The Smiley Smile Message Board

I love Smiley Smile, and think of it as an entirely separate entity to SMiLE. I not only think the Smiley version of Chimes is better than the Smile version, I think it is one of the greatest tracks ever put onto tape by anyone anywhere, seriously.

There is something about the staggered timing of the vocal, those spooky harmonies, the overall structure of the thing....and that  spine tingling fade.  It is a truly stunning creation. I could go on and on about it

When I first read the SS/WH two-fer liner notes back in 1990, I was excited to read David Leafs assertion that the Smile version of Wind Chimes was even more beautiful.
Later that year when I got the T2580 boot, I was very disappointed, as to me, the Smile version of Chimes was nowhere near as good as the haunting creation on Smiley.

Does anyone else feel the same way? Has this question come up before? If so just tell me to STFU.

I've come out, and I don't care, Mum, Dad, you have to accept me for who I am. I love the Smiley Smile Wind Chimes, and it feels good.

I kind of agree with you. The SS version has a haunting feel to it. There is also, what I have always heard, and echo of God Only Knows in it... Just seemed a lot more wistful than the SMiLE version.

That being said, the SMiLE version is funner. :D

Interesting observation.  I bet you'll see that whichever one people heard first is the one they prefer.  I heard the GV box version of Wind Chimes first, so the Smiley Smile version was a bit weird to me (still is, but it's cool in it's own Smiley Smile way).  Same thing with Wonderful and Vegetables - I heard them on them box first, and those are the versions I prefer.

MAYBE you just haven't heard the best SMiLE version, yet.

You have to take the unfinished Smile versions and the finished Smiley Smile versions as two different entities. As far as I'm concerned Smiley Smile is just as worthy as the unfinished Smile recordings, not to mention that it's easily one of their top 3 LPs (behind Sunflower and Pet Sounds IMO). Smiley Smile still finds Brian at the apex of his creative powers; though the achieved ends are (to us) much different than those intended for Smile, Smiley Smile is just as important to the Smile story and effectively the last chapter of Brian Wilson as the driving force in the Beach Boys. The session tapes indicate that Brian is still clearly in control of the proceedings and the Boys are following his direction as producer/leader. I can't say if one is better or worse than the other because we only have a finished Smiley Smile available for comparison.

I love Smiley Smile, but having heard BWPS first, it took me a while to get into it.

Its mix has a kind of cleanness/clarity about it as well that was not evident on any of the 'big budget' productions that came before.

Also, that last part of Vegetables has always been - to me - a unique glimpse of what Smile would have sounded like if released in 1967.

Wind Chimes might be my favorite track on Smiley, and definitely the version I listen to more often. Maybe it's just me, but it just seems slightly creepier than the rest of the album; not to say that Smiley isn't creepy, but that it doesn't inch out in that direction moreso is what prevents me from falling in love with it.

Smiley version all the way!!! But then the Smiley renditions of "Wonderfull" and "Vegtables" are not a patch on the most commonly booted versions from Smile.

Man, I love 'em both.

SMiLE version: when you feel innocent, full of wonder, lighthearted

Smiley: when you're lonely, it's dark, you're moody

They both taste great.

However...re Veggies and Wonderful, the SMiLE versions always win.

Speeches vs. She's Goin' Bald? Uh...the latter. It's more of a song, whereas the former is sort of a repetitive loop.

Seriously????  I've always found it ironic that the unfinished SMiLE version sounds so much more finished than the released SS version, which really sounds like a hastily thrown together home demo to me.  No comparison.  Apples to....er, rotten apples.

I agree both are great tracks and the best part is how completely different they are!

Always thought that the ending of  the SS veggies was the best part of the entire song. Love Goin' Bald but could do without the high pitch voices....kind of ruins it for me.

I love the tag to the Smiley version but it's the SMiLE version easily.

I love the chorus.

I could easily pontificate all night about the often maligned or simply overlooked Smiley Smile, singing its praises, but i’ve grown a little weary of tirelessly defending it, which, regardless, i’ll end up doing anyway until my death. My brain is also in a permanent state of discombobulation trying to figure out how legitimate fans of the Beach Boys not only do not like the album but actually HATE it. It is completely beyond me. It’s sheer insanity as far as i can see, seriously. You’re a fan (of the non casual variety) of the Beach Boys and yet you hate this record? What is there not to love? A quiet, gentle, peculiar, creepy, oneiric, childlike, deranged, whimsical, innocent, lighthearted, heavy, absurd, tender, modest, low-key album that need not be judged in relation to Smile, but by its own impressive merits. This is a totally separate entity from Smile. They’re not even in the same realm. And that's a GREAT thing.

Think this is a defeated Brian Wilson handing over the reigns and not caring anymore? Listen again and pay closer attention. The man had not lost ANYTHING at this point. He's as daring and adventurous as ever here. There is an undeniable ambition present on this recording that absolutely refutes the notion that Brian Wilson had called it quits. But i think for a lot of people, that’s not really evident simply because Smiley was an understated, subtle effort, rather than the grandiose, declarative Smile. Putting aside what Smile should have been, or just putting it aside altogether, and examining Smiley on its own merits, it clearly shows that, once again, Brian was one step ahead of everyone. What else does this album sound like? Nothing. And it predates everything from the less is more, "back to basics" movement. Right here is the birth of the lo-fi bedroom aesthetic.

How did they get away with releasing this? This is the Beach Boys at their weirdest and most uncompromising, and also probably their purest and rawest. It’s actually not too dissimilar from their very beginnings as a band––no studio musicians, no grand productions, no blanket of reverb. The voices are close-miced and dry, the arrangements are sparse, the playing is loose. This is, in a sense, a group starting over, and heralding in the beginning of a new era––the “band” years, the smaller productions, the homier sound. Yet, nothing that came after Smiley ever sounded like it.

What’s the matter with you? You don’t like an incessant, buzzing Baldwin organ, a wonky, slightly out of tune upright piano, laughing, chatter, weird effects, background noise, "mistakes" being left in, minimal and inventive arrangements, and mind-blowing harmonies right up in your ear? This album really offers what was probably the first good opportunity to clearly hear Beach Boys vocal arrangements (at their peak) without dense instrumental arrangements and reverb convoluting them.

I’ve always said that in an odd, counterintuitive way i’m grateful that Brian abandoned Smile, for the marvelous anomaly of Smiley Smile would not have existed otherwise. And in my ideal, alternate universe, upon the completion of Smiley Smile, Brian would have returned full force to the Smile sessions, completed them, thus leaving us the best of both worlds. Sigh.  

Oh yeah, Wind Chimes...It’s weird, just today i was listening to the Smiley version and thinking how i like it more than the Smile version. I agree that it is one of the greatest recordings of all time. And while i still think the Smile version is amazing, i have never cared much for Carl’s over affected vocal on the Smile version. It’s too precious, which i often found his singing to be.

That's me, all over.

Couldn't have expressed it any better myself.  Smiley is in my top-5 Beach Boys albums, and listening to it makes me feel something that no other Beach Boys record makes me feel.

People tend to incorrectly mistake simple and understated with lazy and rushed.  When I hear this album, I hear a piece of art that was carefully thought out and produced in such a way that makes it sound a lot simpler than it really is (as Brian had an uncanny knack for in those days).  The fact that Brian could take these songs, strip them down to almost nothing, and still manage to make them fit into his modular framework is nothing short of astounding.

To go back to the original topic here, I've always thought the Smiley version of "Wind Chimes" is miles better than the Smile version (which I also happen to enjoy).  Again, it's a testament to Brian's genius that he could turn a delicate and peaceful song about wind chimes into that.

I LOVE Smiley Smile. But prefer the Smile version of Wind Chimes.

I heard the SMiLE version first but prefer the Smiley Smile version. I enjoy listening to the SMiLE tracking sessions though. Smiley Smile was my 2nd BB CD I bought (1999) and I was a bit let down by the other SMiLE tracks on there upon first listening. But my head certainly popped up the first time I heard SS "Wind Chimes". A true fucking masterpiece!

Absolutely love Smiley Smile after Pet Sounds and Friends its one of my favorites. If there is one thing I could find wrong with the album is that its too short. I just wished it lasted a little bit longer. But other than that its just a really great album.

Why pick one over the other when you've got both.  I heard the Smiley version first, in fact Smiley Smile was the album that got me into the Beach Boys back in 1989.  Loved it from the first playing.  When I heard the Smile version later, I thought 'how cool is that?  A completely different mood, but just as good.'  I like 'em both.

The thing about Wind Chimes (and Wonderful) on Smiley Smile is that it sounds like a "defeated" Brian Wilson. When I heard the SMiLE version, it was all happy and upbeat, something fun! When I listened to the SS version it just sounded like something was wrong...

Now this I agree with most assuredly.  I've always wished it had been longer.

What the SMILEY SMILE version of "Wind Chimes" has going for it are the vocals. The SMiLE version of the track is all about the production and arrangement of the music; the lead and backing vocals are simple and straight-forward. The SMILEY SMILE version, on the other hand, does some truly remarkable things with the vocal arrangement. Really, no one has ever come close to creating such an eerie yet beautiful (and funny) combo of voices as appears on this song. I think it goes without saying that the ending coda is among the Beach Boys finest moments...and it's little surprise that Brian and co. resurrected it for BWPS even if it technically wasn't a SMiLE recording (same as the "Mrs. O'Leary's Cow" vocals). The only possible drawback is the rather unprofessional recording of these vocals with their "pops", breaths and dryness. If these were recorded in a proper studio, they would have sounded even more impressive.

If more of SMILEY SMILE was on this level, I would be willing to call it one of the Beach Boys best albums; but, for me, too much of it sounds rushed and inconsequential.

Are we 120% sure of that? It's just so, so, well… SMILE!

And I keep thinking back to Adam's "Whoa" moment when chatting with Alan Boyd – could the revelation have been about sessions previously not thought to have been associated with SMILE? Why include the material in BWPS if it ain't SMiLE?

For ref, edited to the pertinents:

Because Brian doesn't think of Smile time in quite the same terms that we do.

The music to the coda seems to come from "Holidays" which is why the BWPS transition from "On A Holiday" to "Wind Chimes" works so well. Could this have been a similar situation to "Look" where a theme from an abandoned track was salvaged as a vocal riff for another song ("Good Vibrations" being the track that borrowed from "Look")? In that case, it could have been something recycled early on as part of SMiLE or later as part of SMILEY SMILE. I don't know.

The music to the coda seems to come from "Holidays" which is why the BWPS transition from "On A Holiday" to "Wind Chimes" works so well. Could this have been a similar situation to "Look" where a theme from an abandoned track was salvaged as a vocal riff for another song ("Good Vibrations" being the track that borrowed from "Look")? In that case, it could have been something recycled early on as part of SMiLE or later as part of SMILEY SMILE. I don't know.

The beautiful vocals at the end of the SS WC are definitely the same chord progression as the coda to Holiday, as Roger notes.

To me SS remains vastly under-rated by most.
On some board, years ago, I suggested that the SMiLE sessions - as we already have them - are far more finished on the music/instrumental side.
Whereas SS has essentially completed vocals, with pariticpation by the whole group, but minimized music/instrumentation.

"SMiLE" would then represent a combination of the two approaches: SS-type vcls, SMiLE music backing tracks.

I really wonder if Brian thought he was making a hit/revolutionary record while recording smiley smile.

In regards to Wind Chimes, i'd take both the SS and SMiLE version over either.

Both have a life of their own. Love the coda in the SS version, but I love blasting the coda in the SMiLE version on my stereo system. I used to really dislike the SMiLE version for that coda, but the more I played it the more I loved it.

Smiley Smile cements Brian as the very first lo-fi hipster. If he had been an unknown and had recorded Smiley Smile in the early to mid-2000s, he'd have been the next Jeff Magnum. This is what Charles Manson would've recorded if he understood anything about arranging, and knew a few more chords. "With Me Tonight" is like the perfect hippie hymnal. Imagine a dim, candlelit room, incense and marijuana wafting in the air, hippies sitting Indian style on a Persian rug as they chant... the song's presence almost seems to grow from their conviction to the melody and the simple, homey message carried on it. That's why the helium effect on "She's Goin' Bald" works. It's as if they've finally meditated themselves to a higher plain. Brian can now be anything he wants. Just listen to him turn the Beach Boys into a gentle breeze on "Wind Chimes"! Magic!

That's the whole vibe of Smiley Smile, folks. A bunch hippies smoke pot one evening and cut a record. If you can't appreciate that, then maybe you need to stop being uptight and smoke a doob or two, chased with a fine domestic brew. Brian Wilson loves you, and wants you to have a good time with him.

Oh yeah, and you know that bridge on "Wonderful"? "You just gotta cool it, all you gotta do is cool it, man... cool it." That's meta-satire on the Facebook phenomenon.  

Sorry if I blew all your minds.

Really though, you're making a mistake if you're comparing Smile to Smiley Smile. They have completely differing merits, and both are great on their own. There's nothing like Smiley Smile's "Wind Chimes" on Smile, and there's nothing like "Cabin Essence" on Smiley Smile. Of course, you can draw comparison from afar, but they really are different brands of beauty.

I heard SS first and love SS Wind Chimes (it's really a totally different song with just the same lyrics and a similar melody) and the dumb-dumb-dumb bass version of Vegetables. When I heard the box set I was rather disappointed with those versions of these two songs. Especially after having been blown away by the SMiLE version of Wonderful, which is way better than the SS version - it only lacks a middle eight. That is, not counting the rock me Henry version. Had that been on the box set, Ram4's theory would have been right for me.

The BWPS version of Wind Chimes though is an improvement over the box set version.

Wow, some great responses, and I am mightily heartened to see that everyone feels the same way about Smiley as I do. Chat soon , I is at a rather exciting part of 24. It's Bauer time!

Never been too keen on the SMiLE 'Wind Chimes' 'chorus' if that's what it is. It is far too heavy for such a delicate song. The Smiley Smile version is soooo malevolently perfect. But it is great to have both!

Smiley Smile is rather a 'spooky' album. Perhaps more of a Californian companion to Their Satanic Majesties' Request.

I like Smiley Smile for what it is (or isnt) but IMHO both Wonderful and Wind Chimes are unsurpassed in their Smile renditions. The SS versions are like an artist saying, "Look how cool my portrait is in comparison to the Mona Lisa", whereas the Smile versions are the artist saying, "I painted the Mona Lisa."

Haha, I'm watching 24 right now too

On topic, I look at both Wonderful's as two separate entities, almost like a Part 1 and 2

Anyone else awaiting with baited breath Bill's Zen interpretation of this song being rammed down their throat next time he logs on?

Oh man, it's been so long, I completely forgot about 24. When did it start again?

I wouldn't mind hearing his interpretation if there is one. Just my opinion.

Bring it on, Bill.

I think it's done, I'm just re-watching my old boxets now I'm on summer break with lots of time to kill lol

Don't you worry, Bill.

Essentially, so long as the guy is cool with posting here he's ok with me - his Smile opinions are as welcome as mine.

I like Smiley Smile but I definitely prefer the Smile version of Wind Chimes.
But I have to recommend the early version on SOT 18, where you actually hear Brian's piano playing. Those are some awesome chord changes, completely different from the Smile version, can't believe they left that out on SS. It feels almost like Brian had lost his confidence completely when he decided to simplify the songs like that. Or just didn't care.

No thanks.

P.S. plz don't ruin songs for me in the future. kthx.

Haaa, my thoughts exactly.

That's basically how the song was made, though.

The fact that DEADLY MARIJUANA was smoked during the production of the song ruined it for you?

Ah well, more for us.  :hat

I think you meant Wonderbill

Really?    That ruins it for you?  seems odd that it would. 
Decrription reminded me of the Skeletons and "Waiting For My Gin To Hit Me"

No, doofus >: (

That's interesting that you feel that way. For me it is the other way round. In the first part of the verses in the SMiLE version it is just two chords changed back and forth, while there are some more modulations and vocal arrangements on the Smiley version. Less instruments, but compositionwise more elaborated.

As someone else said, SMILEY was the album that got me into the more creative side of BW/BB's.
Never cared for Wind Chimes or Wonderful on Smiley.  When I heard the SMILE versions of those tracks, not only did I get that feeling that "these" were the best versions, I also went back and re-evaluated SMILEY.

This is what I concluded: I will always enjoy the album, but I feel like WC, Wonderful, and With Me Tonight were like a "wake" for the album that was left behind.  The minimalism of the LP still puzzles me.  Maybe Brian felt like he painted himself into a corner with Smile?  Who knows?

And yet, to me, there is something about the SS version of Vegetables that has it all over the Smile one.

Go figure.............

Dan