Heroes."  He had a mix set to go in mid-February, which would have been only 4 months after "Good Vibrations."  Maybe there was no "perfect sequence" of the "Heroes" sections that would have lived up to the hype, but I still think that a release of the "Cantina" mix in early March would have been looked on much more highly than the version that finally came out in July.

The backing vocals sung so subdued, the droning organ... that's not to like. That is, I don't like them, but it's perfectly OK to like them.

The original instrumental track with the complex percussion and the ascending bass lines is much more powerful, I like that more.

Surf's Up on the back???????????????????????????????????????

Vega-Tables became such an unexpected great seller back in June 1967 that the group went on to record Sea-Men Conservation to promote another integral idea of enlightenment that the conservation of 'essence' leads to enhanced brain functioning i.e., striving for 'genius' - breaking through into a new mode of subconscious explosion, rather than the tame pitter patter of the usual one.

it's gonna be the new BEST VERSION EVER wild honey era version

Probably for sake of hypothetical authenticity - Brian explicitly stated back in the day that "Surf's Up" could never be a single (I suppose they're taking that to mean it could never be an A-side).  This pairing definitely makes for an odd combination, but given that they're already used "Heroes," "Wonderful" and "Cabinessence," it's the most logical remaining track to fill out the B-side with "Vega-Tables."